The Volokh Conspiracy
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Intellectual Diversity and the Problem of Speaking Up
A few thoughts about disagreement in academia.
There have been a lot of debates here at the blog, and elsewhere, about the value of intellectual diversity in academia. The case for intellectual diversity is usually expressed in terms of the value of having different ideas. No one ideological perspective has a monopoly on the truth, the argument runs. You can get to better ideas, in general, by drawing insights from a range of different inputs. To borrow a metaphor, the marketplace of ideas produces better products when there's competition.
There's a lot to that, I think. But I've come to think that an under-appreciated benefit of intellectual diversity in academia is not so much the range of ideas felt as it is the range of ideas actually voiced. In my experience, at least, intellectual diversity makes it more likely that people will speak up. This is perhaps an under-appreciated corollary to the general case for having a broad range of inputs. To get those benefits, people need to be willing to say what they think. And my sense is that people are more willing to say what they think when they aren't necessarily sharing the priors of the speaker, or at least believe some others in the audience aren't.
The dynamic within a particular faculty or discussion group might run something like this. Imagine there's a faculty workshop, and a professor presents an academic argument that supports a high-profile political or ideological cause. Imagine, further, that pretty much everyone in the audience strongly supports that cause. At the same time, many in the audience conclude that the professor's specific argument has a lot of problems. It's in support of a wonderful cause, they're all thinking. But it has a lot of problems.
When the audience questions the speaker about the argument, social dynamics may encourage the audience to be self-conscious about how or whether to respond. Dynamics vary group to group, of course. But my sense is that, often enough, those who share an ideological view are more reluctant to voice objections to arguments offered in support of that view.
Part of the problem is what you might call the suspicion of hidden sympathies. Direct questioning of the argument may create the impression the questioner is secretly sympathetic to the other side of the political cause. You see this all the time in public discussions of hot-button topics. When an objection is made, the specific question about whether the objection has merit often brings up additional questions about why that person asked the question, what's their agenda, and the like. If the cause is one you hold dear, and that the group sees as important to its collective identity, you may not want to risk being seen as having uncertain commitment to it.
In that setting, potential questioners may decide to keep objections to themselves. You can't have your motives questioned if you stay silent, after all. Or if they decide to speak, they may do so obliquely, downplaying objections so that they become easier to dismiss or ignore. Either way, the questioner ends up trying to balance the group's interest in the exchange of ideas with the questioner's self-interest in in-group identification. To varying degrees, the former suffers to protect the latter.
Intellectual diversity can help this situation, I think, because outsiders are less likely to worry about these in-group dynamics. Not sharing the views of the rest of the group, they are likely to be less worried about suspicion of hidden sympathies. And I think this extends to those in the group who share the majority view but who know there are dissenters from it. The more they believe that their colleagues are coming from different perspectives, the less self-conscious they are likely to be about whether their question might be misunderstood.
The usual caveats apply, of course. Group dynamics can vary. And there are limits to what kinds of intellectual diversity are useful, with judgments always needing to be made about what views are off-the-wall and useless versus on-the-wall and useful. But I think this dynamic occurs often enough, and in settings where the dissenting voice is on-the-wall, that it ends up as an important purpose intellectual diversity tends to serve.
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This is actually a bit funny, though I understand you to be coming from a perspective of, "What would persuade the already not very diverse campus to permit a bit more diversity?"
The problem isn't one of people who agree with the general ideology refusing to speak up on side points for fear of being identified with the minority ideology. The problem is why they're in fear of that. The problem is that being identified as being of the minority ideological group can have real consequences, even if they're mostly informal, and nasty consequences at that.
A whole campus doesn't end up dominated by one ideology spontaneously, this is engineered and enforced, and THAT is the problem.
But, yeah, you're trying to get the people doing the enforcing to relax the pogrom a bit, I get that. And you can't accomplish that if you suggested the people disagreeing might have a point.
Gladwell describes the case of a Korean Airline plane crash. The tired pilot was misjudging the landing by several miles in stormy weather. His copilot had meekly suggested using weather radar to land. Because that culture inhibits the questioning of authority, the copilot let the plane crash rather speak up. That is a harsh outcome to the suppression of alternative thinking.
Education requires the presentation of all sides of a subject. Presenting one side is indoctrination. The privileges and exemptions granted to these schools are to provide education. Do it once. Take away the tax exemption from one school, and Kerr's aspiration will be realized in a minute.
An advocacy group should mandamus the Non-Profit Office of the IRS to start to enforce its rules of tax exemption.
