Peter Bagge

The Overly Examined Life of Henry David Thoreau

Cartoonist Peter Bagge looks at Henry David Thoreau's life at Walden and beyond


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  1. Thoreau was a poseur and Bernie Sanders is his heir.

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    Last night, #antifa in Portland barricaded the front of the @ICEgov building. They then set it on fire while federal officers were inside. Antifa also obscured the security cameras before launching the arson attack. #PortlandRiots [video link]

    1. That will surely put an end to the border crisis.

    2. Antifa also obscured the security cameras before launching the arson attack.

      Ah, *that* explains the dearth of media coverage of this mostly-peaceful protest!

      1. They’ve been watching Wonderwoman 1984.

    3. Libertarians need to riot more.

      1. If libertarians ever acted as much as they complain, their ideas might actually gain traction.

      2. This comment is a hoot and a riot! Gozer the Gozarian is a DAMNED good libertarian!

        Also this:

        Gozer the Traveller! He will come in one of the pre-chosen forms. During the rectification of the Vuldronaii, the Traveller came as a large and moving Torb! Then, during the third reconciliation of the last of the Meketrex Supplicants they chose a new form for him–that of a Giant Sloar! Many Shubs and Zulls knew what it was to be roasted in the depths of the Sloar that day, I can tell you.

        1. Spaz flag 1!

    4. Arson and attempted murder and wilfull endangerment of human life are serious charges. We keep hearing there is a small number of violent radicals and the rest are mostly peaceful protesters. Why aren’t the small number of violent radicals behind bars, facing multi-decade sentences in federal prison?

      1. Almost like an insurrection.

    5. I didn’t see a single Antifa ID badge in the video. How do we know that Antifa had anything to do with this?

      1. Lol. Youre back to this shit? Aren’t you embarrassed by it yet? Where were the maga badges at the Capitol? Have you taken even a few minutes to research reporters on the ground who know the blm people? Ngo has cross indexed this shit many times. But you persist. God damn man. Youre just pathetic at this point. Lol.

        1. Oh shit. Good one. You got me. Parody is too on point.

        2. Poe’s Law alert, Jesse.

          1. Read this if you dare, JesseBahnFuhrer and MammaBahnFuhrer!

            Trump’s Big Lie and Hitler’s: Is this how America’s slide into totalitarianism begins?

            Oh but I know… Anything that disagrees with the JesseBahnFuhrer and MammaBahnFuhrer echo chamber is “Marxist”, right? No matter HOW factual it might be!

            1. You’re more fascist than Marxist, Sqrlsy.

              Also, quoting Salon is like quoting Der Sturmer, IMHO.

            2. Spaz flag 2!

            3. How stupid do you have to be to think that we didn’t already have authoritarianism or that Biden isn’t 10x more authoritarian than Trump?

              Apparently you have to be as stupid as the squirrel.

              1. Trump used tariffs. That’s as authoritarian as you can get.

                1. Lol, I love your spoofs of WK.

              2. Speaking of stupid, deluded fools… Y’all are still sending your money to the Rip-Off Artist In Chief, right?

                ‘A complete rip-off’: Campaign-finance experts puzzled and stunned by Trump camp’s reported ‘money-bomb’ ploy

                1. Wow – good one sqrlsy. That’s the first time your boot licking ass has produced anything of merit on this site. First time ever. The only reason I read it is because I didn’t catch your username – because if I see sqrlsy, I just keep on to the next one. But now that you’re posting decent citations I’d have to say nothing’s gonna change whatsoever, thanks to your previous record.

                  Keep up the good work. Love your website!

                  1. Thank you kind Granite!

                    New subpage you may or may not have read, it refers to some interesting psychology (or more so I think, sociobiology).


                2. Seeing as how I voted for Jo, no I’m not sending Trump any money.

                  This may come as a shock to you and White Knight, but you can think that Trump was objectively less authoritarian than Biden and still not be a Trump supporter.

        3. You are responding to Tulpa.

      2. Unless you bring notarized copies, in triplicate, of your official Antifa membership certificate to the riot peaceful protest, you’re not actually Antifa.

      3. As I have said MANY times before, I have never expressed any support for BLM or antifa. I had a disdain for antifa long before any of the Portland rioting, ever since some antifa goons in Berkeley beat up my friend’s son.

        All I have even pointed out before is that BLM, the official organization, has never organized riots, as many commenters here sloppily claim they have. N.B. that is in no way equivalent to my pointing out that antifa has not been involved in organizing riots; antifa has a long record of organizing riots. But antifa is also a decentralized organization, so they don’t have “ID badges”.

        I condemn rioting, whether it is left-wing antifa goons or right-wing MAGA goons. Or unaffiliated, independent rioters who happen to be wearing BLM t-shirts.

        1. So what? This isn’t the real you anyway.

          1. Can you see the real me me me me

        2. Oh come now, you understand the drill. There is no arguing with these right-wing morons about BLM or Antifa. BLM means “Marxists undermining America and wanting to impose Communism by cynically exploiting racial injustice”. Antifa means “organized terrorist organization that hates America”. No amount of evidence will change anyone’s minds.

          1. Yeah, I know. Arguing with CACLLs is like Sisyphus rolling the wheel up the hill over and over again.

            1. Yup. “If you support BLM you support Marxism!” End of story. Of course this very convenient narrative means that they have a motte-and-bailey argument for opposing BLM’s proposals for criminal justice reform or correcting racial injustice – they don’t have to argue against them on their merits, they can just scream MARXISM MARXISM and the right-wing news bubble junkies will fall in line and just oppose it for no other reason than that.

              1. Do you have notarized facts to back this up?

                1. You guys just like to make jokes to make up for the fact that Jeff and I are smarter and more principled than everyone else here.

                  1. I don’t know about that, but you do provide a lot of laughs.
                    Probably unintentionally.

                    1. You just replied to Tulpa.

                    2. Wrong again fuck-o.

                  2. You guys just like to make jokes to make up for the fact that Jeff and I are smarter and more principled than everyone else here.

