Debates 2020

Tuesday's Debate Demonstrated That Donald Trump Wants This Election To Become a Chaotic Mess

Chris Wallace asked both candidates on Tuesday night if they would urge "supporters to stay calm during this extended period, not to engage in any civil unrest." Trump rejected the premise.

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Near the very end of Tuesday's mostly unwatchable debate between President Donald Trump and former Vice President Joe Biden, there was actually a single important moment that could have ramifications on and beyond Election Day.

By now, it's no secret that the outcome of this year's presidential election might not be known on November 3. Due to the abnormally high number of mail-in and absentee ballots that are expected to be cast this year—and compounded by the fact that several states, including some important swing states, are not allowed to start counting those ballots before Election Day—there will likely be a large number of completely legitimate votes that won't be counted in the hours immediately after polls close. If the election is close, how the two top candidates act in the immediate aftermath of an uncalled contest will be crucial to securing the legitimacy of the election.

With that in mind, debate moderator Chris Wallace asked both candidates on Tuesday night if they would urge their "supporters to stay calm during this extended period, not to engage in any civil unrest" and pledge that neither would declare victory until the results were final.

Trump immediately rejected the premise.

"I am urging my supporters to go into the polls and watch very carefully," he said, before spiraling off into a tangent about how some of his supporters were "thrown out" of polling places in Philadelphia earlier today. "You know why? Because bad things happen in Philadelphia," Trump said.

Fair enough. But in this case, it doesn't look as devious as the president is trying to make it sound. City commissioners in Philadelphia have denied that anyone was unfairly tossed from election offices processing mail-in ballots, according to the local CBS affiliate.

Later in the same answer, Trump accused Democrats of cheating because of reports that "they found ballots in a wastepaper basket three days ago…and they all had the name 'Trump' on them."

Again, there's a bit of truth here. The FBI and the Pennsylvania State Police are investigating an incident in which nine ballots were apparently discarded in a Luzerne County, Pennsylvania, election office. At this point, it remains unclear whether those ballots were discarded for legitimate reasons. But Trump and his supporters have seized on the fact that at least seven of the votes were cast for the incumbent president as proof of malfeasance.

All of that only makes it more important for Trump, Biden, and everyone else to keep their shit together for the next six or eight or 10 weeks. But Trump's ultimate goal is not allowing law enforcement to determine the truth about whether those nine ballots were legitimately discarded. He'd much rather use the incident as a wedge to raise questions about the legitimacy of the entire election.

As Wallace dutifully pointed out, there were more than 31 million mail-in votes cast in the 2018 election—more than a quarter of all votes. As Biden pointed out, there are five states where elections are now conducted almost entirely by mail—and he could have pointed out that at least one of those vote-by-mail systems, in Colorado, was implemented by a Republican. No matter how many times Trump tries to claim otherwise, it is simply not true that more mail-in voting will disadvantage Republicans.

Biden's response to the same question from Wallace was exactly what you'd hope to hear from a national leader. "Yes," he said, he would wait to declare victory until the race was certified. "No one has established at all that there is fraud related to mail-in ballots," he added. "I will accept [the outcome]."

But it matters that Trump won't say he trusts the process, and it matters that he won't tell his supporters to wait for the results to be counted. It matters that he seems willing to turn everything into a conspiracy directed against him.

"This is not going to end well," Trump said at the very end of his tirade.

It might turn out to be a self-fulfilling prophecy.

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  1. When have Republicans ever engaged in rioting and civil unrest on election night or any time? Meanwhile, Democrats are the ones who have been rioting for months and are war gaming civil unrest as a way to win an election. It isn’t Republicans doing that. That is Democrats.

    I don’t know what Trump wants. But I know for sure what Democrats are doing and show no sign of stopping. Rioting and political violence on a mass scale. I would think anyone with any brains would be more worried about that than parsing Trump’s words or Trump refusing to say he will accept the result of a rigged election should such a thing ever happen.

    1. I’m ready to start.
      #FightBack

      Be afraid, Boehm.
      Be very afraid.

      1. Well, Nardz, you know where their offices are…

        What an abyss of shit, this nation lurches towards.

        1. I quit working at shoprite and now I make $65-85 per/h. How? I’m working online! My work didn’t exactly make me happy so I decided to take a chance on something new…OUj after 4 years it was so hard to quit my day job but now I couldn’t be happier.

          Here’s what I do…>> Click here

      2. Articles like this are necessary laying the groundwork and “legitimacy” for the coming coup by the establishment left and the clerisy should Trump win.

        Boehm is joining the coup plotters with this incredibly dishonest, mendacious garbage article.
        He’s just leapfrogged Shikha and Suderman to become the most anti-libertarian Reason writer.

      3. People need to make sure to flag this comment. I don’t know how to throw a red flag on this guy but I hope someone at Reason sees this and contacts authorities.

        1. Oh fuck off.

          If that makes you pee a little, don’t stick around here for Buttplug, Misek and Kirkland’s lefty rants or when Sqrlsy gets mad at Tulpa.

          1. Nardz has slowly descended into a violence fantasizing nut job. It’s what happens when you have no life in the real world and reality exists in a website chat room. And you and the other 24/7 doom posters around here have helped curate that.
            I say to you – Get a life loser. Go get a girlfriend, a job, and get out of your mom’s basement and gain some real world perspective instead of committing intellectual incest with your cabal of like-minded Incels around here.

            1. I’m pretty sure it’s the man in the mirror you should be addressing your huffy little rant to.

              1. True. I spend too much time here. I used to come here to learn and gain perspective from thoughtful people with differing political perspectives. Most of them have left and now it’s just a cabal of angry right-wing shit posters sniffing their own farts and shouting down dissent. People who have no idea how much they resemble the leftists they hate.

                  1. Fuck off, Sqrlsy.

                1. Fuck you, piece of shit.
                  How libertarian to call for tattling on the thoughtcrime of quoting Geena Davis.
                  Can’t talk about things that make bitch ass eric uncomfortable, though.
                  Heil marxism!

                  Oh, btw, you and Reason continuously covering for violence that’s happening right now?
                  No biggie, I guess.

                  1. Just to fully inform readers here, especially NEW readers…

                    Nadless Nardzi the Nasty NAZI is a Holocaust denier just like Rob Misek! (Another evil asshole who posts here). Two peas in a pod, Nadless Nardzi the Nasty NAZI and Rob Misek are!

                    Does Nadless Nardzi the Nasty NAZI deny what the NAZIs did? As Misek does? Perhaps not, I do not know HOW far Nadless’s evil goes! It might strut in front of a mirror wearing NAZI gear for all I know!

                    What I DO know is that Nadless Nardzi the Nasty NAZI ignores the roots of NAZI, and other, evil, mass-murdering authoritarianism! Nadless Nardzi the Nasty NAZI, like Hitler and the NAZIs and other evil authoritarians, starts out by assuming that Nadless Nardzi the Nasty NAZI knows whose life is worthy, and whose is not! Then Nadless Nardzi the Nasty NAZI moves on to sterilization and killing! It all starts out by denying the value of other human lives! And if Nadless Nardzi the Nasty NAZI (and fellow NAZIs) can’t or won’t see and acknowledge that, Nadless Nardzi the Nasty NAZI is a deluded and EVIL Holocaust denier, same as Rob Misek!

