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San Jose Unified School District Likely Discriminated Against Fellowship of Christian Athletes, Based on …
the FCA's requirement that leaders "abide by a Statement of Faith, which includes the belief that sexual relations should be limited within the context of a marriage between a man and a woman" -- so holds a Ninth Circuit's panel.
From Fellowship of Christian Athletes v. San Jose Unified School Dist., decided yesterday by the Ninth Circuit, in an opinion by Judge Kenneth Lee joined by Judge Danielle Forrest (it's on a preliminary injunction, so this is technically based on a finding of likelihood of success on the merits, but the panel majority seems pretty firm on the subject):
The Fellowship of Christian Athletes (FCA) requires students serving in leadership roles to abide by a Statement of Faith, which includes the belief that sexual relations should be limited within the context of a marriage between a man and a woman. The San Jose Unified School District … revoked FCA's status as an official student club at its high schools, claiming that FCA's religious pledge requirement violates the School District's non-discrimination policy….
The School District engaged in selective enforcement of its own non-discrimination policy, penalizing FCA while looking the other way with other student groups. For example, the School District blessed student clubs whose constitutions limited membership based on gender identity or ethnicity, despite the school's policies barring such restricted membership. The government cannot set double standards to the detriment of religious groups only….
We apply strict scrutiny to government regulations that burden religious exercise unless those laws are neutral and generally applicable. A law is not neutral and generally applicable if it is selectively enforced against religious entities but not comparable secular entities. "[W]hether two activities are comparable for purposes of the Free Exercise Clause must be judged against the asserted government interest that justifies the regulation at issue." … Finally, the "Government fails to act neutrally when it proceeds in a manner intolerant of religious beliefs or restricts practices because of their religious nature."
Under strict scrutiny, the government can prevail only if it shows that its restrictions on religion "are justified by a compelling interest and [are] narrowly tailored to advance that interest." Given that high bar, the defendants do not argue that their policies can pass muster under strict scrutiny; rather, they contend that strict scrutiny does not apply at all because their policies are neutral and generally applicable.
But the record before us shows that the School District's non-discrimination policies have been, and continue to be, selectively enforced against FCA. Other secular student groups maintain facially discriminatory membership criteria but enjoy ASB recognition. In short, the School District targeted FCA because of its religious-based views about marriage and sexuality, and not merely because of its alleged violation of non-discrimination policies….
The ASB-recognized Senior Women of Leland High School maintains a discriminatory membership criterion that violates the All-Comers Policy. The Senior Women Club's mission is to "connect the school's women with local events." The club's constitution limits membership based on gender identity. Even though the Senior Women Club explicitly stated its intention to exclude males from membership—i.e., that they intend to discriminate based on gender identity in violation of the All-Comers Policy—the School District still granted it ASB recognition. This alone shows selective enforcement by the School District.
To be clear, there may be very good reasons for the Senior Women Club to have restricted membership. A female-only group may enhance mentorship, camaraderie, and networking for its members. But the School District's All-Comers policy does not carve out exceptions for "benign" discriminatory membership rules. Simply put, the Senior Women Club's constitution violates the School District's All-Comers policy, yet the School District recognizes it as an ASB student club.
Still, the defendants argue that the Senior Women Club's discriminatory membership rule should be excused because the club agreed to comply with the All-Comers Policy when it signed the school's standardized club application form. The district court charitably said that there was "arguably some tension" between the Senior Women club's membership criteria and its affirmation of the All-Comers Policy. The district court then resolved this "tension" in the School District's favor because the plaintiffs had not proven that the Senior Women Club actually discriminates based on gender identity.
The district court clearly erred. First, the Senior Women Club's discriminatory membership criterion and the All-Comers Policy are not merely in "some tension." Rather, they are diametrically opposed to each other—only one can be true. Either membership is open only to female students or it is open to all students. And the club specified on the application form required by the School District for the 2021–22 school year that its membership was open only to "seniors who identify as female." We fail to see how this club can maintain its restrictive membership criteria while complying with the All-Comers Policy.
The district court relied on the boilerplate nondiscrimination statement in the club application form that the Senior Women Club's student leader signed as proof that the club does not discriminate based on gender identity. True, the boilerplate statement in this form does have the School District's required non-discrimination language in it. But the Senior Women club modified that form twice by handwriting in discriminatory membership conditions based on gender identity. First, as noted above, the Senior Women Club's leader handwrote that only "seniors who identify as female" can become members. To accentuate this point, she then handwrote that a student will no longer be considered a member if the student "is not a senior who does not identify as female." In other words, the Senior Women Club modified the terms of ASB participation when it inserted its gender-based membership conditions into its club application form submitted for ASB approval. And when the School District approved the Senior Women Club's application, it assented to the club's discriminatory condition.
Whether the plaintiffs can set forth specific instances when the Senior Women Club has discriminated against males is irrelevant under the School District's reasoning. The School District has repeatedly emphasized that the mere existence of FCA's religious beliefs was enough to deny ASB recognition, regardless of any affirmation to the contrary. And according to the School District, FCA will be denied recognition so long as it maintains its student leadership requirements, even though there is no evidence that FCA has ever denied a student leadership application because the student disagreed with FCA's statements of belief. So, whether the Senior Women Club actually discriminates is beside the point. The mere existence of the Senior Women Club's discriminatory criteria should likewise require denying it ASB recognition. But instead, the School District welcomed this club.
{We also question whether a club's mere affirmation that it will follow the All-Comers Policy is in fact meaningful. For example, Big Sisters/Little Sisters is obviously intended for female students only; it is unclear that a male student would or should try to serve as a mentor or seek guidance through this group. Big Sisters/Little Sisters may have affirmed the All-Comers Policy on the School District's form, but the club's name and mission is obviously gender-specific. At oral argument, the defendants' counsel highlighted how little the affirmation means: she conceded that a White nationalist group would not run afoul of the School District's All-Comers Policy or its Non-Discrimination Policy so long as the group signed the affirmation statement and club application form stating that anyone could join the group. Not only does such a formalistic litmus test fall short of serving the School District's goal of inclusiveness, but it appears to penalize student groups that are truthful about their mission and membership.}
The dissent criticizes us for crediting the plaintiffs' evidence of Senior Women Club's discriminatory membership policy because "it is not our role to find facts." We agree that such fact finding would be inappropriate if there was any real dispute that the Senior Women maintain discriminatory membership criteria. But the School District admits that the discriminatory criteria exists and "under the District's policy the … activities director should have required the Senior Women Club to clarify or modify their handwritten characterization of their members or else disapproved the application." We are not required to shut our eyes to "uncontested facts" found within the record….
