Trump's Mass Deportation Plan Is Anti-American
Donald Trump’s promise to carry out “the largest domestic deportation operation” in U.S. history would tear apart families, harm American workers, and require militaristic enforcement.
Former President Donald Trump has promised to enact a wide range of restrictionist immigration policies if he wins the presidential race this year, but his most extreme proposal is to carry out "the largest domestic deportation operation in American history." In an interview last month with Time, Trump suggested that between 15 million and 20 million people could be targeted by the plan.
The idea of mass deportations had buy-in from other contenders for the Republican presidential nomination, including former New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie, former South Carolina Gov. Nikki Haley, and Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis. And 51 percent of people surveyed by Axios and The Harris Poll in April said they support mass deportations of undocumented immigrants.
The proposal has entered the mainstream, though few who embrace it as an antidote to a chaotic border policy seem to realize what implementation would cost. It would require militaristic enforcement that would bleed into many parts of everyday life; it would tear long-present parents and providers away from their U.S. citizen children; it would rattle key economic sectors; it would carry an extraordinary price tag; and it would fly in the face of American ideals.
In other words, Trump's mass deportation plan isn't just anti-immigrant. It's anti-American.
An April report from the Office of Homeland Security Statistics put the number of unauthorized immigrants around 11 million as of January 2022. (The count includes people who entered the country illegally or overstayed visas, as well as those who benefit from forms of prosecutorial discretion, such as individuals brought to the country illegally as kids.) Targeting those 11 million would amount to targeting about 3 percent of the U.S. population, while Trump's numbers would represent about 5 percent to 6 percent of the population.
Trump has said that his administration would use local law enforcement, the National Guard, and potentially the U.S. military to carry out deportations. "Advisers are eyeing military bases for expanded detention capacity," reported The Wall Street Journal. Jason Houser, former chief of staff at Immigration and Customs and Enforcement under President Joe Biden, told The Atlantic that Trump may well need to use warehouses or abandoned malls to temporarily house migrants slated for removal. Houser estimated that hundreds of thousands of enforcement officers could be needed to detain and deport migrants at the magnitude Trump wants. Hard-liner Trump administration immigration adviser Stephen Miller has suggested that Trump may deploy National Guard troops from red states to blue states that refuse to comply with the deportation plan, per The Atlantic.
Fifty-six percent of respondents to a Reuters/Ipsos poll "said most or all immigrants in the U.S. illegally should be deported," per Reuters, but about half also said they opposed putting undocumented immigrants into detention camps while waiting to be deported. Americans may prove more comfortable with the idea of mass deportations than the reality, which would inevitably tear apart families and lead to horrible scenes of enforcement, given the "large-scale raids" Miller has called for.
The plan would target millions of people who have established productive, peaceful lives in the U.S. and support U.S. citizen children. Roughly 80 percent of the country's unauthorized population has lived here for over five years, according to a 2019 estimate from the Migration Policy Institute. Just over one-fifth have lived in the U.S. for two decades or more. Eighteen percent are married to a U.S. citizen or legal permanent resident, and one-third—over 3.5 million people—reside with at least one U.S. citizen child under 18. Over a quarter of the unauthorized population, slightly more than 3 million, own a home.
Mass deportations would punish the U.S. citizen children and spouses of undocumented immigrants, but they would also significantly disrupt the economy, which would affect vast numbers of Americans. About half of the country's farm workers are undocumented; targeting this work force would lead to labor shortages and raise already-high food costs. The same is true in the construction sector, which disproportionately employs undocumented immigrants. And since many undocumented immigrants are entrepreneurs who create American jobs, deporting them would put U.S. citizens out of work.
Mass deportations would prompt American "business owners to cut back or start fewer new businesses, in some cases shifting their investments to less labor-intensive technologies and industries, while scaling back production to reflect the loss of consumers for their goods," warned George Mason University economist Michael Clemens. "Prior episodes of mass deportations and exclusions" in U.S. history, Clemens continued, have reduced both employment and earnings for American workers "in the short run and long run."
Even if these consequences don't touch all Americans, the price tag of Trump's plan would. Taxpayers would be on the hook for exorbitant enforcement costs. In an analysis conducted for MarketWatch, researchers with the Penn Wharton Budget Model estimated that Trump's deportation plan "could easily reach more than $1 trillion over 10 years." That estimate "comes in high relative to some other sources that still name a staggering price for deportation," wrote J.D. Tuccille for Reason this week. "If Trump and company want to own the issue, the costs associated with it also belong to them."
But this conversation is about much more than monetary costs. It's about the government wielding force against largely peaceful, nonviolent residents who help create vibrant American communities. It's about whether deploying police officers, National Guard members, and the military to extract undocumented immigrants from their homes and workplaces in raids is consistent with American values. It's about the civil rights and due process violations that will inevitably occur if this plan comes to fruition.
The U.S. immigration system is undeniably broken, but mass deportations won't fix it or create order. They would change the face of the country for the worse.
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Every time a criminal is punished, that tears apart a family.
I hope those ILLEGALS get theirs torn apart so good and hard. Time to watch some border footage, yum.
Ok, Fed.
Ok, Fag.
Is 5.56 the length or the diameter of your penis?
A faggot would be interested in that kind of information.
So you’re tiny. I’m so sorry:
.
An international political (DEMOCRAT) organization issues arrest warrants for Jews……
First nation saying – “WE WILL ARREST THOSE JEWS”
.
GERMANY – 2024.
.
WTF?
DEAD SERIOUS.
FUCKING LOOK IT UP.
DON’T USE GOOGLE IF YOU ARE HONEST.
IS THE DEMOCRAT PARTY (U.S. GOVERNMENT) BUYING / INSTALLING GAS CHAMBERS?
.
IT’S AN HONEST QUESTION DESERVING AN HONEST ANSWER.
