Government Spending

Obama to Talk About Debt-Ceiling Tonight at 9pm ET: Open Thread


President Barack Obama is ready to disrupt normally scheduled shows tonight to give a talk about the debt-ceiling debate:

Raising the stakes and seeking to seize back control of the debate, the White House said Obama would address the nation at 9 p.m. EDT (0100 GMT) about "avoiding default and the best approach to cutting deficits."

That's from the Chicago Tribune, which also notes a few other things:

The stalemate [in settling on a plan to cut spending and/or raise the debt ceiling] rattled investors worldwide, sending stocks and the dollar down and pushing gold to a record high, but falling far short of the panicky sell-off that some politicians in Washington had feared after weekend talks broke down….

House of Representatives Republicans unveiled details of a two-stage deficit reduction plan that would start with an initial $1.2 trillion in savings over 10 years. It is sure to be rejected by Obama because it would raise the debt limit for only a few months, meaning the issue would have to be revisited early next year.

Obama's Democrats formally presented their competing plan for $2.7 trillion in deficit reduction over the next decade but with a debt limit increase that would carry through the November 2012 elections, when Obama and many lawmakers are up for re-election….

Neither plan may be enough to avert a downgrade by ratings agency S&P, which has indicated it wants to see a $4 trillion deficit reduction plan over 10 years. Critics said both sides appeared more interested in scoring political points than forging compromise as the 2012 campaign gathers steam.

Whole article here.

A few things to keep in mind about this all:

1. It is now generally understood that reaching the debt limit does not equal defaulting on the debt. It's a good thing that we've come to that realization, as it provides a starting point for discussion going forward. As we've stressed here, any default—which would indeed have major impacts on all sorts of things—is a choice, not a fait accomplit.

2. August 2 is not Armageddon etched in stone. That's not to say that the government (and let's face it, taxpayers, it's them—Republicans and Democrats in Washington, who have joined hands over the past decade at least to spend us into the poor house—against us) doesn't need to figure out what to do. But it's one more sign that there ain't a lot of trustworthy talent in the captain's quarters.

3. As the Trib article above notes, the debt limit isn't the ultimate issue when it comes to bond ratings and investor confidence. It's the far more important issue of whether or not the government is going to get its act together regarding fiscal sanity. S&P, which has plenty to answer for given its role in the fiscal crisis, wants to see at least $4 trillion less going down the rat hole over the next decade. Even that's a down payment on ratcheting down government spending that has absolutely exploded in the 21st century. Here's a snapshot from the historical tables prepared for fiscal year 2011 by the Office of Management & Budget:

4. If the pols really want to part short-term politics aside, it's worth considering a short-term fix that gives a coupla-few months to really has out a longer-term plan and make the 2012 election a referendum on different approaches to budget policy and priorities. I know what my first draft of a plan would look like. And we know what the GOP's Ryan plan and Obama's budget would be like. One would end up spending $4.7 trillion in 2021 and the other would spend $5.7 trillion. Neither of those is a realistic plan.

So let's get cracking on getting back to something like sanity. We don't need to—and shouldn't—govern by panic. But time ain't on our side, either.

Reason on the debt debate.


NEXT: Dispatches From the Food Truck Wars

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  1. First post since his Real Time, and all Nick can manage is an open thread?

    Donna Brazile must have done a number on you, boy!

    1. Dance, puppets!

    2. Overcome with lust for democratic consultant!! Must control

  2. I’m watching MSNBC (don’t ask) and the histrionics are delightful. “America will default! America will default! Republicans are playing politics! Old people in the street! Death! Despair! Dogs and cats living together!”

    Meanwhile, none of these well-read, highly-educated, politically-connected people will dare mention who actually “holds” most of the Public Debt (the US government) because of the fundamentally farcical nature of “owing” money to oneself.

    They also have a countdown clock until Obama’s speech from the throne.

    1. A little nonsense, now and then
      Is relished by the wisest men.

  3. I’ll go ahead and summarize for everyone who isn’t able to watch.

    Blame Republicans, blame Republicans, blame Republicans, blame Republicans, and blame Republicans.

