Brickbat: Papers, Please

Erie County, New York District Attorney John J. Flynn has charged Amber and Michael Naab with second-degree felony charge of criminal possession of a forged instrument. Naab said the two used fake COVID-19 vaccine cards to get into the Jan. 15 Buffalo Bills game at Highmark Stadium. Flynn said the Naabs were on the Buffalo Bills radar because the two had boasted on social media about using the fake vaccine cards to get into previous games. The Naabs were questioned by deputies from the Eric County Sheriff's Office during the game and arrested a week later. The Naabs face up to seven years in prison if convicted, but Flynn's office said he does not anticipate they will serve time.

Comments

[Fist of Etiquette]

The health of everyone at the game was so in danger did authorities not only let them in but waiting until the third quarter to confront them.

[Adans smith]

Just like never talk to the cops, you should never run your mouth on 'social ' media. That goes double if your part of the great unwash.., uh , un vaccinated

[GroundTruth]

That goes double if you didn't already know it by the time you hit middle school.

[Mockamodo]

They may not serve time, but a conviction will be a felony conviction which means they lose their right to bear arms, essentially for not being vaccinated.

[m4019597]

It’s a brand new law that’s yet to be challenged.

They’d be fools to consider a plea bargain without reducing the charge to disorderly conduct, a low misdemeanor in that state.

There’s an excellent chance that taking it to court will get it tossed on the merits, if not the obvious flaw in the law over requiring “accurate” medical information to be furnished to non-medical door greeters.

The merits is that there’s no proof they actually used their fake cards at the game, despite boasting about it, and the state has no blood evidence to prove they’re unvaccinated.

[Jerryskids]

First, it's New York so US law does not apply, and secondly it's CNN reporting this so these people may not even exist.

[Its_Not_Inevitable]

"so these people may not even exist." Did Mitch Album contribute?

[m4019597]

I’m aware. They’re charged in NY under the new NY Covid Card authenticity law.

https://www.nysenate.gov/legislation/bills/2021/s4516

[Kevin Smith]

It looks like it doesn't matter if they used the fake cards at the game, or if they are actually unvaccinated. Since they are charged with "possession of a forged instrument" as long as police found the forged cards when they arrested them, and they can check the records of wherever the cards say they were vaccinated to see if they match, I'd say the merits are stacked pretty heavily against the couple.

Pleading to a lower charge is pretty much their only option, but given that it is likely a slam dunk case, and the DA likely wants to make an example of someone, I think they are sunk on the felony charges

[Cyto]

I wonder what counts as a "forged instrument" under the law in NY.

These are not certified state documents. In my state they were simple, printed slips of paper that the assistant initialed after the shots. (Not even a nurse or attending.... Just the paperwork dude).

There was no verbiage about official document, forgery, etc. Just a grid for information and date and a set of initials.

[Ben of Houston]

That is probably their best, if not only defense, that this was not a state document. Since it lacks any sort of signature or seal, and is not issued by a state employee, that might work.

It seems a long shot, but if they prosecutor tries to throw the book at them, a sympathetic jury may decide that enough is enough. This is especially absurd when you consider that fake IDs are traditionally met with confiscation and lectures, not even arrest.

If they try to argue on the legal requirement to submit it, the state will counter that it is irrelevant, since a fake document is a fraud in and of itself.

[Kevin Smith]

"1. "Written instrument" means any instrument or article, including
computer data or a computer program, containing written or printed
matter or the equivalent thereof, used for the purpose of reciting,
embodying, conveying or recording information, or constituting a symbol or evidence of value, right, privilege or identification, which is
capable of being used to the advantage or disadvantage of some person."
...
"7. "Forged instrument" means a written instrument which has been
falsely made, completed or altered."
(New York Penal Law 170.00)

Seems like the vaccination card fits the definition

[Don't look at me!]

I would maintain the card is real, the records are faulty.

[m4019597]

The law. It’s distinct from the forgery statute.

https://www.nysenate.gov/legislation/bills/2021/s4516

[Kevin Smith]

That just amends the definition of "written instrument" I quoted to specifically include vaccination cards, which would seem unnecessary since the cards already fit the definition as-is

It adds "For the purposes of this article, a card provided to a person by a vaccine provider indicating the date a person received a vaccination against COVID-19, the type of vaccine and its lot number, and bearing a government logo or other indication that it is created by a governmental instrumentality, shall be considered a written instrument."

