Immigration

Washed Up Pitcher to Immigrants: Learn English!

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John Rocker

Former Major League reliever John Rocker, who last pitched for the Long Island Ducks, posting a pitiful 6.50 ERA in 23 games, has at last waded into the immigration debate. You might remember Rocker's 2000 ethnographic study of New York, which he succinctly summarized for Sports Illustrated: "It's the most hectic, nerve-racking city. Imagine having to take the 7 Train to the ballpark, looking like you're riding through Beirut next to some kid with purple hair, next to some queer with AIDS, right next to some dude who just got out of jail for the fourth time, right next to some 20-year-old mom with four kids. It's depressing." And now, over at Johnrocker.net, the lantern-jawed yokel sounds off on non-English speaking immigrants and explains the impetus behind his "speak English" campaign:

In my own personal experiences, I have lived abroad for over a year of my life, three different times in Puerto Rico and once in Venezuela. During my time in these countries, I did my best to speak their language even though my Spanish is barely adequate. I attempted to speak the language whenever the situation presented itself and worked to learn the language better in order to avoid the 'ugly American' stereotype.

And what better way to combat anti-American stereotypes then printing t-shirts demanding folks "speak English!" (Somebody send this guy's resume to Karen Hughes, STAT.) Also note that Rocker pats himself on the back not for learning Spanish, for his skills are "barely adequate," but for simply attempting to speak the language. C'mon you Spanish-speakers, at least try to fail like John Rocker!

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  1. Has anyone informed him that Puerto Rico is not abroad?

  2. In fairness, maybe he was distracted by another broad.

  3. In fairness, maybe he was distracted by another broad.

    I have no idea what you’re…

  4. Just looking at the picture, I find the argument on the right far more compelling than the argument on the left.

  5. How do you say pinche cabron in English?

  6. My question is why John Rocker wants to people here to speak English. What’s wrong with American?

  7. I really like the fact that the T-shirt on the right is angled for easier reading.

  8. I want to start a T-Shirt campaign as well. Al the shirts will say “John Rocker” on the front.

    On the back, it will say, “Shut your big, fat overly paid, useless, mashed potato-filled fucking head.”

  9. My shirt would read…

    LEARN SPANISH… You lazy, racist, fucks.

  10. I can’t believe nobody has made the slightest mention of the awesome rack on that chick.

    Oh, never mind.

  11. Anyone want to bet that his I.Q. is lower than his ERA?

    [I have no idea what an ERA average is, whether it is supposed to be high or low, or why it matters. Please do not bother trying to educate me as I loathe baseball.]

  12. Aresen,

    Despite your lack of baseball knowledge, the joke holds water.

  13. I wish he’d kept his trap closed. He was a closing machine for the Braves before he started talking and stuff.

  14. Pftt… Rules. I’m a rocker, I don’t care for
    rules.

  15. Is he’s proving he’s not racist by posing with the hot half black/half white (I guess?) chick? The sacrifices he must make.

  16. People complain about immigrants who don’t speak English in situations like when they try to order food, or pay for stuff at the grocery, or talk to someone on the street.

    You know, when the immigrants ARE trying to speak English.

    Immigrants today learn English faster than at any time in American history, for exactly that reason – because now, more than at any time in the past, immigrants are living in mainstream society, rather than staying within non-English-speaking neighborhoods during their work, home, and recreational lives, and trying to speak English.

    Hey, all you immigrants out there doing your best to master a second language and get by in society – you really piss John Rocker off.

    So, good for you.

  17. Ingl?s es tan f?cil, hasta John Rocker lo puede aprender.

    For the time being, until Hindi & Mandarin take over; English is the world’s language of commerce and science.

    The only jobs open to you if you are a monolingual Spanish speaker are cutting lawns, cleaning hotel rooms and pro baseball.

  18. [I have no idea what an ERA average is, whether it is supposed to be high or low, or why it matters. Please do not bother trying to educate me as I loathe baseball.]

    The Equal Rights Amendment was a proposed amendment to the United States Constitution intended to guarantee equal rights under the law for Americans regardless of sex. Amendments can be approved according to the process in Article V of the Constitution. The final deadline for approving the ERA passed in either 1979 or 1982-depending upon one’s view of a controversial extension of the ratification time constraint. In the intervening years, public discussion on the ERA has been greatly reduced, though the proposal has been reintroduced in every Congress since 1982.

  19. My mother is an immigrant, and I nearly failed Spanish in high school.

    Would that make Rocker feel better?

  20. Episiarch,

    They are dating. And she has an undergraduate degree from UCONN in Neuroscience and a graduate degree from Columbia University to go with all that.

    While a Long Island Duck, Rocker couldn’t find home plate if he had a Sherpa with him.

  21. The only jobs open to you if you are a monolingual Spanish speaker are cutting lawns, cleaning hotel rooms and pro baseball.

    That is total bullshit, and if you don’t believe me, I’ll bring about 15 people from the office I’m in right now to tell you it’s bullshit.

  22. Despite the fact that he’s a giant-sized moron, the sentiment is generally a good one. Speak the language where you are. I don’t think that people complain so much that non English speakers are having difficulty in the grocery store; it’s when ballots and public schools use Spanish as an alternative.

  23. This is similar to his other T-Shirt campaigns, “HIRE STRIPPERS” and later “HIRE ME – PLEASE!”

  24. from Rocker’s website:

    Modeling the t-shirts with John is Alicia Marie – fitness athlete, freelance writer, and Ms. Bikini Universe 2004; for more on Alicia Marie, visit http://www.aliciamarie.com.

    My only question: where exactly is this Bikini Universe?

