The Volokh Conspiracy
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Supreme Court Will Consider Trump Section 3 Disqualification Case
The justices will hear the case on an expedited schedule, and could potentially consider all the issues it raises.

This afternoon the Supreme Court agreed to review the Colorado Supreme Court decision disqualifying Trump from appearing on the state's ballot in the 2024 presidential election, under Section 3 of the Fourteenth Amendment. The case will be heard on an expedited schedule, with oral arguments scheduled for February 8, a little over one month from now. The justices likely chose to hear the case quickly so as to make sure it gets resolved before we go too much further into the 2024 election cycle.
Significantly, the Court has not limited the questions presented. That means the justices could potentially consider the full range of issues raised by the case, including whether the January 6 attack on the Capitol qualifies as an "insurrection," whether Trump's actions amount to "engaging" in insurrection, whether the president is an "officer of the United States" covered by Section 3, whether Section 3 is "self-executing," whether it is a "political question," and whether Trump got adequate due process in the state court. There may be some additional procedural questions, as well. But perhaps the Court will issue narrowing questions presented before briefs are due.
Most observers expect the Court to overturn the Colorado decision. That might well happen; it may even be the most likely outcome. But I think many are underrating the likelihood that the justices will affirm the Colorado ruling. The latter is based on strong reasoning, including from an originalist point of view. And to the extent the justices may be motivated by reputational considerations, disqualifying Trump is the perfect opportunity for them to show once and for all that they are not adjuncts of the GOP and especially not the "MAGA Court." In my view, much of the left-wing criticism of the Court is wrong or over overblown; but my opinion is not what's decisive for the Court's public and elite standing.
Of course, I'm far from a perfect prognosticator of what the justices will do. We'll likely get a better sense of where they stand during the oral argument.
I assessed the Colorado decision (which I think is largely correct) here. I went over the issues at stake in the Section 3 litigation in more detail in this article (written before the Colorado decision). In a September Lawfare article, I addressed various pragmatic and moral concerns raised by disqualification, such as claims that it would be anti-democratic and might create a dangerous slippery slope.
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Dude just preemptively take the L.
Y'all:
Rather than solely commenting on here, since it won't influence anything, I was thinking of trying to get my thoughts into an amicus brief. I wouldn't file the brief myself (I'm not a member of the bar, and don't have the money to spare to pay someone to file in my behalf), but I'm considering writing to law professors, in order to suggest that this decision cannot be reversed, save on grounds generally applicable to state action, such as due process. I've discussed that view at length in other comments.
Do you think I should? Are they generally receptive to people who write to them, provided that they can explain their opinions well?
Of course, I wouldn't be Nameless when I write them 😉
There is nothing that’s the least bit compelling about your argument.
The states could be totally wrong about as a matter of law about whether Trump qualifies as an insurrectionist, whether section 3 applies to the presidency, whether section 3 is self executing, and whether state action is preempted by section 5, and what the standard of proof is, and there could be a dozen different results, but as long as they observed due process in misinterpreting the US constitution their decision isn’t reviewable?
Good luck with that. That would fly interpreting the state constitution, but there is no way in hell the justices will punt on a national question that hinges on the US Constitution.
Here is the most compelling aergument in favor of reversal.
https://reason.com/2024/01/04/7-reasons-trumps-lawyers-say-he-is-not-disqualified-from-running-for-president/
Trump's lawyers unsurprisingly take a different view. Given the historical context, they say, "'insurrection' as understood at the time of the passage of the Fourteenth Amendment meant the taking up of arms and waging war upon the United States." That is notably different, they argue, from what happened at the U.S. Capitol in 2021 or from what happened the previous year in Portland, Oregon, where "violent protestors targeted the federal courthouse…for over 50 days, repeatedly assaulted federal officers and set fire to the courthouse, all in support of a purported political agenda opposed to the authority of the United States." Such incidents, they say, reflect "a long history of political protests that have turned violent," which are a far cry from what Section 3's framers had in mind.
I agree that "political protests that have turned violent" are not inherently the same thing as insurrection. I strongly disagree that the J6 attack can be fairly characterized as a political protest that turned violent.
