Have a Merry War on Christmas

Here's a special holiday message from Glenn Garvin, television columnist for the Miami Herald and a contributing editor at Reason:

Consider the possibility that there's something seriously wrong with you. I mean, really. It's Christmas Day and you're reading a TV blog on the computer instead of counting your loot or bonding with loved ones or smugly contemplating the superiority of your own religious beliefs. (They worship somebody who was born in a manger?) Stranger yet is that you'd think I'm here writing something on Christmas Day. Do you think I don't have a life?

At the very least, I figure you're pretty sick of the whole Christmas business. So, here's an alternative: Watch the world's most peculiar Christmas TV programming marathon. The TV Guide Network is screening the 1987 film Dirty Dancing for 12 straight hours starting at noon. I don't know why. The whole movie takes place in the summer, so there's not some misty Christmas ending to it. It's just Patrick Swayze and Jennifer Grey dancing to a pretty cool 1960s soundtrack (and no, it does not include Brenda Lee or Rocking Around The Christmas Tree). Oh, and bad-mouthing Ayn Rand novels. But as far as I know, she didn't write about Christmas. Though you gotta think she probably admired Santa for taking his workshop offshore, away from the prying eyes of OSHA and the NLRB. If those elves wanted to work for all the sugarplums they could eat instead of minimum wage, that was their business, right? I can see it now -- The Christmas Sweatshop, An Epic Novel of Capital Formation and Voluntary Association.

Anyway, we're getting off the subject here. Dirty Dancing. Noon. TV Guide Channel. I don't really have any other insights. I'm sorry you didn't get the stuff you wanted for Christmas. Ayn Rand would say it serves you right for lying around like a welfare-state slug expecting somebody to give you something instead of working for it. But I don't have time to talk about it. I've gotta go before the elves start snorting mistletoe again. Merry -- oh, forget it. Just turn on the TV, okay?

Note from Reason management: You are not actually obliged to watch the Dirty Dancing marathon. Enjoy the day however you see fit, with family, with friends, or, if all else fails, with the commenters here at Hit & Run.

Comments

[Fist of Etiquette]

It's Christmas Day and you're reading a TV blog on the computer instead of counting your loot or bonding with loved ones or smugly contemplating the superiority of your own religious beliefs.

I can do all of those things at the same time. But they talked about Rand in Dirty Dancing? I just wonder the context. (But not enough to turn on TV Guide Network.)

And they show movies on the TV Guide Network? I suppose they have TV Guide Network 2 now for playing nothing but the scrolling schedule grid. That won't last.

And they still have a Miami Herald?

Merry Christmas, Ms. Rand, wherever you are!

[Kolohe]

The owner's rich preppy jackass son gave a copy of the Fountainhead (I think) to Baby, and said "some people matter, some people don't"

[The Libertarian Guy]

I'm a poor non-union workin' man, and I gave my kid a copy of The Road to Serfdom . Used bookstore copy.

He read it front to back, did a great book report on it, and the teacher gave him a D - she told me it was due to the subject, with which she vehemently disagreed - and I took the matter up-level to the superintendent, who made her change it to a B+ grade. Her ass got chewed out, thankfully.

So, what was your point again, Kolohe?

[The Libertarian Guy]

I think I missed the snark factor, Kolhoe, as well as the Dirty Dancing reference. My bad. I retract my above and reserve it for some Tonyesque poster.

[John Tagliaferro]

In this day and age . . .

Wait, why try to kid myself? I am surprised I have not heard more of this.

[smartass sob]

and the teacher gave him a D - she told me it was due to the subject, with which she vehemently disagreed

Good ol' leftist academia.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Got that right, smartass... I went round and round with more than one teacher over various liberal horseshits.

I'm just glad my kid's out of school - if he were in elementary now, I'd be getting kicked out of the building for disagreeing with the policy of confiscating every kid's school supplies and putting them in a "community" bin. Fuck that shit.

[Ron L]

You'd love Steven Landsburg jawing with his kid's teacher over environmental religion ("The Armchair Economist").
It would have been funny if it weren't so depressing.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Where can it be found?

[Ron L]

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb.....Armchair+E

[Ron L]

Oops; that didn't work.
Stick the title in the Amazon search area.
~$10, a good read...

[The Libertarian Guy]

Sweet. Thanks for the tip, bro.

[TimC]

No, the community bin is a great idea; just make sure all the parents know, and therefore none of them will buy their kids very many or very good school supplies!

[db]

I agree. This would offer a perfect lesson in the practical outcomes of collectivism, one undoubtedly bleaker than what the students will find in history class.

[The Libertarian Guy]

That's what I tell parents when discussing this - and there's been a lot of parents sending their kids on the first day of school with no supplies at all.

One of them sent their kid with one-half of a pencil and one sheet of notebook paper. THAT was a wicked burn.

What gets me more is the schools that use this barbaric collectivist nonsense. Not surprising, but still sad.

[Who's Sean Hannity]

Good thing about anecdotal evidence, i can ignore the reams of school supply lists all across the walmarts of the land.

[The Libertarian Guy]

What, your area schools don't force kids to hand over their supplies "for the common good"?

I figured you'd be all for that sort of shit.

[Fl0yd]

Wow, you sure pummeled that straw-man to the ground, libertarian guy.
And you built that straw-man all by yourself.

[The Libertarian Guy]

What straw man?

[The Libertarian Guy]

And have the kidlings read The Rainbow Fish right after they're done watching Gore's we're-all-gonna-die docudrama movie.

