Today in Supreme Court History: November 12, 1975

11/12/1975: Justice William O. Douglas resigns.

Justice William O. Douglas

Comments

[Frank Drackman]

Love how he pulled a "Costanza" and kept coming to work after he resigned until early 1976 when Burger reassigned his clerks and they changed the locks.

[Estragon]

Ironic you would bring up that episode as you were joking about slipping someone a Mickey just yesterday!

[Dan Schiavetta]

Winter v. Natural Resources Defense Council, 555 U.S. 7 (decided November 12, 2008): vacating stay of antisubmarine SONAR use by Navy off California shore; strong national security interest and no showing that it actually harms marine mammals (“not a close question”)

Barnhart v. Thomas, 540 U.S. 20 (decided November 12, 2003): laid-off elevator operator was properly denied Social Security Disability; though suffering from heart disease, lumbar strain, etc., was still able to physically do old job; did not meet definition of “disability” and also Chevron deference to finding of SSA appeals board

Northern Indiana Public Service Co. v. Porter Co. Chapter of Izaak Walton League of America, 423 U.S. 12 (decided November 12, 1975): reinstating Atomic Energy Commission approval of nuclear power plant because AEC's construction of regulation requiring distance from population centers was reasonable; notable as the last opinion by Douglas, on the day he retired after his record 36+ years of service (his concurrence notes that the successor agency subsequently revised the regulation to fit facts of the case; “a certain danger lurks in the ability of an agency to mold its regulations to conform to its instant needs”)

Kelly v. Robinson, 479 U.S. 36 (decided November 12, 1986): court-ordered restitution obligation (monthly payments to victim after larceny conviction) is not dischargeable in bankruptcy

[CJColucci]

I have not been able to verify the story, but supposedly Douglas's doctor told him that sex with his young wife could be fatal and Douglas replied: "If she dies, she dies."

[Dr. Ed 2]

Well, I *have* wondered about some of the child brides in Islamic countries. A 9-year-old girl isn't, umm, fully grown and dare I impose my Western values and say that both Mohamed and these men are wrong doing this.

(I presume that Douglas' wife was at least a decade older...)

[Noscitur a sociis]

dare I impose my Western values and say that both Mohamed and these men are wrong doing this.

Based on your comment history, it’s safe to say that no, you daren’t.

[Dr. Ed 2]

So it's OK to have sex with a 9-year-old -- and rip her insides apart?!?

Have you -- I don't know -- compassion, humanity, sense of decency or *something*?!?

This is not a question of if she'll enjoy it (which also should be asked) but her physical well being. If you rip her insides apart, even if she doesn't die, it will sorta be double un plus good for the rest of her life....

Pinch an adult woman's butt -- to the gulag with you.
Rip the insides out of a GIRL not mature enough to have sex -- that's somehow OK?!?

Do we have no perspective here???

[Estragon]

This is one of the most truly deranged comments I have seen on this site, and that is saying a lot.

“rip her insides apart?!?” “If you rip her insides apart” “Rip the insides out of a GIRL”

Uhhhhhhh. Wow. Feeling a bit lurid on a Sunday evening, are we? And three times too!

“This is not a question of if she’ll enjoy it (which also should be asked)”

Oh? And why is that?

[Dr. Ed 2]

One other thing -- "he is not only unable to do his previous work"

You have to have 39 "credits" of which 10 must be in the past 20 years in order to qualify for SSI Disability. So take someone (and I know people like this) who had low-paying jobs during high school and college (e.g. McDonalds), get a more lucrative public sector job upon graduation --- and then go out on psych disability at age 26. (At 2/3 pay, but I digress...)

Why is the person eligible when the person is still able to do the "previous work", i.e. at McDonalds? Those were the premiums that paid for this insurance....

[Magister]

Why would you assume that the disability would not prevent working at McDonald's?

