Minimum Wage

Voters in Two Deeply Conservative States Look Set to Approve Minimum Wage Increases Next Week. That's a Bad Idea.

Minimum wage ballot initiatives are often good politics, never good policy.

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Kevin Duke/Dreamstime.com

Next week, voters in Missouri and Arkansas will get the chance to approve new minimum wage hikes that offer the promise of higher pay for some workers—and hours cuts and potentially even job losses for others.

Arkansas' Issue 5, if passed, would raise the state's minimum wage from the current $8.50 an hour to $9.25 come January 2019; the minimum wage would continue to tick up each year until it reaches $11 in 2021. Neighboring Missouri's Proposition B would similarly boost the minimum wage from $7.85 to $8.60 in 2019, then increase it 85 cents each year until it hits $12 in 2023.

Minimum wages of $11 or $12 fall a fair bit short of the $15 minimum demanded by many progressive activists and adopted by cities such as Seattle, New York, and Washington, D.C. They look more ambitious when you consider how low the cost of living is in both states. Missouri ranks seventh in the nation for lowest cost of living. Arkansas is second, behind only Mississippi. So $11 or $12 an hour is going to go a lot farther there than in higher-cost jurisdictions.

The National Employment Law Project—a pro–minimum wage outfit—estimates that the two measures combined would raise wages for nearly one million people, including some 300,000 workers in Arkansas and another 660,000 in Missouri.

This, it is important to stress, does not mean that earnings will necessary increase for one million workers—only that their state-mandated hourly wage rate will increase.

Indeed, some cities that have been most aggressive in boosting their minimum wages have seen returns for workers decline. A 2017 city-sponsored study on the effects of Seattle's $15 minimum wage—passed in 2013, but phased in over time depending on business size—found that workers were actually losing about $125 a month thanks to a mix of hours cutbacks and slower employment growth for lower-wage workers.

D.C. and San Diego likewise show minimum wage increases slowing the growth of jobs, even while neighboring communities continued to add jobs at a growing rate.

It's doubtful these examples will sway voters in either Arkansas or Missouri to vote no on either measure. Minimum wage ballot initiatives have a history of doing well, even in deeply conservative states.

A $12 minimum wage in deep-red Arizona, for instance, received a whopping 58 percent of the vote in 2016. Back in 2014, 65 percent of Arkansas voters approved a minimum wage increase at the ballot box. One poll shows support for Arkansas' Issue 5 at 60 percent.

In 2006, 75 percent of Missouri voters voted yes on a wage hike as well, and the state's two largest cities—Kansas City and St. Louis—have approved minimum wage increases in recent years.

Neither of those minimum wages are in effect currently, thanks to Missouri state politicians, who passed a law preempting local minimum wages after St. Louis' wage hike—passed in 2015 but held up in the courts for two years—had already gone into effect.

Passing a law that actually lowers the cash value of a minimum wage—whatever the merits of the policy—is terrible politics. Republicans didn't help matters by arguing that a patchwork of local minimum wages would be too much of a hassle for businesses. This naturally provided a ready-made argument that state-level action is necessary.

An analysis by the Show Me Institute estimates that a $12 minimum wage would cost the state some 11,000 jobs. It also found that about 80 percent of workers who would benefit from Proposition B are not living in poverty. Add to that the harder-to-see costs of minimum wages, including price increases, hours cuts, or deferred investment.

But those negative effects are easy to ignore when the possibility of immediate and widespread wage increases are in the offing. That makes Proposition B and Issue 5 typical minimum wage ballot initiatives: good politics but bad policy.

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  1. It’s doubtful these examples will sway voters in either Arkansas or Missouri to vote no on either measure. Minimum wage ballot initiatives have a history of doing well, even in deeply conservative states.

    If you want economic literacy in the voting public then maybe you should start pushing for school choice.

  2. You now what else could raise wages?

    Lower taxes and less regulatory costs.

    1. A claim with plenty of evidence to disprove it.

      1. Present said evidence, please.

        1. Still waiting.

          1. NPC tony is caught in a feedback loop.

          2. Intruder alert!!! Intruder alert!!! Fire red klaxons right and blue photon cannons left!

            A model 666 Tulpanator Robot Anthropoid Cyborg from the future has arrived HERE, to exterminate ALL rational discourse, with grade-school insults!!! Batten the hatches, and clutch DESPERATELY, to the hope that the model 666 Tulpanator Robot Anthropoid Cyborg will find some grade-school site to retreat to, and leave the rest of us the Hell alone, to have adult conversations!

            Tony, I disagree with you, but please don’t let the model 666 Tulpanator Robot Anthropoid Cyborg-Troll, troll you into finding any supporting links. He’s not capable of actually reading and understanding them; that requires REAL intelligence, not the poorly simulated kind that we have today, or even in Tulpanator’s future days. Tulpanator will not even read your detailed responses of any kind… Tulpanator will simply dismiss you as being a stink pants, call you stink pants and many more, and then go on to shit all over some other part of the thread.

            1. OK, now, then, assuming that the adults will be able to discuss, rationally, adult matters, w/o the Model 666 Tulpanator coming by to disturb us, and shit on the thread?

              Over-regulation is clearly bonkers, and harmful! A distraction of time, labor, and money (and jobs) away from useful things! For just one example, read?
              https://reason.com/archives/201…..ions/print
              Whole Foods’ John Mackey on Veganism, Gary Johnson, and How Regulation Is Stunting Innovation

              John Mackey and Whole Foods had to treat as a POISON, like a radioactive waste, or some such, customer-returned multi-vitamins! They are fit for us to swallow, to help our health, but, since they contain trace amounts of selenium (a needed trace element, but a poison at way-high doses), the customer-returned pills must be handled as hazardous wastes!!!