Now that's a trifecta of child abuse.

[Fl0yd]

"I am libertarian guy and I make shit up and then denounce it!
Libertarian guy, slayer of self-assembled straw-men!"

[The Libertarian Guy]

I'm not a liberal, therefore I don't make shit up.

[Blitzkrieg]

"I'm a poor non-union workin' man"

Is that something to proudly proclaim? That you're lazy and dumb?

Take evening classes.
Improve your lot in life.

Stop whining online.

[The Libertarian Guy]

At least I don't live on the dole, Blitzkreig. What's your welfare footprint?

And way to miss the point, which isn't surprising.

Besides, if I made more, you liberal cocksuckers would just take half of it in taxes. Why should I give you that kind of satisfaction? Liberals hate successful people unless they're successful liberals, which makes your screed above all the more curious.

But at least I don't sit around and wait for The Monthly Check. How does that feel, by the way?

[Blitzkrieg]

At least I don't live on the dole, Blitzkreig. What's your welfare footprint?

Yes, because anyone who isn't a rugged individualist libertarian is on welfare.

Besides, if I made more, you liberal cocksuckers would just take half of it in taxes.

That's the reason. That's why there aren't any rich people in the US, since they've all gone Galt together with you. It's not that your skills aren't worth shit and that you're too lazy and stupid to improve your situation.

Nope, must be the "liberals" keeping you down.

[The Libertarian Guy]

You think you know what you're talking about, but you're just bullshitting now.

I own my home outright. I make enough to pay the bills and have creature comforts. But if I made "evil rich white man" money, you fuckers would want at least half of it to pay for your get-everyone-on-the-dole Ponzi scheme. You'd be joining the Derision Chorus about how "the top wage-earners" are keeping the little man down because the rich only pay 34.5 cents on the dollar in taxes.

Fuck you. YOU can live like that, but I refuse handouts.

You poor, pitiful fool. Why do you even come here, when there's DemocraticUnderground just a click away? Is there some need buried in your psyche to rail against people who want government to leave them the fuck alone and not dip into their paychecks to pay for stupid, failed, pointless "war on povery" programs?

I can answer my earlier question, though: Your welfare footprint is huge, and you're proud of it.

[Blitzkrieg]

Fuck you. YOU can live like that, but I refuse handouts.

Yes, all the millionaires and billionaires in the US are all on welfare and accepting handouts.

You poor, pitiful fool. Why do you even come here, when there's DemocraticUnderground just a click away? Is there some need buried in your psyche to rail against people who want government to leave them the fuck alone and not dip into their paychecks to pay for stupid, failed, pointless "war on povery" programs?

Did I ruin your perfect echo chamber by disagreeing with you?

Tough shit.

If your ideology is so weak that you cannot even accept some opposing views without throwing a hissy fit then maybe it deserves to die.

[The Libertarian Guy]

No, but it would be nice to have some thoughtful opposing views. You can't even be original - note your pathetic "if it weren't for government, I couldn't get to work on time or feed myself properly" post below.

Nice use of rich-people-suck cliches at the top, though. Shows where your loyalties lie.

[Fl0yd]

By using public schools, public roads, etc. you are part of what you foolishly think is "the problem", libertarian guy.

How is that not a truthful critique of your hypocrisy?

[The Libertarian Guy]

I don't have much choice BUT to use them. Besides, I pay for it... why not recoup my taxes in the process?

But do tell us how more government, less private-sector input, higher taxes, and higher energy costs will make America better.

I can't wait for your pathetic answer.

[Fl0yd]

There's always choice, you lying shithead.

[The Libertarian Guy]

1. No, there isn't always choice.

2. You are so blinded by your liberal ideology, you think everything that doesn't fit it, is a lie. I can't help you with that, as I'm no psychologist. But there are people out there qualified in that area. I suggest you find one.

3. You didn't answer my question. Not surprising, as cowards rarely do.

[oaktownadam]

haha, and here we have the usual liberal go-to argument: if you don't like it, you don't have to use it!

What they leave off the end of that argument is "as long as you keep paying for it".

That's what liberals consider "opt-out"...keep paying for the stuff you don't like, and give up your claim to any of the benefits.

[The Libertarian Guy]

"must be the 'liberals' keeping you down"

They sure as fuck don't help matters. Raising taxes, increasing the size, scope, and cost of government, and jacking up energy prices in the name of bullshit global warming won't fix a damned thing.

You'll disagree, of course, being programmed as you are.

[Tony]

Strange how of all the things interfering with your life you choose the exact things FOX news thinks we should all be concerned with most.

[qwerty]

Of course, because there were no libertarians at all until FOX news brainwashed us.

[Ron L]

Do you watch FOX news?

[The Libertarian Guy]

The government cheerleaders here are thick lately, querty. More than usual.

I do find it amusing that the ones most critical of working-class folks, are the ones who claim to be on their side. Guess one must vote Democrat AND be poor, to be in their good graces.

What a bunch of hypocrites.

[Fl0yd]

Libertarian guy, You are tiny and weak and the only reason you're still alive is because of the government protecting you.

You use public infrastructure, publicly subsidized resources, you're protected by the government in matters medicinal, criminal as well as financial and yet you foolishly think you're self-sufficient and a "self-made" man without any need for a government.

I really wish you'd put all your money in a financial entity not insured by FDIC and then lose it all.