  25. Shrek, is that you?

  26. They are dating. And she has an undergraduate degree from UCONN in Neuroscience and a graduate degree from Columbia University to go with all that.

    Interesting. I wonder if she was there while I was, and if I nailed her? So much of that time is a blur.

  27. Dan T.

    You mean, the CIA isn’t the Culinary Institute of America?

  28. Hey Quinn, you know what, I smell ‘Rican. You got ‘Rican blood in you?

  29. Also note that Rocker pats himself on the back not for learning Spanish, for his skills are “barely adequate,” but for simply attempting to speak the language. C’mon you Spanish-speakers, at least try to fail like John Rocker!

    In Rocker’s defense, if his Spanish skills are truly “barely adequate” then that means he did not fail at learning Spanish.

  30. Episiarch,

    Were you at Columbia or UCONN?

  31. My only question: where exactly is this Bikini Universe?

    Take I-95 south until you hit the exit: I-195 East, Miami Beach, FL

  32. UConn. She looks about the right age to have been there when I was.

  33. I am an open boarders libertarian. I think we should solve the illegal immigration problem by making the all legal immigrants. However, I am also of the ‘speak English’ mindset. If you don’t speak English you can’t participate in the larger American society. You are trapped in a subset. English is the ticket to full membership in the culture. Populations which are divided by language are at perpetual conflict with themselves.

  34. I’m marvelously competent in speaking one language – English. Try as I have, my brain (I have a masters degree from an Ivy League university.)cannot get its neurons around any other language but the one I learned first. My sin, I suppose. But when I travel overseas, I do so with a pocket guide to other countries’ languages so that I at least make an attempt. It would seem to me that were I to move to any other place where English is not Numero Uno, I’d eventually get the gist of their language, and use it, no matter how poorly.

    It’s not the facility that matters, it’s the intention to “blend” into the culture, and the best way to do that is to communicate in the native tongue. Those who entered this country in massive waves of immigration up until the 1960s knew that if they were to survive and thrive, they needed to have a working command of English to do so.

    So what’s changed? Bravo John Rocker.

  35. [Grown-ups only]
    Isn’t it true that the MexicanGovernment as well as far-left non-profits ResistAssimilation? And, isn’t it true that the crypto-corporatists at Reason would gladly give them even more power, making their opposition even easier?
    [/Grown-ups only]

  36. That’s Rocker’s wife.

  37. Taktix?
    I’ve never been there, but I’m pretty sure that’s just a bikini satellite. My understanding, is that the center of the bikini Universe is in Rio.

  38. I completely disagree with John Rocker, but for some reason I strongly support the movement for “PEAK NGLISH”.

  39. Isn’t it true that the MexicanGovernment as well as far-left non-profits ResistAssimilation? And, isn’t it true that the crypto-corporatists at Reason would gladly give them even more power, making their opposition even easier?

    TLB-

    If they don’t speak English, their children will.

    Take it from me, La Raza is no match for the assimilating power of Nickelodeon.

  40. Dan T,

    I believe the bikini universe is the parallel universe where the movie “The Last Action Hero” was set.

    Incidentally, Aresen, don’t listen to Dan, everybody knows that ERA stands for Electronic Realty Associates.

  41. I’ve never been there, but I’m pretty sure that’s just a bikini satellite. My understanding, is that the center of the bikini Universe is in Rio.

    I must admit I was wrong. South Beach can’t be the Bikini Universe because they don’t wear any on some parts of the beach.

    Kinda throws the average off a little, but I don’t mind.

  42. I hope there’s a copy of that photo at hotchickswithdouchebags.com.

  43. The problem with all this is that there are probably very few Latino immigrants who wouldn’t like to be able to speak English. Learning a new language as an adult is very difficult, and it’s probably even more difficult after working a 14-hour day.

    John Rocker’s xenophobia is annoying, but his attempts to rationalize his xenophobia with claims that he’s really trying to help Spanish-speakers by intimidating them into learning English is a load of total BS.

  44. Pedants are a pain, but since the entry is subtitled “Learn English!” it seems fair to urge the author to himself learn the proper use of then/than.

    “And what better way to combat anti-American stereotypes than printing t-shirts…

    It’s really not that hard.

  45. Some people are racist and they don even know it

    I am sure she is at least 85% black since everyone in America is mixed with something. I know African-American women that look like her whose parents are both dark in complexion. I have blond-brownish hair but both parents are dark skin with none of my follicle features. SO DON’T ASSUME SHE’S HALF BECAUSE YOU THINK SHE’S HOT. YOU THINK SHE’S HOT DISPITE HER BEING BLACK.

  46. **Episiarch | August 31, 2007, 2:47pm | #

    Is he’s proving he’s not racist by posing with the hot half black/half white (I guess?) chick? The sacrifices he must make.**

    Episiarch, Some people are racist and they don even know it

    I am sure she is at least 85% black since everyone in America is mixed with something. I know African-American women that look like her whose parents are both dark in complexion. I have blond-brownish hair but both parents are dark skin with none of my follicle features. SO DON’T ASSUME SHE’S HALF BECAUSE YOU THINK SHE’S HOT. YOU THINK SHE’S HOT DISPITE HER BEING BLACK.

  47. Based on the disparity between lighthearted Friday comments and pissed off, offended comments, I’d say some of you are being told that you have to work tomorrow.

    Cheer up, dammit.

  48. Warren,

    I agree that linguistic divisions, and the inability to be mutually-intelligible, can cause problems. But this of all issues is where your libertarian instincts should kick in. The private market – and in particular, the mass media, the labor market, and the national chains that are such a huge part of our economy – are incredibly effective at getting people to speak English.