              Government Almighty regulators have NO common sense, and they are mostly a blight on the planet!

      2. If we take the past 18 months as any indication, lowered corporate tax rates sure seemed to have stimulated hiring and wage growth. It could be a misleading correlation though.

        1. This causal claim doesn’t even work theoretically. Labor demand doesn’t go up just because the boss has more cash. Stock buybacks aren’t hiring or wage increases.

          1. It’s like in order to be a progressive you have to completely not understand economics eve a little bit.

            What do you think a company does with more cash? What do you think an investor does with the money he gets from a stock buy back?

            Do they all just have a vault of gold coins like Scrouge McDuck (or Ron Paul more than likely)?

          2. Labor demand could have been suppressed when taxes were quite high and after the tax cuts was moving in the direction of its more “natural” level. Also, businesses looking to expand could do so more easily than before the tax cut. But really, it’s more likely that the personal income tax cuts are what led to more economic activity, which leads to businesses expanding, which leads to demand for labor.

          3. Labor demand doesn’t go up just because the boss has more cash.

            You think that because you don’t understand how running a business works.

            If I am a general contractor, for example, just to speak to something I have intimate familiarity with, I hire a carpenter at, say $45/hr. I charge you $95/hr for that guy. I do that because that’s called turning a profit.

            Let’s simplify the situation and say that all $50 of my markup is profit. I make that on each and every guy I hire. Do you see how that just might create an incentive for me to hire more people?

          4. Because all the employers will use extra cash to buy stocks?

        2. Think you better look closer at BLS stats a little closer.

          Trump touted some 201,000 jobs created in Aug. 2018, yet on top of that number, 433,000 jobs were lost in the same month.
          That’s a net loss of -222,000 jobs….in one month.

          The wage increases applied mainly to Management.
          Non-management, though they did see higher hourly wages, saw decreased weekly take home pay.

          Plus, per the BLS special report on job losses, over 3 MILLION people lost their jobs in the past three years.
          Only 2 million of those found new jobs.
          And, 49 percent of those had to take jobs that paid less than the previous job they lost.

          So, a net loss of 1 MILLION jobs, with almost 1 more MILLION people making less.

          Plus, as per the BLS, over 102 MILLION Americans ARE STILL OUT OF WORK, yet with over 96 MILLION not reported as “unemployed”, by simply being removed from the official stats.
          And, that number keeps rising.

          They just keep systematically removing scores of Americans from the count.
          Obama started this lie, any president succeeding him had to continue the lies.

          You need to ignore the overly-hyped summaries, and start examining the tables they use for those summaries.

          See, the economy is over 70 percent driven by consumers spending. As such, those consumers must be led to believe the economy is doing better, to entice them to spend more, keeping the economy from completely tanking.

          1. In a truly good economy, it doesn’t have to be constantly hyped as such.
            That’s called propaganda.

            A truly good economy speaks for itself.
            A bad economy, must be hyped to keep it from getting worse.

            ? Consumer debt is outpacing wages by over 300 percent.
            ? Real inflation is closer to 7 percent.
            ? Housing and construction starts are down over 19 percent.
            ? Farm incomes are falling.

            Those don’t happen in a good economy.

            Plus, “tariffs” (veiled taxes) don’t happen in a truly good economy.

            Immigration crackdowns don’t happen in a truly good economy (as employers are looking for anyone to fill jobs).

            Plus, quickly rising budget deficits don’t happen in a truly good economy.

            In a truly good economy, it doesn’t have to be constantly hyped as such, by highly manipulated stats.
            That’s called propaganda.

            It’s like a Promoter selling tickets to a show they don’t think will sell-out……they start to advertise (hype) that show.
            They say things like “tickets are going quick”, or “seats are limited”, etc.

            If a Promoter has a show they know will sell-out, they don’t have to advertise it.

            You don’t NEED to sell what you don’t need to sell.

            This is how propaganda (aka spin, marketing, PR, etc.) works.

            1. jello.beyonce|10.29.18 @ 11:59PM|#
              “In a truly good economy, it doesn’t have to be constantly hyped as such.
              That’s called propaganda.”
              As opposed to your bullshit? Seems most people are looking at their paychecks and there portfolios and are quite pleased

              “? Consumer debt is outpacing wages by over 300 percent.
              ? Real inflation is closer to 7 percent.
              ? Housing and construction starts are down over 19 percent.
              ? Farm incomes are falling.”
              Amazing how many numbers you can pull from your ass!

              And your posts are a good example of bullshit.

          2. jello.beyonce|10.29.18 @ 11:48PM|#
            I think you need to back up your claims:

            “Trump touted some 201,000 jobs created in Aug. 2018, yet on top of that number, 433,000 jobs were lost in the same month.
            That’s a net loss of -222,000 jobs….in one month.”
            Very interesting cite.

            “The wage increases applied mainly to Management.
            Non-management, though they did see higher hourly wages, saw decreased weekly take home pay.”
            ‘Nother great cite

            “Plus, per the BLS special report on job losses, over 3 MILLION people lost their jobs in the past three years.
            Only 2 million of those found new jobs.
            And, 49 percent of those had to take jobs that paid less than the previous job they lost.

            So, a net loss of 1 MILLION jobs, with almost 1 more MILLION people making less.

            Plus, as per the BLS, over 102 MILLION Americans ARE STILL OUT OF WORK, yet with over 96 MILLION not reported as “unemployed”, by simply being removed from the official stats.
            And, that number keeps rising.”
            Cite, cite, cite, cite and cite missing. I’m guessing many of those are pulled from your ass.