                    Nadless Nardzi the Nasty NAZI and its fuckbuddy, Shitsy Shitler, also run around telling people to commit suicide! Even vaguely decent people don’t say things like that! Nor even THOUGHT about saying that to people! Nadless Nardzi the Nasty NAZI is FUBAR (Fucked Up Beyond Repair). But if YOU, Dear Reader, are much like Nadless Nardzi the Nasty NAZI , then take stock of your SERIOUSLY FUCKED UP SOUL, Evil One Junior! Start by reading this: M. Scott Peck, the Hope for Healing Human Evil, https://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0684848597/reasonmagazinea-20/

                    1. Fuck off, Sqrlsy.

                    2. Sqrlsy with the straight up lie.
                      I’ve never denied the holocaust and I’ve rebutted Misek’s attempts to do so.
                      I am clearly not a Nazi, and if anyone hear wouldve volunteered to be a guard, then accept a position as janitor, at Auschwitz it’d be sqrlsy.
                      You’re an awful person.

                    3. The below is demonstrably true from Nadless’s past posts:

                      What I DO know is that Nadless Nardzi the Nasty NAZI ignores the roots of NAZI, and other, evil, mass-murdering authoritarianism! Nadless Nardzi the Nasty NAZI, like Hitler and the NAZIs and other evil authoritarians, starts out by assuming that Nadless Nardzi the Nasty NAZI knows whose life is worthy, and whose is not!

                      DENY for us, Nadless, that you have posted about whose lives are worth living (and whose are not)! DENY for us that THIS kind of thinking is precisely at the roots of the Holocaust, and other genocides! DENY for us, that you have urged others on to suicide!

      4. Hahahahah holy fuck you’re such a loser

        1. That’s all you’ve got?
          Lol

          1. The Lefties don’t have much since they are so sad about trump being reelected and Republicans still controlling the US Senate.

    2. The problem with Trump is the standard by which he defines a “rigged electon” and the fact that he and other Republicans are actively preventing mitigation of the problems that might arise from so many mail in ballots.
      And I hope you realize, unlike Trump, that sending out ballots to all the registered voters is not rigging the election. Registering to vote is an affirmative action indicating a desire to participate in the election so it’s perfectly reasonable to send ballots to the registered voters. A few states like Colorado have already been doing this for a decade and it works out. And you know this “concern” about counting votes is laughable coming Republicans considering that they suppress and disenfranchise voters any chance they can.

      1. Zero proof of suppression or disenfranchisement beyond your biased fever dreams. Everybody who works has some difficulty getting to a polling place. In states that require identification to vote, people still vote. The claims that requiring identification is racially biased are in fact, racially biased, as they propose that ethnic minorities are less able to acquire identification. There are very few people in this society with no form of identification, but this flies in the face of the narrative. Shared in-group ‘knowledge’ is not the same thing as facts

      2. The problem here is your idiocy, dishonesty and TDS.
        Fuck off and die.

      3. Pay attention White Knight. This is how you white knight.

    3. The absolute chutzpah to ask Trump to pledge that his supporters won’t be violent, when left-wing mobs have been burning down chunks of a half-dozen American cities these last few months. Chris Wallace, and the rest of his gaslighting brethren, had better fall to their knees and pray that Trump + supporters don’t ever actually become the Fascists he seems to think they are.

      1. Yeh.

        And Proud Boys. What a joke Biden is.

        Go drink your egg nog.

    4. “When have Republicans ever engaged in rioting and civil unrest on election night or any time?”

      Let’s rephrase the question: WHEN have far-right nut-jobs ever responded to clearly dangerous LIES, with ridiculous levels of totally unjustified violence?

      Answer: Pizzagate! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pizzagate_conspiracy_theory

      1. HERE are the lies being told NOW, to right-wing nut-jobs, in hopes of stirring up “Pizza-Gate Part II”!

        https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/24/politics/trump-election-warnings-leaving-office/index.html
        A list of the times Trump has said he won’t accept the election results or leave office if he loses

        Essential heart and core of the LIE by Trump: “ANY election results not confirming MEEE as Your Emperor, MUST be fraudulent!”

        September 13 rally: “The Democrats are trying to rig this election because that’s the only way they’re going to win,” he said.

        1. Fuck off, Sqrlsy.

      2. 4chan isn’t Republicans you gibbering nut, and Pizzagate turned out to be basically true when Epstien was arrested.

        1. Epstein was a regular at this Pizza Joint? Or the Pizza Joint management (or employees) helped him gather up sex slaves? Citation please!

          Otherwise, your argument is “Epstein abused sex slaves, so PizzaGate was justified, because Epstein is proof that humans can abuse sex slaves, and the management of Pizza Joint were humans”!

          Using your logic: “Donald Trump is just like Adolf Hitler, because both of them breathed air!”

          1. I’m not sure if you’re playing dumb or if you honestly can’t make the mental connection between a 4chan conspiracy theory about a service catering to rich, elite pedophiles, and the Epstein scandal.

            1. Admit that I utterly SMASHED your stupid “arguments”, you arrogant moron! Being stupid is common and easily forgiven, but you combine your stupid with arrogance, and that is NOT so easily forgiven!

              1. Delicious Sqrls tears of impotence.

                1. Epstein was a regular at this Pizza Joint? Or the Pizza Joint management (or employees) helped him gather up sex slaves? Citation please!

                  1. The substance of the conspiracy theory was true, retard. Not some bullshit about a pizza place.

                    Or do you think the Epstein story is a hoax?

                  2. Look, blithering idiot and-or colossally arrogant one, my point is that right-wing nut-jobs CAN, and HAVE, committed violence against INNOCENT PEOPLE based on LIES! So sexual slavery is REAL, then… Does that mean it is OK for said nut jobs to come over to your place, and try to shoot and kill YOU? THAT is a literally MONSTROUS leap of “logic”!

                    1. Who killed anyone, Sqrls?

                    2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pizzagate_conspiracy_theory

                      On December 4, 2016, Edgar Maddison Welch, a 28-year-old man from Salisbury, North Carolina, arrived at Comet Ping Pong and fired three shots from an AR-15-style rifle that struck the restaurant’s walls, a desk, and a door.[43][44][45] Welch later told police that he had planned to “self-investigate” the conspiracy theory.[46] Welch saw himself as the potential hero of the story—a rescuer of children.[47]

                      So lie-believers can shoot bullets all around you, and so long as they miss, you’re OK with it?

                      Good to know!

                    3. If he were following Antifa/BLM standard operating principles, he’d have just set the joint on fire.

                      He was an idiot, and got what he deserved, but he didn’t kill anybody, and the property damage was quite minor. Not like trapping people in a building and setting fire to it, an Antifa favorite at this point.

                    4. i followed it… dont see why you had a problem with it

                    5. Fuck off, Sqrlsy.

                  3. Poor Sqrlsy.

                    The owner of Comet Pizza did a documentary and admitted that famous people and DC powerful eat regularly at Comet Pizza.

                    1. And so then it logically follows that all famous people and DC powerful people are sex-slave-abusers, and so deserve to have bullets shot all around them! THIS is the logic that encourages Der TrumpfenFuhrer to enlist Brown Shirts to stand back and stand by, until they are called upon (or call themselves up) to violently smash all the Marxists! And if you are NOT a Trump supporter, you are a MARXIST!

                    2. Fuck off, Sqrlsy.

        2. My God this place is even more fucking crazy than usual lately. I find it hard to believe the Russians would invest in a quaint little backwater like the Reason message boards.

          1. And why not? After all, you’re proof that Media Matters is.

    5. I would say that he’s not wanting it to become a chaotic mess. Trump is acknowledging that it is already a chaotic mess. We have multiple people arrested for voting fraud in the primaries, Veritas releasing video evidence of ballot fraud that the media is still claiming is mythological, and multiple groups promising even worse riots if Trump is re-elected.

      It’s like the authors of today’s pieces live in another reality.

