The Kash Patel Loyalty Test
Plus: Canada tariffs, New York City overtaken by sharks, Paxton cheating scandal, and more...

What is the FBI doing? Since the start of the Trump administration, the FBI has ramped up their use of polygraphs, or lie-detector tests. Used in the past to suss out whether employees can be trusted with secret information, the FBI under Director Kash Patel has a new application for polygraphs: Sniffing out whether employees have ever said anything mean about their boss, the controversial right-wing figure himself.
"The use of the polygraph, and the nature of the questioning, is part of the F.B.I.'s broader crackdown on news leaks, reflecting, to a degree, Mr. Patel's acute awareness of how he is publicly portrayed," reports The New York Times. "The moves, former bureau officials say, are politically charged and highly inappropriate, underscoring what they describe as an alarming quest for fealty at the F.B.I., where there is little tolerance for dissent. Disparaging Mr. Patel or his deputy, Dan Bongino, former officials say, could cost people their job."
Lie detectors, of course, are regarded as junk science, so it's a little insane that the FBI deploys them to the degree it does in the first place. But it's especially wild that they're trying to use them to sniff out who is loyal to top officials vs. who feels allegiance to the Constitution and to defending the laws of this country, which is really what these agents ought to be concerned with. (Regardless, lie detectors won't be able to get them very far on either front.)
Get your morning news roundup from Liz Wolfe and Reason.
Tariff whiplash: Yesterday's Roundup tackled President Donald Trump's trade war with Brazil. Today, I bring you fresh insanity: Trump has threatened Canada with a 35 percent tariff to be imposed on August 1—an escalation from the current 25 percent he's already imposed for anything that doesn't fall under the terms of the US-Mexico-Canada Agreement. "Fentanyl is hardly the only challenge we have with Canada, which has many Tariff, Non-Tariff, Policies and Trade Barriers, which cause unsustainable Trade Deficits against the United States," said Trump on Truth Social, changing his argument from "Canada needs to stop bringing fentanyl into our borders" to "Canada in some way exploits us with (unspecified) unfair trade practices."
"If for any reason, you decide to raise your Tariffs, then, whatever the number you choose to raise them by, will be added onto the 35% that we charge," warned Trump in a letter addressed to Canada's prime minister. Then, oddly, the letter's kicker deals with fentanyl again, letting the Canadian government know that if the border is made more secure, tariff levels will be tweaked again in their favor.
These two items—the Canada tariffs and the Patel loyalty polygraphs—are but two small examples of what appears to be the Trump administration's second-term ethos: Arbitrary displays of muscle not grounded in cogent arguments, and not really oriented toward delivering for the American people.
Scenes from New York: THE SHARKS ARE OUT IN FULL FORCE! They're ruining surfing in New York City (a beach town). I partially recant my earlier-in-the-week hypothesizing that an increase in the fleet of drones was possibly leading to an increase in shark sightings and that city policy pulling people out of the water is dumb. I was about to surf yesterday and ran into my neighbors, who said a big-ass shark had been maybe 8 feet away from them in the water; they immediately stopped surfing and hightailed it to shore. This is more anecdote than data, but it really does seem like there's been an increase in shark activity, from both police and fire department drone reports and on-the-ground reports from shaken-up surfers. Sorry to the haters, but I'm staying OUT of the water for a few days!
QUICK HITS
- How AI-powered scanners are making it so that rental car companies can charge customers for every single minor scratch or ding sustained.
- "State Senator Angela Paxton of Texas, the wife of the state attorney general, Ken Paxton, announced on Thursday that she had filed for divorce, saying she made her decision 'on biblical grounds' and 'in light of recent discoveries,'" reports The New York Times. Mrs. Paxton claims that her husband has committed adultery, and that they have been living separately for more than a year. This might shake up Texas politics to a fairly substantial degree: Mr. Paxton, a Republican, has mounted a primary challenge to Sen. John Cornyn (R–Texas), in which Paxton has repeatedly questioned Cornyn's conservative bona fides.
- "The Department of Homeland Security is urging local police to consider a wide range of protest activity as violent tactics, including mundane acts like riding a bike or livestreaming a police encounter," per information obtained by Wired. "Protesters on bicycles, skateboards, or even 'on foot' are framed as potential 'scouts' conducting reconnaissance or searching for 'items to be used as weapons.' Livestreaming is listed alongside 'doxxing' as a 'tactic' for 'threatening' police. Online posters are cast as ideological recruiters—or as participants in 'surveillance sharing.'"
- "Vietnam's leadership was caught off guard by US President Donald Trump's announcement last week that it agreed to a 20% tariff, and the Southeast Asian nation is still seeking to lower the rate, according to people familiar with the matter," reports Bloomberg. "Straight after last Wednesday's call with Trump, Vietnam's party chief To Lam told his negotiating team to keep working to bring the tariff rate down, the people said, asking not to be identified as the talks are confidential. The 20% figure came as a surprise as Vietnam believed it had secured a more favorable tariff range, the people said."
- This take—which is attracting lots of ire online—raises another interesting question: Have vet prices absolutely skyrocketed over the years? Why is this? "As household pets have risen in status—from mere animals to bona fide family members—so, too, has owners' willingness to spend money to ensure their well-being. Big-money investors have noticed," writes Helaine Olen for The Atlantic. ("One vet, who worked for an emergency-services practice that, they said, raised prices by 20 percent in 2022, told me, 'I almost got to the point where I was ashamed to tell people what the estimate was for things because it was so insanely high.'") More on the explosion in veterinary care prices over the last decade here. As someone who is spiritually Gen X and not millennial (the generation most likely to call animals "fur babies"), I have no problem with Caitlin Francis' coldness in the tweet below, but am mostly just fascinated by the dynamics that got us here.
My extremely unpopular opinion is that once a pet costs over $500-1000 it's time to put them to sleep https://t.co/Tyh5VEDjQI
— Caitlin Francis (@MrsCMFrancis) July 10, 2025
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More shots fired at ICE.
https://www.zerohedge.com/political/dramatic-video-anti-ice-protester-fires-weapon-federal-agents-during-immigration-raid
Nothing? Sullum has dozens if articles on J6 without rioters shooting?
Also there were illegal unaccompanied minors working this farm. Remember when it was found out Biden's DHS was sending unaccompanied minors to farms?
Bill Melugin
@BillMelugin_
To recap:
- Federal agents conduct massive op at Camarillo marijuana farm.
- Politicians push false narrative food workers & children are being raided.
- Feds disclose they have criminal judicial warrant for harboring aliens.
- Protester appears to shoot gun at agents.
- Protesters throw rocks at federal vehicles.
- 8 unaccompanied migrant children recovered at the cannabis farm, child labor investigation initiated.
But wired says this is good and should be accepted... According to Liz link
We'll have to wait for one to happen in NYC I guess. Did you hear about the sharks?
Who knew Reason was a surfing journal?
Kelly Slater forever.
Let's go surfin' now
Everybody's learnin' how
Come on and safari with me
The shooter is on the same side as the Colonge sex attackers.
The shooter is on the same side as the illegal who killed Laken riley because he wanted to rape her pussy.
There are lots of stories that many of these farms in California are cartel backed.
Can we just all acknowledge that the democrat party is a domestic terror organization? Given the ongoing and escalating events of the last year it seems obvious.
Democrats and their lackey judges continue to go after J6 under a ridiculous lawsuit of cops suing the Trump administration for harm. Seeking donor records and other privileged material.
https://justthenews.com/government/courts-law/federal-judge-orders-jan-6-rally-organizer-pay-2k-daily-until-complies
Have these people even heard of Castle Rock v. Gonzalez, 455 U.S. 748 (2005)?
https://www.law.cornell.edu/supremecourt/text/04-278
If they have, they don’t care. These are not honest actors.
Democrats only care about getting their way. And now they become extremely violent when they don’t get it.
Time for them to end.
DoJ files suit to finally end California regulations that have added cost to eggs since 2013.
https://www.justice.gov/opa/media/1407446/dl?inline=&utm_medium=email&utm_source=govdelivery
Comeon man, egg prices are all Trump’s fault.
So nothing about Colorado adopting similar regulations?
Would think this would undo those as well.
The problem is the California regulations apply to out of state actors as well. They can regulate their own farms in state however they want.
Colorado bans the sale of any eggs that are not raised in a very specific way, so it does apply to all to out of state actors.
California just did it first.
“Democrats did it first!!!!!”
Video of NEA conference shows endemic antisemitism.
Corey A. DeAngelis, school choice evangelist
@DeAngelisCorey
"The NEA and other organizations are overtly all about Inclusion, Diversity, Equality, Justice, Access, and everything, unless you’re Jewish."
This undercover video was filmed during the National Education Association's 2024 annual convention.
Video
https://x.com/DeAngelisCorey/status/1943369178536112138
Just so you know, this "sting video" is the equivalent of an undercover reporter going to a Trump rally and finding one guy who says "MAGA is all about hating Mexicans". Not exactly iron-clad proof.
Your team deliberately blurs the distinction between pro-Palestinian and pro-Hamas, the distinction between opposition to Israeli policy and opposition to Jewish people, and in so doing you use the anti-Semitic charge as a cynical weapon and a thin rationalization to accomplish your wider goals of destroying the enemies of your team. Your team isn't going after Harvard so vigorously because of the Jews. Your team is going after Harvard so vigorously because your team has ALWAYS hated Harvard and "anti-Semitism" is just the excuse to justify your team's crusade against them.
Here’s Lying Jeffy equating members of a teacher’s union to random people at a political rally. He’s really that dishonest.
Of course he is. And he will NEVER give up the con. The problem is that he’s too stupid to understand that everyone is on to him here. He needs to go away and shitpost somewhere else, where they don’t know him, but he won’t.
Best to just make him suffer as long as he’s here.
I don't like it when people blur those lines, either, but you're one to talk.
How many times have you blurred the distinction between legal immigrants and illegal immigrants?
Twat IS this SOOO IMPORTANT distinction between legal immigrants and illegal immigrants?
Give the illegal sub-humans their "Magic Papers" transforming bad into good, like a Philosopher Who Got Stoned, and Magically, Magnificuntly turn dross into GOLD!!!!
WHY do I have to think of ALL the Good Ideas anyway?
Wait till Trump gets His Way on Government Almighty arbitrarily determining WHO is, and who is SNOT, a citizen, ignoring being native-born, and the USA Cunts-Titus-Tuition's plain and simple words cuntcerning that... And then we will soon be pondering, "How many times have you blurred the distinction between legal native-borns and illegal native-borns?"
YOUR SO-CALLED "NATIVE" BIRTH WAS ILLEGAL, YE ILLEGAL SUB-HUMAN YE!!!
(Also Yer Mama will be charged for yer illegal birth, and SNOT getting an abortion when warned... And will be charged the costs of the bullets with which to shoot you!)
Gee, that's a stupid question. One reason I blur the distinction between legal immigration and illegal immigration is that, for the overwhelming majority of migrants, I don't see a meaningful difference between the two. It's like asking, "why do you blur the distinction between legal pot smoking and illegal pot smoking?" It shouldn't be illegal!
So if you really think that this is some sort of 'gotcha' against me, then it must be because you don't think there is a meaningful difference between support for Palestinians as a group, and support for Hamas. Is that the case? But yet, you said you don't like it when people do blur the distinction between the two.
Or maybe, you tried to spring a gotcha on me and it didn't work!
Dude, get over yourself. My point was that you blur distinctions whenever you want, for political reasons, so quit lecturing people on that.
There absolutely is a meaningful distinction between people critical of Israel and people who just hate Jews, people who support Palestinians and ghouls who support Hamas.
There is also a meaningful distinction between legal and illegal immigrants, whether you want to admit it or not. It's been pointed out to you hundreds of times.
“..,,, I don’t see a meaningful difference….”
Really? So you’d be ok with 3 billion uneducated third world non English speaking people crawling all over each other here in the US, Jeff? Do you have a limit?
There just ain’t that many toilets to clean, or land to scape, dude.
blurs the distinction between pro-Palestinian and pro-Hamas
Can you remind us who the Palestinian people elected as their government again?