[The School District has also] repeatedly looked the other way when secular ASB organizations maintained discriminatory membership and leadership criteria that violated the School District's policies before the All-Comers Policy went into effect during the 2021–22 school year [and while a previous Non-Discrimination Policy was in effect].
For example, Girl Talk and Big Sisters/Little Sisters limited membership to female-identifying students, which violated the Non-Discrimination Policy's prohibition against gender identity discrimination. The South Asian Club also "prioritize[d]" members who were South Asian. Yet these clubs retained ASB recognition because, as Pioneer's Activities Director admits, the school never received any complaints from students or teachers about these gender-or ethnicity-limited clubs.
The defendants argue that we cannot consider these past instances of selective enforcement of the then-controlling Non-Discrimination Policy when evaluating prospective relief because the School District has since implemented the "new" All-Comers Policy. We disagree. Past examples of selective enforcement inform whether the School District is still selectively enforcing the "new" All-Comers Policy because these two policies are effectively one and the same. Indeed, the School District's counsel at oral argument walked away from the assertion that the All-Comers Policy is "new": She represented that "[the All-Comers Policy] is not a change in practice … and what [the School District] was implementing in 2021 was a formalization of a long-standing practice of the School District."
In other words, the "new" policy is just a rebranding. The Non-Discrimination Policy and the All-Comers Policy are substantively identical. Based on their language, both policies purport to bar discrimination. Both policies also have the effect of excluding FCA from ASB while allowing secular groups that discriminate based on protected characteristics to maintain ASB status. And both policies were enacted and implemented by the same School District and Pioneer officials that expressed hostility towards FCA's religious views (more on that later)….
{The plaintiffs also argue that the School District's policies facially violate the EAA, and their First Amendment rights of free speech, association, and free exercise of religion. The School District responds that this position conflicts with binding precedent. In Christian Legal Society v. Martinez (2010), the Supreme Court held that an All-Comers Policy identical to the School District's here did not run aground of the EAA or the First Amendment. [This might be a mistake as to the EAA, which I don't think CLS v. Martinez mentioned. -EV] We also held that similar non-discrimination policies do not violate the EAA or First Amendment. See Alpha Delta Chi-Delta Chapter v. Reed (9th Cir. 2011); Truth v. Kent School Dist. (9th Cir. 2008). The plaintiffs reply that our decision in Truth only approved of non-discrimination policies as applied to student members but not its leadership and rely on Hsu v. Roslyn Union Free Sch. Dist. No. 3 (2d Cir. 1996), which held that impeding a group's ability to exclude non-Christians from leadership positions violated the EAA. We need not decide these issues or address the plaintiffs' and certain amici's argument that intervening Supreme Court decisions have undercut Martinez and Truth because we hold that the plaintiffs will likely prevail on their as-applied challenges.}
Judge Lee also wrote a separate concurrence, just for himself, focusing on what he saw as evidence of religion-based hostility on the part of School District decisionmakers:
Under the First Amendment, the government must "proceed in a manner neutral toward and tolerant" of people's "religious beliefs." The School District contends that there is not a "whiff of antireligious animus" motivating its actions. The record, however, belies that assertion.
One schoolteacher called the Fellowship of Christian Athletes' (FCA) beliefs "bullshit" and sought to ban it from campus. Another described evangelical Christians as "charlatans" who perpetuate "darkness" and "ignorance." And yet another teacher denigrated his own student as an "idiot" for empathizing with FCA members who faced backlash from teachers and students.
This is not, to put it mildly, neutral treatment of religion. More than a whiff, a stench of animus against the students' religious beliefs pervades the Pioneer High School campus….
Pioneer's Climate Committee—the body that led the district-wide push for FCA derecognition—had members that expressed remarkably similar hostile statements. Peter Glasser was the most forthcoming about his contempt for FCA's religious beliefs. The day after learning about FCA's religious-based views on marriage and sexuality, Glasser channeled his inner Martin Luther, pinning the Statement of Faith and Sexual Purity Statement to his classroom whiteboard along with his grievances. But instead of a reformation, Glasser demanded an inquisition. As he explained in emails sent to Principal Espiritu, FCA's "bullshit" views "have no validity" and amount to heresy because they violated "my truth." Glasser believed "attacking these views is the only way to make a better campus" and proclaimed that he would not be an "enabler for this kind of 'religious freedom' anymore."
Glasser's desire to attack FCA's views makes plain that FCA, putting it charitably, was "less than fully welcome" on Pioneer's campus. Glasser's comments also improperly imputed insincerity to FCA's religious views by referring to their beliefs as an exercise in (air quotes) "religious freedom."
Glasser was not the only skeptic. Michelle Bowman also serves on the Climate Committee and as faculty advisor to the Satanic Temple Club. In discussing this lawsuit with a former student, she opined that "evangelicals, like FCA, are charlatans and not in the least bit Christian," and "choose darkness over knowledge and they perpetuate ignorance." But it is not for Bowman to dictate what beliefs are genuinely Christian. Id. at 1731 (The government cannot "pass[ ] judgment upon or presuppose[ ] the illegitimacy of religious beliefs."). Nor should the government disfavor religious-based beliefs, even if many may view them as not "acceptable, logical, consistent, or comprehensible."