Indeed.
According to Gladwell, an American consultant forced a change in that airline culture. He mandated that all pilots speak English. He mandated that all crew members loudly announce problems they see. That American style cultural change saved many lives.
Who cares about why? We often won't even know why (though I know you have great faith in your speculations).
The functional upshot is the same regardless.
A whole campus doesn't end up dominated by one ideology spontaneously, this is engineered and enforced, and THAT is the problem.
No, this is your pet conspiracy theory. Number big, must be on purpose.
You sound like a broken record sometimes, like those who defended old-timey racism.
No. It's Brett who sounds like a broken record, with his conspiracy theories.
To him, every problem is a result of some left-wing conspiracy.
It really is tiresome.
Yes, I respond to the same argument when repeated the same way.
Calling an unsupported conspiracy what it is != defending racism, weirdo.
"Conspiracy" is the word you're using to strawman.
What exists are well understood series of biases and exclusions against people who are of a particular type, and not of the local majority group, because those people "don't fit" and "aren't really liked" because "They're different".
What...is exactly what racism also is.
And all the same arguments I see used why this doesn't apply, I've seen used to defend racism as well.
No, *you* misunderstand Brett's thesis.
He's arguing an intentional coordinated plan to purge conservatives out of academia.
I agree with you about group bias being a bad and hard to surmount thing for conservatives in academia. Which is why I want affirmative action.
Yes, I am arguing that. If you look at the stats on party affiliation in 'elite' universities, the percentages of Republicans started a steep downward decline around 2000, at multiple institutions. It wasn't gradual and organic, they basically altogether stopped hiring Republicans, and the existing ones have been aging out ever since.
This graph says it all.
Note, it's not all institutions, just a select group of them. But the inflection in the curve is so profound that I don't see how it can be explained as anything but a deliberate shift in policy.
Brett, I don't think it's necessarily a "plan". There's no signed declaration to "discriminate against conservatives"
It's simply that a common understanding has been reached that it is entirely acceptable to.
Well, sure, I'm not saying that they met in a volcano lair, or signed a legally binding contract. I am saying that it was somewhat more organized than just a change of mood. People talked to each other and arrived at a policy, and then applied it.
I wouldn't even go a "policy".
People talked to each other. "Did you know X supports Trump" "Ugg..." "Do you really want to work next to someone who listens to Talk radio?" "Not really" "Wasn't person Y better by comparison?" "yeah"...
And so it happens...
I'm not a social or political scientist (IANASPS?)
Having said that, there are documented shifts in political affiliations over time. One obvious example was the shift between Democrats and Republicans pre/post Civil war. That shift continues, IMHO. Regan certainly tapped into that as has every GOP candidate since. Self-sorting by political affiliation might look more drastic still when you consider the rise in Independents. Are they "conservative" or "liberal" in your graph? (I suspect they're not even represented, which could easily account for things if true.)
Then there's the fact that your graph is "New England," which is a largely liberal portion of the country. Self-selection might just be one of location rather than anything else. Are all the conservative academics seeking work in places like Texas and Florida rather than the more liberal coastal states?
I've offered two explanations that have nothing to do with university hiring policy. Does that help?
The point is that the speed and degree of the change in those specific institutions, beginning in the same time frame, makes it hard to explain except as hiring policy. To shift that fast they had to basically stop entirely hiring conservatives.
You arbitrarily declare the speed is above the threshold your intuition tells you can be explained with simple bias.
It's completely unmoored from anything but your gut!
"Beginning in the same time frame" is gibberish. Either something happened at the same time, or it didn’t. In this case, it didn't.
Note you went from "Conspiracy" to " intentional coordinated plan"
Here are some of my favorite stats....
"Over 90 percent of Trump-supporting academics wouldn't feel comfortable sharing their views with a colleague, and 85 percent of their Democratic colleagues agree that Trump supporters should stay silent."
Wow.... If that's not bias and a hostile environment, I don't know what is.
Let's continue...
"Sadly, these fears are well-founded. Using a concealed survey technique called a list experiment, I found in an August 2020 survey that four in 10 American academics would not hire a known Trump supporter. Meanwhile, one in three British academics would discriminate against a known Brexit supporter for a job, despite the fact 52 percent of the population voted to leave the European Union. Between a fifth and a half of academics would mark a right-leaning grant application lower."
Wow.
That's not a peer reviewed study. By an author of such books as 'Rise and Fall of Anglo-America (2004).'
Methinks there may be an agenda there.