Are you going to claim that there is no difference between the government and the people?
Are you going to claim that every single American is a Trump-worshipping MAGA cultist because of who's currently in charge?
"Oh but THAT'S different!"
The palestinian people overwhelmingly support Hamas and take part in their attacks. Obviously this doesn't mean every single living creature in Gaza does this, Jeff, but Hamas is the government, and that government went to war with Israel.
"Oh but THAT'S different!"
Not different at all.
Just so you know, this "sting video" is the equivalent of an undercover reporter going to a Trump rally and finding one guy who says "MAGA is all about hating Mexicans". Not exactly iron-clad proof.
It's a pretty funny criticism since Jeffsarc accepts these instances as 100% proof of MAGA beliefs. But when Team Blue does something stupid Lawyer Jeffsarc applying a different standard.
"Your team deliberately blurs the distinction between pro-Palestinian and pro-Hamas"
Seems to be an issue with your boos there.
Perhaps if you could find a single pro-Palestinian who is not also fervently pro-Hamas, it would be less of an issue.
On a macro level, Jewish people bring far more positive to the world than Muslim people. On that basis alone Israel >> Gaza (or any part of the Islamic world). Islam is fundamentally incompatible with Western Civilization. Jewish culture is fundamentally compatible.
And CAIR is all excited about the prospect...
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/teachers-union-nea-members-endorse-cutting-ties-with-adl/ar-AA1IdEjw
The Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR), the nation's largest Muslim civil rights and advocacy organization, said it welcomed the NEA vote due to concerns over ADL's "anti-Palestinian bias."
"This principled move is a significant step toward fostering respect for the rights and dignity of all students in public schools, who must receive an education without facing biased, politically-driven agendas," CAIR said.
Clownworld at wapo.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2025/07/10/donald-trump-clown-clowns-without-borders/
Article I, Section 8, Clause 1:
The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States; . . .
No Taxation without Representation!
Didn't you read? Trump won in a landslide. There's your representation.
How Congress delegates its tariff powers to the president.
It's amusing they've gone from predicting economic collapse, moving to future ripples, but now ignoring over a century of precedence.
SuPer PrECeDENT!
Also I've been saying this since George W Bush and Obama did the same. Nice try though, with the typical progressive, makeup an argues I've not made.
Poor sarc
Poor proggie
You're citing New Deal era legislation? Seriously? I thought it was common knowledge that FDR got SCOTUS to sign off on blatantly unconstitutional legislation by threatening to pack the court. And that's what you're using to defend the government thumbing its nose at separation of powers. You guys are progressives and you don't even know it.
^Did not read or did not understand the link.
1962, 1974, and 1977 were the new deal?
Poor sarc.
Defending New Deal legislation like a good Progressive 80s Democrat.
You are ignoring 90% of the article. You are really bad at this.
Given sarcs behavior yesterday, he at best reads the first paragraph of articles. Like how his own article said the same thing we have been on tariffs in the 4th paragraph.
That's if he actually does read an article and not just a link name.
Your knowledge of history is only overshadowed by your knowledge of debate fallacies. If you knew anything about either, you might be halfway dangerous, but right now you’re reduced to nothing but a toothless, dimwitted, retarded, lame, gay shill for the Democrats here.
How progressive of them. Me, I'll stick to the Constitution and the words printed on it.
Oh and since Obmacare was passed by legislation and approved by Scotus, that means you agree with the constitutionality of the law forcing Americans to buy a product.
That's not for me either.
No, but there is nothing you or I can do about. Sometimes you just have to accept things aren't always going to go your way.
Cmon man. True libertarianism is demanding the country runs exactly as you want and not how it is run through precedence and elected bodies.
Views are so much easier to generate when you have to do no homework on how things actually operate.
So progressive of you.
And you are free to do that. I'll advocate for the government I want.
Nothing says business-friendly like changing taxes on day-to-day whims unrelated to anything predictable.
Funny how so many people deride California increasing gasoline taxes in predictable stages yet applaud Trump raising tariffs as a personal vendetta.
The use of the polygraph
Nothing left to cut. We need our fake science union bureaucrats!
Kash Patel, FBI director and coverer for pedos.
Lie detectors, of course, are regarded as junk science,
I didn't have to take one to get my clearance, but I heard other people have.
It's easy to detect a lie. If a person is a registered dem, they are a liar
I remember my father telling us how he'd played with the lie detector to pass a security check, giving fake answers at the right time, just to see if he could. He was not impressed. This was 50+ years ago. I doubt they've gotten much better. Junk is junk.
Isometrically tense your muscles to simulate being a stressed-out Nervous Nellie during the innocuous, innocent "baseline reference questions", then do SNOT do that later on for the REAL questions, and all is easy-peasy!
That way, Government Almighty goons can SNOT bust you for unauthorized blowing upon cheap plastic flutes!
To find precise details on what NOT to do, to avoid the flute police, please see http://www.churchofsqrls.com/DONT_DO_THIS/ … This has been a pubic service, courtesy of the Church of SQRLS!
I don't know if it works, but I recall an episode of Penn & Teller's "Bullshit" about how to beat a polygraph. They said to clench your sphincter when answering the baseline questions (like what's your name, is today Friday, etc.), but answer the lies normally.
I imagine this would be better than the Sqrlsy answer above about tensing your muscles, as that would be more noticeable by the person operating the test.
Of course, there's also the George Costanza method: "It's not a lie if you believe it."
There’s also the beavis and butthead method: hold your breath.
Tariff predictions are junk science at this point as well.
Remember when everybody (else) got "vaccinated" against a previously unknown virus of zoonotic origin because the living embodiment of The Science told them to?
Guess how concerned I am about the FBI's internal use of lie detectors (Pulse: 65 bpm, BP: 115/75, RR: 15 bpm, O2 sat.: 98%, Temp.: 97.4°).
Economics is junk science.
Economics is at a minimum an explanatory guess to reality due to the chaotic interactions of those participating in the market. There is good analysis, but the vast majority of models are junk science for sure.
Anytime someone starts an economic argument with "now assume all other variables are fixed" or "assume all actors are rational", you can basically just dismiss their argument.
Trumponomics is FAR more lowly, tribalistic, anti-data-driven, and EVIL than economics will EVER be!
"Tariff predictions are junk science at this point as well."
THIS is why All Truly Patriotic Orange Dick Suckers support 4,578,937% tariff-taxes on ALL nations (and states too?) who DARE to DISOBEY or DISRESPECT Der Orange TrumpfenFarter-Fuhrer!!!
(Ass ALL of us Truly Obedient brain-washed dumbshits "know", the producers, SNOT the cuntsumers, pay those tariff-taxes anyway!)
I had the full-blown "Do you like gladiator movies" NSA-administered one for my clearance (had to go to Langley and everything, although it was actually off-campus not in the HQ). I remember two things.
First, the tech administering the test, after strapping me in and hooking everything up said "Breathe normally." That messed me up for some reason "Am I breathing to fast, too slow, too deep, too shallow, how do I breathe normally...?"
Back home later, I was called into security office, where I encountered an FBI agent and our head of security. Not good, I immediately thought, even though I hadn't done anything wrong. Turns out the agent wasn't there for me, but the meeting he had with the head of security went a bit long. Special Agent left, and security told me my clearance had been approved and that I was the first employee who had passed the polygraph and all the investigative stuff on the first try. How white-bread am I, I thought.
My interviewer had every day I skipped class in high school written down and asked me why I missed for each day.
Sex drugs and rock and role, right?
Was involved in a very minor incident in the military, resulted in JAG investigation. 18yo me, fresh out of boot, was escorted into a room with just me and a very salty, experienced investigator.
“So, is there anything you need to tell me?” as he glared at me. It only would’ve been a few seconds more before I spilled the beans about our underage drinking and shenanigans, nothing at all to do with what was being investigated.
“Ha, I’m just fucking with you! Now, where were you the night of…”.
Aside from all that, I’ll bet the FBI and their associates have a lot more “reliable” methods to get info out of people than the rank and file slobs in the criminal justice system.
There was a raid on the barracks one day when I served. MPs arrest a bunch of guys, including me. I hadn't done anything that would have garnered the interest of the MPs, but apparently a few of the ones swept up had. So they take all of us to the station, then interview us one at a time. When they pulled me in, the investigator makes small talk for a minute, then asks me to sign a form saying I'm willing to talk. I decline to sign the form and just say, tell me what this is about and I'll consider it. He won't unless I sign first, and I wasn't about to sign, so that ends it. As I'm about to be swapped out for the next guy, he asks me to sign a form saying they can search my barracks room. (This was odd to me, since I figured under UCMJ they didn't need my permission.) I refuse that too. I wasn't worried about them catching me with something in there, but why give permission if asked?
The three that had contraband all signed the forms to talk without a lawyer, as well as authorizing searches of their barracks rooms. It did not go well for them. I was so amazed that guys who knew they had shit in their rooms would voluntarily sign away their rights, when had they done otherwise, they probably would have gotten away with it.
How AI-powered scanners are making it so that rental car companies can charge customers for every single minor scratch or ding sustained.
Or how to lose customers. Some did something similar with GPS and issuing speeding fees. They learned their customers don't want the hassle.
Will buy the insurance and beat the hell of out every rental car if that becomes the norm.
Hey Liz, you do understand that after the first trump term a ton of things employed in the gov came forward stating how they broke the law to undermine Trump because orange man bad. Faggot mille even admitted to treason.
Yeah, and also THE PRESIDENT is in charge of the Executive Branch, as voted by the people. Unless the president is asking FBI agents to do something specifically unconstitutional, undermining him is undermining the Constitution.
Either Liz has smoked herself stupid or she’s started accepting envelopes.
Unles the president is asking FBI agents to do something specifically unconstitutional
Have you been in a coma for the past 70 years?
Do you hope to ever get that second brain cell?
Mike is still stumping for GMO turducke.
To go with his bottles of HO2?
YES! Finally a new insult from Sevo. It's very weak, but I appreciate the variety nonetheless. Keep working at it, Sevo. You'll get past the preschool level if you keep at it.
Edit:
Sigh. Still nothing new from our Laursen obsessed resident know-it-all though.
Gee, TDS-addled slimy pile of shit, perhaps your pre-school buds will give you something other than Trump(!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) to complain about.
Fuck off and die, asswipe.
Oh well. It was nice while it lasted.
So what was Trump doing that was unconstitutional in his first term that justified Crossfire Hurricane?
How about lying to him about troop levels in Syria?
Were you in a coma for Trump’s first term?
None of that is justified. And it exemplifies the problem when the FBI is loyal to a person or party rather than the constitution and justice.
Loyal to Trump is no better than loyal to Obama.
“None of that is justified.”
Well that’s wtf we’re talking about dumbass.
One of the sob stories is some fed crying about being questioned because he’s “friends with someone critical of Trump.” His friend is Peter Strzok. Not exactly someone simply critical of Trump, is it?
For the nonbinary, the problem of the FBI is its partisanship seeking to serve the powerful rather than the people. The solution is not to switch from dems to GOPs. The solution is to stop the partisanship.
And Trump’s administration is not just trying to switch partisanship, they’re trying to consolidate and strengthen it. And if they succeed we'll be worse off for it.
So just ignore all the evidence that contradicts your shallow understanding of the subject, Dee.
This is my favorite Mike tactic.
He will make an argument with such conviction.
When evidence is presented disputing his assertion he does one of three things:
1) claims ignorance that he didnt know about the counter evidence (despite even it being in the thread)
2) claim he has no conviction on the subject but still supports his original assertion.
3) try to move the argument to a tangential argument and claim he never made the original assertion.
Why do you talk about Mike so much? I'm sorry. I think your man-crush is gone for good. The guy really branded himself on your brain... reminds me of when my grandmother got dementia and fixated,...ohhhh....Now I see.
Why don't you present the evidence you have to contradict my point?
You didn’t make a point Dee.
OK then
And Trump’s administration is not just trying to switch partisanship, they’re trying to consolidate and strengthen it. And if they succeed we'll be worse off for it.