With these two individuals in the room, the Climate Committee concluded that FCA's Statement of Faith and Sexual Purity Statement go against Pioneer High School's core values and that the Committee "need[s] to take a united stance" against FCA. The Committee's unity suggests there was little to no push back against Glasser and Bowman's views. So does the speed of the derecognition decision—two days later, Principal Espiritu informed FCA that they had lost recognition without giving FCA's students any opportunity to defend themselves or their organization. At least the baker in Masterpiece Cakeshop had a chance to be heard.
Equally telling was the continued hostility towards FCA even after it lost ASB recognition and thus could not possibly violate the School District's non-discrimination policies. In an effort "to ban FCA completely from campus," Glasser ginned up another potential "avenue" of attack during Summer 2019. He posited that FCA could be accused of violating the School District's sexual harassment policy by creating "a hostile work environment for students and faculty." In other words, teenagers—meeting privately to discuss the Bible—were creating a hostile work environment for adult faculty, according to Glasser. There is no indication in the record that Glasser's inimical view of FCA was rebuffed.
The defendants contend that any past animus is legally irrelevant for two reasons. First, they argue that the School District, and not the Climate Committee, made the decision to derecognize FCA, and this "decision was based solely on the club's violation of the [non-discrimination] policy." Second, they contend that past animus has no bearing on whether the plaintiffs are likely to suffer future harm—denial of ASB recognition—during the 2022–23 school year, when the School District's new All-Comers Policy is in force. The defendants are wrong on both points.
The School District is incorrect that our animus inquiry must be strictly limited to the actions or words of the "decisionmakers." As the Supreme Court held, we may assess "the historical background" and "specific series of events leading" to the decision in question. And the "historical background" and "series of events" leading to FCA's derecognition included animus against FCA's religious beliefs by multiple Pioneer officials….
The events preceding FCA's derecognition are of special importance here because the School District relied on receiving complaints in enforcing its Non-Discrimination Policy. Absent Glasser's call for action and pressure, the Climate Committee may have never broached FCA's Statement of Faith and Sexual Purity Statement and its ASB status. And but for the Climate Committee's "united stance" against FCA, the controversy would not have been escalated to the School District. So even if it was the School District that determined FCA was violating the Non-Discrimination Policy, the issue came to its attention as a result of Glasser's open hostility towards FCA's religious beliefs expressed to Principal Espiritu and the Climate Committee. The Climate Committee's "united stance" then catalyzed the School District's derecognition of FCA.
The defendants also cannot dismiss their past animus by relying on the newly-adopted All-Comers Policy. When Pioneer officials pushed to have FCA derecognized after the Climate Committee meeting, the plaintiffs were deprived of ASB recognition in violation of their Free Exercise rights. FCA had enjoyed ASB recognition for nearly two decades without controversy, and the School District's laissez-faire attitude to enforcing its Non-Discrimination Policy meant that FCA would likely retain recognition but for the Climate Committee's actions. As Pioneer's Activities Director admitted, renewal of ASB recognition for already-established clubs like FCA was a formality.
The defendants say their concerted effort to derecognize FCA should be excused because ASB approval is decided annually, and during the upcoming 2022–23 school year, the only relevant inquiry is whether the School District may properly deny FCA recognition for violating its All-Comers Policy. But as explained in the majority opinion, the defendants concede that FCA will not be approved while it maintains its faith requirements for student leaders, and the All-Comers Policy is inextricably linked to the Non-Discrimination Policy in force in Spring 2019.
Judge Morgan Christen dissented, arguing that there wasn't sufficient evidence that the FCA had standing to seek the injunction; if you're interested in the standing question, please do read the opinion. Here are a few passages, though, that go more to the substantive question:
The majority accepts plaintiffs' argument that the District selectively enforced its Policy because the District approved the Senior Women Club's ambiguous ASB application, which simultaneously affirmed compliance with the Policy and included a notation that "[m]embers are considered students who are seniors who identify as female." The majority brushes off the district court's factual finding that "there is no clear proof that the district allows the club to violate the Policy," or that the club actually discriminates. The district court did not ignore the ambiguity presented by the handwritten notation but recognized the District's approval may have been an oversight. The court's analysis demonstrates that it correctly limited its focus to how the Policy would operate prospectively. The majority's scattershot references to other clubs are also unavailing because the court found no club besides FCA has refused to sign the ASB Affirmation Form and there is no evidence that any other club discriminates….
Congratulations to Daniel Blomberg of the Becket Fund for Religious Liberty, who argued the case, and also Eric S. Baxter, Nicholas R. Reaves, Abigail E. Smith, and James J. Kim of Becket, Kim Colby of the Center for Law & Religious Freedom, Springfield, Virginia, and Christopher J. Schweickert of Seto Wood & Schweickert LLP.
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Bad news: You're asking the Ninth Circuit to protect conservative values.
Good news: You draw two Trump appointees on your panel.
The school can always seek en banc review to shred the First Amendment within that circuit.
It's sad that the dissent needs to argue that the school is in the right because a club merely has to lie about its practices to pass the filter applied in the current case -- as if the school wouldn't discriminate just as much when holding a group up to scrutiny for that.
Whatever the majority thinks, the case is too fact-intensive and not precedential enough for en banc reversal to be likely.
That sounds like good news for the victorious bigots!
NPC Alert.
If the headline hadn't said otherwise, I would be hard pressed to believe this was a decision from the Ninth Circuit.
Shakespeare has no reason to his mind about lawyers. Now add schoolteachers and administrators.
*change* his mind
I refer you to Pope's epigram: A little learning is a dangerous thing; Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring.
That was not "Shakespeare's mind about lawyers." Shakespeare thought exactly the opposite, which is why he put those words in the mouth of his villain.
Per Shakespeare in Hamlet; Brevity is the soul of wit... and yet the court found it necessary to issue an 83 page decision in this case.
Why?
Did you miss the part about ninth circuit?
Long winded opinions don't seem to be limited to the Ninth Circuit.
Presumably at least in part to make it a heavier lift for the en banc 9th Circuit to flip and thus decrease the appetite to try.
The opinion isactually 46 pages long (the last page has only two lines on it).
Is the good Rev on their school board? You queered your own case.
My difference is I agree with them, but wouldn't use the power of government to hamper or ban them.