                    OK, now that made me chuckle.

              2. We do. The only racial injustice in the world is that committed by BLM’s side.

            2. The White Knight
              October.22.2020 at 3:18 pm

              It means conservative and conservative-leaning libertarian, and I coined it.
              Is there a law in Canada that ordinary people aren’t allowed to coin acronyms. Here in the godamn USA we have freedom of speech.

              1. You’re Canadian.

                1. A proud Canadian. I’m not an oikophobe who thinks my nations culture and proles are trash, like you.
                  I’m also very fond of the US and truly want the best for it and its ordinary people. It’s the home of most of my immediate family after all.

        3. “All I have even pointed out before is that BLM, the official organization, has never organized riots”

          You are an ignorant tool. Clearly, you have not been watching Chicago or any other blue city. See, Grant Park. BLM is fully responsible. They provide cover for the arsonists, the looters, and the people that are beating and killing innocent people. If BLM were law-abiding and deserving of respect, they would stop the looters and arsonists and continue their “peaceful protesting” . They don’t. They cheer them on, they prevent the police from taking action, every single time.
          Have you noticed that BLM doesn’t march in their own ghettos, where people are being slaughtered daily?
          Here is a photo record of the deaths in Chicago last year, 80% are black on black. When will BLM start protesting the 800 dead, 400 shootings that took place in Chicago? They won’t. There is no money in solving the real issues.

          1. No no, we get it.

            If some people go to a BLM protest, but some people in the protest engage in a violent riot, then all who were there were guilty in some measure, either by rioting themselves or by providing cover for the riots; furthermore, the protest organizers deliberately intended for this to occur, and should be held accountable for all of the people that showed up.

            By contrast, if some people go to a Jan. 6 rally at the US Capitol, but some people in the protest engage in acts of violence, then those few individuals should be condemned of course but the vast majority of protesters there had nothing to do with the riots and shouldn’t be condemned and moreover the organizers of the protest had absolutely nothing to do with anything that happened that day.

            1. As I have stated before. BLM showed up in my town. They collected a pack of over-entitled, bored, clueless college kids and started to march downtown. The police warned them to behave once, and only once. They were peacefully protesting and were being ignored. Nobody cares about their false narrative. Then, BLM decided that they should take action to get attention, much like any spoiled child does. They lit a paper fire in the street. The Mayor ordered the police to gas them immediately. It was wonderful, people were cheering the police and enjoying the show. Then, a group of local veterans, heavily armed and wearing full kit showed up in support of the police. They told the BLM animals that they were not welcome in our town.
              We have had zero damage to tax payers businesses. We have had zero fires, zero graffiti, and zero nonsense. 2020 was quiet for us. People in our town will not allow the BLM animals to act out. We will fight for our homes, for our businesses, and for our town.
              My home has nearly doubled in value. Everyone’s homes have nearly doubled in value. Security, safety, and strong leadership comes with a premium. They cannot build homes fast enough for all the people that are moving here. We are living the American dream. We are safe, people are law abiding, and fully support our local law enforcement.
              There are 100,000 veterans in my town. Many of us fought for this country and we will not be threatened by BLM animals or their ANITFA friends. None of us wish to see war again but if it is pressed upon us, we will slaughter those BLM and ANTIFA shits with pleasure. We won’t need to. Our law enforcement will handle the problem for us, as it should be.
              Now, ask anyone living in those Blue cities if they love their town, support their local leadership, and support law enforcement. They don’t. That is why their towns are regularly looted and burned by scumbags. That is why their police don’t police and their leaders don’t lead. Their taxpayers just get hit with the bill.
              I worked my way out of the ghetto. I won’t allow the ghetto to come to me.
              BTW, one of the leaders of BLM just purchased a 1.4 million dollar home. Like Obama, she bought that home as far away from the black community as she could afford. Why is that? Why don’t they live among the people that they so “fervently” support? Because they don’t really support them. They only act like they support the cause to collect money from suckers.

              1. Right. So you judge them by who they are, not by what they did.

                The Jan. 6 protesters were good people so their actions should be viewed sympathetically.

                The BLM protesters were terrible people so their actions should be viewed skeptically.

                1. “Right. So you judge them by who they are, not by what they did.”

                  Credit to Ken: He was the first to point out that ignorant lefty shits like Jeff are certainly ignorant, but that’s not the real issue.
                  They (turd, Tony, LoS, and others are simply not equipped mentally to understand that they are not addressing the issue at hand.
                  Simply put, they are too fucking stooopid to engage in any real discussion.
                  Fuck off and die, jeff; the world will thank you.

                2. There is no comparison. I support neither. You are an assclown if you think they are equal in any measure. We can start by comparing costs, or number of innocent people killed, raped, or assaulted. We can compare the number of buildings burned, or businesses looted, or number of people affected. We can measure the increased violent crime in the blue run cities that allowed the denizens of the ghettos to run wild. We can measure the income and trade lost when BLM blocks roads. We can measure the costs associated with the police and fire department overtime needed to combat the outrageous crime and arson attacks. We can also measure the lost tax revenue caused by businesses being looted, boarded up, and closed due to BLM.
                  Shall I continue, Assclown?

                  1. You don’t respect Jeff for the genius he is. You should apologize for using such offensive language against my best friend. If you can’t understand why scaring AOC is worse than burning down some randos business I don’t know what else to tell you.

      4. The same way we know q-anon was behind the insurrection on January 6th.

    6. But were the officers conducting a vote? That is the key to insurrection.

    7. Now, more than ever, the media and BLM should be denouncing violence with respect to any verdict in the ongoing trial in Minneapolis. Why have I heard none of this from BLM or the media? Whether the BLM organization deserves to be associated with violence ( I believe they do) or if they have been hijacked by non-card carrying BLM protestors who want to besmirch their name, both the media and BLM should be finding it in their best interest to promote a peaceful response to any verdict. Right?. Right? Now is the time to plan to stop any violence. Right? You would think some politicians would support this. Right?

