The Volokh Conspiracy
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Higher education faces an inflection point with DEI
Stanford Law School was just the cardinal in the coal mine.
Universities have long had strong commitments to diversity. This fixation was necessitated by Justice Powell's concurrence in Bakke, and later Justice O'Connor's majority opinion in Grutter. Admissions offices and hiring committees were trained to recruit the "right" under-represented candidates, while assigning low personality ratings to the "wrong" under-represented candidates. In any other context, such pretext would immediately be smoked out. But when you're on the right side of the justice-arc, the tails are ignored. These practices likely violate federal law, but we will have to wait for the Supreme Court to weigh in. Still, the work of admissions offices and hiring committees was front-loaded. These organizations did not have any impact on the curriculum, and what was actually taught in the classroom. Nor should they have. These matters were traditionally left to faculty governance, and academic freedom.
In the last decade however, there has been a change. Universities began to establish offices of diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI). The exact role of these entities was always amorphous, but it soon became clear their role would extend beyond admissions and hiring. Rather, DEI sought to inject itself into every facet of academic institutions where DEI could be at issue--that is, everywhere. Following the final year of the Trump presidency--which included George Floyd, the pandemic, and the Capitol riot--this aggrandizement accelerated. At many institutions, DEI has some oversight over the curriculum, student organizations, and even the faculty themselves. Of course, this design inverts the usual hierarchy of academia. DEI should be an administrative department with no more power than finance or IT. But armed with the cause of moral justice, and backed by aggrieved students, DEI can steamroll over pliant faculty who are afraid to push back and be called racists.
Judge Duncan's protest is a perfect illustration of that dynamic. Much has been said about what Dean Tirien Steinbach said. But a better question is why was she the one to speak? SLS has many associate deans who could have represented the administration. Indeed, there were several deans present in the room, including Jeanne Merino, the acting associate dean of students. Why did the DEI Dean speak at the podium? Steinbach claimed in the WSJ that she "was asked to attend the event by the Federalist Society." I am skeptical of this claim--and I am 100% confident that FedSoc would not have invited Steinbach if they knew she would not enforce the policy, but would instead berate Judge Duncan. But let's assume FedSoc invited her as the mediator. And let's assume that Steinbach's fellow associate deans, and even Dean Martinez, designated her as the representative of the administration. Why?
On today's campus, DEI administrators are among the most powerful positions. When every single conflict is refracted through the lens of race, it is of course obvious that DEI should be the sole arbiter of those disputes. (I'm sure many critics will dismiss this post as a byproduct of racism.) Consider the actual words that Steinbach used. She spoke on behalf of the administration:
And there is always an intention from this administration to make sure you all can be in a place where you feel fully you can be here, learn, grow into the amazing advocates and leaders and lawyers that you're going to be.
Because me and many people in this administration do absolutely believe in free speech.
Steinbach obviously thought she could speak on behalf of the Stanford Law School. And why would she think that? For some time, these roving bureaucrats have assumed a limitless jurisdiction to touch every facet of an academic institution that could fall within the chasm of diversity, equity, and inclusion--roughly the emptiness of the Grand Canyon.
But Steinbach was wrong. Dean Jenny Martinez did not give Steinbach "snaps," but did place her on leave. Steinbach likes to decorate her office with "ampersands" to signify the word "and" over "or." However, Steinbach should become intimately familiar with another punctuation mark: a period. Because her tenure will soon come to an end.
There is much to praise about Dean Martinez's letter. In many regards, she performed better under pressure than did Dean Gerken last year. Perhaps the comparison is unfair, since the "traphouse" situation happened first, at a school not bound by the First Amendment. Martinez had the benefit of more preparation time, as well as the Leonard Law. Still, both Deans were forced to confront these problems caused by DEI Deans. Last year, Gerken gently chastised Associate Dean Ellen Cosgrove and Diversity Director Yaseen Eldik. They were allowed to leave, quietly. In June 2022, Cosgrove retired, and Eldik was reassigned to a non-student facing position. Martinez, however, dropped the hammer right away.
How can it be, that at two elite institutions, DEI deans acted in a manner contrary to free speech, and placed their deans in intractable crises? Eldik and Steinbach apparently thought they were following university policy. They were so, so wrong. Still, this perspective certainly cannot be limited to Yale and Stanford. I suspect DEI deans across the country were quietly snapping along with Steinbach.
Thus, a foundational question: is DEI, as understood by Steinbach and Eldik, consistent with the mission of higher education? I think the answer has to be no. Michael McConnell, the only right-of-center scholar at Stanford, made this point sharply in WSJ:
Nor is it possible to ignore the damage that university diversity bureaucracies can do to the scholarly values of liberal education. Diversity and inclusion are of course good things, but neither value is advanced by partisanship and censorship.
Dean Martinez hinted at this problem:
The university's commitment to diversity, equity, and inclusion can and should be implemented in ways that are consistent with its commitment to academic freedom and free speech. See Marc Tessier-Lavigne and Persis Drell, Advancing free speech and inclusion, (Nov. 11, 2017), https://quadblog.stanford.edu/2017/11/07/advancing-free-speech-andinclusion/. Indeed, for the reasons explained below, I believe that the commitment to diversity, equity, and inclusion actually means that we must protect free expression of all views.