    1. You forgot:

      It’s not my fault. I inherited it from Bush and the republicans because they want tax breaks for millionaires and billionaires so that grammy will have to eat dog food as she dies in the street from a lack of health care.

      1. You can say that again.

    2. You forgot:

      It’s not my fault. I inherited it from Bush and the republicans because they want tax breaks for millionaires and billionaires so that grammy will have to eat dog food as she dies in the street from a lack of health care.

    3. Blame Republicans, blame Republicans, blame Republicans, blame Republicans, and blame Republicans.

      In all fairness it is the Republicans fault that Obama got elected.

      And only republicans can take the blame for Bush.

      The whole thing is pretty much their fault.

  4. Tax breaks for corporate jets.

    Millions and billionaires.

    That is all.

  5. 100 bucks says Obama throws another temper tantrum tonight because he’s not getting his way. Per usual.

  6. Watching this on FOX. What bizarre transformation has this debt-ceiling debate wrought to make Bill O’Reilly’s show a source of reasoned, informative debate?

    1. Re: GSL,

      Watching this on FOX. What bizarre transformation has this debt-ceiling debate wrought to make Bill O’Reilly’s show a source of reasoned, informative debate?

      And all of a sudden! Somebody must have rammed some sense into his ass during the weekend!

      1. Somebody must have rammed some sense into his ass during the weekend!

        Fire Island?

        1. Thai Ladyboys

  7. Is there a drinking game?

    1. Yeah, “We’ll default on August 2”.

    2. I’d like to propose two drinks for any reference to the TEA Party, explicit or suggested.

    3. Is there a drinking game for each time Obama doesn’t mention S&P’s recommendation of a $4 trillion cut?

    4. Any time he mentions Bush tax cuts or tax cuts for millionaires/billionaires – take a shot

      Hmmm… maybe this isn’t such a good idea.

    5. for my sake, I hope not

    6. Yes. No watching necessary.

      Just start drinking. You’ll need it.

  8. Is Obama going to give out that address in WV?

    1. I live in West Virginia. You can send any donations to me, and I’ll make sure they get to the right person.

  9. Gold closes at $1611, silver over $40. Truly, Scrooge McDuck is the only winner in the debt ceiling showdown.

    1. but imagine the cost of maintaining his swimming pool now!

    2. Well (ahem), not the only winner.

  10. Pols have a new gimmick to get more face time. I suspect their ratings are already falling rapidly.
    Democracy is “the god that failed.” Get used to it.
    You haven’t been voting, have you?

    1. In the future, politicians will realize the only way to get the public’s attention is to appear as contestants on reality shows. Viewers will laugh as they screw up task after task and stab each other in the back on camera, and a few weeks later vote them back into office by an even greater majority with even more power.

      1. I predict that president Comacho will be elected within a couple of decades.

  11. “All Bush’s Fault”

  12. Obama just cited the “Clinton surplus”.


    1. Obama: My deficit was good, Bush’s deficit was bad.

      1. Obama: Corporate Jet owners!

        DRINK again!

        1. Obama: ROOAAAADDDZZZZ!!!!


          1. Obama: Saint Ronald loved taxing the rich! Stop being mean to me, Rethuglicans!

            1. Obama: We won’t be able to write SS checks, vet bennies, or government contractors! Gimme back my credit card you meanies!

              1. Obama: “The ‘new members’ (Tea Partiers) of Congress and I don’t see eye-to-eye…”


                1. Obama: Jefferson said, ‘every man can’t have his way in all things.’

                  Jeff also said, “I wish it were possible to obtain a single amendment to our Constitution. I would be willing to depend on that alone for the reduction of the administration of our government to the genuine principles of its Constitution; I mean an additional article, taking from the federal government the power of borrowing.”

                  DRINK IT UP.

                  1. Or as another great man put it a few years before entering the White House:

                    The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the U.S. Government can’t pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government’s reckless fiscal policies.

                    Over the past 5 years, our federal debt has increased by $3.5 trillion to $8.6 trillion.That is “trillion” with a “T.” That is money that we have borrowed from the Social Security trust fund, borrowed from China and Japan, borrowed from American taxpayers. And over the next 5 years, between now and 2011, the President’s budget will increase the debt by almost another $3.5 trillion.