    Larry Bormel,

    So what’s changed? Nothing has changed, except that immigrants today are actually more likely to learn English than immigrants who came here before World War 2. Those immigrants had the choice – often, not even a choice – of living, working, shopping, and socializing entirely within non-English-speaking enclaves. Now, those people are mostly living, working, and/or shopping with English-speaking Americans, or at an absolute minimum, watching TV and buying CDs.

    And in doing so, they piss off John Rocker, even though they’re doing exactly what he should be hoping they do.

  49. Truth, seeing as I put “(I guess?)” after the half thing, your statement is as stupid as your clumsy phrasing.

    Unless you are trolling, in which case well done.

    By the way, I am pure Atlantean and yet an American. I am not mixed with anything, so your statement is demonstrably false.

  50. If only Rocker learned to pitch as well as he’s learned to bitch.

    “””SO DON’T ASSUME SHE’S HALF BECAUSE YOU THINK SHE’S HOT. YOU THINK SHE’S HOT DISPITE HER BEING BLACK.””””

    She looks mixed to me. She’s hot regardless.

  51. If Rocker visits Bikini Universe, what language does he speak/barely get along in?

  52. If Rocker visits Bikini Universe, what language does he speak/barely get along in?

    Esperanto?

  53. “It’s the most hectic, nerve-racking city. Imagine having to take the 7 Train to the ballpark, looking like you’re riding through Beirut next to some kid with purple hair, next to some queer with AIDS, right next to some dude who just got out of jail for the fourth time, right next to some 20-year-old mom with four kids. It’s depressing.”

    That’s an indelicate way of putting it, but I don’t doubt its accuracy. Rocker was a not-very-bright athlete who got railroaded for being politically incorrect. I remember a day when libertarians derided political correctness. These days they’re on the same page as the Easily Offended.
    What happened?

  54. Truth,

    How about this? She’s either only partially black or she’s had her hair straightened. Either way, “hot hot hot and hot”. You could shave her head and paint her green, “hot hot hot and hot”.

    I took the “half-black” assertion to be more a modifier of Rocker’s tolerance than a modifier of her hotness. As in, he could show off his brownish-skinned booty buddy, but he couldn’t quite get himself to model his t-shirt with a beauty who was on the darker side of the “paper bag test”.

  55. My phasing is correct and I didn’t mention anything about your ethnicity. So I don’t know what you’re rambling about.

  56. Akira MacKenzie,

    Are you taking preorders?

  57. My ultimate point is, why does her race even matter. Why can’t she just be hot. I think Liz Hurley is just hot. Not hot because she’s an Aussie, but just HOT!

    Like the delicious booty b/c she’s HOT!

  58. While I try to understand why you folks are debating a 13-month-old article, what do you suppose that Italian guy said to Zidane that set him off like that?

  59. John Rocker is not racist. I’m sorry but I don’t care what his sound-bytes claim. The guy played ball and traveled with latino teammates for 10 years. He’s lived in south and central american countries when he was playing winter ball. He’s been exposed first hand to more cultural diversity than likely anyone on this forum. You don’t get very far in professional baseball refusing to be cooperative and friendly with people of different races and cultures.

    Yeah his message is abrasive and the delivery is hardly PC. I don’t even really care so much about illegal immigration in a vacuum (I do care about entitlement exploitation) But I toss that out and look at how the guy lives and has lived his life and he might have a big mouth and a bad attitude, but racist he isn’t.

  60. Nash,

    You are so right. Rocker just speaks the Truth. He speaks about specify types of people that are destroying America.

  61. “””That’s an indelicate way of putting it, but I don’t doubt its accuracy.”””

    Minus the Beruit part, it’s pretty accurate. But all the lines are carry a very diverse group, which brings me to Nash’s comment.

    “””He’s been exposed first hand to more cultural diversity than likely anyone on this forum.”””

    Then why was he bitching about the diversity of the 7 train?

  62. You could shave her head and paint her green, “hot hot hot and hot”.

    Well, if you’re Captain Kirk…

  63. I think Liz Hurley is just hot. Not hot because she’s an Aussie, but just HOT!

    Liz Hurley is a limey, d00d.

    My phasing is correct and I didn’t mention anything about your ethnicity.

    Your “phasing” is clearly terrible, but you seem to have totally missed the whole “Atlantean” thing, so I’m guessing you are humor-impaired too.

  64. Speaking of Kirk and green women. . . .

  65. The guy played ball and traveled with latino teammates for 10 years.

    Yes, he used to jokingly call refer to one of his black teammates as a monkey. All in good clean fun, of course.

    Except the guy obviously hated it, and John Rocker was the only one in the clubhouse who didn’t realize that.

  66. Are you taking preorders?

    You know, that not a half bad idea.

  67. “If only Rocker learned to pitch as well as he’s learned to bitch.”

    I thought he was a half decent closer when at Atlanta, but too prone to wild pitches.

  68. Truth | August 31, 2007, 3:53pm | #

    Nash,

    You are so right. Rocker just speaks the Truth. He speaks about specify types of people that are destroying America.

    If I may put on my “neighbor” hat here, the America that I have come to love and respect; to view as a good friend; and which has espoused the highest of ideals, has (thankfully) turn its back on creeps like you.

  69. Maybe Rocker is just celebrating the 22nd anniversary of S.O.D’s debut album.

  70. So what’s changed? Bravo John Rocker.

    Uh… what do you think has changed? I live in the city that Rocker so despises, surrounded by immigrants, and not one single time have I ever had a problem communicating with someone in English that I needed to communicate with. This idea that immigrants “aren’t learning English” anymore is pure myth. The fact that we’re seeing other languages more frequently is a product of the explosion of media outlets combined with government pandering–it’s not a reflection of some imagined trend that immigrants are not learning English.