  3. The only real problem with Thoreau’s philosophy is that, like all philosophies, while often interesting to study, they should never be actually “lived.”

    1. It is idealism vs realism. Idealists generally stick to ideal states so they can’t ever be wrong.

      1. Certainly true. But also, there is a huge difference between taking elements of a philosophy, as “getting close to nature” and actually building one’s entire life around such a philosophy. I lived for years “close to nature.” I lived in a very rural area. I raised goats and chickens, cut firewood, etc. The difference is that my “cabin” was a three-story octagonal house with every modern amenity I could squeeze into it.

        Have a great day, JESSEAZ.

        1. You had a bidet? A Slurpee machine?

          1. Not in the same room, I hope. That would be nasty!

    2. When people forsake modern society to live in self-sufficient isolation, that usually lasts until the first time they get a toothache.

      1. Well, self-reliance can be a matter of degree. Using modern professional medical care for regular maintenance and emergencies is leaps and bounds better than being tethered to the system for life, especially an increasingly Socialized one. Even in that latter situation, if you earned your insurance and co-pays, that is self-reliant too. Meanwhile, keeping yourself healthy is always the best of all possible worlds.

    3. Everyone lives by SOME philosophy.

      1. Of course. Usually, it’s their own philosophy, and not a borrowed one, though it may contain many borrowed ideas. And, often, such philosophy may change over time.

        1. You don’t say?

          People have their own philosophies that change over time?

          That’s some revolutionary shit right there.

  4. It wasn’t just that his aunt paid his poll tax for him. I remember reading his description of the other men in the jail going out to do their forced labor every day–something he wasn’t required to do AIR. He may have willingly gone to prison, but if his sacrifice didn’t require him to break a sweat to cover his expenses, like the others had to do, he was playing at being imprisoned. A more modern description of what Throreau did might be “adventure tourism” or “slumming it”.

    “To visit impoverished areas or squalid locales, especially out of curiosity or for amusement.”

    —-“Slumming It”

    1. Or, perhaps it was his version of “glamping.” /sarc

    2. The most common example of slumming it is otherwise known as “blackfishing” or “Rachel Dolezalling”.

      1. Don’t forget the real Talcum X.

      2. “Rachel Dolezalling” should be updated to Kamala Harrising.

    3. Aspiring to ideals and coming up short isn’t necessarily a terrible thing, especially when it comes to civil disobedience. The problem with coming up short on your ideals has been a problem since long before Thoreau.

      The apocryphal Book of Judas, discovered and translated into English in recent decades, appears to have been something like a fan-fiction reaction to the early Christian leaders insisting that lay people not renounce Christianity when dragged in front of the local Roman magistrate and threatened with death for their faith. In the apocryphal book, Judas betrays Jesus at Jesus’ own insistence, ending with “What you’re about to do, do quickly” (John 13:27)–with their point being that Jesus asked Judas to “betray” him so that Jesus could die for his faith–so that we don’t have to. The early bishops were, apparently, excommunicating people for renouncing their faith, and the excommunicated were pissed off about it.

      The interesting thing is that in the rare instances when some idealistic young girl refused to renounce her faith and was thrown to the lions for the amusement of an audience, “turning the other cheek” had precisely the intended effect. Slaughtering innocents for spectacle made the emperor seem decadent, insane, and unjust, and it helped make Romans more sympathetic to Christianity.

      In other words, you don’t need everyone to engage in perfect civil disobedience in order to be effective. Because everyone who holds an ideal doesn’t live up to it, doesn’t mean the ideal isn’t powerful, isn’t true, or isn’t effective. Stalin was right, in a sense, when he said, “If only one man dies of hunger, that is a tragedy. If millions die, that’s only statistics”. I don’t know how many people were falsely imprisoned or murdered by the South African government, but apartheid might not have ended the way it did without the murder of Steve Biko and the imprisonment of Nelson Mandela.

      Because the government in New England was insufficiently oppressive against wealthy white men in Thoreau’s day to really make him choose between liberty and death isn’t really a knock on Thoreau or his ideals about civil disobedience. Thoreau’s ideals were more or less the same as Steve Biko’s ideals–and Biko dying for them doesn’t make the ideals of civil disobedience any better than they were when Thoreau was jailed. Rather, Biko dying for them makes the government of apartheid South Africa look worse.

      Thoreau could openly oppose the government and still live a relatively comfortable life, even in jail, and he could get out of jail by paying a fine that his aunt could send him without missing any meals because of it. If Thoreau couldn’t really attract oppression the way Biko did, then we’re talking about the relative oppressiveness of Thoreau’s government towards a wealthy white man vs. the oppressiveness of Biko’s apartheid government towards him. That civil disobedience is less effective against less oppressive governments doesn’t undermine the ideal at all. It isn’t the ideal that’s ridiculous. It’s Thoreau and the suburban, white anti-fa rioters of Portland that are ridiculous.

    4. I wonder if this is the passage you recall:

      “In the morning, our breakfasts were put through the hole in the door, in small oblong-square tin pans, made to fit, and holding a pint of chocolate, with brown bread, and an iron spoon. When they called for the vessels again, I was green enough to return what bread I had left; but my comrade seized it, and said that I should lay that up for lunch or dinner. Soon after he was let out to work at haying in a neighboring field, whither he went every day, and would not be back till noon; so he bade me good-day, saying that he doubted if he should see me again.”

      Since Thoreau was only in for one night and was still “green”, are you sure he would even have an idea whether he was required to labor? This passage describes another man doing labor, but doesn’t say the man was required to do so as part of his punishment.

      1. What is your point?

        1. That you may be recalling incorrectly when you say that the other men were required to do labor but Thoreau wasn’t.

          1. To the immediate question, even AFTER the 13th Amendment (which was post-the Mexican-American War), prison labor was explicitly constitutional.

            Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.”

            —-13th Amendment

            The idea that prisoners in the 1840s would be given free food and board because they committed a crime probably would have been absurd to voters of the era–an idle mind being the devil’s workshop and all. I don’t see any good reason why we should imagine that prisoners of the era wouldn’t be required to earn their keep.