                    And the cost of our debt is one of the fastest growing expenses in the Federal budget. This rising debt is a hidden domestic enemy, robbing our cities and States of critical investments in infrastructure like bridges, ports, and levees; robbing our families and our children of critical investments in education and health care reform; robbing our seniors of the retirement and health security they have counted on.

                    Every dollar we pay in interest is a dollar that is not going to investment in America’s priorities.

                    1. 2006 was, like, at least 100 years ago. The worst economic crisis in our lifetime! Unexpected job losses! Compromise! Other stuff!

                    2. It’s a LIVING DEBT CEILING!!!1!!


  13. “Government had a budget surplus in 2000”. First lie of the evening.

  14. The Fucker’s lying already.

  15. It was like that when I got here

    1. The cherry tree was like that when I found it!

  16. I’m just gonna read this and hope I get all the relevant points. I cannot watch him on TV anymore fearing the health of my TV.

  17. Is Mr. Gillespie getting weak? I thought that the line was that we did not need a debt limit increase at all.

  18. “The stalemate [in settling on a plan to cut spending and/or raise the debt ceiling] rattled investors worldwide…”

    That’s baloney.

    The markets today were rocked by Spain and Italy’s declining prospects and the realization that Greek bond holders are definitely taking a haircut…

    Correlation doesn’t equal causation–and that guy from the Chicago-Tribune is only seeing what he wants to see.

    1. Yeah, and the drop wasn’t even that bad–less than 1% off on the DJIA today. Christ, even Paulson was able to get drops of 400-500 points during the TARP debates. Obama can’t even scare the market enough now because they know he’s their bitch.

      1. The other thing he keeps trying to do–and I’ve seen Gillespie call out on TV–is the conflating the budget deal with the default. …and they’re two different things.

        Even if there isn’t a budget deal, the U.S. isn’t about to skip any bond payments.

        Those are two different things. You got your budget deal over here–and your defaulting on bond payments over there…

        And the markets KNOW those are two different things.

        1. The Greek bond holders are gonna get a hair cut because the Greeks CAN’T make their payments.

          The U.S. isn’t making a budget deal because Congress and the president WON’T make a deal.

          It’s not because we can’t make our bond payments–that’s a totally different situation, and the president keeps conflating the two.

          1. He knows that most Americans won’t understand the difference. He and his lapdogs in the media have been trying to drive the debate by intentionally equating the two, and he still became desperate enough to do his little hissy fit on teevee tonight.

            1. Obama’s the Fear-Monger in Chief!

              Just like the joker before him.

              If we don’t do what he says, then it’s gonna be scaaaaaaarrrryyyy!

    2. the stock market is not the US economy. It isn’t even a good proxy for it.

      What is good for the economy is not always good for the stock market


      what is bad for the stock market can be good for the economy.

  19. Money was spent on tax cuts…drink!!!!!

  20. Interest rates could climb for everyone who saves money too asshole

  21. That was a lot of economic ignorance to pack into one sentence.

  22. Good, he won’t bore us.

  23. “Let me be clear. Class warfare is an expression of our deepest values as a society.”

  24. Let me clear, we need to raise taxes on the wealthy! But it will be slow and painless. Like boiling a frog.

  25. He just used the word “sacrifice” again–that’s Obama’s favorite word!

    The Republicans in the House passed a budget in April–why hasn’t the Senate voted on it yet?

    1. Because Reid doesn’t want to put his cards on table?

    2. Because Reid doesn’t want to put his cards on table?

      1. Close!

        It’s because Reid wants to accuse the Republicans in the House of refusing to compromise.

        1. Let him – some consider the refusal to compromise to be a point in their favor.

    3. He just used the word “sacrifice” again–that’s Obama’s favorite word!

      I wrote hime a letter telling him to say, “Put on a sweater, turn down the thermostat”.

      Obama hasn’t gone full negative yet.

  26. Teabaggers! DRINK!

  27. You don’t “ask” for taxes, Mr. President…FUCKHEAD!

  28. corporate jets! drink!

