Meanwhile in Portland, Roosevelt and Lincoln Get Canceled

Statues of Presidents Abraham Lincoln and Theodore Roosevelt are the latest victims of rioters in Portland.

|The Volokh Conspiracy |

Revelers celebrating the Los Angeles Lakers' NBA Championship crowded the streets and remained mostly peaceful in Los Angeles (even if there was not much mask wearing). Meanwhile in Portland, a "day of rage" produced anohter round of vandalism, looting, and wanton destruction. From the Oregonian:

A group of protesters toppled statues of former presidents Theodore Roosevelt and Abraham Lincoln and shattered the entrance to the Oregon Historical Society in Portland's South Park Blocks late Sunday before moving into other areas of downtown, smashing storefronts and engaging in other acts of destruction.

As is becoming increasingly common, the "protestors" discouraged filming or recording of their activities:

The organizers had signaled their aggressive stance for the night, calling for "direct action" and demanding that the video live-streamers and photographers who had become staples of such events stay away.

People in the crowd were repeatedly admonished not to film. Passersby who happened upon the group were ordered by demonstrators to stop filming or delete photographs, including an apartment resident who had lasers shined at his eyes and a liquid thrown in his face as he appeared to shoot video of the scene from his terrace.

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  1. Yeah yeah yeah now about Qanon and the epidemic of rightwing militia violence that is the only violence that exists in the universe.

    1. the rightwinger rioters who are pretending to be leftwing protesters didn’t want to be filmed in the act.

      1. Led by that rightwing shooter who pretended to be leftwing when he shot up the GOP baseball game.

      2. Is that just general sh*t talking, or do you honestly believe that it’s right wing violence?

        1. Almost certainly the first. One would think that Portland’s Democratic city prosecutors would want to press charges against right-wing agents provocateur, but the charges are almost always dropped, including charges against repeat offenders. We get lazy conspiracy theorists who don’t even put a QAnon level of effort into their accusations.

          1. I hope it’s not a genuine belief that it’s right wing agent provocateurs or right wing mobs are causing the problems in Portland or Atlanta. If it is, there is a tenuous grasp on empirical reality that James possess. I mean, I can see people of good will disagreeing about A LOT, but at some point the Left has to realize that it’s their ideological brethren out there.

            1. Joe Biden favorably quoted Mao Zedong the other day, and not for the first time. While his senior adviser calls him her favorite political philosopher.

              1. Much like the fascists managing to get the trains to run on time, Chairman Mao does have some accomplishments, such as driving foreign imperialists out of China. this is generally perceptable as a good thing, unless one happens to be a foreign imperialist.

                1. There are about 60 million dead Chinese who might retrospectively wonder if driving out foreign imperialists was such a great thing….

                  1. There are about 1.2 billion live Chinese who like it the way it is.

                    1. Just because things are better than they could be doesn’t mean they don’t deserve criticism. Especially as the vast majority of those deaths were due to massive violations of human rights and famines caused by rampant incompetence.

                    2. “Just because things are better than they could be doesn’t mean they don’t deserve criticism.”

                      Please point to where anyone said they don’t deserve criticism.

                    3. At least 1.1 billion of those live Chinese are living in abject poverty, and we’ll never know how much better off they might be if capitalism had not been banned.

            2. We definitely have a Poe’s Law problem here.

            3. ” If it is, there is a tenuous grasp on empirical reality that James possess. I mean, I can see people of good will disagreeing about A LOT, but at some point the Left has to realize that it’s their ideological brethren out there.”

              Speaking of tenuous grasp on reality, you seem to have identified me as “the Left”.

              1. Not “the left, but “of the left?”

                1. Yeah, that’s totally better.

            4. “I hope it’s not a genuine belief that it’s right wing agent provocateurs or right wing mobs are causing the problems in Portland or Atlanta.”

              I don’t know much of anything about Atlanta, and don’t claim to, but I did have a “Portland” mailing address for almost 20 years before leaving in 2018. There’s definitely a rightwinger presence in Portland, largely based in Vancouver, WA. Some names to Google: Jeremy Christian, Mulugeta Seraw.

              1. What about Jeremy Christian? He was a psychotic and all over the political map. Even supported Bernie Sanders.

                1. He was leaving the “Unite the Right” rally. Not a lot of Bernie Bros hanging out there.

                  1. That would explain why he was leaving.

          2. “Almost certainly the first.”

            You’re wrong about that, too. There’s a genuine possibility it’s “false flag” playacting. The rightwingers definitely do like to come to Portland and create/cause trouble, and the idea probably occurred to at least one conspiracy nut, but whether a false-flag operation could successfully operate AND manage to keep it a secret is more doubtful.

