Coronavirus

Trump Says Coronavirus Crisis Could Last Until July or August

The White House has issued new 15-day guidelines for slowing the spread of the coronavirus. The president implied at a press conference that crisis measures could be needed for much longer.

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President Donald Trump said today at a press briefing that social distancing measures being voluntarily adopted and imposed by governments to slow the spread of the novel coronavirus could be necessary for several months.

"Each and every one of us has a critical role to play in stopping the transmission of the virus," Trump said during this afternoon's press briefing. "It's important for the young and healthy people to understand that while they experience milder symptoms, they can easily spread this virus. And they will spread it indeed, putting people in harm's way."

The new White House guidelines released today advise senior citizens and those with serious underlying health conditions—the population most at risk of suffering serious health consequences from the disease—to stay home and away from other people.

Households that have had a single member test positive for the coronavirus are being told to keep everyone at home. "Do not go to work. Do not go to school. Contact your medical provider," the White House guidelines say.

Younger, healthier people are being advised to work from home whenever possible, and not to visit nursing homes. They are also being told to avoid discretionary trips, and to not gather in groups of more than 10 people.

These guidelines are for at least the next 15 days. However, when asked by a reporter how long the coronavirus crisis could last, Trump said we could be in this situation until the end of summer.

"People are talking about July, August, something like that," Trump said.

In addition to the White House guidelines, states and local governments continue to order shutdowns of bars and restaurants, with some counties going so far as to issue "shelter in place" orders.

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  1. And, once it is all over, the same people that called for Trump to aggressively exercise his executive powers will denounce him as a callous dictator …

    1. And, of course, Trumpsters are gushing with praise for Trump’s bold exercising of his executive power … as he does what his own health officials have demanded for over a month. And, of course, there will be no more needless deaths from the President’s weeks of staunch refusals.

      1. Fuck off and die, Hihn.

        1. Ahh yes, the ever wise comment from Sevo.

          You obviously have jack shit to argue back (like, a single speck of reason) so resort to bs.

      2. It’s Hihnsanity!

        (Chortles)

        1. It’s pronounced like “hine” (smirk)

          1. How do you know? You denied that you were Hihn!

            Oops!

                1. I KEEP SAYING SO, LIAR

                  1. Sorry I missed it. Last I remember you were denying it. Won’t happen again buddy.

                  2. I wrote you a song, Mikey:
                    (tune of Flintstones)

                    Hihn-o, meet Michael Hihn-o
                    He’s as nutty as they come you see
                    Hails from, Cloud-Cuckoo-land
                    He’s an example of hihnsanity

                    Full caps-lock, the Hihn posting does accrete
                    Sense though, will lead to his defeat

                    When you’re, reading Hihn posts
                    Have a Super-Cloud-Cuckoo time
                    A crazy-poo time
                    It’s an insane old time
                    TUUUULLLLPAAAA!

                    1. Literally lol.

                    2. Nice….very alliterative. 🙂

  2. “It’s important for the young and healthy people to understand that while they experience milder symptoms, they can easily spread this virus. And they will spread it indeed, putting people in harm’s way.”

    “OK, Boomer.”

    1. Remember… we must all disrupt our personal lives because a Boomer may be inconvenienced.

      1. “because a Boomer may be inconvenienced.”

        Seems like a rather odd way to say “might die a preventable death,” but you are rather odd.

        Hopefully you don’t need one of the very precious few ventilators in the country. You might change your tune then, but will be unable to sing it.

        1. “Seems like a rather odd way to say “might die a preventable death,” but you are rather odd.”

          If you are at risk, where possible YOU should be self isolating and sheltering in place. The fact that the entire country is being asked to go under house arrest to protect these people is a huge problem.

          1. Do people really think the economy can just shut down for half a year? People are already losing their minds because they can’t buy toilet paper. Imagine when you can’t buy basic food items. The store has food because it’s delivered DAILY.

            1. The TP thing is so weird because you can clean yourself with water as most of the world does. It’s not that big a deal.

              1. Ice Trey sneers because, after a crap, he wipes his ass with his fingers … wet, with water … as does most of the world.
                Oh.

                1. You heard it here first, ladies and gentlemen. Hihn does not wash his ass!

                  1. He probably licks it.

                  2. NOT WITH MY FINGERS. (lol)

            2. I made similar arguments when people started complaining about the Anti-Vaxers. I think those people (Anti-Vaxers) are idiots. You should vaccinate your kids. But the government should not have the power to force you to stick needles into your arm in order to reduce risk for others.

              Many people argue with me about that- pointing to the 3 month olds who died at Disneyland of measles. I’m like, “Why the fuck do you take a 3 month old to Disneyland?!” Seriously, we want to grant the government the power to force injections on kids so that “high risk” people can go to a theme park? No Thank you.

              But everyone has bought into that- that it is ok for the government to force ridiculous infringements on your liberty in order to reduce someone else’s risk by a tiny, tiny amount.

              1. If anti-vaxxers weren’t such mooches, they’d accept legal liability for all medical costs, and/or deaths, that result from their own intentional decisions. But that would mean personal accountability. By adult mentalities.

                But everyone has bought into that- that it is ok for the government to force ridiculous infringements on your liberty in order to reduce someone else’s risk by a tiny, tiny amount.

                A core purpose of government is to protect and defend human life. So, how many needless deaths do you require, before action?

                And how do recommendations = force?

                1. You realize many states are FORCING bars and restaurants to close, right?

                  Haha, crazy ass Hihn doesn’t know what force means.

                  1. You realize many states are FORCING bars and restaurants to close, right?

                    1) Not all states, as he implied.
                    2) And done mostly BELOW the state level, which exposes your own hysteria.

                    Haha, crazy ass Hihn doesn’t know what force means.