          3. So some of what you assert is true, like how they started fudging unemployment numbers under Obama… But much of the rest of what you say is directly contrary to stats I have read that even accounted for the different ways of counting things. We have NOT had a net loss of jobs according to anywhere I have seen. The labor force participation rate has more or less been handing steady the last few years… So cite something, or I’m not buying it.

        3. In a truly good economy, it doesn’t have to be constantly hyped as such.
          That’s called propaganda.

          A truly good economy speaks for itself.
          A bad economy, must be hyped to keep it from getting worse.

          ? Consumer debt is outpacing wages by over 300 percent.
          ? Real inflation is closer to 7 percent.
          ? Housing and construction starts are down over 19 percent.
          ? Farm incomes are falling.

          Those don’t happen in a good economy.

          Plus, “tariffs” (veiled taxes) don’t happen in a truly good economy.
          Immigration crackdowns don’t happen in a truly good economy (as employers are looking for anyone to fill jobs).

          Plus, quickly rising budget deficits don’t happen in a truly good economy.

          In a truly good economy, it doesn’t have to be constantly hyped as such, by highly manipulated stats.
          That’s called propaganda.

          It’s like a Promoter selling tickets to a show they don’t think will sell-out……they start to advertise (hype) that show.
          They say things like “tickets are going quick”, or “seats are limited”, etc.

          If a Promoter has a show they know will sell-out, they don’t have to advertise it.

          1. Given how much debt Americans pile on just to get a mid level college degree, even a “good economy” was never going to resolve that issue.

            Housing development is slowing down because construction costs are climbing and most urban zones make it exceptionally difficult to build anything. There’s actually a shortage in construction workers, and maybe you can blame that on Trump’s immigration policies, but construction isn’t one of those “jobs Americans won’t do”.

      3. You’re against lowering regulatory costs?
        Seriously Tony, why the fuck are you even on a libertarian site?

        1. How do you think contracts are enforced? Through regulation. It’s the kind and quality of the regulation that matters. Lowering regulatory costs at the expense of the public at large is an injustice.

          1. That’s just one tiny fraction of the current regulatory boondoggle costs. To pretend that that’s the major aspect is disingenuous.

      4. Ummm… Cost of labor has grown at just over 3% a year since the 1970s. Cost of labor is income, regulatory costs, benefits, and taxes. Income hasn’t gone up, per all the lefty sites, since the late 1970s. So if it isn’t incomes going up, it is one of the other buckets since cost of labor continues at a steady pace. Even you can figure this one out Tony.

      5. “A claim with plenty of evidence to disprove it.”

        I’m still waiting for your evidence, shitbag.

    2. Here’s a little exercise I like to do called “Crunching the Numbers”:

      So, at a $12 minimum wage:
      Assuming 40/hrs per week
      That gives us a pre-tax full-time income of $480/week, $2,080/mo, $24,960/yr
      Less taxes (est 20 percent) = $384/week, $1,664/mo, $19,968/yr

      The median rent is Missouri = $771-$926mo (from 2016-one bedroom)
      The median utility bill in Missouri = $108/mo
      The median used car payment in Missouri = $378/mo
      Th median auto insurance payment in Missouri = $98/mo
      The median health insurance plan in Missouri = $254

      So, on the low-end we have necessary monthly bills of $1,609
      On the high-end we have necessary monthly bills of $1,764

      This is on a max. take-home salary of $1,664….assuming full-time employment (which many minimum wage jobs aren’t).

      This doens’t even take into account: Food, clothing, household expenses, gas & maintenance for that car, or entertainment, etc….
      The USDA estimates montly food costs ON THE LOW END at $240/mo.

      So, even at this minimum wage initative, workers are expected to get food assistance, at a minimum….food, housing subsidies, and energy assistance.

      Thus people working at this low wage are working just to pay bills.
      Plus they’re getting government assistance.

      Why is it that the GOP plans looks a lot like the Dems plans?

      Bigger government, more bureaucracy, more & larger welfare, less quality of life.
      Meaning either higher taxes, or larget budget deficits.

    3. Here’s a little exercise I like to do called “Crunching the Numbers”:

      So, at a $12 minimum wage:
      Assuming 40/hrs per week
      That gives us a pre-tax full-time income of $480/week, $2,080/mo, $24,960/yr
      Less taxes (est 20 percent) = $384/week, $1,664/mo, $19,968/yr

      The median rent is Missouri = $771-$926mo (from 2016-one bedroom)
      The median utility bill in Missouri = $108/mo
      The median used car payment in Missouri = $378/mo
      Th median auto insurance payment in Missouri = $98/mo
      The median health insurance plan in Missouri = $254

      So, on the low-end we have necessary monthly bills of $1,609
      On the high-end we have necessary monthly bills of $1,764

      This is on a max. take-home salary of $1,664….assuming full-time employment (which many minimum wage jobs aren’t).

      This doesn’t even take into account: Food, clothing, household expenses, gas & maintenance for that car, or entertainment, etc….
      The USDA estimates monthly food costs ON THE LOW END at $240/mo.

      So, even at this minimum wage initiative, workers are expected to get food assistance, at a minimum….food, housing subsidies, and energy assistance.

      Thus people working at this low wage are working just to pay bills.
      Plus they’re getting government assistance.

      Why is it that the GOP plans looks a lot like the Dems plans?

      Bigger government, more bureaucracy, more & larger welfare, less quality of life.
      Meaning either higher taxes, or larger budget deficits.