To be sure, that may describe the involvement of some of the participants, who may have just been caught up in a mob with no concrete idea of what they were doing and what would happen. But it does not describe Donald Trump's involvement. Neither he, nor the inner circle of his co-conspirators, were trying to "protest" anything. They had a conscious plan to stop the certification, using the mob as muscle.
Can you explain the conscious plan, and how it was more coherent than, say, the Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone? Was the plan that the horned helmet guy would sit in the high chair, declare himself president of the Senate, and that Trump had won? Or was it to hold Mike Pence at gunpoint (not that anyone had a gun, so far as I have heard) and threaten to shoot him if he didn't declare Trump the winner? Because I don't think either of those programs would work. Maybe it was to fill the gallery with raucous protesters, thereby demonstrating that the people were behind Trump, and thereby induce the Congress and Pence to declare him the winner? Because that doesn't seem very different from the protesters who invaded the hearing room during Kavanaugh's confirmation, and I haven't heard that called an insurrection.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastman_memos
None of which called for waging war against the U.S..
I'm confused. Pressuring the Vice President to do something many people don't think he has authority to do is insurrection? What would you say about Biden's directing the CDC to declare an eviction moratorium which the SC had made it clear the agency had no authority to do? Insurrection?
You're not confused. You also probably didn't read the link.
The memos expect Pence would be seen as not having the authority, and what actions should be taken to deal with that.
It is a plan to overturn an election that Trump lost. And the violence at the Capitol was aimed at pressuring Pence to put this plan into action.
The rest of your post is an obvious deflection.
Put down the conspiracy theory and step away from the crack pipe.
They wrote it down Michael.
Which is why I guess you went for empty insults and nothing else.
You're even more unserious than usual.
But it does not describe Donald Trump’s involvement. Neither he, nor the inner circle of his co-conspirators, were trying to “protest” anything. They had a conscious plan to stop the certification, using the mob as muscle.
Even of he ordered the attack, the attack was not an act of war against the United States!
This is not what insurrection means. The Founders could have talked about waging war. They did not.
So you, and Trump's Lawyers, are pretty out there and wrong.
Ejercito, you need to read Chief Justice Marshall’s opinions in the Burr treason cases. They set forth in detail the criteria necessary to prove war against the United States. They are less grandiose than you seem to suppose. The Capitol attack checks all the boxes, many times over.
On the strength of those cases, Trump could likely be convicted not only of insurrection, but of treason.
Trump can't be convicted of either insurrection or treason, because he hasn't been charged with either.
"disqualifying Trump is the perfect opportunity for them to show once and for all that they are not adjuncts of the GOP and especially not the "MAGA Court.""
Like one victory on any issue, however important, could ever do that. The left wins plenty of the time, and it has never satisfied them. They're still griping about the ACLU's CU victory, pissed off about Bush v Gore, plotting stacking the Court to get Roe back and the 2nd amendment to go away.
They'd lose the right, not gain the left, and end up terminally devoid of allies.
They should just rule that federal insurrection law IS Section 3'enabling legislation, and if the Democrats are to afraid of an acquittal to charge him with what they claim he's obviously guilty of, that's on them.
At least standing isn’t an issue—hooray!
Brett: Do states have a right to enforce Federal law?
If Maine can enforce the insurrection act, why can't it enforce the immigration act and send illegal aliens to state prison?
What, you don't think Maine has machine guns?
They make them in Saco....
They should just rule that federal insurrection law IS Section 3’enabling legislation
Not even Trump's lawyers are asking for this, it's that stupid.
How is it right to disqualify a candidate when they haven’t been convicted of insurrection, treason, or anything remotely close? The judges massively overstepped their remit in ruling that an insurrection occurred, Trump is guilty of it, and therefore should be blocked. I thought that before you were convicted of insurrection you had to be charged, tried and allowed to defend yourself.
Gosh, it's almost like you know nothing about the topic and just popped in to express that fact to everyone.
1) Section 3 of the 14th amendment says nothing about being "convicted" of anything.
2) Trump was not in fact "convicted" of it. That's why he's not being fined or sent to prison for it.
3) Trump had the opportunity to litigate the matter in court.