You don't know that. They could just as easily be trying to get rid of people loyal to Dems which you claim to want but always manage to oppose.
True, I don't know that, but it is quite evident. Everything about this administration has been about consolidation of power and loyalty to the executive.
but always manage to oppose.
Like when?
Right now dumbass.
Right now = always...Genius!
True, I don't know that, but it is quite evident. .
Meanwhile, just upthread...
2) claim he has no conviction on the subject but still supports his original assertion.
QB gets pegged. Ouch!
I have conviction, but only a fool is certain.
My lack of Dunning Kruger confidence is considered a flaw in the MAGA movement, but an unavoidable fact for those seeking truth.
only a fool is certain.
Ugh! I am certain you are incapable of formulating an original thought. Prove me a fool.
Everything about this administration has been about consolidation of power and loyalty to the executive.
Or it is about breaking the loyalty of the bureaucracy to Dems so the agenda voted in by Americans can be fairly executed? The current status quo means that the Dem agenda is enthusiastically implemented while any Rep agenda is sabotaged. This is what Dems support and why they protect the bureaucracy including portraying any effort to eliminate this sabotage as "consolidation of power and loyalty to the executive".
It's perfectly legitimate for Trump to terminate executive branch employees working against his agenda even if I disagree with some of his methods and individual decisions.
Or it is about breaking the loyalty of the bureaucracy to Dems so the agenda voted in by Americans can be fairly executed?
It's possible, but looking at the treatment of Amash, Massie and Pence, etc. makes me extremely skeptical.
It's perfectly legitimate for Trump to terminate executive branch employees working against his agenda even if I disagree with some of his methods and individual decisions.
I agree here. I often don't like what his administration is doing, but it's his right to run it how he wants including hiring and firing within the executive branch.
It's possible, but looking at the treatment of Amash, Massie and Pence, etc. makes me extremely skeptical.
These are politicians who he is dealing with politically. Unlike politicians these bureaucrats work for Trump and owe him their honest efforts just as they would to whoever is President.
You make a good points, Marshal.
All civil servants, including the FBI, is bound to uphold the Constitution and federal law. There is nothing in the job that has anything to do with loyalty to any politician or political party.
Yes, now as soon as every sing thing employed by the cia nsa and doj that spied on us citizens without a warrenty are executed for treason, then I will think that we have rule of law. Until then I say lawfare against the Marxists and traitors is good
Fuck off commie scum.
One of the questions on the DOGE loyalty test was whether or not you support tariffs. That's right. Support for the president unilaterally levying taxes, which is a power given to Congress by the Constitution, was a requirement for joining Team Trump.
I doubt the FBI loyalty test is that much different in that to pass you must be loyal to the administration always, and the Constitution when convenient.
Cite?
I mean, you support orher countries tariffs all the time. You demand disadvantaged global trade. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Meanwhile in reality, inflation to lowest level in years, no actual costs rising to consumer, corporate profits up, record announced domestic investments, 1M jobs to Americans, lowering welfare roles.
My god. How terrible these policies are.
"All civil servants, including the FBI, is bound to uphold the Constitution and federal law."
You didn't give a shit about this for the last four years, when you all behaved like unrepentant Nazis in one of the biggest crackdowns on free speech in America's history.
And you still don't give a shit because your flat out lying when you claim these actions are unconstitutional.
You're a depraved Nazi, Tony, who will say anything to attack the Democrat Party's enemies.
Watch this.
Molly, we're the legal actions taken against J6 defendants all justified?
Yes of course. They participated in an attempted coup.
one of the biggest crackdowns on free speech in America's history
Does "one of the biggest crackdowns on free speech in America's history" include deporting people over speech?
I'm (not) surprised you didn't go with the Douglass Mackey example. He wasn't deported, but, far worse, put in prison on a 10-year sentence for reposting a joke meme on Twitter about voting by text.
You mean, his fraudulent activities to deprive individuals of their rights to vote? Not protected speech.
Writing an op-ed objecting to Israeli policies? That is protected speech.
"You mean, his fraudulent activities to deprive individuals of their rights to vote? Not protected speech."
This is the defense of speech I expect out of you.
You mean, a principled defense of speech? Why thank you!
No, a hypocritical one. It is all you're good for.
Oh and let's just be real clear here.
reposting a joke meme on Twitter about voting by text.
He and his team CREATED the image which stole the IP of the Clinton campaign to make it look like an official message from her campaign, while at the same time discussing among themselves how they could depress the vote among Hillary's supporters. He did WAY MORE than just retweet a joke. Fraud and theft in the service of depriving people of their voting rights is not protected speech.
It doesn't surprise me that you favor his persecution.
fine, I'll put you down as "pro-fraud" and "pro-IP-theft" then
I'll put you down as "pro-free speech" but only for your political allies.
But that's not true. I'm in favor of free speech. I'm not in favor of fraud.
You are the one who thinks that Team MAGA should be able to get away with actual crimes in the name of 'free speech'.
Your framing of the Mackey case puts the lie to your claim of support for free speech.
He and his team CREATED the image which stole the IP of the Clinton campaign to make it look like an official message from her campaign, while at the same time discussing among themselves how they could depress the vote among Hillary's supporters
The ruling overturning the conviction specifically stated there was no rational reason for the jury to convict on that crock of shit theory.
Which is it Jeffy, are you irrational, or a shitposting liar.
Which is it Jeffy, are you irrational, or a shitposting liar.
When it comes to chemjeff, those aren't mutually exclusive.
Those actions were done by political appointees, not civil servants.
What was this alleged treason by MIlley?
2 things. Working with Pelosi to bypass the president in execution of military direction. And stating he would give China a heads up for any strikes ordered.
QB doesn’t know what you’re talking about.
Cocksuckers like him should be presumed guilty of grift as well:
https://www.semafor.com/article/05/07/2024/military-generals-report-for-duty-on-wall-street
Canada hosted the ccp for cold weather war tactics to be used against the US. Canada is not a US ally Liz. They should be treated as the enemies they are. Also Canada has a 200% tarrifs on some us products. Fuck canada
You're right. The entire rest of the world is America's enemy. Fuck them all. We can stand alone and prevail. USA! USA! USA!
Jeffy, should we hold joint tactics with Mongolia and Vietnam?
If Canada is holding joint military exercises with China, that's a pretty good indicator we need to cut them out of the FVEY entirely, you stupid fat fuck.
Leftists always side with the commies in the end.
What were these joint military exercises that you claim took place?
You're a fucking idiot:
https://x.com/CanadianArmy/status/961998352761188352
And no, that isn't the only time.
Not an idiot, just a psychopathic liar.
"observe winter survival training". Wow, that sure sounds like "joint military exercises" to me! And, what you are leaving out (intentionally), is that the invitation was later rescinded and no Chinese military observers ended up going to Canada.
Trudeau invited them to come over in 2018 until his defense minister came to his senses and cancelled the exercises, much to the chagrin of Fidel Castro's baby boy.
And the point is that if Canada ever does actually do something this stupid, then the US is well within its rights to kick them out of the FVEY.
Oh, okay, so there were no actual "joint military exercises". Glad that we could clear that up.
If Trump invited the Russian Army to the US to do joint exercises, but at the last minute Hegseth convinces Trump it's a bad idea, you wouldn't be crowing every minute about that? I don't think you'd shrug it off as you are the real-life example of this with Canada and China.
So, your argument is that you agree with me that this incident was wildly overblown for partisan reasons, but you think I am a hypocrite for pointing it out. Is that right?
No, I think it's rather troubling that Canada would even consider it. But I do consider you a hypocrite. Admit that if the scenario I laid out were true, you absolutely would be complaining about it nonstop.
Nope, not gonna play your game. I'll wait until you can provide an actual situation where that has happened.
Now admit that the only reason you even brought this up was name-calling against me.
Do I need to ask you how you would feel if you hadn't eaten breakfast this morning?
Here are some more "joint military exercises" that took place with China:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Military_World_Games
Oh, and who was president in 2019? Gee, imagine if Biden had done this...
You don’t see a problem with doing military exercises with CCP in Canada?
Is that really your position Lying Jeffy?
Extremely unpopular opinion today but if you are gonna have a pet you should always have AT LEAST ten grand set aside for them at all times in case of serious emergency.
Extremely regular and good opinion: You should have 10 grand set aside for financial hardship emergencies. Like losing your job or flood/fire. If you got some leftover for pets, great you do you.
How about have a lot more than 10 grand set aside (enough for six months of unemployment) and I’ll spend whatever the fuck I want on my dogs.
Sure, no problem, saving more is always good in my book. Minimum for the axiom was alway 3 months, though and median income in America is 40k; so the numbers worked out with the original 10k.
Covid significantly changed my calculus. I’ve actually got 6 months of dog food.
Agreed.
Yeah, the Dave Ramsey get-out-of-debt plan is pretty solid IMO.
Put $1000 in an emergency fund.
Then, get out of debt. (Except the house.)
Then, increase your emergency fund until it corresponds to 3 months of your income.
Per wired?
Really your reposting trash from wired? You become more idiotic day to day liz
Between weed and surging she doesn't have time these days to look at non KMW approved sources.
Is there any libertarian you guys still tolerate?
Do you know any?
Not anymore.
Spiked. I disagree with about half of what they write, but they argue from first principals, and rarely go into the emotion arguments
Thanks for the sincere answer.
Your welcom
My problem with Spiked is that you can read the articles for free, but you have to pay for a membership to read the comments, much less comment yourself. I'm too cheap to pay for that, so I generally skip Spiked, even though I've found them fairly based and libertarian the few times I've checked them out.
Poor Mike is extra upset with me lately lol. He doesn't realize he has so significance after exposing himself as a bog standard gov fixed liberal "scientist."
Is Mike a scientist?
He researches GMO turducken and HO2.
I'm guessing he needs to work under high vacuum conditons maintain hydroperoxyl for any length of time.
In case you're unaware, that wasn't a typo by ITL.
Yep, I know.
Ha!
QB = White Mike run through ChatGTP. It makes so much sense now.
Vet prices have skyrocketed because every mentally unstable awfls that concider the pets her kids, (because no man would touch them) will spend thousands of dollars on the animals
This guy gets it.
So the NYT publishes the claims of anonymous former officials and Liz regurgitates their possibly fictitious story and paints a dark picture of malevolence. That's the kind of reporting Reason is famous for.
It's not like the nyt to lie about things.
Haha.
I remember when the nyt made up a general and quoted him
Such principles! Holding such a tough line on honest journalism!
I'll just assume you haven't gotten around to ridiculing the claims of the anonymous "NEA worker" in the x.com clip posted above.
Lol. Fucking retard. They just cut ties with thr ADL too dumbass. And it isnt one person who has said this. Even their conference votes have been released.
Leftists hate evidence, preferring narratives. Cite: your posts.
I wonder why they cut ties with the ADL?
They just cut ties with thr ADL
Being opposed to the ADL is not the same as being anti-Semitic. Hopefully even your tiny brain can understand that.
Let me put it to you in a way you might understand:
Being opposed to the SPLC is not the same as being racist.
Being opposed to the ADL is not the same as being anti-Semitic. Hopefully even your tiny brain can understand that.
Jeffey's lying about the circumstances again. What makes this anti-Semitic is that the NEA still incorporates Hamas materials in its programs. But then his job is defending Team Left so he simply cannot offer a comprehensive analysis.
I would think, then, the criticism should be for the Hamas materials purportedly in its programs, instead of for cutting ties with the ADL. I put the ADL in the same category as the SPLC, and ideally neither should be used by any organization to determine if someone or something is actually antisemitic or racist.
They were criticized for that, and their explanation was that they source material from everywhere expecting the teachers to be able to present it fairly. But eliminating ADL material shows they do not actually do this and thus their original excuse for including Hamas material was a lie.
The NEA is a far-left, practically (or perhaps literally) Marxist, organization that should be condemned for that (as well as actively hurting the educational opportunities of students). Substituting out Jews for Palestinians as (one of) the most oppressed, even if that means promoting Hamas propaganda, as you said, is just rearranging the collectives in their oppressor-oppressed dichotomy that was false before the change and is false now. I already believed the NEA were liars who would prop up ANY group and condemn ANY group to correspond with the political winds of the left.
