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Preliminary Thoughts on NYSRPA v. Bruen
A minor impact on gun laws but a potentially momentous shift in constitutional method
My contribution to a symposium on New York State Rifle & Pistol Association v. Bruen is now up on SCOTUSBlog. It is pithily entitled: A minor impact on gun laws but a potentially momentous shift in constitutional method. In it, I describe the extensive "shall issue" process I underwent to obtain my concealed carry license in DC for the many who have no idea what this process entails.
I had to pay an application fee of $75. I had to submit my application in person at the Metropolitan Police Department headquarters and be photographed and fingerprinted at an additional cost of $35. I had to pass a federal background check. I had to enroll in and pay for an approved firearms training course, which included 16 hours of classroom study of D.C. gun laws as well as the law governing the use of deadly force, plus another two hours of range instruction. In 2018, the course cost $250 plus $20 for the range fee. The monetary cost of the license amounted to $380. This was in addition to the $125 tax I paid to D.C. on the purchase of my handgun, which brought the total regulatory cost to $505. Since the course took 18 hours to complete, I took it on a Saturday and a Sunday so as not to lose two days of work.
There being no gun ranges in the District of Columbia, my course was taught in Virginia. The instructor was African American, and most of the other students in the course were members of underrepresented groups, which is unsurprising given the demographics of D.C. Since it is doubtful that any other Georgetown professor has a concealed-carry license, I suppose I too was a member of an underrepresented group.
Every two years, I must renew the license. If I miss renewing within the 30-day window before my permit expires, I have to start all over. So, two years later, I had to pay another $75 fee and complete a recertification class consisting of four hours of training, and two hours of range training from an MPD-certified firearms training instructor, which cost $160. I can afford all this, of course, though I cannot say the same for all other citizens of D.C.
This is the type of regulatory regime that, in Bruen, the court said it was not questioning: "[N]othing in our analysis should be interpreted to suggest the unconstitutionality of the 43 States' 'shall-issue' licensing regimes."
I then discuss my effort to understand Justice Thomas's "text and history" alternative to the "tiers of scrutiny" doctrine that has dominated constitutional law since the 1950s. I explain why am still not sure I completely understand how it is supposed to work. The essay is long and I cannot truly summarize it my uncertainties and reservations, so you may wish to click through to read it here. Here is a taste:
There is, however, an even more fundamental question raised by Thomas' text-and-history approach. It seems to assume that, once we use history to identify the "outer contours" of a constitutional right, then any such right bars not only prohibitions on its exercise but also trumps any statutory regulation of it. Prior to the New Deal, however, rights were not viewed as trumps on the regulatory power of government. Instead, the existence of a right barred the complete deprivation of it — that is, a prohibition — and statutes were "strictly" or "equitably" construed to avoid this result. And the existence of a right also required that a regulation be within the power of a legislature to enact. At the federal level, this meant a power delegated to Congress by the Constitution. At the state level, this meant what is called the state's "police power." While broad, the state police power was not unlimited….
Thomas seems to want to limit the original scope of a constitutional right by his historical inquiry. And then the right, so limited, may not be restricted in any way. If rights are this absolute, however, then we cannot afford to recognize very many if government is to function. This would explain Thomas' apparent movement toward an "enumerated rights only" view of constitutional rights (though he has not yet committed himself to this view). But viewing rights as absolute in this way is quite modern and ahistorical, and its invocation in a purportedly originalist opinion is therefore surprising.
I do conclude with a tentatively proposed alternative:
Perhaps a better approach would have been to distinguish between prohibiting and regulating the exercise of a right. Any prohibition of the exercise of a constitutional right is per se unconstitutional. In contrast, a regulation of how a right may be exercised is permissible, provided the ends of such a regulation are within the legislative power of Congress or a state.
Under this distinction, because the "special need for self-protection" that was required by the New York system was "distinguishable from that of the general community," the law amounted to a prohibition on ordinary citizens exercising their constitutional right to bear arms outside the home. Not only was this the scheme's effect; it was also its intention.
By contrast, D.C.'s "shall issue" regime provides a means by which every "law-abiding" (per the background check) citizen of D.C. can obtain a permit, so it is not a prohibition of the exercise of a constitutional right. Unlike the New York law, it is a "regulation" because it proscribes the manner of exercising the right.
It may not always be easy to distinguish a prohibition of a right from a mere regulation of its exercise. For example, is a ban on a particular class of firearms a prohibition or merely a regulation of the manner by which the right to keep and bear arms may be exercised? However, at the extremes it can be quite obvious, as I think it is with New York's law and the D.C. and Chicago gun bans the court held to be unconstitutional in Heller and McDonald v. City of Chicago. (Even after Heller, D.C. still regulates the types of firearms that can be kept in the home or carried concealed outside.)