      1. jello.beyonce|10.29.18 @ 11:38PM|#
        “Here’s a little exercise I like to do called “Crunching the Numbers”:

        Here’s a little exercsize I like to do called “Calling Lefties On Bullshit”:
        “So, even at this minimum wage initiative, workers are expected to get food assistance, at a minimum….food, housing subsidies, and energy assistance.”

        If you pull enough assumptions out of your ass, why you can prove people are starving.
        Fuck off.

      2. Good post Jello.

        A registered nurse gets about $32 an hour. Anesthesia around $85 per hour.

        Entry level is just what it is.

        1. Also, Echospinner, Anesthesiologists are typically M.D.’s, which certainly calls for a higher wage.

      3. Using median expenses to show minimum wage shortfalls. Do you even statistic bro?

        Did you know that my earnings as an engineer won’t pay for a house in the Hollywood Hills? How can this be?

      4. LOL

        So the biggest BS things in there are the car payment sufficient to buy a ~$20,000 car… And the insurance on it. People who make minimum wage don’t generally buy $20K cars.

        Rent? Yeah, often times roommates, because they have to. All of those are blown out of proportion, and also ignore that most minimum wage people are not the sole earners in their household. So put down the crack pipe, and consider realistic numbers. Like $400 a month for a room with a roommate, no car payment because they ride the bus or have a $3,000 car they paid cash for. Split the utilities! Etc etc etc.

        You’re ridiculous.

      5. LOL, try to find a decent one bedroom apartment in LA that goes for 770 dollars a month. There are also things called deductions and tax refunds.

        Your calculations are pure fantasy anyways. Most Americans will not have a deficit between monthly take home pay and cost of living that’s only around 60-100 dollars (1,764- 1,664).

        You could probably make 15 dollars a month in places like LA and never afford a decent 3 bedroom house or apartment. Since FICA will eat a larger share of your pay as it goes up, all it would take is slight upticks in cost of living or a reduction in hours or benefits to effectively offset the hike in pay.

        1. 15 dollars an hour

      6. Taxes at 20%. What are you smoking? The marginal rate at that income level is 12%, and 10% below at $13k, so assume overall at 11% but this does not include the individual exemption of $12k this year, so the effective income tax rate for someone at that income level is 0%. One does need to account for payroll taxes at 6.2%, which yields an after tax income for your hypothetical individual of $23,911.

  3. I’m having trouble understanding that sign. There’s a lot you can pack into that message.

    1. There are a few definitions of ‘union’. I wonder which it is he wishes to see.

      I wonder if he would be happy if a took out a ten and a five and flashed them at him while I showed him a video of two Diane’s bare-hearted glass frogs mating.

    2. Kinda shows how far the union attitude has fallen. It used to be “Give Me $15 or I’m Gonna Form a Union and Beat Your Ass.” Now it’s “Give Me $15 and Find Me a Union.”

  4. Yeah, the minimum wage is one of the issues on which I disagree with my progressive friends. I believe the best way to increase standards of living for everyone, but especially the poor and working class, is unlimited immigration.

    #OpenBorders
    #NoMinimumWage

    1. Without cheap migrant labor skirting US labor principles, all the cheap shit in your house wouldn’t be cheap anymore. You guys really have a boner for paying $50 for a pair of undies, huh?

      1. Wait, you think MIGRANT labor does that?

        Lolo loo lollololllll

        1. Cheap tomatoes then.

        2. I’m still trying to wrap my head around your comment… Because minmum wage laws…unless they’re broken and even then… And it’s really importation so….

          Seriously Tony what the fuck man?

          1. The fact that western civilization has never been able to sustain itself, at least with the mass-market goods we are accustomed to, without cheap or free labor, is quite a political, philosophical, and ethical conundrum. If only the anti-immigrant crowd based their objection on that rather than the vulgar “brown skin is icky” attitude.

            1. No that didn’t help at all.

            2. “The fact that western civilization has never been able to sustain itself, at least with the mass-market goods we are accustomed to, without cheap or free labor, is quite a political, philosophical, and ethical conundrum.”

              You do realize that nearly everything produced post-World War II and up until the beginning of the 70’s was produced by the US or European countries, right?

            3. “If only the anti-immigrant crowd based their objection on that rather than the vulgar “brown skin is icky” attitude.”

              Somehow when Cesar Chavez and unions were calling for limitations on immigration that wasn’t racist. How come? Because it tracked well with the opinion of the elites.

              Now workers still want limitations on immigration, but elite opinion has changed (just on unskilled immigration- they still don’t want skilled immigration) it’s now racist.

              So weird how that works

              1. Somehow when Cesar Chavez and unions were calling for limitations on immigration that wasn’t racist. How come?

                Because he was Mexican-American, and was therefore punching up!

                Where have you been for the last five years?

                1. And he literally sent thugs to go beat illegal immigrants up.

                  And Obama loves the guy. They even have streets (and I bet schools) named after him.

                  The left and thuggery go hand in hand.

              2. Biden, both Clintons, schumer, et all talked about ending illegal immigration as late as 2007.

            4. By mass-market goods, you mean the factory made goods produced in the past 2 centuries. During that time, we had open immigration for White people, followed by restricted immigration from the 1920’s to the 1960’s, followed by the moderate immigration policy we have today that is still one of the most generous ones in the world. Most Baby Boomers don’t even notice that their childhood happened under a restrictive immigration policy.

              We should have a generous streamlined immigration system open to people from all nations as a mater of general principle, but restricting immigration will not make our civilization unsustainable.

            5. Is this apologia for slavery?

              Amnesty gets rid of the slave labor by giving them access to enforcement of laws.

              So this is also an argument against open borders and amnesty.