I don't expect principled decisions from them, unless you consider "there is no truth but power" a principle.
the NEA still incorporates Hamas materials in its programs
Proof?
Even their conference votes have been released.
Then produce the evidence which allegedly demonstrates that the NEA is anti-Semitic. Not just that they don't like the ADL anymore, but they really do hate Jews. Go ahead. Or did the JesseBot daily programming update not include this?
Are you this stupid?
They cut ties with the ADL because the ADL supports Jews being in Israel.
The NYT doesn’t engage in honest journalism. Just like all of you leftists, they lie.
yup, you got it.
Anonymous claims are only bad if they are directed against Dear Orange Leader and his team.
Remember how Team Red circle-jerked for months about the "anonymous whistleblower" who claimed Biden took bribes?
Yeah, that’s all the evidence there is that Biden took bribes, a random whistleblower.
Who do you think you’re fooling with this bullshit, Lying Jeffy?
"Remember how Team Red circle-jerked for months about the "anonymous whistleblower" who claimed Biden took bribes?"
Only you could handwave the bank records, the 200 bank issued Suspicious Activity reports, Wire transfers from China listing Joe Bidens home address, the Privat bank transactions, the LLCs, the texts, the emails, the WhatsApp messages, the photos of Joe with Hunter’s business partners he said he didn’t meet, the voicemails to his son, the two business partners advertising Joe as “The Brand”, the “big guy” and “the chairman”, the TWO NON-ANONYMOUS whistleblowers testimonies, the recorded phone calls between Biden and Poroshenko, the video of Joe bragging about the firing of the Ukrainian prosecutor, email showing Joe’s VP office helping Hunter directly, and Hunter’s statements about having to give his father half his income as a single "aNonYmOuS wHisTleBloWeR"
What a piece of shit you are, Jeff. Nothing you say is true. You go out of your way to lie about things you don't even need to lie about just because you like lying so much. You're a garbage human who revels in execrable behavior.
I’m really not being hyperbolic when I call Lying Jeffy a psychopath.
This is your team's whole strategy right here, in a nutshell. None of what you wrote above proves that there was any bribery of Joe Biden. But your team created so much smoke from allegations and insinuations and circumstantial evidence that you create guilt from mere suspicion alone. Which is, by the way, the same tactic that the other team uses against Trump. You're really no different than the ones that you hate.
yet...Trump instigating 1/6 is proven fact, amirite?
Tony Bobulinski wasn’t anonymous. And he had proof
He wasn't anonymous, he was one of Hunter's business partners who also provided email evidence of the bribes and pictures proving Biden and his defenders were lying when they claimed Biden never met with the people bribing him.
If you think of Jeffey like a Team Blue defense attorney - obligated to advance their best defense regardless of how stupid it is - you'll realize his position on every single topic is an exact match.
Patel's loyalty is to the Tribe. Apparently so is Trumpy.
Just remember he and his other clownstools, Bongo and Blondi told us there is nothing more in the Epstein videos than kiddie ****
"Nothing to see here....move along."
Alan Dirtshowitcz knows all the names. But he ain't saying.
Fuck off and die, Nazi scumbag.
You're just mad because Trump won't bake you a kike.
"My extremely unpopular opinion is that once a pet costs over $500-1000 it’s time to put them to sleep."
I loved my dog more than I can express. When it came time to put him to sleep it cost $200 (rolled-up) to euthanize, and another $200 for communal cremation. The vet pushed hard for the more expensive individual cremation, so much so that it snapped me out of my grief and I realized this is the vet equivalent of car "undercoating" and "extended warranty." So, just the cost of euthanasia is close to Caitlin's limit.
I grew up on a farm, if your pet is unable to take care of itself it means you've already waited too long to put it down.
Vets now think of themselves as family practitioners.
It is amazing that some people can get so attached to their pets.
You should check out this GoFundMe posted by Lauren Frize.
https://www.gofundme.com/f/help-pixie-walk-again-support-her-surgery-9qra9
I kind of get it. You do get attached to the little fur balls. There is something odd with pet owners where the less able someone is to afford it - the more they end up paying.
Most dogs just don't have a very long life expectancy.
the less able someone is to afford it - the more they end up paying.
And the more pets they have.
I know this may seem silly to some but if you know me, she is my world. She’s only 7 and she’s a healthy girl.
If the dog is healthy, she wouldn't need this surgery to walk again.
This one doesn't scream scam, but I'm skeptical of all of these crowdsourcing requests (GoFundMe, GiveSendGo, etc.).
1 round of .22 LR and a shovel are much cheaper than $400.
Our small-town vet comes out to the truck so the pet doesn't have the final trauma of the vet's office, I think the last dog put to sleep was $35.
The drug they use including the syringe probably cost less than $5.
Then why don't we use it for death row convicts?
We need the 3 drug cocktail so the executioner can withhold the drug that causes unconsciousness - so the person being executed suffers horribly for a few minutes. The paralysis drug is to keep bystanders from being able to tell.
If I don't like cremation, how much is it for taxidermi... Asking for a friend
For yourself or a pet?
Got 40 acres and a backhoe, so 'pet cemetery' is a thing. One corner of one pasture is used, there's a memorial oak tree planted when we had to bury the first pet that died after we moved here.
""As household pets have risen in status—from mere animals to bona fide family members—so, too, has owners' willingness to spend money to ensure their well-being. Big-money investors have noticed," writes Helaine Olen for The Atlantic."
Wow. Prices rise with increased demand? Who knew?
Interesting commentary on Obama’s use of the alphabet agencies.
https://x.com/politicalmath/status/1943513591090401621?s=46&t=qeA47-JjK6vq0pfnxg60dA
Nah nah nah can’t hear you, Nah nah nah can’t hear you!
— Liz
That is the legacy of Barack Obama. He took the honesty of the "benefit of the doubt" people and manipulated it. He engaged in deep corruption knowing his press handlers would run defense for him.
This isn't a shock, it's been the MO of the New Left since they began taking over the Democrats in the late 60s. It's why the cuckservative right finally got bounced from the GOP in 2016; their voters finally got sick of their pundits and thought leaders taking everything the left says at face value and constantly nannyscolding the right for complaining about the left's subversion and mendacity.
Obama was nothing next to the Clintons
It's not "benefit of the doubt", it's the Can I or Must I difference. Team members will accept anything helpful to the team whenever they can, but will only accept information damaging to the team when they must. Each of these is limited by the reputational harm supporting false ideas or denying true ideas entails.
But the vast majority of political information is sufficiently opaque so most of the acceptance or denial will fall along party or ideological lines.
The Kash Patel Loyalty Test
Hook. Line. Sinker.
Always worth repeating from time to time:
https://www.thelibertybeacon.com/dear-liberals-how-many-of-these-msm-hoaxes-did-you-fall-for/
How many of these conspiracy theories did you fall for?
Obama Birtherism
"Pizzagate"
Hillary and "Uranium One"
Ted Cruz's father helped assassinate JFK
Biden was ready to have Trump killed during the "raid" at Mar-a-Lago
The 2020 election was stolen
Voting machines in 2020 were hacked due to a sinister plot out of Italy
Vaccines cause autism
Wind turbines cause cancer
Global warming is a hoax
Haitians in Springfield eat cats and dogs
The government of Venezuela is intentionally sending gang members to the US as a part of an invasion plan
Poor pedo jeffy.
You fell for all of them, didn't you?
You are a devotee of BlueAnon, son.
It’s funny he included pizzagate.
You would think he wouldn't want to bring any attention to his predilection.
Jeff's Blueanon conspiracy theories:
COVID came from a wetmarket, Conservatives are all terrorists, Ivermectin doesn't work, HCQ doesn't work, Biden doesn't have dementia, Masks work, COVID passports, Cuomo didn't kill old people, Dominion systems were secure, Hunter Biden is an artist, Trump colluded with Russia, Jan 06 was an insurrection, Transwoman are real women, BLM is mostly peaceful, Trump had a pee pee tape, Antifa is an idea, George Floyd didn't overdose, Advanced coursework is racist, 1619 is real history, Hunter Laptop wasn't real, Trump caused asian hate, White rage is the problem, CRT isn't poisonous, All white people are racist, A pipe in ATL stopped the count, Jussie Smollet was attacked, China travel ban was racist, Words are violence, The military isn't woke, The FBI is apolitical, Shokin was fired for corruption, Obama didn't build cages, Iran never got cash pallets, The border is under control, Voter ID is racist, Biden is tough on Putin, Blasey Ford was credible, Swalwell isn't compromised, Kids should get the jab, Teachers had it the worst, WHO is an independent body, The Great Reset isn't real, Renting forever is just fine, Bailouts are necessary, Gain of Function wasn't funded,
Hunter isn't incestuous, Double masking is best, Own nothing, be happy, Hillary had 98% chance to win, Melania was an escort, A video caused Benghazi, Ban fully semi-automatic guns, Trump camp wasn't spied on, Hunter was hired on merit, Hands up Don't Shoot happened, AR15s are weapons of war, Bubba Wallace noose was real, Covington Catholic kid is racist, Trump will start WW3, If you like your Dr., Keep your Dr., Trump said drink bleach, Assange is a criminal, Putin hacked VT electric grid, Trump threw out MLK, Jr bust, Kushner never got a Peace Deal, Trump banned Muslims, Mueller proved Trump-Cohen lie, Trump Jr had WikiLeaks access, Global warming is #1 threat, Arkancides are a myth, Iraq had WMD'S, Russia hacked DNC, The science is settled, There are no Uyghur camps, Elizabeth Warren is native, The icecaps are melting, Steele Dossier is bulletproof, Seth Rich mugging went wrong, Bernie lost primary fair&square, Coyotes aren't carrying humans, Guns cause Chicago violence, Wall-Street isn't rigged, Fast & Furious = conspiracy, Joe never hid in the basement, 15 Days to Slow the Spread, MAGA rallies = super spreaders, Late-term abortions are normal, Only vaxxed can enjoy July 4, There's a War on Women, Gates isn't buying up farmland, Russian bounties were real, Stormy Daniels is credible, Kavanaugh is a drunk rapist, Monsanto has a great product, Wildfires are bc climate change, Gen Flynn is a traitor, Omar didn't marry her brother, Anita Hill story was true, Trump votes were whitelash, Trump called Nazis fine people, The media is tough on Biden, Trump tried to nuke a hurricane, Cops kill 1000s unarmed POC, Green New Deal is affordable, Hurricanes are all stronger now,
Kamala never witheld evidence, Everything is infrastructure, America is structural racism, IRS never targeted Tea Party, Defund the Police, Austere religious scholar dies, Joe never fingered Tara Reade, 17 Intel Agencies agree, Imran Awan did nothing wrong, Greta Thunberg is authoritative, Giuliani warned of FBI raid, Social Workers can stop crime, Joe Scarborough is innocent, No Las Vegas Shooter motive, Brexit was undemocratic, Moderate rebels aren't terrorists, GOP baseball shooter apolitical, Dangerous Lockdown protests, Scaramucci had Russian ties, CIA doesn't plant news stories, NSA isn't spying on your calls, Trump preparing Martial Law, Border Walls don't work, You didn't build that, Racism is public health crisis, Walls closing in on Trump, Bitcoins a worthless scam, Gillum did no wrong, Trump said all Mexicans rapists, 5 people murdered at Capitol, No immunity via C19 infection, Trump tear gassed Lafayette Square, Hillary didn't hide any emails, Its illegal to view Wikileaks, Trump had secret Russia server, Clinton-Lynch Tarmac was fine, Katie Hill is the victim, Trump pays no taxes, Brazille never leaked questions, Manafort visited Assange, China never paid Hunter, Pelosi's hair salon set her up, W.E.F. is a benign organization, Meat is bad for the environment, Feinstein's staffer wasn't CCP, Podesta emails were doctored, Omar didn't pay husband $2.8M, Amazon = 'Lungs of the Earth', Clinton foundation helped Haiti, Nothing was on Weiner's laptop, Hillary didn't collapse into a van, Nike doesn't use slave labor, Trans Story hour is beautiful, The Asymptomatic spread C-19, Stacey Abrams was cheated, Zuckerberg saved 2020 election, The NBA isn't supporting CCP, Trump failed Puerto Rico, Rittenhouse showed up to kill, AOC staff didn't divert $1M, C.Cuomo didn't break isolation, Baturina never wired Hunter $$,
China stopped fentanyl export, Chauvin jury was impartial, Maxine Waters made no threat, Ed Buck was just a fundraiser, Schiff didn't leak classified info, COVID Spring break will kill you, Boulder shooter Alissa is white, Biden attended Delaware State, 2-Scoops was a Big deal, Weinstein shocked Hollywood, Guns owners don't stop crime, Brian Williams Heli was shot at, Hillary did land under sniper fire, Lauer's behavior was unknown, Joy Reid's blog was hacked, NY DA will take Trump down, You should report GOP family, Solyndra did nothing wrong, Prince Andrew isn't a Pedo, Kaepernick unsigned because racism, Avenatti will be great President, Coal miners: learn to code, No, Blackrock isn't to blame, Trump last-ditch war with Iran, Uranium One wasn't a scandal, Carter Page was Russian asset, Burisma did nothing wrong, AR15 used in all mass shooting, Trump stimulus is breadcrumbs, 1/6 riots planned assassination, Trump wants to Nuke North Korea, FISA warrants aren't abused, Democrats freed the Slaves, Tucker wasn't spied on, The GOP opposed Civil Rights, Biden never plagiarized, Trump hates the environment, The parties flipped, USMCA is a disaster, Biden didn't kill keystone jobs, Trump destroyed US leadership, Vince Foster committed suicide, CCP wont manipulate currency, Classical Music is Racist, Trump wont have magic wand, Paris Climate Accords help US, Trump is Anti-Semite, Math is Racist, What difference does it make, Manufacturing isn't returning, Trump will crash stock market, There is no deep state, Abolish gender pay gap, POC have trouble getting an ID, Seattle's CHAZ isn't dangerous, CNN townhall wasn't scripted, Trump hid in bunker, Ma'Khia was in schoolyard fight, The NC bathroom bill was evil"
Well got that first 25% out of the way.
