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Two Cheers for the "Freedom Conservatism" Statement of Principles
It has many good points. But I have some reservations and questions.

Earlier today, a group of 83 prominent conservative (and a few libertarian) academics, intellectuals, and public policy experts issued the "Freedom Conservatism" Statement of Principles. One of the signers, John Hood, has written an article where he summarizes the group's principles, as follows:
We believe in free enterprise, free trade, free speech, strong families, balanced budgets, and the rule of law. We champion equal protection and equal opportunity. We think Washington has too much power and our states, communities, private associations, and household have too little. We believe Americans are safest and freest in a peaceful world that is led by a United States committed to pursuing its just interests.
With the caveat that it's far from entirely clear what counts as a "just interest" of the United States, this sounds great to me! I also agree with much of Stephanie Slade's Reason article about the "Freecon" statement, particularly where she notes its superiority over the rival "National Conservatism" statement of principles, issued last year. Compared to most of what is produced by the so-called New Right, the Freecon statement is a much-needed breath of fresh air.
I largely agree with all but one or two of the Freecon principles, and partly endorse even the latter. I'm also a longtime admirer of the writings of many of the signers.
But I still have some questions and reservations. I completely understand that any group statement will involve some compromise, and that no such statement can include much detail, without becoming too long and unwieldy. Still there are issues the signatories may need to rethink or at least consider in more detail as they move forward.
In what follows, the Freecon principles are in block quotes, and my comments in regular text:
- Liberty. Among Americans' most fundamental rights is the right to be free from the restrictions of arbitrary force: a right that, in turn, derives from the inseparability of free will from what it means to be human. Liberty is indivisible, and political freedom cannot long exist without economic freedom.
I agree completely! But I wonder how far the signers are prepared to go with this idea. If "liberty is indivisible," does that mean they reject paternalistic restrictions on freedom supported by many social conservatives, such as the War on Drugs and laws banning pornography and prostitution? Are they on board with the "My body, my choice," principle, and all its implications? For some of the more libertarian signers, I think the answers to these questions are "yes." For others, I'm not so sure.
- The pursuit of happiness. Most individuals are happiest in loving families, and within stable and prosperous communities in which parents are free to engage in meaningful work, and to raise and educate their children according to their values.
I completely agree with this one, as well! Though the caveat of "most" is significant. I assume the signers rightly acknowledge that some people are happiest remaining single. But, here too, I wonder how far the signers are willing to go. Does their conception of "loving families" include those built on same-sex marriage? Should parents be free to "raise educate their children according to their values" if those values are left-wing or allow for things like gender reassignment? Once, again, I am confident the answers to these questions are "yes" for the more libertarian-leaning signers, but not sure about some others.
- The foundation of prosperity. The free enterprise system is the foundation of prosperity. Americans can only prosper in an economy in which they can afford the basics of everyday life: food, shelter, health care, and energy. A corrosive combination of government intervention and private cronyism is making these basics unaffordable to many Americans. We commit to reducing the cost of living through competitive markets, greater individual choice, and free trade with free people, while upholding the rule of law, freedom of contract, and freedom of association.
It's hard to find a bone to pick with this one! My only possible reservation is about the meaning of "free trade with free people." Taken literally, it may mean a rejection of free trade with the billions of people who live under oppressive dictatorships of one kind or another. I suspect the signers actually mean we might need some narrowly targeted trade restrictions to prevent, e.g., the sale of weapons technology to authoritarian adversaries like China and Russia. But the meaning of this point may require some clarification.
- Full faith and credit. The skyrocketing federal debt—which now exceeds the annual economic output of the United States—is an existential threat to the future prosperity, liberty, and happiness of Americans. We commit to building a constructive reform agenda that can restore America's fiscal sustainability, ensuring that future generations inherit a more prosperous and secure nation than the one we now inhabit.
I would not have used the term "full faith and credit" (which has a technical legal meaning that may confuse readers) to denote this idea. "Fiscal sanity" might be better. But otherwise, I completely agree. I wish, however, the authors would have made clear the need to cut entitlement spending, as part any "reform agenda" for getting federal spending under control. This is a problem both major political parties, "national conservatives," and most left-liberals seem determined to ignore.
5. A nation of laws, not men. Equality under the law is a foundational principle of American liberty. Unfortunately, today this principle is under attack from those who believe that the rule of law does not apply to them. One manifestation of this problem is the explosion of unaccountable and unelected regulators who routinely exceed their statutory authority and abridge Americans' constitutional rights. The President should only nominate policymakers and judges who are committed to upholding these rights.
I agree with much of this, but have a reservation. The rule of law has been undermined because we have too many laws. But I'm not convinced that "unaccountable and unelected regulators" are a bigger menace than the elected politicians and voters who empower them. Many of the biggest power grabs and rights violations of recent years have been originated by the occupants of the White House, rather than by regulators and bureaucrats acting on their own initiative. Indeed, there are few bureaucrats and regulators that the president and Congress could not hold accountable if they wanted to. The problem is not so much rogue regulators as an excessive concentration of power in the federal government.