Rather than use modern tiers of scrutiny, when considering the appropriate regulation of constitutional rights, we should look instead to the type of eyes-open arbitrariness or rationality review that preceded the adoption of modern tiers of scrutiny. This is not, I should stress, the same as the modern eyes-closed rational basis scrutiny, which the court today considers its default approach under its tiers-of-scrutiny doctrine. (See Dobbs. "A law regulating abortion, like other health and welfare laws, … must be sustained if there is a rational basis on which the legislature could have thought that it would serve legitimate state interests.")
I put the sentence above in bold because I realize how prohibitions can be characterized as regulations and vice versa. But at the extremes there is surely a difference between telling someone they cannot do something and telling them how they must do it.
Such are my preliminary thoughts on the reasoning of Bruen, whose outcome I applaud. I look forward to benefiting from the thoughts of others about the text and history approach before reaching any final verdict on its merits.
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You should move out of Washington DC. The white part is more homosexual than San Fran. The city is a horrible place to live. Stray a block outside the federal reservation, you will be hit on the head for the $5 in your pocket, or murdered. Nothing will be done about it, because the government is totally pro-criminal. Live in Bethesda, which is crime free.
Professor of Legal Theory
The theory is the Inquisition 2.0. Take our $trillion and return nothing of value. Spew a toxic effluvia that is 1000 times more toxic than organized crime. Impose supernatural doctrines from the 13th Century, which not even the Medieval church believed applied to people.
Presumably, the folks who live in D.C. have sized up their situation for themselves, and don't need our advice.
A more apt name would be the "partial text and history approach," since Scalia, in Heller, excised the text, "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State," from the Second Amendment. So, part 1 of the "text and history" approach is to eliminate any part of the text that may pose an issue. Part 2 includes examining the history of the remaining text.
That's Heller-Bruen two-pronged test.
I'm going out on a limb here to guess that you didn't do very well in English.
No, he's just exercising Step 1, "to eliminate any part of the analysis that may pose an issue".
The militia clause is a "recital". If the meaning of a term is unclear, you look to the recitals which declare the purpose of the contract. That's why recitals are put in. That's also Contract Law 101.
And the importance of State Militias is why all federal firearms regulations are unconstitutional.
That’s why you need law professors with over 200 IQs—because it takes a lot of brain power to thread that needle. Good thing in America we have incentives for geniuses to spend their time interpreting an over 200 year old document instead of designing space ships. 😉
That is the great tragedy here. You have a dude who goes to Cal tach at 12. He could have been a billionaire and worth every penny for the great value provided to society. Instead, his intellect got carpet bombed by 1L, and is an absolute dumbass and a denier.
I know people like you don't like it, but you continue to ignore the core holding of Heller: a free people choosing to be armed is the militia in question, and that no government, state or national, may "well regulate" it out of existence by disarming the populace.
Objecting to law-abiding individuals owning (keep and bear) weapons of war directly contradictions the purpose of the militia. The history shared in Heller catalogues that the militia wasn't exclusively armed by government. Those arms were individually owned and that itself was a check on an abuse of power, both by government or during civil unrest uncontrollable by any government.
Thanks Maddog regarding what the "militia" is. I had several ancestors in colonial and revolutionary New England, who were part of the militia. They carried their own muskets, powder and ball. Most of the time they patrolled the environs of their towns, villages, and farms, protecting their communities from raids by the Indians the French sent against the English settlers.
When the Revolution began, one of my ancestors led a detachment of militiamen from New Hampshire to Bunker Hill (actually to Breeds Hill, which was where the fight really was) and gave the British Army a hot time until the ammunition ran out.
Later, the same ancestor led a detachment of New Hampshire militia to Saratoga, after the two main battles, where they helped to block the British retreat, and forced the Brits' surrender. In fact continual reinforcement of the Patriot forces in northern New York by New Hampshire militia seems to have been crucial to the success of the Patriot campaign, while the Brits lost their Indian allies and were unable to bring in British regulars from Canada to replace their losses.
No big surprise that the framers of the Second Amendment included the word "militia" to remind people how important privately-held firearms can be to protect communities.
Kinda one of the points made in Miller. Raising a militia (or volunteer army recruits) in time of national emergency is difficult without a pool of citizens already familiar with the standard issue (regulation) Army rifle or even just familiar with safe handling of firearms around others.