    6. You are so full of Sean Hannity’s pork belches you are becoming unreadable. Stop being such a goddamn mark, John.

    7. As to Pizzagate, Edgar Maddison Welch was sentenced to 4 years in prison for brandishing a weapon and is expected to be out soon.

      They Lefties made this guy out to be a mass murderer. He never shot anyone even though he could have.

      He will be out just in time for Lefties to kick off more violence following Trump’s reelection and Civil war 2.0 turning bad for Lefties.

    8. “Trump refusing to say he will accept the result of a rigged election should such a thing ever happen” — he’s refusing to say he’ll accept anyone but his own determination of whether the election was rigged. Do you see the problem with that?

    9. That’s what I said in ‘016 – I don’t know what Trump will do, I know absolutely what everyone else will do.
      I don’t like nor want what everyone else will do.

      I still don’t want what everyone else will do.

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  2. Trump was correct to reject the premise because it was a false premise. Trump’s base is not rioting in the streets and threatening to “burn it all down” if they do not get their way.

    Wallace pitched out a loaded question that made no sense given the chaos we have all witnessed over the past several months. The political violence, and threats of violence — for all intents and purposes — are coming almost exclusively from Democrats and their supporters.

    1. Will you stop beating your wife?

      1. Spousal abuse is just an idea, man.

      2. “Some women like violent sex.”—Frank Zappa

    2. Funny how you forgot about the racist Trump supporter, but I repeat myself, who murdered all those people in Walmart before the midterm elections. Or the dozens of Trump supporters who drove vehicles into crowds.

      1. Again, zero proof. Not dozens, this is a lie. Several.

      2. Do you understand that responses to answers and/or comments should at least be tangentially related to the answers and/or comments?

        1. My bad that was meant for John

      3. “dozens”
        started lying early today i see

        why not just go while hog what’s with the weak ass lies be a real Goebbels and have some conviction

      4. I’m more concerned about the millions of people who are mass murderers in the Democratic party

      5. “racist Trump supporter”

        Tell us again why minorities have no personal agency of their own, Strozele.

        1. Do you think Trump has no racist supporters?

          1. I think that critical race theory, which now informs leftist thinking, including yours, in essentially the Scientific Racism of the 30’s, version 2.0 and just as bigoted and dangerous.

            Any racism to the right of you, is like a sweatdrop compared to the Pacific. You may try to present yourselves as anti-fascist and anti-racist, but this is merely a way of defending your class interests.

            1. Lol you are such an IDW cultist cuck.

              1. Tony would know about being a Cuck. He is one of the biggest cucks around.

                1. Can you really call him a cuck if most of his romantic experiences occur in park washrooms?

              2. Wow. Solid rebuttal, Tony.

          2. Yeah, of course Trump has racist supporters. Just like Biden has racist supporters. In the same vein, those that voted for Hillary because of her genitalia are sexists. Obama received an untold number of votes because he’s half black. Don’t fall into the narrative that only Trump has racist supporters or that only Republicans are racists or that only white people can be racist. The racial problems are much deeper than that.

            1. But it doesn’t need to be so complicated since he openly courts white supremacists and they follow him like he’s their leader.

              1. His outreach to black people proves it

  3. Tuesday’s Debate Demonstrated That Donald Trump Wants This Election To Become a Chaotic Mess

    That’s one interpretation and the one you ran with. The other interpretation is that believes it WILL be a chaotic mess, regardless, and he’s very concerned about it.

    1. That’s the way it seemed to me. And if I’m not mistaken he used similar rhetoric in 2016, yet there weren’t bands of red hats prowling the streets on Election Day or there after.

      1. I’m trying to think of all the times I’ve ever seen people who are right, or at least identify as right-wing, actually riot. Maybe count Charlottesville, maybe count a few occasions of Patriot Prayer/Proud Boys. We can talk about the Bundy family but that was structured and orderly, not a riot.

        In short, the number of right wing riots I can recall from the past decade can be counted on my fingers, because they tend to embrace law and order.

        The riots we’ve seen this year alone are generally left wing in origin, or embracing left wing ideals in leftist strongholds, dwarf that by far.

        1. I’m open to having my mind changed if people can point out the right-wing rioters. I’ll wait on examples. Generally, though, even the scumbag neonazis like Richard Spencer are trying to play the victim and provoke people into punching them.

          1. Neo nazis are socialists. Left wingers.

            Its socialists fighting socialists. Just like in 1930s germany. Commies are there too…running the MSM.

            1. There’s big differences between the Nazis and today’s socialists though.
              You see, the Nazis hated the Jew, but the socialists hate Israel. It’s completely different.

              1. Today’s socialists. Which is interesting when you look at who founded Israel originally. There is nothing more socialist than a kibbutz and many of the founders were socialists. The Labor party was very socialist.

            2. Just like in 1930s germany.

              More like 1920s Germany. Hitler was never a fan of the SA, and as he consolidated power and got control of the regular army, he diminished their role and, in some cases, actually had them killed.

            3. The problem with your definition of the left-right continuum LC is that almost nobody uses it. What you’re really describing is the Y axis of the Nolan chart.

          2. The Tulsa massacre in 1921 could be an example. But it was a long time ago. Lately right-wingers generally stick to acts of individual violence and coercion. Tim McVei, the Mosque Shooter, El Paso, etc.

            1. Tulsa in the 20’s was heavily Democrat.

              1. It was a reaction to progressive societal changes.
                In those days there were conservative Democrats and liberal Republicans. In the south there were what was called Yellow-Dog Democrats that couldn’t forgive the Republicans for freeing the slaves. They are pretty much ALL Republicans now after the 60’s party realignment.

                1. Today’s left (and Democrats) are as authoritarian and reactionary as they were in the 20’s. There is no progress in progressive ideology thanks to their embrace of critical theory in regards to race and gender, and the rejection of hard science for scientism and Gaia worship.

                  As the 60’s party realignment nonsense;
                  One.
                  One southern Democrat switched parties.
                  The rest, including those who filibustered the ’64 CRA, stayed Democrats until they were out of office. Most remained Democrats until they died. There was no switch. The record of who was in Congress proves that.
                  This is a lie perpetrated by Democrats, the party of slavery, of Jim Crow, of the Black Codes, of the KKK, of segregation, of thousands of Confederate monuments placed to intimidate black people. The party of redlining, of destroying the black family, of creating ghettoes.

                  1. Wow. This post is the very definition of a post-factual argument.

                    1. How so?
                      Don’t dodge this, weasel.
                      What specific did I give that wasn’t an historical fact?

                    2. Are the Democrats still the majority party in the south? My Facts: No
                      Your Facts: Yes

                      No point in discussing. We consume different facts. Elections have consequences.

                    3. SoMeOne rEd FlAg tHis guY!!!

                    4. Are the Democrats still the majority party in the south?
                      So now you’re trying to infer the South in the 21st century is exactly the same as the South a hundred years ago when the DNC ran the show?

                      No point in discussing
                      I said I’m not going to let you dodge this, weasel.
                      What specific did I give that wasn’t an historical fact?

              2. You are so fucking stupid.

                1. It’s true, you know it’s true, and you’re furious because it shits on your lie.

                  Have you ever considered not being evil Tony?

                  1. You can’t tell the difference between a southern Democrat in the 1920s and Joe Biden. You are fucking stupid and you should read a book before you speak again.

                    1. Joe Biden belongs to the Party of slavery.

                      Yup, same Party that started the Civil War 1.0 with one of their reasons being protecting slavery.

