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Breaking the Law in the Name of the "War on Terror" = Not Breaking The Law
Bush calls for vital action to protect the American Way of Life:
President Bush plunged directly into the campaign to save his warrantless wiretapping program, arguing Wednesday that telecommunications firms that cooperated with spy agencies should be granted retroactive immunity from possible prosecution.
............
"The need for action is clear," Bush said. "Unless the reforms in the act are made permanent, our national security professionals will lose critical tools they need to protect our country."Bush argued that telecommunications companies that provided data to the government under the program should be granted immunity from prosecution in the event that their actions are determined to have been illegal.
..........."It's particularly important for Congress to provide meaningful liability protection to those companies now facing multibillion-dollar lawsuits only because they are believed to have assisted in efforts to defend our nation following the 9/11 attacks," Bush said.
Jacob Sullum from last month on this topic of Bush and the telecom companies putting their lives on the line to wiretap their customers, in which he observed:
the administration....feels duty-bound to withhold information when it might be useful to critics who oppose President Bush's anti-terrorism policies, since those policies are necessary to protect national security. But the very same information can—indeed, should—be released at a more opportune time, when it will help the president pursue his policies.
|9.20.07 @ 7:15PM|#
I support granting the telecommunications companies immunity for
their acts.
By the Special Prosecutor.
In exchange for their testimony in the criminal trials of the
President, VP, SecDef, Attorney General, DCI, DNI, and whomever
else the next President can get her hands on that has violated the
law.
shecky|9.20.07 @ 7:19PM|#
Why doesn't the Administration just nationalize the telecommunication sector already?
GOD|9.20.07 @ 7:23PM|#
Why should you mind being listened in on if you are not doing anything wrong?
|9.20.07 @ 7:32PM|#
The Devil's most loyal servants are those who mistake him for God - Some Catholic theologian
|9.20.07 @ 7:45PM|#
And if you're not doing anything wrong, you shouldn't mind
having the police pop by and search your house on a daily basis,
right? You shouldn't mind permanent roadblocks where every driver
is stopped, asked a long serious of deeply personal questions, is
required to pass, oh, a breathalizer test, piss in a cup, have
their hair sampled and whatever else they think up next
month.
Basically, if you're not doing anything wrong, you should be quite
happy being the government's bitch. Now that's patriotism if I've
ever seen it.
|9.20.07 @ 7:55PM|#
There I was completely wasting, out of work and down.
All inside it's so frustrating as I drift from town to town.
Feel as though nobody cares if I live or die,
So I might as well begin to put some action in my life.
Breaking the law, breaking the law.
Breaking the law, breaking the law.
Breaking the law, breaking the law.
Breaking the law, breaking the law.
So much for the golden future, I can't even start.
I've had every promise broken, there's anger in my heart.
You don't know what it's like, you don't have a clue.
If you did, you'd find yourselves doing the same thing, too.
Breaking the law, breaking the law.
Breaking the law, breaking the law.
Breaking the law, breaking the law.
Breaking the law, breaking the law.
You don't know what it's like.
Breaking the law, breaking the law.
Breaking the law, breaking the law.
Breaking the law, breaking the law.
Breaking the law, breaking the law.
Breaking the law.
|9.20.07 @ 8:01PM|#
Well, we asked them to break the law, but we didn't tell them
they were breaking the law? So now they need immunity.
Goddamn it, I want specifics, how many call did you listen to? From
where? To where? What were your reasons? How many of them evil
terrorists did you catch with this program?
Basically, GWB, I no longer believe a goddam thing that comes out
of your administration. I hate to sound like one of the sore loser
democrats, but prosecution of administration officials seems, more
and more, to be necessary. God, you're such an incompetent,
arrogant ass.
|9.20.07 @ 8:02PM|#
You know the inventor of that helmet is in hell right now
don't you (hint!)?
With all the hot chicks and interesting conversation.
|9.20.07 @ 8:23PM|#
I didn't used to talk like that Bazil.
But we need to make an example of these people, or they next set of
politicians, and the next, and the next, are going to think they
can get away with anything.
thoreau|9.20.07 @ 8:37PM|#
PL-
They tried stealing some of Cheney's jewelry and placing it on the
tracks of the Metro at the Pentagon station, but the diminuitive
Dennis Kucinich decided that the Ring is his, and he will not give
it up.
|9.20.07 @ 8:52PM|#
I hate to sound like one of the sore loser democrats, but
prosecution of administration officials seems, more and more, to be
necessary.
Yeah - if you still trust the courts and the legal system, that is.
They don't seem to be in great shape, either.
I'm with joe too, but I don't have much faith that it'll ever
happen....
|9.20.07 @ 9:08PM|#
Yeah - if you still trust the courts and the legal system,
that is. They don't seem to be in great shape, either.