You wouldn't need to shout if you were honest.
Vulgar Fatman is oncerned about tininess too, I see. Any other issues we should be aware of?
Shoulda gone with 7.62...
funny how violent fascists seem to find the comments section lol
Yes, it does. So we should reserve "criminal" status for those crimes that are truly harmful. Murder, Rape, Assault, Property Theft and the like.
The illegals are being given 150B of stolen tax money a year. But you dont care about that do you dummy.
Not to mention the people who have been raped and murdered by illegal immigrants.
Where is that 150 billion figure from?
https://www.fairus.org/issue/publications-resources/fiscal-burden-illegal-immigration-united-states-taxpayers-2023
And if you dont trust them.
https://www.newsweek.com/illegal-immigration-costs-us-billions-biden-administration-policy-impact-taxpayer-burden-1866555
That doesn't include the ngo's
So, compare that in per capita numbers to full citizens and how much per capita is spent on them. 150 billion sounds like a lot of money, but compared to the whole of the Federal and state budgets it's a tiny fraction of money spent.
HA HA yeah, $150 billion here, and $150 billion there, and soon you might be talking about real money. Maybe you could give me $150 billion, since you think it's such an insignificant amount of money, eh?
That's not an answer.
Look at the sarc sock come to a libertarian site and defend welfare for illegals. Lol. But they just want to work huh?
And you want to compare welfare rates?
https://cis.org/Report/Welfare-Use-Immigrants-and-USBorn
There you go dummy.
Fuck you.
Sorry, but that is simply moronic. Because mathematically less is spent per capita on illegal aliens then its not a problem? Omfg.
No, I don’t trust FAIR, given the flaws in its study pointed out here: https://www.cato.org/blog/fairs-fiscal-burden-illegal-immigration-study-fatally-flawed
The Newsweek article simply cites the FAIR study.
Cato is one of the worst sources to use for illegal immigration debates dumbass. They have hired Marxists on the issue as well. The CATO articles dismiss a lot of the funding and over estimate the taxes paid. They are a joke on border issues.
Likewise your link is from 2017 and doesn’t refute the above report retard.
How is the 2017 report exposing the study from 2023 flaws? You open border idiots are so desperate to deny the costs it is amazing.
The 2023 FAIR report uses the same flawed methodology as its 2017 report. As to CATO, there’s nothing you can point to to show that the data FAIR relies on is any more reliable than CATO’s, or that FAIR’s analysis is any better.
Good news! CATO has updated their criticism of FAIR for 2024.
https://www.cato.org/testimony/cost-border-crisis
Bonus — they take on CIS’s as well.
Vernon Draper assures us that any statistics showing anything positive about illegal aliens is all an "ass pull". His words, not mine. He says this in the next conversation.
If any positive study is an ass pull then why are we to belive your negative studies aren't also ass pulls? Seems to me if we don't have good information on illegals than any statistical data is just an ass pull.
I will say I have noticed the right leaning folks here tend to point to one bad apple and insist the whole barrel is bad when it comes to drug users as well as illegal aliens. Few examples mean all are bad.
Since I know you're wrong about drug users then it's not much of a stretch to figure you're wrong on illegal aliens. Can you prove otherwise without ass pulls?
I see you can't counter any of the actual data used as reported by government data.
Standard sarc/jeff argumentation style. Good work dummy.
Fick you. If I am to believe you then Vernon is full of shit and another study that proves you wrong is accurate which means you are full of shit too.
If I believe what Vernon wrote then you are still full of shit and we don't need any circular logic to prove you are wrong.
Roughly 80 percent of the country's unauthorized population has lived here for over five years, according to a 2019 estimate from the Migration Policy Institute. Just over one-fifth have lived in the U.S. for two decades or more. Eighteen percent are married to a U.S. citizen or legal permanent resident, and one-third—over 3.5 million people—reside with at least one U.S. citizen child under 18. Over a quarter of the unauthorized population, slightly more than 3 million, own a home.
All these numbers are ass-pulls. We have no idea how many illegals are here.
100% of illegal immigrants have broken the law
All these numbers are ass-pulls. We have no idea how many illegals are here.
^ This
Do they really expect us to believe that the number of illegal immigrants has stayed flat over the last 20 years? According to DHS, the estimated number of illegal immigrants in the US was 10.5 million in 2005.
(https://www.dhs.gov/xlibrary/assets/statistics/publications/ILL_PE_2005.pdf)
Since then, that number is almost always given when talking about the number of illegal immigrants in the US.
That’s despite what we are all able to see with our own eyes. Hell, even Snopes had to admit that, “As of January 2024, more than 7.2 million migrants had illegally crossed into the U.S. over the Southwest border during U.S. President Joe Biden's administration — a number higher than the individual populations of 36 states.”
(https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/million-migrants-border-biden/)
Lol. Fiona used an estimate from before the surge of 7M illegals.
the government wielding force against largely peaceful...
Invading another country is not peaceful.
^THIS
“Hey man. I didn’t steal your car. I just peaceful drove off in it.” /s
Calling people who entered the country illegally to work "invaders" is just as dishonest as calling the J6 yahoos "insurrectionists."
Same level of deliberate dishonesty, and for the same reason.
The reason is to trigger laws against "insurrectionists" and "invaders" who are actually armed, organized and dangerous, and use that to initiate force against people who are none of those things.
But you have called J6ers insurrectionists.
Likewise your lie about them just wanting to word has been debunked dozens of times. Even the ones who work want free shit from healthcare to schooling. Now they want free food and shelter.
You continue to lie.
He lies all the time. He can’t help it.
Better than dealing with random sock hallucinations like you were nothing more than an ill-trained LLM.
Are there legal ramifications that follow from the generic term 'invader'?