And that's the thing. Unlike the views of a disturbing amount of people today, Constitutional protections aren't only for people I agree with or find pleasant. The previous post about Science Fiction notwithstanding, the US is not a Hive Mind.
While I generally agree with the decision, if in fact the school was lax on its own requirements for non-religious groups, I think it's important to remember that karma is a patient beast. The large number of Catholic schools in the US owes itself to how deeply protestantism was embedded in "secular" American life and public schools. "Under God" was added to the pledge to specifically exclude non-believers from being fully American. In other words, there's a long history denying constitutional protections based on religion in this country and only now, as religious diversity grows, do Protestants find themselves in the shoes of others.
I'm glad the court called the school out for not being impartial but I have a hard time finding empathy for a group hoisted by their own petard.
I was raised and educated Catholic, but have been a small "a" atheist for almost 40 years now, since my late teens.
Let me tell you, no religious group has seen as much exclusion and disregard as someone of no faith. There is no regard for sincerely held secular beliefs, no matter how deeply held those principals are.
You and I are alike, here. But I'm also gay, so that made things even more interesting.
" There is no regard for sincerely held secular beliefs, no matter how deeply held those principals are. "
That might be true in the can't-keep-up, downscale, rural and southern world; it is not my experience in modern, successful communities inhabited by educated, informed, reasoning, accomplished people.
NPC Alert.
IIRC fewer Americans would vote for an atheist candidate for president than for any candidate from a major religion, including Islam.
"You queered your own case."
Interesting turn of phrase.
"Identify as female", how can someone identify as a biological sex? Wasn't "woman" the term of gender and thus an alleged cultural construct, but "female" a term of biological immutability?
Oh that was back in 2021, it's 2022 now and Democrat Facist NewSpeak demands new realities be drawn.
Even in a court.
I am sure it will do real well when seeking medical treatment.
nature doesn't care what they identify as.
Even way back in 2020, you weren't allowed to refer to biological males as biological males, at least in some courts.
Good of Morgan Christen to straighten out the record on the KKK and their purported discriminatory practices. There is nothing by her standards proving they ever actually discriminated against anyone. How stupid or blinded by hatred do you have to be to actually argue along these lines against the record here.
What a fucked up mess this is. The decision should be easy and the dissent is ridiculous - “the SWC lied so why couldn’t the FCA”.
Not gonna even comment on the Satanic Temple Club.
And Glasser should be banned from being anywhere near a school. No telling what damage he’s done to teenagers privately. He’s a classic example of why we never want the progressives in power - “live and let live” is not allowed under their philosophy.
What is wrong with the Satanic Temple Club?
A high school having a Satanic Temple club, and it’s faculty advisor complaining about the Christian students’ club being “darkness,” is something so perfectly 2022 that a resurrected Tim Wolfe would’ve dismissed the idea as too obviously satirical.
*Tom Wolfe, obviously.
It’s Pythonesque.
The Satanic Temple is a "reason-based" religion that spends a lot of time drawing attention to government-sponsored religious bias in favor of Christianity. If real religious freedom is your goal, the Satanic Temple is your friend.
This is how liberals use power, ends justify the means.
Do you think they really want an "all comers policy" for student groups? Heck no. They just want an excuse to chase the "inconvenient" groups off campus and blatant viewpoint discrimination has been foreclosed an an avenue to do so. That won't stop an army of overpaid administrators though and their lawyer enablers.
The overall playbook these days does seem to be trending hard in the direction of broad, squishy rules, selectively enforced.
And sending in Antifa or other extra-legal foot soldiers when official actions aren't available.
The Revolution has already begun, just some people have yet to realize it.
The culture war is over, Jimmy. Not quite concluded, but settled.
Clingers hardest hit, deservedly so.
Ok Groomer.
Thank you for your continuing compliance with the preferences of better Americans, clingers.
We missed it because it wasn't televised.
This has always been the playbook. What's changed is that the WASP majority isn't as big of a majority as it once was and isn't always the beneficiary of "squishy rules, selectively enforced" like it used to be.
Ah, so it's a tactic we've endlessly railed against in the past, but now we can use it to stick it to Whitey so it's cool? Ouch.
Or, and this is just me spit-balling here, this is all just WASPy projection of victimhood brought on by the realization that other people's opinions and needs are starting to get equal attention.
Who are you people, and what have you done with the 9th Circuit Court?
All animals are equal, but some are "haters" by definition, so it's OK to discriminate against them.
I think this case was correctly decided. Schools cannot allow clubs and then discriminate by viewpoint.
That said, I'm old enough to remember when Christians used their political power to prevent gay clubs from forming; in fact, I argued a couple of those cases. And I will confess to feeling a certain amount of schadenfreude at Christians having done to them what they used to do to others (and, truth be told, probably still would if they had the political muscle to do so).
But my personal feelings aside, it was wrong when Christians did it, and it's wrong when progressives do it. Both sides need to review the First Amendment.
" (and, truth be told, probably still would if they had the political muscle to do so) "
This is a diminishing practical problem as reason, modernity, science, and inclusiveness continue to prevail against superstition, gullibility, religion, dogma, and conservatism at the modern American marketplace of ideas.
Yes. Straight from the legal school of "Two wrongs don't make a right".
I also agree the outcome is correct.
I'm a little concerned about the apparent shift in "free exercise" jurisprudence to the "purity test" concept of exercise. We're starting to take for granted that one "exercises" one's religion by rejecting other persons or behaviors. Here, the FCA "exercises" its right by requiring one to swear against gay marriage.
Can one "exercise" religion by requiring members to:
--swear against kosher principles?
--believe girls should not be educated in public schools?
--cyberbully non-mulsims and other infidels?
--interrupt others saying the pledge of allegiance because it's a violation of the Second Commandment?
--publicly berate black people?
--publicly refuse to interact with blue-eyed people?
At some point, these "exercises" (not all of which are improper, in my view) affect the secular educational mission of the school. Where are we placing that line?
What about human sacrifice? Surely religious freedom doesn't allow *that*!
