Today in Supreme Court History: March 7, 1965

3/7/1965: Civil rights marchers are attacked by the police in Selma, Alabama. The event would become known as "Bloody Sunday."

Comments

[DaivdBehar]

Prior to this date, all racial disparities in social pathology were small. For example, for example, 5% vs 7%.

After the lawyer got through with black people, the disparities became horrific, like 400%. The Black family survived slave auctions, genocidal maniac lawyer attacks by the Klan, lawyer designed Jim Crow laws, racial segregation and discrimination. It did not survive the War on Poverty, ending with a 70%+ bastardy rate. That locked in the disparate poverty rate, the high crime rate, and all other social pathologies. Black people in patriarchal families with religiosity outperformed whites in the 2010 Census. For example, very dark skinned African immigrants induced a new racial stereotype of a very high performer, super desirable to employers and admissions officials. Of course, the one who became President was not from the American South, but from Kenya. His upbringing was not devastated by the American lawyer, taking place abroad in a poor country like Indonesia, in a traditional Muslim, patriarchal family.

Good job lawyer profession, generating worthless, make work government jobs that fail to address the disparities you caused.

[Dr. Ed 2]

If you toned down your ideology a bit, you'd actually have a point here -- actually several.

First and foremost, I have seen allegations that the march over the Edmund Pettis Bridge was intentionally provocative -- that Bull Connor was being silenced as quickly as people could do it (his public safety position had been eliminated in 1963) and that people really were trying to clean up the police department.

I can't speak to that, but looking at the bridge -- then or now -- the first thing that comes to immediate mind is no sidewalk -- you can't walk across it without disrupting traffic. It's not the venue I would have picked -- and blocking traffic really isn't "nonviolent."

Personally, I think that it was a tactically stupid thing to do -- you don't want Joe Sixpack concluding that you are a-holes, and that was the genius of both the Freedom Riders and the Lunch Counter Sitins. Joe Sixpack may have been a racist, but he'd also conclude "what the hell is wrong with selling those kids hot dogs? -- *I* would because I want the money."

And this is the distinction between WEB DuBois and Booker T Washington and George Washington Carver. The latter two realized that self-interest would supersede racism, that people wouldn't want to be racist.

For example, if a farmer's crops are failing, both his cow and his (drinking water) well have gone dry, his horse is lame and he's terrified that his wife will die in childbirth -- and if the Black guy who lives a couple miles down the road knows how to prevent all of this from happening -- either personally knows or knows other (Black) people who do -- the White farmer isn't going to be a racist anymore.

Hence Tuskegee University and the rest --- and that was a very different approach that we've forgotten because WEB DuBois lived longer.

[DaivdBehar]

Doctor. Tell me the phrases you think are not appropriate.

[Queen Amalthea]

Behar and Dr. Ed, "you've got your crazy trolling in my whacky nuttiness!" "No, you got your whacky nuttiness in my crazy trolling!"

[DaivdBehar]

Just insults. I do not even inderstand them. You are blithering.

[Queen Amalthea]

" I do not even inderstand them."

Oh, I'm sure of that!

[David Nieporent]

Behar and Dr. Ed, “you’ve got your crazy trolling in my whacky nuttiness!” “No, you got your whacky nuttiness in my crazy trolling!”

I wish I could marry that comment.

[DaivdBehar]

David. You sound frustrated and angry. Start a club with Artie.

[apedad]

Joe Sixpack?

I like how you tried to sugarcoat mouthbreathers from Tennessippi.

[DaivdBehar]

Snob. There is no justification for your superior attitude. Your peofession stinks and is in utter failure. It does nothing well except take our $trillion and provide nothing of value. Whatever Joe Sixpack does, he provides 10 times the value as a lawyer. This is true even if disabled, sitting at home. At least, he would not be causing the damage of the most toxic occupation in the country.

[apedad]

BUUUUZZZZZZ!

I'm not a lawyer but thanks for playing.

[Nige]

Good lord this is special.