Again, how could it be that well-trained DEI Deans at elite institutions can have such a fundamentally flawed vision of the purpose of an academic institution? And what are these DEI staff teaching law students? Indeed, Steinbach doubled-down on her position in the WSJ:
Diversity, equity and inclusion plans must have clear goals that lead to greater inclusion and belonging for all community members. How we strike a balance between free speech and diversity, equity and inclusion is worthy of serious, thoughtful and civil discussion. Free speech and diversity, equity and inclusion are means to an end, and one that I think many people can actually agree on: to live in a country with liberty and justice for all its people.
Compare what Martinez said with what Steinbach said. Martinez wrote from a classical liberal perspective: DEI "actually means that we must protect free expression of all views." Free expression is the ends, and DEI is one of many means of getting there. Steinbach wrote from a utilitarian perspective: free speech and DEI are both "means to an end" to achieve "liberty and justice." For Martinez, free speech prevails over DEI. For Steinbach, free speech and DEI are both mere tools that are subordinate to some amorphous concept of "liberty and justice" (presumably defined by progressives like Steinbach). And when free speech does not lead to DEI, then the free speech must be subordinated. Steinbach made this point explicitly. She questioned whether the harm from Duncan's speech justified his presence. In other words, where the juice is not worth the squeeze, you don't squeeze. Steinbach is unrepentant, and preaching from the DEI gospel. Again, I presume many DEI deans who read the Wall Street Journal were quietly snapping along.
Martinez, thankfully, rejects the notion that the University can even agree on what "liberty and justice" means. The University should avoid taking any institutional positions:
At the same time, I want to set expectations clearly going forward: our commitment to diversity, equity, and inclusion is not going to take the form of having the school administration announce institutional positions on a wide range of current social and political issues, make frequent institutional statements about current news events, or exclude or condemn speakers who hold views on social and political issues with whom some or even many in our community disagree. I believe that focus on these types of actions as the hallmark of an "inclusive" environment can lead to creating and enforcing an institutional orthodoxy that is not only at odds with our core commitment to academic freedom, but also that would create an echo chamber that ill prepares students to go out into and act as effective advocates in a society that disagrees about many important issues.
I could not agree more. Universities do not pursue any orthodoxies like "liberty and justice," however defined. Universities provide a place in which ideas can flourish. Moreover, most of these statements are, at best virtue signaling, and at worst, embrace a substantive position on a matter of public debate. The university must remain neutral in the battle of ideas. All juice is worth the squeeze.
Higher education faces an inflection point. Stanford is just the cardinal in the coal mine. Deans must choose whether to allow DEI to erect their own fiefdoms that will tower over a school's academic mission. Or Deans, like Martinez, can restore the proper balance of powers between academic departments.
In a future writing, I will offer some suggestions of how universities can confine the jurisdiction of DEI officers to prevent a repeat of what happened at Stanford. A preview: faculty who care about academic inquiry will have to get their hands dirty. This juice will be worth the squeeze.
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Was there some explanation in that mess to justify swapping the canary in the coal mine for a cardinal?
The canary identifies as a cardinal. It's very woke.
The one joke, dutifully supplied by BL.
The Stanford athletic teams are known as the Cardinal. That is Cardinal, singular, not plural like the Louisville Cardinals or the Ball St. Cardinals. For Stanford, Cardinal refers to the color red, not to the bird.
To quote the school website: "The nickname for Stanford is the Cardinal – in reference to one of the school colors (and is therefore in the singular). Stanford’s history with its nickname began on March 19, 1891 when Stanford beat Cal in the first Big Game. While Stanford did not have an official nickname, the day after the Big Game local newspapers picked up the "cardinal" theme and used it in the headlines."
Wait a minute, Stanford website ... weren't Stanford teams the "Stanford Indians" from the 30s through the early 70s?
I would hope this would be obvious, but 1981 was after the early 70s.
Are you dyslexic?
Does the bird even live on the West coast?
The northern cardinal (Cardinalis cardinalis) is a bird in the genus Cardinalis; it is also known colloquially as the redbird, common cardinal, red cardinal, or just cardinal (which was its name prior to 1985). It can be found in southeastern Canada, through the eastern United States from Maine to Minnesota to Texas, New Mexico, southern Arizona, southern California, and south through Mexico, Belize, and Guatemala.
"Stanford’s history with its nickname began on March 19, 1891 when Stanford beat Cal in the first Big Game. While Stanford did not have an official nickname, the day after the Big Game local newspapers picked up the “cardinal” theme and used it in the headlines.” "
Unmentioned, they used to be Indians, pre-Woke. The red uniforms were probably associated with THAT, but we make progress towards 1984 now and were ALWAYS at war with
OceaniaIndian logos.Let’s judge people by the color of their skin
I am sure the rev would agree
Not much is more insufferable than a whining clinger, angling to provide safe spaces for bigots and dogma in the modern world.
Pond Scum Artie complaining about “insufferable whining” is SO funny!
Soon he'll be complaining about others' lack of new materiel.
Grammar aside, please don't.
"Please don't" aside, what is your grammatical objection to "In a future writing" ?
That, in some way that I can't quite put my finger on, "a writing" is extremely awkward.
It does seem to be an unusual construction.