Has anyone been convicted of insurrection in connection with the Jan. 6 riot? Because the convictions I have seen have been for Dodd-Frank violations.
No, but that doesn't stop the jack-booted goose-steppers from demanding their domestic political enemies be banned from ballots.
'enemies'
Who else?
y81, which January 6 defendants have been convicted criminally for Dodd-Frank violations? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dodd%E2%80%93Frank_Wall_Street_Reform_and_Consumer_Protection_Act
Please name names.
To be fair, he meant Sarbanes-Oxley rather than Dodd-Frank.
Well... that used to be the usual, customary and legal method to assess someone's guilt. Today half the country goes by whatever sounds good and not much else.
Nothing about this has anything to do with guilt… just like you don't need to be found guilty of being under 35.
Man the retards are out tonight!
That's a refreshing level of honesty on your part: Trump doesn't need to have actually engaged in insurrection to be removed from the ballot under Section Three. Facts have nothing to do with it!
Facts have everything to do with it.
You guys have this kindergarten view of the law which is that it's all about crimes. Like, you know what a policeman is and what prison is, and that's the extent of what the legal system is for.
Guess what, it's barely about crimes. It's mostly regulations about property, economic policy, social policy, military affairs, intelligence... basically just go down the list of cabinet members. Everything other than the DoJ is about stuff other than crimes. And in all those areas of the law, there are mechanisms to have hearings to determine facts in order to adjudicate cases.
How many Supreme Court cases do you think are criminal cases? Practically none. Harvard wasn't "found guilty" of anything but was forced to stop discriminating based on facts found at a trial. That's how it works almost all the time.
Same here. Trump can be found legally ineligible to run for President without being found guilty of anything, just like Harvard was found legally ineligible to use race in its admissions process.
Get it, buddy?
Yeah, buddy, I get that you don't understand English.
guilt, n.- The fact of being responsible for the commission of an offense; moral culpability. synonym: blame.
Michael P, did O. J. Simpson, who was found not guilty by a jury, murder two people or not? There is a reason that the only white man over the age of 40 ever to be awarded a Heisman Trophy is Fred Goldman.
Well… it [conviction] used to be the usual, customary and legal method to assess someone’s guilt.
It’s the premise of the thread, dumdum.
Oh. So you meant that being under 35 years old is a crime. Got it.
Yes, you are.
Thanks for conceding.
"How is it right to disqualify a candidate when they haven’t been convicted of insurrection, treason, or anything remotely close? The judges massively overstepped their remit in ruling that an insurrection occurred, Trump is guilty of it, and therefore should be blocked. I thought that before you were convicted of insurrection you had to be charged, tried and allowed to defend yourself."
Disqualification from holding office under the Fourteenth Amendment, § 3 is a civil disability, not a criminal penalty. If it were criminal punishment, it could not have been applied ex post facto to ex-Confederates to punish conduct occurring prior to 1868. Disqualifying the ex-Confederates for their engagement in insurrection during the Civil War was the very raison d'être for § 3 in the first place. (I have made this point numerous times on these comment threads, and no Trump supporter has bothered to address it. Their silence speaks loudly.)
Nothing in § 3 requires a criminal conviction to trigger disqualification thereunder.
I must respectfully disagree with the argument the 14th Amendment applies to Trump.
Specifically, the Amendment applies to "a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State."
The argument is that Trump was an officer of the United States. However, Officers are defined in Article 2, Section 2 as those who the President "shall nominate, and by and with the Advice and Consent of the Senate, shall appoint Ambassadors, other public Ministers and Consuls, Judges of the supreme Court, and all other Officers of the United States. Officers are those appointed by the President with the advise and consent of the Senate, not people elected to office.
That's confirmed in Article 2, Section 4: "The President, Vice President and all civil Officers of the United States, shall be removed from Office on Impeachment." If the President is an Officer, why name him twice?
My bad: "Impeachment for, and Conviction of, Treason, Bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors."
So, if I vote for Trump in the NH Primary and SCOTUS allows states to remove Trump from ballots thereafter, do I get a redo Primary vote?
Ginni Thomas should recuse herself from this case.
How about a joint recusal -- Ginny and Clarence? They could phone it in from the yacht.