In the many instances where the executive branch wields powers not given to the federal government, I am not sure that greater accountability to the elected president is necessarily a good thing. It could lead to an even more dangerous concentration of power in the hands of one person.
- Americans by choice. Immigration is a principal driver of American prosperity and achievement. America is exceptional because anyone—from any corner of the earth—can seek to live in America and become an American. Nearly all American citizens descend from someone who came here from somewhere else, and we must treat all citizens equally under the law. To this end, the United States, as a sovereign nation, has the right to secure its borders and design a rational immigration policy—built on the rule of law—that advances the interests and values of American citizens.
This is the one I have the most reservations about. The statement rightly praises immigration's crucial role in promoting American "prosperity and achievement" and in American exceptionalism, more generally. But it then seems to suggest (the text is not entirely clear on that point) that the US has a "sovereign" power to restrict immigration as it wishes, even equating this to "secur[ing] its borders." The latter, perhaps unintentionally, perpetuates the pernicious conflation of immigration restriction with security against attack. Noticeable by its absence is any recognition that immigration restrictions violate the "liberty" and "the right to be free from the restrictions of arbitrary force" that is at the heart of the statement's Principle 1. And, yet, immigration restrictions do in fact severely infringe the freedom of both would-be immigrants and current American citizens. Indeed, they likely do so more than any other US government policy - even if we consider only the liberty of native-born Americans.
Admittedly, Principle 6 is vague enough to be susceptible of more pro-immigration interpretations. For example, perhaps advancing "the interests and values of American citizens" requires abolition of all or most immigration restrictions (I certainly think it does!). But if that's what the authors mean, it would help to be more clear about it.
- Out of many, one. The best way to unify a large and diverse nation like the United States is to transfer as many public policy choices as possible to families and communities. Much of the discord in America today comes from the fact that too many decisions are made for us by centralized authorities. The Constitution of the United States is the best arrangement yet devised for granting government the just authority to fulfill its proper role, while restraining it from the concentration and abuse of power.
I agree almost completely. My one major caveat is that state and local governments should not be allowed to enact policies that severely restrict mobility, such as exclusionary zoning. Also, this - like Principle 1 - needs to be applied to immigration, including by divesting the federal government of its sweeping authority to impose immigration restrictions. At the very least, state governments should be empowered to admit additional immigrants on their own.
- America's promissory note. Martin Luther King, Jr. described the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence as containing "magnificent words…a promissory note to which every American was to fall heir." Prior to 1964, however, slavery and segregation were enforced by state governments and, in many cases, by the federal government. Many who descend from victims of this system now face economic and personal hurdles that are the direct result of this legacy. We commit to expanding opportunity for those who face challenges due to past government restrictions on individual and economic freedom. We adamantly oppose racial discrimination in all its forms, either against or for any person or group of people.
I agree. I hope the signers are prepared to support all the policy changes needed to make government color-blind, including some that may discomfit many on the political right.
- The shining city on a hill. American foreign policy must be judged by one criterion above all: its service to the just interests of the United States. Americans are safest and freest in a peaceful world, led by the United States, in which other nations uphold individual liberty and the sovereignty of their neighbors.
It's hard to disagree with any of this. But that's in large part because it's hard to tell what this principle actually means. Much depends on what exactly counts as "the just interests of the United States." Interpreted narrowly, it might mean indifference to all but direct security threats (narrowly defined), or narrow American material self-interest. But the second sentence suggests America has an interest in promoting a world where "other nations uphold individual liberty and the sovereignty of their neighbors." If so, that might justify things like humanitarian intervention, backing Ukraine in its resistance to Russian aggression, and much else.
Also, what if upholding "individual liberty" conflicts with upholding "sovereignty," as it often does in many situations where sovereigns perpetrate human rights violations? Is outside intervention to protect liberty justified in such cases, or must we respect to sovereignty of oppressive regimes?
I am somewhat more hawkish than many of my fellow libertarians, and believe we should back Ukraine and other relatively liberal states against authoritarian adversaries. But it's hard for me to tell what kind of foreign and security policy the Freecons are advocating here. Perhaps this vague language is an attempt to finesse internal disagreements. The issue is a crucial one that has led to major internal divisions among conservatives - and libertarians, as well.
- Freedom of conscience. Essential to a free society is the freedom to say and think what one believes to be true. Under the First and Fourteenth Amendments to the Constitution, federal and state governments have a legal obligation to uphold and protect these freedoms. Private institutions have a moral obligation to do the same.
Agreed. My one caveat is I'm not sure what is meant here by the "moral obligation" of private institutions to uphold and protect freedom of speech and conscience. If it means merely that they have an obligation to abjure lobbying for censorship by the state, I agree. But I differ if it means all private organizations have a duty to promote free speech internally, similar to the government's obligations under the Constitution. For example, a conservative organization can legitimately hire only conservatives, publish only conservative views in its publications, and the like. The same goes for, e.g., a church that only wishes to promote speech compatible with its theology.