          3. ” One would think that Portland’s Democratic city prosecutors”

            If the city’s prosecutors did much of anything, but most criminal prosecutions are handled at the county level. Plus, they’re almost all civil service, not elected.

    2. ” the epidemic of rightwing militia violence that is the only violence that exists in the universe.”

      In Portland, there’s the case of notorious leftist Jeremy Christian, murderer of 2 of the 3 people who demanded he stop harassing a pair of teenaged girls on the public transit train.

      1. Anecdote, data, blah blah blah

        1. You’re not very bright, and I bet you don’t like having that pointed out. The problem with your blah, blah, blah is that it isn’t correct.
          The claim was that left wing violence was the only political violence.
          Pointing to a single case of political violence that was not left wing is sufficient to disprove the claim.

        2. “Bernie Sanders was the President I wanted,” wrote Christian in December. “He voiced my heart and mind.
          – “Who is Jeremy Christian?”, Oregon Live, May 30, 2017

          1. “In April, Christian was filmed and photographed doing a Nazi salute while shouting: ‘Die Muslims!’ at an alt-right ‘free speech’ rally.”

            “On Twitter and other social media, however, people who identify as alt-right are distancing themselves from Christian, calling him a Bernie Sanders supporter.”

            Well, if they’re calling him a Bernie Sanders supporter, it must be true. It’s not like they have a reason to lie about that.

  2. They are right; it is time to stop shooting videos, just shoot.

  3. Thank goodness the thuggish federal forces left Portland. Prof. Kerr is vindicated.

  4. And if you look for this story in the Washington Post, you won’t find it without doing a word search, and then it’s just an AP writeup.

    1. Yep. A mere inconvenient truth, and treated accordingly.

      1. Plus the fact that the Portland Historical Society is around 3000 miles away from the metropolitan area that the Washington Post primarily serves.
        Not much coverage of the Hillsboro Hops baseball team, either, for about the same reason.

          1. It’s no USA Today…

  5. “Revelers celebrating the Los Angeles Lakers’ NBA Championship crowded the streets and remained mostly peaceful in Los Angeles (even if there was not much mask wearing).”

    https://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/fan-celebration-of-lakers-victory-near-staples-center-prompts-police-response/2442529/

    Sure, if you consider the usual (lots of vandalism, attacking police cars, shutting down the ramps off the freeway, and then the crowds being dispersed by large militarized groups of riot police with tactical gear firing non-lethal munitions) to be “mostly peaceful” then whatever, dude.

    1. Not a lot of Commies, even in Ecotopia.

        1. Not Commies. Pop into the area and see for yourself.

          The state’s beaches are all owned by the state, but not a lot of other property or economic resources is/are. The utility that provides electric service to most of Portland was once part of Enron, but the voters convincingly shot down a proposal to create a public utility out of the Enron bankruptcy.

  6. If a basketball team wins a championship in the woods and no one watched, did they still win?

    1. Durr. The SOCCER team is called the Timbers. The basketball team is called the Trail Blazers. The soccer team DID win the MLS is Back tournament, which I’m sure came as good news to the 3000 people or so who go to the games regularly. Doesn’t answer your question though, because the soccer stadium is right downtown. It’s the baseball teams who play out in the woods.

      1. Plus all the basketball was played at Disney World, which isn’t “in the woods”.

  7. Lincoln was the very worst President in history. He is in a category all alone, an order of magnitude more catastrophic than the usual terrible Presidents.

    1. Usually people say that’s Buchanan, the fellow in charge when the South seceded, who mishandled the start of the crisis.

    2. And not a single argued reason to justify such a claim.

      1. Usually it’s material about Lincoln’s suppression of the press and habeas corpus.

        1. He was offered alternatives to war. Free the newborn. Buy the slaves. Let the Southern States go, they will be back. Mr. Please Do Not Sue Your Neighbor chose war that killed 800000 Americans, like 8 million today. It delayed the settling of race relations 100 years. He blew up the size of government. He started the draft, the income tax, and mass incarceration. He issued an arrest warrant for the traitor, Tanney, but took it back, persuaded by a lawyer to not arrest the Chief Justice. That warrant is an icon to judicial accountability, and lies in the US Marshall museum. Instead of being mercifully hanged for treason, Tanney went on to linger and to suffer a long, painful death, in abject poverty.

          To his credit, Lincoln’s soldiers pistol whipped judges on the bench, and imprisoned those who granted writs of habeus corpus to confederate spies, without a trial.