[Jimmy the Dane]

January 6th should go down as a similar day. A million people from all over the country show up in DC, after enduring a months long campaign of censorship, to have their voices heard. And what is the result? Brutal oppression after the event with freedom fighters being unfairly prosecuted and held before trail, unconstitutionally, without bail. All while the same people caterwauling about a sit-in stoked the flames of racial hatred all summer resulting in widespread looting and rioting. Congress should dedicate a Day of Atonement for what happened on January 6th.

[Dr. Ed 2]

I think that "Letters from Birmingham Jail" is a better analogy.

Yes, two of the fatalities were a direct result of law enforcement -- Ashli Babbit who was shot by a STILL UNNAMED police officer and a woman who was crushed to death. The latter is a combination of tactical incompetence, lack of a unified crowd control strategy, and overly aggressive officers -- it's something that I have been raising with both college police chiefs and student affairs administrators for decades.

(They wouldn't run bald tires on their cruisers -- they freely admit that -- yet can't comprehend that people can be and are crushed to death by crowds. They just don't "think"...)

But _Letters from Birmingham Jail_ is the better analogy because if the FBI had pulled a Bull Connor stunt, the sane left would be saying that they would have gone too far. And if there were bodies floating down the Potomac, the environmentalists would be raising concerns about how that would be depleting the level of dissolved oxygen in the water (which it would) and how that will harm the endangered something-or-other (which, OK, it would...).

What we have here is an abuse of process more than actual violence. Both are wrong, but we need to maintain accuracy.

And the other thing is that this is rather stupid on the FBI's part because they are revealing their methods and abilities. For example, in using credit card data to determine who was in DC on January 6th (including businessmen engaged in business meetings no where near the protests), they are telling everyone who is truly of malicious intent to either use cash -- or a stolen credit card. Or something that doesn't come back to you....

I'm not going to speak to the wisdom of the FBI, but if I had such a means to track truly dangerous/bad people, I'd be damn careful about using it lest the general public (and hence said "truly dangerous/bad people") learned that I could do it. And hence that they needed to take means to avoid this ability of mine.

And once the public learns of a tactic or ability, you can't unring that bell...

[David Nieporent]

MLK only wrote one letter from the jail, and getting that wrong was the least incorrect thing in your comment.

[DaivdBehar]

January 6 was our pro-democracy movement takeover of the Hong Kong Parliament, after no legal recourse was posdible. The mass arrests of dissenters by Democrat Party enforcers is coming soon.

[Alpheus W Drinkwater]

So many commenters to ignore here now.

[DaivdBehar]

That is bevause you are a denier. Here is a denier screening question. Was 9/11 a CIA/Mossad operation? Did the outbuildings come down in a timed detonation of explosives. Answer the questions denier.

[Alpheus W Drinkwater]

No and no. For those particular questions, I am proud to be a denier. Now back to the whole ignoring thing.

[DaivdBehar]

All deniers are anti-semites and racists. Say hello to Pavel.

[LawTalkingGuy]

You think a demand to overturn election results and entrench minority rule based on bogus claims that people in majority black areas are committing massive fraud is the same as the Civil Rights Movement?

[Queen Amalthea]

"after enduring a months long campaign of censorship"

People didn't believe our ludicrous claims=censorship

And we all remember when the guys at Selma with the zip ties yelling to hang the VP smashing windows and swarming in.

This is how laughably pathetic conservatism is now folks. Conservatism is a large extremist nutty fringe with a thin mainstream coating of people who want smaller government.

[Ben_]

Now people who are for freedom and equal rights get attacked by Antifa while police watch and let it happen.

Leftists applaud the violence because someone told them a story about bogeymen like QAnon and they spend their lives afraid and hateful of their fellow Americans.

[Queen Amalthea]

"they spend their lives afraid and hateful of their fellow Americans."

The Least Self Aware Person in the World Folks.

[Ben_]

You are exactly what you pretend to dislike the most: someone who is happy to mistreat people who are not like you. Leftists point fingers at others while more-or-less universally engaging in bigotry and hateful behavior themselves.

[LawTalkingGuy]

Let’s assume leftists do that. What’s your excuse for your anger, hate, and cruelty?

[Queen Amalthea]

He's not self-aware enough to get how he constantly projects what he decries.

[LawTalkingGuy]

I am now more concerned that he doesn’t understand the concepts of humor and figurative language.