                    (snort) I know what “many” means, chump.
                    And that you have egg on your puss. Again.

                    1. REPEAT
                      “A core purpose of government is to protect and defend human life. So, how many needless deaths do you require, before action?”

                      AWESOME video shows Fox News hosts … side-by-side … before and after Trump’s YUGE flip-flop.
                      https://twitter.com/KFILE/status/1240131226268323842

                      First they ridiculed coronavirus as media hysteria to bring down the President … then flipping to a major crisis, some within a few days!!

                      What does this say about Fox’s contempt for their viewers’ intelligence?

                      How many viewers will again follow the robot-like mind control, to do a spinning Hannity pirouette? … also placing tribal politics above human life?

                      Pollsters have just started reporting that Trump’s base is starting to fall away, after 2-months of continuing apocalyptic failures. How many times can Trump’s base stand by him … for shooting someone to death on Fifth Avenue … now that he’s placed their own family’s health and finances at risk? (And their supply of toilet paper)

                      Much of his alt-right core is now ridiculing Trump in online forums, to defend their own denials. Is even Trump now manipulated by CNN, MSNBC, the NyTimes and WaPo? (gasp)

                      I await the same video treatment of Trump. … which I could probably make myself (with Google search) … Trump NOW says he suspected it was a pandemic before anyone else did! Since he says he’s smarter than health professionals. (Far worse than his lies about Charlottesville, to defend rioting, mass assaults and death by his racist and neo-nazi supporters)

                      You’ll see all these videos again .. A LOT … starting about mid-October (or immediately, if he’s re-nominated).

                      This now feels like it did, watching Nixon commit suicide.

                2. “If anti-vaxxers weren’t such mooches, they’d accept legal liability for all medical costs, and/or deaths, that result from their own intentional decisions. But that would mean personal accountability. By adult mentalities.”

                  If you had any grasp of basic premises, then you would understand that it is not the responsibility of individuals to protect you from nature. If I am your neighbor, do I need to install automated rifles on my land to prevent migrant wolves from getting to your property across mine? Should I be required to fence off my property so that no wolves cross my property to yours? Of course not.

                  If you know that you are infected, you are morally culpable for spreading that infection to others. But no one should be held morally or legally culpable for declining to vaccinate. (They should still do it, because it’s your fucking children, people!)

                  This is such a simple, simple exercise. If your brand of NAP means that you think it is OK to force someone to stick a needle in their arm for your benefit- either through coercion or threat of legal liability- then you don’t understand the NAP.

                  *Mind you, I am sure there are plenty of arguments for coerced vaccination if you are NOT a believer in the NAP. So, there are plenty of people who can argue for forced vaccinations in goof faith. I think they are wrong, and I also think Bailey is mistakenly applying the NAP when he argues for forced vaccinations from a libertarian perspective.

                  1. “If anti-vaxxers weren’t such mooches, they’d accept legal liability for all medical costs, and/or deaths, that result from their own intentional decisions. But that would mean personal accountability. By adult mentalities.”

                    If you had any grasp of basic premises,

                    (snort) Like accepting personal responsibility for the consequences of one’s intentional actions??

                    then you would understand that it is not the responsibility of individuals to protect you from nature./blockquote>WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOSH
                    It’s NOT nature, if
                    1) YOUR intentional action causes a needless death
                    2) YOUR intentional action causes costly medical treatment.
                    3) YOUR intentional actions causes ANY damage to another.

                    If I am your neighbor, do I need to install automated rifles on my land to prevent migrant wolves from getting to your property across mine?

                    Your “basic premises” are profoundly ANTI-RATIONAL, even to confusing positive action with negative action.

                    PAY ATTENTION. WHILE I DUMB IT DOWN.
                    I NEVER ENDORSED FORCED VACCINATIONS. AND DID THE EXACT OPPOSITE,

                    FREEDOM INCLUDES ACCEPTING RESPONSIBILITY FOR THE CONSEQUENCES OF ONE’S FREELY CHOSEN ACTIONS.

                    NAP DOES *NOT* COVER EVERYTHING. WHICH IS WHY DAVID NOLAN EXPANDED IT. NAP ALLOWS BANS ON GAY OR INTER-RACIAL MARRIAGE .. WOMEN’S SUFFRAGE ,… SEGREGATED LUNCH COUNTERS, AND MANY MORE ABUSES OF LIBERTY … THUS IS NOW THE RALLYING CRY OF HOMOPHOBES, RACISTS AND AUTHORITARIANS LIKE RON PAUL, AND MOST MISEANS AND ROTHBARDIANS

                    VAXX IS A STRAW MAN FALLACY … ANY ACTION THAT DAMAGES ANOTHER IS WRONG … WHICH IS WHY YOU’RE ALSO LAUGHABLY WRONG TO APPLY NAP HERE.

                    YOU DEMAND SOME CRAZY RIGHT TO CAUSE ANOTHER PERSON’S DEATH OR FINANCIAL LOSS. … BY WHAT RIGHT

                    Should I be required to fence off my property so that no wolves cross my property to yours? Of course not.

                    If you know that you are infected, you are morally culpable for spreading that infection to others. But no one should be held morally or legally culpable for declining to vaccinate. (They should still do it, because it’s your fucking children, people!)

                    This is such a simple, simple exercise. If your brand of NAP means that you think it is OK to force someone to stick a needle in their arm for your benefit- either through coercion or threat of legal liability- then you don’t understand the NAP.

                    *Mind you, I am sure there are plenty of arguments for coerced vaccination if you are NOT a believer in the NAP. So, there are plenty of people who can argue for forced vaccinations in goof faith. I think they are wrong, and I also think Bailey is mistakenly applying the NAP when he argues for forced vaccinations from a libertarian perspective.