          1. You had me until the Taney rant. Should have seen it coming, though.

            The fact is, Lincoln took it upon himself to suspend the writ of habeus corpus, and not even in a war zone where the courts weren’t functioning. Just someplace he wanted to be able to throw people in jail without judicial review if they disagreed with him.

            For all Taney’s sins, his only “treason” in this case was ruling that Lincoln couldn’t constitutional do that, which was something of a no-brainer, given that the power was assigned to Congress, not the executive branch.

            Pointing out an obvious point of law is not treason, even if the President would rather be permitted to go on violating the Constitution.

            1. These are not the reasons the statues were torn down. They want to take a squat on someone who moved the issues forward (how you get here from there) but who otherwise didn’t act like he believed every last 21st century litmust test.

              1. Well, no: The sort of people who tear down statues probably view jailing dissenters as a point in Lincoln’s favor.

                But being a respected American President? Intolerable!

                1. “Well, no: The sort of people who tear down statues probably view jailing dissenters as a point in Lincoln’s favor. ”

                  Well, no. The sort of people who view vandalizing property as meaningful contributions to political debate probably lack the sort of knowledge needed to debate Lincoln’s place in history.

            2. Brett. Dred Scott abrogated a law that prevented war for 20 years, a ratified international treaty with Canada, Article I Section 1 that prohibits judicial review, not to mention self evident common sense. It was a factor setting off the Civil War. Hard to find someone doing more damage to the Nation, even for the Democrat that Taney was.

              1. Did anyone hear a word about Dred Scott in law school? The above info was from high school AP Am. History. Why is Dred Scott never mentioned in law school?

                1. “Did anyone hear a word about Dred Scott in law school?”

                  Yeah, in the background coverage of the 14th amendment in second-semester Con Law.

                  1. In Portland. And right before the election of 2010, for that matter.

          2. ” Mr. Please Do Not Sue Your Neighbor chose war”

            That’s the choice you have when other people start shelling your forts. Might as well complain about how FDR “chose” war in 1941.

    3. If Donald Trump governed like Lincoln, he would deport “seditious” journalists, shut down more than 300 newspapers, use federal troops to occupy hostile state legislatures, suspend habeas corpus, and plan to send blacks back to Africa.

      1. “If Donald Trump governed like Lincoln”

        If Donald Trump WANTED to govern like Lincoln, he’d have to actually DO something, and that’s not his wheelhouse. Trump is more the “wait until somebody does something popular, then claim credit for it” style manager.

        1. Are you trying to get me to vote for Trump? Because that sounds like a reason to vote fro Trump, especially over his opponent, who will gladly do SOMETHING just to say he did, even if it is complete nonsense.

          1. I don’t give two farts in the wind who you vote for. If you favor mismanagement, by all means vote for der Trumpfenfuhrer. He’ll deliver you all you can handle.

            1. The cognitive dissonance here is just mind-blowing.

              Der Trumpfenfuhrer the incompetent. Is he literally Hitler or not? Too much thought for the little fish brain of yours?

              1. “The cognitive dissonance here is just mind-blowing.”

                Stop doing it then.

                ” Is he literally Hitler or not?”

                That would be not. Hitler died in his bunker after double-crossing the Russians. Trump hasn’t a clue how he could double-cross the Russkies.

                “Too much thought for the little fish brain of yours?”

                Was that you trying to be clever? It’s hard to say, as you lack skill in this area.

  8. “A group of protesters toppled statues of former presidents Theodore Roosevelt and Abraham Lincoln and shattered the entrance to the Oregon Historical Society in Portland’s South Park Blocks late Sunday before moving into other areas of downtown, smashing storefronts and engaging in other acts of destruction.”

    This demonstrates that the demonstrations have gone from calling attention to racial inequities to the taking down of the US government by destroying the its history. That will make it easier for the group of revolters to replace that history with one that indicates how terrible the US has been thus showing that the government needs a radical change.

    “The organizers had signaled their aggressive stance for the night, calling for “direct action” and demanding that the video live-streamers and photographers who had become staples of such events stay away.”

    Yes, these rioters are demanding that video live-streamers and photographers stay away. They have learned that these live-streamers that they can be used to identify the criminals involved in this criminal activities. So expect anyone who attempts to live-stream or photo any of these events to get what is coming to them even up to death.

    1. “This demonstrates that the demonstrations have gone from calling attention to racial inequities to the taking down of the US government by destroying the its history. That will make it easier for the group of revolters to replace that history with one that indicates how terrible the US has been thus showing that the government needs a radical change. ”

      So, you’re speaking for them, and they told you all this, did they?

