The Volokh Conspiracy
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New Deal Justices and MAGA Justices
FDR appointed Hugo Black because he was a "thumping, evangelical New Dealer." Why can't Trump want a "thumping, evangelical MAGA warrior"?
The current outrage is that President Trump might seek to appoint judges who are in line with his MAGA agenda. This pearl clutching lacks any sense of history. Let's jump back about nine decades to the Democratic party's favorite modern president.
The centerpiece of President Franklin D. Roosevelt's domestic agenda was the New Deal. Roosevelt and New Dealers in Congress enacted statutes and reforms that clearly violated settled Supreme Court precedent. And, perhaps unsurprisingly, the Supreme Court halted several planks of his federal platform, as well as analogous state legislation.
FDR was so incensed by these rulings that he considered amending the Constitution to grant the federal government more powers. When that process seemed too difficult, he instead proposed the Court packing bill, to ensure there would be more Justices who supported his agenda. Ultimately, that plan never came to pass. Justice Owen Roberts, for one reason or another, began to uphold New Deal legislation. And soon enough, the Four Horsemen retired.
Biographer Howard Ball offers this account of how Roosevelt made his first Supreme Court appointment. Read it carefully: whenever you see the word "New Deal," substitute it for "MAGA." I think you'll get the picture quickly.
Consequently, Roosevelt turned to his attorney general, Homer Cummings, for a list of possible nominees to replace Van Devanter. Sixty names were produced, including federal judges, Solicitor General Stanley Reed, law professors such as Felix Frankfurter, and strong congressional defenders and advocates of the New Deal, including Senators Hugo Black of Alabama and Sherman "Shay" Minton of Indiana.
At a White House meeting, Roosevelt and Cummings agreed upon four criteria that the nominee had to meet. First, the nominee needed solid New Deal credentials; he had to be a "thumping, evangelical New Dealer," said Roosevelt (and Black was certainly that, having voted for all twenty-four of Roosevelt's major New Deal programs.) Second, he had to be confirmable in the Senate. Third, he had to be reasonably young. And finally, he had to come from a region of the country unrepresented (on the Court)--the West or the South. Using these criteria, by August 1, 1937, the two men had cut the list to seven names.
The seven included four federal judges (quickly dropped out because they were not economically liberal enough,) Solicitor General Reed (Kentucky), Senator Minton (Indiana), and Black. However, Reed, according to Roosevelt, "had no fire" and was dropped from consideration. . . .
Franklin Roosevelt, according to Harold Ickes, a Roosevelt Administration figure, liked Black very much. FDR thought Hugo was too liberal for his own state; while he was not as good a lawyer as others, he would make a good justice because of his support of New Dealism. According to Bill Douglas, at the time the new appointed chairman of the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC), Roosevelt was attracted to Black for three reasons: his use of the investigative role of the Senate to shape the American mind of reforms, his strong voting record in the Senate, and his early support for FDR in 1933.
Douglas insisted that President Roosevelt chose Black because he wanted "to throw a 'tiger' as he put it, into the Court--an outstanding opponent of all that the old Court had done."
FDR wanted an economic liberal who supported his agenda, and would have courage on the Supreme Court. And who were Roosevelt's other picks: Solicitor General Stanley Reed, who defended New Deal policies in Court; Professor Felix Frankfurter, who provided the intellectual foundation of New Deal policies: William O. Douglas, who chaired the Roosevelt SEC; Attorney General Frank Murphy; Senator James Byrne, a New Dealer; Robert Jackson, the Solicitor General and Attorney General. FDR appointed all people close to him who he deemed loyal and supportive of the new Deal. Indeed, Byrne stepped down from the Court to take a position in the administration. Frankfurter continued advising Roosevelt even after he was appointed. These justices remained loyal to Roosevelt throughout.
If Trump simply said, "I want to appoint Justices like FDR did," would the left say "okay"? No. They'll say Trump is being hypocritical; progressives have no actual judicial philosophy, other than achieving progressive results, but conservative profess fidelity to originalism, which is not results oriented. Do as I say, not as I do.
For starters, I'm not sure Trump has ever said he was an originalist. And he has publicly disavowed those who supported his appointing originalists to the Court during his first term. Do you think anyone told Trump that appointing Justices who would overrule Chevron means that his policies get less deference?