[DaivdBehar]

No one is less self aware than the dumbass lawyer in failure, save for taking our $trillion and returning nothing of value. The nation would be btter off fulfilling the goals of each law subject without this toxic occupation.

[Ben_]

Victims of cruelty feel anger. Didn't you know?

[LawTalkingGuy]

What is the cruelest thing someone has done to you in your lifetime?

[Ben_]

So you can laugh? Or so the other leftist assholes here can pile on?

[LawTalkingGuy]

No. Why would I laugh at someone deliberately hurting you?

[Ben_]

Why are leftists intentionally hurtful to people who are not like them? Same reason Klansmen are.

[LawTalkingGuy]

Why are rightists?

[Ben_]

Same reason, on the occasions when it happens. Klansmen and gun controllers and anti-religious people are all bigots who want to mistreat and do harmful things to people who are not like them.

[Sarcastr0]

You're not answering LTG's question.

[Ben_]

What question?

[LawTalkingGuy]

Interesting that you include gun controllers. Has it ever occurred to you that people think mass shootings and gun violence are cruel and would like them to stop?

[Ben_]

Gun controllers are ignorant of guns and people who own guns and think it’s ok to harm people who are not like them who own guns and never hurt anyone with them. Gun controllers never try to learn about the thing they hate or the people they want to hurt. They don’t consider the lives of the innocent people they want to have arrested.

It’s almost a precise match to the way Klansmen or other bigots think.

Klansmen point at urban violence exactly like you’re pointing at "mass shootings". Urban violence is also cruel. It’s not an excuse for targeting innocent people who are not like you.

[Dr. Ed 2]

"Why are leftists intentionally hurtful to people who are not like them? Same reason Klansmen are."

Klansmen don't have college degrees -- leftists do.

That's why I consider leftists more despicable -- they've had the gift of an education and hence ought to know better...

[LawTalkingGuy]

I’ve shot several types of guns. I’ve also seen autopsy photos of gun victims and listened to the testimony of the witnesses who saw their kids murdered.

You know what is cruelty? Insisting that maintaining the ability to kill other people with ease is a special personality trait that is more valuable than human lives. Shrugging off death and insisting it’s because mean liberals want to “hurt” you by making it harder for you to kill other people is a cruel and callous act. Gun ownership isn’t an innate human trait. It’s a choice. A choice that says something about your values. A choice that you privilege above human lives. Would you give up you guns to save a life? If the answer is no, you are cruel person.

[Ben_]

Targeting innocents who never hurt anyone is targeting innocents. Period.

People who never hurt anyone are not a threat to "human lives".

Innocent people are not guilty by association. Not because they look a certain way, not because of their innocent hobbies, not because of their peaceable beliefs.

Stop targeting innocents. Stop making excuses to target innocents. That’s what bigots do: appeal to emotion, engage in guilt-by-association, and target innocents based on that emotion and that prejudice.

[Dr. Ed 2]

"Would you give up you guns to save a life? If the answer is no, you are cruel person."

Would you give up your car to save a human life?

[Nige]

Shooters at schools are targeting innoents. Gun restrictions are causing minor inconveniences to gun owners, some of whom have massive entitlement issues.

[DaivdBehar]

Democrats laugh at suffering because they are dicks. Turn on 99% of any show on TV especially the news.

[LawTalkingGuy]

When I go to the comments it’s like I’m in a movie theater: I’m surrounded by projectors.

[Ben_]

Because movie theaters have more than one projector? And they surround you when you're there?

Keep trying.

[LawTalkingGuy]

A “movie theater” is an obvious synecdoche for a cineplex. A cineplex would have multiple projectors and would be around a person in the building,

But more importantly: do you think pedantic nitpicking about obvious jokes and sarcasm makes you smart or clever? Because it really just makes you seem like you can’t grasp figurative language at all.

[Ben_]

Do you think responding to pedantic nitpicking helps you out somehow?

If you want to make a joke, try being funny. Or amusing. Or clever.

Or do what someone else might do: write it, read it, and then think twice about posting it because it’s no good.

[LawTalkingGuy]

“Or do what someone else might do: write it, read it, and then think twice about posting it because it’s no good.”