                    2. “Well, I tell you what, if you have a problem figuring out whether you’re for me or Trump, then you ain’t black.”
                      “You got the first mainstream African American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy. I mean, that’s a storybook, man.”
                      “Unlike the African-American community, with notable exceptions, the Latino community is an incredibly diverse community with incredibly diverse attitudes about different things.”
                      “In Delaware, the largest growth in population is Indian-Americans moving from India. You cannot go to a 7-Eleven or a Dunkin’ Donuts unless you have a slight Indian accent.”
                      – Joe Biden

                      If Trump had said any of this racist shit you’d be screaming for blood, you mendacious poseur.

        2. There were not any riots in Charlottesville until Antifa showed up. The dingbats were just marching around not bothering anyone. The violence started when Antifa showed up and started attacking people.

          1. I think that’s disingenuous. The worst of that group got there a day early and were happy to walk around the night before looking for people to start fights with.

            It’s okay to point out that there were nazi scumbags at Charlottesville, because there were. It doesn’t make the counterproductive into good guys. Nazis and commies fight, and that doesn’t mean either side are good guys.

            1. Nazis are leftwing.

              Socialists fighting socialists.

              1. Yes, but they run with conservatives in the USA.

                1. Yes, but they run with conservatives in the USA.

                  Richard Spencer, one of the nazi architects of Charlottesville, has endorsed Biden. Prior to that he was a Bernie supporter.

                  While he tried to ride Hitler memes to some sort of relevance when Trump supporters used them, his politics are quite leftist, as are the politics of all who wave the socialist banner, be they nationalistic or internationalistic.

                  1. Most white separatist groups are unabashedly socialist in their economic platforms. It’s right there on their web sites and in their literature.

                2. “Yes, but they run with conservatives in the USA.”

                  Your cite to support your bullshit is missing.

                  1. Look at the photos from the Unite the Right ‘rally’ in Charlottesville. Plenty of swastikas mixed in. Trump was correct that there were ‘good people’ in the group as well, simply protesting statue removal.

                    But there is NO DOUBT the Nazis invite themselves to conservative events. I am not saying there is sympathy for them, only that they arrive on occasion.

                    1. Why do you think progressives have the idea that conservatives are racists, fascists, violent? Conservatives are not vigilant about clearly expelling the Nazis and white supremacists. Too tolerant of them.

                    2. Trump should be selling red hats with “Black JOBS matter!!”

                    3. Trump commercial:

                      Repeated short clips of Biden saying “Barack Obama”, each one slightly higher pitched and faster. And then Trump, staring into the camera, deadpanning : Haven’t we had enough?”

            2. I think that’s disingenuous. The worst of that group got there a day early and were happy to walk around the night before looking for people to start fights with.

              The night before was that weird torch parade. Also structured and orderly.

              Much as I despise so many of them for ruining something that could have been a real statement, there would have been zero violence if antifa had not shown up and staged an unpermitted counter demonstration.

              To deny this is insane.

          2. There weren’t even any riots in Charlottesville until the police deliberately channeled the two sides together. Charlottesville never wanted to issue that parade permit, they were forced to by a court.

            So they engineered a riot to have an excuse for revoking it. That’s the awful truth.

            1. +100000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

        3. If they are Nazis…they are Lefties. Socialists.
          Neo-Nazis…Socialists.

          Right wing people dont riot. They peacefully protest…rarely.

          Conservative literally is defined by change only accepted when supported by the majority. Resistant to change. Revolutions are conducted by minorities. Even our revolutionary war was fought by a tiny minority of Americans.

          1. I know that actual Nazis are socialists. I don’t know if neonazis are actually socialists, and they say they’re rightwing with their “unite the right” shit.

            I’m saying that even if you give me those assholes as rightwingers, I’m still struggling to find anything close to matching left wing violence.

            1. If Gab is any indicator, neo-Nazis are adamant socialists that want all of the absurd “benefits” of forced redistribution, but for the limited purpose of benefiting the white race.

              1. Do you know what socialism is?

                1. Ask your social studies teacher to explain it to you.

                  1. I want one of you people to explain it to me.

                    Also explain why the Nazis built their first concentration camp for them if they agreed with them so much.

                    1. Your citations fall off Tony

                      Heres a citation from Nazi propaganda about how they are Socialists.
                      Those Damned Nazis by Joseph Goebbels

                      Socialists that fought National Socialists rise to power and are a continued threat were placed in concentration camps. Socialists had a choice and concentration camp if you chose wrong.

                    2. Sounds like a real love affair.

            2. Neonazis are simply americanized nazis. They want socialist rule over the economy and government like nazis do. Its racial too.

              Same way neo conservatives are socialist authoritarians.

              Socialists always bounce between terms to hide their identity because the truth that socialists killed over 100million humans in the 20th century doesnt poll well.

              1. You’re saying neonazis are happy with the “Nazi” branding, but they decided “Socialist” doesn’t play well? Seems like they’d try to get away from both terms if they’re trying to paint themselves in a good light.

                1. Indeed, they are quite comfortable being called Nazis. People that genuinely believe in Nazism are not the type of people that dissuaded by branding or how they are perceived by the general public.

                  I do not understand the notion, nor have I seen evidence to support it, that Nazis group are dedicated to tricking people into joining their ranks.

                2. Some of these guys tattoo swasticas or SS runes on their bodies. I would absolutely say they okay with being nazis.

                  1. Fun fact: there is a certain ice crwam place in atlanta where the servers used to hand you and ice cream cone and you would witness nazi camp numbering first hand.

                  2. You’re the one who told me they were trying to hide their politics.

                    1. Some Nazis are and some are not trying to hide.

                      Its like Muslim fanatics. Some wear beards and robes. Some are allowed to live with Capitalists, shave, and fuck men.

                      Tyrants have different strategies for destroying us freedom loving Americans.

            3. There is practically no left wing violence in this country, and a good two-thirds of the political violence is right wing, and these are facts from Trump’s own FBI. You people need to stop talking about things you know nothing about.

              FOX News playing the same video footage from some burning car in Yemen on a loop is not evidence of a surge in left wing violence in America.

              Please, make them work for their propaganda. Don’t just be the laziest asshole on the planet and swallow every lame ass bit of it like gospel.

              1. Tony has obviously been in coma for last few months.

                1. See something on Facebook did you?

                  1. He probably saw it on CNN, actually.

                    1. Right here I see libertarians talking of people protesting violent government abuse and then taking the side of the government.

              2. why does this strike me as gaslighting?

                1. It’s the audacity of the lies. Your being told that something you can see with your own eyes isn’t there.

                  1. Those burning cars from some shithole in Africa are real videos. They just aren’t videos of things happening in Oregon.

        4. the riots in Charlottesville were started by Antifa every march prior to antifa being there were peacefull.
          Same deal with the proud boy they have a right to march but Antifa always starts the violence

    2. It’s hard to believe he is concerned about it, since all he does is post divisive tweets about it. He is President, he could have done things to help, such as taking action to ensure that the Post Office is ready to handle all the mail-in ballots.

      1. He has offered to go to Portland and stop the violence with federal forces numerous times and been told no. He did send federal forces to Wisconsin and the riots stopped immediately.

        The only reason there are riots and violence anywhere is because Democratic mayors and governors allow them to occur.

        1. Wasn’t the topic voting and the election?

            1. “That’s one interpretation and the one you ran with. The other interpretation is that believes it WILL be a chaotic mess, regardless, and he’s very concerned about it.”

              1. OMFG White Gripe how are you whining at me for answering your question JFC…

              2. So Tulpa was right, because that quote proves clearly he was talking NOT about the election but about perapective.

                God you’re fucking stupid.

                1. *perspective

                2. “…God you’re fucking stupid.”