Still, I will give Justice Black the benefit of the doubt, and assume was not just acting to support New Deal legislation. His judicial philosophy operationalized New Deal politics. His understanding of the Commerce Clause and other facets of federal authority led to decisions favorable to Roosevelt.
Relatedly, President Nixon wanted to appoint justices who were "tough on crime." As awful his picks were, Nixon succeeded on this limited front. The Burger Court scaled back the exclusionary rule and Miranda, even as they decided Roe v. Wade.
If Trump were to follow FDR's playbook, who would he pick? Let's see: who is a young Senator who supports the MAGA agenda who would be confirmed, and represents an under-represented part of the country? I think the obvious candidate would be Senator Josh Hawley. Plus, as a former Roberts clerk, that selection might even be enough to get Chief Justice to (at long last) retire.
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The current outrage is that President Trump might seek to appoint judges who are in line with his MAGA agenda. This pearl clutching lacks any sense of history. Let's jump back about nine decades to the Democratic party's favorite modern president.
People don't like his MAGA agenda.
If they did like his agenda, appointing a variety of people (including politicians, academics, and administrative officials) to promote it would not be a concern.
The MAGA agenda includes support of personal loyalty over principles and qualifications.* People are concerned about that. So, they are worried about that being the standard.
==
* The agenda also has various other bad points.
The MAGA agenda includes support of personal loyalty over principles and qualifications.
That's not what "agenda" means.
Merriam Webster defines "agenda" as "a list or outline of things to be considered or done." The second definition is "an underlying often ideological plan or program."
Personal loyalty to a leader is a central MAGA concern when working out what to do. It is a significant aspect of MAGA planning.
No, Martinned is right. That usage doesn't scan. It's too abstract. Also you're using the dictionary wrong.
That must be why President Trump decisively won the election and the popular vote. Because people don't like his agenda. And all those polls showing people like his agenda. They really mean the opposite.
Would you please get a job advising the DNC? I'll even give you reference. If you have any friends that share your opinions, bring them with you.
Riva, do you even know what the DNC is? It is primarily an organization that raises and distributes money. Apart from holding a quadrennial nominating convention, its input into candidate selection or strategy is virtually nil.
President Trump did not, of course, decisively win anything, other than the hearts of minds of Riva's programmers.
No, MAGA does not mean personal loyalty. In fact, Trump has a long history of appointing people who were not personally loyal to him.
And then disparaging them while his followers cheered.
In terms of appointing personally loyal people Trump at least in his 1st term probably has one of the worst records I can think of in modern history off the top of my head. Maybe some tinpot dictators in Africa who only lasted a few months have him beat. The media certainly let everyone know. In terms of the threat of instituting a 1000 year fourth Reich your local grocery bagger is quite possibly closer let alone the Democrats. It's so funny how backwards some low intelligence people's perceptions are vs established easily observable facts.
…and then having a tantrum about their lack of loyalty.
MAGA is not an agenda. It's a cult. That's what makes Blackman's whatabout analogy so terrible.
Can't let you make a fool of yourself
Consumer Confidence Surges Under Trump: A New Era of Economic Optimism
Talk about fake news! The real story is below. Bottom line: consumer confidence partially rebounded in May after a sharp decline in April, but is still below the level that generally signals a recession. https://www.conference-board.org/topics/consumer-confidence
I never pegged FDR as JB’s lodestar. Go figure.
FDR began a long period of liberal ascendancy.
Blackman jealously dreams of such success.
Some FDR critics are appalled at the results. They might not be as gung-ho about following his methods.
Others might respect his success & use him as a guide while trying to advance a very different agenda.
WTF are you talking about? The only thing Trump (and you) want is Justices who will rule in whatever way Trump wants them to 100% of the time. That's an entirely different problem than trying to find justices who will uphold the New Deal or be tough on crime.
Yet you are so in the dark you can't be more specific than 'in whatever way" Makes you look sooooo stupid.
FDR saying that he wanted Justices who would support the New Deal is the equivalent of saying that they "will rule in whatever way [FDR] wants them to 100% of the time."
FDR was the New Deal the same way MAGA is Trump. But don't let that get in the way of a good Trump bashing.
Yeah, no. The New Deal implied a particular approach to defining the powers of Congress, which FDR needed the Supreme Court to back.
Name a competent attorney who has stated that SCOTUS or the lower courts are wrongly interpreting the Constitution.
