Giffords Tucson Shooting

Suspect in Tucson Shooting Has History of Death Threats, "Nonsensical Outbursts"

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Jared Lee Loughner

Six people, including a federal judge and a nine year old girl born on September 11, 2001, were killed in yesterday's shooting in Tucson. Several others were injured, including Democratic Congresswoman Gabrielle Gifford, who was shot in the head, but is reported to be alive and responsive to certain simple commands. Police now have a suspect in custody, and the Arizona Daily Star has details on the alleged shooter's background

The suspected shooter is Jared Lee Loughner, a 22-year-old who lives on the northwest side. He is mentally unstable and may have had an accomplice, Pima County Sheriff Clarence Dupnik said Saturday evening.

A former classmate of Loughner at Pima, from which he was suspended Sept. 29 for code-of-conduct violations, said he was "obviously very disturbed."

"He disrupted class frequently with nonsensical outbursts," said Lynda Sorenson, who took a math class with Loughner last summer at Pima Community College's Northwest campus.

Dupnik said the suspected shooter has made death threats before and been contacted by law-enforcement officers. The threats weren't against Giffords, Dupnik said.

…Loughner's online accounts contain some political comments but are dominated by bizarre discussions of his desire to establish a new currency and his disdain for what he considered the public's low literacy rates. He also wrote threatening and despairing messages.

DanielFoster has collected screengrabs from several of the alleged shooter's YouTube videos, most of which consisted entirely of text set to music. In the text from those videos, Lougher writes about terrorism, U.S. currency, and revolution.

A screengrab from one of Loughner's YouTube videos.

According to The New York Times, members of Congress are planning to delay some legislative action, including a vote on the repeal of the health care overhaul, as a result of the shooting:

The House was set to vote Wednesday on the new Republican majority's proposal to repeal the health care law that had energized their supporters and ignited opposition from the Tea Party movement. Representative Eric Cantor of Virginia, the new majority leader, said Saturday that the vote and other planned legislative activity would be postponed.

The original health care legislation stirred strong feelings that flared at angry town hall meetings held by many Democratic lawmakers during the summer of 2009. And there has been broader anger and suspicion rising about the government, its finances and its goals, with the discourse partially fueled by talk shows and Web sites.

Tea Party activists also condemned the shooting. Judson Phillips, the founder of Tea Party Nation, noted on his Web site that Ms. Giffords is "a liberal," but added, "that does not matter now. No one should be a victim of violence because of their political beliefs."

But others said it was hard to separate what had happened from the heated nature of the debate that has swirled around Mr. Obama and Democratic policies of the past two years.

"It is fair to say—in today's political climate, and given today's political rhetoric—that many have contributed to the building levels of vitriol in our political discourse that have surely contributed to the atmosphere in which this event transpired," said a statement issued by the leaders of the National Jewish Democratic Council. Ms. Giffords is the first Jewish woman elected to the House from her state.

Rep. Raul Grijalva, another Democratic legislator from Tuscon, told TPM yesterday that "there's a lesson in this whole horror that we're going through—it's about the tone and the tenor of the debate."

"None of us get into this business thinking that we're risking life," he said. "But there's a tone of division hatred anger that's been part of the political dialogue for far too long. This might be an extremist, it might be an isolated case, but the fact that a person feels that an elected official is expendable because of a different set of views is not the American way. I hope there s a lesson people learn about that tone and tenor."

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  1. The tone has been the same for all of my forty four years. It’s probably been like this forever.

    1. Yes, and people have been complaining of the coarsening in tone for all of those years as well. Reason made a nice video about it.

    2. Americans are ahistorical. (Ironically, I don’t know if they’ve always been this way or if it’s something more recent.)

      I witnessed an online fight last night where some lefty had challenged a righty to provide evidence of left-wing violent rhetoric in modern times. When supplied evidence of everything from the Weather Underground to the Bush assassination movie, the guy responded — genuinely and earnestly — that “modern” means the last two or three years.

      As if history, the part that counts, started in 2008. It’s such a bizarre, flimsy way of processing reality.

      1. Given that the more energetic parts of the Left are constantly trying to reset the calendar to Year Zero, he has a point.