          2. The fact that the entire country is being asked to go under house arrest to protect these people is a huge problem.

            Really? How tragic that we are inconvenienced for a few months by protecting the most vulnerable among us: The silent & greatest generations. Overt, we normally see eye to eye on many issues, but you are very badly mistaken here.

            As a child, you were completely dependent on these same people who you complain about now. Did you complain then? No, you took food and sustenance from their hands. You were taught the skills to live your daily life by these same people. One can credibly argue you are being a complete ingrate.

            This emergency (and it is an emergency) will pass. A hundred years from now, it will be an interesting note in history books. But know for certain we will surely be measured by our children and grandchildren by how we have treated the most vulnerable.

            Think about that.

            1. Really? How tragic that we are inconvenienced for a few months by protecting the most vulnerable among us:

              It is.

              To protect them, quarantine them.

              Not everyone.

              We can’t protect the most vulnerable if we shut down the society that provides that protection.

            2. “House arrest” is far more hysteria than anything from the meedja.

              Left – Right = Zero

        2. Still terrible with statistics huh? We may die from a car crash. Many more deaths. Or a weekend trip to chicago. Many ways we might die. Let’s all live in houses of bubble wrap.

          1. “Preventable”
            “Needless”
            “Irresponsible”

            Are your parents still alive.

            1. Car accident deaths are preventable if we make cars travel no faster than 25 mph. People die dumbfuck. We can’t save everyone all the time. This is why you’re an idiot.

              1. Well, to be fair, he’s mostly an idiot because he refuses to take his antipsychotic medications regularly.

                1. And his lack of education I guess.

              2. Are your parents still alive?

                Even Trump rejects your hysteria. Finally.

                And since we’ve barely begun testing, you have no clue how many are even infected. And how many of them because of the two-month delay,

                Hell, even Hannity, Ingraham and Judge Perino have bailed on your hysteria! Along with Trump!

                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYUP95sw1IM

        3. ^THIS
          (De Oppresso Liber

      2. Jesse….I am no fan of the Baby Boomer generation, but I am much more worried about the Silent & Greatest generations. They are truly the most vulnerable. A good many are in nursing homes, and completely unable to fend for themselves. We know this virus is a death sentence for a good many of them, if they contract it. Our people, and our society can be measured by how they treat the most vulnerable.

        My answer to your comment: For a short time, be inconvenienced. Things will start returning to normalcy in a few months.

        1. It isnt a short time. Especially given the panic and effects to the stock market. It is a major disruption. Nursing homes and the like are fine to take precautions. Asking my child not to go to school has no bearing on nursing homes.

          1. Um…you are just wrong = Asking my child not to go to school has no bearing on nursing homes. Sorry, but you need to rethink your premise. Science is science. Children are notorious carriers for colds, flu, etc. They come into contact with adults, who then go on to interact with each other and their elders. There is real risk there.

            We agree much more than we disagree, Jesse. On this one, you’re off base. The market disruption is a very temporary one. For buy and hold investors, this temporary disruption is irrelevant.

            This is a national emergency. We have not had one of those for some time, and I do not count 9/11 in the same category. We have not had an emergency like this since WWII, and before that, the 1918 pandemic. My point, it has been a long, long time since we exercised the ‘national emergency muscles’.

            Jesse, this too shall pass. Roll with it. It will be Ok in the end.

            1. Kids can still infect others even if they don’t get that sick themselves. Grade schools have about 200-300 kids and that’s a lot of exposure. Even if they have to go to daycare, usually daycare is about 20 or 30 kids. Much less exposure.
              It’s just an extra long summer vacation. Whatever they would have learned in school that last month or two they can catch up later.

    2. The irony that a cold that primarily kills the old is being treated like the worst pandemic in history by old fucks in power is just a little rich.

        1. It’s humanity. Totally lacking in the jack-booted Authoritarian Right.

            1. Of course.

              Left – Right = Zero

    3. Boomer’s should be happy I’m not President. I’d have gone full Logan’s Run on them. Force their estates to be taxed, get this over with already. No shutdowns. Holla.

  3. Holy crap. We might get up to a couple of hundred deaths by then.

  4. I’ve seen varying numbers of death form other countries but none are the same number or for one day vs total does anyone have an actual count or are they all just blowing hot air. You would think we could get accurate counts from France and Italy maybe

    1. I have no idea how they are tallying the numbers. Some 85 year old patient is admitted with pneumonia … and dies. Do they test for common cold viruses? Influenza? Coronavirus? All of the above? How do they determine what caused the death?

      I don’t think anyone knows.

      1. Intelligent people know. Thankfully, the medical profession is not limited to what Guzba can grasp.

        1. “Intelligent people know.”

          As if you could recognize intelligence.

      2. And yet, Bailey bangs the testing, testing, testing drum incessantly…

        We don’t know – yet. I think by mid-April, we will have a substantially larger data set and then can make definitive conclusions. We should have a several million observations by then.

    2. Here’s the tally from Johns Hopkins

      The two major countries whose numbers are probably crap (both on the low side) are Iran and the US.

      1. Thanks. Thats a large number for italy surprising. Seems like an outlier compared to the rest. But a real number

        1. Most of that is because their system has been overwhelmed and they are simply not treating old people.

          Hurray universal health care!

  5. Of course we all wonder if the Democrats had not distracted us with their impeachment shenanigans, maybe things would have been better. Naturally they will not take any blame.

    1. Hilarious.

      If only dear leader knew about this! He would save us!

      1. Remember folks… neutral jeff is always neutral. Not a leftist at all.

        1. He’s a dishonest pos is what he is.

    2. (laughing) That was long before the virus was noted. You mighyt just as well blame the Obama administration,

      And Bernie Sanders’ grandmother,

      1. Just laughing, or pee your pants laughing?

        Cuz we know you sometimes pee you pants. Probably daily.