For example, has one competent attorney said that people subjected to deportation are not entitled to have the courts rule on a habeus corpus filing prior to deportation?
I'm sure that No True Scotsman Attorney has never said that.
Name one doctor that doesn't think you should have that operation. Attorneys, courts, legal action --- they sit still like a police dog until some liberal yells 'Get em"
"...but conservative [sic] profess fidelity to originalism, which is not results oriented. "
Sure.
Originalism isn't results oriented, except in the negative sense that being results oriented is the point of NOT being an originalist.
But in practice, originalists shouldn't be expected on the bench, and especially above the bottom tier of courts, because they are, no matter what Presidents may say, selected against, because so many current federal activities are unconstitutional under any originalist understanding of the Constitution. And Presidents don't want a judiciary which would demand that half the federal government be shut down, even if (Especially if?) they'd have a point.
You sure sound mad about some results not being delivered.
Only Leftwingers are allowed to appoint ends over means partisans (living constitutionalists) who do whatever they feel like. Right appointed judges are expected to be strict originalist and textualists regardless of whether it serves the conservative agenda at the current moment and just be satisfied with the fact that more often than not the two align given that the Dems want to overthrow the underpinnings of society.
The game is set up to be a one way ratchet and conservatives are supposed to play interference and defense only and never actually score points to move in the other direction. Maybe once in awhile they'll graciously allow conservatives to fight to a temporary slowdown to the left's agenda but never a true reverse. That is the role Progs and a lot of controlled opposition fake 'conservatives' and 'libertarians' ordain for the right leaning party.
You have a habit of insisting that the latest MAGA shitting on our republic is cool and good the liberals in your head are exactly that evil.
It’s the evil liberals in his head that justify his lack of principles. They’re up to so much no good we just have to break the rules now, we have to become them to beat them!
"Right appointed judges are expected to be strict originalist and textualists regardless of whether it serves the conservative agenda at the current moment[.]"
Yes, yes they are. And should be. Because one of the surest checks on the judiciary's inclination to infringe upon the spheres of the executive and the legislature is by appointing people who seriously believe in the school of judicial interpretation born in response to the worst excesses of the likes of William O. Douglas and legal realism his fellow-travelers espoused.
If it's ok to appoint people to achieve an end, then it's ok to oppose them to achieve an end.
Meanwhile he can also be opposed by people whose principles are independent of political parties.
Blackman's fall off to results oriented jurisprudence (well he always was but this time you'd have to be a complete moron not to see it) is honestly hilarious. At least he's dropped all pretenses.
Pre-Dobbs, he expressly said that if originalism didn't deliver a repeal of Roe, then originalism needed to be abandoned.
"The current outrage is that President Trump might seek to appoint judges who are in line with his MAGA agenda. This pearl clutching lacks any sense of history. Let's jump back about nine decades to the Democratic party's favorite modern president."
No, the pearl-clutching is precisely because a sense of history is possessed in abundance. We have seen how this story plays out and should not want to see it happen again. (And, given how things've gone thus far, the odds are high about the old adage about the first time being as tragedy and the second time as farce.) It's taken decades to make real progress at sorting out the mess the full-throated embrace of legal realism by the New Deal-era court caused and, even then, things like Wickard v. Filburn endure nonetheless. It's folly beyond reason to think a modern-day flirtation with results-oriented jurisprudence will end any better than the last one did for constitutional governance.
And I'd prefer if we just avoided finding out just what the executive power version of the economic agglomeration doctrine was and how cancerous it would be for the constitutional order, myself.
Ok going back 80 years for your whataboutism is pretty funny, but this takes the cake.
conservative profess fidelity to originalism, which is not results oriented
No one, not even you Josh of the "judicial courage" mantra, thinks that originalism as practiced isn't results oriented.
I am disappointed by the extent to which I am disappointed by self-described "conservatives."
I really enjoy reading a Gorsuch opinion that leads to an outcome I did not predict.
Apparently, I am alone in this. I should have known better.
Even Gorsuch is results oriented, he just usually hides it better than the others. But not always. See for example his very confused concurrence in Cakeshop.
Just because FDR did it, does not make it right. Judges should be chosen based on their ability to put aside their politics and rule according to the law. Packing the court with political loyalists is a fascist move.
Only on the illogical premise that one's politics and one's constitutional adherence share no provenance. But that of course rules out being an originalist DE NOVO
Someone said that "Judges should be chosen based on their ability to put aside their politics and rule according to the law."