      2. Americans are ahistorical.

        History books in the us are on top selling lists all the time.

        Americans are the number one consumers of history and history related media world wide.

        I think your statement should be modified.

        “American’s news media and political pundits are intentionally ahistorical.”

        1. Being number one at “consuming history-related media” isn’t at all meaningful. It’s relative. It could mean 5 guys in Spokane consuming lots of media, but only 4 guys in Europe do. Big deal. It also doesn’t say whether the media itself has any real value or if those consumers are retaining any of the value that is there.

          I’m willing to bet the average American is ignorant of even basic historical facts, much less possessing an understanding of the contemporaneous historical context within which any events they have memorized occurred.

      3. I’ll let Comrade O’Brien handle this one:

        “Who controls the past controls the future. Who controls the present controls the past.” -O’Brien, 1984

  2. Can’t wait for the dems to bash Ron Paul and his desire to have money backed by gold and silver as just ‘fostering a climate of hate’.

  3. Idiot kid reminds me of Episiarch – a psychopath with a tenuous grasp on reality.

    1. I’m so torn — Episiarch behaved like an unconscionable douchebag in the other thread, and yet I loathe you as a worthless troll and scourge of everything I stand for.

      Jokers to the left of me, clowns to the right, here I am stuck in the middle with a bunch of prickly libertarians.

      1. I’ve never noticed you before I read yesterday’s thread today.

        Rep. Giffords should be honored here as one of the most libertarian Congress members – a fiscal hawk, pro-gun, pro-choice on social matters, etc.

        But the (D) by her name gives the bigots mental hives.

        1. shriek, tell us about all your short sells! Please, I need some more laughs.

        2. That’s why she got a D+ from the NRA and voted for Obamacare.

          Not that it matters, of course, it’s still horrific that she got shot.

          1. She opposed the DC gun ban and filed a brief with SCOTUS to kill it and no legislation has come since 2006 for her to vote on.

            I trust the NRA about as little as I do Operation PUSH – not at all.

            1. Yeah, like what does the NRA know about firearm rights?

              1. They are Christfags, all.

              2. Given their past history, I’d say “Not much”.

                JPFO forever.

        3. shrike, you have no place calling others “bigots”.

      2. clowns to the right

        From what I have read Episiarch is not right wing.

        My assessment is that he is of the min-anarchist wing of middle libertarianism.

        Shrike is on the militant anarchist, sort of libertarianish, wing of the left.

      3. Wahwahwahwahwahwahwahwahwahwah!!!!!

      4. Thanks for the excellent porn movie concept

    2. Episiarch hasn’t killed anyone that we know of.

    3. Oh, being insulted by shriek. It makes my day.

      This event is H&R’s own Heathers, and I’m Wynona Ryder. Pointing out all your false concerns and fake emotions. Oh noes, we care! And we’ll beat you over the head with it until you submit and agree that we care.

      You don’t care. And in a few days, you won’t even think of this event. But for now, a frenzy of false concern will occupy you, and you’ll feel so good, warmed by your pretentious concern trolling.

      Man, it burns you up when someone points this out, doesn’t it. Good. Someone needs to.

      1. Narcissistic personality disorder is a mental disorder in which people have an inflated sense of their own importance and a deep need for admiration. Those with narcissistic personality disorder believe that they’re superior to others and have little regard for other people’s feelings. But behind this mask of ultra-confidence lies a fragile self-esteem, vulnerable to the slightest criticism.

      2. Narcissistic personality disorder is a mental disorder in which people have an inflated sense of their own importance and a deep need for admiration. Those with narcissistic personality disorder believe that they’re superior to others and have little regard for other people’s feelings. But behind this mask of ultra-confidence lies a fragile self-esteem, vulnerable to the slightest criticism.

        1. Projection’s a bitch, isn’t it, dude.

          1. Underneath all this behavior often lies a fragile self-esteem. You have trouble handling anything that may be perceived as criticism. You may have a sense of secret shame and humiliation. And in order to make yourself feel better, you may react with rage or contempt and efforts to belittle the other person to make yourself appear better.