Problems with Miller, though, is neither Miller nor his attorney were present, Miller was decided based on the prosecution's arguments before the judge .
since Scalia, in Heller, excised the text, "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State," from the Second Amendment
That bullshit claim from simpletons like you never gets old. No, wait...yes it did, the moment it was first trotted out.
"A minor impact on gun laws but a potentially momentous shift in constitutional method"
hahaha, no. See footnote 9, along with the two first amendment cases the majority cited in that footnote. The six-member majority all-but endorsed constitutional carry if the right to bear is excessively burdened.
Shuttlesworth v. City of Birmingham, 394 U.S. 147 (1969)
"1. A law subjecting the right of free expression in publicly owned places to the prior restraint of a license, without narrow, objective, and definite standards is unconstitutional, and a person faced with such a law may ignore it and exercise his First Amendment rights. "
Footnote 9 endorses the same holding for the 2nd amendment"
How much is "excessive" is where the rubber hits the road. I think we can already see that the majority is open to extensive training requirements. To exercise a constitutional right!
I did not read the opinion as an endorsement. They were careful to qualify the opinion with "appears." The regimes in the other 43 states were not at issue. And they did not rule out challenges based on lengthy wait times or high fees.
The 16 hours training requirement in IL, DC, and MD are outliers and hard to justify.
As is the $430 fee in New York City.
"In contrast, a regulation of how a right may be exercised is permissible, provided the ends of such a regulation are within the legislative power of Congress or a state."
I really don't like that. Rights should limit the means government can pursue even legitimate ends. I really hate this invisible "Unless there's a really good reason!" the courts have appended to every right in the Bill of Rights.
I agree. Properly construed, rights should limit the permissible means by which government can pursue even permissible ends.
The "history and tradition" test is unsupported by either history or tradition.
Excuse me, that's what the entire British constitution is based on, it's all history and tradition.
But don't get to fixated on the history and tradition test, because the text is still supreme. History and tradition can inform the text, it can't override it.
Any thoughts on the abortion decision from your "libertarian" (or "often libertarian," or "libertarianish") perspective, Prof. Barnett?
Or, like the general trend at this faux libertarian blog, do you practice a libertarianism curiously congruent with right-wing political preferences?
#ConservativeCowardice
Trolling off topic I see. Ridiculing the blog's ideology, yet demand the participants answer your questions. Charming
But you did me a service, because your mentioning abortion gives me the chance to comment on the professor's post: maybe the last half century of abortion jurisprudence is where the idea germinated that a constitutional right may not be "unduly burdened". Just saying. Or maybe some rights are better than others, I don't know anymore.
I like to highlight the Conspirators' cowardice (including conspicuous silence regarding affairs of the day that discomfort bigots and superstitious hayseeds), hypocrisy, and bigotry.
Just another day at the marketplace of ideas.
Where, of course, the liberal-libertarian mainstream prevails over conservatives and faux libertarians.
"If rights are this absolute, however, then we cannot afford to recognize very many if government is to function."
Now, that's hardly true, or rather, it depends on the nature of the rights, and what you mean by government "functioning".
For instance, for most of the nation's history we got by with essentially zero in the way of regulation of what sorts of guns one could own. They were still selling anti-material rifles mail order when I was a child! People brought guns on airliners, and I mean in their carry on bags. You could send your minor children to buy ammo at the corner hardware store. And yet, we somehow had a government. That's how much of a right to keep and bear arms still permitted a government to function.
We also survived having basically nothing in the way of drug laws for most of our history. Coca Cola had cocaine in it! And yet, we somehow had a government. You could have a right to ingest anything you damned well pleased, and still have a functioning government.
When you get down to it, for most of the nation's history we had Grover Norquist's ideal government: Small enough you could have drowned it in a bathtub. I think people generally don't understand that: The amount of government we had for most of our history would be dismissed as anarchy today, and things worked.
Barnett has internalized the legitimacy of a degree of government intrusion on our lives that would have completely horrified Americans for the majority of our history.
I missed out on getting a 20mm Lahti L-39.
I only got $2 a week allowance in the 1960s and I was saving for a .22 Marlin 39 Mountie.
You don't get to go back a century and just use their policies. Modernity requires differences.
Maybe you can go back there with guns specifically. But your general endorsement ignores a lot.
The America you yearn for sucked a lot for a lot of people who weren't middle class straight white guys. If it really existed at all.
You also don't get to say that what worked a half a century ago couldn't possibly work. Existence proofs are like that, you know.