                  Not sure if that’s the cause or the effect of TDS. Regardless, WK has stupid in spades.

          1. No, it was Kaos, Siegfried

          2. Haha you’re being stupid again!

        2. You’re trying to sell using the federal government to round up protesters en masse and unfortunately that’s going to sell more on this libertarian site than the libertarian position would.

      2. Poor biden got called that out that a presidential term is 4 years not 3 years.

        Amy barrett will be confirmed.

        1. I know you think you posted some kind of gotcha, but I’m not a Democrat or a liberal. I happen to agree that Trump and the Republicans have the right to appoint Coney Barrett. I agree with Trump said, that he was elected for a four-year term.

          1. Youre a white knight.you are apolitical like nazis are not socialists.

            I look forward to Trump replacing Breyer and thomas in his second term.

            I called RBG selfish demise in office and breyer will have the same fate. These selfish politicians always think they are irreplaceable.

            1. Yawn. I know you think you posted some kind of gotcha…

              1. Poor Lefty. The gotcha is in every lie you post.

              2. Wow he flat shut you the fuck up I didn’t think that was possible

                1. Haven’t shut up.

                  1. Slapping you so hard that all you can muster is a lame repetition of a point he destroyed is yes, shutting you the fuck up.

                    And you know it, which is why you relied.

                  2. Haha Dee, he made you shut the fuck up!

                    You’ve become a bigger joke than the squirrel and the dildo.

                  3. “Haven’t shut up.”

                    You should; you’re hole is not getting shallower.

                  4. Haven’t shut up.

      3. “He is President, he could have done things to help, such as taking action to ensure that the Post Office is ready to handle all the mail-in ballots.”

        Like what, exactly?

        1. Well, he could have insisted that states not be sending out unsolicited ballots, that in-person voting should be the default position and ballots should only be mailed out to people who specifically requested them.

          1. Trump does not have control over states sending out unsolicited ballots.

            1. He’s alternately attacked for being a dictator, and for failing to do things only a dictator could do.

            2. Exactly. In Michigan, the Democrat governor and democrat Secretary of State are going all out to push mail-in voting. I e received three different applications to do it, get phone calls almost every day encouraging it, and the TV is filled with commercials to vote by mail. Nothing Trump says or does would change this.

              1. Lefties are going to be mighty surprised when most of those mail in ballots are for Trump.

          2. Crazy talk, Jerryskids. Don’t you know there’s a virus going around? Why do you hate grandma?

            As usual, you’re right. When both sides mistrust each other to the extent that both are willing to believe a defeat will be illegitimate due to fraud, and that said illegitimate defeat will lead to great social unrest, it seems imperative for this election that everything possible be done to assure voting integrity. And yet, this election instead is trying out methods tailor-made for committing fraud.

            It’s like the powers that be want this country to tear itself apart.

            1. It’s only one side here that’s trying out those methods, you may have noticed. The other side keeps saying, “Just enforce the laws already on the books, and conduct a normal election.”

              And, yes, they actively want this election to be a dumpster fire, so that no matter how it turns out, they can claim to have won, and not be obviously wrong. As well as blow off any fraud they get caught at as just a screwup.

              1. But leftist totalitarianism totes isn’t realistic!

        2. He likes issuing executive orders. He could have issued one instructing the Post Office to prioritize correct handling of mail-in ballots, as a judge ended up doing five days ago, perhaps provide special funding for that specific purpose.

          Bigger point is he hasn’t even tried. He hasn’t even tried to calm the situation with words. In fact, he has used it to stir up fear and divisiveness.

          1. “…Bigger point is he hasn’t even tried…”

            No, the bigger point is regardless of what he did or didn’t do, brain-dead TDS shits like you would scream bloody murder.
            As you constantly do.

            1. All she does is cry and lie.

        3. “Like what, exactly?”

          Stuff.
          And when he did, WK would accuse him of interfering!

      4. The post office is indeed ready to handle the mail-in ballots. They handle many multiples of that amount of mail routinely.

        So why did that become a talking point?

        Did you ever bother to consider why that was being pushed throughout the media for a few weeks? I mean, they really pushed it hard, and it was a silly thing to allege. Why?

        Well, if you are not planning to have the need for a bunch of ballots to suddenly show up a week or two late and have a court battle over whether this truckload of ballots that are not postmarked should be counted…. you probably wouldn’t.

        1. I’m amazed at the denial going on among so many here, even some who are otherwise sensible.
          The left is totalitarian. They tell us this.
          They plan on massive vote fraud. They tell us this.
          What do yall think happens after the totalitarians steal an election and seize power?
          No biggie?

          This is a HUGE fucking deal.
          Why so calm?
          What the fuck are we going to do if no-shit Bolshevik’s seize power?
          Why the hell don’t yall have more urgency?
          Do you think your “both sides” faith will save you? Will it save your children?

          I’m guessing a lot of you don’t understand that worst case scenario is a hell of a lot worse than you’d like to believe, because you don’t want to believe it.

          1. Civil war 2.0 that democrats started..again.

          2. “What do yall think happens after the totalitarians steal an election and seize power?
            No biggie.”

            Admittedly, nothing happened after the Gregoire or the Franken elections. Like you, I think things have changed now. I think we may see the Second Amendment put into action if this Election gets tainted with ridiculous cases of obvious fraud. I find the idea absolutely horrifying.

            1. They’ve shown a willingness, verging on eagerness, to destroy tens of millions of people’s lives with fear mongering and lockdowns, just so they can blame people’s conditions on Trump as an electoral strategy.
              They’ve combined with that months of coordinated mob violence and threats to “burn it all down” if their demands for absolute power aren’t submitted to.
              But here we are, bitching about fantasies of white supremacists and Trump’s unconventional style.
              It’s total determination to learn nothing from Nazi Germany, the Bolshevik Revolution, Mao’s cultural revolution, and most recently Maduro’s Venezuela and the color revolutions of the Mideast and Eastern Europe.

          3. When did “the left” say they were going to engage in massive voter fraud? I’ll wait.

            1. When they announced that Trump is going to win on election day, but they won’t concede until after they come up with enough votes to reverse the decision.

              1. Maybe this is your first election?

                1. We’re worried about it being our last

          1. https://www.snopes.com/news/2020/09/29/project-veritas-ilhan-omar/

            Always check on Project Veritas because almost everything they do is a lie.

            1. Snopes? You are an idiot.

        2. It became a talking point because Trump kept going on Twitter and stirring up the specter of the mail-in ballots not being handled correctly (by his own administration’s Post Office).

          Except, for some unexplained reason, he encouraged voters to vote by mail in Florida, because the mail is different there somehow.

          1. stirring up the specter of the mail-in ballots not being handled correctly

            Calling the public’s attention to the enormous potential for voter fraud with mail-in ballots and encouraging them to vote in person, is encouraging fraud? Okay…

            1. There is no such potential. So he’s lying and stirring up mistrust in an election he’s losing. Why do you refuse to see what’s going on in front of your face? Is it unreasonable to think Donald fucking Trump might be a corrupt lying asshole?

              1. Compared to the dishonesty you’ve continually demonstrated here Tony, Trump is a freaking saint.

                1. I think you’re going to be really ashamed of yourself if you ever get out of the rightwing echo chamber.

                  1. Poor tony.

              2. The Russian bot going all in.

      5. White knight, here to piss on everyone’s leg and tell them it’s raining.

        1. She’s a squawking bird named Dee.

          1. That darned bird keeps squawking over our beautiful echo.

          2. I was wondering if White Knight is a Reason Staffer. They seem far more invested in defending the Reasonistas honour than most of the lefties here.