  29. Let me be very clear. These tax breaks aren’t needed.

  30. Stop . . . stop . . . too many false choices . . . please stop!

  31. ROADZZZ!!11!111!

  32. “We all want a government that lives wihtin its means”


    At least he’s got a future in comedy.

    1. I think he’s being honest about that. Of course, he also wants government to have very expansive means.

  33. “Working families”

    1. Like they all sit around doing piecework in front of the hearth like in pre-industrial England

    2. If Obama gets his way, we will have “working families”.

      If his spending desires are met, I’m putting my 9-yo daughter to work. Because it’s her debt now, too.

  34. Hedge fund managers pay taxes at a lower rate than their secretaries?!

    The man live in the World of Make Believe! He must think we’re stupid.

    1. They do.
      Capital gains tax vs regular income taxes+FICA

      1. I am sure that Hedge Fund Managers have to pay FICA too.

      2. You forgot to factor in the corporate taxes paid on their behalf. Since stockholders own the company’s assets – including the bank accounts that corporate taxes are paid from – that counts as the stockholders paying it.

        1. “You forgot to factor in the corporate taxes paid on their behalf.”

          In my entire life, I’ve never seen an offering memorandum where a portfolio manager didn’t put his own equity into the fund.

          Regardless, I’m supposed to take the fact that hedge fund managers have their proceeds DOUBLE-TAXED as definitive proof that hedge fund managers are UNDER TAXED?

          What is this, Alice in Freaking Wonderland?!

          1. Alice in Wonderland is now a shooter, so pretty much.

    2. They pay 15% on carried interest. A (good) executive secretary is probably in the 25% bracket and in NYC could easily be in the 28% marginal bracket.

      1. Even if they paid 15% on carried interest–that wouldn’t mean their tax bill is paid at a lower rate than their secretaries.

        That’s totally jacking the numbers.

        Fer Christ’s sake?

        How much do secretaries pay on dividends–more than hedge fund managers? Hedge fund managers pay higher rates on their salaries than their secretaries do. Why the tax rate on dividends should be higher for hedge managers–based on their occupation? Do you really think that’s what Obama was trying to propose?!

        That’s freaking ridiculous.

        1. If Barack Obama just tried to compare the tax rate on dividends to the income tax rate of secretaries? Then he’s a lying sack of shit.

          1. Either secretaries pay the same rate on dividends as hedge fund managers pay–or Barack Obama is a liar.

            Either secretaries pay a higher income tax rate than the rate hedge fund managers pay on their income–or Barack Obama is a liar.

            1. ARE YOU SAYING OBAMA IS A LIAR???!!!!!

        2. They don’t take the money as “salary”

          1. Everybody that owns a corporation takes a salary. Everybody that owns a corporation takes dividends.

            Hedge Fund managers typically have performance bonuses that are higher than a lot of other industries, but their profits are taken as dividends after salary and bonuses–which are paid just like everybody else gets paid.

            None of which even mentions the corporate taxes they pay before they take salary or dividends.

            P.S. Barack Obama is a liar.

        3. Ken, Warren Buffett says all the time that his overall tax rate is higher than his secretary and the numbers bear this out. Now, there’s reasons why the numbers work out this way and some of them are good ones, but it ain’t no big conspiracy.

          1. Ken, Warren Buffett says all the time that his overall tax rate is higher than his secretary and the numbers bear this out.”

            Warren Buffet says all sorts of stupid things.

            “Now, there’s reasons why the numbers work out this way and some of them are good ones, but it ain’t no big conspiracy.”

            I didn’t say it was a conspiracy; I’m saying it’s bullshit lying.

            The only hedge fund managers who are paying taxes at a lower rate than their secretaries are hedge fund managers who are losing a ton of money and not taking any salary.

            Anybody who takes a salary higher than their secretary is paying income tax at a rate higher than their secretary–and no amount of bullshit will ever change that fact.

            1. P.S. Barack Obama saying that hedge fund managers pay taxes at a lower rate than their secretaries doesn’t make it so–and why anyone would defend that obvious lie is beyond me.

              He’s warmongering class war rhetoric like Bush used to talk about Al Qaeda.

              People who take more salary than their secretaries do not pay income tax at a lower rate–and comparing income tax rates to dividend income is bullshit.