But you won't because you love that government insurance, you pathetic little maggot.

You are a loser in today's capitalist society and you'd be a loser in a libertarian society.

The only difference is that today's capitalist society isn't as Darwinian as the deregulated libertarian nightmare you foolishly long for.

In your libertopia, you'd have no money, no property, and you'd be bleeding to death while your kidneys are being extracted and your son is being sold as a sex slave.

[The Libertarian Guy]

*yawn* Hey, was that another big-government-is-always-good post? I see so many, they kind of blend together...

[oaktownadam]

"Libertarian guy, You are tiny and weak and the only reason you're still alive is because of the government protecting you."

Yeah, because the government "protects" him from people like you, whose moral and ethical system allows you to take what isn't yours, because you feel entitled to it.

At least, that was how the Founders envisioned it.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Common sense, Tony. I watch maybe fifteen, twenty minutes of FNC a week, IF that. But thanks for the assumption.

But do tell us how raising taxes and energy prices, and increasing the already-unwieldy federal bureaucracy, will actually help in the long run. I can hear all those jobs thunderin' across the plain as we speak! [/snark]

[Ron L]

Blitzkrieg|12.25.09 @ 5:31PM|#
"Yes, all the millionaires and billionaires in the US are all on welfare and accepting handouts."

Well, not all of them, but I'm gonna guess you're not real familiar with the concept of 'rent seeking'. Or you're being cute ignoring it.

[Fl0yd]

Why, that's nothing but class warfare and envy of those better than you!
For shame!

[Liberal Example]

In order to be a good citizen, one must be receiving federal aid. Otherwise, they are free-thinking individuals with their own support systems, which is a danger to the public and must be curtailed as quickly as possible.

[Barack Obama]

Class warfare is one of My duties, FlOyd. Know your place, and go back to your job of making money so I can take more than My fair share and redistribute it.

I have spoken. Obey.

[Matthew]

Since when does "poor=lazy"? Or dumb?
Also how is it whining?

If you're a troll, it's weak trolling and if you're sincere, you're an idiot.

Take your pick.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Chad tried this line of logic with me, and it was just as weak and laden with hypocrisy - liberals are, in theory, supposed to care about the poor.

With other peoples' money, of course.

[Blitzkrieg]

It's your own "libertarian logic" applied to your situation, Sparky.

[The Libertarian Guy]

You don't understand anything that isn't ladled out by a hack from D.C., do you, Blitzkrieg?

Troll elsewhere, traitor.

[Who's Sean Hannity]

He or she's got you there, or maybe you all don't want to admit the Phil Gramm love you showered about a year ago.

Back when Reason libertarians were saying the recession was all in our heads and Phil Gramm was on to something.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Count me out on the Phil Gramm love... I trust exactly one sitting politician: Ron Paul. The rest can die in a DC nuke attack, and I wouldn't lose one second of sleep over the loss.

[Fl0yd]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!
RON PAUL!
MASTER OF GOLD!
RON PAUL!
IS NOT ENUMERATED IN THE CONSTITUTION!
RON PAAAAAAAAAUUUUUUUUUUUUULL!!!

I bet you put your life-savings in gold as well, you easily deluded fool.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Better there than trusting the Fed.

[WHo's Sean Hannity]

Then you should be reading a different magazine, it seems people here think differently than you.

[Blitzkrieg]

Since when does "poor=lazy"? Or dumb?

Isn't it obvious?
Anyone who is poor simply isn't working hard enough!

And the fact that he can't figure out that he's not working hard enough mean that he's stupid.

Also how is it whining?

He's posting that he's a poor non-union workin' man as if we're supposed to feel sorry for him instead of contempt for not being bootstrappy enough.

The free market helps those who help themselves.
So sayeth St. Rand.

[The Libertarian Guy]

I said nothing of the sort, and you goddamned well know it.

You're just pissed because I refuse to take welfare. I'm not plugged in to your Godvernment programs. Fuck that, I'd rather starve than eat food bought with money taken from the pockets of strangers.

Figures you still don't get my original post intent, though. Fools who think those who are self-sufficient usually don't understand why people like me don't sit by the mailbox and wait for a handout.

[Blitzkrieg]

"Self-sufficient", my ass.

The only way you can call yourself self-sufficient would be if you'd hunt your own food like a primitive hunter-gatherer and lived in a forest that you owned.

And I noticed you didn't homeschool your kids either, mr. No-handouts.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Who says I didn't homeschool my kid?

But please, do resume your horseshit tirades against self-sufficiency. It amuses those of us who don't depend on The State for our every need.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Oops, shouldn't have hit "enter" so quick:

No, I didn't completely homeschool - but I do pay personal-property taxes, and by God I did utilize the school system. But... I de-programmed my kid when necessary, and taught him things said school did not.

As for the rest of your post, it's a load of "isn't government wonderful?" tripe, just like all of them have been to this point - and likely beyond.

Your turn, statist tool.

[Blitzkrieg]

Who says I didn't homeschool my kid?

From your previous posts:

He read it front to back, did a great book report on it, and the teacher gave him a D - she told me it was due to the subject, with which she vehemently disagreed - and I took the matter up-level to the superintendent, who made her change it to a B+ grade. Her ass got chewed out, thankfully.

and

I'm just glad my kid's out of school - if he were in elementary now, I'd be getting kicked out of the building for disagreeing with the policy of confiscating every kid's school supplies and putting them in a "community" bin.