Much more can be said about many of these issues! But this post is already long, so I will leave off. Despite my caveats and reservations, there is much to praise in the Freecon statement. I hope and expect they will elaborate their ideas more fully in the future.
NOTE: I am not a signer of the Freecon statement. Ilya Shapiro of the Manhattan Institute is. He and I sometimes get confused with each other, but we are not the same person.
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It's hard to disagree with principles drafted in such lofty and vague ways, with crucial distinctions left for the reader to infer to their preference. Typical diplomatic pablum and amateurish political philosophy.
First time I've agreed with as much as half of what you say. My primary objection is the weasel wording, the pablum, which seems to want to avoid giving offense more than provide clarity.
Yes, the statement is so vague that it is worthless. Statements like this are usually written by politicians trying to hide their real agenda.
This seems largely a group of state-level right-wingers whose organizations rely on flattering prospective donors fearful of communists, socialists, Blacks, immigrants, modernity, science, reason, Jewish space lasers, and threats to our precious bodily fluids.
Do you think it's a good idea for the left and right in this country to try to identify common ground?
It's hard to disagree with principles drafted in such lofty and vague ways, but SimonP will try his darndest.
I’m saving the commentariat from having to read through my own running commentary. But suffice it to say, it is impossible to take these “principles” seriously, as statements of political philosophy. If you read them with any kind of analytical rigor, they’re nonsensical. You have to read them as the implicit political platform that they’re intended to be read as. When viewed through the intended lens, you’re just talking about traditional Republican ideology.
Taken as a whole, both the statement and Somin's response are anti-originalist and anti-American. Despite lip-service in the foreign policy section (and the usual right-wing mis-reading of, "city on a hill," the statement either slights or denigrates the notion of popular sovereignty. For instance, there is no way to square it with the principles of the Declaration of Independence, with its explicit commitment to choice of government principles at the pleasure of the People, without constraint.
You should try reading the Declaration again. You have greatly misrepresented it. (No surprise there.)
And yet, the actual constitution The People shortly crafted used a design principle to thwart unrestricted power by the power hungry. Just who the hell do you think will seek election?
Remember you live in a fantasy world where you'll get all the little goodies you want, with none of the bad things you don't. The choice of the word "fantasy" is as appropriate to this as to a Disney movie.
Krayt, probably without intending to do it, you conflate a sovereign decree constituting government with government itself. In American constitutionalism, government is not sovereign, and decapitated constitutionalism gets it wrong when it ignores a continuously active popular sovereign empowered to constrain government. To understand the framers intent, you will have to reconcile whatever meanings you assign to the DOI with whatever meanings you take to be intended for the Constitution. If either one of them seems to contradict the other, you are doing it wrong.
Nobody cares what you think SL, irrelevant failure.
You're still pompously getting this wrong, eh? Nobody is misreading anything.
More empty potshots and disparaging adverbs from Nieporent.
Reagan's speechwriters had him pretend to echo Winthrop. In context of meaning given, "city on a hill," by Winthrop, the famous (and constantly repeated) Reagan quote gets the meaning backward, turning advocacy of humility before God into blasphemy and braggadocio. Go back and read Winthrop's sermon. You can search for it online by Googling, "Model of Christian Charity." The relevant quote comes toward the end.
The only misreading is by you. Reagan in no way got it backwards, and of course Winthrop took it from the Sermon on the Mount. The meaning in each of the three cases was that the eyes of the world are upon us; if we do well people will see it and if we do ill, the same.
Yes, the Bible is the original source; no it was not Reagan's intended reference. He was explicit in at least one of his several references, and mentioned Winthrop, no doubt with some inchoate nod toward proto-originalism.
Have you even read Winthrop's sermon? Why do you suppose Reagan added, "shining," to Winthrop's message of humility? Reagan was bragging, about what he and so many others since have taken as, "American Exceptionalism"—which is another historical reference those same folks distort wildly with comical effect.
I have read Winthrop's sermon. I don't doubt you have, but you clearly do not understand it. It is not about humility. Indeed, it cannot be, because that's the opposite of the metaphor. "The whole world is paying attention to what we do" is not a humble message. "The whole world is paying attention to what we do, and therefore if we misbehave God will punish us to send a message to the world" is most certainly not a humble message.
And Reagan didn't add "shining"; that's from the original, the Sermon on the Mount:
Also not a message about humility.
I would add that even if you were right, which you most certainly are not, there's nothing wrong with repurposing a historical phrase for a different purpose. It's not like there were lots of John Winthrop stans out there whose adulation he was trying to unfairly convert for himself.