I’m sorry but the case for 14th amendment disqualification is paper thin. The arguments for it are lawyerly, not plain common sense. Worst of all, there is no broadly agreed determination that the events of Jan 6 constituted an insurrection. Every court or public official ruling on ballot eligibility has made their own determination, frankly based on politics.
What matters in elections is the perception (preferably grounded in reality) that the voting is secure and fair, and the acceptance of the result as legitimate by the public. If there is reasonable question as to the appropriateness of disqualifying a candidate, and no honest person can deny there is in this case, the small-d democratic thing to do is resolve it in favor of letting the voters decide. Anything else risks the legitimacy of the election. It’s hard to see how that serves the goal of preserving democracy.
The aim is not to preserve democracy by violating the Constitution. The aim is to follow the Constitution, and by that means preserve democracy.
...sayeth the political persuasion who feels the expressly Constitutionally required Electoral College is, somehow, not totally legitimate.
Oh, it's constitutionally legitimate. No doubt about that. But experience shows now that it is no longer a fit means to conduct elections, given political changes and population changes which have turned it into a gameable partisan tool. A dilemma is how to get rid of it, if the gaming continues to forbid doing it by amendment.
'that the voting is secure and fair,'
Why vote for Trump who made a point of undermining this in order to remain in office?
The most important thing the court could decide is what is the mechanism for determining what constitutes an insurrection.
We elect a president via the Electoral College. And if no candidate receives an absolute majority it doesn’t go to Congress but goes to state delegations in Congress. So it’s pretty obvious to me that this is a state issue and if you don’t like it then get rid of the EC. I wonder what we should replace the EC with???
We could aim for anything Constitutional...which the EC is.
State by state definition of insurrection! Are you ready for some states to remove Kamala from the ballot for providing bail money for the CHAZ insurrection?
This is MAGA Mad Libs — a set of words put together in random order that don't refer to anything.
Well, I agree somewhat that it is important for the Supreme Court to decide on the terms for using Section 3. It is also better to do this early in the process.
I an Australian constitutionalist view that the USA constitution determines the eligibility of a person to be a candidate and if elected President without political motives. If the denial of Trump was to be permitted than from then on every presidential election might be undermined by opponents not based upon a person having been convicted but depending upon how a judge may deem in his/her mind the person should be denied to be on a ballet regardless of any charges, let alone conviction. Before I represented Mr Colosimo he was placed under Orders for Administration because the medical experts testified he would not accept to be convicted for contempt of court and therefore could not mentally conduct his personal affairs. I then took over and successfully appealed on the basis that Her Honour Harbison (on record) stated to me that she had NOT convicted Mr Colosimo at all for contempt of court, when I represented Mr Colosimo regarding the contempt of court litigation and she ended up never to convict him. The medical expert witnesses simply were told a lie and upon this had certified for Orders of Administration of a man who had not been guilty of any legal wrongdoing, rather upon assumed guilt. Trump like it or not is entitled to a "fair and proper trial" and he doesn't need to go to court to prove his innocence! As a constitutionalist I am exposing the "covid scam" since January 2020 and exposed how in Australia everything was unconstitutional. I have been targeted by even council so far with 12 trespassing's without any court orders to validate any entry upon my property. This is that the powers to be fear the legal accountability for the harm and mass murder they can be held legally accountable. No longer is the rule of law the first principle of democracy! Now it is the powers to be are the ones who decide what constitutional/legal/human, natural and/or common law rights you can be entitled upon. Those who may desire some injustice because it may suit them for their political goals may in time discover they be likewise targeted and then well too late to claim your rights.
Do they not have paragraph breaks in Australia?
I am a life-long austrophobe. I fear and distrust Austrians and Australians. Peruse Inspector-Rikati's comment above to understand my plight.
"to the extent the justices may be motivated by reputational considerations, disqualifying Trump is the perfect opportunity for them to show once and for all that they are not adjuncts of the GOP and especially not the "MAGA Court"
I used to be the chief umpire for my son's Little League. When training new teenage umpires, one of the first things we told them was not to make "make-up" calls - that is, not to let a bad call in the past against a team influence a later call in that team's favor. Every umpire knows that's the wrong thing to do, but the impulse to do so is surprisingly strong. If the Supreme Court lets their perceived reputation from previous calls influence any decision, they will be doing exactly that. I hope the justices are at least as well trained as my teenage umpires.