I'm with joe too, but I don't have much faith that it'll ever
happen....
I know what you mean. And does anyone think that Hillary or Obama
is going to return the power that this administration has
misappropriated? It's the nature of the beast.
peter jackson|9.20.07 @ 9:10PM|#
Could someone point to the law that's been broken? I must have
missed it. is it an actual criminal law? Because it sounds like
Bush is talking about civil lawsuits.
yours/
peter.
|9.20.07 @ 10:20PM|#
Precisely who will pay for this insurance premium?
I'll give you one guess, but it doesn't matter because we are all
taking it up the ass.
Thanks, Generalisimo!
|9.20.07 @ 10:59PM|#
This is it! One second left in the game, score tied, here comes
the field goal attempt! It's up, and it -- turns into a fat guy who
hits the left upright!
And just like we always say when something really strange happens,
it's good that you did that, God.
|9.21.07 @ 4:26AM|#
You all do know that I can always hear you?
Yeah, well, GOD, you see, the problem is, that a lot of us can't
hear you very well, and can't understand you when we do.
Could you speak a little more clearly?
|9.21.07 @ 9:18AM|#
Sigh.
Ok, Pro Lib, we need a Censor.
Don't turn around, uh-oh!
Der Kommissar's in town, uh-oh!
|9.21.07 @ 9:44AM|#
Ok, Pro Lib, we need a Censor.
No worries, we'll just appoint a triumvirate to speak for the
people.
Oh, wait...
Episiarch|9.21.07 @ 9:50AM|#
joe, was that you with the Real Genius reference?
Kudos.
"In the immortal words of Socrates: 'I drank WHAT?'"
VM|9.21.07 @ 9:54AM|#
joe and epi - fantastic.
someone also used "moral imperative" yesterday.
just take those license plates out of your underwear!
|9.21.07 @ 10:10AM|#
"...does anyone think that Hillary or Obama is going to return
the power that this administration has misappropriated?"
I do! I do! You just need the right people in control.
Fluffy|9.21.07 @ 10:25AM|#
I am torn on this issue.
If you're ordered to do something by a public official and you do
it in good faith, shouldn't that constitute some sort of
affirmative defense?
Say you were caught in the middle of a riot and some cops told you
to help them carry some valuable property into their vehicle. If it
turns out that the cops were stealing the property for themselves,
are you an accessory to their crime? Shouldn't you be automatically
entitled to defend yourself by saying "The cops ordered me to do
it"?
If NSA officials turn up in my office and demand my database, they
are the ones violating privacy. It's not like anyone's going to
stand up and defend ME if I refuse to turn over the database and
start smacking NSA guys in the head. I don't see how we can
structure the law so that it creates a "duty of resistance" to
illegal state demands.
|9.21.07 @ 10:29AM|#
Fluffy,
Are you saying the telecoms don't have a gaggle of lawyers who
think about this type of thing everyday?
|9.21.07 @ 10:47AM|#
Precisely.
I also like the idea of automatically putting an outgoing president
on trial for his crimes.
|9.21.07 @ 10:58AM|#
"I also like the idea of automatically putting an outgoing
president on trial for his crimes."
Indeed. I also remember hearing that there was some Republican
resistance to renewing the PATRIOT Act due to concerns about how a
Democratic President would use the, how you say, 'phenomenal cosmic
powers' of the law.
|9.21.07 @ 11:05AM|#
joe,
I think we've reached a historic understanding. North and South,
Red Sox and Braves, Democrat and Republican, we're both agreed--the
White House needs a thorough scrubbing down after each president
leaves. As well as a complete inventory of all valuables.
Just the idea of someone hounding every elected and appointed
official on ethics issues on a regular basis makes me happy. The
Office of Censor wouldn't have prosecutorial powers, I don't think;
rather, it would simply have the power to investigate, review
evidence, hear a defense, and remove said person from office. Of
course, others could prosecute afterwards, based on the information
uncovered by the Censor. And the Censor shall have investigatory
power that trumps all claims of privilege, national security, and
good taste.
"President Bush--you've been Censored! Take off, hoser."
|9.21.07 @ 11:51AM|#
I like the way it would eliminate the whole "you're just
investigating me for partisan purposes" dodge, like Tom Delay
used.
And for once, the whole "if you're not doing anything wrong, you've
got nothing to worry about" reasoning actually applies.
All of the IGs become arms of the Censor, in Executive Branch
offices.
peter jackson|9.22.07 @ 1:13AM|#
Wow, so the telecoms have broken the Fourth Amendment and FISA?
You guys should call the press and let them know. Surely there's a
Pulitzer in it for you.
yours/
peter.
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