            6. Ignorant Tony is flying today.

              Right. Because civilizations in Asia and Africa never had to rely on ‘cheap labour’. The regions that gave the world top notch slavery rackets.

              1. So retarded.

                The time when the USA was the most prosperous EVER, especially for the working class, was when we had very restricted immigration, and some of the highest wages for workers in the world.

                The truth is America could never allow in another immigrant, and we could even slap massive tariffs on imported goods, and we’d STILL be very wealthy. Because automation and technology have made us so, and those wouldn’t go away.

                Now, we’d be less wealthy than if we had more free trade, and if we took in high skill immigrants… But we’d be able to chug along just fine being better off than almost anybody in the world. The USA is one of the only countries on earth that could legitimately pull this off because we have such vast natural resources, but it’s still true.

      2. What kind of undies are still made in this country, by migrant labor or otherwise?

        1. Well, if Orange is the New Black is to be believed, those made by the incarcerated.

        2. Tony is 100% fine with slavery as long as he benefits from it.

        3. If you buy underpants that say “Made in America” they were probably stolen.

        4. I actually own some! They’re really awesome custom made boxers. The nicest friggin’ underwear I’ve ever owned in my life. City Boxers bro, they’re worth it!

      3. Without cheap migrant labor skirting US labor principles, all the cheap shit in your house wouldn’t be cheap anymore. You guys really have a boner for paying $50 for a pair of undies, huh?

        Wow. While I agree with your “migrant labor is a good thing” conclusion, this is one of the shittiest arguments for it I have ever seen.

        Tony in 1859: “What, you want to pay more for cotton?”

        1. Yep, a typical Democrat from the 50’s.

  5. Where is the evidence that these proposals are likely to pass? The article doens’t offer any that I can see. Did I miss it?

    If not, then the headline of this is a complete lie. Voters don’t look set to do anything. Just because it is on the ballot doesn’t mean it will pass.

    1. – One poll shows support for Arkansas’ Issue 5 at 60 percent.

      -In 2006, 75 percent of Missouri voters voted yes on a wage hike as well, and the state’s two largest cities?Kansas City and St. Louis?have approved minimum wage increases in recent years.

      -Neither of those minimum wages are in effect currently, thanks to Missouri state politicians, who passed a law preempting local minimum wages after St. Louis’ wage hike?passed in 2015 but held up in the courts for two years?had already gone into effect.

      Above cut from the article.

      1. 2006 was 12 years ago. And St Louis is a huge blue city in a red state.

        Thanks for pointing out there is no evidence they are poised to do anything.

    2. Here’s the evidence:

      “People like free shit and the minimum wage is just a corollary of free shit”

    3. More proaganda from Reason.

      The MSM does the same thing. It says that there is oferwhelming support for some Socialist agenda item and then pushes that.

      1. You’re best parody of a rightwinger ever. It’s beautiful. Congratulations. You’ve done it.

  6. The National Employment Law Project?a pro?minimum wage outfit

    This sentence could be re-written as “The National Employment Law Project — a union-backed think tank”.

    1. Info.

      NELP is extremely close to the union movement, receiving funding from major labor unions and working hand-in-glove on labor union legislative initiatives. In recent years, NELP has received funding from the Bricklayers Union, the AFL-CIO, the Service Employees International Union, the United Auto Workers, United Steelworkers, the Carpenters Union, and the California Nurses Association.[14]

      NELP has worked closely with unions on labor legislation at the local level. The free-market Employment Policies Institute used open records laws to show that NELP had written a San Francisco scheduling mandate ordinance in concert with the San Francisco Bay Area Labor Council, AFL-CIO.[15]

      Union officials also sit on the NELP board. Amy Sugimori of Service Employees International Union Local 32BJ, Lynn Rhinehart of the AFL-CIO, and Naomi Walker of AFSCME all hold board positions.[16] Other labor-aligned organizations also have representation on the organization’s board: Working America Education Fund, Family Values at Work, and Amalgamated Bank also have officials on NELP’s board.[17]

    2. How it all works.

      How does a bill become a law? In the city of San Francisco, it’s nothing like the process you learned about in high-school civics class.
      The Retail Workers Bill of Rights (RWBOR), a first-of-its-kind package of employee scheduling mandates passed by the Board of Supervisors in November 2014, was hailed in the press as a historic victory for employees. Now, using hundreds of pages of emails obtained under the California Public Records Act, we know how this radical new mandate was passed.

      The story starts with the brothers Mar ? Eric Mar, who represents District 1 on the Board of Supervisors, and Gordon Mar, the executive director of Jobs with Justice-San Francisco and a one-time political consultant for his brother. In a phone call in January 2014, representatives of Gordon Mar’s group, the Washington, D.C.-based National Employment Law Project (NELP), and San Francisco’s AFL-CIO-affiliated Labor Council solicited ideas for future employment regulation changes. After the call, NELP followed up with suggestions for a new set of restrictions on employee scheduling.

  7. I voted yesterday. The amendments to the state constitution are scary in many instances and have gotten worse here with multi-issue amendments, which I thought weren’t allowed. At least wages weren’t on this year’s.

    1. “Just say no”

  8. By the way, Arkansas and Missouri are deeply socially conservative. They are not at all fiscally conservative.

    1. They are listed as 15th and 25th among all states in terms of fiscal health.

      http://www.mercatus.org/statefiscalrankings

      I don’t see how you can describe that as “not at all fiscal conservative”.

      1. Fiscal health doesn’t always track with a state’s politics. Minnesota is very “blue” (although that’s changed recently) and their fiscal health is very strong.