Since 1970, America has become more populace, cities more dense, and our society in general has become more technologically complex, especially with respect to medicine and end of life care.
We've gotten a lot better at handling diverse points of view, and seeing that as a virtue.
We've transitioned from a manufacturing economy to an IP/Service economy.
These are all things that mean perhaps the government style of 1970 would not be well suited to today. Is it for sure? No, it's a counterfactual. But it does throw your 'things were better when I was young, lets do all the same things again' argument into pretty strong question.
And, of course, beyond that, as I noted yesterday the America you yearn for was good for people like you and me, but absolutely not for many others. Including women in the workforce, among other things.
Yeah, I get that a lot of things have changed since then, some for the better, some for the worse. My point is that you can't just categorically say that you can't have a functioning government with extensive rights. We know you can, because we did have one; A lot of the rights people today assert were incompatible with a functioning government were respected to a degree modern sensibilities would declare insane, within living memory, (Though perhaps not too much longer.) and we did have a functioning government.
By some standards, MORE functional, because it was actually somewhat competent at it's much smaller scope of responsibilities.
On your last point, I don't agree that the changes for the worse were necessary to get the changes for the better.
This is burden shifting. You're saying we should go back to the 1970s without much real support that we can.
I'm noting that support is absolutely required.
There are certainly areas that are overregulated, and policies we could bring back (strong unions, for instance). But a sweeping 'we could do it then so we can do it now' is not a logically coherent statement because now is very much not like then.
Yeah, god forbid blacks have to behave and women don't mouth off in impotent rages in front of courthouses.
You don't get to...
Someone who lies his sorry ass off as habitually as you do doesn't get to tell others what they get to do.
IIRC, the hoops of the NY regulatory regime weren't being challenged because the applicants had fulfilled them?
In California, for example, the "may issue" aspect is the primary hurdle.
I tend to agree with this analysis, but I have a few extra thoughts.
There are really three types of Second Amendment concerns:
(1) The general scope of the right
(2) The type of weapons covered
(3) Limitations of when that right may be exercised or other regulatory burdens
For the first one, this new case seems to be addressing this issue. There is a right to carry in public and that right cannot be restrained by non-objective rules. This seems to follow the History and Text test.
The second is the type of weapon. I think Heller itself deals with this, which is the definition of "arms." The test is "regularly used for lawful purposes." It's clear that this isn't a historical analysis test but, instead, an argument by analogy or even an argument almost of consensus. There's some problems with this test in that it could be circular, but we've had over 50 years of the Reasonable Expectation of Privacy test, which is subject to similar criticism.
For section (3), I think there are two separate areas. The first are things like "protected spaces" arguments - banning weapons from courthouses, government buildings, military bases, etc. Despite the majority not wanting to use a traditional "test" I think Intermediate Scrutiny works fairly well here as long as it's agreed that simply a generalized need to protect the public from gun violence by itself never satisfies the test and there has to be an important government need related to the specific place in question.
The final question would be regulatory limitations on firearms - background checks, waiting periods, educational requirements, etc. Until about a week ago, I sincerely felt that the best test to use was an Undue Burden test. I think many of the same types of regulations as abortion regulations could be found and, conveniently, you could use Judges against themselves. Any ruling in favor of abortion restrictions could be used to restrict second amendment rights. Any ruling against those restrictions would liberalize second amendment laws. Obviously, my master plan is no longer effective, but I think it was a good idea while it lasted.
The concealed carry permitting process in D.C. sounds like a breeze compared to what we’re still facing in the most populous California counties post-Bruen.
County sheriffs typically issue concealed carry licenses in California. The State has little or no operational role—it primarily sets the ground rules through statutes. Rob Bonta, California’s attorney general, just issued some advice to these sheriffs, recommending that they drop their good cause requirements and instead apply their so-called “public safety” subjective criteria through the statutory provision for good moral character. He also urged them to thoroughly employ the statutory requirement for psychological testing.
So post-Bruen, a county such as Alameda (population 1.7 million) will continue to conduct a months-long investigative process that is far more intrusive than one conducted by the FBI for a federal top secret clearance (Eugene Volokh has already commented on the likely unconstitutionality of the social media and ideological aspects of this investigative process). They will also continue to require five hours of one-on-one psychological screening. These requirements are on top of requirements for days of training and the payment of nearly a thousand dollars in fees.
Sure, many if not all of these requirements are not consistent with the Bruen decision. But California will litigate, and the judges within the Ninth Circuit will find ways to rule in their favor. So even if the Supreme Court chooses to finally begin policing the lower court’s active defiance of their Second Amendment rulings, most Californians can expect to suffer another 5-10 years of infringements.