I remember well my days as a teenage umpire.
One particular game it was dusk and there weren’t lights. and the manager of team that was ahead didn’t want to bring his team out for the start of the final inning claiming it was too dark. I thought it was still plenty light enough and he just didn’t want to risk losing his lead. I ended up declaring a forfeit when he wouldn’t let his team go out in the field at the top of the inning.
The manager I had the run in with was the county sheriff, but I never had any blowback from it.
But it probably did enhance my reputation.
The logic of Professor Somin's articles leads to one simple conclusion: Donald Trump should not appear on the ballot in any state, and also write-in votes for him should not be counted (or if counted, ignored).
Presumably this decision will result in the nomination of someone else at the Republican convention. That candidate will, of course, attack the decision as an attack on democracy since the decision will prevent tens of millions of voters from voting for the candidate that they want to support. All the arguments about the meaning of "engage" and "insurrection" will be brushed aside, as will any considerations about the true intent of a section of the 14th amendment that the vast majority of voters have never heard of.
If Biden wins the election under these circumstances, tens of millions of voters will see his 2nd term as profoundly illegitimate. Those who support removing Trump from the ballot seem to think that eventually those voters will just suck it up and go about their lives, and that politics will calm down, as it did after the 2000 election. I am not so optimistic.
Um, those are the same people who see his 1st term that way. They don't need an excuse. They're either mentally ill or dishonest or both.
No, there'll be more and more vehement.
Think the DDR 1953 versus 1989.
Oh no, not MORE vehement.
“Um, those are the same people who see his 1st term that way.”
Well, same general reason, actually.
In 2020 Democrats went ahead and made ad hoc changes to election administration to improve their chances, using Covid as a transparent excuse, and didn’t give a damn about whether their opponents thought they were illegitimate.
They won, formally, and as a result of the changes, the losers didn’t accept the result as legitimate.
Now they’re setting up the same dynamic, only turned up to 11.
If you want civic peace in a democracy, it isn’t enough to formalistically be right, you need a public perception of legitimacy. And you don’t get that by disqualifying a candidate from the ballot on a basis half the country thinks is bullshit.
Here’s the thing, Brett. No one buy your ‘just the tip’ 2020 trutherism.
You’re by yourself in cranktown.
Everyone is either fully deluded about secret ballot dumps or has the baseline humility to accept that state courts, not their personal takes, get to say what the law is.
So you can repeat over and over how Trump was robbed but not like that, and it’ll just be you and your unearned confidence.
Crank (person), a pejorative term used for a person who holds an unshakable belief that most of his or her contemporaries consider to be false
Elements of a crank (from https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aY985qzn7oI):
-Their take is only worthy on the biggest problems
-Their take is exhaustively explained, yet devoid of expertise or rigor. Often based on a single invalidating assumption they cling to.
-Respond to criticism with meta claims against the establishment , not actual adjustment of their take
-Takes generally don’t even count as a cognizable position or theory to take in the discipline they’re cranking in.
Your big failed assumption is that you discard our federalist judicial system of institutions and responsibilities for your personal take.
As though the law must be what you believe it to be, if you believe hard enough.
Do you wish to discuss the percentage of Democrats who still think Russia “changed” the 2016 election?
It’s at 72%.
They never viewed Trump as legitimate. Which they expressed ad nauseum.
If this stands, Biden will be tossed off numerous state ballots for similar sketchy reasons.
Yeah, in the same way that the Swift Boat ad "changed" the 2004 election and "read my lips" "changed" both the 1988 and 1992 elections.
It's not that the voters didn't actually vote for Trump, it's that they were duped into it.
(I'm not endorsing this view btw, just explaining it to you.)
Attempted Russian interference is well-established at this point, so the belief isn't as completely off the wall as Trump's Big Lie.
'They never viewed Trump as legitimate.'
So who cares if people who didn't vote for him view the president as illegitimate, then?