It's hard to tell if it refers to an instance of the action, "writing", or to the product of the action. I can't say I've never seen this construction before, but I can say I've never seen any point to it.
I have seen it, though generally in older works. It's the same as saying "in a future article" or "in a future letter" but without the commitment that the future writing will actually be published specifically as an article, letter, book, blog post, tweet or other media.
I found the wording quaint but neither awkward nor especially unusual.
Exactly. Though I might describe the usage as "educated" rather than "quaint"
And even if you don't like the choice of word, there's nothing wrong with the grammar.
There's nothing odd about the construction - it's just "writing" used as a noun.
"Marx's writings betray a very loose grasp of arithmetic"
"Blackman's writings contain innumerable examples of his pomposity"
etc
It’s just a noun. Not one I favor, but not terribly objectionable.
As opposed to calling it a “construction”, which is wrong.
Do you like "a text"?
"Because me and many people in this administration do absolutely believe in free speech." It's bad enough that nowadays "I" is used as the object of verbs and prepositions by people who should know better. Using "me" as the subject of a sentence ought to be grounds for firing, even if Ms. Steinbach had done nothing else objectionable.
Is she just ignorant or is she getting a pass for speaking Black English?
“Martinez, thankfully, rejects the notion that the University can even agree on what “liberty and justice” means.”
It seems that “Some Come Running” to analyze Dean Martin[ez]’s remarks.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Some_Came_Running_(film)
I’m not sure Dean Martin[ez] disavowed the ability to define liberty and justice.
I certainly *hope* the University and the law school have some idea of their purpose (or if you’ll let me be pretentious, their telos), and that this purpose is connected to promoting liberty and justice. I mean, shouldn’t the students be taught that there are principles of liberty and justice undergirding the laws they learn? Shouldn’t they be encouraged to help the law serve those principles?
Or are we to be governed by Stanford graduates, and other elite folks, who are pure positivists, glorying in their will to power and their ability to lord it over their inferiors?
A few random comments from a combat veteran...
First, while this stuff may be new to law schools, it is not new to academia -- I was personally dealing with it 20-30 years ago. Ann Coulter at Smith College comes to mind -- the 115 lb female undergrads were intimidated by the 180 lb female lesbians, but the latter were intimidated by the taller young men from UMass.... 🙂
I would have insisted that the DIE dean attend, not only invite her but insisted she be there because she couldn't say that (a) she didn't know what happened or (b) that she couldn't stop it if she WAS there. I've seen to much of the "If only I had been there, I would have done something" -- so you insist she BE there.
You need to play hardball with these people and make it clear that their jobs are on the line -- that it is THEY and not "the students" who will be blamed if something happens.
And you need to remember that they'd encourage the mob to kill you if they thought they'd get away with it.
You are going into combat -- there are different rules of engagement, ie no gun, but it very much is combat and don't ever think otherwise.
That's the horror of it. University administrators with benign-sounding titles ("diversity," "inclusion," etc.) are inciting student mobs against "undesirables," much like Nazi professors would incite their students against Jews, until the students dutifully threw the hated Jews out of windows.
Perhaps Mao and his Red Guards would be more apt than the Nazis.
On the other hand, perhaps that's a distinction without a difference.
Who are the undesireables you're referring to? We know YOU guys class drag shows and trans people that way. The fact that the Nazis did to them what they also did to the Jews never seems to bother you much, and the connection is direct and historical instead of your dark inferences.
If you want to know who Steinbach was inciting the mob against you need merely read her words.
She's illiterate, but not indecipherable.
'And you need to remember that they’d encourage the mob to kill you if they thought they’d get away with it.'
No mob has been encouraged to kill anyone. Except for Trump, a few times.
"Except for Trump, a few times."
Facts not in evidence.
There was Jan 6th, the post-Mar-A-Lago promises of civil war, and the latest 'Violence and destruction!' ranting.
Your mischaracterizations are not evidence of anything except your dishonesty.
In the last decade however, there has been a change. ...
The paragraph following this may feel satisfying to write, and may appeal to a certain contingent, but it is, by all appearances, devoid of any factual support. You're just riffing here, Josh, pointlessly.
Much has been said about what Dean Tirien Steinbach said. But a better question is why was she the one to speak? ...
It's not really a mystery, when you understand why the "protesting" students in the room were angry at Duncan, in the first place.
In a future writing, I will offer some suggestions of how universities can confine the jurisdiction of DEI officers to prevent a repeat of what happened at Stanford. ...
There is a deep irony in a "law professor" claiming to care about norms of free and open inquiry promising "suggestions" for constraining DEI-related campus speech. Though not, of course, one that you could ever hope to appreciate on your own, Josh.
And again with this insipid "juice" metaphor. Do you know how I know you're a hack, Josh? Do you know how I know that you don't genuinely care about any of the issues you write about, and are really just an ambitious troll trying to leave his mark on the field? It's the creation and endless repetition of these not-very-good "memes," which you hope will catch on and be traceable back to you. You couldn't claim "shadow docket," so it was on to "epicycles" and now "juice worth the squeeze." It's like some juvenile notching his initials into a tree trunk or patch of wet cement. You don't care about winning people over with the quality of your ideas or prose, because it's clear you're not talented in either of those respects. You're just hoping that, if you repeat yourself endlessly enough, it'll start to get picked up by clueless journalists and law students.
