The Volokh Conspiracy
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Goldilocks and the Four Non-Originalists
Counterman v. Colorado was a throwback to a different era.
In Bruen, Justice Thomas observed that the Second Amendment, like the First Amendment, should be interpreted with an originalist standard. Thomas wrote that with the freedom of speech, "to carry that burden, the government must generally point to historical evidence about the reach of the First Amendment's protections." Really? That was news to me. Throughout the entire twentieth century, the Supreme Court erected an elaborate and intricate free speech jurisprudence. There are tiers of scrutiny, balancing tests, categorical tests, and more. But very little of the free speech caselaw could be called originalist. Sure, in some cases, the Court talks about history. But this jurisprudence was manufactured from the ground up.
Nowadays, the Court seems to eschew this sort of free-floating judging. Even when the Court develops new doctrine, it tries to ground those principles in history. But Counterman v. Colorado felt like a throwback to a different era. This case considered what the proper mens rea was in a true-threats case. Justice Kagan wrote the majority opinion, which was joined by Chief Justice Roberts and Justices Alito, Kavanaugh, and Jackson. Should it be purposeful, knowing, or recklessness? The majority chose a recklessness standard. Why recklessness? Justice Kagan explained:
Among those standards, recklessness offers the right path forward.
The Court struck a balance between punishing threatening behavior and avoiding the chilling of protected speech. There is no originalist case for this standard or that standard. Rather, the Court made an overt value judgment.
Justice Barrett wrote a dissent, joined by Justice Thomas. Justice Barrett charged that the majority was engaging in an inherently legislative task:
The optimal balance strikes me as a question best left to the legislature, which could calibrate the mens rea to the circumstance—for example, higher for the criminal context and lower for the civil. The reality is that recklessness is not grounded in law, but in a Goldilocks judgment: Recklessness is not too much, not too little, but instead "just right."'
In response, Justice Kagan owned her open-ended balancing:
The dissent accuses the Court of making a "Goldilocks judgment" in favoring a recklessness standard. Post, at 13 (opinion of BARRETT, J.). But in law, as in life, there are worse things than being "just right."
How would Justices Barrett and Thomas have resolved this issue? The starting point is not the Justices' own sense of propriety, but history:
So is the silence in the historical record. Since 1791, true threats have been excluded from the "speech" protected by the First Amendment. R. A.V., 505 U. S., at 382–383, 388. If Counterman could show that a subjective requirement has been inherent in the definition of "true threat" since the founding, he would have a compelling case. But Counterman cannot make that showing. For starters, he produces no evidence directly addressing the meaning of the First Amendment—nothing from state ratifying conventions, political commentary, or even early debates about efforts to regulate threats in ways that might threaten speech. That is not surprising at the federal level, because the Federal Government did not prohibit threats until the early 20th century. Elonis, 575 U. S., at 760 (THOMAS, J., dissenting). Some States, however, both regulated threats and guaranteed the right to free speech in their own constitutions. Id., at 760–761. Yet even at the state level, there was apparently no discussion about the implications of these statutes for the constitutional right.
What should the Court do in the absence of historical support for this rule? The Justices should decline to expand the protections of the"true-threat" doctrine:
At the end of the day, then, the best historical case for Counterman does not add up to much. He is plainly not asking the Court to enforce a historically sanctioned rule, but rather to fashion a new one.
Justice Thomas wrote a separate dissent. He analogized the made-up true threats doctrine to the "actual malice" standard from New York Times v. Sullivan:
Like the majority's decision today, "New York Times and the Court's decisions extending it were policy-driven decisions masquerading as constitutional law." McKee v. Cosby, 586 U. S. ___, ___ (2019) (THOMAS, J., concurring
Moreover, Justice Thomas faults the majority for extending further this "flawed" jurisprudence.