              He’s lied. Barack Obama is a lying liar who lies about his lying.

              1. Ken I don’t know what to tell you. Most fund managers (and many other rich schmos) structure their compensation to make it taxed like capital gains and not like straight salary exactly because the preferential tax treatment. Google it if you want, you’ll find a few sites (including McArdles) that aren’t left wing axe grinders . ‘Carried Interest Loophole’ has been talked about on the interblawgs for several years now.

                1. Hedge Funds takes fees like everybody else. Hedge funds take capital gains–and pay capital gains taxes like everybody else.

                  Hedge Fund managers typically (more like always) have some of their own skin in the game–which means they keep their own funds in the fund. So they get paid out–just like their investors do…

                  There is NOTHING different about the way hedge fund managers take their profits that’s different from any other corporation structured the same way.

                  Their corporation pays corporate taxes–and all the other taxes corporations have to pay.

                  The owners get dividends. The employees (like the hedge fund manager) get bonuses–and they pay taxes on them just like everybody else in America!

                  The owners get dividends, and they pay taxes on dividends–just like everyone else in America.

                  The only reason Barack Obama said what he said is because he’s trying to roll back the Bush tax breaks–meaning SPECIFICALLY that he’s trying to raise the tax on dividends–for everybody!

                  That’s all it is. \

                  Just because you truly believe in Barack Obama’s lie? Doesn’t make it true!

                  Even if you believe that the tax rate on dividends should be raised to be taxed like ordinary income? That doesn’t make Barack Obama’s lie true either!

                  No fact can make Obama’s lie true–because it’s a lie.

                  He lied like a rug to inflame class warfare like Colin Powell liked about mobile WMD labs–to try to make you do what he thinks is best for us. Doesn’t make it true!

                  He’s a lying liar.

              2. Barack Obama is a liar!

      2. Right.. and the total tax burden is like what? 8%? 12%?

      3. They pay 15% on carried interest. A (good) executive secretary is probably in the 25% bracket and in NYC could easily be in the 28% marginal bracket.

        If this comparison is accurate (and I don’t believe it is because I have a sneaking suspicion that taxes come out of hedge fund managers somewhere else) then the only thing it proves is that regular folk are taxed too much, not that we need to make special dispensation for hedge fund managers.

  35. RONALD!…reagan? Wait, what the fuck?!

  36. “Saint Reagan wanted higher taxes too”

  37. He says he knows my answer, but he doesn’t know my answer!

    He’s quoting Reagan?! Reagan?

    Obama comparing himself to Reagan!

    I went door to door for Reagan when I was too young to vote. You, Mr. Obama? Are no Ronald Reagan.

    1. He learned his deficit spending at the feet of Saint Reagan.

  38. “Republicans mean, want me to stop spending money they want me to spend”.

  39. Nope, no Social Security checks! Pay up!!!!

  40. Wow, this is condescending nonsense even by Obama’s standard.

    1. Well it always worked down at the community center….they always started clapping and singing….it worked great.

      Why aren’t you people singing?

  41. DEFAULT!!!1!!!!1!!!1!!!!!

  42. Let me be clear: if you don’t all pull down your pants and let the Federal Government fuck you in the ass, the country will default and that’s not nice for members of government.

  43. “If DC doesn’t borrow another couuple trillion all of you will pay more interest because there will be so much more money available for lending, er something”

  44. “I’d like to ask the wealthy to pay more…or they can go to prison”

  45. High interest rates are bad for Wall Street and Washington, not “Main Street”

  46. I repeat, the government never fucking “asks” for taxes, Mr. President!

  47. He’s really being a jerk to all those wealthy Americans who donated money to the Treasury. Poor form, Mr. President!

  48. “The house is refusing to prevent default, forcing me to veto the legislation that will prevent default”.

  49. “1. It is now generally understood that reaching the debt limit does not equal defaulting on the debt”

    Tell that to the steno pool MSM who continue to faithfully regurgiate that claim.

    Even if any of them ever do grudingly acknowledge it, there will never be any questioning from the MSM about the admninstraton lying about – or any reflection on themselves for failing to question it.

  50. I told both leaders to compromise and enact my plan>

    Does this dickhead think he’s a dictator or what?