    That’s an indelicate way of putting it, but I don’t doubt its accuracy.

    There’s a difference between being politically incorrect and being a misanthropic prick.

    He speaks about specify types of people that are destroying America.

    Ha ha ha… well, there you go. Great minds think alike. (Apologies if you’re being sarcastic, but it’s sort of hard to tell.)

  71. “So what’s changed? Nothing has changed, except that immigrants today are actually more likely to learn English than immigrants who came here before World War 2. Those immigrants had the choice – often, not even a choice – of living, working, shopping, and socializing entirely within non-English-speaking enclaves. Now, those people are mostly living, working, and/or shopping with English-speaking Americans, or at an absolute minimum, watching TV and buying CDs.”

    My wife, who’s Iranian, learned English watching “Three’s Company” reruns. Spanish television, radios, and CD’s can hurt Spanish speaking people and keep them from learning English, but I assume most of them are making an effort to learn English. Those who don’t are only hurting themselves.

  72. Let me ask you a question. Is generational welfare good or bad? Is a dirty smelly NYC, Boston Chinatown good or bad? I think Rocker is like Garry Sheffield. He means well, but is dumb as a rock and therefore cannot make his points intelligently.

    Rocker is a moron yes, but people that wish to make American their home must at least be willing to assimilate.

    BTW, I am an immigrant from Haiti. If my family had not pulled me out of Haiti when I was 9, I would be saying and doing the same things to help protect their sovereignty. I am now an American therefore I will not be shy in pointing out things that are not good for America.

  73. I’ve lived in the Lower East Side of Manhattan for 15 years. When I first moved in it was almost all hispanic. Jake is correct, at least in my experience. I have had problems with spanish only people a few times, but it was always the older generation.

  74. Rocker was a not-very-bright athlete who got railroaded for being politically incorrect. I remember a day when libertarians derided political correctness. These days they’re on the same page as the Easily Offended.
    What happened?

    I don’t support governmental sanctions on speech, but reserve my own right to call an asshole an asshole. Does that clear things up?

  75. Is a dirty smelly NYC, Boston Chinatown good or bad?

    Wait, what?! Boy, you are an asshole. While you are pointing out things that aren’t good for America, take a look in the mirror.

    Douchebag.

  76. Marcvs,

    Stop trolling! I think Haiti is smelly and dirty as well. Don’t Get it twisted, OK. I am an equal oppotunity basher.

  77. Well at least the major cities in Haiti are dirty. The countryside is quite beautiful. Especially, the beaches in the North and North west and some South eastern beaches.

  78. Populations which are divided by language are at perpetual conflict with themselves.

    Like the Swiss?
    English may be the most commnly spoken language in the United States, and it certainly makes sense to learn it well from an economic perspective. But the United States was a multilingual country from its inception, and in many areas other languages continue to have deep(er) roots. Spanish is certainly a legitimate American language, having been spoken in many parts of the country for much longer than English… not to mention the many Native American languages. We’ve always been a polyglot country, and it hasn’t wrecked us yet.

  79. Taking the “In my own experiences…” quote all by itself, without knowing who said it or that person’s history, it’s certainly a reasonable quote. Anyone, whether it’s an American living abroad or vice-versa, would seem better equipped in making their everyday lives – as well as the lives of people around them – easier by learning a basic grasp of the local language.

    The loud, obnoxious shirt kills this lucid notion, however.

  80. The problem here for guys like Rocker is not that immigrants aren’t learning to speak English. It’s that they have the gall to speak other languages around him, and he just doesn’t like it that he can’t always understand them. They could be plotting something, for Christ’s sake.

    Actually, I’m not sure if that is Rocker’s motivation, so I’m not being entirely fair. But it certainly is the motivation for a lot of the people who complain about this. Foreign jibber-jabber that they can’t understand intimidates and scares them. Throw in the (baseless) fear the they, as natives, might be forced into having to learn a new language to get by in their own home country, and you have a winning combination to stir up the nativists.

  81. I HOPE you don’t think Hurley’s hot because she’s Australian; she’s a Brit (and she’s just hot, but the accent doesn’t hurt).

    As for Zidane: his sister got called a whore: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zinedine_Zidane#Confrontation_with_Marco_Materazzi

  82. I am now an American therefore I will not be shy in pointing out things that are not good for America.

    Like queers, purple hair, and young mothers. Got it.

  83. I liked Rocker. It was a shame he was never really the same after his injury. He brought excitement to an otherwise drearily boring sport. Watching him charge out to the mound under a hail of boos at Yankee stadium is the sort of thing sports is all about.

  84. FatDrunkAndStupid wins the thread!

  85. **Rhywun | August 31, 2007, 5:05pm | #

    I am now an American therefore I will not be shy in pointing out things that are not good for America.

    Like queers, purple hair, and young mothers. Got it.**

    See, you must be one of those people that try to take things out of context so you can justify you point. If you understand the context of what I was saying then you would be able to agree with me that generational welfare is bad for America. I know people that have been on welfare and their children are also on welfare. unfortunately, there grandchildren will also be on welfare. The queer portion about of Rocker’s statement I don’t agree with.

    CONTEXT is the word of the day kids!

    Have a good labor day.

  86. Ten percent of the concern these people attempt to express is genuine and based on real issues. The rest of it is just unadulterated, pure bigotry. Next thing you know he’ll be pushing for a wall on the border, beefing up the INS, and demanding reductions in “legal” immigration. At that rate he can move to Texas, run for Congress and tell everyone he’s a libertarian! Maybe not. After all, who’d believe it?