            The question remains. If you aren’t denying that the other inmates did farm work that Thoreau, by his own admission, apparently, didn’t do, what point are you trying to make? If Thoreau did or didn’t do farm work or other inmates were or weren’t required to earn their keep, what point are you trying to draw from that?

            1. “I don’t see any good reason why we should imagine that prisoners of the era wouldn’t be required to earn their keep.”

              If your assumption is correct, then Thoreau would be required to labor, too. No? (That is, if he had been there more than one night.)

              “…that Thoreau, by his own admission, apparently, didn’t do…”

              He was in the jail for one night.

              Boy, you love to hold forth, but you really get bristly if the things you say are questioned.

            2. “If Thoreau did or didn’t do farm work or other inmates were or weren’t required to earn their keep, what point are you trying to draw from that?”

              That you sometimes make claims that are not true or that you cannot back up with any facts.

              1. That you quoted a passage saying that Thoreau didn’t do any work while his fellow inmate did–to disprove my assertion that Thoreau’s “sacrifice” didn’t include doing manual labor like his fellow inmates–that doesn’t suggest anything more than that you’re a retarded troll.

                1. I don’t think it’s funny to call me a retard. People that have really low IQ’s are suffering and should not be used as a tool for mockery.

                  1. Fuck you.

                    1. Lol

                    2. LOL, you just told Tulpa, “Fuck you.”

                    3. Hmm, Mother’s must be my sock puppet. We posted within minutes of each other and both said, “LOL”.

                    4. Reset sarc meter, Ken.

                  2. True. If you have ever known a family rearing a Down’s Syndrome child (or adult) and the difficulties they go through, you wouldn’t make fun of “retards”.

                    1. You shouldn’t call people with Down’s syndrome retards.

                    2. I didn’t technically call people with Down’s Syndrome retards.

                    3. Yes, given that you’re a imbecilic steaming pile of lefty shit, you’re surprised that it was close enough to your TDS-addled bullshit that it was easily mistaken.
                      Says far more about you than anyone else.

                2. Now, you are being disingenuous because you don’t want to lose the debate. My comment clearly addressed why the passage I quoted from “Civil Disobediance” does not support any of your claims, which you admit were only “AIR” (“as I recall”):


                  I found the passage that most likely gave you the impression that others were required to work while Thoreau, and clearly explained why it does not support your conclusions.

                  1. Ken really doesn’t like to lose an argument or admit when he’s wrong. Next up, he calls you stupid and ignores you while he continues on with his pretentious bloviating.

                    1. Bingo! He already called me a “retarded troll”.

                    2. With good reason.

                    3. Ken knows a retarded troll when he sees one.

                    4. “Ken knows a retarded troll when he sees one.”

                      They’re not hard to spot!

                      She quoted a passage where Thoreau admits to not doing manual labor like the other inmate–as evidence that I was wrong to say that Thoreau didn’t do manual labor like the other inmates?!

                      That’s just plain stupid.

                      And then she starts lecturing me on hurting people’s feelings? We’re being lectured on rude behavior by someone who effectively claimed that trespassing on public property justifies shooting an unarmed protester.


                      Assuming she’s developmentally disabled is probably giving her the benefit of the doubt–on that last point. The next most likely explanation is moral depravity.

                      P.S. I’ve been wrong on the facts and the logic, and I’ll be wrong again. The chances of White Knight or ChemJeff catching it are practically zero. I actually thought she might have something of interest to say for a moment there. Jesus Christ, she is so dumb.

                    5. “I was wrong to say that Thoreau didn’t do manual labor like the other inmates”

                      Not what you claimed. You claimed he wasn’t required to.

                    6. “We’re being lectured on rude behavior by someone who effectively claimed that trespassing on public property justifies shooting an unarmed protester.”

                      I have never argued that mere trespassing warranted the shooting of Ashli Babbitt. I have argued that her being at the head of a violent mob with apparent murderous intent did justify the shooting.

                      So now that I have clarified, trust you will not misstate my argument in the future.

                    7. And it’s clear to me they had murderous intent because they were armed to the teeth with fire extinguishers, zip ties, pepper spray, and flag poles.

                    8. You’re right, Tulpa. The police should have stopped and handed out a survey to all of the rioters who broke their way into the Capitol building. “I am breaking down the door to the Speaker’s Lobby because:
                      a) I want to take a selfie.
                      b) I am looking for a restroom.
                      c) I want to kill me some commie Congresspersons and hang that cowardly traitor, Mike Pence.
                      d) I want to steal some souvenirs.”

                    9. “Ken really doesn’t like to lose an argument or admit when he’s wrong. Next up, he calls you stupid and ignores you while he continues on with his pretentious bloviating.”

                      Jeff has yet to show he knows when he’s called on his constant bullshit, which I guess amounts to ‘winning’
                      Fuck off and die, lefty shit.

                    10. The White Knight III: Army of Canuckness
                      April.11.2021 at 8:08 pm
                      “You’re right, Tulpa. The police should have stopped and handed out a survey to all of the rioters who broke their way into the Capitol building. “I am breaking down the door to the Speaker’s Lobby because:
                      a) I want to take a selfie.
                      b) I am looking for a restroom.
                      c) I want to kill me some commie Congresspersons and hang that cowardly traitor, Mike Pence.
                      d) I want to steal some souvenirs.”

                      This from the TDS-addled lefty asshole who demanded ID that the Antifa assholes hand over badges.
                      Are you proud to prove how fucking stupid you are? Did your mommy say you were smart, even after it took three years to get through the 6th grade?
                      Fuck off and die, steaming lefty pile of shit.

  5. So many Sherlock Holmeses here, using clues like time stamps to “prove” who is the sock puppet of who, but not one Sherlock Holmes figured out this connection:

    “The Oregon Trail” turns 50 this year.

    In the fall of 1971, the computer game was created for student teacher Don Rawitsch’s 8th-grade history classes at Bryant Junior High in Minneapolis.