        1. “Golden showers increase Hihn powers” as his grandmother used to say.

  6. My apple news feed Coronavirus update just informed me that the Bay Area has issued a “shelter in place” order? So this virus is now a mass shooter?
    That don’t even make sense.

    They’re fuckin with us. This shit ain’t even real.

    1. just had to cancel going to SF for pop’s 70th … he and his wife got back from New Zealand last night and she’s all “what the fuck! I can’t even host dinner Wednesday night let alone any birthday party”

    2. No politician will ever be hounded from office for doing TOO much to protect people.

    3. This action by San Fran is exactly why people started stock piling.

    4. I wonder when they will declare marshall law and start shooting/killing more people than those infected.

      1. marshall? or martial?

        Or is it Marshal Law, which could easily have been a name in an old, crappy western?

        1. Martial Law: A Shanghai cop who is a master of martial arts fights crime in the Los Angeles Police Department.

          1. Martial Law: A Shanghai cop who is a master of martial arts fights a dictator who rose to power off the backs of the military.

    5. If the homeless aren’t dying in droves is it really that dangerous?

    6. Obviously, EISTAU has no idea what “shelter in place” means.

      So this virus is now a mass shooter?

      Ummm, no. It’s a communicable disease, that can be spread, invisibly, for 14 days, by infected people. That’s how long one can be a carrier, and NOBODY knows it, not the carriers, nor anyone near them.

      That means people can be in danger, with no way of knowing. Even the President has had multiple exposures, at three different events.
      His name in Trump.

      They’re fuckin with us. This shit ain’t even real.

      Umm, no. The virus is very real, and similar bans and recommendations are happening all across America, that people are being told to minimize social contact, often far more strict than the Bay Area, Even (finally) by Trump! Parts of many states are in various forms of lockdown, with bars and restaurants are being mandated to close for now. Ohio’s governor wants to delay his state’s primary election, from tomorrow until June … NOT in fear of mass shootings.

      In fact, none of this has anything to do with mass shootings.
      Though, a good chance that Communist China is intentionally causing mass infections and death, in their sinister new plot to achieve domination … of all world markets … for toilet paper.

      They’re fuckin with us.

      Not they. You.

      This shit ain’t even real.

      People are dying. Everything I’ve noted here has been common knowledge for several days, to informed people.

      Well, the Red China plot is new, and still unfolding ….
      Check your apple feed. Or an orange.

      1. So this virus is now a mass shooter?

        You’re talking about it, Hihn. Maybe it is a mass shooter.

        1. (sigh) I’ve already applied all the ridicule I can think of, on your “mass shooter” scenario. Can you switch to mass rape?

          1. So it is ENB behind this sock the whole time…

          2. Seems like, having taken so much time applying all that ridicule, one might realize it was a joke.

            Unless you’re a raving lunatic.

      2. Your posts are far more legible without the all caps

        1. So, legibility is all that mattered …when you used only necessary caps … to INSIST …. that sick poor people were evicted from hospitals … and sent home to die … by NUNS.

          https://reason.com/2020/03/13/coronavirus-expensive-trump-congress-debt-deficit-huge/#comment-8168036

          (I’ll apologize for the caps, when you apologize to tens of thousands of nuns, all across America at the time. DEAL?)

          1. Hey, you got the right link this time. Good for you. You’re equal to my 3rd grader now.

            1. You’re 3rd grader is a raving lunatic?

              Sorry to hear that man. Good luck!

              1. Yeah, she can throw a fit quite often still. She’ll grow out of it. Hihn is growing into it with his Biden like senility.

                1. Hopefully she doesn’t wipe her poo on the wall?

          2. I never said the nuns did it. You did that. I’m sure they were busy paddling errant kids. But the fact is that is exactly what happened in 1918

            1. It’s a major reason the death toll – esp for Oct 1918 which was the main month – is an estimate with wide error bars.

              1. Even crazier, typical Bernie bot

            2. I never said the nuns did it. You did that.

              Yeah, cuz you’re TOO DAMN STOOPID to know the Charity Hospitals — that YOU say sent the poor sick home to die , to please their donors — were CATHOLIC …. AND YOU JUST PROVED IT!!

              I’m sure they were busy paddling errant kids.

              In Catholic hospitals — YOU SAY DIDN’T EVEN EXIST!!

              The fact is that is exactly what happened in 1918

              FAILS four demands that you PROVE it!

              One sick fuck lefty, supported by his other socks: JesseAz and RMac

      3. A ‘shelter in place’ order or warning means to stay where you are–do not attempt to return home or seek further shelter.

        It is the type of order issued when there IS a mass shooter, or when the tornado is minutes away.

        It is an immediate order.

        It doesn’t mean ‘stay in your homes’ or ‘go to your homes and stay there’ unless you’re already IN your home.

        It means, wherever you are, make that your shelter as best you can.

        As if the virus is stalking people.

        1. Azathoth .. wrong AGAIN

          A ‘shelter in place’ order or warning means to stay where you are–do not attempt to return home or seek further shelter

          READ THE DAMN NEWS … FOR ONCE

          Seven Bay Area counties and others across the region have ordered residents to shelter in place for the next three weeks as health officials scramble to keep coronavirus from spreading.

          OMG! I’m at a 7-11, ordered to stay here FOR THREE WEEKS.

          Critical information on:

          To safeguard public health and safety. Coronavirus is easily transmitted between people, especially in group settings. The shelter-in-place orders are being enacted to slow the spread of the virus by mandating that people stay indoors and isolate themselves — except to attend to certain essential activities,It can also mean stay at home. That’s why adults follow the news.
          To educate themselves!

          Please, Azathoth, stop adding to the hysteria.

    7. They are so begging for a French Revolution. Once the millenials realize that their careers and businesses are perma-fucked, they’re going to go Clockwork Orange on the boomers and guillotine Pelosi and Mcconnell.

