Weapons of Mass Departures

I wondered when we'd get to boat people in the latest Haitian crisis. President Jean-Bertrand Aristide finally let loose with that dreaded threat -- at least dreaded by Floridians and those who covet their electoral votes.

Aristide must've noticed that the 50 Marines dispatched to his capital were not sent to save his sorry ass.

Comments

[Key West]

And there's still plenty of time to register to vote. Florida here we come.

[KJ]

Bush said the United States first will work on a political solution. "Incident to a political settlement, we will encourage the international community to provide a security presence, and that it also being discussed right now," he said.

Earlier, White House press secretary Scott McClellan emphasized that sending American forces there was "not something that has been in our plans."

"We encourage, strongly encourage the Haitian people to stay home," Bush said.

Link: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&e=3&u=/ap/20040225/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/us_haiti_10

[Ken]

Chum the waters between Haiti and the USA. Well, maybe just say we did.

[Andrew]

There is only one Hatian who needs to flee, and that is Aristide: getting his sorry ass out should be a condition for any peace-keeping forces to move in. We should NOT try to save him from the disarry he invited.

[Douglas Fletcher]

Let's send the faculty of Harvard down there & see if they can straighten things out.

[Mark S.]

And we pulled this murdering crypto-commie's ass out of the fire the last time because... Oh yeah, Clinton liked him.

[joe]

...because he was the elected president, Mark. I guess that's why only one of the two parties has the word "democratic" in its name.

[Jason Ligon]

" guess that's why only one of the two parties has the word "democratic" in its name."

I thought it was because they went around asking people how much of someone else's stuff they'd like this election cycle. Vote for me and I'll give you joe's house! Ahh, look ... democracy is beautiful.

I guess thats why the other group has the word 'republic' in its name.

[Warren]

...because propping up a democratically elected tyrant is what the US is here for. Crawling in bed with a despot whats been elected is a righteous thing.

[GodwinsEvilTwin]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Hitler elected too? Why the sudden reverence for elected despots?

[Umbriel]

He wasn't exactly, Godwin etc. Per the wonders of the parliamentary system, he, leader of the plurality (but not majority) party in the Reichstag, was appointed as a compromise Chancellor by President Hindenburg, and later used various "emergency powers" and mass arrests to consolidate his control. He originally came to power peacefully, then, but wasn't, strictly speaking, elected.

Here's a review of a book on the subject that fleshes out some of the details:
http://pages.prodigy.net/aesir/htdtp.htm

[joe]

Aristide was voted into office, and he can be voted out of office. But I guess not sharing your fiscal policies makes military coups ok.

Real proud day for conservatives. Tell me more about liberating Iraq.

[dhex]

well, duh, of course it's ok. he's on the wrong team! 🙂

[joe]

Seriously, you people are fucked up today. A judge thwarting the democratic will by using his delegated powers to overturn a law that violates the constitution, and send legislators back to the drawing board, elicits wailing and gnashing of teeth. But a bunch of thugs thwarting the democratic will by putting bullets in the back of people's heads is ok, because the people getting killed are wrong on policy, and you don't feel like waiting until the next scheduled election.

What a bunch of maroons.

[Grant Gould]

Um, elections do not a democracy make. Haiti's most recent round of elections was rigged, and the notion that Haitians should sit down and take it, because the US is content to let their president rig elections is simply laughable.

If the government rigs elections, the people have a right (some would say a duty) to rebel. This seems simple enough for most third-world countries to understand, but still seems rather an advanced concept for Americans.
--G

[Democracy's a crock]

Aristide hired the same PR firm that the Kuwaitis and the Bosnians used. One is quite justified in treating any official history of his regime with a good bit of skepticism.

He might have been elected but he was also censured by a democratically elected legislature when his autocratic ways manifested themselves.

[JimInNoVA]

joe - yeah, because Aristide has a really great history of obeying the will of the people. As I recall, didn't US Marines prop him up the last time there was a mass revolt? The man stayed in power by buying the military and gangs of thugs that are now turning against him, so quite frankly I have no problem with those same gangs of thugs removing him from power. No need for intervention on either side. Or is non-interventionist foreign policy suddenly against libertarian ideals?

[dhex]

heh, if the presence of PR firms makes one doubt governmental policy, then i think you'll have to look long and hard to find a gov't that doesn't enlist them heavily.

of course, it should make you wonder just what the fuck the sneaky bastards are up to.

[joe]

Don't ask me about libertarian ideals. They appear to revolve around "beat it, deadbeat!"

Grant is right that elections are not a sufficient conditions for democracy. But they are a necessary condition. Haiti might or might not develop its political culture into genuine democracy under a system of regular scheduled elections. It absolutely will not become a democracy if the pattern of coup after coup continues.

It's not about Aristide having the right to hold office. It's about consolidating a system in which leadership is decided by elections, and the route to power is within a democratic system.

[KJ]

"What a bunch of maroons"

joe,

I hate to communicate this to you, but if you want to adress persons who have far below normal intelligence and are judged to be unable to develop beyond a mental age of eight to twelve years, the accurate term would be morons.

"Maroon" on the other hand is either an adjective denoting a color of or pertaining to a dark brownish red or, as a noun, any of a group of West Indian Blacks who are descended from fugitive slaves of the seventeenth and eighteenth centuries (like, say, some of the denizens of Haiti).

[joe]

It's also how Bugs Bunny pronounces "moron," Ms. HighCulture.

Nice irony about the West Indians, though. I did not know that.

[StMack]

We should take no action beyond protecting our embassy without the unanimous support of the UN Security Council, or at the very least a written note of permission from France.

[joe]

I heared one of them rebels got hisself a anthrax bomb.

Let's roll.

[Jean Bart]

joe,

The term "maroon" is not universally used on the Caribbean (partly because so many European countries colonized it); plus you have terms like mulato, mulatto, creole, criollo, landino, etc. to contend with. As I recall, at one time, Brasil's colonial laws included dozens of "racial gradiations." Each one having its own sartorial laws and the like (some could own horse, some could not, what weapons one could own, etc. were also regulated).

KJ,

BTW, the term "maroon" is often found in usage in Brasil; maroonage being a term to describe escaped slaves who lived in the hinterland. Indeed, "maroon kingdoms" were created by these escaped slaves, and they even fought wars and signed treaties with the Portugese crown.

[Jean Bart]

StMack,

Actually, France has been asking for a UNSC resolution on the matter for approximately a week and a half now. Indeed, we've pledged approximately ~1,000 troops for a peacekeeping force if they do pass such a resolution.

[JimInNoVA]

Don't you hate it when your attempt at sarcasm ends up being way too close to the thruth? It's like getting out back issues of the Onion, and seeing the same headlines as the current week's NY Times.

[joe]

No shit! Does anyone know if the Monroe Doctrine is still in effect?

Seriously, wouldn't it be a blow to our prestige if the US didn't send in a peacekeeping force to a country in our own back yard, but the wussy and amoral French did?

Let's call this payback for Yugoslavia, JB, and call it even.

[Jean Bart]

joe,

I suspect most Latin American countries aren't very fond of the Monroe Doctrine; furthermore, France has possessions close to Haiti, so it would be easy for France to deploy and support a force there. Also, de Villipen has also stated that France could at minimum deploy ~1,000; he also said ~2,000-~3,000 might be possible.

[JimInNoVA]

It figures. The US sends its troops to the middle of the desert. French troops get to hang out on Carribean islands. =)

[JimInNoVA]

Good luck finding the Harvard faculty. They're all in Cuba for spring break.

[Maceiras Rachel]

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DATE: 05/20/2004 09:09:23
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