    1. Plan?

      Obama never HAD a plan.

      1. He did propose a budget for 2012? It’s Reid that doesn’t have a plan.

        1. 46 trillion in spending over ten years is not a budget, it is a wishlist from a hyperactive child.

  51. “Let me be clear. The compromise reached by Congress must be something I can sign. What that might be, I’m not saying.”

  52. “The new members of Congress are retards.”

  53. Has he told us he needs more money to finance the killer drones he uses to slaughter civilians in primitive parts of the world?

    1. Pretty sure he will skip over that little detail.

  54. “They work all day long…”

    If they’re lucky.

  55. “The American people are fed up with me not getting my whay

    1. go eat your pease!

  56. Aren’t they also too fat?

  57. “It was the heat of the moment….”

  58. If I want anti-tax obstinance, should I still contact my congressfuck?

  59. Yup, those Americans who held fast to rigid ideologies. Thomas Paine, for instance . . .

  60. God just tattoo Looter on his forehead and be done with it.

    1. ^ this

      Purposely avoiding the use of text speak to describe my response to this comment but, luckily, I’d just put down my coffee and swallowed. Coulda been ugly…

  61. Scene overseas: “SELL! SELL! SELL! SELL!”

  62. Buck O’fama.

  63. Shepard Smith’s cadence always cracks me up.

  64. Make my life easier by sending me your money.

  65. What should we expect from the Speaker? Sobbing. Nothing but uncontrollable sobbing.

    1. Speaker Fake-N-Bake

  66. I’ve got news for myself…

  67. As long as the House doesn’t cut funding for lawyers to defend DOMA…

  68. The Speaker should have sent a subliminal message with a yellow tie vice a green one.

  69. John Boehner hates those fat cats up on Capitol Hill just as much as you do, America.

  70. Wow, that was quick. (and smart to make it so)

    1. Thank God they wrapped it all up before 6:30 on the west coast. If Obama had preempted Jeopardy!, I would have had one more reason to hate him.

  71. We need to get this settled NOW, I have savage tribes to subjugate!

  72. It’s over? I missed it, but I would not have watched it had I known. I’m guessing Obama is pissed that he’s not getting his way, so he spent twenty minutes wagging his finger at Republicans? Close?

    1. Add in a hefty dose of class warfare, and you’ve got it.

      1. Any references to evil mustachioed libertarians threatening to reform the glorious working man’s paradise?

      2. The subtext of the entire talk was that Boehner cheats at golf.

  73. “The Bigger the government the smaller the people” – so that means if you cut spending, everyone becomes 7 ft tall?

  74. I wish the Dems would take the debt more seriously. No liberal should be satisfied with paying 40 cents on every dollar to enrich debtholders.

    Having said that, Obama handed it to Boehner tonight. Sure, ideologues and partisans won’t be convinced of that, but of course they already had their minds made up before the speech. The speeches are for independents and Obama spoke to them, Boehner spoke to his base. Big mistake. His “that’s not going to happen” is not going to sound good next to Obama’s plea for compromise in their minds. The GOP has created a fervent base that it can’t control when it needs to…

    1. “Having said that, Obama handed it to Boehner tonight”

      In your dreams.

      1. Think what you want Gillie, I’m betting Nov. 2008 you were thinking “boy that Obama is going down, nobody I know is going to vote for him!”

        1. You’ve never known what you were talking about, MNG.

          Today is no different.

    2. I thought it was typical pandering on both sides. Boehner played the “talking tough” card, Obama played the “class warfare” card. Yawn.

      1. Talking tough card rarely wins over independents…

        1. And class warfare doesn’t win them over in recessions either.

          1. Are you kidding? Ever heard of this guy named FDR?

            1. Signed the Federal law making marijuana illegal…put American citizens in concentration camps because of their race…sold out Eastern Europe to the Commies? Yeah, I think so…

              1. Yeah, and won four terms largely on class warfare.

                I love the Yalta stuff though SIV, classic Bircher. Right up there with your Carter-Panama Canal complaints. That is the good stuff, keep it coming.

                1. Yeah, and won four terms largely on class warfare.

                  Not many soup lines today.