Many Members of this Court havequestioned the soundness of New York Times and its numerous extensions. See, e.g., Berisha, 594 U. S., at ___–___ (GORSUCH, J., dissenting from denial of certiorari) (slip op., at 5–8); Coughlin v. Westinghouse Broadcasting & Cable, Inc., 476 U. S. 1187 (1986) (Burger, C. J., joined byRehnquist, J., dissenting from denial of certiorari); Gertz, 418 U. S., at 370 (White, J., dissenting); Rosenbloom v. Metromedia, Inc., 403 U. S. 29, 62 (1971) (Harlan, J., dissenting); id., at 78 (Marshall, J., dissenting); Rosenblatt v. Baer, 383 U. S. 75, 92 (1966) (Stewart, J., concurring); see also E. Kagan, A Libel Story: Sullivan Then and Now, 18 L. & Soc. Inquiry 197, 207 (1993); J. Lewis & B. Ottley, New York Times v. Sullivan at 50, 64 DePaul L. Rev. 1, 35–36 (2014) (collecting statements from Justice Scalia); cf. Tah v. Global Witness Publishing, Inc., 991 F. 3d 231, 251–256 (CADC 2021) (Silberman, J., dissenting in part) (questioning the doctrine). It is thus unfortunate that the majority chooses not only to prominently and uncritically invoke New York Times, but also to extend its flawed, policy-driven First Amendment analysis to true threats, a separate area of this Court's jurisprudence.
The Court should not extend doctrine that itself has no grounding in the Constitution's original meaning. Justices Barrett and Thomas are exactly right.
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Ketanji is Beyoncé…the other justices are Destiny’s Children!
Doesn't this assume you have to justify being free by finding some inkling of it in the then-times?
That does not comport with the idea rights not listed are reserved to the states or to the people.
I am fine with finding new rights, even if they would have not been considered so at the time. This is in line with concepts of freedom in our Constitution (happy 4th of July!)
Note the opposite is not true: changing attitudes grant government new power sans amendment. This is the opposite of that exact same principle.
The historical bent is really just an excuse to wind back progress to get the most conservative result possible, and ignore the clear direction of subsequent amendments and court decisions.
One man's "unenumerated right" is another man's mockable penumbra; motivated reasoning all the way down. Or, more briefly, Blackman.
Someone should claim an unenumerated property right to wifebeat. History & Tradition! It's hard to see how these justices could deny it.
When you invoke 3 abstracts to make a concrete point you will be mocked by any person of common sense. Progress, historicism, conservative...then you go into words you don't understand like unenumerated right.
Obviously, logically, that firt subsequent amendment and first subsequent court decision, did just what you oppose !! But you think it progress and liberal so it is okay. Show me your Constitutional law degree, please.
Doesn’t this assume you have to justify being free by finding some inkling of it in the then-times?
Yes. And then we have to use the bullshit "history and tradition" principle.
I knew you hated free speech! Good job owning it at least.
In response, Justice Kagan owned her open-ended balancing:
This leads to something I’ve always wondered about. Who goes last – the majority, dissenters, or concurrers (is that a word – I doubt it)?
How is it that the dissent can comment on the majority opinion and the majority can comment on the dissents?
They circulate draft opinions and re-edit.
Eventually one turtle's legs give out and the back-and-forth concludes from exhaustion.
That process on its own might not converge, but then the deadline of the end of the Court’s term interrupts it, and somebody gets the final unanswered insult of someone else’s mother.
One possible explanation for all the opinions issued so late this year.
(Or what the alphabet commenter said while I was writing that.)
Sure, but sooner or later someone gets the last word. So you write, "The dissent idiotically claims .....," but the claim was removed from the dissent last time around, and the dissenter says, perhaps truthfully, that it was her turtle that collapsed and she never recirculated the draft.
And what do you call someone who writes a concurrence?
Why, for Thomas and Barrett, is the presumption that unless Counterman shows that his speech would have been protected, he loses? Doesn't that flip the originalist presumption the SCOTUS conservatives usually use, which says that speech is presumptively protected and you have to show that historically it would have been unprotected.