  9. Left wing violence is geared to be just violent enough to antagonize a violent reaction, but not too violent. The idea is to keep prodding a person or a system again and again until it overreacts. Then the leftists point to the overreaction (and the media ignores the provocation). Of course, at some point, they will start being as violent as they want since there will be no one to stop them.

    1. It is allowed to continue as those at the top desire the power that toppling Trump will bring.

      If this happens, they will receive no more benefit from it, and orders from the top will cause it to dry up.

      Problems you can, however illogically, tag the opposition with, must evaporate from attention once you get power.

      For god’s sake, these large cities have Democratic control for decades, but the rhetoric has successfully turned it into a referendum on Trump.

      Ergo it will dry up overnight.

      1. “If this happens, they will receive no more benefit from it, and orders from the top will cause it to dry up.”

        At this point, though, hasn’t the looting made the rioting essentially self-financing, maybe even a profit center?

        And rioting is kind of like a forest fire, in that it’s a lot easier to start than stop.

        But if the Democrats have enough media dominance to pull this election off, they’ve got enough media dominance to blame the continued rioting on Trump even if he lost.

      2. “It is allowed to continue as those at the top desire the power that toppling Trump will bring.

        If this happens, they will receive no more benefit from it, and orders from the top will cause it to dry up.”

        Trump is currently at the top, and doing everything he can to try to stay there. You’re suggesting he’s so inept that he doesn’t even know he’s at the top?

        1. “Trump is currently at the top, and doing everything he can to try to stay there. You’re suggesting he’s so inept that he doesn’t even know he’s at the top?”

          That’s dumb, even as an attempt at pedantry. If I mention the top brass of the Marine Corps, will you also think “oh, must be talking about Trump”? Of course Trump would not be at “the top” of those “who desire the power that toppling Trump will bring.”

          Jeez.

          1. “That’s dumb, even as an attempt at pedantry.”

            So sorry. Are you objecting because I’m infringing on your pedantry turf, or because dumb is YOUR thing?

            1. I object to you being an idiot. You’re no Sarcastr0, stop trying. But, you’re a step up from Artie, so that’s something.

              Your rebuttals are super amazing though.

              1. I’ll gladly leave the idiot-being to you, as you have so much more experience and do it better.

    2. “Left wing violence is geared to be just violent enough to antagonize a violent reaction, but not too violent. The idea is to keep prodding a person or a system again and again until it overreacts.”

      This can be distinguished from right wing violence, which is just violence for the sake of violence. See, e.g. Jeremy Christian, who reacted with fatal violence to being asked to stop harassing teenage girls on the public transit train.

      1. You keep mentioning him, but he’s only “right wing violence” because you decided that all racists are right wing. Judging from most of your posts though, that’s about as much critical thought as you are capable of attempting.

        1. “You keep mentioning him, but he’s only ‘right wing violence’ because you decided that all racists are right wing.”

          That, and the fact that he was on the way home from the “Unite the Right” rally when he decided he should kill people.

          1. It’s a two-party system. Crazy people exist on both sides. We don’t reference political parties in the courts because it’s not relevant. Killing someone for no good reason is not political violence. It’s just the fact that by random chance, half of violence will be committed by each side of the political spectrum.

            We are concerned about violence committed in the name of politics because your political opponents need to be shut down. IE: terrorism.

            1. “. Killing someone for no good reason is not political violence.”

              He had a great reason, those oppressive leftist thugs told him to stop harassing teenage girls on the train for wearing Muslim garb.

              ” It’s just the fact that by random chance, half of violence will be committed by each side of the political spectrum.”

              Which is fine, until one side starts claiming that their side never, ever act (or reacts) with violence. and then gets their panties in a knot when you point out that this isn’t true.

          2. He was a Bernie Sanders fan. How is that right wing?

            “Bernie Sanders was the President I wanted,” wrote Christian in December. “He voiced my heart and mind.
            – “Who is Jeremy Christian?”, Oregon Live, May 30, 2017

            1. “How is that right wing?”

              You’ll have to ask him about how his political opinions formed. Unambiguously, he was leaving a right-wing rally when his murderous rage erupted. The triggering factor was that bystanders didn’t just stand by when he decided that he should start harassing a couple of teenage girls for looking like Muslims.

            2. “He was a Bernie Sanders fan. How is that right wing?”

              this is a popular claim from the alt-right, because they want to dissociate with him. The fact is, he was leaving a right-wing rally when he decided to start killing people, and the reason he targeted the people he did is that they objected to his harassment of two teenage girls for “looking like Muslims”.