  87. Like queers, purple hair, and young mothers. Got it.

    I would contend that basically every person has a “look” in their mind whereas if they see it in public, it immediately conjures up an internalized disparaging or negative reaction. It could be a yuppie in an expensive suit, or a skater kid, or a tattoo (“tramp stamp”), a smoker, a woman wearing a What Would Jesus Do? shirt, or whatever.

    Some people act out on this and mistreat the person accordingly, while others brush it off and treat the person as the individual they are. But that initial reaction is there, be it positive or negative.

    I’m not saying this is right. Nor am I defending Rocker in the least. But I think we should be careful in claiming that we (the collective ‘we’) would never, never, ever, ever reflexively judge someone’s lifestyle based on their outward appearance. Yes, even liberals and libertarians.

  88. joe,
    The private market – and in particular, the mass media, the labor market, and the national chains that are such a huge part of our economy – are incredibly effective at getting people to speak English.

    I agree. The market does a fine job of assimilating. I’m a great believer in the melting pot. No doubt English will pick up more Spanish in the coming decades. We don’t need to force people to learn English, but neither should we remove any incentives.

  89. I think he means “Speak American”

    I was educated in England and found that a large portion of Americans think they know English but they really do not. (case and point, our glorious furer er president)

  90. Populations which are divided by language are at perpetual conflict with themselves.

    Like the Swiss?

    Don’t forget Belgium.

    That place is such a hellhole that it’s needed a NATO presence since 1949.

  91. People complain about immigrants who don’t speak English in situations like when they try to order food, or pay for stuff at the grocery, or talk to someone on the street.

    You know, when the immigrants ARE trying to speak English.

    It took me no more than a week to learn how to learn the difference between hamburger and cheeseburger in Spanish, and to learn that “no tomates” really does in fact mean “no tomatoes” and “lechuga ?nica” means “only lettuce.” And my language skills are fairly inadequate, so I hold people who actually, y’know, need to use the language to this standard (learning 15 words in a week). BUT THEY KEEP MESSING UP MY MEAL EVERY TIME >=(

    We can all agree that John Rocker is a hypocrite though. Third year Spanish student (just started reading my first Spanish book, a translated Neil Gaiman book, lol); learning Japanese on my own time for about 5 months (I finally got the hang of katakana!). The only place that natively speaks those languages that I’d go to is Cancun.

  92. Odd Trivia Department: Rocker got 1,270 on his SATs. George W. Bush got 1,206.

  93. Warren,

    Printing ballots in other languages when doing so will increase voting rates is an assimilationist policy.

    It takes people who, by definition, live within an insular subculture, and engages them in the broady polity. Maybe they start watching the City Council meetings to see the guy they voted for. Maybe they start talking politics – American politics – with their neighbors. Maybe they see themselves a little differently in relation to the rest of their city.

  94. Odd Trivia Department: Rocker got 1,270 on his SATs. George W. Bush got 1,206.

    And they’re both fucking morons…

  95. I think he means “Speak American”

    I think you mean “Speek “Merican.”

    Another T-shirt idea!

  96. And they’re both fucking morons…

    Akira, how could you say that about Laura?

  97. OOPS

    I should have said:

    “Dick, how could you say that about Laura?”

    Apologies, Akira.

  98. It’s OK, though I did have a “Wha?” moment for a second.

  99. Hey Rocker, your proctologist called; they found your head…

  100. I know people that have been on welfare and their children are also on welfare. unfortunately, there grandchildren will also be on welfare.

    Oh yeah? My mom was on welfare for awhile after divorcing her abusive husband and raising four small children. Bad for America!! Oh wait… she eventually got off welfare and got a good job when we got a little older. And I am not welfare. So your cynical generalizations don’t work on me.

  101. [Grown-ups only]
    Isn’t it true that the MexicanGovernment as well as far-left non-profits ResistAssimilation? And, isn’t it true that the crypto-corporatists at Reason would gladly give them even more power, making their opposition even easier?
    [/Grown-ups only]

  102. [Grown-ups only]
    Isn’t it true that the MexicanGovernment as well as far-left non-profits ResistAssimilation? And, isn’t it true that the crypto-corporatists at Reason would gladly give them even more power, making their opposition even easier?
    [/Grown-ups only]

    You know, for someone who stumps for the “English as the official language of the US” crowd, lone wacko’s grasp of the language is quite abysmal.

  103. Odd Trivia Department: Rocker got 1,270 on his SATs. George W. Bush got 1,206.

    Which I think pretty much proves that the SATs are worthless as assessors of human intelligence.

    Also, Rocker is a douche bag.

    That is all.

  104. Wow… This is interesting news.

    But I think the most surprising part of this story (actually, of what I looked up on Google, after seeing this blog entry), is this encyclopedia article stating that Rocker is now married to fitness model Alicia Marie. Is this true?

    Maybe he isn’t a racist after all.

  105. Classic!

    Colin Quinn: “I don’t like the guy, but he’s clearly been on the 7 train.”

  106. I completely disagree with John Rocker, but for some reason I strongly support the movement for “PEAK NGLISH”.

    Oh my, lonewacko’s right! We’ve reached Peak English! We need a Kyoto conference for the ‘Merican language!

  107. His statement on his website is dated September 25, 2006.
    This post is dated August 31, 2007.

    Why exactly is this news?

  108. Has anyone informed him that Puerto Rico is not abroad

  109. Weel, let’s try that again.

    Most PR’s consider themselves abroad so I dunno.

  110. I have to agree with the racist bastard on this one. I’m of Puerto Rican descent, but English is my only language. I’ve worked with Mexicans in a restaurant kitchen, and they are happy to be here and learn our language. However, I have actually heard Dominicans say that we should learn Spanish because Dominicans are coming to the US. Yes, reread that last sentence. That is ridiculous, speak English.