Absolute seems to be the word of the day. Is it absolute? Is it a right? When is it absolute? Like the words always, never, & perfect, there is a degree of hyperbole. This briar patch of semantics & various levels of consistency for systems of taxonomy & procedure is all well and good. But we are dealing with power in primate communities. And the animals do not understand nor care about all that hair splitting. And until we start talking about power & its use & abuse, instead of philosophy & markets, we are just deciding things by complex bullshit contests. In the real world the irrational arrogance & uncompromising stance that the most vocal of the 2nd amendment advocates have taken, along with the pretty scary optics of the various "private militias" that are the vanguard of the movement, is causing a sincere backlash. Nothing is absolute. It's just a word.
"If rights are this absolute, however, then we cannot afford to recognize very many if government is to function."
Re-read the Declaration of Independence. Rights are superior, the existence of government is inferior.
A midwit mind often manifests itself by its owner's smug declaration that there can be no absolute rights while thinking he's brighter than Blackstone himself.
Thomas' apparent movement toward an "enumerated rights only" view of constitutional rights
It is most peculiar that there is such opposition on the radical right-wing to recognising unenumerated rights, particularly given the clear text of 9A and the clear expression of the FFs in other documents. IIRC both Scalia and Bork were anti9A as well.
That it may not be immediately evident what those rights include is not a legitimate justification for saying they do not exist. If Thomas doesn't know how to determine whether something is an enumerated right he can always STFU or resign. Effectively denying that they exist should not be an option.
They also said that shall-issue regimes that put up too many road blocks such that they don't work that way in practice could be vulnerable to an as applied challenge.
Effectively denying that they exist should not be an option.
SRG — Problem is, among folks who agree they exist, there is disagreement about which ones exist. Pretty clearly, the 9A and 10A cannot be used to make up new rights without limit, just by claiming they exist. Originalists might try to limit that problem by demanding proof which unenumerated rights existed at the time of the founding. That's before you get to the problem of wording and extent.
Then, of course, comes vindication. Got a God-given right? Look to God to vindicate it. Got a natural right? Let nature vindicate it. Got an enumerated right? Much, much better. Sovereign power can vindicate that one—just don't make the mistake of confusing the government with the sovereign.
Indeed it is a problem
Originalists might try to limit that problem by demanding proof which unenumerated rights existed at the time of the founding. That's before you get to the problem of wording and extent.
Surely the correct demand is to put the burden of proof on the person arguing that something is not a right, given that the Constitution is a delegation of power. If a power has not been explicitly delegated, nor is there proof that the government freely infringed on something, currently claimed to be a right, at the time of the BoR, then it's a right. The default position should always be that something is a right unless the government has the relevant delegation of power to infringe on't.
SRG — That analysis does not work, at least not within the historical framework of ordered liberty in the U.S.
Make a right of everything outside the designated powers of the federal government, and you are left with nothing but designated powers, rights in conflict, and state powers greater than the federal government's. You have gutted both the Necessary and Proper Clause, and the Supremacy Clause.
Worse, you have also denied the sovereign People practically all scope for self-government. That problem is unsurmountable. The notion of sovereignty is that sovereign power is unlimited, except by geographic extent. To make everything not delegated to the federal government into a right posits a sovereign which puts itself out of business. It undoes the sovereign's power to enumerate rights, or to constrain government. It turns sovereignty into a nullity, and strips the populace of protection against government overreach which only sovereign power can deliver.
Government without scope to govern can do nothing. The founders understood that, and explained it when they announced that the Constitution was not the nation's universal and exclusive code of laws, but instead had been left deliberately brief, general, and ambiguous. They knew they had to retain for the People themselves the power of self-government, and said so explicitly in the nation's founding documents.
I have to hand it to you in one respect. It can be difficult to explain to people unmindful of the role of sovereignty what it is, and why all national governments since the Enlightenment have depended on some notion of sovereignty—which is to say a power greater than government's, which can make or unmake governments at pleasure, constrain their operations, and protect citizens from government abuses. Your everything-unenumerated-is-a right approach provides a useful example to show what stops working if you subtract sovereign power from the scheme of national government. In a way, you seem to posit as a virtue what Hobbes critiqued as the inevitable devolution of any society without a sovereign—into a war of each against all.
Perhaps you count yourself an anarchist? If so, then I understand where you are coming from. What Hobbes cautioned against becomes your ideal.
If you are not an anarchist, then you need to rethink the question of where government comes from. That would put you in plentiful company. Pretty much everyone unmindful of sovereignty needs to rethink that question.