            1. It really bothers you to have your hypocrisy pointed out. Sorry if it stings, but, frankly, you deserve it. Again, how’s that projection working out for you, dude?

              1. When you have narcissistic personality disorder, you may not want to think that anything could be wrong ? doing so wouldn’t fit with your self-image of power and perfection. But by definition, narcissistic personality disorder causes problems in many areas of your life, such as relationships, work, school or your financial affairs. You may be generally unhappy and confused by a mix of seemingly contradictory emotions. Others may not enjoy being around you, and you may find your relationships unfulfilling.

                1. I’m laughing out loud right now, dude. Thank you. This is making my morning. Please be sure to post another installation within one to two minutes of my response, as I might have stopped laughing by then.

                  1. It’s not known what causes narcissistic personality disorder. As with other mental disorders, the cause is likely complex. Some evidence links the cause to a dysfunctional childhood, such as excessive pampering, extremely high expectations, abuse or neglect. Other evidence points to genetics or psychobiology ? the connection between the brain and behavior and thinking.

                    1. That was three minutes! Too long. I had to read other comments in the meantime.

                    2. Because personality traits can be difficult to change, therapy may take several years. The short-term goal of psychotherapy for narcissistic personality disorder is to address such issues as substance abuse, depression, low self-esteem or shame. The long-term goal is to reshape your personality, at least to some degree, so that you can change patterns of thinking that distort your self-image and create a realistic self-image.

                      Psychotherapy can also help you learn to relate better with others so that your relationships are more intimate, enjoyable and rewarding. It can help you understand the causes of your emotions and what drives you to compete, to distrust others and perhaps to despise yourself and others.

                      Good luck!

                    3. OK, two minutes is better. Do you have more?

                    4. Perhaps a DNA test would reveal that you are a direct descendant of the Borgia family. This analysis may prove lucrative for you.

                    5. This is actually pretty witty, shriek. Did you get lucid for a few seconds? And I am part Italian.

                    6. The Dago part, of course.

                    7. Attention whore uses yet another sockpuppet to call out someone for narcissism.

                      Alert: Irony levels reaching maximum saturation level. Attain minimum safe distance.

                    8. DANGER, SIGMUND FREUD! DANGER!

                    9. Protect the Queen!

                    10. Which one’s the queen?

            2. Comment board psycho-analysis. Is Miracle Whip an undergrad Psych student?

              1. Swarm! Swarm!

                1. Yes it’s all a conspiracy. Episiarch is the Big Boss and we are his lowly minions.

                  1. Protect the Queen!

          2. “projection’s a bitch.”

            I was going to say thing to you in regards to your comments about “fake emotions.”

            He’s right, only a narcissist, and borderline sociopath, would assume that no one else could react emotionally to seeing violence done to someone else: “Everyone must be the same as ME!”

      3. “You don’t care. And in a few days, you won’t even think of this event.”

        I think that’s not quite right in my case. I _shouldn’t_ care and hopefully in a few days I won’t. As I said before, awful things happen to the young and innocent all over the world on a daily basis, and if I treated each like a personal tragedy, the only way I’d get out of bed and leave the house would be to throw myself off an overpass.

        So the death of this 9 year old girl shouldn’t be bothering me to the extent that it actually has so far. No it hasn’t bothered me like it was personal (thank god), but I haven’t shrugged it off, because news reports and the constant discussions on the internet keep reminding me of it. Go to a baseball site, there it is. Go to a soccer site, there it is. Go to a midget porn site, there it is.

        I don’t like dead 9 year olds. I know that it happens a bunch whether I like it or not. My coping mechanism is ignoring that reality and getting on with my life. This story is not helping me with that.

        Now I realize this may be just be me. From what I can observe, a lot of other folks, at least outwardly, seem to handle the topic of death better than I do. I’ve got the entire Two Shoes album from Cat Empire on my MP3 player except for Protons, Neutrons, Electrons because I can’t take the subject matter (IE, death). Maybe this counts as a personal failing, but not one I’ve found a way to do much about.