    8. Friend of mine in palm beach.
      Apparently they have instituted a curfew.
      Why?
      Who knows

    9. “This shit ain’t even real.”

      There is talk of Wrestlemania being cancelled.

      For that to be an idea being floated around something is going on. You can guarantee it.

      (I see it happening on schedule though. Even in an empty stadium.)

      1. I had to tune in to watch the last broadcast, when they wrestled without an audience . . . that’s a tough sell. I doubt the PPV audience is there for that.

        1. NXT was done there with an audience and they trashed the place. It was done well. Smackdown followed and sucked there. Raw is there tonight.

          Wrestlemania was just cancelled and is being held there. I bet they’re going to redo the place for it. Most have the WWE Network anyways so singular PPV buys will drop for sure. If they were to cancel, postpone, or put it all on hold then the number of members that would cancel wouldn’t be good for business so best to keep it going, keep the storylines going, and pick up like nothing happened when this is over.

  7. Flu season tapers off in April why shouldn’t this?

    1. I guess we’re going to find out.

    2. Doesnt it have to grow to much higher. Numbers in order to taper off?

      1. Umm, tapering off can start at any number. It means to start declining.

        1. Hihn, defense against sarcasm. All hail the idiot.

          1. I’m the idiot …. but it was you who insists that sick poor people were evicted from hospitals … and sent home to die … by NUNS.

            https://reason.com/2020/03/13/coronavirus-expensive-trump-congress-debt-deficit-huge/#comment-8168036

            Even this atheist finds your claim to be … appalling.
            But NOT idiotic?

            1. Do you think I’m JFree or something? Or are you off the meds again?

              1. The attitudes are identical. And we all know what socks are.

                1. LOL. Now I know you’re an idiot. I’ve been calling JFree out for a week dummy.

            2. It is hilarious how much of a fuck up you are.

                1. So YOU also insist that poor sick people were evicted from hospitals … and sent home to die … all across America …. by tens of thousands of … NUNS!

                  Anyone who disagrees is …. crazy … you say … including tens of millions of Catholics … while even this ATHEIST defends the nuns against your slanderous assertion.

                  Oh.

                  1. No, I just know you’re crazy. I have no idea what you’re prattling on about re nurses.

                    1. Something JFree said. Hihn’s vision is going.

                    2. No, I just know you’re crazy. I have no idea what you’re prattling on about re nurses.

                      You have no idea why you assaulted me for defending NUNS (NOT NURSES.)

                    3. It’s clear to all of us you’re just Jfree’s sock.

                    4. Nuns, nurses. Madness is madness.

            3. “I’m the idiot”

              Now you’re getting it.

              1. I’m the idiot …. but it was you who insists that sick poor people were evicted from hospitals … and sent home to die … by NUNS.

                Now you’re getting it.

                Why did you lie about my words?

                1. Now what are you prattling on about?

                  (Chortle)

    3. There have been a couple journal articles in the last few days indicating that this is looking more and more like a real possibility.

    4. My understanding is that it isn’t influenza. Lots of viruses aren’t.

      The other thing is that this virus seems to be different in a number of ways. For instance, the flu is usually harder on infants than anyone else because their immunse systems are relatively undeveloped. That may still be the case, generally, but it appears that the older you are (the more highly evolved your immune system), the more likly you are to die. The early bet around the campfire has it that this virus may be more deadly because it triggers something like a hyperactive autoimmune response, and infants are less suceptible than the elderly and people with underlying conditions because infants have less in the way of an autoimmune respoonse to start with–and so a much lower baseline from which to go hyperactive.

      Point being, this virus appears to be different. We’re speculating based on limited data. We won’t know we’ve hit the peak until after it peaks, and we probably won’t know whether it acts like influenza until after it peaks either. It’s a lot like climate change now that I think of it. People who say we need to sacrifice our standard of living because we can’t just sit back and do nothing need to contend with the fact that you can’t rationalize sacrificing x amount of our standard of living until you’ve quantified at least that amount of damage to our standard of living by climate change.

      We won’t know how bad the virus is likely to get until it’s peaked and done it’s damage. Meanwhile, Americans aren’t doing nothing. we cancelled our cruises, stopped in restaurants, stocked up on water and TP, and started washing our hands like crazy. But beyond that, we really shouldn’t do much of anything. It’ll be over in April or July or some other month–regardless of what we do at this point and regardless of whether we like it.

      1. Good post man.

  8. I guess it’s important to speak the obvious in times of panic, and I guess rhis is the obvious:

    The pandemic will last as long as it lasts, and it will be over when it’s over–regardless of what President Trump does or doesn’t do about it. We won’t know it’s over until it’s over, and there isn’t an expert in the world smart enough to tell us what the statistics will show over the coming weeks. The rational reason to have us all cloister ourselves isn’t so that we avoid getting the virus. It’s so we don’t all get the virus at the same time and overtax the healthcare infrastructure. When we cloister ourselves, it slows the spread of the virus, so that there are enough ventilators, ICU beds, etc for everybody. If we all got sick at the same time, some highly suceptible people would need to go without.

    The economic fallout will mostly be tied to businesses not being able to meet their contractual obligations, follow through on purchase agrrements, or service their debt because revenue dried up along with their customer base. The areas of our economy that are best suited to write off these bad debts and suffer the consequences are the people and entities that extended this credit.

    This is not to say that there won’t be bankruptcies because of this, only that the entities that go bankrupt because customers dried up are precisely the entities that should go bankrupt. Those that thrive in the aftermath will only do so because consumers come back with plenty of discretionary income, so keeping businesses from going basnkrupt today by squandering the future earnings of consumers by way of government spending is foolish.