A 195 page report....
And your objection is it "isn't peer reviewed"? Do you KNOW it hasn't been peer reviewed?
Un...be...lievable.
...AL, size isn't the same thing as unbiased.
I clicked through where your text shows up and read the author's posting about it. He links to his post on the CSPI website LOL.
So, in other words, you don't know it hasn't been peer reviewed.... All you know is it isn't in a peer reviewed journal.
A 195 page report, with more than 100 references.....
But because it's not in a published journal, you're going to disregard it. Never mind that you couldn't put a 195 page report in most journals. Are you going to apply the same standard to other documents? That unless the entire thing is in a peer reviewed journal, it "doesn't count". I think not.
you don't know it hasn't been peer reviewed.... All you know is it isn't in a peer reviewed journal
On whom do you think the burden is?
A 195 page report, with more than 100 references.....
I could shit that out in a day.
There's lots of crap out there, page numbers and refs are not a signal of quality.
I'm disregarding it because it aligns directly with the org that published it. I am not so prideful as to think I can't be fooled by statistics presented by a biased source. This is, in fact, one of the values peer review provides.
"On whom do you think the burden is?"
You made the allegation that it wasn't peer reviewed. Typically those who make the allegation are responsible for actually upholding it.
"A 195 page report, with more than 100 references I could shit that out in a day"
You could "shit out" a 195 page report with more than 100 references in less than a day?
No. You could not. That you think you could is laughable, pathetic, and makes it clear you have no idea the work and effort that goes into such a report. Fact is, you'd be hard pressed to simply type and reproduce those 195 pages in a single day with the entire thing in front of you. Let alone do the research and reproduce the graphs, not to mention the editing.
Very little could have made me think less of you. But that statement did it. You think you could produce a nearly 200 page document, fully edited and proofed, in less that a single day? You might as well say you could jump to the moon.
You clearly have ZERO idea of what type of effort goes into such documents and research. Your opinions should be disregarded in the future of those being an idiot who has zero concept of what real work and effort looks like.
You clearly have ZERO idea of what type of effort goes into such documents and research.
LOL. I guess you don't know what I do for a living.
You're the one citing length and number of citations as all you need to be credible.
You claim to be able to put out a 195 page white paper in a single day.
Beyond the research and everything involved...just looking at the typing alone. That ~500 words per page. Or 97,500 words. Assuming you're a world-class typist (a big assumption), at 100 words per minute, that's more than 16 hours worth of typing.
Your claim is laughable.
Those are the same thing. Do you understand what peer review is? It doesn't mean, "I asked one of my colleagues to look it over."
David,
Those aren't actually the same things. There are actually large reports that are peer reviewed, but aren't in a peer reviewed journal. That's why Sarcastro didn't "point it out". He probably knew this.
The most obvious example is the IPCC climate change reports. They're not in peer reviewed journals, but are peer reviewed. See how that works?
“Note you went from ‘Conspiracy’ to ‘intentional coordinated plan.’”
I’m turning that into an NFT. My first. Should do well.
What is a conspiracy but an intentional coordinated plan the public doesn't know about?
And while I think there is a big problem, a group that thrives on victimhood narratives self-reporting they feel like victims is not the strongest evidence out there.
You got us. Just the work of the Jewish Cabal at it again. All thwarted by Brett Bellmore!
Here's a question for you IP Lawyer.
If you had two equally qualified candidates for a position where you worked. But one supported Trump and the other didn't.
Would it make a difference on who you hired? Be honest.
Trump != conservative
If I had two equally qualified candidates and the job required great ditch-digging, I'd not care which one likes Trump because digging a ditch is not impacted by this in any way. But, in fairness, I might find a professional way to drop a hint that I'm gay and see if the Trumpian ditch-digger self-selects or not. If they don't care, then I don't care.
Now, for a job that requires investigating real facts, proving them, and assembling them into coherent arguments, I contend that people who still support Trump are incapable. No one wants a conspiracy theorist on tenure.
And that's a problem.
There are many reasons that someone would support Trump. They don't necessarily need to be a "conspiracy theorist"
The fact you are willing to actively discriminate against such people, despite their job not relying on who they support politically, in the least, is a problem.
I can't imagine how you'd have two equally qualified candidates but one of them somehow stands behind trump and his various frauds, most notable his fraudulent legal challenges to the election. I understand that you aren't an attorney, so that doesn't matter to you. But to me, as an attorney that is hiring an attorney to work under me, I would want him to have the reasoning ability to see through such frauds.