            1. She’s too dumb to be…wait, never mind.

      6. ‘All,’ that’s some decent, dishonest passive-aggressive concern-trolling. What should POTUS do that does not trample on state’s rights? Your point about USPO is demonstrates a basic ignorance of how little control over federal organizations he has, and how slowly they change.

        1. “how little control over federal organizations he has”

          Oh, right. The Trump is a victim (of the branch of government he is in charge of) trope, again.

          1. “how little control over federal organizations he has”
            “Oh, right. The Trump is a victim (of the branch of government he is in charge of) trope, again.”

            Do you ever post without some gratuitous dishonesty tossed in? Even for a truly fucked-up TDS victim, you are a pathetic excuse for a human.
            Hint, asshole, not being an emperor =/= being a victim.
            Fuck off and die.

        2. For a guy who has so little control over the executive branch of the government he sure issues a lot of executive orders, and does an awful lot of victory laps celebrating those orders before they are carried out.

          1. For guy who is full of shit, you sure post a lot of nonsense.

  4. One side refused to say he would tell people to stay calm. The other side has been burning, looting, and murdering for months now.

    Or, to rephrase that: one side refused to say he would stop beating his wife. The other side has been beating entire neighborhoods for months.

      1. No it isn’t. If they asked Trump if he’d tell his supporters to stay calm, that means his supporters are currently calm. You can’t stay calm if you aren’t already calm. So the “stop beating your wife” analogy doesn’t hold. It would be like asking if you would continue to not beat your wife.

    1. Fox News is not reality dude. Stop being such an easy mark. It’s embarrassing.

  5. Poor boehm. Such a liar.

    Tru,p pointed out democrat voted fraud.

    Boehm and his propagandist hacks choose to destroy America. Fuck you traitors.

    1. Btw Boehm, learn history.

      They always come for the Commie sympathizers like you first. Luckily Trump will be reelected and the commies wont have the power to come after propagandists like you.

  6. Good lord, that’s a stupid take. I mean, you have to be an absolute nincompoop to have that take… unless you are engaged in partisan motivated reasoning, that is.

    We have had months of politically motivated violence by the left, specifically authorized and promoted by Democrat politicians and prosecutors. Politically motivated violence that not one single national democrat has even given full acknowledgement. And they certainly have not lifted their voices to try to stop it.

    And no… Biden saying that “there is no place for violence” while specifically condemning Trump supporters does not even remotely count.

    And out of that, your important moment is that when some DNC think tank invents the notion that it would be a good idea to put Trump on the defensive by having him pre-concede the election, Trump is the problem if he doesn’t take the bait and condemn his supporters for rioting (that has not happened) in response to a Biden landslide (that has not happened).

    Good lord, have you no shame? Who the hell could pen that nonsense?

    That’s something that Tony would write.

    1. https://www.csis.org/analysis/escalating-terrorism-problem-united-states

      Also there’s the 200,000 dead from covid. But Trump’s not a terrorist because nobody runs burning car videos from Mogadishu on a loop on FOX News about it.

  7. BTW, the DNC clearly does not believe your conclusions about the nature of election by mail… whatever they might say in public. They are pushing hard in court and in the governors mansions to ensure that unsolicited ballots are sent to everyone – eligible voter or not.

    And they are also fighting hard in court to ensure that “every ballot counts”…. .even ballots that are not postmarked at all and show up days or weeks after the election…

    And we also have DNC think tanks warning us that “the election may appear to be a Trump landslide on election night.. but as mail in returns are counted, eventually it will be a Biden landslide”. Now, that’s pretty close to an admission, even without the other stuff.

    Finally, we don’t have to rely on our suppositions about democrat ballot harvesting…. Project Veritas went and got videotape on exactly such a scheme in Minnesota.

    But sure, dismiss all of that and pretend that there is no reason at all to suspect that the democrats have something in mind for mail in elections.

    1. In short, they may in fact *not* be up to something.. .but they certainly are acting like they at least believe that they are up to something.

    2. They’ve been pretty blatant about the coming coup, and are relying heavily on their media allies (like Boehm) to provide cover.

      From my perch here in the frozen north I can only wish you all the best in your coming civil war.

        1. Canada, you might not have heard about it. It’s not in Chelsea or the East Village.

    3. No they didn’t. You’re lying and being had by rightwing propagandists, as usual. You people are all so fucked. How much public money is it going to take to deprogram you?

      You are not going to accept any legitimate outcome that doesn’t see Trump as the winner. You are the problem with elections in this country.

    4. yeah all this. the left gots to cheat because the ideas suck and nobody likes them.

  8. The Lovely Peacock
    We all know the peacock. These huge proud birds have something to be proud of. Their tail is huge, wide, and full of colors. This is often blue and green but can deviate from this. This is also why they are so famous – that beautiful tail. The tail can be very small, but they are only too happy to show their tail. If they make their tail bigger, the tail is bigger than half the size of the peacock itself! The peacock is also known for having a special eye color. You can find red, gold, blue also other colors. Peacocks are very special and beautiful birds.
    The Peacock; World Most Beautiful 4th Birds, What’s your thought, please.

  9. But Trump’s ultimate goal is not allowing law enforcement to determine the truth about whether those nine ballots were legitimately discarded. He’d much rather use the incident as a wedge to raise questions about the legitimacy of the entire election.

    Haha! It’s somehow evil to use actual vote fraud as a warning of future vote fraud. What a crappy article.

    1. We don’t know that it’s vote fraud. All we know is that ballots were found in the trash and 7 of them were for Trump. The ballots could have been disqualified for a legal reason. In PA, mail in ballots are supposed to be mailed in two envelopes, for privacy and anti-fraud reasons. The PA Supreme Court recently ruled that mail in ballots that come in only one envelope are invalid. Perhaps that’s what happened here. We don’t know yet.

  10. I don’t want either Biden or Trump to be the next president, but I do agree with Trump that it is going to be a huge mess. Both the Republicans and Democrats have demonstrated that they are very willing to push the boundaries of the law and even downright cheat to maintain power.

    The very fact that both the Democrats and Republicans have gamed the system to prevent third party candidate participation from the presidential debates. How the Republicans and Democrats have passed twisted ballot access laws to effectively prevent third parties.

    I get that Eric hates Trump and is always willing to go into attack mode. I also get it and agree that there is plenty to criticize Trump about. I also find it pitiful to simply attack for the sake of attacking.

    If Eric Boehm does not recognize that this election cycle is going to be a $#!& show of an election this is not due to simple ignorance on Eric’s behalf.

  11. Never say never. This is the same as refusing Hillary’s challenge to agree ahead of time to accept the results of the election. Notice how goddamn quickly Hillary changed her mind about accepting the results of the election.

  12. Trump is a whiner. To say he’s a child is dumbing down children. It’s always about conspiracies against him. Did you read all the comments here? Sad to say we know what the Republican base has become, your libertarian base is following In lock step (good analogy there).

    What Trump did was a national disgrace. As Republican strategist Mike Murphy said, he’s created an election that won’t be about issues anymore, but will instead be about norms of behavior. About decorum. Pathetic that our sitting President stokes that daily.

    A cue to the children here…scream away!

    1. What Trump did was a national disgrace. As Republican strategist Mike Murphy said, he’s created an election that won’t be about issues anymore, but will instead be about norms of behavior. About decorum. Pathetic that our sitting President stokes that daily.