What is telling about Reagan's COAH speech is how decisively it refutes the leftist claims that Trump is the culmination of Reagan, and the handful of MAGA people who still pretend they believe in the party of Reagan. Here's how Reagan described the U.S.:
It's impossible to imagine Donald Trump ever talking like that. (And not just because all the words form complete sentences and Reagan didn't talk about 'haters' and 'losers.') It's because Trump does not believe in that vision of the U.S. Trump doesn't believe in liberalism and openness; he's a small petty man who believes the U.S. is a sick nation with only parochial interests.
This is all very....aspirational. I mean, what is not to like? Now craft legislative policies that align with those values and get those passed into law at the state and municipal level.
"Americans can only prosper in an economy in which they can afford the basics of everyday life. . . . "
Yeah . . . no.
People don't "prosper" by meeting minimum standards.
Looking at you Maslow.
The alternative hypothesis is that Americans can prosper in a system where they cannot afford the basics of everyday life. Is that your belief?
What's wrong with you?
What a comeback. Truly, it is as well thought out as your earlier comment, and solidly reinforces the obvious conclusions from that comment.
The statement you complained about identifies a necessary condition for prosperity, not a sufficient one.
Nobody's ever accused apedad of 5th grade or better reading comprehension.
I thought about explaining that the heading “foundation of prosperity” implied that it was just the start of prosperity, almost like the lower levels of a hierarchy or something.
And I thought about explaining the differences between “A if B”, “A only if B” and “A if, and only if, B”, to elaborate on the concepts of sufficient, necessary, and necessary-and-sufficient conditions.
And I thought about writing “if reading better than apedad is wrong, I don’t want to be right”.
But I decided instead to be somewhat kinder and gentler and only somewhat sarcastic.
Economic freedom comes first, and the free people rise to supply goods and inventions, and the stores are crammed with ever better, ever cheaper stuff.
We just ran hundreds of century-long experiments involving 10 billion people showing this correlation. Get on bended knee to a dictator or omnipresent corruption, your economy sucks.
No, though. Unregulated markets with no social safety net was awful. Market failure, insider trading, dickensian immiseration of the poor and voiceless…that’s just economic feudalism.
Markets are incredible engines for efficiency and innovation. But also for blind growth in defiance of all morality and utility. They are a means, not an end.
Otherwise you get the law in its majestic equality etc etc…economic freedom for all, an actual variety operational choices for a lucky few. True freedom is freedom between choices you can actually make without starving you and your family.
The last time we had unregulated markets and no "social" safety net we were at a much lower tech level, productivity was low enough that poverty being widespread was unavoidable regardless of social arrangements.
So we don't actually have any good test case of unregulated markets with no governmental (That's what you really mean by "social" here.) safety nets in a modern, productive, high tech society. We genuinely don't know how such a society would look.
Real capitalism has never been tried. You sound like a parody of a communist.
No, you can’t tech yourself out of the fundamentals of how you distribute resources and define freedom.
Well, unregulated capitalism in a high tech society has never been tried, for sure.
I'm saying, "Look, here's this poor society with unregulated capitalism, and there are poor people!" doesn't actually establish that dire poverty would be a problem in a wealthy society that had unregulated capitalism.
The wealth isn't guaranteed to be distributed in a manner that eliminates serious poverty under unregulated capitalism, but you can't blame poverty on capitalism in a society that's so poor that poverty is inevitable!
This exact pie in the sky logic works to defend retrying communism one last time.
This is because it is built on ideology and nothing more.
You need more.
‘doesn’t actually establish that dire poverty would be a problem in a wealthy society that had unregulated capitalism’
I don’t know what it is about the behaviour of the wealthiest capitalists that would suggest otherwise. They capture government power wherever they can and use it to drive inequality and wholesale environmental destruction. When governments are powerless, they’ll have pretty much all the power to keep doing that, only more so.
Yeah, my point isn't that it's implausible, just that it is hardly proof. Widespread poverty was utterly unavoidable during the early industrial revolution, productivity was too low for ANY system to have prevented it.
'just that it is hardly proof.'
Oh, I think it's absolutely proof. It was a time of immense technological change and the first thing they always did was treat human beings like shit and disposed of them whenever the next technological change made it possible. I'm not seeing a whole lot of change in attitude. Look at ChatGPT et al - unhesitatingly undercutting writers, musicians and artists, not exactly the most highly paid professions as it is. Not a qualm, not a care. They're cannibals.
You're making a "no true Scotsman" argument.
You can't discard by fiat all evidence contrary to your position just because it wasn't exactly the same in some regard. History repeats but will never be exactly the same. The 20th Century US experience with dis- or un-regulation led to horrible abuses. They repeat with each new unregulated economic sector. For example, only a few years ago we crashed the economy because of VERY free-market housing mortgage and securities behaviors. This year's SVB crisis was another example of when inadequate regulation threatened to spark a bank run.
The fantasy of un-regulation is utopian.
No, I'm saying that claiming that unregulated capitalism was responsible for income inequality at the beginning of the industrial revolution is like blaming it for water having been wet. Virtually everybody in the world was poor at the time, regardless of economic system. Productivity wasn't high enough for poverty to not be the fate of most people!