        1. No one likes people being shot for no reason, dude. But let’s be real, here; all the concern trolls–which is half the people commenting here–are merely masturbating. They don’t care. They want to be seen as caring, being it fills some sick need of theirs. They can post on the internet until our eyes bleed, but they won’t actually do anything; they won’t send money to aid the families of the slain; they won’t do shit. But they’ll tell us endlessly how much they fucking care. How hypocritical. How worthless.

          1. How much money have you sent to the victims of drug raid shootings, Episiarch? Have you done anything besides post on the internet to help them?

            If not, by your own standard you don’t care about victims of police shootings.

            1. When you find me caterwauling on about how much I care, you can try and hold me up to my own “standard”, asshole. There was a reason I referenced Heathers, subgenius. If you can’t get it, it’s not my problem.

              1. C’mon, Epi, no one should be forced to watch that movie. I love Winona Ryder, and even I won’t watch that movie again…

                1. 🙁

              2. I apologize for not sharing your extensive knowledge of chick flicks. In any case, when you say the people who claim to care are hypocrites, that means you’re saying they don’t really care.

                1. “Chick flicks”?!? Holy shit, you’re even more of a douche than I thought possible. Really? Wow.

                  “Football season is over, Veronica. Kurt and Ram had nothing left to offer the school except for date rapes and AIDS jokes.”

            2. To me, the difference between these victims and drug war victims is that this is random and unpreventable, whereas drug war violence is something that political will and “awareness” could actually have an effect on.

            3. My mom did some charity work with her work, and wound up working with this woman and her charity. I wound up meeting her and her family at a party at my parents house.

              Her story is just awful, I mean things like this just shouldn’t happen to people. But just how much can you reasonably empathize with people who have suffered this way before the sheer massive scope of evil in the world consumes and paralyzes you.

              At some point you have to decide to _not care_ or at least not care in the same way you would if it happened to someone close to you.

              I don’t have a problem with Episarch’s attitude. Yes it’s a similar attitude to a sociopath, but that doesn’t make him a sociopath. It’s a fairly logical attitude. It’s the attitude I think we all ultimately come around to in cases like this after a little while. Why should he be blamed for getting there quicker than I will?

              Empathy is an important human emotion, but it’s not the final word. Life would not be worth living if it was.

          2. No one likes people being shot for no reason,

            Actually I prefer that slightly to people’s being shot for a reason. If it was for a reason, that means that on top of getting hurt, somebody was angry at somebody else. All things considered, better people not be angry.

            Well, OK, there’s an exception in case the reason for the shooting was coercion or benefit of some sort. In that case, it’s slightly better that there was a reason, because that means that the shooter at least likely got something s/he wanted. All things considered, better that someone get what they want than not.

          3. Episiarch, I don’t have anything productive to say about your basic stance here (the cynicism doesn’t feel totally unfamiliar, trust me). But I did want to point out that I think you’ve been misusing the phrase “concern troll.”

          4. I call “Straw Bullshit Man” to Episiarch’s claim. Is anyone saying that he would care about someone being shot in the same way he would care about a family member? To the same degree? I haven’t seen that. All some of us are saying is that if you see real people getting shot and killed on tv, it sucks. It’s, at least for a fleeing moment, sickening. But that doesn’t mean, I’m sitting around mourning or weepy like I would if it were a relative or a friend. But Epi would have you believe that “fuck the politician” is actually the more honest, initial response (and to sell his argument he builds his phony straw man). Well, for him and people like him, I can believe that. Hopefully they’re in the minority.

            1. Another example. I’ve seen people jumping from burning buildings on tv and it always gives me a sick feeling. I’m not thinking of what their profession or politics are. I just feel socked in the gut and sorry to see it happen. But okay, the next day, I’m right as rain. Maybe even just a little while after turning off the tv. But that doesn’t mean it’s b.s. how I actually felt when I saw it. It’s not more honest to say, “Hey look, there goes another shitbag burning, falling politician!” Not more honest for some of us anyway.

  4. Didn’t the left also try to blame the Times Square thing on the right, only to look like giant morons when it turned out the guy was a Muslim?