      If you’re more focused on style than on substance, that’s on you. Where are you getting the idea that whether or not Trump “acts presidential” is more important than what he actually accomplishes as President? CNN? The NYT? The DNC? Sure, Trump is a gross pig of a human being, a braggart, a narcissist, a blowhard, a conman – but what has he actually done? Has he started WWIII, has he locked black people up in concentration camps, has he assumed dictatorial powers, dissolved Congress, canceled elections? No? He’s just a horribly shitty person, but that’s got nothing to do with what he’s done as President and look where electing “nice guys” has gotten us.

      1. That you think we have to wait for those exact things you mention to have actually happened isn’t a feather in your critical thinking cap. He’s done PLENTY to make us all fearful of those things. Has he locked black people in concentration camps? No. He’s stoked racial unrest throughout the last 4 years (Charlottesville and Prod Boys last night). Assumed dictatorial powers? Nope. But he has mentioned numerous times that serving more than 2 terms would be a good idea. And taking this man on his word is a good idea. Cancelled elections? No, but surely you jest…he’s working overtime to cast doubt about the honesty of any election in which he loses.

        You admit he’s a horrible and a conman. Yes. And when such a person takes part in the things I mentioned, you don’t wait for him to make it worse. You vote him out.

        I’ll leave you with what Republican Stuart Stevens himself said about Trump: “I’ll never question 1930s in Germany again.” Yeah. We all wonder about what happened to the voices of all those good Germans back then. After all, had Hitler started a World War? No. Concentration camps? No. Dissolved the Reichstag? No. Assumed Dictatorial powers? Well, not yet anyway.

        I’ve quoted two people…they’re both fearful Republicans.

        1. “He’s done PLENTY to make us all fearful”

          Being an irrational coward is your problem.

        2. “I’ve quoted two people…they’re both fearful fake Republicans that Trump embarrassed”

          FTFY

          1. Buttplug’s never met a real Republican. They don’t live in his Mom’s basement.

        3. the only people stoking racial unrest is teh left rioting in the cities. Charlottesville and proud boys are a reaction to the lefts riots and destruction of this nation and its history

        4. Yes, like the 1930s. Biden is running on an NSDAP-style platform and ideology, Trump is running against it.

    2. “Jackand Ace
      September.30.2020 at 8:02 am
      Trump is a whiner”

      Irony.

    3. ‘A cue to the children here…scream away!’

      Pot, kettle, black.

    4. “Trump is a whiner…”
      And you’re a dishonest pile of lefty shit.

    5. It’s Biden and the Democrats who are making this election about norms and personality rather than policies.

      Biden has avoided talking about policies as much as possible, and the policies he has announced are absolutely awful.

      1. Didn’t Biden disavow court packing?

        Oh, wait….

  13. Behavior norms like not vote harvesting?

    1. How fucking rude is it for you morons to force others to constantly fact check your rightwing horseshit lies?

  14. ‘But Trump’s ultimate goal is not allowing law enforcement to determine the truth about whether those nine ballots were legitimately discarded.’ Is thinking one can read minds a prerequisite for being wrong? I am not sure orangemanbad knows what his ultimate goal is, so a claim about ‘a wedge to raise questions about the legitimacy of the entire election’ made with absolute conviction is no more than proof of bias.

    1. Mind reading is the core of “progressive” commentary these days. Almost every opinion piece is about what other people are thinking and feeling.

      1. And it’s all just projection

  15. So, what Trump said is true, but he shouldn’t have said it cuz feels?

    1. It’s Boehm.

      1. It’s every B-team article here.

  16. I’m curious to see if Trump gets a mail-in ballot from DC since he resides there or from New York since he didn’t update his voter registration. That’s a point I wish Trump had the discipline to hammer home instead of his usual scatter-shot shit flinging – Biden raised the point of Trump himself engaging in mail-in voting while denigrating it and Trump should have pointed out the difference between solicited ballots and unsolicited ballots and pointed out Biden’s disingenuous in pretending there’s no difference between the two.

    I also wish like hell when Biden raised the question of Trump’s taxes, Trump would have shot back with the question of Biden’s own S Corp formation. Biden did what he could to shelter his own income, it’s not Trump’s fault that Biden wasn’t smart enough to shelter more of it by not taking distributions from the S Corp but instead investing it in real estate where he could take massive deprecation write-offs and then roll the investments into further investments and have unrealized capital gains rather than taxable profits.

    1. There is no difference in the security of solicited vs. unsolicited ballots. Trump is not doing this because he believes what he says. He’s trying to generate doubt in any election he loses. Dictator shit. You people get hysterical at the drop of the hat, at least notice when the least libertarian shit imaginable is happening in front of your goddamn faces.

      1. “There is no difference in the security of solicited vs. unsolicited ballots.”

        I intend to steal ballots to use as I see fit. Much safer to make it a situation where I have to search a lot and hope I get lucky rather than simply finding ballots 100% of the time I check a mailbox.

        And we all know that voter rolls don’t have people who moved, died, etc that would get those ballots. No chance of that at all.

      2. Is life easier for you both gaslighting and creating strawmen so that you don’t have to approached the world with nuance, you can just simply believe the movie storyboard in your head that there is one side that is all bad and that the other side is all good?

        That’s the only way I can explain your comments anymore.

      3. Wow! Just wow, Tony! You’ve outdone yourself with this stupidity.

        The state sends out ballots to all registered voters on Monday. Someone goes up and down the street on Wednesday and steals them all from the mailboxes. That’s unsolicited.

        Solicited ballots are sent as applications are received and checked. There is no way to know when ballots will be sent out, as they all go out on different days. Little chance to intercept.

  17. I made the mistake of watching it.

    Is it just us or is the rest of the world this idiotic?

      1. Yes but it is nice up here on the hill

        I see the sun going down

        And the eyes in my head

        See the world spinning round.

    1. Something about Americans and their confusion of religion, sports, and politics?

  18. Huh.

    Here I thought it was the Democrats laying the ground work for mayhem and a constitutional crisis.

    All I see is Trump mounting some sort of push back.

    1. That’s because you are lacking in critical thinking skills and have been victimized by rightwing propaganda.

  19. I don’t know why everyone is acting so surprised by Trump’s debate performance, this is how he is, and Biden had a vacant look most of the time, not really landing any punches. I am not voting for either, but if I was looking to be enlightened by the debate, I would not have found anything to sway me one way or the other.

    Think we all know the election results will not be known until well into December. If Biden comes out ahead, Trump will challenge, further delaying the transition if there is one. And if Trump is leading, all hell will break loose.

    1. The true results will never be known. The next president will be chosen by the courts and the military.

  20. No Biden should not have said he would wait until it was certified. That will come back to bite. If we have overwhelming indications that Biden won early in November he should claim victory. That would be a data-driven choice. By waiting for certification it allows Trump more time to make up fantasies and change the narrative and sow doubt. Obviously, if it is close and we think waiting for a full 100% count is needed to see who wins he should wait. Biden gave that answer because he doesn’t think people can handle nuance. That’s not good.

    1. “…By waiting for certification it allows Trump more time to make up fantasies and change the narrative and sow doubt…”

      Do you have a fever with your TDS?

    2. Biden says whatever it takes to get elected. He is a habitual liar. “It was a debate” as Harris put it: you can say anything to win.

    3. I remember the debate in 2016 when Trump wouldn’t commit. The people that were up in arms about it were the ones who couldn’t accept the results. #notmypresident

      Then they claimed the election was illegitimate for various reasons, didn’t win the popular vote, or “The Russians” for example.

  21. Why ask Trump about civil unrest its teh left doing all the rioting even teh NAZ’s who marched in Charlotsville were peacefull untill Antifa attacked them

  22. Biden’s brownshirts are burning down our cities and Boehm blames Trump. Seriously?

  23. The goal of the debates is to reach the middle. To get the vast middle to swing towards the candidates. Because diehard Democrats are ALREADY going to vote for Biden, and diehard Republicans are ALREADY going to vote for Trump.