Now that doesn't sound like homeschooling to me.
In fact, it sounds as if you sent him to a public school.

[The Libertarian Guy]

I used what I had to pay in, AND supplemented his education by correcting the bullshit they fed him.

If I'd 100% homeschooled him, you'd be chastising me for it. No-win scenario with you fucking liberals, isn't it.

Your turn, cocksucker.

[John Tagliaferro]

You can homeschool your kid while sending them to other school. It was called "parenting" in my day.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Blitzkrieg doesn't understand such antiquated concepts. Nice try, though.

[Fl0yd]

You were the one who couldn't balance parenting with the public school, libertarian guy.
Isn't that why you took your child out of public school?

[The Libertarian Guy]

I didn't take him out... I deprogrammed him by teaching him things they don't teach in government schools.

You really are a piece of shit. How do you sleep at night?

[The Libertarian Guy]

I have a job, I pay my bills, I carry no debt... and you have the gall to say I'm not self-sufficient?

If I were on the dole, you would have a point. But I don't leech off the trough... do you?

[The Libertarian Guy]

I have turned down working for three different union-related jobs, Blitz. I refuse to join the collective or allow any of my hard-earned money go to EITHER major party by way of union dues.

I'd rather do that, than help fund the reasons this country is disintegrating. How about you?

[Who's Sean Hannity]

Unions are the reason this country is disintegrating? This post, and others, leaves one to think that you arrive at your viewpoints by mere emotional fiat.

[The Libertarian Guy]

ONE reason, WSH. Logic can be a tricky thing; I see you're having trouble with it. Poor soul.

[Who's Sean Hannity]

ANd i see you're just beating your chest. I wouldn't even label them a third of one reason, for a institution that has been in decline for many years, your head seems to make a pretty big deal of this boogie man.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Of course you wouldn't. Paying auto workers not to work is, by your reckoning, a good thing.

[Fl0yd]

Libertarian guy, you're truly are a woman scorned.

[WHo's Sean Hannity]

I see you beat your boogie man hard, an emotion based libertarian is truly dangerous thing, but i'll leave you to dream about punishing workers, or whatever it is that keeps you up at night. You should try logic sometime, it may influence your priorities.

[Fl0yd]

Libertarian guy is just a sad person who thinks if he parrots his masters' talking points loud enough, he'll get some tasty scraps and morsels from his masters' table.

Libertarian guy is just a pathetic, uneducated shell of a person who's denying his children opportunities just to prove a talking point.

Libertarian guy's a stupid scab who's trying to convince himself that he's going Galt when he can't find work.

Keep blaming the liberals and the unions for your own personal failures, libertarian guy.

Remember, it's never your fault.
Personal responsibility is for other people, not libertarian guy.

[The Libertarian Guy]

I have a job, cocksucker.

And I haven't deprived my child of anything.

At least I don't advocate getting MORE people on the dole... unlike a traitor such as yourself.

[Mr ?]

Catch-22 - liberals despise homeschoolers, yet bitch about how your kid is going to their school.

OTOH, if you send your kid to a private school, you're a rich SOB who got that way being dishonest and off the backs of "the workers'... but Obama can send HIS kids to private school and be against a damn good voucher system in Washington DC.

Dig the irony.

[WHo's Sean Hannity]

Traitor!?!?!?!? We really are scrapping the bottom of the barrel.

[The Libertarian Guy]

No, it isn't scraping anything. Purposefully encouraging people to go on the dole is pretty damned close to treason, in my never-humble opinion. Why work when one can subsist on taxpayer crumbs?

Well, I refuse that, and whatever feeble-minded health-care reform to come down the pike. I'd rather die than take something to which I am not entitled.

[Fl0yd]

I'd rather do that, than help fund the reasons this country is disintegrating. The medal is in the mail, O selfless one.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Voting Democrat every two years isn't medal-worthy, floyd. In fact, I'd call it an act of hatred against one's fellow countrymen.

[The Libertarian Guy]

I'll bet Blitz would have a field day with this:

My brother is 40, but is mentally retarded and has, basically, the mind of a twelve-year-old.

However, even with his limited understanding, he can still work a solid 40+ hours a week and he refuses to go on SSDI.

Moral: Even someone with the mind of a child, can be smart enough to not live off the backs of other people.

I now await input from someone who *professes* to care about the plight of the underprivileged. That's your cue, Blitz. You have the floor - dazzle us with your bullshit.

[Blitzkrieg]

I think you've mistaken your brother with yourself.

And here's some delicious copy-pasta, just for you, mr. Self-sufficient:

This morning I was awoken by my alarm clock powered by electricity generated by the public power monopoly regulated by the US Department of Energy.

I then took a shower in the clean water provided by the municipal water utility.

After that, I turned on the TV to one of the FCC regulated channels to see what the National Weather Service of the National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Administration determined the weather was going to be like using satellites designed, built, and launched by the National Aeronautics and Space Administration.

I watched this while eating my breakfast of US Department of Agriculture inspected food and taking the drugs which have been determined as safe by the Food and Drug Administration.

At the appropriate time as regulated by the US Congress and kept accurate by the National Institute of Standards and Technology and the US Naval Observatory, I get into my National Highway Traffic Safety Administration approved automobile and set out to work on the roads built by the local, state, and federal Departments of Transportation, possibly stopping to purchase additional fuel of a quality level determined by the Environmental Protection Agency, using legal tender issued by the Federal Reserve Bank.