In any case, the earlier work may have no effect on disability eligibility:

Age 24 to 31 – In general, you may qualify if you have credit for working half the time between age 21 and the time your disability began. As an example, if you develop a disability at age 27, you would need 3 years of work (12 credits) out of the past 6 years (between ages 21 and 27).

So the 26 year old might qualify after working for 2.5 years at the more lucrative job post graduation (for the recent work test), which would also seem to cover the duration work test.
https://www.ssa.gov/benefits/retirement/planner/credits.html

[Dr. Ed 2]

First off, as I understand it, "half the time" means half the quarters, not 20 hours a week, so as long as one made the minimum, one could get credit for all four quarters just working Christmas and Summer vacations -- Christmas being the 4th and 1st quarter, and May/August being the 2nd & 3rd. She also got another 5-6 quarters working minimum wage between graduation and being hired by the state.

Second, state job don't pay into SSI -- and back then, didn't pay into Medicare (they now do). So none of the lucrative state job counted toward her eligibility for disability.

Third, as to the disability precluding her being employed at the prior jobs -- you don't need professional judgement or supervisory skills to punch a cash register....

[Magister]

Massachusetts is one of a few states where state workers do not participate in Social Security, although Dr. Ed 2 had not mentioned the details of the lucrative work. (My own state employment was always been covered by Social Security for decades.) If the lucrative work was not covered by Social Security, maybe there would be no Social Security disability eligibility, but I expect that the Social Security Administration applies its rules as it should (I'm still granting deference).

But as with previous complaints about women getting advantages, Dr. Ed 2 assumes he knows the entire story. The frequency with which Dr. Ed 2 is provably wrong does not augur well for his vague and unverifiable claims (nobody sensible would grant any deference).

[Dr. Ed 2]

First, this is in Maine, not Massachusetts.

Second, Dr. Ed is NOT usually wrong on citations, maybe sloppy but not WRONG.

Third, from the SSI:“The Social Security Act of 1935 excluded state and local government employees from Social Security coverage because of constitutional ambiguity over the federal government’s authority to impose payroll taxes on public-sector employers and because these employees were already covered by DB pensions (Nuschler 2021). Beginning in the 1950s, a series of amendments were enacted that allowed state and local governments to enroll certain categories of employees in Social Security. By 1991, over 75 percent of them were covered by the program.”

National league of cities versus usary????

SSI initally also did not cover fishermen, but I digress…

And here is a detailed SSI analysis of the issue: https://www.ssa.gov/policy/docs/ssb/v82n3/v82n3p1.html

What no one is saying is that the majority of these state pension systems are way underfunded for the promised benefits. What that means — I don’t know…

[Magister]

Second, Dr. Ed is NOT usually wrong on citations, maybe sloppy but not WRONG.

Another wrong statement by Dr. Ed 2, who is all but legendary for being wrong.

What that means — I don’t know…

If only Dr. Ed 2 would apply this insight before every post.

Wandering away from Dr. Ed 2's original anecdote.... Most state and local employees are covered by Social Security; most who are not covered are in local employment. There are state pension systems that are underfunded; "way underfunded" is a vague standard, and few pension systems hold more assets than their obligations. But many states meet the traditional 80% level of funding that is considered healthy.

[Dr. Ed 2]

OK, look at USA Today's figures
https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2020/12/11/every-states-pension-crisis-ranked/115099952/

[Magister]

Sure, let's look at 2020 where the average funding level of 70% was lower than the previous three years (likely because of COVID) and pension plans were still recovering before that from the Great Recession. In 2021, they averaged 83.3% funded, a huge increase. It dropped again in 2022, to 77.3%, and there are a few perennially underfunded state pensions like Illinois. But still no definition of "way underfunded" that would apply to the majority; 71.5% appears to be the median for states in Dr. Ed 2's link to numbers from the worst recent year.

[BrotherMovesOn]

If you really wanted to help yourself you would be saving these 'observations' for your therapist, instead of mouthing off on this blog.
Your grasp of reality is tenuous.
Please stay well north of the Piscataqua River.

[Kazinski]

Douglas was probably the least experienced Supreme Court Justice of the 20th century.