Capitalism didn't imply that nobody would be poor, but it made it possible for poverty to start declining, by generating the necessary wealth.
Okay. What year would you like to use as the cutoff before which people were so poor one cannot fairly evaluate free market capitalism?
'is like blaming it for water having been wet'
Now there's an admission. Meanwhile, wages have been stagnating while productivity rises since the eighties.
"Meanwhile, wages have been stagnating while productivity rises since the eighties."
Yes, yes they have. And it would be fatuous to claim that we have more of an unregulated free market system today than then.
Wages are stagnating because wage stagnation is a covert aim of federal policy. That's why, for instance, border enforcement is deliberately hobbled: To flood the unskilled labor market with cheap, safely abused workers, to drive down the cost of labor.
That said, as automation advances, you have to expect more and more of the profits to go to the people who actually own the automation. Eventually factories will run 'lights out', and who's going to get those wages?
The real problem is the barriers that have been raised to the average guy owning a real share of industrial capital. Qualified investor rules, companies getting tax advantages from retaining profits instead of distributing them to stockholders, that sort of thing.
The period right after WWII is known to economists as "the great compression" for it's extraordinarily low income inequality. Are you under the impression that was brought about by massive levels of bureaucratic regulation, and that we now live in an unregulated free market?
We would be a utopia but for stock regulations and corporate tax deductions!
'Wages are stagnating because wage stagnation is a covert aim of federal policy.'
Insofar as it has been captured by capitalists and serving their interests.
'Are you under the impression that was brought about by massive levels of bureaucratic regulation, and that we now live in an unregulated free market?'
I'm under the impression that unregulated free markets don't exist and if they did they would be a dystopian hellhole because eveyrthing indicates that capitalists like to hoard wealth, suppress wages, erode workers' rights and wreck the environment, and the struggle, broadly, is between regulation in the interests of the citizens and deregulation in the interests of capitalist entities.
unregulated capitalism in a high tech society has never been tried, for sure.
Sam Bankman-Fried would like a word. As would all those who lost money in the housing crisis.
Oh, and a bit of banking regulation in the late 1920's/early 1930's would have done wonders.
If you think the housing market has been "unregulated" at any point in the last century, you might want to think again.
Not the housing market per se I was referring to, but rather the housing finance market, and of course the market for various "securities" associated with it.
And if you think free banking is a great idea let me introduce you to the late 19th and early 20th centuries.
"I suspect the signers actually mean we might need some narrowly targeted trade restrictions to prevent, e.g., the sale of weapons technology to authoritarian adversaries like China and Russia."
I think you're missing the elephant in the room. The implications are a lot larger than that, and rationally so.
When you trade with other countries, you become, at least in the short term, reliant on them. You lose all the economic gains, and then some, by retaining enough excess capacity to replace that trade in an emergency, after all! A command economy might take such an economically irrational measure, a free economy never could, because the players who retain that excess capacity would lose their shirts.
Trading with friendly nations is safe enough, because you can assume that the trade will mostly be there when you need it, except as things like natural disasters dictate, and natural disasters are sufficiently uncorrelated that widespread trade actually reduces the risk. You can enjoy the gains from scale and comparative advantage in safety.
BUT. When trading with unfriendly nations, that don't even have free economies, a new risk appears: Essential supplies being cut off in order to harm you. What you might call "spiteful" interruptions of trade.
Suppose we're reliant on Chinese microchips, and China goes to war with Taiwan. We're allied with Taiwan. Is China going to sell us microchips, just because it's economically rational? No, of course they won't.
The bottom line is that it's irrational to assume that hostile countries are safe trading partners, because you KNOW they will not act as economically rational partners. At times they will actively be trying to hurt you!
And at some level you must be aware of this. So, why don't you take it into consideration?
The bottom line is that it’s irrational to assume that hostile countries are safe trading partners, because you KNOW they will not act as economically rational partners. At times they will actively be trying to hurt you!
That is a very important consideration when thinking about trade, but I would add another consideration. Free trade between friendly countries is to their mutual benefit when there is competitive balance between them. Each country's markets are equally open to the other, their environmental, financial, and labor regulations are comparable, and so on.
These are all things that need to be considered and examined and negotiated over when working on trade agreements and trade policy.
You have identified a cost. And a legit one. But now check the other side of the ledger for benefits.
This is complicated and nuanced, and not an issue to be fixed by adhering to a single principle and going home.
I didn't say it was decisive, I said it was an important factor he's not taking into consideration. Tariffs among friendly nations may be economically irrational, but tariffs between hostile nations may be militarily necessary, and not just for things like munitions. You don't just not want to sell China bullets. You also don't want to sell them the ability to crash your economy whenever they want.
Ok. Agree with you there.
Though I disagree with many details of your positions, I unfairly mischaracterized you in a post a month or more ago. Your positions (often enough) appear considered and not stuck, and I even encounter meaningful areas of agreement with you.