You clearly don't understand the concept of free speech if you think limiting jurisdiction of an administrator is constraining free speech.
Do you also think it's a free speech issue that the football coach can't call plays for the basketball team?
I understand "the concept of free speech," which is why I note the strange irony of seeking to limit the "jurisdiction" of DEI bureaucrats so that their points of view don't inflect or otherwise shape campus discourse. Josh himself commends the Stanford dean's declaration of fealty to the liberal orthodoxy, and believes that orthodoxy should govern in higher education, without taking a single moment to reflect on whether it is an orthodoxy.
Those words were spoken in the midst of the debacle by Dean Steinbach herself — in the very exchange Josh described in the sentence before he used the phrase himself.
Were you minimally aware of the subject matter instead of just here grinding out another post about how you can’t stand Josh, you might have skipped this one. Or maybe you just can’t help yourself, and the facts just don’t matter.
Ah, so he can't lay claim to even that metaphor.
Who, other that you, said he was? At a longer glance than this deserves, the phrase apparently dates back to the 1800s. Apparently you haven't heard it before, but instead of spending 15 seconds educating yourself you just blindly assumed it was good fodder for your latest anti-Josh rant.
We call it derangement syndrome for a reason.
For god's sake, read my comments if you're going to respond to them. I'm done with this digression.
Yes indeed, sir -- my comments were directly responsive to your opening froth-fest, where you stated:
Did you honestly think throwing a haughty-sounding rejoinder over your shoulder would camouflage you retreating with your tail between your legs? Or was that just the best way you could come up with to try to save face?
Prof. Blackman has recycled that one a few times, after seeing the dean's comment, you bigoted, sycophantic rube.
Which was precisely my point, Artie. Your reading comprehension certainly is poor for someone of your alleged station.
Not sure you can expect to derive much predictive power from someone's "station", if said station is self-appointed.
You were wrong about "epicycles," too - he didn't claim that one for himself, either, so your thesis suffers another blow -
https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Adding_epicycles
I'm quite familiar with where Josh got the actual term from, as he explained it himself when he introduced it as a way of critiquing the last several decades of Roe. You don't seem to understand what I'm saying about it.
You referred to "the *creation* and endless repetition of these not-very-good 'memes,'" etc. [emphasis added]
SimonP: "And again with this insipid “juice” metaphor..."
https://stanforddaily.com/2023/04/05/judge-duncan-stanford-law-school-explained/
If Blackman is a "hack", what is one to make of the ignorant and insipid SimonP?
We don't need Normal Schools.
What is taught in Trachers Colleges isn't worth teaching to anyone.
In fact it's a detriment to anyone who falls into their clutches.
"Still, the work of admissions offices and hiring committees was front-loaded. These organizations did not have any impact on the curriculum, and what was actually taught in the classroom."
Personnel is policy. They knew that, and concentrated on getting entrenched before making any further moves that might warn people where things were going.
This has been the left's SOP in taking over institutions since before Conquest first announced his three laws: Concentrate on getting positions that control who is hired, then hire only allies, and wait until you have a controlling majority before striking.
Mind, in a lot of these universities, this is the second time through this cycle: Not the left taking over neutral institutions, but the ultra-left taking over leftwing institutions. You'd think the people they were taking them over from would remember how they'd done it in the first place, and be on the lookout. I suppose too caught up in "No enemies to the left" to be alert to the danger.
Take a look at this comment:
https://reason.com/2020/12/20/would-the-aclu-still-defend-nazis-right-to-march-in-skokie/?comments=true#comment-8649081
Could it be that universities' "strong commitments to diversity" itself has played a role in setting up the current illiberal moment?
"Mind, in a lot of these universities, this is the second time through this cycle"
No, THIRD time through the cycle — or at least the third generation of “tenured radicals.
The first generation were the radicals of the late 1960s who were the junior faculty of the 1980s and who had tenure by 1990. They called themselves the “tenured radicals” and this is when academic craziness first started to make the national news. The National Association of Scholars was founded in 1987, Doe v U-MI was 1989, the Water Buffalo incident was 1993, and FIRE was founded in 1999 (in response to both the Water Buffalo incident and the book that Kors/Silverglate wrote in 1998).
The second generation were the graduate students of the initial “tenured radicals” and this is when you started to see a lot more administrators being hired — and the existing administrators now needing master’s degrees (if not doctorates) to do jobs that had been done by people with no college degree at all.
Graduate school admissions, unlike undergrad or law school admissions, is highly individualized and the tenured radicals were willing to serve on admissions committees — and applied litmus tests in multiple dimensions.
The initial “tenured radicals” had an explicitly stated belief of “they will die” — that the older traditional professors would eventually either retire or die, and be replaced by their politically correct graduate students. And they were — Gen X replaced those who had been born in the 1930s, and as the litmus tests had been applied to entry to grad school a decade earlier, this generation was to the left of even the “tenured radicals.”
And now we have “Obama’s Children” — while he was only President from 2009 to 2016, it really started with claims that Bush/Cheney had stolen the 2000 election and eight years of protesting them, along with four years of protesting Trump — so you have 20 years of truly pathological indoctrination and to understand the Millennials, I encourage people to read Stephen King’s _Children of the Corn_.