You have obviously never listened to this advice.

[Ben_]

Incorrect

[LawTalkingGuy]

Well then you really need to think three times because in this thread you:

1. Called someone a liar for making a joke.
2. Then pretended sarcasm was a form of “leftist dishonesty.”

Neither of those are good takes.

[Ben_]

Noted

[Jimmy the Dane]

Or in the case of the capitol hill freedom festival the police shoot unarmed protesters. And, what is sick most of all, is the media discovers their new found appreciation for the police because they shot the "right kind" of protester.

[Nige]

What's even weirder is the right suddenly getting mad at the police for shooting unarmed protestors.

[Dan Schiavetta]

The loonies are out today. Please, Eugene, get this blog off of Reason. Go independent again.

[Rev. Arthur L. Kirkland]

The Volokh Conspiracy is getting precisely what it wants, in large part because it is actively attracting and lathering these followers.

This is their middle finger to the deans, faculty colleague, and mainstream society that don't want them around.

[Krychek_2]

I brought home this great clock last time I was in Switzerland. Every hour the little door opens, the little bird comes out and discusses the views of Daivd, Jimmy the Dane, Dr. Ed and Ben.

[Dr. Ed 2]

Where in Switzerland did you obtain it?

I want one, and have sources in switzerland....

[Queen Amalthea]

Ed wants to know how he can subscribe to the bird's newsletter.

[Ben_]

Liar

[LawTalkingGuy]

Yeah I guess people who are being obviously sarcastic are in some technical sense “liars” since what they are saying is not a true recounting of factual occurrences. But it’s pretty weird to call someone a liar for engaging in it.

[Ben_]

It’s just another form of leftist dishonesty. And an assholish one at that.

If leftists ever stopped being dishonest and uncivil, America might be able to come together a little bit. So they won't.

[LawTalkingGuy]

Sarcasm is a form of “leftist dishonesty?” One of the oldest rhetorical forms in human history is leftist dishonesty? Did anyone bother to tell that to Babylon Bee?

Also isn’t it far more assholish to call someone a liar, which is a grave moral transgression, when they’re merely and obviously joking? I mean talk being about uncivil.

[Ben_]

He's actually a lot worse than that.

[LawTalkingGuy]

Why? Because he made a dumb joke?

[Ben_]

No.

[Queen Amalthea]

Ben man few words.

[LawTalkingGuy]

So you called him a liar for making an obvious joke, while you yourself were either lying or being woefully ignorant about the nature of sarcasm. And you justify it because he is “a lot worse than that” and has done something worse to earn your ire mixed with dishonesty?

[Ben_]

It's false. That’s enough. Stop making excuses for him.

[LawTalkingGuy]

It’s obviously false that he went to Switzerland to get a cuckoo clock that had birds read your out your comments. It was obviously false because it is a joke. That was the point.

Calling someone a liar for making an obvious joke is itself a form of dishonesty that you are trying to justify. I don’t think I’m the one who needs to stop making excuses, dude.

[Ben_]

If it’s obvious he was joking, then the context of that obviousness also informs the response.

[LawTalkingGuy]

It’s not an “if” question, he obviously was.

Why are you being so willfully obtuse?

[Ben_]

Why was a guy making an assholish comment about me?

[LawTalkingGuy]

Maybe because he finds your views cuckoo? It was kind of evident. Why did you feel such a mild comment merited another insult based in willful dishonesty?

[Ben_]

What views?

Why shouldn’t I respond to someone being an asshole about me? What's a more concise response? Let’s hear your idea of an awesome response that no one would ever complain about. Post it here.

[LawTalkingGuy]

Maybe something like: “my views aren’t cuckoo” and an explanation of why. Or maybe something that turned the clock metaphor back on him? Another joke perhaps?

The problem, isn’t the fact of response. It’s not even that a response wouldn’t merit complaint or pushback. The problem is that your chosen response made no sense and was rooted in willful ignorance/dishonesty, which is sort of ironic considering the response was “liar.”

[Ben_]

Complain about the response. Then, given a direct challenge to come up with a better one to validate the complaint, fail to come up with anything.

I’ll wait if you want to try it.