      2. What the hell does fiscal health mean in this context? It doesn’t mean low taxes, because neither Arkansas or Missouri are low tax states. Just because a state isn’t deep in debt doesn’t make it fiscally conservative. To me it means a government with low taxes and low “services”. Maybe it means something else to you. I don’t know.

        1. Yeah, true. Iowa also has high taxes (at least with regards to income tax) and yet its financial position is still good.

          A state with low taxes and good fiscal health would be TX of FL

          1. Texas has oil and migrant labor.

            1. So does California.

          2. Yup. Several of our socialist friends in Europe and the Anglosphere are actually not bad off debt wise, because they just tax the shit out of everybody and don’t run in the red… So low taxes versus being in debt are largely completely unrelated.

        2. http://wallethub.com/edu/state…..den/20494/

          Arkansas is 19th and Missouri is 38th among the states in terms of tax burden. Missouri is below average and Arkansas just slightly above.

          I know they are evil SOCONS and you like all right thinking people hate their guts. I get that. Don’t ever think I would think you were one of THOSE PEOPLE

          But that doesn’t mean they are guilty of every sin.

      3. Looking at the tax burden, Arkansas is right under Massachusetts in this ranking.

        Ok, Missouri is a little better, but it’s the municipal taxes and fees that get you there.

        1. Neither of them are even in the top 15. Juice is just getting his virtue signal on about the evil SOCONs in flyover country.

      4. Consider relative and absolute fiscal conservatism: it is possible that there is no state whose population is fiscally conservative.

    2. And they love meth.

  9. OT: Attention San Francisco area H&R readers! There will be a meetup of H&R/Reasonoids/Glibertarians in San Francisco on Saturday evening, November 3rd. If you would like to attend, email me at my handle at gmail.com and I’ll send you the details.

    1. Screw you

      1. So you won’t be attending, huh?

        1. Not necessarily. He might simply be stating the ground rules for attending your San Francisco event.

      2. Just Say’n|10.29.18 @ 5:37PM|#

        Screw you

        You were quite the regular when the Glibs first started up, weren’t you? Did something happen, or are you just being playful?

  10. Minimum wage ballot initiatives are often good politics, never good policy.

    Well that’s just economically ignorant bullshit. If a labor market is dominated by a monopsonist or oligopsonist cartel, then a minimum wage is a net positive. It becomes essentially a negotiated wage in an economic environment where there is no other means of negotiating a wage.

    Personally I doubt Missouri fits that criteria. Arkansas might. It’s far more common at the muni level where the large employers can easily dominate the labor market and collude by conducting salary surveys where they agree on how to use that data at the local chamber of commerce. If they can de facto collude, then there is no reason why those affected should not also be able to collude via minimum wage statute.

    At the federal level, there is no valid policy. At the state and local levels, the only ‘libertarian’ option is to leave the decisions up to them. And stop imposing some moronically bogus ideology on them.

    1. That is actually a cogent point. Amazing. You are exactly right. Bravo.

    2. Well said.

    3. This is reason. All writers have to write in puritanical perspectives and ignore the actual state if reality.

  11. Indeed, some cities that have been most aggressive in boosting their minimum wages have seen returns for workers decline. A 2017 city-sponsored study on the effects of Seattle’s $15 minimum wage?passed in 2013, but phased in over time depending on business size?found that workers were actually losing about $125 a month thanks to a mix of hours cutbacks and slower employment growth for lower-wage workers.

    I am against minimum wage laws on general principle, but these results prove that we never have a labor shortage. We sometimes have a shortage of people willing to do a job at a price or employers willing to pay a price for the results of the labor. If you can’t find someone willing to climb a rope for $2 per hour, maybe we don’t need the rope to be climbed.

  12. ” Republicans didn’t help matters by arguing that a patchwork of local minimum wages would be too much of a hassle for businesses.”

    A hodge podge patchwork of conflicting local laws is how you avoid “to big to fail”. What business really means is they cannot afford to bribe a bunch of state and local politicians, so they want a federal override so only the politicians they already own need to be kept n line.
    On the plus side, that also allows business to vote with their feet as well as the citizens. Too many picky regulations on business? Soon no business.

  13. The Show-Me Institute is an American think tank based in St. Louis, Missouri that promotes public policies that advance “free market” principles.
    The organization was founded in 2005 by Rex Sinquefield, who serves as president of the institute’s board of directors.

    In 2014 and 2015, he donated $1 million to Republican Bev Randles’ 2016 campaign for Lieutenant Governor of Missouri and three quarters of a million to Kurt Schaefer, a Republican candidate for Attorney General (after the Missouri legislature ended campaign finance limits in 2009).

    In 2014, he supported a ballot initiative to abolish teacher tenure in Missouri.

    Rex Sinquefield is a “devout” Roman Catholic billionaire Republican.

    He led an initiative to abolish the state income tax, while instituting a REGRESSIVE sales tax that would be applied to virtually any good or service transaction involving individuals (taxes that impact the poor more).

    FOR THOSE THAT DON’T KNOW:
    The WTID wealth inequality index has been rising quickly since the 80’s, and has eclipsed past it’s former peaks in the late 1920’s and late 1930’s.
    The ultra-wealthy now hoard more wealth than at any time in history.

    And yet, like in the late 20’s, they are getting more tax cuts, claiming those cuts will spur the economy (while actually allowing them to acquire & hoard more).

    1. The “free market” is a complete farce…..it is propaganda used by those ultra-wealthy looking for ever-greater wealth.
      Every market is subject to manipulations.
      I challenge anyone to demonstrate contrary evidence.

      Ridding an economy from constraints always leads to vast manipulations by the wealthy-elite.