    1. Then there was this guy too.

    2. They’ll keep doing it until one day, by random chance, one actually sticks.

    3. Daily Kos shut up about the Times Square guy as soon as they found out he wasn’t a fat, white Rush Limbaugh listener.

  5. “there’s a lesson in this whole horror that we’re going through?it’s about the tone and the tenor of the debate.”

    How about this for tone? – Raul Grijalva is a thug, jumps to shameless, self-serving conclusions, and is a dishonest, power-suck-up, maifa shill.

    Tenor later.

    1. The first link is particularly good – thanks

    2. OMGZ! It’s all Sarah Palin’s fault!!!!!!11!

      1. Yeah, that’s the gist of everything I’m seeing. She’s got some kind of mind control program happening – so is she now considered a Bond bad guy?

        1. Check out Johnny Longtorso’s links if you haven’t – brilliant stuff.

          Man, I can’t wait till I pick up my 1911! I think I’m going to name it “Sarah Palin”. Get it engraved right into it. That’ll get some people excited…

        2. I meant the ones below, since this one was obviously…you know what I mean….:)

        3. As my friend John wrote when I echoed Mr. Simpson’s wish from Simpson cartoons (“I want to work for Scorpio.”), “Sure, why work for a scum bag when you can work for a super villain?”

      2. I don’t care for Sarah Palin at all, but the left’s insanity the last couple of days makes me dislike her a lot less.

    3. The first link is pretty good but its message of careful reflection rather than knee-jerk reactions is contradicted by the giant STOP THE MOSQUE ad at the bottom, featuring the Dome of the Rock next to a burning WTC.

  6. Kos: 2010 will be primary season
    …Who to primary? Well, I’d argue that we can narrow the target list by looking at those Democrats who sold out the Constitution last week. I’ve bolded members of the Blue Dogs for added emphasis….

    …Giffords, Gabrielle (AZ-08)…

  7. Wow, deja vu. This is so much like the way these same people condemned the heated rhetoric coming from Islam when Nidal shot up Fort Hood.

  8. Suki, take your meds and go lay down.

    1. Says the guy with the Ayn Rand character handle.

  9. So Community Colleges are the new “hotbed of violence”, right? Cause this guy went to community college, and (allegedly) shot the FUCK out of bunch of people…

    So, we should ban ocmmunity colleges? Right?

    1. We need to ban everything and let the government decide what to allow to be built up again.

      1. Tulpa, that is a sublime idea.

      2. Let me be clear.

        My team and I have already started looking into how to implement this.

    2. As a community college faculty member, I might support banning them.

      1. When community colleges are outlawed, only outlaws will attend community college.

    3. So, we should ban ocmmunity colleges? Right?

      Ban pre-algebra in community college, yes.

    1. Wait, wait, wait….so Sarah Palin, Sean Hannity, Ronald Reagan’s ghost, Dick Cheney, the Republican Party, Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh and the Tea Partiers are now considered “left-wing”?

      Cause that’s who got in this guy’s head, right? Cause they’re the only entities/people who create an environment that leads to violence, right? So…QED. Got it – they’re “left wingers” now.

      Man, you gotta have a scorecard these days…

  10. It is getting ridiculous with what is being attributed as the cause of this. Crazy people have committed atrocities through all times. Oswald, mcveigh, the unabomber, the guy that tried to kill reagan etc. But this is too much of a good political opportunity to pass up. Again showing how morally bankrupt members in congress are…

  11. Also, I thought the Chiefs would fare a lot better against the Ravens. They don’t look so hot right now – down 23-7 @ 13:00 of the 4th.

    Shit. Hope the second game is better (assuming no brilliant, exciting, last-minute comeback, etc. etc.).

    1. I can’t believe the Seahawks won. I was at Uwajimaya during the game, which is right across the street from Qwest, and the noise was unreal. People were freaking out.

      1. You were at Uwajimaya? Cool. Next time could you hold up a sign so I can take a picture. I want to practice some air nut kicking in my apartment.

      2. Which of the 500 lunatics in that area are you?

        Glad I at least moved out of the ID. Your post reinforces the wisdom of that decision.

    2. 30-7 now with 4:30 left.

      The Chiefs are playing like the She-hawks were expected to.