[LawTalkingGuy]

I’m still waiting for you to admit either :

1. Your response sucked and was dishonest,
2. You lied about the nature of sarcasm.

OR

You don’t understand figurative language and need help.

Guess we’ll both be waiting a long time.

[Ben_]

One thing you may want to note: attempts to change the subject to get me to talk about myself fail. We all know no one cares to hear it and the only reason to try that approach it is to uncover an opening to launch attacks.

[Nige]

*clock whirrs bird clears throat*

[Queen Amalthea]

Whoa, Ben reaching in to his Big Words for Arguing bag today.

[Krychek_2]

Where’s the lie? I actually do own a cuckoo clock, and “cuckoo, cuckoo “ actually is a fairly accurate discussion of your views. So what did I say that’s false?

[DaivdBehar]

Krychek gets insults from the KGB Handbook, wet from the garbage.

[Queen Amalthea]

No, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, and a nut is actually a nut.

[David Nieporent]

Does the KGB have a handbook? Does it actually contain insults?

[bernard11]

Is it in English?

[Queen Amalthea]

One notices that our regular conservative crowd simply can't appreciate what went on that day. They have some vague idea that it's considered important and heroic but can't get why or how, and so at best they use it for a type of nos quoque.

[Jimmy the Dane]

Liberals can't understand what the seismic effect of January 6, 2021 had or why it was important. They have no idea what went on that day other then some biased accounts that provided a vaguely factual retelling of the actual happenings. Instead of trying to understand what transpired on that day and its importance, they wallowed in their own self flagellation of ignorance.

[Nige]

We know it signified the right's intention to go to an extreme to overthrow democratic elections. I don't think that should ever be forgotten. It really is the anti-Selma in that way.

[Cal Cetín]

Not to be confused with the 1972 Bloody Sunday which U2 sang about.

[Seamus]

Or the 1971 movie with Glenda Jackson and Peter Finch.

[Number 2]

Or this:

Bloody Sunday or Red Sunday[1] (Russian: Крова́вое воскресе́нье, tr. Krovávoye voskresén'e, IPA: [krɐˈvavəɪ vəskrʲɪˈsʲenʲjɪ]) is the name given to the events of Sunday, 22 January [O.S. 9 January] 1905 in St Petersburg, Russia, when unarmed demonstrators, led by Father Georgy Gapon, were fired upon by soldiers of the Imperial Guard as they marched towards the Winter Palace to present a petition to Tsar Nicholas II of Russia.

This year is the first I am hearing the anniversary of the Selma march also being referred to as “Bloody Sunday.” Not sure why we needed to borrow a term already in use elsewhere.

[David Nieporent]

This year is the first I am hearing the anniversary of the Selma march also being referred to as “Bloody Sunday.” Not sure why we needed to borrow a term already in use elsewhere.

Not sure why you're bragging about your own ignorance. The attack on blacks at the Edmund Pettis Bridge was dubbed Bloody Sunday almost immediately.

[David Nieporent]

*Pettus.

[Cal Cetín]

Oh, this is interesting:

"November 1, 2019

"(CNN) McDonald's has pulled an ad which used the words "Sundae Bloody Sundae" to promote a Halloween dessert, apologizing for "any offense or distress" it may have caused.

"Bloody Sunday is the name for the day in 1972 on which British soldiers shot unarmed protesters in Derry, Northern Ireland, during the Troubles -- resulting in 14 deaths....

"In 2013, a London bar apologized after an outcry over a cocktail named "Sundae Bloody Sundae," which was served with a small toy soldier."

https://edition.cnn.com/2019/10/31/europe/mcdonalds-sundae-bloody-sundae-advert-scli-intl/index.html

[bernard11]

Your point?

[Cal Cetín]

"Bloody Sunday" isn't assumed by everyone to be an American event, you Ugly American.

[bernard11]

I know that, asshole, but what is your point?

Do you think McDonald's did something wrong by pulling the ad? "Gave in to the woke mob or something?"

[Rev. Arthur L. Kirkland]

How is the search for Obama's communist Muslim Kenyan birth certificate progressing, mad_kalak?

[Nige]

Your failure was to show there wasn't. Why fight so? They were fighting for democracy.