And thus, you've directly addressed the issue.
Given two equal candidates, where the only difference is that one supported Trump and the other didn't. You'd discriminate against the one who supported Trump.
That's a problem. The JOB you're in (presumably) doesn't involve Trump or politics at all. But you would discriminate on the basis of the support of a politician.
This didn't used to be acceptable. But it is now, among liberals.
The job I'm in involves the law and if a lawyer can't tell that Trump's election lawsuits were fraudulent then they are not a good attorney.
I didn't ask about the lawsuits. I asked about support of Trump, overall.
The fact that you can't differentiate between the two, the fact that someone may view the lawsuits as a poor choice, yet nevertheless support Trump overall....And BECAUSE you can't differentiate, choose to discriminate...
Speaks to you and your lack of an ability to separate politics from the evaluation of a person.
You may have had a point in 2016 — before we really got to know Trump. But his antics and lies since then should — in the minds of all thoughtful, rational adults — disqualify him from any job where integrity and intelligence are necessary conditions of employment. And the same goes for anyone who continues to support him in 2021.
I answered your question. I don't care if they like Trump or not. If they think he won the election or that it was stolen, they cannot work for me as an attorney because they'd be a moron.
"I answered your question"
Did you? Not really.
"I don't care if they like Trump or not"
Seems like you do....
But we'll ask the question again.
Joe walks in for an interview with Trump 2020 bumper stickers on his car, and a Trump 2020 hat on.
Moe walks in for an interview with Biden 2020 bumper stickers on his car, and a Biden 2020 hat on.
Does it affect your decision who to hire? Be honest.
I mean, sure: anyone who has such poor judgment that he walks into an interview with a political hat on — any political hat — is not someone I would hire. (I'm assuming that this job is for a position requiring judgment — a lawyer, paralegal, etc. — and not for a job in maintenance or the like. Not that I hire people for jobs in maintenance.)
But if we change the hypo so that for some reason I'm required to hire one of those two, Joe or Moe, with no opportunity to look for another applicant, then, sure, I'd pick Moe. Unlike skin color or national origin or the like, who one personally chooses to support actually provides relevant information about oneself.
David,
That is textbook political discrimination you're practicing then. Discrimination on the basis of political affiliation.
David,
We'll add onto this. What "relevant information" does wearing a Biden 2020 hat versus a Trump 2020 hat give you, in regards to the hiring process?
Can you tell if one is smarter? A harder worker? More detail-oriented?
What EXACTLY can you tell between the two, with certainty? Or are they just "generalities" in your opinion?
Who cares about why?
Anyone who actually would like to solve the problem.
No, this is your pet conspiracy theory.
What is seen daily on campuses across the U.S. is not "theory", you disingenuous hack.
"No, this is your pet conspiracy theory. Number big, must be on purpose."
Conspiracy?
Scientists are being openly blackballed for opposing affirmative action.
When UC did a search for Life Science faculty, three-quarters of candidates were rejected for inadequate diversity statements before even being evaluated on the merits.
It's not like anybody's hiding anything.
Exactly
I have to agree here. I have long pointed out that you can find diversity of opinions on campuses you merely need to look at different departments. Do we sit and wonder why there is a more conservative lean in the business college than in letters and science? Do we wonder why there is not more diverse discussion on how to calculate interest rates?
Why are you complaining, your ghetto is AN ENTIRE SIX BLOCKS you entitled jerk.
S_0,
It is so tiresome to see reasonable intellectual arguments dismissed instantaneously with no thought by the phrase, "this is your pet conspiracy theory."
What Orin reports is certainly the case in hard science and medical school departments. If one does not go along with the current woke screed, people just shut up, especially at top schools.
There is nothing to be gained by encouraging disparaging comments and the subsequent pile-on by otherwise well-meaning colleagues.
Yet in the other thread you pretend that Latinx is an attempt to feminize the word Latin. Completely moronic bullshit that runs contrary to the facts of the reality yet you boo hoo hoo cry here
Do you see Brett's thesis, Don?! It well beyond 'there is a bias in hiring' or even 'the culture chills dissent.'
A whole campus doesn't end up dominated by one ideology spontaneously, this is engineered and enforced, and THAT is the problem.
THAT, Don, is nonsense.
I thought that you were complaining about Orin.
The nail that stick out gets hammered. As long as people have peers, peer pressure will be a thing.
Intellectual diversity certainly helps this. However, faculty workshops can still become self-selecting bubble zones. What is the value of speaking up if you doubt the speaker will be persuaded. Why alert your opponent of problems in the argument? Spring it on them later, and embarrass them!