Don't be too sure. What if there's a religion that practices voluntary ritualized human sacrifice? I'm not convinced Justice Gorsuch wouldn't have 5 justices to declare that it's a required MFN accommodation because the law permits secular people to disconnect feeding tubes from living humans who need them.
/sarcasm but not 100% confident is really is.
"exercises"
Most of those require one to do bad things [bully, interrupt, berate]. Here, its just agreeing to the platform of the group. Nobody outside the group is bothered.
I think that's the question. You seem to say the line between acceptable and unacceptable is "no doing bad" so long as "nobody else is bothered." Is that correct?
But that line wouldn't hold for:
--holding prayers at mid-field
--requiring belief that minorities are inferior
--refusing to interact with others of certain types.
Can one refuse to take a math class with specifically Mr. Goldberg because "Jews killed God"? Is that free exercise if everyone else has to take the luck of the draw?
Can one insist on having no women teachers because one's sub-sect of Christianity expects them not to be superior to men?
And by the way, cyberbullying is just Free Speech isn't it? Telling the infidel they will never enter heaven and should be burned alive in a cage is just free exercise, isn't it? Or did that cross the line because.... why?
To be clear, I see a big gap between "permitting one to do one's own religious activities and avoid certain anathema activities [e.g. saying the Pledge]" and "condoning intolerance in the name of free exercise."
If it's okay for the bakeshop guy to say "I'm not baking a cake for people I don't like" why isn't it okay for his kid to say "I'm not taking math from a Jew?"
No bakeshop guy has said "I'm not baking a cake for people I don't like". The guy in Colorado has explicitly said the opposite, that he's completely willing to bake the plaintiffs any cake they like, so long as it doesn't express a message he disagrees with. Which is the same standard he uses with people he does like. And in fact there's no indication that he doesn't like gay people.
I like gay people just fine, but I will not perform any service for them that would make me an accomplice in an act I consider wrong. I'll help them with their civil union or commitment ceremony, but not with anything they call a "marriage". And no court can force me to do so; the most a court can do is throw me in prison for refusing.
It is pure superstition that inclines in that direction, or is there something else?
Oh for Pete's sake.
What message does a white cake with no words and no symbols on it express? No message at all. Sometimes, it's just a freaking cake.
If the "message" is the use the customers put it to, then it isn't the baker making the statement. Otherwise, he's probably expressed the message that adultery is okay more than once.
This is ridiculous. We are talking about a club setting rules for who can hold office in that club. Not about being allowed to do things otherwise prohibited just because "my religion demands it".
Can one refuse to take a math class with specifically Mr. Goldberg? No, because in high school one can't refuse to take an assigned class for any reason. But if the school does allow students to pick and choose their classes, then it can't prevent someone from doing so because it doesn't like their motive, and this is especially so if that motive is mandated by their religion. If you allow one student to switch from Mr Goldberg to Ms Flanagan because "I would be more inspired by a female teacher", then you have to allow another one to do the same because "Christ's blood is on his head".
Used to? Probably still would?
May I introduce you to the "Don't Say Gay" laws?! What impact do you think that will eventually have on school-sponsored clubs?
"May I introduce you to the "Don't Say Gay" laws?!"
May I introduce you to unicorns?!
No such laws exist.
Bob, your comment would come as a huge surprise to the Governor of Florida, who signed a don't say gay bill into law this past legislative session.
No he didn't. Stop repeating propaganda.
Bob is correct. No, he didn't.
Bob is wrong. Yes he did.
Oh... this is fun.
Yes, what Krycheck_2 calls the "Don't Say Gay" bill is actually Florida House Bill 1557 (2022)- Parental Rights in Education. But if you insist he use its official name instead of a pejorative created by its opponents, then I assume you've never called the Affordable Care Act "Obamacare" or Defense Directive 1304.26, an executive order signed by Pres. Bill Clinton, "Don't Ask, Don't Tell", or any number of other laws or government orders or policies that their opponents labeled in a way to call attention to what they oppose about them.
The truth is that HB 1557 does limit what teachers and other school employees can say about gender and sexual orientation to students. Do you deny that? It is also vague enough about its proscriptions that school employees are likely to self-censor in ways that wouldn't hold up in court if such censorship was enforced. That is certainly intended by DeSantis and the Florida GOP that does his bidding.
That is why I agree with Krychek_2 that "Don't Say Gay" is a fair label for HB 1557, even if the law doesn't explicitly prohibit teachers from saying the word "gay".
None, because the so-called "Don't Say Gay" laws are about government speech, as expressed by government's paid representatives, while this case is about government discrimination against speech by private individuals, speaking in their private capacity, as members of private organizations that the government chooses to host.
So the government can make you say what it wants once they hire you, but can't ensure you're into it before they do?
That seems kinda perverse.
The government can control what speech you make, during the time when the government is paying you to make speech on their behalf, even if you real beliefs are entirely different?
Why, yes, that does sound fine to rational people. Why do you disagree?
Gullible gay-bashers have rights, too.
But not any right to have others accept an argument that a cloak of superstition improves that bigotry, or transforms the stale, ugly, conservative thinking into anything other than bigotry. At least, not among competent adults.
While the case came out the right way, it is unfortunate that the victory depends on the school's hypocrisy in relation to other clubs. A public institution has no right to insist on the ideology of any group.
The problem is in these two sentences:
The Fellowship of Christian Athletes (FCA) requires students serving in leadership roles to abide by a Statement of Faith, which includes the belief that sexual relations should be limited within the context of a marriage between a man and a woman. The San Jose Unified School District … revoked FCA's status as an official student club at its high schools, claiming that FCA's religious pledge requirement violates the School District's non-discrimination policy….
See what they did there. The club never said it would not admit anyone on the basis of sexual orientation. What it said is that you had to pledge adherence to their beliefs. A homosexual could very pledge to that belief, and even adhere to it by being celibate.
The conflation of discrimination on the basis of ideology and on the basis of identity is at the root of much of these problems. And it is used as a stick against religious organizations. That is where, in my opinion, there is a serious First Amendment problem.