On the way out the door I deposit any mail I have to be sent out via the US Postal Service and drop the kids off at the public school.

Then, after spending another day not being maimed or killed at work thanks to the workplace regulations imposed by the Department of Labor and the Occupational Safety and Health Administration, I drive back to my house which has not burned down in my absence because of the state and local building codes and the fire marshal's inspection, and which has not been plundered of all its valuables thanks to the local police department.

I then log onto the Internet which was developed by the Defense Advanced Research Projects Administration and post on reason, freerepublic and fox news forums about how I'm a self-sufficient individual who doesn't rely on government for anything because that would be SOCIALISM and that's BAD because the government can't do anything right.

[The Libertarian Guy]

*yawn*

Like none of that would be possible without the ever-watchful, ever-benevolent Hand of Government.

Do you have any respect for free thought or free enterprise, Blitz, or are you just up the ass of Obama that deeply?

[crayon]

He speaks the truth. We must all be dependent on the state, and destroy the private sector. It is the enemy of the perfect way laid out by those we elect who have Ds after their names.

HURR DURR!!!

[Morris]

When Our Lord and Savior gets done with these right-wingers, we can all breathe easy and get our hands on all their stuff! Preach on, Blitzkrieg!

[Barack Obama]

I'll do more than that, Morris. I've got plans that would make you shit yourself inside-out with glee.

But it's nice to know My minions are on the ball. Does My heart good to see the faithful defending My Legacy even before I'm done building it.

[Joe Biden]

Um, can I please come out of the basement, Barack? I promise not to say stupid shit in front of live microphones...

[crayon mirror]

I am smart! I am smart!

[Fl0yd]

So why isn't this provided by the private sector?

[The Libertarian Guy]

Why should you care, floyd? The private sector is unfair and not to be trusted, according to you.

Oh, and if I'm such a loser, why do I refuse to take welfare? Not that I need it, but I wouldn't anyway. How about you? You sitting there waiting for that check and EBT card?

[Barack Obama]

My plan is working exactly as I envisioned it. Now, if I can only find a way to spend a trillion dollars every week and destroy the private sector... I'll be the God I've always wanted to be.

[Ron L]

I love to read this argument; it's just dying for a skeptical look.
The claims are as follows (multiples apply to some sentences or paragraphs above):
1) The government already monopolized that activity, so you have to use what the government furnishes or forget it.
2) The government does all this stuff and it really does what the government claims. Really!
3) The government regulated this activity and outlaws any competition, so see #1.
4) The government taxes subsidize this activity, so you can forget about buying it from those who *ask* that you buy it.
5) The government is the best solution to some very few activities, therefore you should turn over everything to the government.
6) While you tolerate the government's horrible waste in those few cases, therefore government is good.
Suffice to say, it's hogwash from top to bottom; special pleading and innuendo by worn-out lefties.

[Tony]

Government monopolies on these various regulations is the only thing that has ever worked. Prior to regulation of natural resources and safety, etc., people died a lot more easily. Regulation is just another technology making our lives better. And so far the marketplace has never innovated that one, and I don't see how you ever expect it to. Nobody is going to cut into their own profits to voluntarily self-regulate. I really don't think you want to live the ruggedly individualistic life you fantasize about. You probably throw a bitch fit if your plane is late or your latte too foamy.

[skeet]

I'm reading a book now that I think Tony/blitzkrieg/crayon/morris would love, though for different reasons: "The Giver" a dystopian (but they'd read it as utopian) fantasy of a perfect world of sameness and safety.
On second thought, maybe they wouldn't appreciate it. Their utopia would be a world where the government paid you to make petty, small, and insulting comments on blogs and you were fined if you actually offered an intelligent viewpoint or counterviewpoint.

[jk]

@skeet

Bravo!

[The Libertarian Guy]

I've read that book... going to read it again, and donate a copy to the local library when I'm done.

Should be required reading in public schools, too, right along with The Road to Serfdom. Open those minds, kids!

[Ron L]

Tony|12.25.09 @ 8:19PM|#
"Government monopolies on these various regulations is the only thing that has ever worked. Prior to regulation of natural resources and safety, etc., people died a lot more easily."

Bullstuff.
People died a lot more easily before, oh, we learned to build fires. Or before we learned to wash our hands. Or before safety helmets were invented. The fact that government grabs more power as we learn more means only that the government grabs more power.
BTW, people also died a lot more easily when government was *really* in control; see the Soviet Union and others I can name.
Sorry, that's one of the silliest if-then 'arguments' I've ever seen.

[oaktownadam]

"Regulation is just another technology making our lives better. And so far the marketplace has never innovated that one, and I don't see how you ever expect it to."

Clearly Tony has never heard of the Underwriters' Laboratories. It's a shame, because without them, all of our houses would have burned down a long time ago.

[Ron L]

Tony also ignores the obvious that folks who wish to, say, sell food don't make a lot of money if they poison the customers.
Tony's ignorance runs to the supposition that people do evil unless they are constrained to do otherwise.
A guy name of Adam Smith pointed out the the falsity of that view, and history proves it's true.
But then, I'd bet Tony and reality are not real close acquaintences.

[Tony]

So a superior system is to let the market trim off all those food companies that poison people? Fantastic.

I dunno, it seems to me that we have a known issue, namely food contamination, know how to prevent it, and can do so with nobody's freedom being threatened. Unless you think the freedom to poison people is something worth safeguarding. Because the only reason you could be against food regulation is because you think the market alone will make food safer. That is preposterous. We don't need to wait for food companies to--maybe--self-regulate out of demand concerns. We know the problem. What's the big deal? Fewer people die this way.