There are absolutely legal ramifications to being charged with 'insurrection', considering that is a legally defined crime.
Can you say the same about 'invasion'?
Why are you drawing some sort of equivalence when there isn't any?
The U.S. immigration system is undeniably broken, but mass deportations won't fix it
Neither will throwing open the gates and letting in everyone in the world who wants to come here. If you want to be taken seriously, Fiona, instead of being ridiculed as an idiot, tell us your plan to improve border security so we can control who enters, and how many. Tell us about your guest worker program. Give us your plan for streamlining the immigration process. "LET EVERYONE COME IN AND STAY 'CAUSE HUMAN RIGHTS!" is not a solution.
^THIS. Humorously the USA already has by-far MORE immigration (legally) than any other developed nation on the globe. These are no longer talk about immigration they are talks about allowing complete invasion to occur. Maybe the entire USA should pack their bags and move into Mexico. Course you know these ‘immigrant’ fans would have a hay-day about that as well as their own-land government and humorously (again) they’d all be breaking back into Mexico’s territory.
Criminal minds out looking for someone else’s greener pasture to graze on without having to *earn*/repair their own is what is at work.
That mentality is completely solidified by 75% also voting for more ?free? other people’s money and 51% right now living on stolen other people’s money. Only 25% of the current immigration should continue to exist by the statistics.
If you want to be taken seriously, Fiona, instead of being ridiculed as an idiot, tell us your plan to improve border security so we can control who enters, and how many.
I don’t think she’s gonna care too much that the usual batch of losers is calling her an idiot in the comment section.
Sick burn brah.
Hey blardo, are you or your parents ILLEGALS by chance? I once knew a guy whose parents were ILLEGALS, he wanted to go to college bad, alas, he couldn't. Because his parents were ILLEGALS. What a poor little LOSER he was.
That you sarc?
That you, faggot?
It is you!
Hey Vulgar Fatman, Im legit making fun of ILLEGALS for putting their kids in gridlock shit situations and setting them up for failure by breaking the law of the land, and your low IQ won't allow you to see past your dumb little sock paranoia. Go make out with that Hank Phillips patient, I think that would be the appropriate kind of company for you at this point.
It sounds more like Pluggo. Pluggo loves his socks.
Not as much as he loves children.
I mean, after seeing how these comments sections deal with tech topics, it became obvious that many here aren’t as bright as you would expect from their verbal capacities.
However, this shit is shocking.
Sarcasmic is living in your head rent free.
Like the Catholic Church for you?
So, you believe that throwing open the gates and letting everyone who wants to come barge right in and stay as long as they want would be a good idea?
I don’t think she’s gonna care too much that the usual batch of losers is calling her an idiot in the comment section.
The comments section is an embarrassment to the magazine.
All the Act Blue socks really drop the average IQ.
Oh the humanity!!
Why can't everyone just let you guys cosplay as libertarians pushing dnc narratives.
Awe, poor sarc.
"The comments section is an embarrassment to the magazine."
Not the alcoholic troll who brownnoses Charles Koch's content farm hacks, but everyone else.
Your ‘contributions’ are certainly an embarrassment. Drunk lying pussy.
That would require intelligence, which isn't Fiona's job. Her job is to construct a story that fits within the views of Reason's owner.
Which is why you're here, I suppose?
Actually, at this point mass deportations are about the only thing left that would convince the world that we actually have a border...
Hi Fiona, pleas go to another country the US doesn't need you or the illegals
I highly recommend it (leaving). The US is a real shithole these days--just ask Donald Trump!
Apparently, being American (according to Fiona), is pretending America is just an unclaimed land mass that hasn't gone through a Revolutionary War (made property claim/independence) and wrote a U.S. Constitution (Supreme Law of the Land) that (Article IV; Section 4), "The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion"
How does one even describe being "American" when they pretend America doesn't even claim an enforced land border? An imaginary figment 'nation' inside one's own head? The stupid is off the charts in this article.
Any crime by a non-citizen, whether felony or misdemeanor, should result in deportation upon completion of their sentence. How is this not standard procedure everywhere in the world?
-jcr
It is every in the world, outside of the West. Zero non-western countries would allow anybody who entered illegally to get away with ANY crimes.
Now, Germany, USA, et al won't kick rapists out of the country.
It's genius. Open the borders and refuse enforcement for a decade, and then when the tens of millions have arrived, say it's just too darned hard to fix the problem.
Wow. Deja Vu, I feel like I've been here before.
I feel like we've been here several times already. It's funny that she pretends most American citizens haven't always been against illegal immigration and pins this as a new Trump-derived phenomenon.
How old is that "der terker jerrrrrbs!" episode of South Park?
Just a little over 20 years, so more mature than Fiona.
Ronald Reagan did a mass amnesty.
Yes he did. He did so based on the Democrats promise that border security would be increased and that the amnesty would be a one time thing. A promise that was never kept. That is a large part of why any talk of amnesty occurring before the border is brought under control is doa.
The sarc sock doesn't actually read history or primary sources. He doesn't know what the 86 agreement actually was.
This sounds like NATO's "promise" to Russia not to expand eastward.
Similar factual basis (if not source) I presume?
Yes the Democrats lied just like Putin.
By all means look to the speeches made by Congressional stalwarts who promised to do things like secure the border properly to ensure that an amnesty would not need to be repeated, or you can simply choose to believe it didn't happen, and Reagan signed it because the Democrats wanted him to...
Open the borders and refuse enforcement for a decade
No one has "opened the borders". No one has "refused enforcement". The reason why there are illegal immigrants in this country is the same as the reason why there are illegal drug users in this country - DESPITE their best efforts, no government can completely stop free people from exercising their fundamental liberties.
So, REPEAL ALL CRIMINAL LAWS! Then there won't be any crime!