Liz:
Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!, Trump!
And, if you ask her, it's quite certain she is not aware of being a slimly pile of TDS-addled shit.
Most commenters are consistent.
Jesse is a conservative libritarian
Fists of etiquit is halariois and glib
Red rocks is a first principle libritarian that hates what Colorado became
Sbp is a child pornografer who got his first name banned by posting child porn links on the burn after reading article
Rev Kirkland is always a psycho talking about klingers (I still don't know why he hates Jamie Farr)
Kar and his socks love the Mormons.
Sarc used to be okay, but tds got him
Same with Chem jeff
Sqrls is hcoekjduejioajbdjdhdifiehdiejjdodjqapwir830rirufowbdue9ohhe
*my handle was a parody of Rev Kirk where I would post things in his style, but that got boring and repetitive so I figured anyone like that cant have an iq above 4. It took about 4 months for someone to notice I was a parody
lol
Jesse is a MAGA NPC. He has zero critical thinking capability. He just repeats what his right-wing masters tell him.
And if by "first principles libertarian" you mean "racist asshole", then "first principles" aren't what they are cracked up to be.
Yeah, I know, fat boy, you're still buttblasted at me pointing out that you support child molesters due to dumbshit marxist narratives about oppression.
lol it was so easy to bait you. I note that you didn't even deny the claim, because it is true. You've said previously that you will object to everything I say no matter what so your attempt to try to lay that "child molester" thing at my feet continually is just one more of your dishonest tactics to "stop me" at any costs. You can't stand that I am right and so you must try to slime me instead.
I note that you didn't even deny the claim, because it is true.
LOL, magnificent circular reasoning there. Same kind of nonsense I see from commie vermin across the internet.
You've said previously that you will object to everything I say no matter what so your attempt to try to lay that "child molester" thing at my feet continually is just one more of your dishonest tactics to "stop me" at any costs.
You literally claimed that not allowing child molesters to claim refugee status was oppressing them, stated that "oppression" trumped their disgusting predatory behavior, and argued that someone exposing themselves to kids from an open window of their house wasn't a big deal.
There's nothing "dishonest" about pointing out shit you said, you're just mad that it makes you look like a pederast.
You can't stand that I am right and so you must try to slime me instead.
You're not right about a single fucking thing, fat boy. Stop the self-important bullshit.
“You literally claimed that not allowing child molesters to claim refugee status was oppressing them, stated that "oppression" trumped their disgusting predatory behavior, and argued that someone exposing themselves to kids from an open window of their house wasn't a big deal.”
Yep, I remember all of this happening.
Still no denial, just doubling down on the diversion and the distraction. You're one of those racist clowns who buys into the whole 'White Genocide' and 'Camp of the Saints' crap. Your version of 'libertarian principle' begins and ends with segregation. YOU are the reason why the cause of liberty is derided and looked down upon, because people correctly see that the people who claim to be 'libertarians' are the ones who want to use liberty to fulfill their innermost racist desires, rather than viewing liberty as an end until itself.
Still no denial, just doubling down on the diversion and the distraction.
LOL, it's the fucking internet, you don't set the rules here, fat boy.
You're one of those racist clowns who buys into the whole 'White Genocide' and 'Camp of the Saints' crap.
Yes, I realize it's verboten to notice the left claiming for years that immigration would turn Texas blue, and that criticizing your side's anti-white pedagogy is racism in your tiny minds.
YOU are the reason why the cause of liberty is derided and looked down upon, because people correctly see that the people who claim to be 'libertarians' are the ones who want to use liberty to fulfill their innermost racist desires, rather than viewing liberty as an end until itself.
YOU are the reason why the left are seen as a bunch of child-lusting pederasts that hate working class white people. Fuck, you and your side don't even LIKE this country.
Since you were named, am I accurate in my assessment?
Rev Kirkland is always a psycho talking about klingers (I still don't know why he hates Jamie Farr)
Well done.
I'm more fuck the left and GOPe both libertarian.
I'm also a realist libertarian, not idealistic. Because all forms of idealism and the models developed from idealism require an authoritarian type view where everyone agrees with you.
I also dont believe the NAP means never fighting back.
You're not a libertarian in the slightest. You're a simp for the right.
You hate your enemies more than you love liberty.
Because all forms of idealism and the models developed from idealism require an authoritarian type view where everyone agrees with you.
LOL - libertarianism explicitly means we don't all have to agree with each other. That's the point! I live my life how I want, you live your life how you want, and no one cares unless one of us violates the NAP.
YOUR team wants authoritarian structures in order to force compliance with your idea of what patriotism means. YOUR team rejects diversity and tolerance and even pluralism now. So STFU asshole.
I also dont believe the NAP means never fighting back.
The NAP means that you can fight back - in self-defense. It doesn't say that you get to be the aggressor when you feel like it because someone was mean to you.
GLIB????
Showing little forethought or preperation: offhand
I doubt you prep any of your comments... Unless your secretly Liz! Du Du duuuuummmmm.
Simmer down Mr Cruise.
Too local?
"Oversight Committee releases video of Biden's physician's closed-door testimony"
[...]
"On the advice of counsel, I must respectfully decline to answer based on the physician patient privilege and the reliance on my right under the Fifth Amendment," O'Connor says in the video.
O'Connor's lawyer then said the doctor would not answer "any questions."..."
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/dr-kevin-oconnor-bidens-physician-sits-interview-gop/story?id=123606551
Like anyone else, he's got the right to incriminate himself by taking the 5th to every question, but you'd think that might be worthy of comment here.
Some of the questions likely dont fall under 5th protections. Such as asking about 3rd party events.
Thank curly Humphrey. He was a mobster in AL capones outfit. He made it through school all the way to the age of 7 years old(about 3rd grade in today's terms) . He developed money laundering with the concept of opening a laundry mat and falsifying receipts to make the money legit, and the phrase "I refuse to testify on the grounds that it may incriminate me"
Curly huh. Was he the one before Shemp?
Semp was actually Moe's brother. Joe besser however... He did not know physical comedy
You know Trump’s done something indefensibly stupid on tariffs again when Jesse has to resort to posting links to random shit that’s not even part of the article….
Reason has had these types of posts long before Trump.
^Reason has had these types of posts long before MG; there have been lying piles of lefty shit here from the get-go.
Yup, that is the general strategy. JesseBot's programmers are not stupid.
chemjeff radical individualist 1 hour ago
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In too-local news:
Missouri state government repeals mandatory paid sick leave law that was approved by voters.
You literally just posted this Lying Jeffy. Damn you’re such a dishonest piece of shit.
you've forgotten the sarcjeff self-exemption rule.
Lolwut?
I dont think these tariffs are bad given Canada's own manipulation of markets. Ive been clear on this since Obama.
What the fuck is wrong with you retards?
Welcome to the roundup dumbfuck. Even doc retard called you out lol.
It’s the roundup, people have been linking to and discussing topics not included in it in the comments since I’ve been coming here, about a decade ago.
But you know this.
McCunt know this. He has been here before. Just another sock most likely.
In too-local news:
Missouri state government repeals mandatory paid sick leave law that was approved by voters.
https://apnews.com/article/paid-sick-leave-missouri-b865c9ccb726b766fae929d228afecba
This is the type of crap that demonstrates that the modern Republican Party is not "populist", they are just pro-business in the same way that they always have been.
I don't think paid sick leave should be mandated by law. But *the people of the state voted for it*. And the legislature defied the will of the people.
There are plenty of good arguments against mandatory paid sick leave. But none of them include the phrase "because I am a populist".
it evidences the Missouri Republican Party bows to the Chamber of Commerce
Do we think Lying Jeffy really believes this is some sort of gotcha?
I help my reading comprehension skills by picking out the flaws in the arguments
The GOPe are on Team Jeffy, as you well know. And are as anti-MAGA as you.
Also Earlier Jeff; "Populism is evil. The Nazi's were populist".
ICE lawyer resigns in protest.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/ice-employee-quits-had-to-make-a-moral-decision/ar-AA1Imv5n
LOL, sounds like the same passive-voiced "No one's saying we don't have problems, but this isn't the way to do things," which is always code for "I'm hoping we can stall this shit long enough so that nothing actually changes."
Just so many slugs trying to suck the fruit dry before they move on...
"Boyd added that many ICE attorneys share his concerns and are biding their time until their student loans are forgiven before they, too, resign.
These are actually the kind of assholes who ensured that student loan debt was so hard to get out from under in a bankruptcy filing. The types who got their law degree and then declared bankruptcy in order to get $250K in loans written off their ledger, while actual working and middle class people judiciously made their own payments.
Democrat holdover who was about to get canned resigns "in protest".
Lol.
I love how anyone with a conscience is now labeled as "Democrat holdover". It speaks volumes about your team.
And?
Oh dear. Bureaucrat resigns.
HOW WILL THE COUNTRY SURVIVE THIS HORRIFYING LOSS?
I'll note he did not resign when Biden was allowing child molesters et al into the country.
Well well well. More and more world leaders are signing on to the nomination of Trump for the Nobel Peace Prize.
https://apnews.com/article/trump-netanyahu-nobel-prize-peace-544b703c161c13d9e14f1529df8a2669
Is it because they genuinely think Trump serves the cause of peace? No. It's because they want to suck up to him.
Trump has done more for world peace than any Democrat in the last fifty years, politruk.
Speaking of gaslighting...
Only ended India v Pakistan and Rwanda v Congo. Ending Israel v Iran and Israel v Gaza.
Yup, he certainly has done less for peace than Obama, who ended zero wars...
You would think they would be upset about him starting World Wars 3 thru 8...
This is more anecdote than data, but it really does seem like there's been an increase in shark activity, from both police and fire department drone reports and on-the-ground reports from shaken-up surfers. Sorry to the haters, but I'm staying OUT of the water for a few days!