Now let's look at the rest of the FCA's Statement of Faith:
We believe the Bible to be the inspired, the only infallible, authoritative Word of God.
We believe that there is only one God, eternally existent in three persons: Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
We believe in the deity of Christ, in His virgin birth, in His sinless life, in His miracles, in His vicarious and atoning death through His shed blood, in His bodily resurrection, in His ascension to the right hand of the Father, and in His personal return in power and glory.
We believe that for the salvation of lost and sinful men (women) regeneration by the Holy Spirit is absolutely essential.
We believe in the present ministry of the Holy Spirit, by whose indwelling the Christian is enabled to live a godly life.
We believe in the resurrection of both the saved and the lost, they that are saved unto the resurrection of life and they that are lost unto the resurrection of damnation.
We believe in the spiritual unity of believers in our Lord Jesus Christ.
This would exclude a believing Jew or Muslim, an atheist, and perhaps some liberal Christians. Is that religious discimination? A basis to take away their club recognition?
Not engaging in homosexual sex is conduct which is inextricably linked to being gay. From Christian Legal Society v Martinez:
So yes, it would be discrimination on the basis of religion to deny membership based on someone who engages in conduct that denies the deity of Christ.
That is the sophistry through which the left uses anti-discrimination laws to trash the First Amendment. When you don't like an ideology, it is "inextricably intertwined," when you like it, the too are separate.
And the cases cited there deal with State laws and acts which are aimed at homosexual conduct. This is a private group that has a belief system, that they are trying to promote. Acc. to you, any ideology that falls outside your view of "discrimination" lacks First Amendment protection. Which is absurd, although there are many who would adhere to that thought.
What examples of an ideology I don't like is separate from status?
If it weren't for the government subsidy, the group would win because of expressive association. But, as noted by this decision
That sounds like a subsidy to me.
It sounds like equal treatment to me.
From Christian Legal Society:
And in the preceding paragraph, the Court endorsed Eugene's argument that a school must be able to limit the groups it recognizes to students, and thus
"One schoolteacher called the Fellowship of Christian Athletes' (FCA) beliefs "bullshit" and sought to ban it from campus. Another described evangelical Christians as "charlatans" who perpetuate "darkness" and "ignorance." And yet another teacher denigrated his own student as an "idiot" for empathizing with FCA members who faced backlash from teachers and students."
One would expect people who speak like this to be incredibly well-educated renaissance men. But are the uni administrators of the world well versed in the classics? Knowledgable in multiple subject matter domains?
No, of course not. They are complete and utter philistines—sanctimonious philistines with a totally unwarranted sense of cultural superiority.
Yes im a polymath of sorts. Im an expert in diversity, inclusion AND equity! (DIE)
BTW, here is a list of the clubs in the school district.
https://sjhs.sjusd.org/student-resources/clubs-asb/
Most of them are activity or service oriented. But one of them is "LGBTQ+ SC." It has no statement of mission.
Does that club "discriminate" against religious people?
Heh. Why go that far? The 4th and 5th clubs on that list are a basketball "club for Boys" and one for girls, respectively.
Does that club "discriminate" against religious people?
Probably not, even with respect to the religious people who are old-timey bigots.
Not all religious people are a-holes and lots of LGBT students are religious. So, no. Obvious answer is obvious.
Question is, can an openly gay person in the organization gain a leadership position even if they meet the religious pledge? If the answer is "yes," then I think the club meets the requirements for official recognition. Otherwise, no, they do not.
Yet again, we find that the vote was based more on how the judges felt about Christian values than it was about the law.
One judge was perfectly happy to just ignore blatant discrimination, going along with the Orwellian "but the other ones weren't shown to actually discriminate even though they made it clear that they were".
"We can tell people we don't want them, but unless someone confronts that, we haven't actually discriminated". A judge actually voted that way. If not for Trump, likely all of them would have voted that way.
It's not about the law. It's about political ideology and personal feelings.
"It's not about the law. It's about political ideology and personal feelings."
Indeed.
This whole mess is created by anti-discrimination laws.
There is no reason why school clubs should not be able to discriminate in exactly the way the cited clubs were all discriminating.
There are probably compelling reasons to limit what kind of clubs a school should sanction, but everyone can come is not where the line belongs.
Yeah. The whole "discrimination" battle cry just falls flat in my mind, since the very purpose of a club is to form a group of people with common interests and/or perspectives. Others that don't share those views will pass. The Satanic Temple Club likely doesn't ban Christians -- it doesn't need to.
And in any event, it's not like some FCA member in good faith was just DYING to assume a leadership role in the FCA and the sexual orientation clause was the only thing getting in the way of that. People who aren't even part of the club just don't want it to exist (you might go so far as to say they "hate" it 😉), and they're latching on to the most plausible pretext they can muster.
" The Satanic Temple Club likely doesn't ban Christians -- it doesn't need to. "
Why not? Some Christians stand on street corners with bullhorns, boorishly antagonizing everyone within earshot, to spread their message or to engage in debate. Why wouldn't someone like that join a club to try to persuade or to engage in debate?
That's one of the finest examples of projection I've seen in a while, Artie -- including the bad-faith angle. Of course I was referring to people who have a genuine interest in the subject matter of a club, not people who feign interest and join just to be disruptive.
The evangelist -- whose motivation and conduct is the point -- likely doesn't see it as disruption.
The point of whatever Very Clever anti-religious argument you may feel like you're making, no doubt. But that has nothing to do with the topic of the thread you parachuted into. Maybe just be honest about it and stick with the standalone harangues.
The Satanic Temple is an atheist organization that doesn't believe in any supernatural beings of any kind, including Satan. Theists in general might have difficulties being regular temple members but they are, according to the Satanic Temple website, welcome to be allies and assist with the Temple's public work.
If the school hadn't enforced its non-discrimination rules for other clubs, it would have had a much higher chance of winning against the FCA here, in my non-lawyer opinion.
The majority brushes off the district court's factual finding that "there is no clear proof that the district allows the club to violate the Policy," or that the club actually discriminates. The district court did not ignore the ambiguity presented by the handwritten notation but recognized the District's approval may have been an oversight.