Fuck you, you lying fucker! Biden ended the remain in Mexico policy, told illegals to "surge the border", flying them all over the country, and actively suing any state that tries to defend the border!
Your can't be ?free? until you can trespass, steal and conquer other people's territory illegally (i.e. against their will)! /s
Hmm. I guess Russia is just 'freeing' their people so they can "exercise their fundamental liberties" in Ukraine. Right? Right? /s
That's right. According to Jeffy, you have a right to enter any country you wish. And, as libertarians, we all agree you have a right to bear arms. Therefore, you have a right to enter any country bearing arms.
Yes, and the recurring bait and switch just makes people skeptical of mass immigration more angry about the situation, and more likely to look to a Trump for a solution.
Is it anti-African? You ain’t black unless you accept migrants…
https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/safrica-election-fire/
Immigrants are the least "Black" Blacks in America.
Why aren’t the traffickers and NGOs throwing the illegals in the vacant estate bunker hotspots of the political democrat wealth management class? Less push back from the working class and takings of the resources they’ve worked, or paid taxes to acquire.
Hey, Ms. Harrigan.
Ask Laken Reilly if mass deportation of illegals who invaded our country is un-American.
I’m sure she falls under the category of: “acceptable losses” for harridan.
Utilitarianism is a philosophy of the greatest good for the greatest number of people (the collective is greater than the individual) . Victims of violence are a lower number utility per capita for Ivy League philosophy professors. same with public safety and justice reform. Individuals are social constructs
Pre wall Liz is too good for this place.
Is the "Wall" that you're referring to the one related to female attractiveness over time, or the one related to the typical post-revolution processing of dissidents and useful idiots? Because I can see your comment applying to either one.
The US has a process for legal immigration and residency. Individuals can apply for visas and citizenship through legal processes. You would be hard pressed to find any native born American who wishes these people ill. The vast majority of individuals crossing our borders are claiming asylum something that actually has a national and international definition. The vast majority of these claims are not legitimate per those definitions. And at least a large majority have violated international protocols which require them to apply for asylum in the nearest country. Legitimate claims should be dealt with promptly. Everybody else should be deported until they can make a legitimate claim through the prescribed international process. Libertarians are supposed to believe in a rule of law. I support enforcing existing law until something better is enacted.
“Libertarians are supposed to believe in a rule of law.”
Libertarians are supposed to oppose unjust laws that criminalize acts that don’t harm the life, liberty or property of others.
How is exporting trespassers on land they have no permission to be on 'unjust'?
So you're a collectivist who believes government owns all the land? Because that's the only way that they can be trespassing when their landlord is ok with them, their employer is ok with them, their grocer is ok with them, etc.
They are not ok with ILLEGALS
Wonder how vulgar reconciles this comment with his theory that I'd be sarc. Its astonishing.
Wow. Full retard.
This comment ignores that not all the land is held in private hands (and the fact that, whether we like it or not, the government absolutely believes all the land are belong to them).
In a perfect libertopia, you wouldn’t be able to transport someone along the private road if one or more of the owners objected to it. Which leaves you somehow teleporting those people on and off your private property, meaning they’re completely dependent on your cupidity. Not sure what the solution to that problem is, just throwing it out there.
We’re constitutionalists who believe in A,Erica’s sovereign borders. Not a global Marxist bitch, like you.
The existence of a nation requires declared government over a collective of land; YES. That doesn’t mean the land itself is/has-to-be collectively owned; NO. It means it is collectively governed by laws (Immigration/Invite-Required Laws).
The very laws / system that not only establish but enforces the very claim of private ‘ownership’. Course you know this. Everyone knows this. Your just attempting to flip the very means of private ownership on it’s head by calling it a ‘collectivist’ issue. Deceitful and fraudulent manipulation is all you’re selling like a dirty salesmen selling ‘missing parts’ after the sale.
So you took a poll of all of the citizens whose land they violated? What a vapid comment.
And we all know what sarcasmic think’s should be done to trespassers
Only if they are in the temple engaging in heresy against Lord Biden.
ILLEGALS harm property
Who defines what is unjust sarc? Do you see the flaws in your ideas? Oppossition doesn't mean blatantly violating either you retarded fuck.
Passing a new law is not a Libertarian act. There undoubtedly is already a law written to fix the problem that really just made it worse. Repeal that law and let the market settle out for a bit. Then repeal another useless law that is making messes.
The best way to stop illegal aliens from entering the US is to stop funding the Cartells that are fucking up Mexico. End the War on Drugs and those assholes will be broke. They won't be able to buy cops or ammo for their fancy guns. Then Mexico can be a great nation of its own and they will need their own labor force to do all the work. Then people won't need to cross illegally.
Most of the illegals aren’t coming from Mexico.
Paraphrased Point: "If the USA was just another sh*thole like the one illegals are trying to escape then no-one would want to immigrate."
Where-as keeping the USA from become yet-another sh*thole is exactly why illegal immigration isn't welcome.
This could be one of the most ignorant things ever written here. Sure we have data showing policy causing a border surge, but you just ignore reality and state some retarded pablum about funding cartels. Lol.
Given that this is a holiday weekend associated with liquid libation consumption, the potential for sarc and his defend Biden brigade of socks to post some real gems is high.
Hey, you’re onto something there mrm. If we really wanna make Mexico great again, the last thing we should be doing is selfishly poaching all of their young people to clean toilets and pick crops. Their countries need them more than we do!
Good to see you coming around to more sensible thinking on this issue.
It is not true that the international protocols currently require seekers of asylum to seek it in the first safe country they visit.
Current immigration protocols also prohibit deportation of people who have claimed asylum.
Supporting the rule of law works better if you know what the law is.