Brett is right about them being “ultra-left” but it is more than just the consequences of a second generation of inbreeding — they are pathological. *So* pathological that they are scaring the Gen X leftists — it isn’t just the fallacy of “no enemy to the left” but their jaw-dropping ruthlessness.
I’m just guessing here, but my suspicion is that the Law Dean is in her 50s-60s and the DIE dean her 30s-40s, Gen X v. Millennial.
Steinbach said in her piece at WSJ: "How we strike a balance between free speech and diversity, equity and inclusion is worthy of serious, thoughtful and civil discussion."
No. I'm not going to be held hostage by DIE in regards to my free speech principles. There is no "striking a balance" and no need for any "discussion".
I was glad to see that out of the thousands of comments at the WSJ on her op-ed, I only recall seeing one or two that supported Ms. Steinbach. Even after having two weeks to dwell on her actions and statements to Judge Duncan, and an opportunity to learn about the First Amendment from someone more knowledgeable than her on the subject, Ms. Steinbach remains clueless.
DIE is killing higher education. Unless faculty members want to see their well-paying and privileged positions go the way of Block-buster employees, the professors better ban together to push these departments out of their institutions. If they fail to do so, maybe they should learn to code.
I think that, at this point, most of the existing institutions of higher education are irremediably broken. The only real solution is to create new ones, and be very careful in staffing them so they don't start out infected.
Shutting off the Federal money -- and being very careful about reopening the spigot -- would work wonders. I doubt that even Harvard could last long without ongoing access to the Federal largess.
If we can get to the point of shutting off the Federal money, I don't see any good reason to open the spigot again.
Harvard has the largest endowment in the world, over $50B. They're the Platonic ideal "Trust fund that runs a university on the side". Forget federal largess, they just charge tuition for shits and giggles. Financially, they could get not one cent of additional income going forward, and not even feel it.
they just charge tuition for shits and giggles. Financially, they could get not one cent of additional income going forward, and not even feel it.
Bullshit.
Some numbers.
The University’s operating expenses increased by $464 million or 9%, to $5.4 billion for fiscal year 2022.
In 2022 they drew about $2 billion from their endowment. That's 4%, which is around the prudent limit.
If we can get to the point of shutting off the Federal money, I don’t see any good reason to open the spigot again.
Harvard got about $650M from federal research grants. Who needs all that research, anyway? We might find out we are wrong about something.
Well, I admit I was wrong: I had no idea Harvard was so spendthrift.
Bet you also didn't know about their 69% Research Overhead Rate -- see: https://research.fas.harvard.edu/indirect-costs-0#fed
What this means is that if Professor Brett gets a $100,000 Federal grant to study something, the Feds *also* send Harvard a $69,000 check that Harvard can spend on anything it wants.
And they're getting $448.5M in those checks annually, along with students paying with Federal FinAid money -- loss of those two alone would be felt.
Indirect costs are limited to specific things, not 'anything Harvard wants.'
The cost of electricity, maintenance, etc. to run a lab is nontrivial, and required to perform a grant. This is a negotiated rate based on that understanding.
Do you think Harvard isn't delivering on the research funding we give them?
"Do you think Harvard isn’t delivering on the research funding we give them?"
Absolutely, positively, for sure, no questions asked, without a doubt we are not getting our monies worth out of Harvard or most other research funding.
What gives you such certainty?
The anti-intellectualism of the right never ceases to amaze.
Yeah. Shut down the universities. That's the way to Make America Great Again.
Fucking morons.
When the "elite" schools are staffed (or at least administered) by the likes of Dean Steinbach ...
(But, for the record, I'd be against public funding of higher education even if all the schools were staffed by intellectual luminaries. It's a matter of respecting the taxpayers (citizens), not disrespecting intellectual endeavor.)
No Ed, we need Normal Schools and we need A&M Schools and they need to be public -- that was shown in the 19th Century when people were far more protective of the taxpayer's dime.
Normal Schools are teacher's colleges -- they train K-12 teachers (and hopefully educate them a bit as well). A&M is the "Scientific Agriculture & Mechanical Arts" (Engineering) of the Morrill Land Grant College Acts -- we still need engineers to build roads and bridges and string power lines and the rest.
I can see a few other things that the public has an interest in having public institutions for, eg nursing.
Yeah, you're fucking morons, that much I agree about. Totally dedicated to always putting the worst/stupidest interpretation on anything somebody who disagrees with you says.
We need higher education. Any particular institution of higher education, OTOH, is entirely dispensable.
Look, all things decay, and get replaced, and life goes on. No reason to think universities would be the sole exception.
Totally dedicated to always putting the worst/stupidest interpretation on anything somebody who disagrees with you says.
Hey, Brett...
You need higher education as dictated by Ron DeSantis and a bunch of Christian fundamentalists.
bernard11 : “The anti-intellectualism of the right never ceases to amaze.”
Another amazing feature of today’s Right is their addition to unhinged hysteria. Rightists love to wallow in frenzied emotional takes so excessive the planet Earth is a tiny pinprick light years away. Look at the “most of the existing institutions of higher education are irremediably broken” shlock above. I’m pretty certain very campus woke / DIE / political correctness brouhaha appears in this forum, usually with 7-10 post devoted to each. Collected together, they’re not a single drop in the ocean of America’s higher education. But our Rightists shriek, wail, rage and sob like fools. “DIE is killing higher education” someone above says. No it’s not. Get a fucking grip.