    In the fall of 1971, Prince was an 8th-grader at Bryant Junior High in Minneapolis.

    1. Prince was a fair to middlin’ guitar player.

      1. I’m not qualified to debate this one. I wasn’t aware until fairly recently that some people rate Prince a guitar god.

        1. “I’m not qualified to debate this one. I wasn’t aware until fairly recently that some people rate Prince a guitar god.”

          Your mom probably thinks you are ‘smart’, too; she lied.

      2. Prince handles the Clapton parts in Gently Weeps more than fair to middlin’.

        1. Is that it? He covered Clapton’s lead from a dumb Beatles song? Clapton is top ten most boring guitarists of all time. Although the end of Layla is actually decent.

          I was suckered into watching that prince gently pissing himself when he died, and I was politely somber. Now I’m not impressed in the least, and frankly would rather see Steve Winwood play it on his keyboard instead.

          Prince was just as good at guitar as he was at popping pills.

          1. What about Jerry Cantrell?

    2. Youre still shocked to learn that not everyone called a Karen isnt named Karen. Amusing at least.

      1. And?

  6. Emerson: “As a Unitarian, I’ve grown increasingly frustrated by the rigid tenets that we–or any denomination–are oblidged to adhere to.”

    With the Woke mob that has presently infiltrated the Unitarian-Universalist Church, I’m sure he’d be saying that today as well. I wonder if the UUs have taken down portraits and Statues of Emerson and Thoreau and excommunicated them?

  7. After the insurrection, America’s far-right groups get more extreme

    While some of the splinter Proud Boys chapters will likely maintain the Proud Boys brand, at least for the time being, others may evolve and become more radicalized. The Base, a neo-Nazi terror group, has recruited from among the ranks of Proud Boys. As the Proud Boys sheds affiliates, it would not be surprising for those with more enthusiasm about hateful activism to seek out more extreme groups. Less committed groups will wither away.

    Neither the Capitol insurrection nor the Charlottesville rally produced the response from mainstream America that far-right groups had hoped for. Rather than rising up in a groundswell of support, most Americans were appalled – some so much that they have abandoned the Republican Party.

    Additionally, right-wingers have been hit hard by the post-insurrection actions by large technology companies like Facebook, Twitter, Apple, Google and Amazon. They took down far-right group members’ accounts and removed right-wing social media platforms, including permanently blacklisting Donald Trump’s Twitter account and temporarily blocking all traffic to Parler, a conservative social media platform. Those steps are more significant than earlier moderation and algorithm changes those companies had undertaken in previous efforts to curb online extremism.


      Last night, #antifa in Portland barricaded the front of the ICE building. They then set it on fire while federal officers were inside. Antifa also obscured the security cameras before launching the arson attack.

      They’ve got a way to go before they’re half as ‘radicalized’ as Antifa already is.

      1. Arson = 20 years or so I believe.

        1. You would know.

          1. Do you have any facts to back up your assertion that he’s been arrested for arson? Because he’s never said that he has.


    If the bill passes social media companies will have to remove posts containing “hurtful” words targeted at Canadian politicians. The provision is a danger to free speech not only in Canada but also the rest of the world as other governments may try to add similar laws

    1. We’re where they test out the stupidity before inflicting it on the US.


    Now that we’ve had a year of it going mainstream, can you name a single thing Woke ideology, activism, or policy has improved? I can’t.

  10. Not sure why everyone admires that hippie so much anyway. Low carbon footprint I suppose, and some boring literary legacy for liberal arts majors to fawn over.

  11. Hmm, wouldn’t conflict be great for China?
    Cui Bono

    JUST IN – United States threatens “consequences” if Russia acts “aggressively” towards Ukraine (AFP)

    1. Good YouTube video in the thread about politics in Ukraine

    2. Thank goodness for the DNC’s reset button.

    3. RED LINE.

    4. They’re not only going to act aggressively, they’re likely going to invade a good chunk of Ukraine. See,

      At least enough to get the water back on in Sevastopol. Maybe even past the Dnieper, or even completely across Southern Ukraine to Moldova. The build-up really reminds me of the run-up to Desert Storm. Not something comparatively minor like reinforcing the Donbas. That could have been done as quickly as, say, the Georgian Invasion happened.

      Bad idea for the US to get substantively involved. Even though Turkey appears to be taking Ukraine’s side on some of this.

  12. John Boehner on when he realized the GOP was insane:

    “At some point after the 2008 election, something changed with my friend Roger Ailes. I once met him in New York during the Obama years to plead with him to put a leash on some of the crazies he was putting on the air. It was making my job trying to accomplish anything conservative that much harder. I didn’t expect this meeting to change anything, but I still thought it was bullshit, and I wanted Roger to know it.

    “When I put it to him like that, he didn’t have much to say. But he did go on and on about the terrorist attack on the U.S. Embassy in Benghazi, which he thought was part of a grand conspiracy that led back to Hillary Clinton. Then he outlined elaborate plots by which George Soros and the Clintons and Obama (and whoever else came to mind) were trying to destroy him….
    “I thought I could get him to control the crazies, and instead I found myself talking to the president of the club.

    (source – his new book)

    1. Boehner on crazy whackjob Michele Bachmann

      “There was no way she was going to get on Ways and Means, the most prestigious committee in Congress, and jump ahead of everyone else in line. Not while I was Speaker. In earlier days, a member of Congress in her position wouldn’t even have dared ask for something like this. Sam Rayburn would have laughed her out of the city.
      “So I told her no—diplomatically, of course. But as she kept on talking, it dawned on me. This wasn’t a request of the Speaker of the House. This was a demand.
      “Her response to me was calm and matter-of-fact. ‘Well, then I’ll just have to go talk to Sean Hannity and everybody at Fox,’ she said, ‘and Rush Limbaugh, Mark Levin, and everybody else on the radio, and tell them that this is how John Boehner is treating the people who made it possible for the Republicans to take back the House.’
      “I wasn’t the one with the power, she was saying. I just thought I was. She had the power now.
      “She was right, of course.”