The People are sovereign. Their representatives have delegated sovereignty - which is limited, and the Constitution lays out those limits. The People can always delegate more sovereignty if they so wish.
It seems to me that you're confusing the People with their representatives, much as I appreciate the effort and thought that went into your response.
I do not think most delegations of power to government are thereby delegations of sovereignty. I do think some of them may be. I am mindful that the impeachment power functions as a constitutive power; constitutive power is a principle sovereign attribute. Also sovereign-looking are the constitutional amendment powers delegated to government, and the treaty ratification powers. Do you notice anything in common among those? All have constitutionally prescribed super-majority provisions. That suggests to me that the power to overturn a presidential veto might also be classed as a delegation of sovereignty.
"principal sovereign attribute."
Methodological precedents are basically worthless. Any lawyer worth his or her or their salt can get any result his her, or their clients want while, to all appearances, complying with whatever method the Supremes say is the current fashion.
Professor Barnett, I do not expect many judges or lawyers to understand why, but from a historical standpoint, the Thomas scheme is unworkable. It is not possible to analogize founding era text and context to modern-era situations formed by present context. Any attempt to do that in a conscientious way is fated to run smack into the kind of paradoxes science fiction serves up, when it turns to time travel for its entertainments.
Academic history—the only kind which does not spend most of its time just making stuff up—has a few points to make, about how to think about sources of confusion regarding history and meaning.
Start with meaning. Taken one word at a time, any text becomes just a pile of definitions. Absent context, those piles are all but unintelligible. Permit me to demonstrate. Using the best dictionary choices for the 8 words in the preceding sentence, it reads, concatenated:
Without the parts of something written or spoken that immediately precede and follow a word or passage and clarify its meaning, referring to a specific thing previously mentioned, known, or understood an assemblage of things laid or lying one upon the other present simple of be the whole of one's energy or interest no more than impossible to understand.
I like it! It's gibberish, but it suggests meaning. Too bad you could never get from the concatenated definitions to the sentence they define. See, the sentence was enriched by context, much more than generally gets noticed.
That is the predicament present-day scholars typically confront when in search of historical meaning they resort to dictionaries. Just as anyone would have to do to make sense of the gibberish above, to get from a dictionary definition to a coherent text, in the absence of context, requires making stuff up. Not only making it up, but also filling it in liberally, to tailor coherence which will not otherwise appear. What relative contributions will deliver the coherence? From the definitions, a tiny, tiny bit. From the made-up stuff, almost everything.
Thus, in any text, ancient, antique, or modern, context is everything. So an unavoidable question becomes, "How do you wrap and pack past context to assure it survives time travel undamaged, to be unpacked unchanged in the present?" Actually, academic historians have figured out how to accomplish that with a plausible claim to validity. I have explained that in other comments. I will not add that bit again here. Instead, return to the dilemma that confronts a modern scholar, like Thomas.
Every utterance from a past era is infused with contextual meaning particular to the time and place it was made. Likewise for modern utterances. And those disparate contexts are typically much farther apart than casual observers suppose. For comparisons as distant in time as the founding era and modern America, they barely intersect at all.
The problem is the interval between them. For the founding era, that interval lies entirely in its unknowable future. All events, occurrences, and changes which happened between then and now cannot have even the tiniest historically valid influence on anything done or meant at the time of the founding. They did not know their future, any more than we know ours.
But for the would-be historian—including even originalist lawyers and judges—the problem is, what the founders did not know about their future, we do, because an interval in between lies in our past. They could not know it. We cannot avoid it. Thus the historical problem takes on a complication unexpected, except as I mentioned in science fiction time travel, of how to deal with an unknoable future for them, which for us is paradoxically knowable.
So reconsider that same interval from the point of view of the present. For us, in the present, that interval contains the very most influential context to affect every present utterance, every meaning, every expectation. Just a bit farther back, there lie all the formative notions, upon which informed modern cognition was built from then forward. In short, that interval which offers zero context to affect the founding era, delivers all but the entirety of context to influence the present—including the part of the present with ambition to interpret the past. There is no overlap.
So what happens when a modern scholar with a head packed to the dome with modern context—and a nearly complete absence of anything else to rely upon—encounters an antique text endowed with contextual meaning the modernist knows nothing about, and does not even suspect to exist?
Inadvertent substitution happens. That intervening interval of time, full of occurrences previously without influence on any meaning in the antique text, suddenly takes over and redefines that text. The modern scholar is pleased not only to administer the process of substitution, but also to supply from imagination generous helpings of otherwise missing coherence.