If you really want to generate some intellectual diversity, force people to debate, taking a position they disagree with.
I don't think red teaming does it. I really think the way to get ideological diversity is to mandate some affirmative action to retain ideological diversity.
Like, a full-on quota of conservative academics in your institution. Newspapers do that on their editorial boards already.
hmm, mandates. Why dont we just mandate people think differently?
Mandate acts, not thoughts.
You know, like 'forcing people to debate.'
Quotas never really work: they can easily be gamed by filling the quota with ineffective representatives and they make it easy to dismiss some people as only being there because of the quota.
There needs to be a commitment to encouraging actual diversity and it will flourish on its own. Any intelligent person with an a realistic amount of humility knows that a team with diverse views will produce better results than a team which thinks alike and either is better than the results from an individual.
This is like when someone resolves to 'do better.' Without anything concrete it's near meaningless.
Just reserve an unendowed chair or two for conservatives. They may not be fire breathers, but they'll be a lot better than nothing.
"reserve an unendowed chair or two for conservatives"
That is a pipe-dream. Getting an FTE from the university is very hard. Opportunities for any hires are fiercely contended. Your idea is a non-starter that only a person not living in academe could imagine.
OK. I will admit, I don't know academic hiring well at all. I cede to your experience.
So then if ideological Affirmative Action won't do it...what do you think? I really don't think 'resolve do better' will cut it, even if you could get that buy-in.
You mean the way the WaPo put Jennifer Rubin on the op-ed page as a "conservative" voice?
Plenty of conservatives don't like Trump.
But this does point to a more general issue of labels. Really what Prof. Kerr is talking about is more general heterodoxy. But I don't think one can make a policy about 'heterodoxy' nearly as easily as one can about conservativism, subjective as that label may be.
The thing is, conservatives don't generally expect to like or admire politicians, viewing politics as a dirty business that attracts dirty people. So not liking Trump doesn't particularly mean not voting for him.
Rubin was a conservative until Trump redefined conservatism as Trumpism.
I agree that quotas can't really work here. The basic problem is that these institutions are already controlled by the left, and there is a widespread agreement on the left that discrimination against rightwingers is right, just, and even necessary. Any quota would be implemented by people of that mindset.
It would be great for the job prospects of members of the Lincoln Project, but otherwise wouldn't do much.
The right needs to create its own institutions, it isn't reclaiming the ones the left have taken over any time soon.
You lost me at mandate, Sarcastr0.
Not a federal mandate, an internal school hiring mandate.
That is not working S_0.
Mandates are a conspiratorial ploy by the leftist classes.
Regular affirmative action is on the initiative of the individual institution, it seems to me this should be the same.
See above - Don is in academia and says this won't work. So back to the drawing board I guess.
Orin Kerr, do you recognize that a good deal of what divides contending parties in today's politics has to do with genuinely held beliefs that certain long-held views have proved, "off-the-wall and useless," and it is thus time to tailor the scope of acceptable debate to rule those out?
For instance, right-wing critiques of socialism seem to many on the political right to have triumphed utterly. Right wingers not only want Stalinism off limits, they also want New Deal politics off limits. To them, it's all communism—and all communism is unacceptable, not even legitimately debatable—as you can see by following this blog.
For a contrary instance, left-wing critics of racism have lost patience with counter-arguments based on demands to prove animus in the heart of a racist person. For left wing critics of racism today, the time has come to stigmatize arguments which deny disparate impact as an objective standard to identify racist policies. Thus, the commonplace tactic to put such arguments off limits by labeling their supporters as overtly racist.
Seems like to be useful today, any real academic sanctuary for diversity of opinion has to be sufficiently encompassing to host somewhat paradoxical arguments that certain views ought to be off limits. Come to think of it, I can remember puzzling discussions along those lines from my own time in college, many decades ago.
There is at least one advantage to think about the problem within a wider scope. You aren't stuck with the unresolvable problem of identifying a single axis along which to measure diversity of opinion. After all, why should a left–right political divide be singled out as the privileged focus of measurement for academic diversity?
At the very least, to do that would short-change other needfully diverse debates which are only incidentally political—such as the ones over climate, ecology, public health, guns and society, wealth distribution, abortion, religious privilege, and so on. I remain baffled by how many folks seem to think it has any meaning at all to divide up such topics according to placement on a left–right political axis. How can that be anything but an arbitrary process? I find logically inexplicable the demonstrable fact that it happens. Given that, it seems to me worse than useless to propose using a standard of left–right political diversity as a measure of academic excellence.