      1. Yeah, shit. Wow. This is a bitch slapping supreme.

        Better luck next year, KC!

  12. Video killed the radio star. Who did Episiarch kill?

    “My front lawn?”

    CORRRRRRECT!!

      1. Not first ranguage. So Solly!

  13. it might be an isolated case, but the fact that a person feels that an elected official is expendable because of a different set of views is not the American way.

    The fact that an elected official feels himself to be in any way superior or more socially “useful” than any other citizen is not the American way.

    Flaming bags of dogshit for you.

  14. So the death of this 9 year old girl shouldn’t be bothering me to the extent that it actually has so far.

    Perhaps this will help.

    his fusillade killed six others, including Christina, a 9-year-old who loved animals and volunteered at a children’s charity.

    She was special from birth because she was born on Sept. 11, 2001, and she was proud of it, her mother said, because it lent a grace note of hope to that terrible day.

    ….

    Indeed, Christina, who was born when the family was living in West Grove, Pennsylvania, was one of the 50 “Faces of Hope” representing babies from 50 states who were born on 9/11. Their images were printed in a book, with some of the proceeds used to raise money for a 9/11 charity.

    She’s not a little girl, she’s an emoticon.

    1. Could it be she was the primary target, picked for the sheer irony?

    2. But that’s really other people’s BS, not the little girl’s fault. If Dan Shaughnessy were to bust into my house and gun me down screaming “DIE, STAT GEEK,” all the stuff to follow about overheated rhetoric from the sportspages and the tragedy should be an event for both sides to rally around, blah, blah, blah would all be someone else’s nonsense. I’d still be pissed about being dead and the sloganeering of others is irrelevant.

      So yeah, I still feel bad for the little girl. She’s just a little girl, even if the adults around her before this and after this seemed to forget that at times.

      1. no shit. I come to this board to read the crazy, but in the past 24 hours I’ve actually been a little sickened. Fucking lunatics everywhere. I wonder what the mental illness to poster ratio is here.

      2. There’s some connections, too. Christina Green is the granddaughter of Dallas Green who was the first manager to lead the Phillies to a World Series. She was the only girl on her little league team.

        I write a space newsletter. Congresswoman Giffords’ husband will be the last US Space Shuttle commander and her brother-in-law is the current commander of the Space Station.

    3. She’s not a little girl, she’s an emoticon.

      She’s the inspiration for the eponymous “Christina’s Law”. Make the use of cross-hairs in a graphic a Federal felony!

    4. She’s also the grand-daughter of former Phillies manager Dallas Greene.

    1. Headline: Republican says anything other than full-throated hatred of Sarah Palin and the Tea Party, Lefties curse them out

      *applies to any nutroots site*

    1. Accept there is no statistical correlation showing increased schizophrenia within nations that have high levels of cannabis use. I don’t deny that cannabis might augment somebody’s personality disorder rather than treat it, but large numbers of people with mental illness will seek out drugs with which to self medicate. I’d argue that marijuana may have prevented this young man from going off the deep end up until now. For all we know, he could have killed earlier had he had no access to marijuana.

      Yes this might be self serving as I am a libertarian and an avid marijuana smoker. I wonder how many government watch lists I’d show up on? Being a mild mannered guy, every time I hear another story about crazy libertarians or crazy marijuana smokers, I get pretty nervous. Oh great, now I’m a paranoid, libertarian, pot head. Oh my god, oh my god, oh my god!

      1. Those people standing over there? They know you’re stoned!

        1. If NutSandwichGuy had been a meth-head, I could accept the “drug use is a factor in the shooting” concept. But not marijuana use. No fuckin’ way.

  15. She’s just a little girl, even if the adults around her before this and after this seemed to forget that at times.

    You’re absolutely right, of course, but I cannot help thinking she will be used as a bludgeon by people (surprise!) solely interested in the political utility of a weird coincidence. As she apparently was for much of her brief life.

  16. I can’t wait till I pick up my 1911!

    Don’t you see, you poor deluded fool?

    In Amerika, 1911 picks up you! And fires you indiscriminately into the crowd of innocent bystanders.