Fionas tears are almost as sweet as those of ILLEGALS. Im thinking about all the DOORS that are SHUT to the children of ILLEGAL LOSER parents. All those translator puppet children of ILLEGAL LOSER parents that speak no english and let their 10 year old ANCHOR BABY APPENDAGES do all the talking at walmart for them. How sad and hopeless they must feel. I really love it.
You’re really overdoing it sarc.
You are more retarded than you are old. Which is probably really hard.
You only get hard when you go to links posted by palins buttplug.
Jesus Christ, this so has absolutely nothing to do with me. But you also failed to identify me correctly when I did my Fiona one trick pony parody account. You fucking idiot legit wouldnt stop accusing me of being OBL. Youre really not that bright, buddy.
The REAL crime is that TWICE in my lifetime the DEMOCRATS have given AMNESTY along with Citizenship to 20 million illegal aliens.
The issue is that they PROMISED the American PUBLIC each time that it would NEVER happen again and that they would CLOSE the BORDERS to illegals.
The democrats are liars and thieves, stealing tax dollars from everyone to pay all costs (scores of times higher than the taxes created by illegal immigrants) and assuring that they will obtain VOTES from those that illegally entered and were made citizens.
This is a Political PONZI scheme. the word of any Democrat elected is NEVER to be trusted. If they make a promise it is only as good as the paper they wrote it on (they didn't write it).
I'm fairly sure Reagan did that too... is he an honorary Democrat?
Reagan was talked into it by the democrats. He later stated that amnesty was his greatest regret. So no.
It’s time to get rid of the democrats.
Ironically; 75% of immigrants vote for Democrats.
You just nailed the root reason I don’t support more immigration.
Even while some of the best people I know are legal immigrants.
They are the exceptional (25%) out of the pool-sample.
So no? So yes.
You don't get a do-over just because you don't like the outcome.
"Get rid of"?
That sounds kind of violent.
How does Trump propose to do this? Will we all be required to carry papers showing where we were born? As a practical matter, how do you separate the wheat from the chaff?
If you’re unwilling to sacrifice liberty to round up 11,000,000 vermin, then you’re not a libertarian. If you don’t support expanded police powers and immunities to catch these vermin, then you’re not a libertarian. If you oppose deploying the military to build concentration camps for these vermin, then you’re not a libertarian. No, if you oppose any of those things, you’re a leftist. Duh.
ICE ICE BABY
Getting your socks mixed up again?
You are beyond retarded, bud. Hope you die soon, telling from how inflexible your brain is it can't be much longer.
Your alcoholism will kill you first, sarcasmic.
You know that everybody here can see how much of a fucking dipshit you are when you call me sarc, right?
Keep coping drunky.
I think youre coping with the fact that you are expired. Must hurt.
Poor sarc
Another goddamn idiot, dont worry, won't look at you. Unless you really want me to lol
We can all see who the dipshit is.
Is that a 5.56 spoof or did him and Vulgar get some beef with each other?
Vulgar is old and not very bright, so he is stuck on that sarc paranoia. He also seems to really like ILLEGALS for whatever reason. I mean, reason really doesn't have the brightest kind of commenters in general when you look at their little AI infatuations of late. But this here is as bad as it gets.
Its pretty obvious that Vulgar doesn't have the ability to process a whole lot of information, I mean I comment rarely, but not that rarely that the slow kid would have a reason to assume that I'm a sock.
Who is it, Vernon Dipner?
I think it's a reverse Spartacus gambit. Anyone they don't like they claim is "Sarcasmic" a guy living rent free in their heads. They then dismiss this supposed sock of Sarcasmic as being not worth discussing matters with.
They're pussies.
Says the sarc puppet.
Good one sarc!
Pretty sure that’s Pluggo, not Sarc.
Im pretty sure you're an idiot, it's just that I don't know why that should have surprised me.
I love how the number has been around 11M for about 20 years now.
Trump sez it, dey believes it, dat settles it! Those blind fools who wrote the 1972 LP platform and ran the author of "Libertarianism" as their candidate--along with Tonie, the first woman ever to land an electoral vote, must've been crazy! So Reagan says "girl-bullying, spic-shooting prohibitionism is the REAL libertarianism, with extra helpings of initiation of force and asset-forfeiture looting to rob and jail them dirty hippies." And just like that the word changed meaning--as miraculously as Lazarus rising, shaking off the maggots and jogging around the block with Jesus!
Most of us already do. If you have a RealID compliant driver license or state ID card, that is proof that you're here legally. Since 1986, we've been required to show proof of legal status when applying for a job, on the I9 form. Aliens who are "in process", such as awaiting a refugee status hearing, are given papers showing their status, which they ought to carry with them.
Sure, and those can't be faked.
You realize when you apply for a job they need to see a state issued ID AND a second form of ID like, for some reason, your Social Security Card.
A Real ID card is extremely difficult to fake. Obviously a new employer needs your SS number. Alien status papers are easy to verify.
Exactly like all law is enforced.
Police ask questions and when the answers smell like fish they dig a little deeper.
Why are Stupid pointers like these even being made?
1) How will law be enforced. (Gosh, not like it hasn't been for millions of years).
2) Why does a nation claim land borders. (Gosh, not like a nation couldn't exist without land borders).
3) Would people want to trespass if they weren't after anything (Gosh, maybe grifting USA wealth is what they're after).
Oh yeah; They aren't 'pointers' at all. They're pathetic and silly *excuses* for an illegal invasion.
RFK Jr. jokes about his 'brain worm' eating 'part of his memory' in speech to cheering Libertarians attacking Trump for his COVID response
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13456657/rfk-jr-brain-worms-joke-speech-libertarians-trump-covid.html
'Maybe a brainworm ate that part of my memory,' Kennedy said. 'I don't recall any part of the United States Constitution where there's an exemption for pandemics.'