DIE is like Mercury or PCBs -- it doesn't take much to poison a lake or river.
Dr. Ed 2 : “DIE is like Mercury or PCBs — it doesn’t take much to poison a lake or river”
I think we’re dealing with a volume much, much smaller than oceans (my metaphor), or lakes / rivers (yours). The only think “poisoned” is the cranial cavities of right-wingers. Question : Do even you take this wild-eyed talk seriously? I can’t see how such a complete divorce from reality is possible, even given the (oceanic) self-indulgence of today’s Right.
Just recently, your handlers had their sheep in panicked rage over the threat of trans people. I saw multiple calls for them to be “eradicated”, as if the tiny percent of people who are trans weren’t the same minuscule numbers that existed five years ago, ten years, fifty years. And before that, the Right’s hive mind was docilly “enraged” about CRT in the public schools. This was a complete fantasy, but that didn’t stop the sheeple from being obediently hysterical. You people are SO damn easy to manipulate.
And check out the rhetoric : “Poisoned” “Infected” “Eradicated” I guess if you’re going wallow in bullshit about nebulous Conspiratorial Evil, then fascist-style rhetoric about social entities being diseased automatically follows. It ain’t a good look though.
Not knowing the difference between a man and a women may be "intellectualism," but being an "intellectual" used to be a pejorative and is quickly becoming one again.
“There are some ideas so absurd that only an intellectual could believe them.”
― George Orwell
Conservatives are welcome to all go to GMU. I thought you guys were big fans of competition?
I didn't say the woke universities should be shut down, though if they're state universities, that might be for best if they can't be successfully reformed. Private universities? So long as they comply with the same civil rights laws everybody else is forced to obey, let them do what they want, on their own dime. Spoiler: They won't comply with them without being forced to, for serious values of force, because their warped consciences tell them they OUGHT to discriminate.
Sometimes you can't fix something, the best you can do is junk it and start over. I think some educational institutions have arrived at that point.
for serious values of force
Well, this isn't authoritarian at all.
Brett, they DO follow the law - DEI offices don't break any laws; private businesses have them as well.
I know you think all institutions are full leftist conspiracies, including the courts, but you being unhappy because BrettLaw isn't being followed won't trigger a Maximum Force scenario.
Nor will it trigger an end to our federals basic research enterprise. That thing which is the envy of the world, but which you and others on here want to end off of some culture war nonsense.
You know that's just bullshit. DIE offices are often openly, and almost uniformly at least covertly, engaged in racial discrimination.
Remember, "equity"? You can have equity, equal outcomes, or you can have equality, equal treatment, but you can't have both, and it's the equality that the civil rights laws mandate.
And by "diversity" they mean racial quotas. They hardly even bother pretending otherwise.
You know that’s just bullshit. DIE offices are often openly, and almost uniformly at least covertly, engaged in racial discrimination.
No, Brett, I don’t know that. As always, what you believe is not shared by everyone around the world and they’re all lying to you.
Your definition of discrimination is not widely shared, and is not any actual way the CRA’s text has ever operated.
And I *do* know equality. I've actually made a study of it, and work on it professionally.
Your sophistry aside, turns out actually engaging with our full talent base is a nuanced task, no. It’s not about seeking equal results; that’s like some early 1990s nonsense. It’s also not just about race and gender.
But you don’t really care; I have brought up actual practice in DEI offices and of CRT multiple times, and you just call me a liar.
And how do you explain what happened at Stanford? Just an outlier?
Why the hell you you think they use “Equity” and not “Equality” for the E in DIE, anyway?
Just to take one university at random, because it came up first in a google search, Here’s what the University of Iowa says about it: “Equity is different than equality in that equality implies treating everyone as if their experiences are exactly the same. Being equitable means acknowledging and addressing structural inequalities — historic and current — that advantage some and disadvantage others. Equal treatment results in equity only if everyone starts with equal access to opportunities.”
IOW, by “equity” they mean that they’re NOT going to treat people equally. Deliberately.
DIE departments are utterly devoted to the cause of racial discrimination, that's all they exist for.
Yes, Brett - it made headlines; that's a great sign it's an outlier.
You read Reason's anecdotes and assume you know statistics. You should be smarter than that, but you are not.
by “equity” they mean that they’re NOT going to treat people equally. Deliberately.
Just because you're not smart enough to see what people not situated like you are like, doesn't mean you get to demand everyone be as blinkered as you.
Your idea of equal treatment is hosing down every house on the block when one is on fire.
DIE departments are utterly devoted to the cause of racial discrimination, that’s all they exist for.
No. You're devoted to calling everything that isn't locking in the current power structure discrimination, because your ideological world is smooth as glass and never reality intrude.
Look, all things decay, and get replaced, and life goes on.
The idea that the culture war's winners -- who operate our strongest schools -- should care what bigoted, superstitious conservatives -- who operates a fleet of shit-rate campuses known for censorship, teaching nonsense, and bottom-of-the-barrel rankings -- is remarkable.