"Attempted Russian interference is well-established at this point, so the belief isn’t as completely off the wall as Trump’s Big Lie."
It is hilarious that you believe that. It did not happen.
Tell me more about believing "The Big Lie"
What do you base this on? The Mueller Report? The bipartisan Intelligence Committee report? They both affirmed that the efforts were real. Show your work.
Do you believe Trump really won the 2020 election?
I think you're taking the word changed and stretching is beyond it's load capacity, damikesc.
I think Russia changed the 2016 election. One element among many. I think it's unfair and not right that we were unprepared and allowed them to do this. I don't think that makes Trump an illegitimate President.
The slippery part here is that "changed" can have multiple meanings.
1) It can affect the outcome by openly persuading voters. A peace deal, a war, an oil shock, etc. — any of those can change the result. Vladimir Putin could give a speech broadcast worldwide in which he says, "If Trump wins, I promise to withdraw from Ukraine immediately."
2) It can affect the outcome by secretly influencing voters: covertly funding propaganda campaigns, hacking into private emails, funneling money to political candidates or PACs, etc.
3) It can actually alter the outcome directly, by hacking into voting machines, stuffing ballot boxes, etc.
There's nothing wrong with the first. The second may be illegal, but it doesn't actually make the election itself illegitimate. The third, of course, makes the election fraudulent.
Yes, that didn't happen. In 2020 elections administrators, Democrats and Republicans alike, went ahead and made ad hoc changes to election administration because there was a pandemic. Nobody thought these were 'illegitimate' until Trump lost, and of course courts rejected virtually all of those arguments because they were such transparent bullshit.
Well, the changes all went one way, in favor of mail-in balloting, and were in any cases in direct violation of state law.
I remember, at the time I voted that year, that mail in voting was odd. I voted at the county elections office, and I had to pretend to mail my ballot, because of the state mandate. What they had set up in the elections office was their usual voting setup, with the addition of the clean/dirty pens that became ubiquitous at the time, as well as masks and wiping down the voting area with a disinfectant. Actually, better done, in terms of protection, than what I was used to all over town, whenever I went shopping, to the bank, etc. I remember asking myself at the time, why elections had to be treated differently from what we were dealing with in our normal lives, day in, and day out, esp since they were there in violation of state law.
Of course, by summer of 2020, it was clear that the lockdowns, and the like were useless, if not counterproductive. Herd immunity was improbable, given the original infectivity of the virus, and became impossible by the time Delta, with its increased infectivity (but lowered lethality) rolled around. Making things worse, the virus was often undetectable with younger demographics. Yes, it hit the elderly, and those with serious comorbidities hard, but for most, it was no worse than a bad flu, and in some, not even that bad. There was no reason to “flatten the curve” because “venting” quickly became counter-indicated, because it killed more than it helped. Throughout most of the country, after that, the medical facilities never became anywhere near overstressed. The virus is a respiratory virus, similar in many ways to the flu, and thus significantly retreats when people are outside and receiving a lot of UV. That means that throughout much of the country, the level of infection was not going to be high until after the election, as we headed into normal flu season (which got pushed out by the virus causing COVID-19 for 3 years).
All of this information (except that COVID-19 would push out the flu for those years) was known. By summer we knew the demographics of who the virus killed, and that most of the mandated precautions were nonsense. It’s almost as if overreacting to COVID-19 was done in order to (in many states illegally) Impose easily compromised mail in balloting.
'It’s almost as if overreacting to COVID-19 was done in order to (in many states illegally) Impose easily compromised mail in balloting.'
That's what you call a shaggy dog story.
And if Republicans / Trump didn't like those rules, they could've challenged them before the election.
It simply doesn't work to accept the rules going in and then challenge them only if you lose. Our elections would be a shambles if we let losing candidates get away with shit like that. That's one thing Kavanaugh understood.
Weird that in a pandemic all the changes were in the direction that make it easier to vote while not having to stand in line near other people.
This is all Bruce needs to assume rampant ballot fraud. Worse, I think he believes the Mules movie.