Cue up the chorus of "Democrats wrote it! Veto proof majority!" from the liars and idiots who deny or refuse to admit that he was very, very, very proud of signing that legislation.
ICE ICE BABY
ILLEGALS love ICE. Because they often come from hot countries. Lmfao
This sock isn’t working for you.
Your sock paranoia is remarkable, I bet your property reflects what kind of a sad, isolated, irrelevant loser you are. Take your meds, you don't want to seem even more irrelvant, old and expired than you are.
Besides National Parks/Monuments, how exactly did Trump “impose lockdowns”?
I’ll give him a lot of the rest, especially dogging on Trump for listening to fucking Fauci.
Trump is pathologically self-absorbed. Since the COVID insanity did not affect HIS life, he had no interest in it.
What would you rather he do that he did not do?
What SHOULD he have done in your ideal world?
I don’t think anyone is discounting his self-absorption. That doesn’t answer my question about how he supposedly imposed lockdowns.
It answers why he didn't care that lockdowns were being imposed. They only affected little people who don't matter.
So he should have forced governors to change their policies? With what? That is a fairly statist desire.
Out of every political power out there; do tell WHO would have done less Constitutional Violations than Trump?
I don’t recall any part of the United States Constitution where there’s an exemption for environmentalists ... either.
An April report from the Office of Homeland Security Statistics put the number of unauthorized immigrants around 11 million as of January 2022.
Why are you using outdated numbers? It's 2024. Now the count is well over twice that. And they're not "unauthorized immigrants" - whatever that means. They are criminal illegal aliens. Emphasis on criminal.
It doesn't matter if it would tear apart families, affect American workers, or require militaristic enforcement. We're either a nation of laws, or we're not.
And if you don't think we should be, then BE HONEST AND UPFRONT ABOUT THAT. If you don't think we should be a nation AT ALL, then BE HONEST AND UPFRONT ABOUT THAT.
Because every time you try to hide these brazenly anti-American positions under a cheap veneer of empathy or pragmatism (neither of which you ACTUALLY believe, otherwise you'd be SPONSORING legal immigrants at your own expense instead of encouraging their criminal behavior) - A) YOU become the ones who want to exploit them; and B) EVERYONE ELSE sees right through you.
The answer to this is simple, and we just recently had a very awesome and effective roadmap made for it, which we can follow Israel's lead on as they purged Hamas from Israel's borders: If you are found to be in America illegally, you will be immediately deported. If you resist this process even slightly, force - all the way up to lethal - will be immediately justified. And I say that as the most anti-capital punishment/prison reform advocate you'll ever know. Rewards should be issued for identifying/locating all illegal aliens, and any American citizen who reports one leading to their arrest/deportation gets a tax credit to offset their total Federal burden all the way to $0.00.
Put the word out loud and clear, obviously some immediate examples will need to be made to prove that we're not screwing around, and then start the national dragnet.
We're far past the point of this being a drastic and crippling problem that isn't affecting each and every American. And while this response may seem overly harsh - it's ONLY that way because it now HAS to be that way. There ARE no other solutions, and that's the fault of those who let the problem get so bad in the first place. If you want to crow about harshness, take it up with the people who made it necessary - not with those who implement it.
The world is out for every would be criminal, grifter, welfare leech, and anchor-baby mama. They know what to do and what to say. They're tearing up their IDs before they even get here. They want to be nameless, faceless, and illegal - and there's only ONE reason for that. Which means it's time to slam the book closed on it all. Hard.
We’re either a nation of laws, or we’re not.
Germany in the late 1930s was a nation of laws. Everything that was done was done in accordance with laws and regulations from the government. Everything.
It doesn’t matter if it would tear apart families, affect American workers, or require militaristic enforcement.
They said the same thing.
Sarc with his genius idea’s again.
He’s now an ansarcist
More like: analcyst.
A mutetation.
So what? You did the EXACT THING that I said punks like you do (and Godwin'd it while you did).
Look, this is simple:
If you DON'T want to be a nation of laws, THEN SAY THAT.
If you DON'T think the United States of America should be a thing, THEN SAY THAT.
Stop pussyfooting around where you really stand. The criminal illegal population in America is a SERIOUS problem. If you want that problem to continue until the United States of America can no longer endure and then falls, THEN SAY THAT.
Or are you too much of a coward, and intellectual fraud, to do so - like Fiona clearly is.
Authoritarians blindly follow laws because they blindly follow authority.
People with a moral sense question unjust laws and see flouting them as a patriotic duty.
Dude, the open borders camp is completely tonedeaf and out of touch with the reality of the kinds of individuals that illegal immigration brings into this country. Those upgraders are one of last groups that need sympathetic political representation. Even the legal-ish ones know very well what theyre doing by instrumentalizing their children to become socioeconomic anchors. Making this shit legally easier isn’t gonna help anyone.
I see repealing them as a patriotic duty. Prohibitionist Amerika under republicans Gamaliel, Coolidge and Hoover was a zoo to outsiders. Young people fled to Europe the way we fled to Canada and South America when Nixon was bombing Cambodia using disposable conscripts. Their moronic prohibition laws weaponized with the income tax amendment and forfeiture powers wreck the economy time after time, yet they convince the gullible that "Business Cycles" are all part of God's Plan.
You still can't even manage to say it out loud, can you.
Can't sell it to anyone unless you obfuscate what you're peddling.
Again...
How is exporting trespassers on land they have no permission to be on ‘unjust’?
Note to German readers: Also sprach Sonderabteilung Gruppenführer Adores Trump.
Guess that makes Biden Hitler.
Now THERE'S a winning ticket!
He is the leader of the [Na]tional So[zi]alist party.