It also specifically makes it a crime to alter the digital records (which again would also already seem to be a crime under the existing statute) but that's not applicable in this case

[kevrob]

Signed in late Dec, 2021. If the couple created these earlier, would ex post facto apply?

[Agammamon]

That's the kicker - it's not a government document or a contract or title so it almost certainly doesn't count.

[Brandybuck]

> ... essentially for not being vaccinated.

Nope, the crime is called "forgery". Look it up. While one may disagree with the rules about having papers, one is not entitled to forge said papers.

[CE]

Everyone has a fundamental human right to create and carry any documents they wish. It is only the purpose to which they put those documents that determines whether they have committed a crime or not.

Or did German citizens not have the right to forge documents and present those documents to try to escape an oppressive Nazi regime? You may argue that checking vaccine status is not oppressive to the same degree, but the phony card holders are not trying to defraud anyone, and since everyone else at the game was vaccinated, they could also argue that they were not putting anyone in danger.

[GroundTruth]

Kewl!

Now do ID's.

[I, Woodchipper]

eliminate IDs as well. Government doesn't need to know who you are.

[I, Woodchipper]

the law is an ass.

[I, Woodchipper]

when the jews were using faked papers to get out of germany, technically they were not "entitled" to do so.

[Its_Not_Inevitable]

But they did have the inalienable right to do so.

[American Mongrel]

I disagree with felons losing their rights after incarceration. 2A is the only one that applies to, correct?

[kevrob]

Felon disenfranchisement across the 50 states is a patchwork of rules.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felony_disenfranchisement_in_the_United_States#Circumstantial

[Chumby]

Health theater industrial complex

[Utkonos]

And at Buffalo Bill games they’ve so rude about it at the gate. “PUT THE FUCKING PASSPORT IN THE BASKET!”

[Roberta]

It's easier to get a real card than make a forged one, so I'm guessing their cards were real and they were boasting that they were fake.

[Brandybuck]

Actually, it's quite simple. These are simple cardstock and laser printers are pretty damned good these days. If you're having troubles maybe talk to your IT about how to use a printer.

But I agree that just getting the vaccine is easier than going through the hassle of forging official documents.

[I, Woodchipper]

good god you people

[mad.casual]

But I agree that just getting the vaccine is easier than going through the hassle of forging official documents.

Incorrect. As someone who both administrates IT and legal injections in his own home, printing is easier.

[Agammamon]

A vaccine card is not an 'official document'.

[Unicorn Abattoir]

Committing a strongarm robbery and throwing a baby in front of a subway are fine, but don't you dare use a vax record that should be a private matter to get into a football game!!

[I, Woodchipper]

heroes...

[PaulTheBeav 2]

Don't confess to crimes on the internet.

[I, Woodchipper]

^ this

Second only to 'never talk to the police'

[Cyto]

Yeah. Good luck proving forgery beyond a reasonable doubt if they had not confessed online.

[Chumby]

Here, hold my chardonnay.

At least they didn’t make a joke about a woodchipper.

[Zombie Apocalypse]

"Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, the so-called "vaccines" do not prevent anyone from contracting Covid-19, they do not prevent anyone from spreading Covid-19, and in fact, at this point there is little evidence that there is any benefit to the vaccines. What little evidence there is, indicates that if there is any benefit at all, it is to those "vaccinated" people who contract Covid-19. That said, the purpose of the "vaccine mandates" and the subsequent requirement for "vaccine IDs" are completey null and void, since the stated purpose was to stop the spread of Covid-19, and neither accomplishes that goal. Since neither the "vaccines" nor the IDs serve any purpose except to limit the free movement of those who have refused to comply with pointless and patently unconstitutional mandates, my clients were compelled to create their own documents in order to exercise their Constitutional rights, and right what is an egregious affront to their inherent, inalienable right to movement and travel unimpeded by government-mandated health checkpoints. The defense rests"