I don't buy the overreacting to Covid argument. The Wisconsin Republican Legislative leader went to visit the polls in hazmat gear, masked and a Tyvek overgarment. So you explain who overreacted.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8198341/Wisconsin-Assembly-Speaker-comes-fire-urging-people-vote-wearing-protective-gear.html
Yes. By Democratic and Republican officials alike. Weird, that. What does that tell you? What might it tell an actually reasonable, intelligent, honest person?
What “state law” was violated by any such changes? (I like how you phrase this as if "state law" were a single entity.)
The changes made in 2020 were not as large as imaged, the fact is that many of them already existed. Mail in voting was already allowed in most if not all states. The difference was that if was used more extensively in2020, because of the pandemic. The fact is that many of what are perceived as changes were already used in election before 2020. What was different in 2020 was that a candidate who lost objected after the fact.
Your timeline doesn't have the Republican convention in it. That's where things will come to a head, not the general election with Biden.
If the RNC delegates fail to nominate Trump, it'll be on them.
I'll publish my brief, or at least it's outline on the Monday open thread.
What I will say is that it's not a rehash of the arguments we've been hashing and rehashing here for months.
And really I'm surprised nobody has brought it up because it's rather obvious.
You have discovered a truly marvelous argument, which this margin is too narrow to contain?
Got to work on it a little.
I’ll try to keep it relatively brief. But anyone spending time on a volokh open thread isn’t worried about wasting time.
You have a means of posting to the margin here? Please share the html...
Thank you for that one, Nieporent. That is funny.
I’ll bet it relies on Hunter Biden being bad somehow.
Not a bad idea. I'll see if I can work it in.
I look forward to Scotus showing that Somin is wrong. Every part of his argument is wrong. As usual.
Somin is among the very few who see merit in the idea that each state can choose who can be on the ballot for POTUS in that state.
Bizarrely, he seems to anticipate that other states wouldn't play this game, and that Trump would end up the obvious loser, thus making it all good.
What Somin didn’t address is that this interpretation of § 3 of the 14th Amdt imposes an additional requirement on the Presidency. They have been repeatedly struck down by the US Supreme Court, including cases involving CO (term limits) and CA for Congress (latter, I believe, in a scathing opinion by CJ Roberts). I have seen no argument that the Presidency would be any different. If § 3 were applicable, and properly applied, that would get around the prohibition on adding requirements for these offices. But it’s likely not, as everyone here seems to now realize.
A Constitutional Amendment, as the 14th is, can do things a statute cannot.
The Supree Court has never struck down a state requirement for the Presidency. Its decisions regarding Cogressional elections, which the Constitution gives to the people as a matter of constitutional right, has nothing to do with the Presidential elections, which the Constition entrusted entirely to state legislatures.
State legislatures can appoint the presidential electors entirely by themselves. They can come up with their own short list and let the people choose among them. They can impose whatever limitations they want on who the state’s presidential electors can be permitted to vote for. (Almost any. They can’t impose whites only or similar rules. But pretty close to any.)
You are still nuts if you think the states can interpret the natural-born citizen requirement to bar candidates conceived by IVF.
States can simply say that, for example, their manner of appointing electors is to pledge electors to only cadt their for someone with a college degree and prosecute and/or replace them if they disobey.
You seem to be taking the position that if states can’t impose a whites only requirement, that somehow proves they can’t impose any requirement at all. That’s a position beyond absurd. It’s trollish. Their power to set qualifications, like all state powers, is of course restricted by the 14th Amendment’s Equal Protection Clause. But they can set any qualification they want that doesn’t violate it.
I think it is doubtful states could impose requirements beyond what is in Article II and 14.3 (e.g., must hold a college degree). But even if they could, they most certainly cannot impose requirements more strict than what is explicitly stated in Article II such as must be 40 or not conceived by IVF.
Ditto for what is explicitly stated in 14.3. If SCOTUS holds Trump is eligible under 14.3, a state cannot interpret 14.3 to make him ineligible in their state.
Of course they can. No one doubts, and the Supreme Court has repeatedly reaffirmed, that a state legislature can impose the requirement that the state’s presidential electors have to vote for a specific person of the legislature’s choosing. Nothing prevents them from having an election with a single candidate on the ballot. The state’s citizens aren’t entitled to have any say in the matter at all. Of course a state legislature can choose to give the state’s citizens some say in the matter, but only a partial say, subject to whatever limitations the legislature chooses to impose.