[oaktownadam]

"So a superior system is to let the market trim off all those food companies that poison people?"

How long do you think a food company is going to last if it's killing its customers with poisoned food?

Do you think that the only reason all of our food is not full of poison is because the government tells people not to do it?

How you can make an assumption that government "can do so with nobody's freedom being threatened"?

Have you taken the time to pay attention to the pasteurized vs unpasteurized milk controversy? Government health agencies have stormed co-ops with SWAT-style raids to seize unpasteurized milk. Pasteurized milk is inferior for certain things, like making cheese. But the benevolent public-health fascists have decided that it shall not be made available to anyone.

There's also the matter of regulations favoring larger producers. But it's the larger producers which have the biggest problems with contamination. If a small company has a problem, only a few thousand people at most will be affected. But when a ConAgra or American Peanut Company has a problem, hundreds of millions of people are at risk. It really seems like government has created the very problem it purports to solve.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Then let government run EVERYTHING, right, Tony? Shitcan that tired, old notion of the private sector! Let government make our lattes and fly our planes!

[Tony]

No for fuck's sake government shouldn't run everything. You've wielded this stupid straw man too many times for me to take you seriously.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Funny, you advocate that very thing, yet here you are denying it. SOP, I suppose.

[The Libertarian Guy]

BTW, it's not a straw man... I'm just outlining general liberal ideology: Private sector bad, public sector good.

Feeling guilty? You're awfully defensive.

[Tony]

You're stupid. Just because you believe in a utopian all-or-nothing scenario doesn't mean everyone does.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Your ideology is closer to utopian, Tony - it encourages people to look to government as their provider, one way or another. And every problem, every skinned knee, every slip and fall, is covered by some alphabet agency.

How did we ever survive without the all-knowing, ever-benevolent state?

[Mr. ?]

If you truly believe that, Tony... why are you a liberal?

[Fl0yd]

THE SLOPE IS SLIPPERY!
WATCH OUT, WE'RE ON A SLIPPERY SLOPE!
IF GOVERNMENT IS ALLOWED TO DO ONE THING, IT'LL TAKE OVER EVERYTHING!
OMG, OMG, THIS SLOPE IS SO SLIPPERY!
LOOK OUT, EVERYBODY!

[DY0LF]

I'M FROM THE GOVERNMENT, AND I'M HERE TO HELP!

WHAT? YOU DON'T WANT MY HELP? YOU MUST BE SUFFERING FROM SOME SORT OF MENTAL DISORDER!

[Fl0yd]

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!
I SLIPPED AND NOW EVERYTHING'S A GOVERNMENT SLOPE!!!
HELP US, ST. REAGAN!!

[Barack Obama]

You just described my entire reason for becoming President.

[robc]

"the marketplace has never innovated that one"

Underwriters Laboratory says "Hi".

[The Libertarian Guy]

UH isn't a government-owned/created/controlled entity, robc. Therefore, they don't count.

[WHo's Sean Hannity]

That's a load of bull, I work with people with developmental disabilities who try to find work or earn a paycheck. Your brother understands libertarian concepts about as well as you, not at all. If that is your priority, your main concern, some poor unfortunate receiving assistance, or welfare to engage your boogie man, then you are a sad angry man. Look around you, can't you see it's not the poor and the workers who control government and have mismanaged this nations resources. It's been people with a pro corporate/pro business philosophy. Obama hasn't done anything for the poor or the working people, he's been there for big business, but this welfare is secondary to you if it means beating on some union scum. How sad.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Nice of you, a "compassionate liberal", to insult my brother.

Nice, also, that you only show your supposed compassion for the downtrodden if they agree with your POV. Your attitude towards me, and that of floyd and a couple of other posters, clearly shows you only care about people who vote themselves goodies from the treasury - which is my REAL gripe, not just the existence of handout programs (which I still refuse to take, although that makes me a "loser" according to the misguided philosophy of some of the aforementioned posters).

Finally, your non-acceptance of Obama shows how far left you really are, WSH. If Barry isn't anti-business/pro-government enough for you, who IS acceptable?

Most Americans have been conditioned to view government as a vending machine. Those who truly can work at all, have no business dining at the trough; I'll concede that those who absolutely cannot survive on their own, need some kind of help, but that is as far as it should ever go.

Of course, you'll disagree.

[The Libertarian Guy]

BTW, as I said earlier, my brother has a steady job, yet refuses to go on disability even though he does qualify - because he's too proud to live off the paychecks of total strangers.

I think that's something which really chaps the liberal ass - people who don't have a lot of income, yet adamantly refuse welfare, aren't gripped by the claws of the system - they might not vote for Democrats.

But, please, do continue. It's quite fascinating, in a train-wreckish sort of way.

[The Libertarian Guy]

"it means beating on some union scum"

It's almost always the other way around. Just ask anyone who HAS been beaten up by union scum.

[WHo's Sean Hannity]

Someday, maybe, you are going to feel very stupid.

[The Libertarian Gu]

I don't plan on voting Democrat, so I don't see your premonition coming true, WHS.

[oaktownadam]

This comment is dripping with leftist contempt of the very people they claim to want to help....