How to say that your argument is garbage without explicitly saying that
1: There is "no clear proof" that FCA discriminated against anyone. Yet they were terminated
2: When all the "oversights" go one way, it's because they aren't oversights
3: Did the defendants state that they were going to cancel Senior Women of Leland High School's recognition? No?
Then it wasn't an oversight.
4: Christian Legal Society v. Martinez, like every other case where Kennedy gave the Left their 5th vote, was a garbage decision that needs to be overturned
"He posited that FCA could be accused of violating the School District's sexual harassment policy by creating "a hostile work environment for students and faculty." In other words, teenagers—meeting privately to discuss the Bible—were creating a hostile work environment for adult faculty"
A mask slip that shows how bogus and unconstitutional the hostile environment cause of action is. It is nothing more than a weapon by which unhinged DIE administrators can entrench insane cultural norms within institutions subject to those laws.
I have always wondered why not just high schools but most schools seem to have so many clubs/groups/whatever not really related to education. If the FCA, SA, LGBzzzzz, what ever want to have a club that is all fine and good but why do they need to have the school provide money and meeting places.
Maybe because teenagers have a need to socialize with each other in positive, structured ways under adult supervision in order to fully mature into well-functioning adults?
(Why adult supervision? That should be obvious, I would think, given the hazing and other harmful behavior kids can get up to without it. A club sponsor, like I have been, doesn't do much besides be there to help set a positive tone and encourage students to respect each other simply by being present.)
I have always wondered why not just high schools but most schools seem to have so many clubs/groups/whatever not really related to education.
Because bonding over a common interest is generally socially beneficial. People who do that tend to be more successful and less inclined to be "off track".
There are exceptions, e.g. criminal gangs, but none of the exceptions are discussed in the original posting.
" I have always wondered why not just high schools but most schools seem to have so many clubs/groups/whatever not really related to education. "
You seem to have a remarkably stilted view of what constitutes education.
I’m not sure this is a Religion Clause case at all. It’s a pure Equal Protectikn Clause case. Here the government had a nominally neutral policy but was engaging in blatant favoritism, ignoring it for groups it liked but not for groups it didn’t.
I think the Religion Clauses would only come into play if the school district’s so-called non-discrimination policy wasn’t enforced in pretty much the same manner as a must-wear-jacket-and-tie-at-beach policy that is only applied if a black person shows up and is otherwise ignored.
There is a lot of gray between most favored nation and least favored nation. I disagree with using a most favored nation approach in Religion Clause cases. But what the school district did here was pretty much least favored nation. And that’s an equal protection violation independent of the Religion Clauses.
I guess trashing the Constitution means little in your book.
And please explain in what way the group are "discriminators." They adhere to a belief system. If that makes you uncomfortable, tough, you don't get to use government position to force your ideology on them.
Is the Congressional Black Caucus discriminatory?
God you’re so fucking hateful and stupid. They discriminated against some discriminators and blessed the discrimination of other discriminators.
You’re saying that some discrimination is awful and should be punished and other discrimination is swell. You constantly prove yourself to be more hateful than most of the people you hate. Pathetic….
It's not even the constitution. This idiot (QA) does not believe in the rule of law - period. Under the rule of law, it is illegal to steal from people who might themselves be thieves. It is illegal to murder people who are killers. It is illegal the burn down the house of an arsonist and so forth. But QA thinks it is just fine, as long as those with the "wrong beliefs"TM are on the receiving end of illegal acts
" They adhere to a belief system. "
They are gay-hating bigots. That their bigotry derives from religion (superstition) does not improve that bigotry, or make it anything other than bigotry.
Gullible, stale-thinking bigots have rights, too.
Of course there is an expressive association right guaranteed by the First Amendment (a group can generally exclude members that conflict with the group's ideas). However, does that right extend to a government subsidy such as refusal to formally recognize the group in a viewpoint neutral manner?
Except the school is a public institution that is Constitutionally required to maintain neutrality in these issues. You want to exclude people, form a private school with private money.
Answer the question:
Is the Congressional Black Caucus discriminatory?
The group doesn’t want to have to associate with gays
that's not true.
What they don't want to do is let people who disagree with them run their group
the school doesn’t want to associate with groups that don’t want to associate with gays.
It's a public school, which is to say it's part of the government
The government isn't allowed to make that choice, and shouldn't be
No, it doesn't. See my comment above.
That is the sleight-of-hand that is happening here. Racial discrimination is not ideological, it's based on a person's skin color. This is ideological (or theological).
You are entitled to your opinion, even though you would take others' rights away. So lucky you.
And as I said above, the club nowhere said they could not have gays. They just said that you have to adhere to their POV.
Really, this kind of absurdity is getting tiresome.
Have them use the same room as the Nation of Islam. Hilarity will ensue.
The question is not whether it's "ok" but whether a public school district can deny them the same status as the basket-weaving club. To which the clear 1st Amendment answer is NO.
An affirmation? Yes. An enforcement at large? No.
"government subsidy "
Letting them have meetings? I missed the money being given.
Did you even bother to read the post? The whole reason for the ruling was that the school district was found to have NOT applied the policy in a viewpoint-neutral manner.
By God, y’all, I think we’ve got a winner for Stupid Analog of 2022.
You’re advocating that some muggers should be treated violent and other muggers should be invited to come loot the house as well.
You have no case to make here and your desperate attempt to come up with ANYTHING is simply pathetic.
This is just sophistry.
The club is welcoming LGBT students in the same way Alcoholics Anonymous welcomes alcoholics.
It is actually illegal to break and enter a thief's home (or break any other law) to retrieve your own stolen property, but that is not even what I was talking about.
The analogy to your idiotic claim that to paraphrase, 'these people discriminate (against some group), so it's ok (for some other group) to discriminate against them', is that it is ok for anyone to steal from a thief, or burn down an arsonist's home. Which is false. Jack Ruby was convicted of murder for killing Oswald.
But you don't care for the rule of law, as you have made clear.