This, BTW, is a HUGE problem for originalism, just like level of generality is. The choice of baseline default rule is completely arbitrary, and they can sound all historical and principled while switching back and forth and doing whatever they want.
It's not a problem for originalism only, it's a natural outcome of lawyerly quibbling. Better to preserve precedent by papering it over than admit any kind of error. Like papal bulls which dare not admit that any previous pope might have been fallible.
NO, hundreds of thousands of emails !! That is psycho even from your Mom !!!
You want this to be a speech thing. It isn't. Pretend it is your daughter and tell me you side with the stalker.
IANAL and precedent has always struck me as the original way lawyers kept their prices high, now enhanced by law school restrictions and bar exams.
Lemme see if I have this right.
The Bill of Rights was passed in 1791. 7 years later, the Sedition Act was passed and signed by John Adams, while George Washington was still alive, and used by Adams to throw newspaper editors in jail for personal insults. Starting in the 1920s after Woodrow Wilson had pushed this suppression of free speech too far, the Supreme Court suddenly got a backbone and made up all sorts of reasons to enforce free speech, without ever really repudiating past actions.
The Supreme Court meanwhile ignored the clear understanding of both pro and con sides of the 14th Amendment and gutted incorporation of the Bill of Rights against the states with the Slaughterhouse cases just 7 years later. Strange number, that 7.
Hoplophobes made up all sorts of excuses to violate the Second Amendment, such as suing gun manufacturers for legally selling legal guns to legal customers which later ended up being used criminally, in ways which would have been laughed out of court if used against car manufacturers for selling cars used by drunks or bank robbers. The Supreme Court laid back supine and enjoyed it. Eventually, in 2010, the Supreme Court finally incorporated the Second Amendment against the states, 145 years late, but laid back and enjoyed its rape by hoplophobes for such crimes as silly ads, arguments which would also have been laughed out of courts if used against car manufacturers.
Then came Bruen, establishing new precedent about precedent itself, requiring historical precedent showing similar usage but only from around 1791 (when the Bill of Rights was adopted) or 1865 (when the 14th Amendment incorporated the Bill of Rights against the states, except it didn’t, because Slaughterhouse gutted that incorporation, so it should have been 2010 when McDonald finally incorporated the 2nd for reals).
Have I got that all right? And now this case argues about how precedent was set for setting precedent for precedent. I think.
What a mess. You lawyers have done yourself up proud.
Precedent is how we do law. Precedents are no always right, nor are they inviolate. But the good practice of law looks at what past jurists have thought and does not lightly supplant your own views for that of the institution you serve in.
You seem to be confusing complexity for elitism. These are hard questions, maybe imponderable ones. But throwing humility aside and declaring your way the new hotness is not cutting the Gordian knot; it's just adding more complexity and a break in continuity for future generations to grapple with.
Oh go blow it. You wouldn't recognize an alternative if it bit your butt. Lawyers save all their imagination for quibbling and have none left for anything else, and recoil in horror at any suggestions that their precious legal systems might have flaws, especially those pointed out by non-lawyers.
This is not a very responsive to my issues with your post, just going and telling me I’m biased because I’m a lawyer.
I’m not a lawyer, and my opinion is just as good as yours.
You're posting like Behar. Don't post like Behar.
It’s crazy that some conservative legal scholars think a good way to make legal decisions is to read a few documents from the 18th century. These documents are often cherry-picked based off the modern judge’s political persuasion and are sometimes not even legal rulings, but instead represent the political opinions of some random authoritarian leader who grew up in a time period in which there were *no* liberal democracies. I’ve even seem some jurists argue that proper legal interpretation in some cases requires relying on what 17th century British judges said (literal servants of a monarchy). The historical process followed by some of the leading originalist judges is very haphazard and often not more repeatable than the reasoning espoused by other philosophies, and frankly I think real historians would laugh at its lack of rigor.