  17. Am I the only one who finds the 9/11 references a little tacky?

    1. No, actually. I was wondering if anyone else would comment on them. Truly cringeworthy.

      1. Too soon?

        Just got a fundraising letter from His Ex-Gubernatorialness Mr. Ridge begging for money for the Flight 93 memorial.

  18. A history of death threats, just like the Tea Party!

    1. Yes. Berkowitz’s neighbor’s dog also had a history of death threats.

  19. And a history of nonsensical outbursts, just like Keith Olbermann!

  20. I’m glad to come over here and get a break from the wailing and rending of garments elsewhere.

  21. Our elected officials, Republicans and Democrats alike, condemn this terrible, and ultimately unavoidable and unpredictable event, in which innocent men, women, and children were killed by an insane man.

    These same officials, every one of them completely sane, are killing innocent men, women, and children in Afghanistan on a fairly regular, predictable basis. Not once every few years, but every few weeks.

    http://www.rawa.org/temp/runew…..mp;mggal=6

    Innocents being violently killed here by a madman is a “tragedy.” Overseas, innocents being violently killed by perfectly sane Americans is a “political reality.”

  22. So why is Congress delaying their business/votes?

  23. In his book “Wingnuts: How the Lunatic Fringe is Hijacking America” Daily Beast author John Avlon speaks about how such incendiary rhetoric –both left and right– may well unleash a “whirlwind” of violence. He can be seen in an hour long interview with John Roberts (who is moving from CNN to FOX News) on BookTV. Well worth watching http://www.booktv.org/search.aspx?For=wingnuts

    1. No thanks, you randy man.

    2. I don’t think we can really base society around what might set off violent schizophrenics. Institutionalization of the dangerous and insane might be a better option — the guy was clearly nuts and scared the hell of people before, so why was he roaming free?

  24. “‘It is fair to say?in today’s political climate, and given today’s political rhetoric?that many have contributed to the building levels of vitriol in our political discourse that have surely contributed to the atmosphere in which this event transpired,’ said a statement issued by the leaders of the National Jewish Democratic Council.”

    No, it is not “fair to say” any such thing. You can’t just assume direct or indirect causal connections between two events.

    If you want to even begin to argue that the way that political discussions are conducted in this country had anything to do with this shooting, the burden is on you to show that Loughner drew encouragement from the tenor of these debates. If you’re going to go further and name names – like, I don’t know, Sarah Palin – you’re going to have to show that Loughner knew what she said and was inspired to kill based on her statements.

    If you can’t do those things, then you’re just trying to score political points off a sad and bloody event, and you should be ashamed of yourself.

    1. It used to be you needed correlation to suggest causation, even in politics. Even that simplest of pretexts no longer applies.

  25. weird… looking at his youtube, people have notice giffords actually subscribed to loughners channel and it is not like she subcribed to everybody, just loughner and another rep.

    1. This one gets funner and funner as the time passes.

  26. I’m surprised no one has pointed out the real culprit: the Bush tax cuts. With less discretionary income, this man would not have been able to afford all the bullets.

  27. I’m sure glad all you tough guys with small penises get your guns while nine year olds die. Must make you feel real adequate.

    1. Nah, not adequate. Confident. Confident that if I found myself in a similar situation, I’d actually be able to defend myself. Not be a willing victim.

      Please though, think whatever makes you feel better.

    2. Yep, as soon as I stopped buying guns, 9 year olds stopped dying.

      MAJICK!

      1. Strange.. I have not purchased a single firearm for over 25 year, and still little girls die..

        Ahh shucks.. I still buy ammo regularly. Could that be the problem?

  28. Shooting suspect’s nihilism rose with isolation

    Say what you will about the tenets of libertarianism, at least it’s an ethos.

    1. Both friends spoke on condition of anonymity, saying they wanted to avoid the publicity surrounding the case. To them, the question was classic Jared: confrontational, nonlinear and obsessed with how words create reality.

      Poor Soul. The Structuralist vs. Deconstructionist battle was like the Vietnam War to the brave men and women who signed up for the Linguistic and Language Dept. of America’s Universities back in the 60’s. Forty years later, and my God, the causalities are still piling up.