  111. I am now an American therefore I will not be shy in pointing out things that are not good for America.

    Like queers, purple hair, and young mothers. Got it.

    And don’t even get him started on queer purple-haired young mothers …

    (Who, incidentally, can be mighty hot.)

  112. See SuicideGirls.com for details …

  113. I think Deadspin was talking about this like, I dont know, 2 years ago?

  114. But I think the most surprising part of this story (actually, of what I looked up on Google, after seeing this blog entry), is this encyclopedia article stating that Rocker is now married to fitness model Alicia Marie. Is this true?

    Maybe he isn’t a racist after all.

    Or maybe really hot booty trumped the racism …

  115. However, I have actually heard Dominicans say that we should learn Spanish because Dominicans are coming to the US. Yes, reread that last sentence. That is ridiculous, speak English.

    Well, why not learn Spanish? As long as we can communicate, what the fuck does it matter? In Canada, I take it, the majority tries to learn some French so as to connect with the minority. Is there something wrong with that? Is it a perversion of God’s will?

    Imagine a USA where huge portions of the country primarily speak Latin American Spanish, and lots of non-Hispanic English-speaking Americans also know conversational Spanish, and Spanish becomes a de facto second language of the USA. Do you see this as some sort of dystopian nightmare? Because it sounds pretty cool to me.

  116. i always liked that original quote: “OH THE TRAIN IS FILLED WITH PEOPLE OF VARIED BACKGROUNDS!”

  117. KRK,
    The reason pedants are a pain is they often assume their target is ignorant when most likely their target knew the rule but was just careless and/or tired when he wrote.

  118. Well, why not learn Spanish?

    Because if Americans become multilingual, then the terrorists will have won!

  119. I oppose a bilingual America for one simple reason: Quebec.

  120. Wow. This thread brings to mind a herd of self-righteous, gossipy, old biddies cackling over a younger woman’s attire.

    Ron Paul sez:
    “The protesters’ cause of open borders is not well served when they drape themselves in Mexican flags and chant slogans in Spanish. If anything, their protests underscore the Balkanization of America caused by widespread illegal immigration. How much longer can we maintain huge unassimilated subgroups within America, filled with millions of people who don’t speak English or participate fully in American life?”

  121. Yup, all the tut-tutting from busybodies obsessed with how other people speak is quite a bit like old ladies cackling about how other people dress.

    That Paul quote is a pretty good example of such, Flemur. My goodness, they speak a different language, and have you seen what they do to their cars’ suspensions?

  122. So far on my problems with Ron Paul list.

    Wants to restrict a woman’s control of her own body.

    Wants to restrict people’s choice of language.
    (and voted for the fence on the southern border)

    Wants to restrict openly gay soldiers from serving in the military.

    Wants to keep gays from adopting children.

    Wants to get prayer back in schools.

  123. I forgot this doozie,

    NAFTA’s superhighway is just one part of a plan to erase the borders between the U.S. and Mexico, called the North American Union. This spawn of powerful special interests, would create a single nation out of Canada, the U.S. and Mexico, with a new unelected bureaucracy and money system. Forget about controlling immigration under this scheme.

    That goes under “seems to be a paranoid xenophobe”

  124. You don’t get very far in professional baseball refusing to be cooperative and friendly with people of different races and cultures.

    I dunno, to me baseball is the major pro team sport where your interactions and trust between teammates is needed the least. In hoops, hockey, soccer and football, team harmony can significantly enhance the flow and quality of play (there’s a reason running backs get gifts for their OLs). Why does a closer that’s a power pitcher need his teammates to like him? It’s not like his teammates like or dislike mattered, just the fact that he could throw in the mid-90s.

    I can understand having multi-lingual ballots. There are a lot of Americans that can speak conversational English and get along fine, but when forced read technical, official English they would struggle (and you don’t learn those words on Three’s Company either). For example, I could get through most of the Middle East and speak Arabic, but I would be hard pressed to fill out a government form, like a visa application.

  125. “Well, why not learn Spanish? As long as we can communicate, what the fuck does it matter?”

    Replace Spanish with English.

    Why should the onus be on those already here.

    I don’t know why calling for immigrants to learn English is so controversial. While I don’t think it should be a requirement it certainly would help those immigrating in their quest to better themselves.

    Of course I may think this way because brown people and eastern Europeans scare me.

  126. Why on earth would Canada or Mexico want to be in a Union that would be dominated by a superpower with a population more than two times larger than both combined?

    It would just be a projection of American power, like Prussia in imperial Germany, Russia in the USSR, etc. Thats one big reason not to believe the North American Union crap.

  127. Should read “A projection of power by a larger neighbor over much smaller neighbors, like Prussia did in Germany and Russia did in the USSR.”

  128. Talk about a slow news day. John Rocker? Paris or Nicole didn’t get shit faced today?

  129. Why should the onus be on those already here.

    You’ve got it all wrong. I don’t put the onus on English-speaking Americans. I reject the whole idea of an onus.

    You’ve got different groups of people with different languages. It’d be nice if they could communicate with each other. There’s lots of different ways that could be achieved. And it really doesn’t matter how it happens. Which one’s the majority and which one’s the minority doesn’t matter. There’s no especially privileged or uniquely correct way to do this.

    Now, my personal preferences are for a place with lots of different languages. But that’s probably because I grew up in a place where you never heard anything other than English (the only Spanish I ever heard was from the Bumblebee Guy on the Simpsons). I envy people who grew up around lots of different languages (in big cities or in multilingual countries or with immigrant parents). I think it would be awesome if America had English and Spanish and Polish and Mandarin all over the place. But those are just my personal preferences.

  130. LeMur-

    Do you oppose southerners flying the Confederate flag?