He was almost certainly the only justice who got his passage to law school (Columbia) by tending sheep on a train from Washington to Chicago.

[Magister]

He had over 36 years of experience on the court, more than any other justice.

There were a lot of justices with no prior judicial experience; ignoring political leanings, would you really rank him least experienced?

[Dan Schiavetta]

Douglas had been a prosecutor (as had been Black and Warren) which explains their jurisprudence. They were very aware of how defendants can be unjustly indicted, defended, tried, and sentenced.

[Kazinski]

Douglas graduated from law school at 27, failed to get a SC clerkship and worked for a law firm for a few months, was unemployed for several months, became a law professor at Yale, then at 34 was named as an SEC Commissioner.

Sure he got some experience on the Supreme Court, but of course I was talking about his pre-appointment experience.

Roosevelt named him to the Supreme Court when he was 40.

That seems like a thin resume to me.

And I don’t see anything on his resume about being a prosecutor.

[Magister]

Chairman of the SEC doesn't seem bad; he was nominated in its first year of existence and became chairman, probably having to navigate a lot of novel legal issues. Nor does Sterling Professor at Yale Law School seem trivial. That he graduated from law school at 27 seems to be the result of having trouble affording to go there; he spent some years teaching trying to save enough to attend law school. He was second in his class when he graduated. (Douglas does not seem to have been a prosecutor.)

I'm not sure I would rate clerkship as highly as you. Would you be happier with Douglas if he had served a short stint on an appellate court first, like Clarence Thomas and Amy Coney Barrett? Mother Jones makes a fair case against both but in fairness they might not object to a progressive nominee with the same inexperience (although conservatives seem more eager to excuse mediocrity in return for loyalty).

Looking over some other 20th century Supreme Court justices with little previous judicial experience:
Pierce Butler was county attorney of Ramsey County in Minnesota for four years; elected President of the Minnesota State Bar Association; and practiced law mostly related to railroads, the last ten years in Canada. And then nominated to the Supreme Court with a much thinner résumé than Douglas.
Arthur Goldberg had impressive academic credentials, practiced labor law, and spent a year as Secretary of Labor for Kennedy. And then nominated to the Supreme Court with at best a résumé comparable to Douglas.

[not guilty]

Bob Woodward and Scott Armstrong wrote that Douglas told friends about the time Richard Nixon reminded him of a speech Douglas had given to Nixon’s law school class at Duke University, which Nixon said inspired his own political career.

“Hearing that, Douglas said, was the most upsetting moment of his life, the only time he actually felt ‘suicidal,’” Woodward and Armstrong wrote. https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2022/09/16/when-republicans-tried-to-impeach-a-supreme-court-justice-00056744

[Dan Schiavetta]

That's funny

[Dr. Ed 2]

And was it true?

Was it true on both levels?

1: WAS that why Nixon went into politics, or was this a pablum politician's speech?

2: Was Douglas REALLY contemplating suicide? Did they lock him up in a psych ward?

I don't have anything wrong with people giving praise to educators, even undeserved praise. But a response like this, if Douglas really said it, is poor form....

[Dan Schiavetta]

There was one at the courthouse at 80 Centre Street, Manhattan, until about ten years ago. Old guy who sat in a chair. What a boring job. I assume it was due to some union rule.

As for Ms. Thomas, her job was eliminated in 1996 and she argued that she could not go back to her old job because nobody hired elevator operators any more. This did not impress Scalia, who wrote for a unanimous Court.

[Magister]

From the summary of the case, she took the elevator operator job after a heart attack in the 1980s left her unable to work as a housekeeper, and the job was eliminated in the 1990s. She was still able to work as an elevator operator, but that was a job that no longer existed in meaningful numbers; the question for the Supreme Court was over the Social Security Administration's position that this meant she was still able to work and therefore not eligible for disability.

There were apparently still elevator operators within the past decade. I last encountered one complete with uniform and white gloves in the 1980s, at a convention at an aging hotel where the elevator interface was not robust enough to be operated by amateurs.