Why do conservatives think their betters are in the market for tips on operating schools? Because, as every Sunday morning indicates, these clingers are gullible enough to believe anything.
People who rely completely on anecdotes, supposition and grinding outrage-driven hostility want to renovate third level education
You'll have to forgive Sarc -- he is a raging racist and sexist.
When Democrats said "segregation now, segregation forever" he really bought into it heart and soul -- it is who he is.
I think some educational institutions have arrived at that point.
Based on what? Some posts at the VC and maybe some other RW sites?
What makes you think you know shit about the state of American universities?
Based on what he’s posted about himself, here, Brett seems to be a middle-to-later aged white man with one or more school-aged children mothered by a woman significantly younger than himself, and who does some kind of independent contracting/consulting for a living. As such, his only apparent possible exposure to relatively recent college grads would seem to be his wife. Perhaps she’s a moron?
I think that, at this point, most of the existing institutions of higher education are irremediably broken.
Do you have any basis for thinking this, apart from the specific controversies that have been cherry-picked for your consumption by the outrage media?
Conservatives -- who turn the campuses they get their hands on into bottom-of-the-barrel hayseed factories marked by censorship, dogma, ignorance, superstition, discrimination, and shabby reputations -- are in no position to provide pointers to the liberal-libertarian mainstream, which operates our strongest research and teaching institutions by preferring reason, science, inclusiveness, and the reality-based world.
Carry on, clingers -- at Biola, Liberty, Wheaton, Ouachita Baptist, Regent, and the other clingerverse schools.
Rev, we understand you need to keep looking in the mirror to tell yourself you still got it. "Carry on."
The important thing to realize is that these social justice warriors aren't liberal Democrats, they are their own party. Their doctrines allow no dissent, they are actively committed to silencing any and all opposing views. In terms of their belief system, they are like a secular version of the Taliban. They are illiberal, irrational, and incapable of remorse or self-reflection.
In short, their teachings are irrevocably opposed to the goals of higher education itself. It would be best to completely remove them from any positions of power. They should be treated as subjects of critical study only.
It was a genius that decided to adopt the bad principles of religions into the anti-racist canon:
1. If you are not with us, you are against us. Silence, or staying on the sidelines is opposition. Aka you are in service to the devil.
2. To even question the received wisdom is itself a sin. Discussion of opposing viewpoints offends, and therefore justifies cancelation, firing, kicking out of school.
Sticks and stones may break my bones, but names allow me to use the power of government to silence (those at the top of my echo chamber have informed me are) my enemies.
I'm sure there are some on the left who think like this, but it's quite a strawman to posit that all DEI offices think like this.
In fact, it's almost like you yourself are what you are decrying...questioning your characterization of DEI is itself a sin. And, of course, commenters here all want to silence these offices. sometimes silence higher education entierly!
Look, DIE was born racist. They took O'Connor's permission to discriminate as long as 'diversity' was the excuse, and ran with it.
DIE has been about racial discrimination from the very start. An excuse to racially discriminate that wouldn't ever expire.
Look: you don't know what you're talking about. Your ideology is authoring facts that are untrue.
And thus you arrive at wrecking our higher education system because you're not really dealing in reality, but in some platonic ideal of evil liberalism doing hidden plots all over the place.
Maybe don't worry so much about what disaffected, gullible, bigoted, on-the-spectrum Republicans think about anything, let alone education?
'Look, DIE was born racist'
And yet all the racists hate it. How odd.
Sarcastro is a racist and he loves DIE
Sarcastro is a racist as defined by right-wing resentment and grievance, therefore not a racist at all.
Horse-manure.
Racism is wrong, yet he will not condemn it, much less racial discrimination.
Democrats are as they ever were.
He will not condemn your attempt at culture war reframing of what racism is.
Racism is racism -- period.
Defending racism is not a good look.
DEI is not going anywhere. It is juvenile and naive to think otherwise. DEI is so deeply ingrained in society, that is now impossible to remove. It's not only deeply ingrained in the universities and schools. It is everywhere, from politics to the banks, to the PTA and school boards, to professional organizations like the AMA and ABA, to the boards of corporations and their law firms, marketing, and accounting firms, and of course the media. It is everywhere. Talk to anyone with money and/or power, and they will be acolytes of DEI, with few exceptions. It is not normal to think otherwise.
Now replace DEI in your paragraph with "Jim Crow". Seventy five years ago the folks with the same thought patterns were performing exactly the same mental gymnastics and rationalizations and reaching the same conclusions.
We eventually got rid of Jim Crow and we will eventually get rid of DEI. It just might take a while.
I do recall when people posting how we should destroy our university system on the Internet ended Jim Crow.
You lot are not really worthy of the comparison to the Civil Rights movement, for any number of reasons, among them how you are ridiculously claiming white oppression.
You’re quite correct, only whites have anything to fear from this ideology.
On another subject, Brooklyn is selling off its bridge, and I think I can get you a good price for it. Interested?
Only racists have anything to fear from this ideology.
If Sarcastro doesn't want the bridge, I'll let you have it cheap.
Lol he thinks he owns Brooklyn Bridge.
You can slippery slope all you want, it's not going to make you MLK.
If this is what the *top* of the slope looks like, I'd rather not see the bottom.