                  Pandering to class warfare is a hopeless gimmick. Anyone who is remotely honest with themselves know the class warfare ended long ago and the US won.

                  Kind of hard to claim poverty when you have a car, a home, internet, a fridge full of food and cable tv.

                  1. Not many soup lines today.

                    Don’t need them – there’s food stamps instead.

                  2. Kind of hard to claim poverty when you have a car, a home, internet, a fridge full of food and cable tv.

                    But it’s not fair that somebody else has a better car, a bigger home, faster Internet, fancier food, and HBO!

            2. History fail. FDR campaigned in 1932 on drastic reductions in public spending. Ultimately, he was more a power-hungry sociopath than a true believer in the People’s Revolution.

              1. Plus I heard he smelled like potato skins.

              2. FDR said lot of things to different audiences. He definitely had the people thinking he was a “class traitor” and their friend against the rich. You’re dreaming if you think he won four terms on balanced budget promises.

                1. And you’re dreaming if you think he won the last 2 terms from anything other than killing Nazis and Japanese.

            3. Good point, and it succeded again for Presidents Mondale, McGovern and Dukakis.

              1. And Gore and Edwards and Drunk Kennedy, don’t forget Stevenson.

                Yep Class warfare is a sure winner for progs.

                1. Yep Class warfare is a sure winner for progs.

                  “… but… but… but this five-year plan is totally DIFFERENT, Comrade — !!!”

    3. Nobody listens anymore.

    4. The speeches are for independents and Obama spoke lied to them

      ftfy, though one could argue that Obama being the subject of “spoke” implies “lied”.

      1. Tulpa bitching about pols lying to the nation? Next up his rants about the alarmingly growing seduction of young people into (gasp) pre-marital sex!

        1. There’s nothing wrong with premarital sex.

          And of course it’s unsurprising to see you minimizing the sins of people in power. I think your tongue missed a pebble in the waffle of BO’s jackboots.

          1. Oh shit, dude, Tulpa just accused you of jackboot licking. That’s… that’s pretty bad. Like a college lefty calling you a Communist.

  75. I will not be able to watch another episode of Master Chef…. for this???

    1. I’m pretty fucking pissed about that. Master Chef is my favorite TV show. A lot better than Hell’s Kitchen as there is less politicking and more competition by merit.

      1. I never thought the Halo guy would tolerate having his show interrupted by this pencilneck dweeb of an executive.

        1. I’m pretty sure Gordon the Asshole, Joe the Prick, and Fat Guy are at least as mad as we are. Maybe not Fat Guy, but the other two have egos that could drive an aircraft carrier.

    2. Although, I gotta admit, this season of HK has some real hotties.

    3. Any sane person should be watching Monday Night Raw at this hour…

      1. Or Neve Campbell pouring champaign on Denise Richards’ bare chest.

        1. That never gets old.

        2. Just re-watched this and I really hope Ms. Richards had someone redo her implants since then. 10/10 everything except the Tijuana boob job.

          1. I could watch her in Starship Troopers all day long.

            1. I could watch her in Starship Troopers all day long.

              I liked that other one… the one the one guy got with when Denise Richards didn’t get with him.

              You know which one I’m talking about.

          2. She’s hideous now, dude.

            Of course I’m not as much of a stud as I was back then either, so not sure I should talk.

            1. She’s fine as hell at 40.

              1. Yeah, and I smell good for a math professor.

                1. She’s a good looking woman, she always has been. I question the taste of whoever did surgery on her tits, but whatever.

                  It’s not the math that makes you stink, tubby. Did you get into that diet and exercise thing yet or did you give up?

                  1. Down to 265, bitches.

                    1. Of course now I have to deal with the skin tags that are popping up like daisies. I’m thinking of attacking them with scissors but with my luck I’d get a staph infection and die.