Our constitution does not provide for a president elected by citizens. It provides for a president elected by a college of electors appointed in a manner directed by state legislatures. State legislatures have complete freedom in deciding how electors get appointed.
The rules for electing Presidents have nothing to with the rules for electing Congress. The Constitution provides that Congress is to be elected by the people. That of course means state legislatures can’t interfere with the people’s choice.
But the President is different. The Constitution gives control of selecting presidents completely over to state legislatures. It’s state legislatures whose power to choose however they want can’t be interfered with. You have it exactly backwards.
The Supreme Court has not “repeatedly reaffirmed” any such thing. It addressed the issue, sort of, once, in 2020. For the first time.
Sorry, you were delivered by C-Section. No presidency for you!
Is it your position that the President can’t interfere with the popular choice for federal judges? That would also be setting out a qualification other than one the Constitution imposes. If there’s no argument that selecting the President might work differently from selecting members of Congress, then there can’t be any argument that selecting the Judiciary might work differently either.
Summary:
1. Because Colorado has the right to incorporate Section 3 into its own election law, and because the plenary authority the Constitution grants state legislatures to determine how electors will be appointed permits states using popular ballot to appoint Presidential Electors to set state-law qualifications for inclusion on the popular ballot, there exists an adequate and independent state-law ground for the Colorado Supreme Court’s decision.
Accordingly, the U.S. Supreme Court should dismiss the writ of certiorari without reaching the federal issues.
2. If the federal issues are reached, then
a. Section 3 applies to the office of President. b. Enforcement of Section 3 of the 14th Amendment is not limited to Congress, and the State of Colorado has constitutional authority to apply Section 3 in screening Presidential candidates for consideration by its citizen-voters and Presidential Electors. c. The Colorado courts gave Mr. Trump adequate Due Process. d. There was no federal-law error warranting reversal and the decision of the Colorado Supreme Court should be affirmed.
SCOTUS is going to reverse, either 9-0, 8-1 or 7-2. You are going to have to come up with another explanation or two.
Enjoy your lottery ticket pick and good luck with the lottery!
I’d like to qualify what I said above about dismissing the writ of certiorari. I no longer think that’s the case. If the Supreme Court finds that Colorado can decide the question as a matter of state law within its plenary power to direct the appoinent of Presidential electors, then Trump still has Due Process claims including adequate notice, a fair hearing, etc.
In addition, whether Colorado has the power to do this - whether my independent state law theory is correct in the first place - is itself a federal question, and one which as the comments on this blog suggest, is clearly a disputed one. So the Supreme Court would have jurisdiction to determine whether the Federal Constitution gives Colorado the power to do what it did even under an independent state law theory.
So the Supreme Court still has jurisdiction and there is still something important for it to review under this theory.
"might create a dangerous slippery slope."???
In Maine, one woman alone now thinks she has to power to keep President Trump off the ballot. It's already happened, and is being tried in other states.
That way lies madness.
w.
But one woman alone did not do what you said. She was petitioned, you remember people have that right, an administrative hearing was held, and both sides could argue and then a decision was made.
I note that the comments spend a lot of time arguing about the peripherals of the case. What is Prof. Somin is correct the case is strong and the Supreme Court upholds the Colorado and Maine decisions. What other states will now join the two states and will any of them be significant, that is toss up states? If the decisions are upheld will the Republican Party adjust? How is the election affected if a stronger Republican candidate moves to the nomination? I can in my lifetime think of elections that have been influenced by large changes as the election proceeds. A candidate dies in a plane crash, Paul Wellstone, or a discovery of mental health issues Thomas Eagleton. What happen if in March or April we find that Donald Trump cannot compete in all states. Does he have enough power to bring the Republicans to their knees?
What if the moon is made of green cheese? Will astronauts be able to build on it, or will mice eat all the foundations?
“The ’framers of the 14th Amendment envisioned precisely this moment’ — when a president would attempt to remain in power after losing an election.” (The Hill, quoting Luttig)