  10. Amid all the leftists screaming about “right wing violence” we still have Portland and violence there every single night. Not a single article in anything other then local papers though. Can’t find a national headline that doesn’t mention a few guys who were planning on making a citizen’s arrest. But apparently a city under the thumb of an anarchist gang setting up lawless zones is not news.

    1. How long have you lived in Portland?

      1. Not long enough to know all of the top secret racists that you know.

        1. Have your therapist adjust your dosage. You’re seeing things that aren’t there, again.

          1. Attention span of a goldfish apparently…

            “…There’s definitely a rightwinger presence in Portland, largely based in Vancouver, WA.”

            Evidenced by a murder in 1988, and a guy who was so ill that he was whatever you want him to be. But, you know about all of the super secret right-wingers in Portland, right? I bet you even hear the racist dog whistles.

            1. The right-wingers in Portland aren’t super secret, there, dimbulb. They hold rallies right out in the open.

              You can read about them here:
              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_Prayer

  11. Protesters? Gimme a break, paid vandals, paid with jewish money to execute a jewish script, undermine a host society….oi vey, can we just put all the jews in Israel and be done with their shit once and for all?

    1. Go fuck yourself Adolf

      1. I think his handle is Pavel…

        1. I think it’s Misek.

    2. Do you mean, Soros?

      He delivered hiding Jews to the Nazis for money, at age 14, the way, you may have delivered newspapers.

  12. I’m beginning to think that the only way out of this is a federal right to record, (Could probably be justified under the 1st amendment.) and hefty penalties for any violation.

    Then put enough camera drones into the air at any protest that all hope of not being filmed has to be abandoned.

    1. Threatening someone for recording your activity, especially illegal activity, is already a crime.

      1. Yes, but you’d need to make it a federal crime in order to get around local prosecutors who were on the rioters’ side.

        1. Ah, yes. The conspiracy theory. But of course, if it were a federal crime, it would be the Deep State’s job to enforce the peace.

          1. Those crazy conspiracy theories, even Portland prosecutors are advancing them.

            https://theintercept.com/2020/09/16/portland-protests-prosecutor-police/

            1. The nerve of that guy declining to prosecute protestors for rioting on the slim technicality that they weren’t rioting.

              ” By the time Schmidt took over, some 550 people, including journalists, legal observers, and many peaceful protesters, had been arrested during nightly standoffs with police — the vast majority over low-level, nonviolent charges.”

    2. “I’m beginning to think that the only way out of this is a federal right to record, (Could probably be justified under the 1st amendment.)”

      Except, as anyone who knows what they’re talking about will explain to you, the first amendment applies to Congress, not street hooligans. The street hooligans don’t owe you any first-amendment rights, and flatly cannot violate the first amendment even if they tell you that you can’t record them.

  13. ” Passersby who happened upon the group were ordered by demonstrators to stop filming or delete photographs, including an apartment resident who had lasers shined at his eyes and a liquid thrown in his face as he appeared to shoot video of the scene from his terrace.”

    18 USC 241?

    1. I keep bringing that up, but apparently it can’t be enforced against left-wing rioters for some obscure reason.

      1. they’e left-wing rioters because you don’t like left-wing or riots, so they must be the same thing.

        1. Lefty troll says what?

          1. “Lefty troll says what?”

            I didn’t hear you say anything.

        2. “they’e left-wing rioters because you don’t like left-wing or riots, so they must be the same thing.”

          Ah, yes. The conspiracy theory.

          1. You guys sure love your conspiracy theories.

            1. This coming from the guy claiming false-flag right-wing violence dressed up as run-of-the-mill lefty violence?

              Did you attend Artie’s school of “Exalted Reason”?

              1. More accurately, this coming from a guy who claims that people who like conspiracy theories might possibly be more likely to try to create their own conspiracy.

                Keep trying. You’ll get the hang of reading.

    2. The challenge is you have to have law-enforcement at the scene, ready to act (not busy, say, stopping vandals), who happen to observe the crime or collect evidence that it happened. Shining a laser at someone is pretty hard to detect the source, unless the scene is particularly smoky.

      1. Are you paid for this? If so Media Matters is getting robbed.

        1. “Are you paid for this?”

          No, I didn’t get your check.

  14. This doesn’t bode well for Mount Rushmore. The other two were slave owners.

    1. At least two will have to go anyway to make room for Trump’s head to be added. It’ll have to be the biggest and best head ever carved on a mountain, of course.

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