                    2. I’ll take time out of my Tulpa-dragging to say, “Congrats, Tulpa!”

      2. Maybe Obama would learn a thing or two about cutting a decent promo if he did as well.

        1. Alberto del Rio, unlike Barack Obama, has Money in the Bank.

          1. Mysterio wins it tonight dude.

            1. And loses it to SuperCena.

  76. The GOP has essentially said “we won’t compromise one bit on taxes and our pet programs defense, veterans, and entitlements are off the table” in their cut, cap and balance approach. In other words it appears to be no compromise at all with their side giving absolutely nothing. Obama can point to cuts he’s offered. That may be great for “extremism in the defense of small government is no vice” types but to indies that is going to seem like wanting your cake and eating it too.

    1. The debt ceiling will be raised eventually, neither parties are capable of meaningful fiscal reform. What’s interesting are the concessions they will extract from the other partisans in the process.

    2. They plan on cutting spending for unicorn breeding programs.

      1. No, they are just going to decrease the rate of growth for the unicorn breeding programs.

        1. MNG, don’t you know that decreasing the rate of growth = spending cut in Washington D.C. speak?

          1. Yeah, that was kind of the basis of my joke there.

            1. I liked Joe’s unicorn joke better.

  77. Am I the only person who sees these “address to the nation” events and thinks of Kang from The Simpsons? “It makes no difference which one of us you vote for. Either way, your planet is doomed. DOOMED!”

    1. The two sweetest words in the English language:
      DEE / FAULT! / DEE / FAULT!

  78. Did anyone already post this?

    Ron Paul’s Pesky Neighbor

    I think it’s a really great analogy.

  79. I like how the problem is “the new members of Congress” when a large part of this mess was caused by the previous Congress’ inability to pass a budget for last year…

    1. Considering the debt ceiling has been raised year after year with budgets being passed I doubt your analysis there Tulpa. Having passed a budget doesn’t seem to ward off that goblin.

      1. The ceiling was last raised in 2006.

        And not passing a budget isn’t a problem? Shucks.

        1. “And not passing a budget isn’t a problem?”

          This goal post moving brought you in honor of the resolution of the NFL lockout.

    2. The new members of Congress are some of the least shitty. It’s the assholes that have been in office for ten, twenty, forty years or more that should be taking the blame.

  80. Sulky President Boy-King unilaterally rejected a bipartisan deal on the debt ceiling.

    Not all the whining and sniveling in the world on the parts of his increasingly desperate online apologists can, will or should change the bald and incontrovertible fact of this. Sorry.

    1. Hey, I’m not increasingly desperate. I’ve always been Barry’s bitch.

      1. I’ve always been Barry’s bitch.

        No lie. 😉

    2. “incontrovertible fact”? It’s a right wing blogger quoting an anonymous GOP aide. Let me know when McConnell cries foul in public.

  81. make the 2012 election a referendum on different approaches to budget policy and priorities

    Because we wouldn’t want it to be about jobs or anything people actually care about.

    1. Since the government can’t create jobs*, why not have the election actually be about something that’s within the proper role of government?

      *Government jobs don’t count, since they lose the government money while private sector jobs make the government money.

      1. We need fewer government employees. Hiring another platoon of bureaucrats won’t get the economy going.

        1. We need fewer government employees. Hiring another platoon of bureaucrats won’t get the economy going

          It sure helped the economy of my two new jet skis and Hawaii vacation.

          Did I mention I’m underpaid and underappreciated?

  82. Thanks reason. I started reading this thread at a bar doing standup, and I am now at a bar eating. Were it not for a long, drunken phone call fron my mom, I would ve super shitfaced by now



    So who is winning?

  84. America is an oogly moogly experiment in compromise.

    Ever since I saw the skinny black guy in the 7up commercial, you know the one who did the movie with Duchovney, say that, I haven’t been able to stop myself from doing it.

    Wait . . was he the one who got kicked off Gray’s Anatomy? No fucking way!

    1. Handsome suave dude.
      Ugly ass annoying bitch.
      Show never made sense.
      Woman goes to a man for advice to eat pussy.
      Makes no sense!
      The curly head gay kid from Endor all the decent looking chicks drooled over.
      Makes no sense!

  85. Geithner: “We Write 80 Million Checks A Month”

    Tragically, insofar as the Obamas and the Tonys and the MNGs of the world are concerned: this doesn’t even remotely qualify as a bug, but (rather) a-full-tilt-balls-out-“ON”-switch-for-the-OrgasmaTron feature.

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