    I really don’t, because I understand they aren’t agitating for secession, they are just expressing something in their heritage. Thats how it is with Mexican flags, 9/10 times.

  131. Yeah, it would be a shame to insist people learn English. After all, is lack of English fluency a problem at all for people in the US? As a matter of fact, I think we should encourage more people to learn other languages. Because as we all know, countries where more than one language is spoken widely, like Canada and Belgium, have never had serious problems related to language.

    Objections to the encouragement of learning English is reason #53702018839465 libertarians will never be taken seriously in this country.

  132. Objections to the encouragement of learning English is reason #53702018839465 libertarians will never be taken seriously in this country.

    Nobody objects to immigrants learning English. I just don’t think its as big a problem as people make it out to be.

    People seem to have this huge issue with Spanish TV. Guess what, there are about two Spanish-language channels on my cable. Compare that to over 300 English-speaking ones. I fail to see what the problem is.

  133. “Why on earth would Canada or Mexico want to be in a Union that would be dominated by a superpower with a population more than two times larger than both combined?”
    No, I agree with you Cesar, I don’t see any big conspiracy to combine us into one government. But I do think that business interests in all three nations want certain goodies they can get from more interaction with each other (Mexico would like some capital, US some cheap labor, etc), and they will push for greater integration in order to get it. Some of this will be governmental. I’m not commenting on whether this will be bad or not btw, but it will mean a lot more integration of our governments, economies and societies.

    “Yup, all the tut-tutting from busybodies obsessed with how other people speak is quite a bit like old ladies cackling about how other people dress.”
    Joe, I see your point. In the sense of Mills harm principle (often a motivating factor on the left) people speaking like the tower of babel does no one direct harm. But you know, I know a lot of decent though very traditional and somewhat “provincal” folks who are just made very uncomfortable by being surrounded by people speaking another language. Humans are not very rational people (my field is sociology, which overdoes how irrational folks are, but there is still a lot if irrationality). Things make them uncomfortable that maybe should not. What good does it do for us “more rational” folks to make fun of them and liken them to silly old ladies? Their preferences matter to, don’t they? I mean, I follow your posts here, and it seems that the gut feeling of obligation that most folks have for one another that undergirds support for welfare and various transfer programs is not always seen as “rational” (look how the hard core libs here treat it), but we don’t dismiss those folks who hold that view as silly irrational goofs, do we?

  134. No, I agree with you Cesar, I don’t see any big conspiracy to combine us into one government. But I do think that business interests in all three nations want certain goodies they can get from more interaction with each other (Mexico would like some capital, US some cheap labor, etc), and they will push for greater integration in order to get it. Some of this will be governmental. I’m not commenting on whether this will be bad or not btw, but it will mean a lot more integration of our governments, economies and societies.

    There will be economic intergration, which as a free trader I believe is a good thing. But there will never, ever be very much political integration.

    The European Union can work because there is not one large state that dominates it as there would be in a “North American” Union. Canadians, and especially especially Mexicans would revolt if such a thing were to occur. They’ll enter into a political Union with the gringos when hell freezes over.

  135. I urge everyone to remain calm and DO NOT BELIEVE THE NORTHAMERICANUNION CRAP!

    despite all the evidence that very powerful people want it

    IGNORE IT!! THEY AREN’T TRYING TO PUSH IT!!

    at least under that name

    IGNORE THE FOLLOWING, CITIZEN!

    house.gov/paul/tst/tst2006/tst082806.htm
    eagleforum.org/topics/NAU
    worldnetdaily.com/news/archives.asp?AUTHOR_ID=223
    lonewacko.com/blog/archives/nau-digest.html
    thenation.com/bletters/20070827/hayes

  136. Hey TLB, why would the Mexicans want a North American Union? Answer my question about how the USA would dominate the Union, with a population two and half times the size of the other two states combined.

  137. Shirt on right say “peak nglish.”
    What language that?
    Hooterese?
    Hooterese universal language? Not Esperanto?

  138. TLB,

    It’s too late, the North American Union is already starting to replace the USA…

    http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=15233

    brought to you by…
    Mr. Corsi is the author of several books, including “Unfit for Command: Swift Boat Veterans Speak Out Against John Kerry” (along with John O’Neill)…

  139. A statement regarding the SPP (aka, the North American Union).

    http://www.spp.gov/pdf/leaders_statement_2007_english.pdf

  140. This thread brings to mind a herd of self-righteous, gossipy, old biddies cackling over a younger woman’s attire.

    Ummm, this thread seems to be more about horny, not-laid-in-a-while guys drooling over the picture of the young woman’s scanty attire.

    Oh, wait, weren’t some people yammering about immigration too? Some people just can’t stay focused, yeah? 😉

    TEY STOLE ARH JARBS!

  141. So far on my problems with Ron Paul list.

    Wants to restrict a woman’s control of her own body.

    Wants to restrict people’s choice of language.
    (and voted for the fence on the southern border)

    Wants to restrict openly gay soldiers from serving in the military.

    Wants to keep gays from adopting children.

    Wants to get prayer back in schools.

    Neu Mejican: So far on my problems with Ron Paul everyone else running list:

    Everything else.

    Bonus points for brevity?

  142. More…

    “Urban legend of “North American Union” feeds on fears

    By Philip Dine, St. Louis Post-Dispatch”

    http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2003713518_rumor19.html

  143. prolefeed,

    I’ll give you the extra point for brevity, but you end up with a D- due to lack of content.