      This “study” by The Show-Me Institute is wholly biased, and complete crap!

      I’m a staunch capitalist, yet even capitalist “laissez-faire” Economist Adam Smith warned of the perils of unrestrained, unfettered capitalism.

      Unfettered capitalism is wholly unsustainable.
      Humans are greedy, and enough is never too much, thus they always want more.

      Wealth, capital, is a resource. Like all other resources it is limited, governed by the principle of scarcity.

      Thus, the more a few take & hoard, the less there is for everyone else.
      THIS IS THE PROBLEM WITH THE CURRENT STAGNANT ECONOMY.

      The Great Depression (1929) occurred just after the peaking of the WTID index in 1927-1928.

      The Historian and Philosopher Plutarch wrote about the dangers of wealth concentration in his “Life of Lycurgus”.

      Thomas Jefferson warned of the dangers of wealth concentration, witnessing it in England, prior to the American Revolution.

      Thomas Gordon and John Trenchard warned about it in their works “Cato’s Letters”.
      They witnessed firsthand how cronyism consumed and destroyed politics and the government, resulting in extreme corruption, for the sole benefit of the few.

      1. This “article” is terrible, terrible “pseudo-journalism”.

        Executives of The Show-Me Institute include:
        Joseph Forshaw – whom has worked for banks & real estate firms (fodor of the ultra-wealthy).
        Brenda Talent – a Lawyer
        W. Bevis Schock – whom argued against Missouri’s campaign contribution limits before the United States Supreme Court.
        Plus several other Bankers, Lawyers, Judges, energy executives, and Investors.

        It is run by those that ensure healthy profits to the .001 percent in the largest industries.

        Whomever wrote this garbage needs to do a better job of researching their material prior to publishing.

        This is pure elitist propaganda.

        “Articles” like this are why the wealth inequality is growing so quickly, with more wealth being concentrated into fewer and fewer hands.

        Shame on Reason for publishing such propagandist nonsense.

      2. This “article” is terrible, terrible “pseudo-journalism.

        Executives of The Show-Me Institute include:
        Joseph Forshaw – whom has worked for banks & real estate firms (fodor of the ultra-wealthy).
        Brenda Talent – a Lawyer
        W. Bevis Schock – whom argued against Missouri’s campaign contribution limits before the United States Supreme Court.
        Plus several other Bankers, Lawyers, Judges, energy executives, and Investors.

        It is run by those that ensure healthy profits to the .001 percent in the largest industries.

        Whomever wrote this garbage needs to do a better job of researching their material prior to publishing.

        This is pure elitist propaganda.

        “Articles” like this are why the wealth inequality is growing so quickly, with more wealth being concentrated into fewer and fewer hands.

        Shame on Reason for publishing such propagandist nonsense.

        1. jello.beyonce|10.29.18 @ 10:57PM|#
          “”Articles” like this are why the wealth inequality is growing so quickly, with more wealth being concentrated into fewer and fewer hands.”

          Do you want a crying towel, you tired piece of shit?

        2. That’s a lot of text just to point out that there is a dude named W. Bevis Schock.

        3. Ya know, limiting unskilled immigration to the country would do A LOT MORE to improve working class incomes than probably any other manipulation of the market… And with a lot fewer undesired side effects. AND we wouldn’t have a bunch of new leftist voters… So yeah, why don’t we try that before we throw capitalism under the bus comrade?

  14. Arkansas and Missouri aren’t exactly “deeply conservative” states. They’re union and have elected Democrats in statewide elections this century.

    1. ^this.

  15. Here’s a little exercise I like to do called “Crunching the Numbers”:

    So, at a $12 minimum wage:
    Assuming 40/hrs per week
    That gives us a pre-tax full-time income of $480/week, $2,080/mo, $24,960/yr
    Less taxes (est 20 percent) = $384/week, $1,664/mo, $19,968/yr

    The median rent is Missouri = $771-$926mo (from 2016-one bedroom)
    The median utility bill in Missouri = $108/mo
    The median used car payment in Missouri = $378/mo
    Th median auto insurance payment in Missouri = $98/mo
    The median health insurance plan in Missouri = $254

    So, on the low-end we have necessary monthly bills of $1,609
    On the high-end we have necessary monthly bills of $1,764

    This is on a max. take-home salary of $1,664….assuming full-time employment (which many minimum wage jobs aren’t).

    This doesn’t even take into account: Food, clothing, household expenses, gas & maintenance for that car, or entertainment, etc….
    The USDA estimates monthly food costs ON THE LOW END at $240/mo.

    So, even at this minimum wage initiative, workers are expected to get food assistance, at a minimum….food, housing subsidies, and energy assistance.

    Thus people working at this low wage are working just to pay bills.
    Plus they’re getting government assistance.

    Why is it that the GOP plans looks a lot like the Dems plans?

    Bigger government, more bureaucracy, more & larger welfare, less quality of life.
    Meaning either higher taxes, or larger budget deficits.

    1. jello.beyonce|10.30.18 @ 12:01AM|#
      “Here’s a little exercise I like to do called “Crunching the Numbers”:”

      Repeating your tiresome bullshit does not make it better.
      Fuck off.

  16. “Voters in Two Deeply Conservative States Look Set to Approve Minimum Wage Increases Next Week. That’s a Bad Idea.”

    Regardless of the states’ political bent, the devil is in the details.
    SF raised the M/W to $15/hr just about the time the market labor rate went to ~$15-16/hour (what it takes to get a busser in a restaurant), so the lefties get to crew that no jobs were lost.
    So depending on the market labor rates in those states, this could be nothing other than throwing the dimbulb lefties a bone, while doing nothing other than trailing the market.
    Without knowing what the current market M/W is, this is all arm-waving.
    And the lefty ignoramus jello can be profitably ignored; I saved you the effort.