If the same "all comers" rule applies to both clubs, and the basket-weaving club complies but FCA does not, then the school district can deny formal recognition to only the latter. I would think that is pretty clear from Christian Legal Society. In this case, the school district allowed other clubs to limit membership and hence FCA correctly won.
Good point, let's stamp out anti-alcoholic discrimination.
I have to disagree only because AA actively recruits alcoholics. You point stands.
No, the sophistry is the conflation of belief with status. And the dishonest attempt to use discrimination laws to favor one ideology over another.
Aw, BL... you're usually more careful than this. Anti-semitism isn't based on skin color. The great partition in India wasn't based on skin color. The KKK assaulted Catholic whites but not Protestant ones.
Meanwhile, good Christian men did a fantastic job of discriminating against black people because it was the "white man's burden." Ideological, surely! We put all all the Japanese in camps because of "ideology" too.
But please, do go on about how "belief systems" are okay but "discrimination" is not.
You are at least equally ready to take away others' rights. You just seem to believe that a cloak of childish superstition -- or reliance on stale, unattractive tradition -- improves your conduct.
Do you understand that ideologies you find repugnant still have First Amendment rights? E.g., the Nazis had a First Amendment right to march in Skokie, notwithstanding that everyone there thought they were first-class jerks?
HEre's a thought experiment. Someone students in the San Jose school district want to start a KKK club or a Nazi club, and require their members to sign a pledge that they believe in their ghastly ideology.
Repugnant, sure.
Protected by the First Amendment? Sure.
Can the school district deny recognition to them based on "discrimination?" No.
Conservatives have become accustomed to benefiting from a 'heads we win, tails you lose' standard. ('We can discriminate against anyone else; no one can discriminate against us.')
Religious claimants shoved (their preferred) religion into the Pledge of Allegiance, placed it on our coins, embedded it into public holidays, etc. They want to maintain that unearned privilege, while simultaneously carving out safe spaces for their discrimination against others.
I do not expect religious claimants to benefit from that 'heads you lose, tails we win' approach over the long term. It is not the right thing to do, and the diminution of organized religion as our society modernizes also will make it tougher for certain citizens to extract (or maintain) special, unearned privilege.
Old, white racists from America's can't-keep-up, bigoted backwaters are among my favorite culture war casualties.
You know, they kind who indignantly demand proof that Alabama or Mississippi is or was racist, or that the Civil War was fought over slavery and racism.
Should another group be entitled to insist that people disclaim religion to be eligible for membership or officer positions?
" You’re saying that some discrimination is awful and should be punished and other discrimination is swell. "
That is precisely the approach conservative and superstitious bigots regularly use as a sword and shield -- at least, until better Americans shut down that scam.
The first was not my argument, as you well know. My argument throughout is that First Amendment rights are not trumped by invoking "discrimination."
Go with my hypothetical. Could the school district not permit a Nazi club or KKK club?
I believe people are entitled to believe as they wish, a right to be safeguarded strenuously.
I believe competent adults neither advance nor accept superstition- (or supernatural-)based arguments in reasoned debate, particularly in the context of public affairs.
I sense that organized religion has been responsible for a substantial volume of good, in several important ways, and has precipitated much ugliness, pain, stupidity, and harm. To be charitable, I would call it roughly a wash.
I believe reason, science, and the reality-based world are superior to superstition and dogma. I believe it is good that the role of organized religion is diminishing in America and in our public life.
Not all religious believers embrace dogmatic bigotry and sacred ignorance (at least, not to severe degree). Not nearly. Not enough religious believers hold the many bigots and severe dumbasses among them to account. It has always occurred to me that the best way for religious believers to persuade others to join their ranks would be to be better people than are nonbelievers. Yet they do not, not even to scant degree.
If you are a person who does not believe in the rule of law, like you, or that two wrongs make a right, like you, then yes, in your lawless world it may be ok.
If the "discrimination" consists simply of not letting Catholics hold office in a School Protestant Club, then yes, it is OK.
Under Christian Legal Society, if the school district has an all-comers policy, they can deny recognition of any club (KKK and Nazis too) based on the club not permitting certain people to join.
" Do you understand that ideologies you find repugnant still have First Amendment rights? "
Yes. That is why I often observe that conservative, Republican, obsolete bigots have rights, too.
Conservatives strive to avoid answering that question.
Why?
If it's, say, an atheist club, sure. Next question?
Of course, you nimwit. If some students wanted to form the San Jose Atheist Club, then that club would be well within its rights to insist that its members (or leaders) confirm they are actually atheists.
Whether they would get any members is another story. The Constitution is not a protection against foolishness.
No, just like the Fellowship of Christian Athletes isn't.
Who says, you? That idea, repugnant as it is, is protected by the First Amendment. You cannot condition a benefit from a public institution on giving up your First Amendment rights.
Why is this so hard to understand?
But that is not the issue here. They require a pledge that, to lead the group, you have to adhere to the group's beliefs. The Nazi and KKK clubs could allow membership to anyone that adheres to their beliefs. That's the point, they are not excluding anyone, just requiring that leaders (not even members) actually believe in what the group stands for.
If a group of students started the Milton Friedman Free Market Club, they could not exclude communists. But they could require members (or, as here, leaders of the group) to state they believe in free markets.
Oh, I thought it was to remind us what a tiresome, unimanginative bore your are. As if we did not get that point the first 736 times.
We can hand out free liquor to make the point. Would certainly be popular on college campuses.
Yes, it's called the marketplace of ideas. The First Amendment does not allow the State to favor one ideology or idea over another, even if most people think the idea is repugnant.
Is this so hard to grasp? The Nazis who wanted to march in Skokie "discriminated" against Jews, whom they would not allow to join their club, and indeed would have liked to exterminate. Yet that was still protected by teh First Amendment.
The all-comers policy the Court upheld in Christian Legal Society covered members and leaders and did not permit groups to condition either leadership or membership on status or beliefs.
Can the young Democrats club be forced to allow a Trump supporter to run their Club? Got to be non-discriminatory, doncha' know?