    =/;)

  144. Why should the onus be on those already here.

    It was that onus stuff that got Craig in trouble. 😉

  145. Neu Mejican:

    Socialized medicine. Higher taxes. Higher spending. No troop withdrawal. Authoritarianism run amok. Monarchical succession. Funny underwear. Hardly any experience. A little too much experience at scewing us over …

    Getting carpal tunnel syndrome. You got something to praise about those buggers? Seriously? 😉

  146. scewing screwing

    Must … learn … to … preview.

  147. More on what R. Paul is afraid of (the NAU),

    http://www.alternet.org/audits/54184/

  148. prolefeed,

    You talking the clowns running against Paul, or the whole crowd?

  149. You mean this?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-OxYbOYPjQg

    Gotta give chops to a Republican courting anarcho-leftists during the primary (or ever).

    Got your “Who is John Galt Ron Paul?” bumper sticker yet?

  150. Neu Mejican — depends on who you define as “the clowns”. I define that as “anyone but Bill Richardson”. You?

  151. prolefeed,

    Sounds good to me.

  152. Rocker’s 2000 comments were widely condemned, but all he said was that the things he described are depressing, not that they should be illegal. I for one think homosexuality, repeat offenders, and unwed motherhood are depressing things. Since when do libertarians think people should keep their opinions about society to themselves? I don’t think the government should punish any of those things (except to the extent that a released prisoner has already been punished), but Mr. Rocker is well within his rights, and quite sensible as well, to disapprove.

    As for learning English, again we have an exhortation rather than a demand for legal intervention. You might not think immigrants should have to learn English, but don’t you think it would be a good idea? And there is a big difference between living somewhere for less than a year and moving to another country permanently.

  153. Bazil | August 31, 2007, 5:31pm | #

    I think he means “Speak American”

    I was educated in England and found that a large portion of Americans think they know English [,] but they really do not. (cCase and in point, our glorious furer Fuehrer [,]er[,] p President[.])

  154. Bazil | August 31, 2007, 5:31pm | #

    I think he means “Speak American”[.]

  155. Hey, what happened to the Tony Snow post?
    Was it something I said?

  156. Nathan: But he also offended the purple hair crowd. And I, for one, welcome out purple-haired overlords.

  157. Close your freakin’ tags, you pedant.

  158. That requires a nap as well.

  159. John Rocker’s English American teacher | September 2, 2007, 1:27am | #

    Bazil | August 31, 2007, 5:31pm | #

    I think he means “Speak American”[.]

    That “.” should go inside the quotation marks to conform with American practices. Outside it is British.

    “Speak American.”

  160. American technical writing, which that was, follows the older convention.

  161. American Technical writing conventions explained…

    http://stipo.larc.nasa.gov/sp7084/sp7084ch3.html#3.11.3

    Place periods before closing quotation marks.

    The operator presses the letter n to indicate “no” and the letter y to indicate “yes.”

    The word pultruded is defined to mean the opposite of “extruded.”

  162. We stand corrected, having been working from an older template.

    And we wonder why we’re not a popular movement.

    (Drink!)

  163. Aren’t John Rocker’s 15 minutes up YET?

  164. BTW, Daniel if you say “lechuga unica” a Spanish speaker might think hmmmmm, he wants a unique lettuce. I’d go with “lechuga, mas nada”

  165. BTW, Daniel if you say “lechuga unica” a Spanish speaker might think hmmmmm, he wants a unique lettuce. I’d go with “lechuga, mas nada”

    Thanks.

  166. I’ve always thought it made more sense to put the period – which I always interpreted as meaning you are absolutely, positively done with the sentence – after the closing quote mark.

  167. Fuck all this. I can’t even get my order right in a restaurant because the Spanish speaking cooks can’t properly deciper the order ticket written by the English speaking waiterettes.

    QSL said, “after the closing quote mark.”

    I’m with you, brother. The punctuation within the quotes is awkward nonsense insisten upon by people who have forgotten languages evolve. I’m amazed they don’t insist we still use “thou” and “thine”.

  168. “I don’t know,” dhex said. “the punctuation within quotes just plain looks better.”

    Since when do libertarians think people should keep their opinions about society to themselves?

    naw dude that’s what it is. it’s a back and forth. part of saying “i don’t like xyz” is someone else who does or objects to your phrasing or whatever sez “you’re wrong about xyz” and uh then democracy happens or something.

  169. I take the middle ground. If what is within quotes deserves the punctuation, then I put the punctuation within the quotes. If not, I put it outside.

    Quoting a word or three usually does not earn the sentence ending punctuation. Quoting a sentence — or a phrase that could conclude a sentence — usually does.

  170. *whatever zombies say

  171. As a NY Mets fan…John Rocker is a F**king A**hole.

  172. Re: punctuation marks.

    The practice evolves.
    This is why there is a difference between the US and British conventions (and a huge range of genre specific conventions).

    In most forms of writing, it will not make a difference. In published professional and technical writing, a copy-editor will insist that the punctuation conforms to the standards they use.

    Irregardles 😉 of common usage, these standards are slow to change and sometimes solidify nonsensical practices.

    Conforming to the standard sends a signal regarding in-group status. The in-group usually being a sign of a certain level of education (in a certain field of discourse).

  173. QSL said, “I’ve always thought it made more sense to put the period – which I always interpreted as meaning you are absolutely, positively done with the sentence – after the closing quote mark.”

    The period inside the quotation mark indicates the end of the sentence. The closing quotation mark indicates the end of the “speaker’s” turn.

    If the quote is more than a sentence long, you have a period or other final mark between the sentences. Putting the closing quotation inside the last sentence would give it strange status as somehow different than the preceding sentences.

    There is a logic to either choice.
    Conventions are that way.
    They are not rational or irrational.
    They just are.

  174. I like the Chinese-style English and the 2008 Beijing Olympics have ties, the Chinglish Chinese-English very interesting

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