A truly libertarian legal philosophy involves making rulings which protect fundamental rights, not perpetuating (or *reinstituting*) tyrannical injustices because some slaveholder from the 18th century ignored the plain text of the Constitution to say it was okay. It would be nice if some legal scholars pushed in the direction of interpreting the Constitution as favoring the protection of rights as much as possible, and jurists to stop presenting dubious historical inquiry as the frontier of jurisprudence.
And are you agreeing with the Thomas’s opinion the NYT v Sullivan is poorly decided? The actual malice standard is one of the most important bulwarks protecting political freedom today; it protects not only professional journalists but also ordinary people criticizing
Your partisanship is showing.
It is just the conservative ones, and the reasons for that are given above.
Seeing as I was criticizing originalism, which is a philosophy primarily espoused by conservatives, it makes sense that I would call out only one side of the aisle.
Left-wing legal scholars also have problems with lacking a consistent legal philosophy defending rights, but that wasn't the subject under debate.
Except you just shot your own argument
[ Before calling the source of this a fool, you will look it up and backtrack ]
" If all men are created equal, that is final. If they are endowed with inalienable rights, that is final. If governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed, that is final. No advance, no progress can be made beyond these propositions. If anyone wishes to deny their truth or their soundness, the only direction in which he can proceed historically is not forward, but backward toward the time when there was no equality, no rights of the individual, no rule of the people. Those who wish to proceed in that direction can not lay claim to progress."
CICERO
. And there will not be different laws at Rome and at Athens, or different laws now and in the future, but one eternal and unchangeable law will be valid for all nations and all times, and there will be one master and ruler, that is, God, over us all, for he is the author of this law, its promulgator, and its enforcing judge.
Nothing was "expanded" in NYT or in this case. Both purport to derive the original meaning of the First Amendment and then apply it in a modern context.
The idea that History & Tradition is the only (or even a good) way to figure out the original meaning of old legal documents is a lame con being perpetrated by the legal right wing. If anything, contemporaneous politicians are the least likely to get the meaning right, as they're so lacking in perspective and likely biased towards the then-status-quo.
Why have a constitution at all if its sole intent was to capture a snapshot in time? Just write "the norms and common law of the 1780s will remain permanent forever." No need for any clauses and articles. But that's not what they did.
And it’s perfectly plausible for two people to agree on the original meaning of words yet disagree on their implementation.
For example, consider “cruel and unusual”. Scalia and Breyer IIRC agreed on the meaning of those words. But Scalia then said that “cruel and unusual” is with reference to what the FFs would have regarded as cruel and unusual at the time the BoR was enacted, while Breyer’s view – and the sane view, IMO – is that what constitutes “cruel and unusual” is wrt current standards. (Funny how Scalia did not apply the same principle to the meaning of “arms”). Same meaning, different effect.
But this retreats into Unrealitalia, the land of cocktail chatter. If your daughter were treated that way by that man , what would you do? Defend his free speech rights? That is a lie and you know it.
But you are the one making it exclusively First Amendment , that is your error. If someone sent as many emails as he did but they were ""Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet consectetuer" and they crashed your computer or ruined your website, would that be the same?
One estimate is about one hundred thousand emails --- obviously not communicating anything for at least 99% of them, right
It is not a free speech issue in the least
But this harks back to Thomas on the Chicago gangs loitering case
CITY OF CHICAGO, PETITIONER v.
JESUS MORALES et al.
"Today, the Court focuses extensively on the “rights” of
gang members and their companions. It can safely do so—
the people who will have to live with the consequences of
today’s opinion do not live in our neighborhoods. "
Take any judge who sided with Counterman and have that man say such things to their daughter or show up at their house. They would not unlikely kill the man.
Yes, there is the other aspect, that the man is mentally deranged and a menace to society. But you can't solve every cause that contributes to a bad effect.