What does that have to do with anything ? It doesn't seem to have anything to do with the conversation except being injected there by the Badfaith Bozo as a neat talking point.
What a stunningly powerful argument ! There is no discrimination because some partizan tool says states it is so.
You are wrapping your anti-DEI reactionaryism in the cloak of MLK's movement. I think that's a very bad comparison, and said so.
We don't have a disagreement on facts, we have on of definitions. Mine has been used since the Civil War, including the CRA.
Yours is not really widely used, except for those trying to argue the CRA either says what it does not, or is bad.
Good luck with the side of history you are on. Pro white, anti-black, and reactionary.
I said absolutely nothing about MLK’s movement. That’s all a product of the echoing emptiness that is the space between your ears. The fact that my questioning of your holy DEI faith is labeled as “reactionary” means about the same. Honesty is not your defining characteristic.
Well of course. You don’t do ideas. You do narratives. Claim you have won the argument by redefining things all you want. The bottom line is that when idiots such as yourself try to argue definitions the proper response is “screw you bozo”. It’s not up to a badfaith git like yourself to define terms for everyone else.
Your descriptions are as accurate as everything else about you. Cheap, dishonest and in pure bad faith. Isn’t now the point that you whinge about “using my telepathy” after trying to tell me what I believe ?
While it is all too easy to look at DIE from a narrow point of view (and the same is true for many things) I am compelled to point out that James Carville was correct in his claim that "It's the economy stupid."
While most economists are predicting a hard landing there are some that view that as looking through rose colored glasses. At some point years of zero interest rates and borrowing money the government has limited ability to pay back will come home to roost. Not to mention that the war in Ukraine has a real possibility of spreading (a war the US is paying for with borrowed money not to mention depleting our military stock piles; Ukraine has used more rockets in one 48 hour period than the US used the whole time it was pissing away money in Iraq).
Already paying for college is at least close to the breaking point and forgiving student loans seems to be at least stalled if not out of the question. Say what you want about Jim Crow but there was never the level of public spending on Jim Crow that DIE now requires. In fact Jim Crow probably decreased government spending (even if it also probably had a negative influence on economic growth).
Point is that like it or not as Maggie T said 'at some point you run out of other peoples money to spend'. DIE may not be the first thing on the cutting block but it will not be far behind.
I dunno, all financial crashes have been caused by capitalist dickheads being capitalist dickheads, which they are rewarded for through bailouts paid for by cuts to public spending. So you're darkly warning that capitalists are sure to crash the economy again and get rewarded for it, so just you watch out, public universities!
I'm glad you managed to find a way in which Jim Crow was actually better than DEI. Really good work there.
Nige part of the reason your post does not carry much weight with me is we have not agreed on the definition of "capitalist" though I do understand your adding the word dickhead to capitalist may leave you an out.
To me a capitalist system would mean SVB would have to go bite a big red donkey dick and Oprah would be out the $US580,000,000 she had deposited there less the $US250,000 that was insured. Of course Biden's appointee Yellen is the one who agreed to pay the 580 million to Oprah along with the pinko commie creeps from China who also had big bucks deposited there. Not to mention that Yellen has never been noted as a big fanboy of capitalism and is rather noted for being a lapdog for the dems and someone the pubs never supported.
Not that pubs have always been better than the dems in moving towards a more capitalistic system, the pubs seem to just be dems light in socialist policies in terms of the too big to fail bullshit. In real capitalism if shitheads drive a company out of business the government does not step in to support them like Biden and Yellen have done.
We can only go into economic crashes under capitalism as it exists, not capitalism as you wish it would be. That a capitalist system protects the wealthy can only come as a shock to the hopelessly naive. If you think Biden and Co aren't capitalists, that's just you believing your own bullshit.
"We can only go into economic crashes under capitalism as it exists, not capitalism as you wish it would be. That a capitalist system protects the wealthy can only come as a shock to the hopelessly naive. If you think Biden and Co aren’t capitalists, that’s just you believing your own bullshit."
Like I said until there is agreement on definition of terms we are both talking past each other.
If you think Biden and Co picking winners and losers (EV and the solar energy bullshit) and bailing out their friends (like SBV) are indicators of being a capitalist you are welcome to your definition. But as I posted earlier my definition of capitalism is the ability to fail and not having the government put their finger on the scales of winners and losers. More and more both the dems and pubs are moving more towards wealth transfers to buy votes, not free markets to determine winners.
That's not the definition of capitalism and never has been. Capitalists have been engaged in government and regulatory capture since day one. It's intrinsic. They claim otherwise, of course, but that's propaganda, which you apparently believe. Capitalism, for example, has been engaged in an overwhelming campaign to prevent the development of alternative and sustainable sources of energy in favour of sources that are immensely profitatble but utterly destructive. That's capitalism.
This is absolutely backwards.
The administrator growth in salaries and numbers is a problem, and is driven by easy loans. But not the public loans - those are well limited compared to the private ones.
But no, student loans are not going to bring down the government.
And also invoking 'Jim Crow but more expensive' is such an irrelevancy, and so unserious, this is about the only place I can imagine it going over.
I never said student loan forgiveness would bring down the government; just that every little bit helps when you keep spending more money than you have.
Anyone who thinks the last fifty years or so since Nixon went full retard on fiat money has a happy ending is living in a fool's world.