I just read the German News. The aliens they import are in large part islamic jihadi slashers like the ones stalking London and Paris--NOT docile South Americans whose economies are scorched and gutted into Hoovervilles by violent DEA agents. A video on Xitter of a bunch of rowdies chanting Nazi deportation memes at a bar on a resort island is making National News! Bear in mind that defeated Germany was pressured and blackmailed by the League of Nations and U.S. prohibition fanatics in July 1931. After THAT, they elected Hitler and we elected beer-legalizing FDR.
So because 1930 Germany had laws, we can't because that makes us Nazis. Are you a moron?
Fiona promotes open borders because her sugar daddy Charles Koch wants to flood the country with cheap labor to depress wages, making the working class poorer and billionaires richer. It's cynical, sure, but it's not exactly stupid. As poll after poll shows most Americans aren't thrilled with this economy, Bidenomics is working out great for billionaires. Koch, for instance, is up over $4 billion in year 4 of Loose Borders Biden's reign, inflating his inherited fortune to (I swear I'm not making this up) $66.6 billion.
Consistent with his gimme cheap labor! mantra, another item on Mr. Koch's wishlist is a minimum wage of $0.00 / hour. Fiona decided not to mention that this time. Maybe her next column will clarify whether that's another policy only a depraved "anti-American" monster could oppose?
I wonder how Ken is doing in Ukraine.
A serious note: If Trump's plan focuses on illegals who have failed to become productive citizens, it would be much more palatable and useful
A flippant note: Should Trump's plan comes to pass, the only ones to blame are every fucking asshat who believes in and allows open fucking borders.
right, if you're paying taxes that's great, if you're here to free load, back to wherever you came from
75% vote to "free load" once their voting-rights begin.
Pretty sure that explains the very root-problem of current immigration as well as the level of the problem.
Or put into a phrase, "You can't import Non-American and keep American."
The Reason commentariat is a sickening example of xenophobia run amok. The truth is that many immigrants do as well if not better and than those wishing harm and deportation upon them. Immigrants are more likely to be in the workforce than native Americans [1], and do not hurt native born Americans economic prospects [2].
[1] https://usafacts.org/articles/how-many-immigrants-are-in-the-american-workforce/
[2} https://www.epi.org/blog/immigrants-are-not-hurting-u-s-born-workers-six-facts-to-set-the-record-straight/
Why Reason magazine doesn't moderate this cesspool is beyond me. About a dozen members need to be banned. It's honestly one of the worst communities on the internet.
Don't let the door hit you on the way out.
Winning through censorship!
“The Reason commentariat is a sickening example of xenophobia run amok.”
lol, sure it is.
It used to be hip deep in flung coward ordure. Now subscribers have the Mute Lewser button. A Brazilian cartoonist, Adão, draws a fish that screeches insults at fish in the other tanks, but is silent when put in with them. He calls it the "Internet Commenter Fish".
Q.E.D.
Why Reason magazine doesn’t moderate this cesspool is beyond me.
SILENCE THE DISSIDENTS! THEY MUST NOT BE ALLOWED TO SPEAK HERESY TO OUR NEW RELIGION!
Yea, you'll fit in great here, Ben.
You know what I see on my drive home from work? I see little taco stands that are popping up, like we're on the streets of the really bad parts of TJ. Y'know, just open air stalls of questionable meat cooked over filthy grills then covered with sauces spooned from dirty plastic jugs, being sold on the cheap (to people suffering under Democrat Inflation) because hey, they don't have any overhead - by people who don't understand a lick of English. I'm not talking food trucks with a health department sticker here, I'm talking about little tents that pop up on sidewalks or gravel beds between the hours of 7p-12a and then disappear.
These are obviously illegal aliens. If that's the grand vision you have for America, then say so. If it's not, then shut up.
This Adores Trump creep, f'rinstance, is an embarrassment Trumpanzees, unable to find menial work for him, doubtless assigned the wretch to fling ordure at Reason subscribers. This is a backfiring strategy of the first water. But all communo-fascist brainwashees are hecklers, as reported by Orwell describing British Union of Fascists rallies. What else can they do? They, like door-kicking minions, are understandably ashamed of their own identities.
You keep trying to stick Orangina to me, despite the fact that it's well known that not only am I a vocal critic of him, that I'd rather see the nation fall to ruin than support the ruin he (or the Democrats) promise us.
The reason you do that is because you're not intelligent enough to actually come at me on the merits of ANY subject we're discussing. You're probably publicly school educated, incapable of rational thought, and high on the notion that you're a special unique snowflake (and also high on drugs).
Shut your mouth, useful idiot. Your role is not in this place.
and do not hurt native born Americans economic prospects [2].
Complete BS.
1) More Immigrants than not are on Welfare [51%] far above the natives [30%] - are you going to pretend that doesn't hurt native born Americans economy somehow? That magical Welfare Tree of free-money in the sky or what?
https://cis.org/Report/Welfare-Use-Immigrant-and-Native-Households
Never-mind your study is cherry-picking a single month for the more likely to be in the workforce than native .. the mass of data there is they're both about the same for "16 years and older that is working or actively looking for work". Never-mind who just doesn't want to work at all; they're not part of the 'participation' rate.
After the COVID-19 low, the labor force participation rate of foreign-born workers rose faster than that of their native-born colleagues. In September 2023, the foreign-born labor force participation rate was 67.1%, and the native-born rate was 61.8%.
CIS's studies use flawed methodology: https://www.cato.org/blog/center-immigration-studies-overstates-immigrant-non-citizen-native-welfare-use
LOL... That's cute.
"The DHS and NAS both agree with Cato scholars that the individual is the proper unit of analysis in a welfare cost analysis by nativity. CIS is on the other side of that issue. I am not making an appeal to authority, but CIS should have to make a better case for why it persists in using the household level of analysis."
Heaven-forbid the 'babies' of immigrants be considered immigrant welfare. Your link is a joke.