      1. Only if you accept an assassination attempt as a text.

        1. Believe me, if you ever read the debate, they couldn’t.

        2. Believe me, if you ever read the debate, you would know without doubt, they couldn’t.

          (accidentally deleted that clause)

  29. Nonsensical outbursts! He poeted here?

    1. On a haiku day.

    2. Why are you so A-verse to it?

      1. 🙂 *chortle*

  30. What a premonition by Mark Penn, what did he know, hmm?: obama needs an oklahoma city bombing

  31. None of us get into this business thinking that we’re risking life

    Raul Grijalva must have failed history class.

    1. Quite sociopathic of him, actually, not to even consider the possibility that his decisions and actions may cause others to react in a negative or violent manner. After all, there has to be some threshold as Ceausescu found out.

      1. I was thinking Charles I, but yeah, that works too.

  32. You know, the more we find out about this guy, the more apparent it is that his actions are IN NO WAY connected to anything Palin or Beck or Limbaugh have said.

    If there is any political leaning to be discerned from his history, statements, and reports from his classmates, he is probably a left anarchist.

    I really don’t see how a pot smoking graffiti artist who likes to burn flags and rails about how free education is guarenteed by the constitution, is going to be inspired by a Sarah Palin campaign poster.

    It’s just fucking nuts to draw any connection between the two at all. The guy was not a Tea Partier, he was not any sort of mainstream conservative, he wan’t even a neo-nazi. He was an uncategorizable loon who was absorbed in his own delusions.

    1. 9/11 Truther, too.

      If you forwarded the “Spare Change” video, you contributed to the Climate of Vitriol(tm) that caused this shooting.

      1. Where did you want me? I can temp for Vitriol!

    2. No one as narcissistic as this guy would have himself pigeonholed. I’m not sure that absolves Palin, Beck, and Limbaugh for spreading their antigovernment paranoia. Whether it has anything to do with the crime at all, it’s still a dangerous toxin.

      1. Dear Gog you are such a fucking idiot.

        1. Notice he completely leaves out pro-government paranoia…

    3. He might not have been a neo-nazi, but he seemed to be a grammar nazi.

  33. According to the New York Times if you disagree with the Times or the Washington Establishment then blood from Tuscon stains your hands.

    ?it is legitimate to hold Republicans and particularly their most virulent supporters in the media responsible for the gale of anger that has produced the vast majority of these threats, setting the nation on edge. Many on the right have exploited the arguments of division, reaping political power by demonizing immigrants, or welfare recipients, or bureaucrats. They seem to have persuaded many Americans that the government is not just misguided, but the enemy of the people.

    That they use this incident as they have used so many before this as an excuse to advance an anti-libertarian agenda is all the more reason to be armed and weary of the bastards. It’s not a social contract we share with them, it is a hostage situation, and they really get pissed when the hostages get lippy.

    1. I’m pretty sure “Government” killed more of “the people” on saturday then the reverse.

      But thats just a gut shot opinion.

    2. These posts expressing sympathy for a mass murderer are really harshing the “don’t blame us” vibe.

      1. My God, you are a fucking idiot who can’t even parse the simplest meaning from words and phrases.

        1. If Boehner had been shot, I’d be dancing a fucking waltz right now.

  34. it is legitimate to hold Republicans and particularly their most virulent supporters in the media responsible for the gale of anger that has produced the vast majority of these threats, setting the nation on edge.

    Flag-burning liberal atheist 9/11 Truther kills Republican-appointed judge; New York Times blames the GOP.

  35. “nonsensical outbursts”

    Quick, grab the ativan and straight jacket and head to the NYTimes. Krugman is at it again.

  36. ?it is legitimate to hold Republicans and particularly their most virulent supporters in the media responsible for the gale of anger that has produced the vast majority of these threats, setting the nation on edge. ???? ????? ??? ??????? ????? ??? ??????? Many on the right have exploited the arguments of division, reaping political power by demonizing immigrants, or welfare recipients, or bureaucrats. They seem to have persuaded many Americans that the government is not just misguided, but the enemy of the people.

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