Regrets for my ill-considered bigotry (and probably for all my bigotry, but that's more than I can realistically deliver).
😀
I agree, but why do you keep mentioning China theoretically doing so, when we have a recent, actual example of Russia doing so?
These conservatives began their statement with a nod to William F. Buckley, a right-wing bigot.
Carry on, clingers.
So far as better Americans permit, as they continue to shape American progress against conservatives’ stale, ugly efforts and preferences.
The best way to reduce the deficit is not to cut entitlements but to raise taxes on the rich to previous levels. But that is apparently not on these folks' radar.
Also nobody who is familiar with the history of oppression of black people and other minorities is going to cheer returning power to the states. Time and again, freedom comes only when the federal government steps in.
The best way to reduce the deficit is not to cut entitlements but to raise taxes on the rich to previous levels. But that is apparently not on these folks’ radar.
The best way to let people know you're economically illiterate is to write what you just wrote. It better not be on their radar, because it's stupid.
Three times in my lifetime taxes on the rich were cut (under Reagan, George W. Bush, and Trump) each time followed by exploding deficits. In fact blowing up the deficit was an intentional strategy for forcing entitlement cuts. Look up “starving the beast”.
Did the fact that the exploding deficits were due to exploding spending, not declining revenues, somehow escape your attention?
The tax cuts are rarer, and well correlated.
Look, he's citing huge deficits as being a result of tax cuts in the Trump administration.
Here's some data.
The tax cuts were enacted in 2017. Revenues continued climbing until 2019, dipped very slightly in 2020, (From $3.46T to $3.42T) and then resumed climbing.
Now, the deficit did gradually increase from 2017 to 2019, because spending went up faster than revenues did, but the huge increase in debt didn't happen when the tax cuts kicked in, they happened in 2020, when SPENDING went up from $4.45T to $6.55T, then $6.82T in '21!
IOW, it is flatly dishonest to blame the exploding deficit under Trump on tax cuts. Grossly dishonest. It exploded because spending exploded. Revenues barely had a hiccup, and even that wasn't a result of the tax cuts, it was a result of state after state going out of their way to tank their economies!
How starkly dishonest would you have to be to blame that on Trump's tax cuts?
Now, you did have a serious decline in revenue over Bush the younger's first term, from a high of about $1.3T to a low of $0.99T, while spending was climbing on autopilot, very steadily. If you wanted you could blame the resulting deficits on the tax cuts, and, oh, not the fact that we had a massive recession. At least, it wouldn't be "Trump tax cuts caused the deficit to explode!" level stupidity.
"If you wanted you could blame the resulting deficits on the tax cuts, and, oh, not the fact that we had a massive recession."
No. I blame the recession on the tax cuts.
(I kid. I kid.)
🙂
How well is Norway's "fuck the rich" tax working out?
And exactly how far do you think taxing our rich would go towards reducing our budget deficit? The Biden administration thought that over ten years, confiscatory taxes might (perhaps optimistically) reduce deficits by a trillion dollars. We're on track for a deficit of almost $2 trillion this fiscal year alone. We can't tax-the-rich our way out of that hole: we either need a lot more people to chip in and pay down the almost $100k/person federal debt, or we need to significantly cut spending, or both.
Is Norway some kinda hellhole and I didn’t realize it?
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/apr/10/super-rich-abandoning-norway-at-record-rate-as-wealth-tax-rises-slightly
Fuck those guys, running like rats.
My guess is that the biggest difference between you and a rat is a billion dollars. (Probably less, but I'm trying not to sell you short on your conviction.)
Is that your guess? The rat won't won't give you any of his billion for thinking so.
Not really a hellhole, just rich fuckers doing rich fuckery.
Hellhole was your leftist-fuckery word, not mine.
So,asking how the tax is working out was about this? Because I’m not sure Norway is really gonna care.
How dare they not stick around to have their money taken! The nerve of them!
How globalist of you!
Rootless cosmopolitans for the win.
Seriously, you announce you're planning on taking people's wealth away, and you genuinely expect them to stick around for you to do it?
Some will some won’t.
Lots of motives other than keeping every cent of more money than you could ever spend.
Yeah, some people will stick around if you announce you mean to kill them. Doesn't mean most will.
"Lots of motives other than keeping every cent of more money than you could ever spend."
If they didn't want the money, they always had the option of not accumulating it in the first place. So I think we may safely assume they want to keep it, or at least relinquish it on their own terms, not somebody else's.
Oh dear. You think they're only JUST finding out about taxes?
I know you equate money with hours of life. Not everyone does, though.
A pinched life of accumulation for its own sake is a thing, but hardly a universal among the wealthy.
Some may even enjoy their work and their home country.
Exactly! They're amoral monsters who want to hoard their wealth like Smaug, not be restricted by silly things like laws or communities or values!
re: "communities"
from Ayn Rand's Atlas Shrugged (from Henry Rearden's speech at his trial): "If it is now the belief of my fellow men, who call themselves the public, that their good requires victims, then I say: The public good be damned, I will have no part of it!"
