Tyler Cowen: Why Do We Refuse To Learn From History?

Economist Tyler Cowen on historical lessons, populism today, and the philosophical debates within libertarianism.

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Tyler Cowen: Why Do We Refuse To Learn From History?

Why are we forgetting history's lessons?

We're told in school that we study history so as not to repeat its mistakes. But what if those lessons aren't sticking? Today's guest regularly invokes what he calls The Great Forgetting. The striking thing about this collective amnesia is that it doesn't apply only to distant, ancient history, but hard lessons learned only a few decades ago—lessons about inflation, price controls, and crime.

Tyler Cowen is the Holbert L. Harris Professor of Economics at George Mason University, Director of the Mercatus Center, and host of the podcast Conversations with Tyler. He and his colleague Alex Tabbarok founded the popular and influential economics blog Marginal Revolution and recently launched their joint show, the Marginal Revolution Podcast, which has released a limited series on the unlearned economic and cultural lessons of the 1970s.

• Producer: John Osterhoudt

Comments

[Peter Kreeft taught me LOGIC, BEWARE !!!!!!!]

Tyler seems to be making a Public Choice argument of sorts. After all , at least initially, you learn those things in school, publicly-mandated inescapable public schools.
I would show this by reference to CIVICS , which one would think the best barometer of how well an American school teaches.
-- But what's this :

2 of 3 Americans Wouldn’t Pass U.S. Citizenship Test
A survey found that people aged 65 and older were more likely to pass the test than those aged 45 and younger.

https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2018-10-12/2-of-3-americans-wouldnt-pass-us-citizenship-test

[Bubba Jones]

The problem is this:

The economically literate answer is for me to give up X now, so that future generations can have Y later. e.g. social security, medicare

But what if voters don't care about future generations?

[Peter Kreeft taught me LOGIC, BEWARE !!!!!!!]

That means in almost ALL cases, they don't have children themselves.
Think Kamala.

[Beezard]

The greatest generation had plenty of kids when they set us on the path to social democrat implosion.

[Not a Conservative but a Biden LOATHER]

Nothing supports that and Tom Brokaw's book destroys it.
I heard him in an interview speaking about what he left out of hte book. He asked many of his respondents < what is the greatest change you've seen in your lifetime? He expected moon shot or computers but he says they overwhelmingly said 'DIVORCE"
Social democrats they never were.

[Not a Conservative but a Biden LOATHER]

NO, deferred gratification generally benefits only you. If you are a Libertarian you rightly don't subscirbe to your nonsense. ROnald Bailey has written books against your view and he only continues the argument of Julian Simon.

[Bubba Jones]

Define "we"

[Super Scary]

He must have a mouse in his pocket.

[InsaneTrollLogic (On The List!)]

Who's "we", kemosabe?

[Stupid Government Tricks]

I have my doubts about how useful any civics test is. Try testing all those new immigrants 10 or 20 years later. How many would still pass those same tests?

As for old folks passing and younguns failing, all it really implies is either (1) schools used to spend more time on the fundamentals, or (2) the oldsters are looking up the fundamentals again in reaction to all that woke crap they teach the youngsters.

I doubt I used even 10% of what schools taught me once I passed the tests. Readin' writin' and 'rithmetic was what mattered, and almost everything I have learned since was stuff I thought myself. State history? One teacher's fanatical love of Robert Frost? Van de Graaf generators make hair stand on end?

[Peter Kreeft taught me LOGIC, BEWARE !!!!!!!]

You have doubts and I have 'certainty' --- when will your doubts resolve into an actual position -- because we can't go into the future on the basis 'it seems' or "I sorta think"

I mentioned Civics,the study in this case of those core things that we agree upon because we are Americans -- and you morph that into "what schools taught me" , quite the leap.

Judging by your experience , why go to school at all. Seriously, why, What do you have to say.

[MWAocdoc]

Having not allowed myself to become exposed to the details of this podcast, I nevertheless would like to point out that it is impossible to learn the lessons of history because there ARE NO lessons from history to learn from. History NEVER repeats itself. Studying history is a fascinating hobby that can teach us NOTHING about what decisions we should try to make in the future. There are certainly a few general principles we should learn about and try to apply to current conditions, but don't delude yourself that they will prevent bad decisions or bad outcomes in any kind of reliable way. Life is chaotic, just try to avoid going out of your way to make bad decisions that you know are bad, that's the best any of us can do.

[Roberta]

The vast majority of what's taught as history is things that no individual could ever act on anyway.

[Not a Conservative but a Biden LOATHER]

Which wrong conclusion you must have come to by : Studying History.
Neeeeeeeext !!!!!

[tommhan]

I am 71 and have and do not have a college degree but could easily pass a citizenship test. I have done so online a few times or more since I love trivia quizzes. I find that most people overall know nothing really about the 3 branches of government and how it all works. Our schools have failed the citizens in teaching "feeling" in place of facts. We need to stop with the social aspect being the only thing important in our school systems. Stop rewarding everyone with praise and trophies and get back to the time when you only get what you deserve in school and workplace. And people need to read and then read some more. Keep your brain active and don't only read or live in an echo chamber. Both sides of the political spectrum have some good points. And like the late great Rodney King said, " Why can't we all just get along."

[Peter Kreeft taught me LOGIC, BEWARE !!!!!!!]

Getting along is not like what has good points from all angles.
Getting along is agreeing on Religous Freedom, all men are created equal,and the Bill of Rights.
FGM, honor killing, jihad -- you should not be allowed to step foot in this country if you are tainted by any of that hatred.
There, I took a stand.

[Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment]

^+1.
Happy to 'get along with' those who keep their hands out of my pockets and don't threaten physical harm to me or others who don't agree with their religion. Including the "mother earth" religion; check your premises.
Those folks get active push-back. Or VERY active push-back; their choice and I'm happy to provide it.

[Peter Kreeft taught me LOGIC, BEWARE !!!!!!!]

You interpreted that the opposite any normal person would.
Suppose the other person does not have your view of what gettingin your pocket is, or whether they threaten any harm but it is not directly to you but to a loved one, or their religion says it is okay to klll apostates.

You assume (and I don't know why) that you will always be the tougher and stronger and more able but that is silly. That might just be what the other guy thinks 🙂

[Roberta]

And give respect. No, wait, that was Rodney Dangerfield.

[TJJ2000]

Commie-Indoctrination camps?

Maybe it's not refusing to 'learn' but 'learning' all the wrong things from the wrong people in charge keeping then safe-haven-ed from *reality* and inside a classroom of indoctrinated imaginary realities.

[Roberta]

We're told in school we study history to avoid making the same mistakes. Oh, yeah, so I won't invade Russia, that'll be a big help.

[Peter Kreeft taught me LOGIC, BEWARE !!!!!!!]

No, it means the opposite of how you take it.
All specifics of any gravity illustrate something in general because human nature doesn't change. If you don't learn from the utter horror and obvious mistakes of Hitler's invasion of Russia, you are beyond learning anything. He saw it as brilliant, all who read history KNOW (from History) that that teaches several lessons

1) Pride of a tyrant or dictator can only be resisted to a certain point. Once the pride gets to the proportion that Hitler's did, you either die in the snow headed to Russia or you are killed outright.
2) Avoid a war on two fronts.
3) Make a deal with an unprincipled man (both Stalin and Hitler) and one of you will assuredly betray the other.
4) Hitler's views were on full display in Mein Kampf , he often mocked how people didn't take what he repeatedly said at face value. On the side of Stalin, Marx would only honor any 'agreement' until it was no longer convenient. the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact would have been betrayed by Stalin if Hitler hadn't beat him to it.
IF YOU ARE NOT THE GREATER DEMON YOU WILL BE DESTROYED.

[mtrueman]

From what I've read, Hitler was a history buff from childhood and read widely. Knowledge of history will only take you so far. It needs to be tempered with humility.

" the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact would have been betrayed by Stalin if Hitler hadn't beat him to it."

That's not necessarily so. Stalin managed to reach an accommodation with the Western powers and there's no indication he was considering breaking it.

[Not a Conservative but a Biden LOATHER]

NO, again that is to muddle your premises. History only teaches the moral docile (teachable) person who aims at goodness, truth , and beauty, not at world domination. And that history teaches eminently well. I am currently re-reading Augustine's City of God and that is 1000 pages of 'learrning from history" if we had not listend to dullards we would not have given that whole enterprise up after Augustine only to be wrongfully revived by Marx at the cost of over 100 million lives.

[mtrueman]

History can teach practical matters. It taught Hitler the difficulties of a winter campaign against Russia. He launched the attack near the summer solstice. It didn't teach him the importance of fuel and the limitations of motorized warfare as it was in its infancy and he was breaking new ground. History doesn't necessarily give us moral guidance. If anything it teaches us that wickedness and ruthlessness is a vital component in the character of the successful military campaigner.

[Not a Conservative but a Biden LOATHER]

NO, you are thinking htat his behavior proves he didn't get the same lessons you did, But that is morality and not lessons. If I read about Jack the Ripper and I have any decency I learn what kind of situations and people are to be avoided. But if I am a pervert reading that I learn how better to atttack women.
WE have a mind, we have a will, What we learn is applied according to our will. History's lessons are no exception. Who was ever a greater history buff than Marx? maybe St Augustine but you should get the lesson there.

[Vesicant]

Oh, well, if Tyler Cowen sez so, we had all better drop everything and go larn us some of that there history. Only one question -- who gets to define those "lessons"?

[Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment]

Do you think the "lessons" of N. Korea, Cuba or Venezuela need definition? Some issues are self-evident.

[Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment]

Still waiting for an answer.

[mtrueman]

"Only one question -- who gets to define those "lessons"?"

Teachers are the ones decide those things.

[Not a Conservative but a Biden LOATHER]

Hmmm, having taught for 10 years I don't think you are right at all.
IF I tell them about the 100 million citizens killed by their own country during the 20th Century, the fact by itself makes the biggest impression. Same with the Holocaust. The mere knowing of such horrors is the main lesson.

[Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment]

Wrong place.

[NellieBly]

Why refuse to learn from history?
1. Can't read.
2. Don't care.
3. "This is different because..."

[Peter Kreeft taught me LOGIC, BEWARE !!!!!!!]

so who are you talking to. Anyone who can't read doesn't benefit from your answer, unless I am missing something 🙂

[Not a Conservative but a Biden LOATHER]

Nellie, you show why bad governments rust to control the schools !!! And historiclally they do.
Andrew Johnson is first technically but
"On October 17, 1979, US President Jimmy Carter signed legislation establishing the US Department of Education."

I pray for Jimmy but ---damn, he was terrible like it was a sporting event.

[mtrueman]

Poland's Ministry of Education goes back to 1773. It was the first such ministry in Europe - emblematic of the Polish Enlightenment, which consequently played an important role in American independence. Also Haiti and France.