    But you have this vast middle that leans one way or the other or are completely undecided. The campaigning is all about getting their votes on election day. So who should a candidate be targeting? The middle. Don’t preach to the choir, preach to the congregation.

    But… Trump is preaching to the choir. He’s hitting all the buttons for his diehard supporters. Those who are going to vote for him anyway. He’s doing nothing to sway the votes of the middle.

    That strategy worked in 2016, because his opponent did the same thing, by calling literally everyone who wasn’t already her diehard supports, a “basket of deplorables”. She shit on the middle, and so did Trump. So the race was about who wasn’t disgusted enough to actually show up on vote. And too many Democrats were disgusted to bother to show up.

    But this is 2020. One candidate is the incumbent. One candidate has been on watch during these four years. One candidate has been on watch while the shit went down. That candidate needs to sway the middle that he’s their best choice.

    So far Trump has ignored them and focused entirely on signalling to the Hallelujah Choir.

    1. Ok, we’ll give you a chance here.

      Be specific: how is he appealing to his base, and what alternative would be reaching out to “the middle”?

    2. I think saying there is a ‘vast middle that leans one way or the other or are completely undecided’ is ‘decidedly’ overstating how many are actually on the fence. These two parties are so far apart there is no middle ground.

  24. >>>and pledge that neither would declare victory until the results were final.

    fuck you, Wallace.

  25. I’m gonna be paying attention to what FOX News does. Generally on elections they report the straight news. A touch quick to declare victory for Republicans but no big deal.

    Trump won’t be able to declare victory if he’s in a room shouting it to himself. The media are who people look to, and people have seen the media make the wrong call before and are not mindless zombies about it. The vote count is the vote count. So I want to know how far FOX is willing to go. Will there be competing media narratives of the outcome, with FOX declaring late-counted ballots illegitimate or whatever? It’s kind of down to them.

  26. Stay Calm while your opponents steal the election and Carry On

    Yeah, I reject that, too

    1. You only have to worry about that if Trump wins since he’s the only candidate plotting to steal the election.

      He’s 10 points down in the polls. This could easily, legitimately, be a landslide for Biden. Please keep that in mind before you have hysterics.

      1. Sure Tony and Biden will stay in office longer than 6 months.

        Prepare to be disappointed on both counts.

        1. Oh no Biden is old what ever will we do, vote for the healthy young guy he’s running against?

      2. >>He’s 10 points down in the polls. This could easily, legitimately, be a landslide for Biden.

        lol polls. nope.

        1. You people really have no idea how insulated your brains are from facts, huh?

          Yes, polls. The things we use to measure public sentiment. What is your problem with polls? Sigh.

          1. inaccurate because their premise questions are designed to elicit results for demographics I don’t belong to.

            1. But they’re not inaccurate.

              1. maybe until people vote … then they all go sideways and Nate Silver’s all “huh whaddya know?”

  27. If there was ever a time to vote Libertarian this is it. Don’t give either of these absolute losers your vote! Vote Jo

    1. ^ this

      Unfortunately I think a lot of independents are just not going to vote at all.

      1. i dont think there are many independents …
        just people who dont vote and maybe green and libertarian voters..
        what is that , maybe 2+% of the voting public?

        1. Nope. Around 40%.

          Independents outnumber both republicans and democrats.

          https://news.gallup.com/poll/15370/party-affiliation.aspx

    2. Wrong.
      You’re saying that virtue signaling is more important than trying to prevent totalitarian marxism from gaining absolute power.

      Seriously think about it: what happens if the left wins?

  28. What if Trump acted the way he did because he knows that at the next debate he will be much more subdued and Biden will expect what we saw last night. So, when they debate next time Biden will bumble and fumble bigglee! Trump has a way of setting traps for people, some say its like 4D chess…who knows.

    1. Trump has never moved his polling support by any appreciable degree, so he should probably try less chess and more shutting up.

    2. Great sarcastic comment. 3D chess my ass.

  29. Eric, if a nuke is launched and I say “That will likely cause a lot of damage”, it is not me rooting for it to cause a lot of damage.

    You don’t seem clear on the concept of “seeing what is there” and “hoping”.

  30. liz peek on fox had a better take on the debate and trumps performance. basically said he is better at meandering answers and communications as he does at rallies but is not good at cutting down his unstructured thoughts into 2 minute answers.
    He knows what he has accomplished and what he offers but just cant concisely state these things… not in his wheelhouse

  31. Do a google search for no civility until democrats win.

    I tried to post but I had five links so it is awaiting moderation. It including Hillary, Pelosi, Michael Barone and a politico article titled “Civility is for Suckers”.

    Democrats called for no civility until they get their way. It is well documented on the internet.

    1. And Republicans are being so civil.

      1. …yeah, by comparison. I dont fucking see mobs of Republicans burning cities down, and demanding people follow their special salutes

        In fact I’ve seen a couple of videos of Antifa outnumbered like 3 to 1 in small rural towns and they were completely safe, whereas Antifa regularly attacks and kills people for any or no reason

        1. “whereas Antifa regularly attacks and kills people for any or no reason”

          Let’s not forget they attack and kill statues because of the people they commemorate and also burn down democratically controlled forests.

    2. You’re waiting for moderation? I think you’re in for a spell of well deserved immoderation. The next generation of democrats are just as uncivil as the old codgers you linked to. You may have to wait a while.

    3. TrickyVic

      For some reason you can only post one link at a time on this format.

      If you want to do more you need to do separate posts.

      Moderation is a black hole.

  32. I guess you missed the project veritas videos. I guess you’re okay with the way things went in California in 2018. Democrats are losing and they know it. So they do what they do best, change the rules to favor themselves. If you go back and review comments on this topic from others you may learn it’s long been a problem. For example, you can find Jerry Nadler talking about New York mail-in voter fraud.

    Chris Wallace was a total jackwagon, Democrat suck up last night and should be out of a job. Instead, I’m sure he’ll receive a bonus and a promotion. Why was he asking Trump to ask his supporters to remain calm? We’ve sat on our hands while crybaby sissy lala Antifa and BLM folks loot, burn, and assault with impunity.

    1. Hasn’t project veritas been caught lying twice? The ACORN videos and when they tried to get the Washington Post to make false Roy Moore allegations?

      The Trump supporters who drove into downtown Portland shooting paintballs, macing people, and brandishing loaded weapons certainly didn’t remain calm. One of them didn’t deserve to die certainly, but the far right has been causing trouble too. Why did Trump tell them to “Stand Down and Stand By?” Why not just Stand down?

    2. You don’t even mention “the way things went in California in 2018.” If you’re referring to mail in ballots taking long to count… That’s not unusual and will happen in 2020. My state has been voting by mail for 2 decades. No one has complained. Not even the far right loons.

    3. “I’m sure he’ll receive a bonus and promotion.” Yeah the Trump-hating pinkos at Fox News will definitely reward him.

      Jesus fucking christ

  33. No, but it does show that this author is a biased liar just like Wallace.

  34. What is there to debate and why have a biased and lame moderator?? What is to be learned you do not already know? The dems and Biden are completely insane and thankfully Trump is not a politician. Biden will probably be trying to fuck Harris and Harris wants to fuck you and not in the way that involves sex (yuck! with her? yuck!)
    Chris Wallace is a pinhead and Reason.com again shows its bias as well. But it puts cash in whats-his-name pocket and a black leather sport coat on his manly shoulders. None of them know America or Americans…Trump does.

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