Yes, the relevant question here is whether the proposed solution (raise taxes on the rich) would likely solve the stated problem (reduce the deficit).
Norway may not be an appropriate example (for one thing, Norway doesn't tax based on citizenship like the US does, but on residence, so "leaving" is a realistic option for Norwegian billionaires), but it the burden of proof still rests with the advocate of the proposed solution.
Leaving aside for the moment whether the US' punitive exit-taxation laws effectively prevent US billionaires from doing what the Norwegian ones appear to be doing, what makes you believe that increasing the level of taxation to "previous levels" would be sufficient to actually "reduce the deficit" to a manageable level? Have you done the math?
FC
Ted Kaczynski organization of one was "FC". Feigned surprise from this group, or did they know exactly what they were doing with the name.
Wow! I can't recall a VC blog post where I found nothing to disagree with. That applies both to the Freedom Conservative statement, and to Ilya Somin's comments and criticisms.
What is such a statement good for? Conservative candidates post Regan have done a poor job of explaining their principles, and why people should support them. If candidates started using careful language like that in the statement, I think they might win more votes.
That's nice and all but almost meaningless. Anyone from most progressive rabid Kendi follower to the most hardcore conservative originalist could support that language (remember, the strongest supporters of affirmative action are going to say it's not discrimination it's a remedy for past discrimination). And even if we take a clue from the implicit associations in the text all the action occurs when you decide how to trade off these values when they come into conflict.
After electing Trump, this just reads like a reiteration of all the stuff conservatives claimed to represent but then happily ditched when they got fed up with the pretence. You'd think libertarians would have learned their lesson by now.
I don't suppose there's anything about climate change or pandemic policy in there anywhere? Do they repudiate the trans hate?
'led by the United States'
Getting a real zombie Reagan vibe off this.
One thing I notice in the statement is the preference for local and community government over federal government. Let's set aside whether that preference is correct for a minute.
Should local government be preferred over state government? I think the same principles would apply. But most folks on the Right seem to favor State government over local government. Is that accurate?
Example: there have been many instances in my state (Texas) of state government interfering with popular local government ordinances. The recent rule banning cities' water break requirements for outdoor workers (in Texas!) is an example.
Please put aside the question of whether the city/state rules are good/bad. Does the Freedom Conservativism statement prefer the locality or the state? Why?
From a federal constitutional standpoint, anyway, one prefers state over federal level action for most issues, just on account of thinking the 10th amendment is a valid part of the Constitution which needs to be followed. That makes it not just a policy preference, but a rule of law issue.
At the state vs local level, subsidiarity might be a policy preference, but unless the state in question has a home rule clause in its constitution, it's not a rule of law issue.
I get the law vs policy distinction. The statement is philosophical, however. It lumps localities with states. I'm asking whether the philosophical principle that prefers states over the federal government also prefers localities over states.
In general, yes, with the proviso that the preference for states over federal has added weight due to the philosophical weight of rule of law, and that you don't get local option whether or not to violate constitutional rights.
This is just evading the very good point Reallynotbob makes.
The right simply doesn't want cities managing their own affairs.
Honestly, they seem a bit incoherent here. Freedom is maximized by more local choice with the fundamental difference being whether you choose to voluntarily opt in to specific rules or whether those rules are imposed on you via the barrel of a gun. This runs headlong into Ilya's distaste for exclusionary zoning. He is certainly happy to use concentrated force to override local decisions there and this certainly doesn't make the local community more "free".
Somin’s reading of the Statement is insightful, without being unduly critical; he merely recognizes that the devil is always in the details, and he’s flagged many of the most important wrinkles to be ironed out in the future.
That said, whenever I read his riffs on immigration I’m always left with the impression that he’s pulling punches. This essay is of a piece. He argues, “advancing ‘the interests and values of American citizens’ requires abolition of all or most immigration restrictions.” Well, which is it? “All” or “most”? I wish he’d be more explicit about which, if any, restrictions he feels are warranted or at least defensible. Anything beyond perhaps border inspections targeted exclusively at detecting terrorists?
Also, I wish he’d get off his high horse about conservative support for colorblind policies falling off when it comes to what he calls “racial profiling.” I’ve never heard anyone ever urge that an individual’s race alone can supply legal justification for detention. On the other hand, if a rape occurs on the corner of Maple and Main at midnight and by someone whom the victim has described by weight, height, build, clothing, gender and race, detaining anyone who fits that description walking four blocks away in the opposite direction at 12:05 am is not an instance of “racial profiling.” Nor does it become one even when, over time, it is shown that following up leads of that general character across entire communities results in disparities between the rates at which members of certain demographic groups are detained for questioning and their percentage in the general population.
"I’ve never heard anyone ever urge that an individual’s race alone can supply legal justification for detention."
