Secession Then, Secession Now, Secession Forever!

Those new-nation mavens at the "Let a Thousand Nations Bloom" blog are celebrating the week leading up the 4th of July the right way--with a week-long series on secession. Here is where the celebration begins.

I wrote about our times' leading theoretician and activist for new nations, Patri Friedman (one of the principles of the blog) and his "Seasteading" idea in the July issue of Reason magazine.

Comments

[shrike]

Damn, I first read this as a "Patti Smith" thread.

That - would be a snazzy topic header.

[Rich]

So, if at first you don't secede ...

[Episiarch]

shriek, you disappoint me. I thought for sure your comment would be rabidly insulting Sutherners for the Civil War or something. You could have mocked "the war of Northern aggression" in a hyper tone with many misspellings. Think of the wasted opportunity.

[shrike]

epixxxxx-

Its important to flog the stupid "conservatives" while they are down....

You know - the Creationists, the anti SCR folk, the science haters. the Sanford/Palin douchebags, the fucking retrograde Hannity types.

Lets rid the country of this trash while they are down.

Reasonable?

[BakedPenguin]

Those new-nation mavens at the "Let a Thousand Nations Bloom" blog...

If they're really in favor of having more choices in government, perhaps they shouldn't name their blog after a Judas goat campaign to get dissent out in the open, and then crush it.

[Marshall Gill]

Its important to flog the stupid "conservatives" while they are down....

You know - the Creationists, the anti SCR folk, the science haters. the Sanford/Palin douchebags, the fucking retrograde Hannity types.

Lets rid the country of this trash while they are down.

That is more like the old shrike. No real arguments and ad homs. And you end it with "reasonable", perfect.

[Douglas Gray]

The key to world peace is secession, secession, and more secession. Countries such as Monaco, Lichtenstein, and Andorra have never killed a soul; they are too small to build nuclear weapons; even tanks would be a major investment. If every country were that small, we'd have fewer problems. Besides, look at the employment opportunities in the currency exchange business.

[shrike]

That is more like the old shrike. No real arguments and ad homs. And you end it with "reasonable", perfect.

Like Hayek I disdain conservatism.

Have at me.

[Brett Stevens]

It's time for the country to divide up.

There is no compatibility between conservative values and liberal ones.

So let's split up, live according to our ideals, and see where we are in two generations.

[BakedPenguin]

Like Hayek I disdain conservatism. ...Have at me.

Hayek took the time to painfully elucidate the logical end results of statist positions.

You shout insults at people.

[JB]

So let's split up, live according to our ideals, and see where we are in two generations.

After Obama runs this country into the ground, that is going to happen anyways. Although since the liberals aren't armed, I predict them moving to California and Canada, France is just too far.

I recommend they move to their socialist paradise of choice why they still can. They won't like it when they are forced at gunpoint to move.

[Voros McCracken]

"If every country were that small, we'd have fewer problems."

All countries (as you could call them such) used to be that small. Once the juvenile delinquents who decided they needed to rule the world figured out that bigger countries allowed them to wage more wars and wage them more successfully, bigger countries were "developed."

[jk]

...France is just too far.

The French like to smoke and eat fatty cheese. 80% of their electrical energy is generated by nuclear power plants. American liberals will not be welcome there.

[BlueBook]

This could be a viable Reality TV program: Two teams, one Red state, one Blue state, must each form their own micro nation. Give each side equal starting resources and one year to build it their way. Monitor the whole thing with a hillion jillion cameras, introducing random challenges and disturbances to add to the tension. Pick the winner with a combination of distinguished judges and audience text voting. Call it "Cold War II" or something edgy.

Of course, it'd be totally predictable, scripted bullshit, but it'd play in Peoria!

[jk]

Give each side equal starting resources and one year to build it their way.

A one year competition would probalby favor team blue. But if you extend the competition to forty years or so, team blue would not have any children to continue the game.

[Max]

2 topics:

a) Small countries are better? Remember around 1780 the HOly Roman Empire consisted of around 50 small states that all had tariff barriers and toll bridges and what else. They constantly fought each other and it was a uber-mess to live in. So, perhaps this works for severa small units, but only because they are reigned in by the larger neighbours stiffling unruly behaviour.

b) You are right, the French wouldn't welcome liberals from the US of A. They are probably vegetarians (a psychological illness for the french and virtually unheared of) and/or like to save animals (french love to eat animals) and probably care about all kind of environmental rules (French think more along the way: Water flows to italy, so no problem loading tons of chemicals into our rivers and radiation stops at the all borders =)).
So, I'd say go to Canada, you are not very welcomed in France =) Though probably Germany would like to see you

[SxCx]

"So let's split up, live according to our ideals, and see where we are in two generations."

What if your ideals involve making war and aggressing against your neighbors?

[The Bearded Hobbit]

And where is the Libertopia for those of us who are neither conservative nor liberal? Or those who are both?

.. Hobbit

[SxCx]

The seasteading thing was interesting, but left me with an important question: who wants to live on a fucking raft?

[squarooticus]

the Sanford/Palin douchebags

What do these two share in common? I'm missing something.

[Chad]

Sorry, folks, but the trend is the other way around. Global synchronization of policy and centralization of decision making is inevitable.

Quit pissin' into the wind...

[Johnny Fivers]

Oh yeah, dude you bring up some really good points!

RT
http://www.anonymize.tk

squarooticus | July 3, 2009, 9:13am | #

the Sanford/Palin douchebags

What do these two share in common? I'm missing something.

Social conservative values with strong libertarian leanings.The only electable small government ideology.

[Zeratul!]

WRONG! YOU LOSE! GOOD DAY SIR!

but global synchronization is a system that begs abuse. the faith conservatives and liberals puts in their leaders is beyond belief. the question is whether we have a choice. and if a choice were employed to construct a new system would it really be better or any different? people are so much the same that I severely doubt it.

when the shit really goes down you can find me in Rapture. I'll be batshit CARAZY! by that time and if you try to steal my adam I WILL NOT HESITATE TO SHOOT BEES AT YOU!

remember, statism is.

[Bingo]

when the shit really goes down you can find me in Rapture. I'll be batshit CARAZY! by that time and if you try to steal my adam I WILL NOT HESITATE TO SHOOT BEES AT YOU!

This is why being a libertarian is so great!

[Brett Stevens]

Sorry, folks, but the trend is the other way around. Global synchronization of policy and centralization of decision making is inevitable.

Samuel Huntington disagrees, and his analysis seems more thorough than yours.

[zoltan]

The seasteading thing was interesting, but left me with an important question: who wants to live on a fucking raft?

Uh, have ya read China Mieville's The Scar?

[zoltan]

There is no compatibility between conservative values and liberal ones.

Ha! They're more alike than you want to admit. Statist and war-loving jerks who have no desire to respect property rights. Unless you're meaning the definition of those terms as used more than 50 years ago, when they both actually meant something good.