Once again, Liz: Unsalted. No sharks.
sometimes I get to a comment before I'll read what Liz wrote and be all "what? Liz didn't write that!" then I scroll up and find out how wrong I was
I am sure no one here will give even the tiniest shit about the conditions at Alligator Alcatraz - just like virtually no one here gave the tiniest shit about people sent to El Salvador's torture prison - but here they are anyway, because you need to know what you are really defending.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/latino/families-immigrant-detainees-allege-horrible-conditions-alligator-alca-rcna217743
Of course, if there is not basic hygiene, then disease will run rampant. Which is I guess the point. It's cheaper to dump dead bodies into the swamp as alligator food then to fly them home, right?
No one here will give a shit about your propaganda.
Fuck off and die, TDS-addled lying pile of lefty shit.
Obviously, all of the people who are complaining about terrible conditions at Alligator Alcatraz, they are all lying. Every single one. I'm sure that the reality of the situation is that the conditions there are terrific! It's basically a five-star hotel! Maybe you should take a vacation there, sounds like a pleasant destination to 'get away from it all'. What do you think?
there are mosquitos in the south regardless of the detainees.
Yes, there are. Most human residences in the South also have reliable electricity and running water. Alligator Alcatraz, however, seems to be an exception.
reliable is subjective and Cuban natives complaining about Floridian conditions is delicious.
Never heard of criminals speaking words that are less than the absolute truth. Never happens.
And, Sevo, you can't say you weren't warned about what you and your team are *actually* supporting.
When this all comes to an end and the number of "missing" migrants is tallied, you cannot pretend ignorance. You knew this was happening all along.
Of course, since I estimate your current age to be approximately 139, by the time the final reckoning occurs, you'll probably be alligator food yourself.
They also said the tents were freezing, so which is it?
https://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local/family-denounces-horrible-conditions-at-alligator-alcatraz-as-mayor-demands-access-to-facility/3654015/
Another family of a migrant is denouncing conditions of lack of water, freezing cold tents and atrocious mosquitoes at the so-called "Alligator Alcatraz."
It is amazing how you leftists continue to fall for propaganda.
These reports have all been debunked.
Along with:
Detainees admitted to hospital (was taken and never admitted).
Claims of both too hot and too cold.
Unsanitary conditions (new facility, there is videos, bugs exist in florida)
This is the same retarded shit you always fall for where a career criminals family state they would never hurt a soul.
You are specially retarded jeff.
Ironically when J6ers were in worse prisons without bail for the crime of, checks notes... parading you defended and supported it.
In JesseBot terms, "it's all been debunked" means "a right-wing influencer posted a video on X so that solves that".
Unsanitary conditions (new facility, there is videos, bugs exist in florida)
You're right, it is a new facility! Maybe migrants shouldn't have been transported to a "new facility" that wasn't truly ready to receive them yet. What do you think?
Oh but wait, you don't give a shit. JUST LIKE in the case of Garcia, where he was deported to the *one place* that he wasn't legally permitted to be deported to, instead of adopting the eminently reasonable position of "maybe these activities should be taken with greater care and diligence", you IMMEDIATELY rush to defend it all DESPITE how sloppy and slapdash it all is.
This is why no one takes you all seriously with your claims that migrants are actually being treated humanely. Because you all have demonstrated time and time again that you truly don't give a shit, that to you it is more important to get them out of there, even if it means that they stay in squalid unsanitary unsafe conditions.
As you admit below, your position is "fuck the left". So if "the left" makes an argument that migrants should be treated humanely, you will knee-jerk oppose it.
...they can leave the facility anytime they wish.
But if you demand to remain here illegally, well, sucks to be you.
Every one of them is free to leave the moment they wish.
Literally every single one of them.
Clearly, it is not that bad.
Mosquitoes? In Florida? Well, I cannot believe mosquitoes exist in Florida.
>>Lie detectors, of course, are regarded as junk science,
meh ... anyone but a psychopath will get sweaty
>> I have no problem with Caitlin Francis' coldness in the tweet below
don't buy a dog if you'll kill the dog before you'll spend on the dog. and fuck you Caitlin Francis
Don't tell other people what the correct amount is for them to spend on their own livestock. Caitlin says she'd be OK with spending $500-1000 on medical care for a dog. Spending even that much on doctoring a pet was unheard of in most circles until quite recently.
>>Don't tell other people what the correct amount is for them to spend on their own livestock.
I offered no correct amount I said fuck you Caitlin Francis for her general attitude. I bet she's a peach.
She said she WOULD spend substantial money on a dog, and you're telling her "fuck you" anyway, apparently because you think she's not willing to spend enough. We can all see what you wrote.
no bro, you determined $500-$1000 is substantial money. she determined more $$ than some broad bracket of $500-$1000 is a death sentence for an animal. I said fuck you for general attitude.
Dogs are endlessly replaceable. Anybody spending big money on pet care should never complain about how expensive it is to do things.
I also loathe animals and cannot fathom desiring a pet. Fucking weirdos obsessing over their precious dog or cat are pathetic.
I'm not certain Texas isn't finished with Cornyn regardless of who's zooming who
I need to share an exchange I had with Quicktown Brix yesterday because it such a good example of the pervasive fallacious attacks lobbed every day in this forum at anyone who expresses any conservative bent to their libertarianism or dares to question the left-libertarian narratives being presented.
https://reason.com/2025/07/10/tariff-vengeance/?comments=true#comment-11121671
Ironically, he provided a perfect example of gaslighting while simultaneously proving my assertion. I have little doubt he actually believes what he wrote about gaslighting and doesn't perceive any flaw in the logic. And if he just left it at that, it would just be an annoying fallacy. But, absent any logical argument as to WHY I am wrong, he escalates, accusing me of redefining words and implies that everybody else agrees with him.
That is the very essence of gaslighting - an effort to make someone else think they are wrong, misguided, or crazy to rely on their own perceptions and internal logic. There is an insidious sophism infecting the purveyors of this tactic, born of deliberately stunted critical thinking skills and the certainty of moral superiority. It has been weaponized through indoctrination by "experts" who present ideologically biased information as learning materials, news, and science.
I don't know if they understand what they are doing. I think a lot of it is reflexive. But they must be called out and excoriated for it.
How was Quicktown Brix gaslighting in that thread you linked? I don't see it.
For context,
https://dictionary.apa.org/gaslight
^This steaming pile of lefty shit supports government murder:
JasonT20
February.6.2022 at 6:02 pm
“How many officers were there to stop Ashlee Babbitt and the dozens of people behind her from getting into the legislative chamber to do who knows what?...”
Fuck off and die, asswipe.
Because you're a Democrat as well. Youre so indoctrinated into these fallacious and sophist arguments you applaud them. You do the same type of argumentation as Mike.
Let me quote myself -
"There is an insidious sophism infecting the purveyors of this tactic, born of deliberately stunted critical thinking skills and the certainty of moral superiority."
That doesn't help.
"deliberately stunted critical thinking skills"
Is this a comedy routine? It is starting to feel like a comedy routine.
Poor poor reason.com conservatives. They are so much the victims here.
so much the victims here.
Remember when somebody linked your public twitter page, and you said you'd been doxxed?
Remember when you had anything worthwhile to say, something other than cheap gotchas? Actually, I can't.
So was your comment about them being victims a gotcha? Or was that arguing in good faith?
The sarcjeff style guide contains many contradictions.
It was mocking.
What is your purpose here? To harass me and the people you don't like?
At least JesseBot, simp for the right, occasionally posts newsworthy articles, as do some of the others. What do you contribute, other than continually yelling "gotcha!"?
What is your purpose here?
At the moment, my purpose is to figure out your rules.
So mocking people is acceptable when you do it, that has been established. My confusion is about how when others mock you, it's apparently playing "gotcha" or "bad faith" etc.
Can you explain?
So mocking people is acceptable when you do it, that has been established. My confusion is about how when others mock you, it's apparently playing "gotcha" or "bad faith" etc.
It's simple, he believes in Marcuse's "liberating tolerance," where the left gets to do whatever it wants, while the right has to be handcuffed at every turn. Which is why he and his lefty boos always bitch when they get a taste of their own medicine.
he believes in Marcuse's "liberating tolerance,"
That is YOUR TEAM. It's YOUR TEAM that thinks the rules don't apply to itself.
That is YOUR TEAM. It's YOUR TEAM
I thought not being on a team was one of the rules...
Right, so your purpose is to try to entrap me with gotcha games.
What you want, is for me to say something like "my rules are, I try to be civil", and then when I am not civil, you will swoop in and say "AHA! CAUGHT YOU!"
I try to be civil, but sometimes I am not.
I try to be honest, but sometimes I am not.
I try to hold myself to some standards, but sometimes I fail to do so.
In other words, I am a human being, just like every other human being, with virtues and failings as well. I am not especially moral nor especially sinful. I am just me.
I put myself out there to make arguments. You don't, because you are a coward. You would rather just criticize and mock and throw stones from the sidelines. You derive joy from tearing others down because it drags everyone down to your level.
I try to be civil, but sometimes I am not.
I try to be honest, but sometimes I am not.
I try to hold myself to some standards, but sometimes I fail to do so.
I don't fail at the second 2 which is the only reason I fail at the 1st.
wrong place
No shit.
Maybe write that on a piece of paper and staple it to your forehead.
What is your purpose here? To harass me and the people you don't like?
Would that be wrong? It's yet another case of Jeffey criticizing exactly what he does.
Oh man that was great shit.
https://x.com/chemjeff
Damn Chuck, I didn’t want this to become personal. I was trying to drop it because I've always l respected you. Well, let's have it out, then, but I'll request we try to come out as friends or at least tolerant of each other.
Gaslighting is an attempt to make one doubt their own sanity by knowingly telling lies to the point that said person doubts their perception of reality.
So if the claimed gaslighter believes what they are saying, by definition they are not gaslighting. They are merely mistaken, but presenting a good faith, even if fallacious argument.
the pervasive fallacious attacks lobbed every day in this forum at anyone who expresses any conservative bent to their libertarianism or dares to question the left-libertarian narratives being presented.
Come on, Chuck. The former libertarian MAGA converts outnumber the so called liberaltarians (i.e. anyone that criticizes Trump) by about 10 to 1 here so you can drop the victim mentality. I mean you jumped on my posts calling me a "retard marxist" and "assbag" because I was asserting my libertarian beliefs. I didn't chase you down.
>>Come on, Chuck.
this reads like Peppermint Patty lol.
And Sarcasmic is his Marcy.
I got a rock.
Gaslighting is an attempt to make one doubt their own sanity by knowingly telling lies to the point that said person doubts their perception of reality.
My definition - an effort to make someone else think they are wrong, misguided, or crazy to rely on their own perceptions and internal logic.
APA definition - to manipulate another person into doubting their perceptions, experiences, or understanding of events.
Your definition is substantially different from both of those, unjustifiably exaggerated by "knowingly telling lies" and "doubt their own sanity" to make it not fit my argument. You claim good faith when, in fact, you moved the goalposts without revealing they were moved, making the post I referenced a strawman argument. To counter my assertion you would need to demonstrate why known lies would be a requirement of gaslighting. Don't bother. It is self-evident that a sincerely held belief can contradict my understanding of events. People sincerely believe that the WTC was brought down by explosives. I work in construction and specifically in fireproofing.
It is the attempt at manipulation that elevates "merely mistaken" to gaslighting. And that is what you did by escalating past your fallacy with an accusation of misrepresentation to make sure it is clear that to me that I am wrong and you are right.
And, here you are, the very next day engaging in manipulative behavior yet again:
I didn’t want this to become personal.
Which is laughable to assert at this point.
I was trying to drop it because I've always l respected you.
This post contradicts both of those claims. Note that falsely claiming respect or sympathy is a hallmark of gaslighting.
The former libertarian MAGA converts outnumber the so called liberaltarians (i.e. anyone that criticizes Trump) by about 10 to 1 here so you can drop the victim mentality.
So much to unpack here. I am not a "former libertarian". I am not MAGA. I have repeatedly criticized Trump for 9 years. I do not have a victim mentality, as evidenced by my confidence in defending myself on the logic. This entire paragraph adds nothing to the discussion and is needlessly personal, directly contradicting your claim to not want it to be personal.