Well said.
Prof. Kerr wasn't really ideological in his OP. That was me. I don't see how you can do much about the more broad category of 'heterodox.'
And yes, line drawing is an issue. What is heterodox and what is lunacy?
Luckily, lunatics don't generally feel intimidated from speaking up.
Well, sure, that's what deplatforming is for: Shutting up people who aren't intimidated from speaking up.
“When an objection is made, the specific question about whether the objection has merit often brings up additional questions about why that person asked the question, what's their agenda, and the like. “
So what the person says is less important than why he said it.
This is a serious problem with the “woke.” Very often I find they go directly to the attack on your motives. They never have to respond on the merits.
Going after the motives of people whose positions you don't like is not some leftist thing.
Hmmm, are you sure?
What about this:
legislator A: I propose legislation requiring voters to show ID.
legislator B: Legislator A is a racist!!!
Ed G, problem is, Legislator C, who pals around with Legislator A, has already applauded publicly the racist outcome he expects from voter ID.
Did you think I meant it's something no leftists do?
It's across all ideologies.
The modern left does not care about any kind of intellectual "diversity" and in fact they don't really care about "diversity" all that much either. It is all about the victim classes getting their just desserts. That is the extent of their ideological convictions. If free speech and equal protection get in the way - well begone with those. Anything else stopping this perceived correction of historical wrongs is also at least inconvenient and at most outright dangerous and will be treated accordingly.
I am not especially convinced that the right cares about intellectual diversity either.
The right cares about intellectual diversity for the same reason the left did decades ago: Because if it's suppressed, they're the ones being suppressed.
But, decades ago, the right had the same dominance that the left has now, and somehow it slipped from their fingers. How could that happen?
It could happen because the right weren't determined to suppress every dissenting perspective, the way the left are today.
It comes down to a fundamental difference: The right are authoritarian, the left are totalitarian. Both authoritarians and totalitarians want your obedience. Only the totalitarians go further, and insist on getting your love and agreement, too, or else.
Authoritarians can tolerate dissenting speech, as long as their orders are obeyed. (And the orders will typically be about a limited number of topics, authoritarians aren't total control freaks.) Totalitarians can't.
If you have to pick between authoritarians and totalitarians, always go with the authoritarians. You can obey them and otherwise live your life.
How could that happen?
Because the "right" ideas and practices are anti-American and our nation decided to discard them.
As we've been doing for 240+ years and will continue to do.
You're on the wrong (losing) side of history and will forever remain there.
Wrong side of history! anti-American!
lmao, no.
You sayin' the Constitution and amendments are lying?!?
There is plenty of room to debate the scope and meaning of the bill of rights.
Of course there's room to debate some constitutional meanings.
Even Brett has some measured insights on the Privileges or Immunities clause (when he's not being a whiney douche).
At the same time, there are also some things that are pretty clear:
* Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States. . . .
* The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of race, color, or previous condition of servitude.
* The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of sex.
* The right of citizens of the United States to vote in any primary or other election for (federal positions) shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or any State by reason of failure to pay poll tax or other tax.
And those are the things I'm talking about.
We progressed past conservative ways and moved into a more enlightened position that we where previously.
hmm, decades ago the right had dominance? No. Depends what you think right and left mean; Those terms change every few decades. Reagan was a right of center Democrat by modern standards, and Clinton was a left of center Republican, because both sides have drifted to extremes. Keynes is still dominant for example in economics circles, and has been since the 1930s. Nixon and Reagan were both Keynesians. Reagan blew out the budget deficit. The budget managed to be balanced under Clinton. Reagan would be primaried for even considering gun control, while Clinton would be primaried for policies on immigration and welfare reductions. Remember those times Clinton said abortion should be rare and the era of big gubmint is over? How about Al and Tipper Gore getting warning labels on sexually explicit or violent music? Or Senator Clinton sponsoring a bill to impose fines on retailers who sold violent video games to minors? This is the same party that now finds themself defending sexually explicit material in schools.
If you think that the right was dominant decades ago, the word right does not mean what you think it means.
The right that was dominant decades ago wasn't today's right, to be sure. But it sure as hell wasn't yesterday's left, either. The right had the same institutional dominance then that the left has today, and they didn't use it to quash all dissent.
Sure they did. McCarthy was a Republican.
Sure, McCarthy was a Republican, but communists weren't "all dissent".