Sure you have. It sounds like this:
“...90-plus percent of those pictures in my book, and it’s a three-ringed binder, are black and Hispanic people from Waterbury, Connecticut, the Bronx and Brooklyn.” --Gov. Paul LePage (R-ME)
"Further, MCSO policy and practice allow its officers to consider the race of a vehicle's occupants in determining whether they have reasonable suspicion to investigate the occupants for violations of state laws related to immigration, or to enforce the LEAR policy. In some instances these policies result in prolonging the traffic stop beyond the time necessary to resolve the issue that initially justified the stop." Manuel De Jesus Ortega Melendres v. Arpaio, 989 F. Supp. 2d 822, 827 (D. Ariz. 2013)
"That the proportion of stops generally reflects our crime numbers does not mean, as the judge wrongly concluded, that the police are engaged in racial profiling; it means they are stopping people in those communities who fit descriptions of suspects or are engaged in suspicious activity." --Michael Bloomberg, NY Mayor 2013.
So... if by "race alone" you don't consider pretextual stops and the like, maybe you're correct. But politicians regularly use the argument that race = heightened scrutiny, even in instances where there is not an eyewitness description.
The first quote doesn't purport "that an individual’s race alone can supply legal justification for detention.” It's just an observation concerning statistics. I make no claim about its accuracy, by the way.
Yeah, the second fits the bill.
The third, again, is just an observation about statistics, which amounts to a denial that disparate impact proves discrimination.
I don't believe the second fits the bill either. The district judge found (as a matter of fact) that "[w]hile officers were prohibited from using race as the only basis to undertake a law enforcement investigation, they were allowed as a matter of policy and instruction to consider race as *one factor among others* in making law enforcement decisions in the context of immigration enforcement." The judge apparently also found (as a matter of law) that considering race to any extent violates the fourth amendment, but I stand by initial observation: "I’ve never heard anyone [--including anyone affiliated with the Maricopa Co. S.O--] ever urge that an individual’s race *alone* can supply legal justification for detention."
You write: "Noticeable by its absence is any recognition that immigration restrictions violate the "liberty" and "the right to be free from the restrictions of arbitrary force" that is at the heart of the statement's Principle 1."
But it's okay to restrict the liberty of a people to protect their cultural and economic inheritance by limiting immigration in a reasonable way?
Sure, just as long as they don't violate Principle No. 2: "The pursuit of happiness. Most individuals are happiest in loving families, and within stable and prosperous communities in which parents are free to engage in meaningful work, and to raise and educate their children according to their values."
In the EU, the "right to a family life" is used to justify a legal resident's or citizen's right to bring into the country their family members from abroad.
“We believe Americans are safest and freest in a peaceful world that is led by a United States committed to pursuing its just interests.”
And guns. Lots of guns.
My guns do keep me safe & free.
(I suspect you know that, and this is why you want to take them away.)
It has always been true: You cannot serve two masters. This document asserts the Natural Law found throughout the Bible.
as to ' the "moral obligation" of private institutions to uphold and protect freedom of speech and conscience" the question is, Who has the legal final say-so on this obligation? Let's revive the Sheriff role in our counties so that at the appropriate level things are decided (Subsidiarity)
"I'm not convinced that "unaccountable and unelected regulators" are a bigger menace than the elected politicians and voters who empower them . . . there are few bureaucrats and regulators that the president and Congress could not hold accountable if they wanted to."
This flips the burden of action. There are people in jail due to laws created by the administrative state, including cases that would never happen if elected representatives had to actually vote on such laws.
The best way to unify a large and diverse nation like the United States is to transfer as many public policy choices as possible to families and communities.
I'm tired of hearing this from conservatives. Let a municipality in a red state pass an ordinance the right doesn't like, or try to run elections, and the RW legislature is all over it.
They don't believe it.
Much of this is empty bloviating.
What does it mean that "liberty is indivisible?"
Is there no regulation of free markets the authors would accept?
Did they think about what they wrote?
What agriculture is predicted and stable from the point of view of profitability at different season changes, applications of remote sensing in agriculture? More flexible tools for controlling farm activity perfectly support the living conditions of plants at the same level.
Right. What I'm saying is that, in a free economy business persons who decide to retain substantial excess capacity get their lunch eaten by business persons who shave their margins. You can't, as a matter of basic economics, expect to maintain enough excess, unused capacity to cope with rare market disruptions like embargoes during wars. The most a free market economy will be prepared for are fairly common disruptions of the sort that would ordinarily be insurable anyway.
And that's perfectly fine if all the trade is going on among friendly, economically rational actors.
Once you throw trade with adversaries into the mix, that non-market factor renders ordinary free market economics existentially risky, because the free market can't properly respond to economically irrational risks. Free markets fundamentally rely on economically rational actors making the important decisions.
Including adversary governments in free market trading arrangements creates risks that require governmental, not free market, responses.
So you are saying it is desirable to regulate markets when failing to do so risks negative consequences.
I agree. It's a much more intelligent POV than that in the Statement.