Think about that the next time you see a would-be originalist purport to illuminate founding era meaning with citations to early 19th century occurrences—as Thomas has done in Bruen.
Thomas has the better understanding of rights and the government’s ability to regulate on a topic without infringing on a constitutional right.
There is such a thing as a right to bear arms.
There is such an activity as bearing arms.
Governments can regulate the bearing of arms, for instance to ensure public safety.
But government cannot infringe on the right to bear arms.
Those concepts are not in conflict if we first determine the scope of a right as it was generally recognized at the time of its ratification, then set the limit on the power of government to regulate the bearing arms so as not to infringe on that right.
In Bruen, the majority holds that there is a right to bear arms outside the home for self-defense. The majority holds that such regulatory schemes such as NY’s that prevent (rather than merely regulate) ordinary citizens from exercising their right to bear arms outside the home for self-defense run afoul of the right to bear arms as protected in the second amendment.
To say that government may infringe on the right to bear arms, despite the clear command of the second amendment, is to deny the purpose of a written constitution.
Barnett writes: "Perhaps a better approach would have been to distinguish between prohibiting and regulating the exercise of a right. Any prohibition of the exercise of a constitutional right is per se unconstitutional. In contrast, a regulation of how a right may be exercised is permissible, provided the ends of such a regulation are within the legislative power of Congress or a state."
No, the better approach is to distinguish between activity X and the right to X. Government may regulate activity X, but it cannot infringe on the right to X.
Any prohibition of X is per se a violation of the right to X (because the scope of the right to X must be non zero, else it is not a right)
edited for clarity and reposted
Thomas has the better understanding of rights and the government’s ability to regulate on a topic without infringing on a constitutional right.
There is such an activity as bearing arms.
There is such a thing as a right to bear arms.
Governments can regulate the bearing of arms, for instance to ensure public safety.
But government cannot infringe on the right to bear arms.
Those concepts are not in conflict if we first determine the scope of a right as it was generally recognized at the time of its ratification, then set the limit on the power of government to regulate the bearing arms so as not to infringe on that right.
In Bruen, the majority holds that there is a right to bear arms outside the home, this is not contested. The majority holds that regulatory schemes such as NY’s that prevent ordinary citizens from bearing arms outside the home (rather than merely regulate the bearing of arms) run afoul of the right to bear arms as protected in the second amendment.
To say that government may infringe on the right to bear arms, despite the clear command of the second amendment, is to deny the purpose of a written constitution
Looking at Part II of Bruen, Justice Thomas says:
"In the years since, the Courts of Appeals have coalesced around a "two-step" framework for analyzing Second Amendment challenges that combines history with means-end scrutiny.
Today, we decline to adopt that two-part approach."
This can be construed that the "text-and-history" approach may only be applied to abrogate "means-end scrutiny in Second Amendment challenge cases. The opinion at the beginning of Part II.B. seems to support such a conclusion.
I note the Professor's comment that:
"Thomas seems to want to limit the original scope of a constitutional right by his historical
inquiry. And then the right, so limited, may not be restricted in any way. If rights are this
absolute, however, then we cannot afford to recognize very many if government is to
function. This would explain Thomas' apparent movement toward an "enumerated rights
only" view of constitutional rights (though he has not yet committed himself to this view)." [Not being familiar with an " 'enumerated rights only' view", I cannot intelligently comment on it - but it seems it could be dangerous.]
In connection with both of these points I note the following at
Part II.D.
"To be clear, analogical reasoning under the Second Amendment is neither a regulatory straightjacket nor a regulatory blank check. On the one hand, courts should not "uphold every modern law that remotely resembles a historical analogue," because doing so "risk[s] endorsing outliers that our ancestors would never have accepted." ... On the other hand, analogical reasoning requires only that the government identify a well-established and representative historical analogue, not a historical twin. So even if a modern-day regulation is not a dead ringer for historical precursors, it still may be analogous enough to pass constitutional muster."
and Part II.C.:
"To be sure, '[h]istorical analysis can be difficult; it sometimes requires resolving threshold questions, and making nuanced judgments about which evidence to consult and how to interpret it.' ... But reliance on history to inform the meaning of constitutional text—especially text meant to codify a pre-existing right—is, in our view, more legitimate, and more administrable, than asking judges to "make difficult empirical judgments" about "the costs and benefits of firearms restrictions," especially given their "lack [of] expertise" in the field."