I mean you jumped on my posts calling me a "retard marxist" and "assbag"
Yes, I did. You have yet to demonstrate that I was wrong to do so.
because I was asserting my libertarian beliefs.
That was notably NOT the reason.
I didn't chase you down.
Um...? What the fuck is this post about then?
Gaslighting. You are trying to assert my logic is fantasy. You are failing.
Note that falsely claiming respect or sympathy is a hallmark of gaslighting.
That is true. You have a good point about what he said that fits this.
My definition - an effort to make someone else think they are wrong, misguided, or crazy to rely on their own perceptions and internal logic.
This is not true. If I try to "make someone else think that they are wrong, misguided, or crazy to rely on their own perceptions and internal logic," when their perceptions are demonstrably false, and their internal logic is fallacious, and I back up my attempts to do that with objective facts and reasoning, then that is not gaslighting. That is rational argument. Your definition is too broad. It would make it "gaslighting" to argue against a creationist.
Yup you got it. To this crew, it's only honest argumentation if one first accepts the other side's premises as valid.
"Okay, convince me God didn't create Adam and Eve. But first you have to accept that God created everything in 6 days!"
To this crew, it's only honest argumentation if one first accepts the other side's premises as valid.
QB didn't have to accept my premise. He did have to present objective facts and reason. Instead he just announced that I was wrong, dishonest, and that everybody agreed with him.
You constantly use the same tactic. Dissemble, deflect, distract. So kind of you to distract while he runs away.
Instead he just announced that I was wrong, dishonest, and that everybody agreed with him.
Can you point out where I did this? It was not my intent. If I knew what you were referring, to I would like to clarify what I meant or apologize if I was out of line.
I may well have said you were wrong, but it's not in my character to say you're dishonest even if I thought you were, and I don't think you are.
Dude, keep up the pious denial. It just makes you look more pathetic.
I don't remember ever seeing you offer objective facts and reasoned argument. You are a sniper. You accuse me of fallacies without ever bothering to show your work. You just called me a MAGA convert and you want to pretend your apology would mean anything?
Why do people think you are White Mike? He does the exact same thing. Claims to be sympathetic while repeating slander. Claims to be reasonable while lumping anyone who wants Trump to succeed in giving the fed an enema as a sycophant. Supports that flaming turd Sarcasmic. We see you, O2H guy. SSDD.
You want my respect? Identify a Marxist apologist just once.
I'll take your comments as constructive criticism.
This is not true.
Sigh.
and I back up my attempts to do that with objective facts and reasoning, then that is not gaslighting
Dude, you are really struggling with the critical thinking here. Of course it isn't gaslighting when you try to manipulate someone with objective facts and reasoning. That is a textbook definition of persuasion.
APA definition - to manipulate another person into doubting their perceptions, experiences, or understanding of events.
If you're trying to convince someone into doubting thier reality and beliefs and to accept what you believe, this is ordinary, honest arguing. This is what debate is. It is an attempt to bring somone to what you believe is true and sane.
By your definition any attempt to convince someone they are wrong is gaslighting. By your definition, you are gas lighting me right now...
Note that falsely claiming respect or sympathy
Falsely?! Not only does that contradict your argument, but how do you know what I'm thinking? I do respect you because prior to a few days ago you would argue with me based on facts and not make it personal.
didn't chase you down.
Um...? What the fuck is this post about then?
You called me out by name. I'm defending myself.
By your definition any attempt to convince someone they are wrong is gaslighting.
BULLSHIT. THIS IS DEFLECTION. You have to completely ignore all of my additional exposition to draw that conclusion. By your obviously flawed logic, under the slightly different wording of the APA definition, any attempt to manipulate someone is gaslighting.
Falsely?! Not only does that contradict your argument, but how do you know what I'm thinking?
How does that contradict my argument? Another assertion without an objective fact or logic to support it. Until you actually exhibit a modicum of respect by honestly engaging my comments, I will continue to assert it is false.
You called me out by name. I'm defending myself.
What defense? I missed where you have made a single appeal to objective fact or reason in any of your responses. Just more fallacy and FEELZ.
New rule: If you show up to immigration court to document ICE activities, you'll be arrested yourself based on trumped-up charges. So don't show up, citizen.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/ice-handcuffs-us-citizen-grandmother-san-diego-rcna218107
I’m going to assume there’s more to the story and you’re lying.
Because it’s what you do.
Hippie gets manhandled for interfering with ICE. When watched, video purporting to show "evidence" captured nothing.
It's what he does.
What they really think...
https://www.msn.com/en-us/video/other/jasmine-crockett-says-people-vote-the-wrong-way-because-they-are-uneducated/vi-AA1Ind6V
"Not woke" and "uneducated" are synonyms to people who use "woke" unironically. Ironically she is trying to sound educated and not use "woke".
I saw a clip of Crockett from when she first ran for Congress. She didn't sound "ghetto" in the clip, but rather normal for someone running for Congress. I suspect almost everything about her is fake, from her accent to her eyelashes.
One of today's illegal alien sob story...not a word about penalties for the employers who are admitting they illegally hire illegal aliens, but there should be.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/smallbusiness/mass-deportations-are-killing-small-businesses-owners-say/ar-AA1Ip7Sv
Contractors say many undocumented workers are staying home rather than risk deportation, leaving job sites understaffed and pushing project deadlines further out.
Ruben Mercado Jr., president and owner of Ipsum General Contractors LLC, said his company has lost one-quarter of its workers amid fears of immigration raids.
"Since the new administration has taken office, many of the undocumented workers have decided to stay at home in fear of being picked up by ICE and being deported," he said. "This has placed a huge pressure in our industry, affecting us in many ways.
"This includes a shortage of workforce. This shortage has impacted our ability to deliver our projects on time. This also has affected our bottom line due to an increase in payroll expenses."
In Houston, one-third of the construction workforce are undocumented immigrants. Deporting these workers would affect the Houston GDP by more than $50 billion over the next 10 years.
Someone needs to tell Ruben there's this thing called E-Verify he can use to form a legal immigrant workforce. Since he's in construction, there's another program called H-2B that will allow him to procure temporary workers just trying to make a buck. This makes it laughably easy to prove to any migra agents that his workforce is fully compliant with the law, and assure his workers that they won't be picked up by ICE in a workplace raid.
Sounds more like these companies are nervous that the gravy train might be at an end and they can't secure the amount of peon labor they're used to hiring.
Someone needs to impose actual penalties for not using E-verify so that businesses that do use it don't put themselves at a disadvantage over their competitors that don't.
But hey, if that happened, then prices across the board in construction, agriculture, and many parts of the service/hospitality industries might shoot up and voters would start whining about that. Not to mention how the businesses on the "gravy train" wouldn't be contributing to political campaigns as readily.
You know what causes prices to shoot up even more? Government regulations. Estimated at 30% of new home costs. But you support that shit.
^This slimy pile of lefty shit supports government murder:
JasonT20
February.6.2022 at 6:02 pm
“How many officers were there to stop Ashlee Babbitt and the dozens of people behind her from getting into the legislative chamber to do who knows what?...”
Fuck off and die, asswipe.
Someone needs to impose actual penalties for not using E-verify so that businesses that do use it don't put themselves at a disadvantage over their competitors that don't.
There's still H-2B available, or did you miss that?
But hey, if that happened, then prices across the board in construction, agriculture, and many parts of the service/hospitality industries might shoot up and voters would start whining about that.
We've been hearing this shit for decades. It's an assertion without evidence.
Not to mention how the businesses on the "gravy train" wouldn't be contributing to political campaigns as readily.
Sounds like those are the ones that need to get cornholed.
Notably, your response here seems to boil down to, "Well, they aren't doing these specific things, so we can't upset the status quo until it happens." Same shit, different year.
We've been hearing this shit for decades. It's an assertion without evidence.
I recently did work for a federal contractor in DC who was not obtaining I-9 docs. The laborers and operator were mostly from Central America, not all with SSNs and they were $36 - $50 an hour.
In Texas, from 2022 through 2024, $300/day was the going rate for each crew member for 10 hour shifts. This exceeds prevailing wage for laborers and the guys are paid cash, so no taxes.
Not an estimate. I ran the payroll and paid the subs weekly.
Why would costs increase? Decent labor always gets paid market price.
Notably, your response here seems to boil down to, "Well, they aren't doing these specific things, so we can't upset the status quo until it happens." Same shit, different year.
Notably, you missed my point by a mile. My point is that Trump and earlier immigration hard-liners on the right are being entirely performative with their policies. If they want to make a real difference in how many immigrants are in the U.S. illegally, then they need to make enforcing the law against business that hire them a priority. I'd even say that it should be the biggest priority. People here without proper authorization will self-deport in large numbers if they can't get jobs. Multiple sources I found while searching for the facts to support my post show that estimates are that around 70% of "illegal immigrants" have jobs or do at least some regular work in both the U.S. and the EU. Note that the estimates for the EU (prior to Russia invading Ukraine and creating millions of new refugees, at least) put such 'irregular' migrants at ~1% of the workforce there, while it is ~5% of the workforce here.
I think that the logical conclusion is that they don't really want to solve the problem that badly. Rather, they want to continue to use it as a tool to gain support from some voters and to distract them from all of their policies that favor big business over the average working American.
Democrats have long cried: "Who will pick our cotton!?"
That's why darkies were born.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_11Fb01Ujw&list=RDh_11Fb01Ujw&start_radio=1
Weird seeing all these businesses admit to fraud.
And whats the cost for non tax paying illegals from public resources?
No shit. They're either getting paid under the table, or like that cucaracha "activist" Jeanette Vizguera, committed identity theft and falsified her information to get employment.
>>Arbitrary displays of muscle not grounded in cogent arguments, and not really oriented toward delivering for the American people.
I know it's a stretch too look beyond because Rockaway is the center of the universe but T is killing it and America fucking loves him.
Another sob story for illegal aliens...why did they leave their kids behind?
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/venezuelans-deported-from-us-demand-return-of-their-children/ar-AA1InDBF
The media keeps trying to setup the sob stories...
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/mother-self-deports-to-honduras-says-she-doesn-t-want-anything-to-do-with-the-us-anymore/vi-AA1In1VQ
Good
Yeah.
"ICE told me they didn't have authorization to deport me because I don't even have a criminal record." Ramit has decided to seek help from the Hispanic community in Houston, TX, where she lived, managing to raise money to buy plane tickets and return to Honduras with her daughter...
[distinct lack of Jedi mind trick] This is not the immigration story you are looking for.
ICE has never said that.
Perhaps the illegals should stop... Colabarate and listen
They've already been ripping off the American taxpayer. Now you want them to rip off David Bowie and Queen?
You win.
How DARE the media tell stories about illegal immigrants who aren't actually violent predators! Why don't they just accept the MAGA narrative that they are all gangbanger rapists and murderers?
The only sob stories that the media should tell are the ones from Real Muricans who are oppressed by liberal politicians.
Yes, fat boy, we realize that you put foreigners over citizens. It's always the way of rootless cosmopolitans.
I put individuals ahead of the state. That is a foreign concept to racist fascists such as yourself.
Are the Mexicans complaining about immigrants from the USA into Mexico City racist facists? I mean...
'...In parts of the city, walls remain scrawled with graffiti: "My culture is not your trend" and "Kill a gringo."
Seems pretty violence inducing, xenophobic, and racist.
It sure does! It absolutely is bigoted and violent. No one said only Americans could be bigoted.
"I put individuals ahead of the state. That is a foreign concept to racist fascists such as yourself."
You and your buddy felt that murdering somebody was justice for trespassing on federal property.
Just pointing that out for you.
I see you're adopting the newest turn-of-phrase the media started using in the last few days, highlighting the "nonviolent immigrants". Used to be they "aren't criminals", but so many actually were, so now the "nonviolent immigrants" language is being used, subtly admitting they just might be criminals, but hey "nonviolent".
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/california-man-detained-by-ice-after-overstaying-visa-for-seven-years/ar-AA1I6w5Q
Critics say the immigration raids sow fear in vulnerable immigrant communities. Newsweek has documented dozens of nonviolent immigrants detained by ICE following Trump's return to the White House on the promise of widespread deportations.