      1. You gettin a boner for Boehner now?


        1. There was nothing in his post that indicated he has an erection. Geez.

          1. Agreed. People can masturbate to RINO’s without necessarily getting erections.

          2. Everything in his post is related to erections. Fool.

        2. It is weird how the only conservatist a leftist likes is the ones attacking conservatism.

          1. I agree this is getting weird.

      2. Yeah I think Team Red is pretty much on board with mob rule now. Politicians are expected to represent the (perceived) will of the voters, and not deviate from that will. Representatives are supposed to be empty vessels simply enacting what the voters tell them to do, not statesmen and leaders who use wise judgment in their duties.

        If the voters want a wall on the border, or a trade war with China, or to invade Canada, or to bomb Iran, then politicians are supposed to automatically vote for all of those things, no questions asked, consequences be damned, because that is what the voters want.

        1. Hot damn, I hate democracy. God put the First and Second Estate on earth for a reason, peasants. The Hoi Polloi needs to learn its place.

          1. Oh look, there’s Mother’s Lament here with another sock puppet.

            I don’t hate democracy. I do think that voters are often wrong in their desire, and their elected representatives should strike a balance between blindly following what the mob wants, and using wisdom to try to persuade the mob about a better course of action despite the mob’s intemperate passions.

            Read Federalist #10. James Madison laid it all out better than I can.


            Complaints are everywhere heard from our most considerate and virtuous citizens, equally the friends of public and private faith, and of public and personal liberty, that our governments are too unstable, that the public good is disregarded in the conflicts of rival parties, and that measures are too often decided, not according to the rules of justice and the rights of the minor party, but by the superior force of an interested and overbearing majority. However anxiously we may wish that these complaints had no foundation, the evidence, of known facts will not permit us to deny that they are in some degree true. It will be found, indeed, on a candid review of our situation, that some of the distresses under which we labor have been erroneously charged on the operation of our governments; but it will be found, at the same time, that other causes will not alone account for many of our heaviest misfortunes; and, particularly, for that prevailing and increasing distrust of public engagements, and alarm for private rights, which are echoed from one end of the continent to the other. These must be chiefly, if not wholly, effects of the unsteadiness and injustice with which a factious spirit has tainted our public administrations.

            1. That’s only the case when you have too much state.
              I don’t want a lot of government. The less, the better. It’s called libertarianism.

              1. Oh but it doesn’t work that way. In James Madison’s time, there wasn’t “a lot of government” after all. If “the people” want a huge welfare state and to invade Canada, who are you or “elites” to stand in their way? Hmm?

                Frankly, I think that if “the people” really did have their voices heard, we would be a lot closer to outright socialism than we are now. Libertarians should be opposed to that sort of thing, whether the socialism is being pushed by elites, or the socialism is being pushed by the mob. Agreed?

                1. “Oh but it doesn’t work that way.”

                  The fuck it doesn’t. Are you seriously trying to say that the fascist regulatory behemoth that’s currently crushing Americans is better?

                  1. Note, chemjeff, that Mother’s can’t debate against what you actually said, so he argues against an exaggerated version.

                  2. Are you seriously trying to say that the fascist regulatory behemoth that’s currently crushing Americans is better?

                    That’s a false choice. I don’t want a gigantic regulatory state. I also don’t want unchecked mob rule.

                    Tell us, in your ideal direct democratic system, how would you prevent the 51% from voting to steal from the 49%?

                    1. I don’t want this or that. I just wanna sit on the fence all day.

                    2. I wouldn’t, because that’s a false dicotomy built on the phony assumption pushed by media propagandists that peoples opinions are always binary, left/right, Republican/Democrat.
                      Eliminate the party system and you eliminate the issue.

                      Also, you really, really hate regular people, don’t you? You’re a fat, basement-dwelling, welfare-sucking Torontonian who thinks he’s an aristocrat.

                2. “Oh but it doesn’t work that way.”

                  Jeff applies to the “more government is better” party, AKA the commies.
                  No great surprise, Jeff; it is obvious that you are a scumbag hoping to tell everyone else to do what you want.
                  Make your family proud; fuck off and die.

        2. Jeffy needs someone to make decisions for him.

        3. TOP MEN, PEOPLE!

          1. What do you want from your elected representatives? To blindly follow the will of the voters? Is that all? If so, why not just go to a direct democracy for deciding matters of state, a la ancient Athens?

            1. Do you even know where you are?
              Frankly, I’m amazed that you’re shocked that libertarians aren’t against the rule of the people.

              Is there some sort of absolute monarchist board out there, that you might fit in better with?

              1. Why do you think libertarianism is equivalent to “rule of the people”? Mobs can just as easily violate your rights as an absolute monarch can.

                I’m not in favor of monarchy. I’m not in favor of direct democracy either. I’m in favor of the Republic form of government that we currently have. Are you?

                1. Are you?
                  In fact I think a lot of it stinks.

                  Particularly the amount of power invested in the chief executive who has literally become an elected monarch.

                  1. Okay, so what form of government is most appealing to you then?

                    1. Partyless direct democracy.

                    2. At least you are brave enough to state what you believe earnestly.

                      So in a direct democracy, the 51% have the power to vote to steal from the 49%. Would your ideal system prevent that somehow? If so, how?

                    3. A federalist system. Having power closer to the individual. You prefer centralized authority because you think you’re an elite. It is why you are a globalist.

                    4. Ironically jeff doesn’t realize that his deference to the elite to change votes means the 1% can overrule the 99% lol.

                    5. A federalist system. Having power closer to the individual.

                      Hey wow, we agree on something!

                      Now why don’t you tell us about the centralized authority in YOUR ideal federalist system, Jesse. Oh wait you won’t, that would ruin all of your trolling fun.