The "analogical reasoning" discussion I found compelling though albeit (by necessity) "guide" line rather than "bright" line. By the foregoing it does not seem to be that an absolute right is being posited but rather than restrictions imposed upon the right can be justifiable, if demonstrated by history. [I would say, though, that rights identified in history should be only cautiously restricted, as Natural Rights (such as self-defense) cannot be divested. In conjunction with this I question whether the Second Amendment "codified" a pre-existing right or rather "recognized" it.]
I certainly have less trouble than Justice Breyer in employing an historical approach, his castigation of it in the dissent being excessive and polemic indeed (though perhaps not as polemic as Professor Cornell in his paper in the symposium). The use of historical investigation and analysis is a common and essential component of much legal analysis. Many cases and statutes of current applicability have respectable vintage, and without an investigation of their historical context it would be impossible to assess their genuine pertinence and viability. While it may be trued that most judges and lawyers are not trained historians, query whether many trained historians are not frequently in error or even prejudiced; otherwise there would be no new reassessments of historical events. Methinks that Justice Breyer "doth protest too much".
No, that's not what common law was or is.
It feeds back and forth: You treat people like infants, you infantilize them. You protect them from the consequences of their own acts, they become careless of them.
The fact remains that we KNOW a society can function with a much less intrusive government. How to get back to that is a question, but we shouldn't pretend that such a society can't function, we had one within living memory, in many ways.
The Constitution absolutely is a contract, ergo, amendments to it are amendments to the contract.
No, common law starts with precedent - with previous legal decisions. That is not the same thing.
In cases of first impression, judges under common law are required only to give an argument for their reasoning. It can be based on culture, on tradition, on economics, on what-have-you. It then adds to other similar facts and judges adopt or reject various precedents and eventually a body of consensus is formed.
No doubt that consensus is influence by culture. But that is not the same as 'common law the same as looking to history and tradition.'
Under a common law approach, New York would clearly win the case, because under common law, the last century of precedent would be more dispositive than initial public meaning.
Sarcastr0's right, common law is just how our law works (except in weird Louisiana). It just means that precedent matters, and in some cases precedent can extend all the way back to jolly old England if it hasn't been disturbed since then.
If Thomas and the other five Republican legislators (yes, they do far more legislating than the ones in Congress) were appealing to common law, they would say so.
Where does the initial precedent come from? I already told you:
'In cases of first impression, judges under common law are required only to give an argument for their reasoning. It can be based on culture, on tradition, on economics,'
Louisiana law is not weird, it's French.
But is is a car part.
Totally agree. This decision is proof that originalism is nonsense and it can yield pretty much any desired result.
The right-wing culture war casualties tend to choose Virginia over Maryland. Makes them feel closer to the Confederacy.
The good times will commence when better Americans quote the clingers' language as the liberal-libertarian mainstream pummels the right-wing precedents into oblivion.
I'd agree with you, except it mostly got it right. All the way up to where they completely glossed over their is no historical analog to permitting schemes.
Sure, put background checks on weapons sales, but there shouldn't be a permit requirement to carry, and 26 states recognize that.
Except that Breyer didn't say we ***have to*** ban the carrying of arms. He said states ***may*** do so. Whether or not you agree with him (I do not: if there is an individual right to own guns, there must be some constitutional right to carry them, so a shall issue regime looks right to me), if you are doing history and tradition analysis, the fact that sometime in the relevant timeframe someone did so, looks pretty dispositive! You could even argue that if a law stood for 100+ years, that in itself is pretty dispositive it has some basis in tradition and history...
But if the text is absolute and does not admit of any exceptions, there is no basis upon which to go any further. "[S]hall not infringe" is not an invitation to regulate.
That's like saying Jim Crow repealed the 14th and 15th amendment.
It did make it null and void in a lot of places for a long time. But we have recovered them, and it would not be a legitimate exercise to start citing all the Jim Crow laws in order to re-erase the two amendments.
But again, the whole point of originalism is that words have to be understood in the context of the founding and to lesser extent reconstruction eras. If the order "shall not infringe" appears absolute to us, but seemed less absolute to them, then originalism would dictate that their understanding controls.
If they intended it to be less absolute, they could have so ordained.
The argument is that they thought they did.
You're cherry picking your jurisprudence to get the outcome you want.
I'm no originalist, but I recognize pretextual originalism when I see it.
To a point, but such a society functioned in a mostly white America where everyone, whites and non-whites, were expected to conform to the majority Protestant culture.
That is gone. Can a society function with a small government without it? I don't think so.
That's what it was, it's not what it is now.
A judge may well get a case of first impression but especially in criminal law, he better find a statute to cite.