    Feeding the seed corn is no way to bounce back from a lost harvest. Whether the coronavirus tales until July or August to run through the populastion or whether it’s over by April, the economic impact will be whatever it was going to be anyway + the extent of the repercussions of whatever the government tries to do to mitigate for it. Oppose all bailouts. If the markets won’t fund a company’s recovery, then it’s a bad investment.

    It’s crazy to see the Fed as recently as a year ago still trying to unload the securities it bought up over after the crisis from ten years ago–and is now repeating the same mistakes. The markets are shrugging off what the Fed did today, but we’ll still be feeling the impact of the Fed’s actions today ten years from now.

    1. The pandemic will last as long as it lasts, and it will be over when it’s over–regardless of what President Trump does or doesn’t do about it.

      His month of delay has already extended it, to a degree yet unknown.

      If action or inaction makes no difference at all, then why do anything at all? Even Trump has finally abandoned your “do-nothing” view of total helplessness.

      Will you be seeking large crowds to mingle with? If not, why not?

      The markets are shrugging off what the Fed did today,

      LONG before you said that, the markets had “shrugged” themselves to the biggest loss ever, or over 30 years as a percentage loss. The Dow lost a hair under 3,000.

      Did Pearl Harbor “shrug off” the assault by Japan?
      Hiroshima and Nagasaki “shrugged off” our later bombing?
      Did Noah “shrug off” the flood, or build an ark?

      1. I never really thought about it that way. Thank you for your insightful criticism.

        1. He doesn’t have time for thoughtful responses while cowered up in a closet.

    2. “The rational reason to have us all cloister ourselves isn’t so that we avoid getting the virus. It’s so we don’t all get the virus at the same time and overtax the healthcare infrastructure. ”

      The elderly and the immunodeficient should be cloistering themselves. 90% of the people under house arrest right now can contract this virus worry free, without taxing the health care system.

      This general lockdown is absurd. The government should be saying, “If you have elderly or immuno-comprimised family, you should shelter in place.” The rest of the population should be going about its business. People who are particularly vulnerable should be the first to self isolate, and if there is ANYTHING that the government should be doing, it is helping them- providing them assistance to bring in the necessities, rather than spending all this energy kneecapping our economy.

      As it happens, this seems to be the UK approach to this virus. It remains to be seen which one is more effective.

      1. “This general lockdown is absurd.”

        I agree because a government lockdown is unnecessary. Most of the cloistering we’ve been seeing is self-inflicted.

        Las Vegas is shutting down casinos. It isn’t because of a presidential decree or because of the mayor or because of the government. It’s because people all over the country and all over the world cancelled their flights and their vacations–without any prodding from government. The occupancy at some of those hotels was less than 10%–meaning it cost more to keep them open than the revenue keeping them open generated.

        https://therealdeal.com/2020/03/16/wynn-mgm-close-las-vegas-casinos-over-coronavirus-concerns/

        When I do see the government stepping in and forcing closures, it seems to be the same nanny state types who say they’re closing them down for the people who work there, etc. I’ve rarely seen the government force people to do something for their own good–and it actually turn out to be for their own good. And yet people in NYC and San Francisco seem to think that’s the whole purpose of government. I repeat: a progressive is someone who thinks that the purpose of government is to force people to make sacrifices for the greater good–as they define it.

        And, again, I think a lot of people are operating under the delusion that the purpose of this guidance from the government is about stopping people from being exposed to the virus. I think that’s baloney. That’s no longer an achievable goal. They’re worried about everybody getting the virus all at once–and there not being enough ventilators and ICU beds for everybody if they all come at the same time. The idea the government stop a virus like this from spreading in its tracks through shut downs is stupid. The idea that the government can slow the spread so that treatment is manageable by encouraging people to do what they’re already doing makes a ton of sense.

        1. For those who can’t digest facts unless they’re served up by progressives, the New York Times has this for you.

          https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/11/science/coronavirus-curve-mitigation-infection.html

          That’s the model we’re following. The same number of people will become infected regardless of what we do or don’t do. However, if we all get sick at once, the healthcare infrastructure can’t handle the capacity so the mortality rate goes up if we don’t slow the spread.

          It’s the progressive mindset to assume that the government is responsible for everything, so everything bad that happens is the fault of the government somehow–either for what they did or because of what they didn’t do. In reality, of course, there’s nothing the government can do to stop highly contagious novel viruses from emerging elsewhere in the world and making their way here to the U.S.

          I guess progressives want to blame everything up to and including the weather on President Trump in an election year, but he isn’t to blame for the weather or the coronavirus, and neither Joe Biden nor Bernie Sanders can stop the weather or the coronavirus either. I guess you’ll just have to do your best to make your own choices.

          Victim of collision on the open sea
          Nobody ever said
          life was free
          Sink?
          Swim?
          Go down with the ship?
          Use your freedom of choice!

  9. I’m not feeling so well. Not sick just depressed. I just think of all the old people who might not really understand what’s going on. I see people at Walmart who can barely walk and I just wonder about those people.
    This kind of stuff can push vulnerable people over the edge. The stock market crashing is horrible and there was a lady in Houston who lost 300k because they canceled a rodeo. It makes me sick thinking about it all. I’m actually doing pretty well and that makes me feel guilty. I’m not religion religious but I’m saying prayers for America and all you guys.

    1. They didn’t just cancel “a” rodeo in Houston, they canceled “THE” Houston Livestock Show and Rodeo. It is an over 3-weeks event. It is also why a man from Montgomery County (the county north of Houston) spread the disease to people in at least 2 other counties south of the county Houston is in all in 1 night. That occurred in the pre-rodeo cookoff weekend prior to the actual Livestock Show and Rodeo opening. It wasn’t discovered and the Rodeo shut down until a little over a week into the event. At that point, most Houston area schools had been on spring break for the weekend and 2 days. With many families traveling or attending the Rodeo and Livestock Show. A livestock show that is attended by FFA kids from all over South East Texas to show and sell their animals they have raised for several months to a year. It has now been shut down for about the length of time most people develop symptoms and we are still only at 69 confirmed cases in our entire state. We have had only one death. So it is hard to determine if shutting it down was worth it or not. We’ll better understand soon since we are just today getting a drive-through testing site in the 4th largest city in America.