                    6. You CACCLLs keep trying to argue with Jeff when he is clearly smarter than you. It makes you look stupid.

                    7. Pretty sure anyone arguing against representative government on a libertarian board is a paid troll, and not the subtle genius you’re hoping for.
                      And, if you think those wicked, wicked CLLALLLLS are getting trounced by chemleft, it’s because you don’t understand what you’re reading.

                    8. Rexist

                2. Libertarianism is not allowing the government to amass power so the rule of the mob is not inherently harmful.

                  You seem to prefer elites utilizing massive power in absence of the voters will. Youre the worst of everything. Youre a socialist.

                  1. You seem to prefer trolling over substance.

                    1. You tell him Jeff!

              2. Are you in favor of direct democracy? Decide matters of state by direct vote of the people?

                So instead of electing Representatives, or Members of Parliament, to (supposedly) represent us, we all vote on taxes and spending. Sound good to you?

                1. Yes.
                  You fascists have deluded yourselves into believing that your top men and Harvard Brahmins are somehow more capable than the first fifty names in the Boston phone book.
                  They’re not.

                  1. …Harvard Brahmins are somehow more capable than the first fifty names in the Boston phone book

                    That has to be one of WFB’s best quotes ever, in fact of the 20th Century. I enjoyed your paraphrase

            2. Weren’t you the one calling jan 6th attacks on democracy not understanding we are a republic? Lol.

            3. By the way, last time you went into this rant of elites over ruling voters you seemed quite ignorant of direct democracy and Athens.

          2. Incidentally I don’t expect ML or anyone else who continually rages about “elites” to ever seriously address this question. They hate elites, they hate it when their elected representatives don’t blindly follow the will of the people, yet they will never contend with WHY we have the system of government that we have, and that is PRECISELY because mob rule can be just as dangerous as rule by a dictator. They won’t confess to that, they will continue to push that “the people” have “their voices heard” without ever acknowledging that “the people” themselves are often wrong.

            1. You don’t seem to realize that arguing for authoritarian government on a libertarian website just makes you look crazy.

              1. There is more than one alternative to direct democracy besides authoritarian government. Try again.

                1. Such as?

                  1. A representative Republic, similar to what we currently have. Where the voters elect representatives, but they are not simply mindless zombies regurgitating the will of the voters. They are supposed to be leaders and statesmen – representing their constituents in a thoughtful way, and sometimes, telling the mob that they are wrong. They are supposed to be leaders, not demagogues.

                    1. That’s a recipe for the exact same garbage bureaucratic disaster that the US has now.

                    2. We call them representatives for a reason. Leader is not part of the job description.

                    3. “Leader is not part of the job description.”

                      Wow, you really believe that.

                    4. Got it. So in your ideal system, whatever the people want, they should get it, good and hard!

                      Do you even know how socialist revolutions come about? Hint: they are not imposed top down by evil tyrants. Whenever there was a socialist revolution, there was mass popular support for that revolution. The people really did think that Mao, or Lenin, or Castro, was reflecting the authentic will of the people by crushing those dirty capitalists and redistributing the spoils to the people, where they belong. That is the inevitable result of mob rule run amok. The 51% oppresses the 49% and you get a type of socialism that descends into tyranny.

                    5. “Do you even know how socialist revolutions come about? Hint: they are not imposed top down by evil tyrants. there was mass popular support for that revolution”

                      You’re an uneducated idiot. That was never true. Not even once.

                      – The Russian Communists siezed power in a coup against the actual popular revolutionary government led by Krensky. Lenin and Trotsky lived in Switzerland and New York the entire time the revolution was being fought.
                      – Mao seized power with an army supplemented by mercenary Chinese Warlords against the legitimate revolutionary government of the Kuomintang who had been weakened and exhausted by fighting the war against the Japanese.
                      – Pol Pot and his Khmer Rouge battled against the the actual revolutionary government using troops loyal to Cambodia’s deposed monarch and with his blessing.
                      – Every single Warsaw Pact nation, plus Yugoslavia, had Communism imposed by Stalin.

                      Not once did mass popular support put socialist authoritarians in power.

              2. The irony, it burns.

                1. As expected of White Knight, he doesn’t understand what irony means either.
                  You should thank fuck that I’m not your boss down at the fifty-cent factory.

                  1. Are you trying to say that it’s ironic that I don’t know what irony means?

                    1. No, just pointing out, for the X time, that you are full of shit.

                2. The White Knight III: Army of Canuckness
                  April.11.2021 at 2:22 pm
                  “The irony, it burns.”

                  The stupditiy from the TDS-addled lefty asshole is amusing.

        4. Jeff, how come you are fantasizing about my nuts?

          chemjeff radical individualist
          April.9.2021 at 7:18 pm
          I bet Jesse’s left nut that come Jan. 20, 2025, that the size of the Supreme Court of the United States stands at 9. No more, no less.

          Is it because you haven’t seen your own in many decades so are unsure if you even have any?

          Kind of a weird thing to say. Creepy as fuck.

          1. Well, it was an easy bet to make, since you don’t have any.

            1. Good one Jeff! It’s fun watching you own all the right wing-nuts.

              1. Get a room you two.

                1. Lol, you just replied to Tulpa. Why do you want Tulpa to get a room with chemjeff.

                  1. You can all just fuck off forever.

      3. Neat to see purported lefties like Buttplug shilling for warpig, neocon corporatists now.

        1. I’m not a lefty and I like corporations and global trade deals.

          Conservatives like yourself are becoming anti-capitalists. I notice Tucker Carlson is advancing a white national anti-corporation agenda.

          1. Being against corporatism doesn’t have anything to do with capitalism and actual corporations.

            You don’t seem to understand what we are talking about.

    2. Exactly what I’ve been saying for years.

      Although I wasn’t old enough to vote at the time, it’s clear to me the GOP of the early 2000s was far superior to the current version. Back then patriotic intellectuals like David Frum and KMW’s former coworker Bill Kristol had tremendous influence in the party. And say what you want about the Iraq War, but that arguably misguided policy didn’t come close to the violence or depravity of Orange Hitler’s war on immigration.