Did it ever occur to you that financial reward is not the only way to have a fulfilling life? Libertarianism doesn't try to push lifestyles onto other people. People are free to make the choices they want, and often those choices aren't the ones with the greatest financial reward.

How dare you judge another man's lifestyle? You're not a liberal, you're an authoritarian.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Liberals bitch about the far-right authoritarian wing, yet fail to see how their own goals and beliefs are, themselves, authoritarian.

[Fl0yd]

And you bitch about how being a loser is not your fault, but that of unions and liberals.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Indeed it is. We'd all be a lot better off without either.

Even you, prick.

[fLoyD]

We should all be liberal union members. It is the only true way to live.

And we should all live in our mothers' basements. Like I do.

[kraion]

FREEDUMB!!! LONG LIVE OBAMA!!! DOWN WITH STUFF THAT ISN'T LIBERAL!!! MY MOMMY LUVS ME!!!

[mOrriS]

Yeah! Down with "free" enterprise! Handouts are cool!!!

[Chony]

You're speaking our language! Preach on!

[Ratko]

Ditto, ditto, and ditto.

Sounds like the teacher validated the first line of the introduction to The Road to Serfdom. The quote of Lord Action that stated: "Few discoveries are more irritating than those which expose the pedigree of ideas."

[smartass sob]

"some people matter, some people don't"

To whom?

[The Libertarian Guy]

Fl0yd, for one...

[Truth-reckoner]

'The owner's rich preppy jackass son gave a copy of the Fountainhead (I think) to Baby, and said "some people matter, some people don't" '
NO. IT WAS SAID BY THE WAITER, THE ONE WHO GOT PENNY PREGNANT. IT WAS SAID TO BABY'S FATHER, WHEN HE REVEALED THAT HE HAD GOTTEN HER PREGNANT; THAT'S WHEN THE FATHER TOOK BACK THE TIP THE SCENE WITH FOUNTAINHEAD WAS EARLIER IN THE MOVIE. BUT STILL AN ASSININE MISREPRESENTATION.

[Sam Grove]

I've only seen DD once, yet that scene sticks out in my memory. It was entirely gratuitous.

Asshole holds up Atlas Shrugged as his justification for being a jerk.

Don't people know that jerks are jerks because they are jerks (and there are plenty of them on the left)?

[Morris]

If I weren't busy buggering crayon right now, I'd show you what being a jerk is really all about!

[Morris Mirror]

*cough* blowjob *cough* blowjob *cough*

[Morris Minor]

*cough* [starter disengaging due to shoddy Lucas-brand electrical system] *sputter*

[Jim Walsh]

Yeah, that's pretty goddam stupid; though I can think of one instance where a TV character was called out for using his left-wing leanings as a pretext for being a self-important asshole. That's when Quagmire ripped Brian a new one on Family Guy a few weeks ago.

[Slut Bunwalla]

That was so freaking awesome. I stood up and cheered.

[P Brooks]

Speaking of humorless cretins...

The prospect that stagnant, smoke-filled air could cause health problems today, particularly for people with respiratory ailments, led Bay Area officials to declare a wintertime Spare the Air alert. That means all open fires that burn wood, manufactured fire logs or other solid fuel are prohibited.

Today's 24-hour ban applies to fireplaces, woodstoves, pellet stoves and outdoor fire pits. First-time violators get a warning; repeat offenders are subject to $400 fines.

Ho ho ho

[John Tagliaferro]

"Ho ho ho"

Tiger: "Where, where, where?"

[*]

In the mirror, in the mirror, in the mirror.

[Ron L]

I saw that, so we're burning a tire this evening. Really great flames.

[wylie]

Hang on, how do you have repeat offenders on a 24hour ban?

[Ted S.]

The Fox Movie Channel has been airing Home Alone over and over since 6:00 PM on the 24th; even longer than Dirty Dancing.

And it's been quite some time since the TV Guide channel has had TV listings, now that the cable and satellite boxes have them.

[Spartacus]

Spike TV is having a Bad Santa marathon, which IMHO is a far more appropriate choice for the holiday. The more I watch it, though, the more I hate the ending.

[The Libertarian Guy]

I'm watching Santa Claus Conquers the Martians - Mystery Science Theater 3000 version.

God, it's so bad a movie, it's good.

[Morris]

Nice break from the usual right-wing drivel, especially for a real left-wingerlike you, Jesse. Merry Xmas.

[The Libertarian Guy]

You just HAD to come here and fuck up things, didn't you, Morris?

[John Tagliaferro]

Just remember, Morris is a pussy.

[Prolefeed]

Pussy is a great thing. Don't besmirch it by comparing it to Morris.

[Bill Clinton]

Hey, man, my radar just went off. Where're all the white women at?

I'm just funnin' y'all, I'm down with the swirl. Some of my favorite lays were black chicks in Harlem.

[Hillary By God Rodham]

WILLIAM!!! WILLIAM HARCOURT FENTON MUDD CLINTON!!! GET YOUR PUDGY ASS BACK HOME RIGHT THIS INSTANT!!!

[John Tagliaferro]

I think we are using different contexes.

[Barney Frank]

Pussy is disgusting no matter which context one uses.

[John Tagliaferro]

Fag!

Oops

[The Libertarian Guy]

Morris and his fellow traveler Blitzkrieg would make a cute couple, wouldn't they?

Just what we need - yet another tool of the handout mentality. Probably pleasures himself while reading transcripts of Bernie Sanders floor speeches.

[John Tagliaferro]

At loeast when they mate they can't breed.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Praise AGW!