  10. That is where the Flattening the Curve graphs that are going around are so misleading. They don’t show the actual time required to keep the curve under the amount of concurrent infections that would swamp our medical systems.

    I saw where some guy did the basic math (Assuming no increased hospital capacity, no vaccines, and no summertime dormancy of the virus, just, at current population and hospital capacity how slow would this virus have to roll to hit herd immunity)

    10 YEARS!

    People who think a two week shutdown is gonna do anything are delusional. For the strategy of social distancing to work, the virus either has to be cured with a vaccine, go away on its own, or infect everyone slowly. The Vaccine will take years to get to everyone, the slow infection will take a decade. So really the only hope we have of social distancing wrapping this up by July is hoping the virus really doesn’t like summer weather.

    1. Three responses:

      1) I think the idea is that flattening the curve is better regardless of how far out the curve needs to be flattened.

      We need to avoid the perfect solution fallacy. IF IF IF we can’t flatten the curve out enough to avoid every fatality due to some people being left out in the cold, a flatter curve means fewer people being left out in the cold–and that’s better.

      2) When all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.

      We have over 4,000 confirmed cases in the USA. Stopping the virus from spreading completely by isolating cases and people who came into contact with them must have gone out the window some time after 1,000 cases were confirmed. Flattening the curve through social distancing and slowing the spread is probably the only reasonable strategy at this point.

      3) Social distancing isn’t really about the government.

      People were abandoning Disneyland, telling their employees not to come to work, and cancelling their flights and cruises long before the government told anybody to do anything. People don’t need the government to tell them to exit a burning building, and they didn’t need to be told that avoiding airports, plane travel, and large crowds was a good idea as the coronavirus approached.

      A lot of this stuff the government is telling us to do is stuff that people are already doing. I think the government is telling us to do some of this stuff just so it’ll look like they’re doing something. There are still a lot of silly people out there who think the government should do something about everything, and it’s an election year.

      1. While I agree that a lot of people were already isolating themselves, this is largely a result of the fear mongering. People need to understand that if you are a healthy, non smoker under 50, your experience with this virus will be benign. You will be a carrier and not much more. Viewed in that context, most people would NOT be canceling their trip to Disneyland, though Las Vegas will take its hit.

        The businesses will still take a hit because older people spend the most money, and because there are many under-50s who have regular contact with at-risk people, either due to family or due to work.

        The public should not be panicking anywhere near the amount they are, but an antagonistic press, and a bunch of politicians afraid to cross them are all feeding into this absurdity.

        1. Great Britain is trying your approach: Develop herd immunity. Ask them how it is going? Hint, hint: Not too well.

          I totally agree the press has been antagonistic (from TDS) and completely irresponsible in their reporting. And the Congress has been…well….the Congress. Too slow, too bureaucratic, and about as useful as teats on a bull. A week to pass an 8B bill? Two weeks to pass a second bill?

          If this pace is the best that Congress can do in a national emergency, then we are well and truly fucked. How would these people have dealt with WWI or WWII?

        2. People are acting the same way and doing the same things (in terms of isolating themselves), everywhere in the world. People were isolating themselves in Wuhan before they government was admitting there was a problem. Cities with millions of people became virtual ghost towns in China, South Korea, and Italy. If different people speaking different languages are with all kinds of different news organizations are doing the same thing everywhere, then it might not be the press that is to blame. It might just be that this is what people do in response to a pandemic, these days. If the government and the press tried to stop them, I’m not sure they could.

  11. Trump Says Coronavirus Crisis Could Last Until July or August
    It’s not over until we say it’s over!

  12. Why not just quarantine the old and sick, and encourage the young and healthy to spread this virus quickly?

    1. In other words, practice reverse isolation rather than forward isolation. Don’t contain the virus, just keep it out of “sensitive areas”. Let the kids spread it around, just don’t visit Grandma and Grampa.

      1. I like the idea. But let’s say it worked perfectly, and everyone who’s known to be vulnerable is kept in isolation. That still leaves the vast majority of us out there—for the sake of argument, we’ll call it 200 million—contracting, carrying, and spreading the virus. Even if all 200 million of us are in the “safe” group—young, healthy, functioning immune system, no comorbidities, etc.—a certain percentage of us, however small that percentage may be, are going to require medical treatment. And pretty much any non-zero percentage of 200 million is going to be a rather large number. Would that not flood the medical system?

      2. The only evidence we have is re fatalities – not serious cases. Every serious case requires hospitalization – and about 5% of total cases require intubations for some period. There is some evidence beyond that for kids and 20 somethings – that they don’t get as high a % of serious cases. But for 30+ – no evidence whatsoever that they are less likely to get serious cases. Here in CO we have age-breakouts – and the 3 largest age decades are 30’s, 40’s, 50’s. Treatment for serious cases is far more effective for the younger than for the older. Which is why the fatality rates are so much higher for elderly when everyone gets treated. Which shouldn’t be surprising at all.

        There are 100,000 or so ICU beds in the US. If all of them are filled exclusively with Covid19 patients and nothing else, then that is a maximum of about 2 million cases that we can have per month. There are 207 million 18-65’s in the US.

        Once hospitals are full – as in Milan right now – then the overall fatality rate skyrockets – possibly up to about 10-15%.

        1. Also – UK is now reporting that up to 20% of people who have had serious cases and survived so far appear to have long-term lung damage

    2. Isn’t that what the Brits are trying to do?

      May not be a bad idea, provided serious illness rates in young people aren’t enough to also swamp the system.