    So a crack addict figured out how to start a successful pillow company but not a Harvard student

    1. Real work is hard.

    2. To be fair he wouldn’t have got within a hundred miles of Harvard, if he didn’t play catamite to the Davos gun-control narrative.

    1. Why are you worried about the Republican Party?

      1. Because right now we have a Congress with no check on Democratic Party spending plans. And Trump, Giuliani, Sidney Powell, Lin Wood, and the Pillow Guy bear a lot of the blame for hahah.

        1. Hahah == that

          Thanks, iPhone.

          1. Don’t blame the iPhone, Chief.

        2. Why would they need to have a check on what they are doing? They know better than the rest of us what is best.

          1. Not all of us are on board with the Biden/Harris spending agenda, like you are.

  14. “His” taxes. Looter politicians invent them, send armed thugs to an individual’s door to collect them and choose judges who–for a consideration–paper the whole thing over with fake legitimacy. But every looter propagandist will assure you those are “your” taxes even though the politicians get to keep and spend them.
    Brilliant this cartoonist, BTW.

  15. Paradise is possible. But it’s not based on self-reliance. It’s possible only by adherence to God’s laws:

    So Abraham called the name of that place, “The Lord will provide” (Yahweh-Yireh); as it is said to this day, “On the mount of the Lord it shall be provided.” – Genesis 22:14

    1. I guess this is the anti Kirkland.

      1. Brings balance to the force.


    Re: the erupting volcano story, it’s even worse than MSM has reported. St Vincent’s Tourism Minister said any unvaccinated person who uses a govt-operated shelter to be safe will be forcibly vaccinated with the AZ vaccine, which violates the Nuremberg Code [link]

    1. Put a figurative gun to the head: hot lava, or vaccine.

    2. Is this Nuremberg Code says you cannot force people to get vaccinated the latest hot right-wing talking point:

    3. Will the vaccine keep you from getting killed by the volcano? If so, a true miracle drug.

  17. Tensions High for ‘White Lives Matter’ Rally, Counter-Protest in Huntington Beach

    Sens. Dave Min, D-Irvine, and Tom Umberg, D-Santa Ana, and Assemblywoman Cottie Petrie-Norris, D-Newport Beach, on Friday released a statement condemning the Sunday rally organized by the Loyal White Knights.

    “We unequivocally condemn white nationalism and the racist ideology promoted by the Ku Klux Klan,” the statement reads. “While we acknowledge the rights of all Americans — even the vilest racists out there — to express their opinions, we want to loudly and clearly state that the views expressed by the KKK and other white nationalist groups do not reflect the views of Orange County’s residents or elected officials.

    1. So white lives don’t matter?

      1. White knights don’t matter.

  18. Tucker Carlson’s White Supremacy Is the Core of American Conservatism
    This week, he went beyond his standard thinly-veiled rants and endorsed white replacement theory.

    Fox News host Tucker Carlson went beyond his usual thinly veiled racist rants on Thursday night, endorsing the explicitly white supremacist “replacement theory.” In response, the American Defamation League has called for Carlson to be fired.

    Carlson is one of the leading voices of what passes for conservatism today and a possible Republican presidential contender. So his embrace of the same poisonous rhetoric that fills hate-filled manifestos from neo-Nazi websites and far-right terrorists is yet another step downward into the ninth circle of hell for American democracy. Carlson for his part insists that his version of “replacement theory” isn’t racist, any more than his contempt for Black Lives Matter protesters or his insistence that Iraqis are “semi-literate primitive monkeys”:


    1. None of those Tiki torches burned any buildings, did they? Did those people carrying the Tiki torches attack any police or local businesses? Were any police cars burned or vandalized? Did those people carrying Tiki torches loot any businesses? Did the city have to board up businesses? Does Biden need to step in an outlaw Tiki torches to keep us safe?

      1. “None of those Tiki torches burned any buildings, did they?”

        Ask turd about his kiddie porn links; he seems to find it hard to respond to those sorts of questions.
        And he claims to ‘work in an office’; probably a good bet that the ‘office’ he works in doesn’t do background checks for contract janitors. A coke habit and a predilection for kiddie-porn might get missed.

      2. Tiki Barber torched many defenses


    If this happened in the service of a patriotic American cause, the media and the left would call it fascism.

    Today it’s “voting laws”—within the next couple of years (or less), these forces will opine on every facet of American life and policy, destroying everyone in opposition [screenshot]


      CONFIRMED: First-of-its-kind call between more than 100 top corporate leaders on Saturday focused on how to respond to proposed changes in state voting laws. Participants included top leaders of airlines, media, law, investment.

      Those invited include leaders of @AmericanAir, @United, @AtlantaFalcons, @LeviStraussCo, @Walmart, @ViacomCBS, @ArielInvests, @LinkedIn, @Twitter, @AMCTheatres, among others, people familiar with the meeting tell @cbsnews.


    Or, just get back to living life without permission slips for everything, like most people are already doing.

    Digital proof of vaccination against Covid-19 would allow Americans to visit family in the hospital, not keep folks out of restaurants, writes @ScottGottliebMD”

  21. Didn’t think of it until now, but it looks like a little Tony Millionaire has crept into the Bagge.

    1. Suburb of Minny. Police may or not get burned out of their police station tonight by this particular mob. Nothing to do with Floyd; some other shithead decided to fight with the police, lost, and a crowd took umbrage.

      Really bodes well for what’ll happen after the Chauvin verdict though, huh?


    Didn’t Antifa try to burn down a federal building in Portland last night, with ICE officers inside?

    Shouldn’t you be tweeting about that?

    Help the #FBI locate individuals who instigated violence at the U.S. Capitol on January 6. If you recognize the person in these photos, visit [link] to submit a tip. Refer to photo 297 in your tip.”


    Brandy lacks the mental capability to understand she is exposing her entire grift here [pic]

  24. Looks like a good thing! – maybe you should check something like this as well.

  25. his book is a wonderful: natural beauty of Cape Cod and the nature that surrounds it.

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