Immigrants are just people. Like any group of people, some are sinners and some are saints. But mostly, they are just ordinary people. Team MAGA wants to vilify all of them as being equivalent to rapists and murderers. But that is not the case, hence deporting grandmas and the sob stories that you are reading.
Like any group of people, some are sinners and some are saints. But mostly, they are just ordinary people. Team MAGA wants to vilify all of them as being equivalent to rapists and murderers.
Liar. Normals want and expect the legal immigration process to filter out the people we don't want including America haters, terrorism supporters, and criminals. By contrast left wingers like yourself demand they all be allowed in without review. Only your position can be accurately described as treating the sinners and saints the same.
hey just might be criminals, but hey "nonviolent".
People whose only crime is illegal entry are "criminals". Just like people whose only crime is smoking a joint in the basement are "criminals". They should be treated the same by law enforcement, i.e., not at all.
All they have to do is leave.
If you opt not to, then you're trespassing.
And we know that trespassers can be shot in the face.
By coming here illegally they skip the screening process. Follow the process or we send you home. It's perfectly normal and perfectly acceptable.
Imagine someone going around the metal detector walking into a game (or political rally) and then whining about being treated unfairly because they send you to the back of the line. What fools left wingers are.
Look at Lying Jeffy lie. Amazing.
Cry harder...I've been told illegal aliens cannot possibly receive a single dollar of taxpayer-funded benefits...
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/donald-trump-announces-major-benefits-change-for-millions-of-migrants/ar-AA1Ip1MA
People who are in the country unlawfully are generally not eligible for most federal public benefits, such as food stamps or financial aid for college. However, for decades, they have been able to use some community-based programs, such as Head Start and community health centers.
HHS said it would now classify those programs as federal public benefits, making immigrants in the country illegally ineligible to enroll in them. Health Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr. said the move was part of a broader effort to protect the interests of American citizens.
Meanwhile, the Department of Education is set to end free tuition for undocumented students enrolled in postsecondary career and technical education programs. The Department of Agriculture is also set to limit access to federally funded food assistance initiatives, and the Department of Labor plans to block undocumented immigrants from receiving federal workforce development grants and resources.
The White House said the combined measures would preserve an estimated $40 billion in benefits for American citizens. The administration argues that the changes fulfill a promise to prioritize American taxpayers and discourage illegal immigration by removing what it describes as incentives for unauthorized migrants to remain in the country.
Health Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr. said in a statement on Thursday: "For too long, the government has diverted hardworking Americans' tax dollars to incentivize illegal immigration."
Secretary of Education Linda McMahon said in a statement: "Postsecondary education programs funded by the federal government should benefit American citizens, not illegal aliens. Under President Trump's leadership, hardworking American taxpayers will no longer foot the bill for illegal aliens to participate in our career, technical, or adult education programs or activities. The Department will ensure that taxpayer funds are reserved for citizens and individuals who have entered our country through legal means who meet federal eligibility criteria."
Secretary of Agriculture Brooke L. Rollins said in a statement: "Today's notice makes clear its intent—illegal aliens should not receive government dollars. This effort is one of many by the Department of Agriculture to eliminate waste, fraud, and abuse of USDA's programs and policies."
I've been told illegal aliens cannot possibly receive a single dollar of taxpayer-funded benefits...
No serious person ever said this. For example I'm pretty sure undocumented migrants "receive...taxpayer-funded benefits" when they drive on public roads.
The claim was that undocumented migrants were eligible for "welfare", where "welfare" is commonly and colloquially understood to be benefit programs like food stamps and housing vouchers. That claim is false, despite how many times the MAGA retards want to pretend that it is.
However, Team MAGA continually blurs and expands the definition of "welfare" to mean something closer to what you said, such as for example when they want to claim that emergency medical care counts as "welfare". A person treated in the ER after getting in a car wreck is qualitatively different than a person signing up for food stamps, yet MAGA wants to treat those two cases as equivalent moochers living the high life on the public dole.
Furthermore, there are some government services that really ought to be available to everyone regardless of their immigration status. Take for example the fire department. Do you really think that the firefighters should first ask about immigration status before putting out a house fire? That's a really bad idea, and the costs of that far outweigh any benefits.
So if you do agree that there are some government services that really ought to be available to everyone, then the real question is where to draw the line.
You stupid mendacious fvck, SNAP and free tuition are not emergency life saving medical care
Neither is the vast majority of ER visits for illegals.
Surely these Mexicans understand that borders are evil, that open-borders immigration is uber alles, and that to dare to question immigrants, or worse, to cast aspersions upon them is xenophobic, racist, and just plain mean. And let's not even talk about the notion that natives might want to preserve their culture and not be overwhelmed by foreign cultures! How crude.
https://edition.cnn.com/2025/07/10/americas/mexico-gentrification-cost-of-living-protest-intl-latam
Critics slam Mexico’s gentrification protests as xenophobic. Activists say they’re fighting for their human rights
I suppose you think that the "open borders" under Democrats is at least as bad as the open borders in the EU.
Like how it is easy for foreigners from non-EU countries to get jobs and live in EU countries. Oh, wait, they need both residence and work permits, just like in the U.S.
Okay, well citizens of one EU country can easily work in another EU country. Well, yeah, and that was one of the reasons to create the EU. European countries are all smaller than the U.S. in both population and geographic area, so greater freedom for people to move between them allows businesses to be more dynamic, just like fewer trade restrictions does.
Okay, well, I bet those "open border" countries don't do jack to businesses that hire illegals. Oh, wait. That isn't true either.
Maybe we should more like those "open border" socialists in Europe and put more effort into enforcing laws against businesses that hire people not legally allowed to work in the U.S. I bet that we wouldn't need all of the ICE raids and beautiful border walls and whatnot if we did that.
I think the people who hire illegal aliens, who skirt employment laws, payroll taxes, minimum wage, etc. should all be investigated and prosecuted when warranted.
Note that I hold this position even though I think the minimum wage laws should be repealed, that payroll taxes are theft, and so on. The fact remains that at the present time, these are generally applicable laws that should be enforced or eliminated.
I give you credit for consistency, then. The next question would be whether you would base your decisions on how to vote at least partly on whether the candidates will do that. And remember that there are primaries, so it isn't a Republican vs. Democrat choice until after the primaries.
Meanwhile...
https://www.newsweek.com/hispanic-support-deportations-rises-sharply-ice-raids-donald-trump-2097163
Support for President Donald Trump's deportations has surged among Hispanic voters in the space of two months, according to a new poll.
The survey, conducted by polling firm Cygnal between July 1 and 2, revealed that the percentage of Hispanic voters that strongly support the deportation of people in the United States illegally rose by 11 percent between May and July 2025.
The poll found that more than 60 percent of all voters now support deportation of undocumented migrants, with Hispanic voters showing a notable uptick. In contrast, 34.7 percent opposed deportations, and four percent were unsure.
Among Hispanic voters, 50 percent supported deportations and 48 percent opposed. There was a seven percent increase in overall support since May among this demographic, with an 11 percent rise among those who said they "strongly support" the policy.
Among Black voters, 53 percent supported deportations, while 37 percent opposed. Overall support among this demographic increased by three percent since May.
Meanwhile, support among White voters was 65 percent, while 31 percent opposed. Overall support fell by three percent since May.
There are 23 varieties of Hispanics. The Majority are Mexicans which is probably the majority in the poll. The Mexicans hate the Guatemalans who hate the Hondurans who hate the Nicaraguans who hate the El Salvadorans who hate the Venezuelans.
I'm sure the majority wants to see the other groups deported. I'm surprised black support for deportations is so low. Hispanics have pushed blacks out of many areas they lived in, often violently. Watts and Compton are majority Hispanic today.
https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna30870505
Another sob story, but with a twist (actually the same twist has been seen on some other cases). His asylum status was revoked under Biden administration, but ICE is just getting around to deporting him so of course it's all about oh, poor me, orange man bad. Did I mention that he's on the terrorist watch list? He says it's a mistake, and I don't personally put much faith in the terrorist watch list or "no fly" lists. But the picture the media paints is ALWAYS "sob...sob..."
Of course, CAIR (noted terrorist-supporting group https://www.newsweek.com/cair-not-only-inspires-terrorists-its-historically-linked-them-opinion-1671796) has histrionics about the guy: Khalid Turaani, executive director of CAIR in Columbus, said Soliman's detention is "a travesty for Americans."
https://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/2025/07/09/cincinnati-chaplain-detained-by-ice/84521510007/
Cincinnati Children's chaplain detained by ICE
Federal immigration officials detained a former Cincinnati Children's hospital chaplain on July 9, about seven months after revoking his asylum status.
Friends and supporters of Imam Ayman Soliman said officials with U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement took him into custody after a scheduled meeting with ICE in Blue Ash.
Soliman came to the United States from Egypt about a decade ago, according to federal court records, and received asylum status in June 2018. His supporters, including local clergy, politicians and representatives from Ignite Peace, said he was fleeing persecution in Egypt and feared his life would be in danger if ICE sent him home.
Sounds like he’s Muslim Brotherhood/ I mean an austere religious scholar
"The moves, former bureau officials say, are politically charged and highly inappropriate, underscoring what they describe as an alarming quest for fealty at the F.B.I., where there is little tolerance for dissent.
This has been true for decades. The difference is that the previous loyalty campaign was supported throughout the education and development system such that people insufficiently obsequious to the Ministry of Truth were never even considered for employment. Thus the left never had to wonder if its bureaucratic enforcers were loyal - they expressed their loyalty in casual conversations twenty times a day.
I just find it amazing that Reason, despite articles praising, is now pretending The Resistance wasn't a thing and bureaucrats were actively undermining the elected president.
THE SHARKS ARE OUT IN FULL FORCE!
Where are the JETS when you need 'em?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9z33lasnkU
>>Where are the JETS
losing the first six games of the season before August.
These two items—the Canada tariffs and the Patel loyalty polygraphs...
I swear to God, if we find out those lie detectors are Canadian made.
Is the equipment sticky from syrup?
If the equipment is sticky, syrup would be the preferred reason considering some of the others.
How AI-powered scanners are making it so that rental car companies can charge customers for every single minor scratch or ding sustained.
I always said that Skynet starts as a claims adjuster.
skynet entirely more personable than any claims adjuster.
...on Thursday that she had filed for divorce, saying she made her decision 'on biblical grounds' and 'in light of recent discoveries...
Well, someone doesn't take her wedding vows very seriously.
"Protesters on bicycles, skateboards, or even 'on foot' are framed as potential 'scouts' conducting reconnaissance or searching for 'items to be used as weapons.' Livestreaming is listed alongside 'doxxing' as a 'tactic' for 'threatening' police.
They also kit their leaders with water and bandages and call them medics to help them explain away their presence during criminal acts.
Why does Reason still resist understanding these protests are not organic? Reason is decades behind regular libertarians whenever understanding something would empower the right, which is probably a result of their journalism school indoctrination training them in ways that take decades to overcome.
Left wing protests are professionally planned, managed, and executed. Many of the people who seem casually present are in fact key participants. This should not be news.
Vietnam's leadership was caught off guard by US President Donald Trump's announcement last week that it agreed to a 20% tariff...
Charlie needs to stick his head out of that tunnel more often. We got tariffs in the wire down here.
'I almost got to the point where I was ashamed to tell people what the estimate was for things because it was so insanely high.
"Then I remembered we don't do shame anymore."
US POSTS UNEXPECTED $27 Billion monthly SURPLUS for June as a tariff receipts for 2025 top $100B
https://www.cnbc.com/2025/07/11/treasury-posts-unexpected-surplus-in-june-as-tariff-receipts-surge.html
I don't have the energy to revisit all 400 Reason stories from this year on ballooning deficits and tariff catastrophes.
Just know this, the tariff haters here wanted to raise everyone's income taxes instead.
You tax something, you get less of it. That's the theory behind sin taxes and carbon taxes. They want to tax work and investment, as opposed to buying foreign.