    3. “Why not just quarantine the old and sick, and encourage the young and healthy to spread this virus quickly?”

      This is essentially UK’s model. It remains to be seen whether or not BoJo can politically maintain the model, and whether or not it is more effective.

  13. There are some useful things we can do even if the government can’t do anything–like we can make recommendations on what to binge-watch!

    I highly recommend the first season of Altered Carbon on Netflix, and I highly recommend avoiding the second season entirely. Also on Netflix, check out Love, Death + Robots.

    I’m also a fan of Castle Rock on Hulu–both seasons are good, but the second season has some moments that are great. The first season of Legion is up on Hulu, if you never saw that.

    Haven’t seen much to be interested in on Amazon Prime since the last season of the The Expanse and Goliath.

    Anybody with similar suggestions, I’d love to hear ’em. Yeah, I already know about Westworld. This season looks to be full of awesome.

    1. Watch Lost with a lot of background study. Start with http://users.bestweb.net/~robgood/teach , although I’m overdue for a new entry. Mostly it’d help to watch Department S first, and read a lot of Arthur Conan Doyle. But even without background material, remember to take everything in the show “seriously”, even if it seems to be a mistake. Trust nothing to be conventional. And expect to laugh a lot once you get it.

    2. Am very sad to hear about Altered Carbon season 2, as I’m getting ready to watch soon 🙁

      Also might as well check out Jericho on Netflix if you haven’t. See if it doesn’t hold up today, 15 years later.

    3. I started playing Opposing Force and Blue Shift, which were free downloads on Steam.

  14. Trump Says Coronavirus Crisis Could Last JFree is Right Until July or August

    There. FIFY

    1. Lol. Just… no. I’m sure you’re walking by pyres of bodies daily from the mass death.

  15. Serious question, why isn’t anyone at Reason currently sounding the alarm on our current inevitable descent into martial law? Where is everyone?

    1. Gillespie seems to be the only one even questioning all this.

    2. Look, citizen, staying inside the Freedom Fence is for your own good! Otherwise it wouldn’t be the FREEDOM Fence!

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  17. You can spent your time with oma sex chat until coronavirus crisis, July or August is so far away

  18. Yes, President Trump is right
    The spread of the virus is very fast

  19. Man, if you still listen to this guy as a source of truth on ANYTHING then you’re somehow dumber than he is.

    This idiot couldn’t manage a corner store, let alone anything of this magnitude.

    1. Indeed, every one of his actual businesses failed, five in bankruptcy.
      But he is our President, and we’re stuck with him until January 20th, 2021
      God help us.

  20. AWESOME video shows Fox News hosts … side-by-side … before and after Trump’s YUGE flip-flop.
    https://twitter.com/KFILE/status/1240131226268323842

    First ridiculing coronavirus as media hysteria to bring down the President … then flipping to a major crisis, some within a few days!!

    What does this say about Fox’s contempt for their viewers’ intelligence?

    How many viewers will again follow the robot-like mind control, to do a spinning Hannity pirouette? … also placing tribal politics above human life?

    Pollsters have just started reporting that Trump’s base is starting to fall away, after 2-months of continuing apocalyptic failures. How many times can Trump’s base stand by him … for shooting someone to death on Fifth Avenue … now that he’s placed their own family’s health and finances at risk? (And their supply of toilet paper)

    Much of his alt-right core is now ridiculing Trump in online forums, to defend their own denials. Is even Trump now manipulated by CNN, MSNBC, the NyTimes and WaPo? (gasp)

    I await the same video treatment of Trump. … which I could probably make myself (with Google search) … Trump NOW says he suspected it was a pandemic before anyone else did! Since he says he’s smarter than health professionals. (Far worse than his lies about Charlottesville, to defend rioting, mass assaults and death by his racist and neo-nazi supporters)

    You’ll see all these videos again .. A LOT … starting about mid-October (or immediately, if he’s re-nominated).

    This now feels like it did, watching Nixon commit suicide.

    1. Part 2
      Is Trump self-impeaching?

      Part one describes a video exposing the staggering moral bankruptcy of Fox News opinion hosts — ridiculing the virus as another media conspiracy to overturn the 2016 election… then a 180 degree reversal … to match Trump’s bullshit flip-flop … in side-by-side, dated windows.

      Here, Part 2, the first of likely many video compilations … tracing Trump’s two months of failures, misinformation and LIES … partisan games that are already killing Americans, and will kill many more.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYUP95sw1IM

      Here’s why his delays will kill so many Americans, needlessly, and/or cause severe financial hardship.
      On average, each infected person infects two more. So the longer Trump delayed action, the more the virus expands exponentially, where each one infection becomes 3 … each 3 becomes 9 … each 9 becomes 27, etc. .

      Now, Trump — already the worst President EVER on new debt … wants perhaps another TRILLION in spending … an amount escalated by his own mismanagement and incompetence. THIS is why it was so reckless to explode the debt in a boom. The unexpected is always … unexpected.

      From another source.
      I believe Italy has the very worst effects in Europe, We began large-scale testing a few days ago … over a month behind everyone else … still only 8,500 yesterday … so suddenly our curve is now almost totally vertical, and the number of tests will continue increasing every day. So far, our curve is as bad as Italy’s, but ten days behind.

      As the wackier Trumpsters continue sneering and ridiculing the threat, remember … even Trump now says they’re nuts. He’s thrown them under a bus. They’re now twisting in the wind, all alone.

      Expect to see all these videos as campaign ads in November, with the death toll superimposed. TRUMP HAD THE POWER TO MINIMIZE THE SUFFERING AND DEATH … and refused … because re-election.

      Now he LIES about what he did for months … fiddling while American burns.

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