And, demonstrably, the purge wasn't comprehensive, the left ended up in control.
the left ended up in control
No they sure didn't! The left got purged. Socialism has been a taboo subject in America from then until the Millennials.
Don't mistake the rump liberals that remained for the full extent of leftist discourse.
"Socialism has been a taboo subject in America from then until the Millennials."
Huh? Che Guevera shirts have always been way more popular than Swastikas.
Yeah, those shirts are only warn by real deep policy thinkers that have loads of access to the halls of power.
Edgy T-shirts are not a sign of where the line of acceptable debate is.
"Yeah, those shirts are only warn by real deep policy thinkers that have loads of access to the halls of power.
Edgy T-shirts are not a sign of where the line of acceptable debate is."
Fair enough. Ditto for Confederate flags, I presume?
Yes, Absaroka. I don't think the South rising again is a part of mainstream discourse.
Taboo? An outright communist asking to nationalize everybody's savings almost ended up comptroller of the currency!
No, she wasn't a Communist, you've just got 1950s McCarthyism brain.
McCarthy was a Republican, but communists weren't "all dissent".
To the right at the time it was pretty close. Civil rights activists, for example, were often denounced as communists, as were opponents of the Vietnam War.
That's right. And once he was done, there were no Democrats or liberal Republicans left in this country who weren't in prison or abstaining from political action because they were cowering in fear.
By that bar, Mussolini was into ideological diversity.
they didn't use it to quash all dissent.
Not for lack of trying. Where were you in the fifties and sixties?
Haha, he walked into that one.
In fact, they still do today:
reports were collected from faculty members throughout the University of examples of incursions on academic freedom. The most significant issues reported to this committee involve
barriers to faculty research and publication,
restrictions related to participating in outside activities that allegedly challenge the political priorities of the executive branch of the State, and
pressure to alter syllabi and course content to avoid viewpoints unpopular among current elected state leaders.
There were specific challenges reported that were related to research on Covid-19, a topic of study across a wide-range of academic units at the University of Florida. Some examples of
challenges reported to the ad hoc committee include external pressure to destroy deidentified data, barriers to accessing and analyzing deidentified data in a timely manner, and barriers to
publication of scientific research which, taken together, inhibited the ability of faculty to contribute scientific findings during a world-wide pandemic.
The "mf" are numbers 1,2 and 3. Everythig after "today" is a quote from the UF report.
Note, by the way, that the UF "report" did not actually find - or even look for - any such events. It merely asked people if they had "concerns".
Considering the conspiracy theories that have been bouncing around DeSantis for the past two years, it isn't surprising to see people on the Left "concerned" about things.
I remember my L3 class in Political & Civil Rights taught by Professor David Goldberger. He was the Jewish ACLU attorney who represented the Neo-NAZIs at Skokie. His class was a safe place for a conservative to safely voice their views.
I think that's exactly right but I'd go farther. I think that intellectual diversity gives ppl permission to think of ideas they might otherwise not let themselves think.
It sounds like you need Jordan Peterson on your faculty. At the very least, invite Professor Peterson to give a seminar on speaking your mind.
Me likum hokum man
Just don't feed him any apple cider or he might have a three-month long mental and physical breakdown because of it!
Intellectual diversity and honesty are not in vogue at the moment.
Team loyalty is what's in vogue.
"The case for intellectual diversity is usually expressed in terms of the value of having different ideas. No one ideological perspective has a monopoly on the truth, the argument runs."
And to the progressives, this is an accurate and concise problem definition.
They are in the process of addressing that problem.
group think is alive and well on campus,
- with all the problems associated with it
- not only do minority viewpoints not speak up
- the ideology police actively work against those who do
- this creeps into various academic organizations and journals
And there are limits to what kinds of intellectual diversity are useful, with judgments always needing to be made about what views are off-the-wall and useless versus on-the-wall and useful.
Seems like that bit reframes everything which preceded it. And not in an encouraging way.
On the bright side, suppressing dissent, ad hominem attacks, and questioning motives are signs of intellectually feeble arguments.
True.
So, we know that leftists' arguments are intellectually (and morally) feeble. They know it too, which is why they're going all out trying to suppress dissent. On college campuses, they've pretty much succeeded. Here's hoping they fail elsewhere.
I'm not so sure of this. The workshops and seminars I've been at have not lacked for participants challenging the speaker. Sometimes there has been what seemed to be competition to be the smartest person in the room.
Admittedly, these did not deal with controversial political topics, so maybe they were different, but I have a hard time believing that the same sort of egos are not at work in most workshops, including the kind Orin discusses.