[Brian Sorgatz]

In my case, it's not so much a war on Christmas as a war on my family. With no remorse, Mr. and Mrs. Families Aren't Democracies sold me down the river to a government-run school system where I was at the mercy of bullies and bureaucrats. As libertarian as I am these days, Rand's gospel of self-reliance and creativity leaves me cold. I feel permanently defeated. At 37, I still wonder if anything other than murder of my one living parent (Adolf died in a car accident when I was 25; Eva survives) will restore my self-respect.

So, anyway, that's my sob story.

[Blitzkrieg]

LOL WUT?

[The Libertarian Guy]

Figures you wouldn't get it, Blitzkrieg. You're too fucking engrossed in statist thought to pick out the nuances in Brian's post.

[Fl0yd]

kill yourself lol

[P Brooks]

Spike TV is having a Bad Santa marathon

Bad Santa was a fucking great movie; there is no way I would watch a butchered Spike TV version. Unedited, or not at all, thanks.

[wylie]

Amen.

[Johnny Longtorso]

Did Santa make it out of Steve Smith's house this year? Did the reindeer, or does Rudolph's nose have a new reason to be red?

[Pontius]

I guess that woman who tackled the Pope took that "War on Christmas" meme a bit too seriously. All she wanted for Christmas was the Pope's two front teeth ...

[Speech Policeman #666]

Pope abuse is nothing to laugh about, Pontius. Consider yourself warned.

[Pontius]

Tonight on Pay-per-view, it's the ultimate "Pope-a-dope fight," it's the "THRILLICA IN DA BASILICA," "the tumble in da jungle," it's Crazy Lady vs. Benedict for the title of Heavyweight Champion of the Word!!

[Det. Munch, SVU]

Pope abuse? Who cares, the Pope is part of the conspiracy... oh, hell, guess we'd better investigate anyway.

[Episiarch]

Dirty Dancing is like the fevre dream of a horny teenage girl who hasn't figured out yet that the detachable shower head is useful for things other than getting clean. 12 hours of that is the equivalent of aggravated assault with a deadly weapon.

[Jim Walsh]

I always though Dirty Dancing sucked, and not just because of the Rand-dissing. Not even the presence of Jerry Orbach and the soundtrack's inclusion of the great Solomon Burke could save it. Put Baby in the corner, and shut up about it, already...

[The Libertarian Guy]

Is there some way to watch DD while listening to, say, Pink Floyd, like watching The Wizard of Oz with the sound off and Dark Side of the Moon in the background?

That would be way sweeeeet.

[Pontius]

I'll be syncing Obama's upcoming State of the Union speech with "Damn It Feels Good to Be a Gangsta"

[The Libertarian Guy]

Ooo, wicked.

Probably racist, though.

[Fin Fang Foom]

It's a Patrick Swayze Christmas!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ZyJCV_dyug

[Peter Griffin]

ROADHOUSE!

[PantsFan]

Patrick Swayze's real Christmas movie

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xOgcKSCF7Hk

[Prolefeed]

You are not actually obliged to watch the Dirty Dancing marathon.

Good, because I was ready to surrender my Secret Libertarian Decoder Ring rather than subject myself to that horror.

[Allan Gotthelf]

Incredible that "Reason" magazine's blog knows Ayn Rand only for her anti-statist view. Where do you think "Reason" got it's name from, if not from its founders' professed appreciation for Rand's recognition of reason's fundamental value to man's life?? Rand's politics is consequential, way down the line. Objective reality; reason; man's life as the standard of value; your own life and happiness as your fundamental moral purpose. Rationality, Independence, Integrity, Justice, Productiveness, and Pride as the fundamental virtues. From there, individual rights - to life, liberty, property - and the pursuit of . . . happiness. And with such an orientation toward the world one finds that it is a benevolent place, with great possibilities open for human beings, existentially and psychologically. As a result, Rand was actually a champion of Christmas, as a time of this-worldly benevolence and celebration. Search "Ghate, Christmas" for a recent article quoting Rand on Christmas.

[The Libertarian Guy]

Pursuit of happiness, note... not guaranteed, as Blitzkrieg and floyd advocate.

You're only whole if you're dependent on other people's money. If you can make it on your own, you've done it because you're a dirty cheating capitalist pig.

Don'tcha just love liberalism?

[mary]

Ok Allan, I care nothing for the movement but am rather interested in her personality. Care to share?

[R C Dean]

Where do you think "Reason" got it's name from, if not from its founders' professed appreciation for Rand's recognition of reason's fundamental value to man's life??

Umm, drink?

[DennyWoods]

Yeah buddy. Makes prety good sense to me dude!

Jess
http://www.Ultimate-Privacy.net

[Fl0yd]

"Where do you think "Reason" got it's name from, if not from its founders' professed appreciation for Rand's recognition of reason's fundamental value to man's life??"

Oh, man.
That's some seriously funny shit.

[Barack Obama]

FlOyd, you are truly worthy of My Recognition. I will spare your life when the purging begins.

[The Libertarian Guy]

FlOyd, et al:

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&a.....32dbb01be6

There's half of your homework. Now, prove some schools don't confiscate supplies from students for classroom community usage. IOW... prove the "lie" allegations. All of them.

Might toss this in, too:

http://www.rethinkingschools.org/archive/21_02/lego212.shtml

Disgusting.

[Clich? Bandit]

I am phisically ill after reading the entire article of link two.

No words