That's an important qualification.
Still. Presidents are going to nominate judges that overall also advance a certain overall view of the law, including its goals and proper limits. FDR thought the Constitution allowed the New Deal. He wasn't just going to nominate judges who could put aside politics. He was going to nominate certain ones.
Multiple people didn't like how I used "agenda" though two replies were somewhat inexact on explaining why. Also, MAGA is not just a "cult." It is a cult with certain principles and goals.
I said the problem was more than a bad "agenda." Word usage can be important. If I used the word wrong, my overall argument still doesn't raise or fall on it.
"FDR thought the Constitution allowed the New Deal."
Thought it allowed, didn't care if it didn't allow, I'm not sure which.
And here we have an example of how originalism works as practiced by your average conservative.
Outcome-oriented and vibes-based.
As they say in logic "no real person is actually an average person"
You know you're right when people attack your words instead of your position.
JUST OUT
Debunking FDR: The Man and the Myths Hardcover – March 11, 2025
by Mary Grabar
FDR wanted the New Deal. Conservative justices struck down portions of it as being unconstitutional. To overcome that, FDR threatened to pack the Court. Then came Justice Roberts' switch in West Coast Hotel Co. v. Parrish (1937), upholding a Washington law that set the minimum wage. Support to pack the Court was never there, so FDR resolved to appoint pro-New Deal justices. After that came a string of pro-government decisions, including Wickard v. Filburn (1942) and others that widened the role of government regulation and dominion over the economy.
In response, conservatives developed originalism as a jurisprudence for interpreting the Constitution. Because it had a more rigorous approach to interpretation than others, over time originalism won over more and more adherents, even on the Left. Now we can say, as Justice Kagan said, "we are all originalists now." Now the justices all agree that the actual, original meaning of a document as seen by its drafters is the proper starting point for interpretation, although they may differ on where that leads. These days, it seems almost strange that prior justices were not so equally moored.
Now, this "originalist" Court is not giving Trump everything he wants. Prof. Blackman's response: Let's go revitalize the FDR route! Yes, let's just throw away decades of carefully developing a workable jurisprudence that leads to more predictable results and rejects the subjective whims of New-Deal-era jurisprudence in favor of the Good Old Days of "just give me what I want!" Let's bring back judicial realism! Why? Because WHAT HAVE YOU DONE FOR ME LATELY, originalists?
I'm not sure what Blackman's point is with this other than "how can Trump pwn those libs again?" This is silliness, if not something that calls for turning in one's Federalist Society card -- which may be the point now that Trump has ragged on the group recently. Is Blackman still angling for attention from the White House? If so, what else is he willing to say? Support for Korematsu?
Touche, Professor Blackman, you have come up with a good argument and an interesting analogy. Many conservatives in the 1930s reacted to Roosevelt in the same way progressives react to Trump.
Another analogy at the time - Roosevelt had fickle allies in his own party - more conservative Democrats including many from the south that were not Hugo Black. Unlike Trump, he also had enemies who didn't think he went far enough, including Huey Long and, very differently, a bunch of New York socialists and communists.
One thing FDR did not do was challenge the ability of the nation's voters to turf him and his party out of office. That's the most dangerous aspect of the MAGA agenda, and it's where compliant judges would get into Ernst Janning territory. I can't imagine Hugo Black would have acceded to actions that would have denied Wendell Wilkie an earned victory in 1940
The MAGA “agenda” is an incoherent agglomeration of ever-shifting quasiprincinciples that net out towards rewarding those who like and are like Trump, blended with a set of cultish tendencies (most definitely not limited to: leader-reverence, authoritarianism, vindictiveness, disdain for evidence and reason, *profound* disdain for intellectual integrity, indifference to outgroup suffering), all stochastically seasoned by the verbal rants and social media ravings of a person whose communicative output is largely determined by his latest glandular secretions.
it is the rare jurist who can meaningfully anticipate and align with such a shapeshifting abomination while maintaining even a thin veneer of professional integrity and public virtue. Those charged with finding such people are due some small measure of our compassion.
" to the Democratic party's favorite modern president."
Wow Joshie I didn't know you were appointed spokesman for the Democratic party.
I thought it was JFK, no Carter, no Clinton, no Obama, no Biden. Did I forget anyone. Who says it was FDR.