[Dr. Ed 2]

Suffolk County (MA) Courthouse did in 1986 and likely still does as they are patronage jobs.

The interesting part of this the statute says "he is not only unable to do his previous work but cannot, considering his age, education, and work experience, engage in any other kind of substantial gainful work which exists in the national economy.”

Here she was able to do her previous work, but (arguably) not any other -- and SSA didn't address the availability of her previous work, which is technically correct, but it was a Chevron deference.

[Magister]

I worked with elevator inspectors twenty years ago; they described some horrific accidents even though people view modern elevators as extremely safe. (They advised never, ever to stick your arm between closing doors to try to stop them.) Liability from aging elevators may make it desirable to have an employee operating them as much as union rules.

[Dr. Ed 2]

I always enter an elevator with my right arm against the wall so if I am not paying attention and there is no elevator there, I (hopefully) can push myself backwards instead of falling down the shaft.

Contrary to rumors, that only caused one fatality at UMass, and the sad thing is that the kid got a grip on one of the cables ("ropes"), but couldn't stop because of the grease on it.

Now as to elevators opening without any elevator there, that *was* a big problem at UMass for a while, it would happen more than once a week.

And as to elevator operators, it could also be a combination of three things -- not being able to get parts that fit an elevator that old and/or not wanting to pay to install them, and not wanting to destroy historical decor of antique elevators with a modern button assembly.

Remember too that the elevator operator is also watching both the lobby and the various floors -- and hopefully will tell management if there is something management needs to deal with. Remove these persons and you have to either hire other people to watch, or install cameras and hire people to watch them.

You don't really think WalMart hires greeters to say "welcome to Walmart", do you?

[Kazinski]

There was the case of he woman who got her leg stuck in the elevator door and the elevator closed its doors and dragged her up half in and half out of the elevator between floors. Leaving the people in the elevator stuck with her lifeless leg for hours while they extracted her body.

https://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/15/nyregion/elevator-accident-kills-a-woman-in-a-madison-avenue-building.html

[Estragon]

“I last encountered one complete with uniform and white gloves in the 1980s, at a convention at an aging hotel where the elevator interface was not robust enough to be operated by amateurs.”

My former middle/high school had not one but two until the early 2000s. Magister is correct: it was because of the interface and the sliding gate. There was no selection of floors, just a handle to move it up and down. Doors opened by hand.

I do love though how certain commenters immediately pivot to union bashing and decrying “patronage jobs”

[Krayt]

There have to be plenty of desk jobs someone can do. Is elevator operator the ultimate bottom job, the communications degree of physical labor?

[Dr. Ed 2]

"I do love though how certain commenters immediately pivot to union bashing and decrying “patronage jobs”"

Until recently, the Suffolk County Sheriff's Department (the jail guards) were all patronage jobs, there was a Federal Indictment over patronage in the Probation Department, and the MBTA was called "Mr. Bulger's Transportation Authority" for a reason.

For some reason, these jobs are now all going wanting (the Sheriff's Department is advertising on billboards), but I love how people underestimate the extent of patronage in the Brave New People's Republic of Taxachusetts....

Oh, and as to elevator doors, the same thing is true of subway cars. Someone was recently dragged to his death by a Red Line MBTA car this way. Apparently a relay had shorted out and no one ever thought of inspecting this particular relay. This and the flaming train on the bridge (metal panel came loose and shorted to 3rd rail) is what got the attention of the Feds, and they weren't impressed...

[Estragon]

We’re talking about elevator operators. Save the whitey soliloquy for the drunks at the end of the bar at the Springfield Buffalo Wild Wings.

“For some reason, these jobs are now all going wanting (the Sheriff’s Department is advertising on billboards), but I love how people underestimate the extent of patronage”

Aren’t patronage jobs usually desirable? Something about this doesn’t add up.

Note to readership: I did check the factual assertions and shockingly they seem to be relatively accurate. I am surprised as you are.