If it is a joke, you have not demonstrated why. For example, why does Texas use the same individual count approach?
WHY demonstrated ... Households are collective 'living' support cubicles. If a household is on welfare all individuals within that welfare-supported house are getting at least some of that welfare.
UR turn. Demonstrate a study showing how such a disparity (63% immigrant versus 35% native / almost 2-Times) can be dismissed by Households on welfare and individuals in that household somehow avoid any responsibility for that welfare.
Frankly; You objection is just as laughable as your article. Grasping at any straw in sight.
The disparity isn’t meaningful because CIS doesn’t show the relative value of the welfare use between immigrant and non-immigrant households.
Like I said; Demonstrate a study that shows individuals in a household are somehow void of any responsibility for that welfare.
If you're going to grasp as straws so UN-believable it'll take more than just you, DHS or NAS just saying it.
I don't measure every-single tread on a tire either before evaluating it's "relative value" and for anyone to say it's a flawed evaluation because I didn't measure every single tread is obviously working an deceptive angle more than anything unless they want to measure every single tread and re-adjust that "relative value".
There’s no need to demonstrate anything about the individuals’ responsibility in a household if you can’t show that the household is getting a higher value of benefits. The analogy isn’t counting treads on a tire, it’s which tire costs more.
"which tire costs more" - pretty sure that was settled at the very beginning.
More Immigrants than not are on Welfare [51%] far above the natives [30%].
Not if you don’t know how much is spent per household.
Just moot the lewsers. Cretins flock to any cheap platform. The NY public video portal to Ireland just got shut down because of sockhecklers and ani mooning the cameras and such. At least Reason lets us shut them off. And once everyone has shut them down they'll at worst be a tiny echo chamber eating up bandwidth. I read comments by actual libertarians, plus a few basket case exemplars as entertainment.
“….plus a few basket case exemplars as entertainment.”
Lol. How meta.
Unfortunately, so is the welfare system incentivizing the 'invasion'. Let's get rid of that, first.
^YES. If nothing else good comes from this - that would be enough.
As a libertarian I support open borders, when everyone else is a libertarian.
I support illegal immigrants.
We all do. That's part of the problem.
'armed-theft' to support 'illegal' activity practically writes the DNC platform doesn't it? Gangland politics 101.
Btw the last time we had mass deportations it was at the behest of an American hero by the name of Dwight D. Eisenhower and was run by another American hero Joseph Swing ( led the 11th airborne during the retaking of the Philippines).
So Fiona would you call these men unAmerican?
Of course—they're MEN.
Completely specious argument. You could say that about all law enforcement and imprisonment. Why send murders to prison? That breaks up their families too. And what is magical about five years? If someone steals your car and manages to hide it for five years, should they get to keep it? These people are criminals - plain and simple - and should be treated as such.
>Donald Trump’s promise to carry out “the largest domestic deportation operation” in U.S. history would tear apart families, harm American workers, and require militaristic enforcement.
What is it we're told every time the Left wants to do something 'un-American'?
Oh yes - 'The constitution is not a suicide pact.'
Sauce for the goose.
At the top or the article search for “would”
This speculative surmise marker appears 22 times in the article, which is itself a fog of hopeful speculation. Why not look at the how the idea worked in the Third Reich? Hitler’s platform points 4-8 of 25 deal with deportation. In practice, Jews with assets were charged an “exit tax” whereby they could leave the Reich with the shirt on their backs and little else. Results? After the May 1945 surrender, Sudeten Czechs rounded up and executed all German collaborators. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6IFfQdM7EI
there is a simple relatively cheap way. cut off the supply of work. Get a work visa program in place for critical activities that Americans aren't willing to do at the prices of immigrants for things like construction and agriculture. For everything else require e-verify. If you're not pulling your weight via paying in taxes and SS (for American coffers) then back you go, and anyone hiring illegal migrants goes straight to jail. that includes executives and higher ups in companies that are clearly giving the orders to hire illegal immigrants. Anyone found without a work visa also goes straight back to their country.
At least some of those jobs, it’s not that some American WONT do the job at that price, it’s that the government says they’re not allowed to (and the company isn’t allowed to pay them that rate.)
trump is unAmerican period
everything he stands for
so his border BS is the least of it
First, if your presence here is unauthorized and you have no legal right to be here, then your children are not American citizens. Second, living peaceably after you forced your way into this country is an odd thought. You are literally breaking laws every single day - with fake documents, working , etc.
Third, these people coming illegally toss their identification so we don't know who they are - murders, terrorists, economic tourists?
Finally, the costs of not returning these invaders to their home countries will cost much more than the outrageously wild estimates of what deportation would cost.
These people had their fun, now it is time for them to go home.
“if your presence here is unauthorized and you have no legal right to be here, then your children are not American citizens.”
Not if they were born here. Here is what the 14th amendment has to say: “All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.”
" jurisdiction thereof...." That's the important part. As non citizens of noncitizens they are not subject to the jurisdiction. They can be held to account for violating our laws, but then they are sent home.
Our legal system has a premise that you cannot be enriched by the results of your crime. As the offspring of invaders, once they are born they are also invaders.
14th does not apply to the children of illegal aliens.
If they are not subject to U.S. jurisdiction, how do we apply U.S. law to them?
We send them home. "Subject to US Jurisdiction does not simply mean "follow the laws". It also includes not being a citizen of another country.
In the Slaughter House Cases, Justice Miller wrote for the Court that "[t]he phrase, 'subject to its jurisdiction' was intended to exclude from [the clause's] operation children of ministers, consuls, and citizens or subjects of foreign States born within the United States."
Sure, but if they are not subject to our laws, how do we have the power — under our laws — to remove them?
Evidently, the author believes that enforcing the law is anti-American.
Libertarian = Anarchist