Bernard,
If I think about workshops focused on hard science issues, then I have seen vigorous debate and disagreement at a level that has not changed during my entire career.
If I compare that with comments about political, sociological and economic issues as discussed in faculty meetings, informal faculty gatherings etc., I have seen the level of disagreement and debate decrease remarkably over the past 20 years. In other words diversity of thought about values has shrunk dramatically. Diversity of thought about falsifiable, hard science remains robust.
For now, and for most topics. The purge in the STEM majors is in progress, it will take a couple decades to complete, since it is accomplished by ceasing to hire candidates who fail ideological tests, rather than by firing.
Incidentally, following the reports about Omicron, I finally decided to get vaccinated Monday. Not so much in fear of a severe case, as proactively making sure I'm not forced to spend 2 weeks of PTO at a time not of my choosing on account of having the wrong species of head cold.
The reaction was a bit more severe than my usual flu shot, but minor compared to the Shingles shots. Still weighing whether to get the 2nd shot, which I had to sign up for on account of booster shots only being available to those who'd already been vaccinated.
The purge in the STEM majors is in progress, it will take a couple decades to complete, since it is accomplished by ceasing to hire candidates who fail ideological tests, rather than by firing.
This is jut more fan fiction. You gotta stop that.
From one perspective, this may be a good thing. What you describe as "hard science issues" are really just the experts in that field having deep, topic-specific debate within their expertise. Whereas, the political, sociological, and economic issues discussed informally among co-workers are self-censored. Could the polarization of Americans in general be leading most professionals to avoid hot-button issues with their coworkers in order to preserve harmony in their work environment? This wouldn't necessarily represent a lack of "diversity of thought" but rather a common sense response to polarizing topics.
I'd also caution that "diversity of thought" as it relates to hard sciences *within a specific field* remains robust, but people outside of that field have their own opinions and those opinions might be misinformed. Example: global climate change. The quality of "diversity of opinions" within the field is likely to be far, far higher than the quality of that diversity outside the field. I hope we're not suggesting that we should give non-expert, climate science deniers equal billing?
Shawn.
Your take on my "hard science issues" is exactly what you describe, topic-specific debate, such as "What is the nature of dark matter?"
However, in our faculty what you refer to as "hot button issues" are talked about frequently, but with the voice opinions being very one-sided and with many members of our department never speaking.
With respect to Brett's comment, I have never heard discussion of a candidate's take on social issues ever being discussed in hiring evaluations aside to our commitments to interview and consider a "more diverse" set of candidates. So I reject Brett's hypothesis.
I've noticed even here that views going against the grain are often qualified. Think of almost any post on the rioting that occurred during the BLM protests with the almost obligatory reference to "mostly peaceful protests" or a discussion of a sexual assault hoax and the obligatory reference to the rarity of such hoaxes, absent very much proof they they are rare.
Finally there are assertions with no quantification the effects of a policy. One example is voter id laws, which are purported to suppress black votes, but could do the same for other segments of society not having the same interests, like the elderly. Another example if the treatment of transgender persons, with little or not consideration of the effects on the population at large for a vanishing small number of people in most contexts.
5 minutes on Google and I was able to find peer reviewed studies showing quantification of the effects on voter ID laws along with the flaws in some of those studies and presentation of new information after accounting for the flaws. These studies include impact on all minorities, not just Black Americans.
Diversity of thought is a great thing, but that doesn't mean bad ideas need to be constantly debunked in the name of fairness. (Even if you really, really believe the debunked idea must be true because an angry white guy on FOX told you so.)
Maybe sometimes people don't speak up because it's not important. Someone presents an idea and you do not totally agree with it but it not worth your time to get into a discussion of the matter. You will save your disagreements for topic you think more important.
Why make this about Academia? I have been on many campuses and always felt free to express myself...even if I could tell the people's blood pressure was going up...in retrospect I can only laugh at some of the things I said.
Now that I am out in the business world, it is way harder to speak up in terms of the social (and supervisor) pressure that you get.
For example it is common for our team to get called together to what I would call the underpants gnome talk; "Blah, blah, blah... [insert magic]... sales will skyrocket!"
Usually, afterword everyone is either numbly staring at the ground or brown nosing the speaker. Sometimes I say something like "That doesn't make any sense" or "How would that work?". But I got tired of it cause it just makes everyone uncomfortable. My spousal unit tries to explain this is not a good career move, but you have to find your fun where you can.