[bernard11]

I love how people underestimate the extent of patronage in the Brave New People’s Republic of Taxachusetts….

Who underestimates it? No semiconscious resident of the state.

[Krayt]

All the elevators I get on are powered and lighted, so I can see if it’s there or not. Also, I wait a second to see if someone is getting off, so I don’t wait right with my nose in the crack, ready to step blindly in without checking if I’m gonna bash into someone.

Exiters get dibs.

Granted, this is all theoretical. If the doors opened and I just rushed in and fell 2 stories to my broken arm, I get what I deserve.

[Magister]

I was expecting video of Captain Kirk being attacked coming out of the turbolift.

[Dr. Ed 2]

First, the floor is concrete and if you only fall two stories, you will be damn lucky to only break an arm. People HAVE died falling shorter distances onto concrete...

Second, as I understand it, the lights in the elevator were vandalized so often that people believe that the victim didn't think anything of stepping into darkness as it was a routine occurrence.

Third, the UMass Towers are 22 stories tall. The one fatality I am aware of involved elevator surfing -- jumping from one to another as both are moving (there is a second set of controls on the top). And these elevators cut power a few floors before the floor they intend to stop on -- saves on electricity, brakes, and the indigestion of the people inside.

What was speculated was that someone got into the actual elevator and pushed a floor button -- with the person jumping not knowing that one of the elevators was going to suddenly slow. He missed the other one and his body was sliced in half (probably more than that) by a cross beam in the vicinity of the 5th floor, with the remains continuing to fall into the sub-basement. I neither know nor want to know the rest of the gristly details -- but do know that viewing the pictures is considered a rite of initiation into the UMass Police.

I'll enter elevators with my right arm contacting the wall...

[Dr. Ed 2]

Elevators always fall UP because of the counterweights.

There was one in the UMass Library (26 stories) that somehow lost a counterweight and shot to the top -- fortunately no one was in it at the time.

But for reasons I don't understand, elevators will always fall "up".

[Dr. Ed 2]

"Aren’t patronage jobs usually desirable? Something about this doesn’t add up."

I am truly amazed -- the MBTA is desperately seeking warm bodies and 20 years ago, you had to bribe someone to get one of those jobs. I do NOT understand why....

[Estragon]

“Until recently, the Suffolk County Sheriff’s Department (the jail guards) were all patronage jobs”

Patronage, as I understand it, involves running a sham hiring process but actually giving the job to cronies or otherwise connected people. Those were the allegations in the case you alluded to about the probation office.

So now your theory is that in the absence of patronage these prison jobs can’t be filled? Is there something about that that doesn’t quite make sense to you? Because I am confused.

[Estragon]

“Because I am confused.”

Truthfully I have only myself to blame, engaging with this huckleberry

[Dr. Ed 2]

Bluntly, no one wants the jobs.

[Magister]

That is undoubtedly wrong; counterweights balance a partially loaded car so it doesn't work so hard, and if the counterweight were lost the elevator would go down until other systems halted it.

[Rev. Arthur L. Kirkland]

This is the direction in which this blog has been heading for years.

[Dr. Ed 2]

I do NOT make stuff up.

Here is the off-campus (Springfield) newspaper report of the incident. https://www.masslive.com/news/2007/08/no_one_hurt_in_umass_elevator.html

Why it only went to the 27th floor as opposed to the 28th, I don't know and never heard. But up is UP and it went up.

[Dr. Ed 2]

I'm tempted to do a clock like you do.

Here is evidence of elevator surfing.
https://buffalonews.com/users/login/?referer_url=https%3A%2F%2Fbuffalonews.com%2Fnews%2Felevator-surfing-claims-life%2Farticle_cc7310c4-5eb4-5cd6-ae07-ba6d97c61172.html

[Dr. Ed 2]

🙂

[defaultdotxbe]

It depends on the design of the elevator, and what specifically broke, but yes, some elevators can fall up. The ones in the building I work in can only fall down though.