  17. So a few things. I’ve been thinking about moving to Idaho, and as a business owner I checked the going rate for various types of gigs there to see what it was like. They have no minimum wage… Yet minimum wage type jobs were all paying about $9 an hour on up in the Boise area. That’s the market wage there already. Keep in mind Idaho is a pretty damn low cost of living state. I suspect the same may be true in these places.

    If I had to guess, I’d say going up to $11-12 in a few years when they’re fully implemented will be a SLIGHT increase above presumable market wages. But probably not much. If they were phasing into $10, I bet the minimum would never top the market rates at all.

    So this may be 95% political theater. That said, policies that don’t need to exist at all are still dumb to pass, even if they don’t have much of an effect. The market rates are already above the federal minimum basically everywhere in the country, so there is no need to do shit with minimum wages anywhere. I live in Seattle and YEARS before they bumped it up here, nobody would work for less than $11-12 anyway, and climbing. By the time $15 is phased in, I doubt even that will be much above where market rates would have been anyway.

  18. The usual, and harmful, triumph of feelings over facts. Businesses which cannot afford the change will let workers go, reduce hours for workers, or just plain close down.The fact is that jobs which are the subject of minimum wage laws are low-wage because the work done is not WORTH a lot. If you sweep floors at a store, do you really believe you’ve done something worth $15 per hour? The reason unions exist is to get “livable” wages for jobs that don’t deserve it. Sadly, there is a sizable coterie of folks who live in the U.S. whose lack of intelligence and/or knowledge do not suit them for livable wage jobs. What to do? I am not sure, but I AM sure that minimum wage laws are not the solution. Example? Burger stores already have available to them machines, which machines would not require a wage, that can do EVERYTHING human burger store employees can do faster and better than humans. Would the “raise the wage” group prefer these workers have NO WAGE? Apparently so. God damn the era of feelings over facts we sadly live in.

  19. The only way the U.S. (and world) economy continues operating is by continued movement of capital.
    The less money that circulates, the less new money (economic growth) is created, leading to stagnation.

    ? The conservative Hudson Institute reported that the wealthiest 5% of American households held 62.5% of all assets in the US in 2013.
    ? The top 0.01% controlled 22% of all wealth in 2012.

    That concentration has increased significantly since.

    The ultra-wealthy hoard between 10%-60% of their wealth (depending on region) in offshore accounts, to avoid taxes.
    The ultra-wealthy hold some 30%-40% of their assets in liquid form, often stashed for safehaven purposes, thus not circulating back into the economy.

    Worldwide, some $8 TRILLION is withheld from the economy.

    In our system of fractional-reserve banking (currently set at 10% reserve limits), that $8 TRILLION would generate an additional $80 TRILLION in “new” capital – available to recirculate in the economy.

    Lower-income people don’t hoard money like the ultra-wealthy, they tend to spend it (either on necessities, or crap like lottery tickets – both of which STILL contribute to economic growth).
    Hoarding doesn’t contribute to economic growth.

    This is why the global economy is still highly-stagnant.

    The same thing happened in the 1920’s, just prior to the first Great Depression.
    The ultra-wealthy began aggressively hoarding, leaving less to circulate, meaning less economic growth.

    1. So, aside from the misleading and propagandist nature of many of the “studies” referred to herein (often conducted or funded by the wealthy), other factors must be taken into account.

      Correlation does not always mean CAUSATION.

      ? Factors such as, in a number of the cities/areas cited in these studies, minimum wage initiatives have been formed because the areas are home to more ultra-wealthy.
      ? Cost of living has gone up significantly because of those wealthy, thus people look to drive wages up.
      ? The more ultra-wealthy you have in an area, the more hoarding, thus the less money in re-circulation.
      ? The less money in re-circulation, the less overall economic growth, and less revenue for businesses in that area.

      Thus, higher minimum wages DO NOT NECESSARILY CAUSE LESS ECONOMIC ACTIVITY/REVENUE.
      In fact, the exact opposite is likely true.

      The true cause of stagnant economic activity is likely due to the hoarding of capital, by the ultra-wealthy, whom don’t get that capital into the hands of those that’ll spend it, generating greater economic activity.

      PEOPLE NEED TO BE WARE OF LOGICAL FALLACIES WHEN MAKING JUDGEMENTS.

      Herein, Cum Hoc is the fallacy committed when one jumps to a conclusion about causation based on a correlation between two events, or types of event, which occur simultaneously.

      Sadly, fewer people are being taught to employ logic, or think.
      More, they’re being taught just to do as told.
      They therefore can no longer employ reason.

    2. So, aside from the misleading and propagandist nature of many of the “studies” referred to herein (often conducted or funded by the wealthy), other factors must be taken into account.

      Correlation does not always mean CAUSATION.

      ?Factors such as, in a number of the cities/areas cited in these studies, minimum wage initiatives have been formed because the areas are home to more ultra-wealthy.
      ?Cost of living has gone up significantly because of those wealthy, thus people look to drive wages up.
      ?The more ultra-wealthy you have in an area, the more hoarding, thus the less money in re-circulation.
      ?The less money in re-circulation, the less overall economic growth, and less revenue for businesses in that area.

      Thus, higher minimum wages DO NOT NECESSARILY CAUSE LESS ECONOMIC ACTIVITY/REVENUE.
      In fact, the exact opposite is likely true.

      The true cause of stagnant economic activity is likely due to the hoarding of capital, by the ultra-wealthy, whom don’t get that capital into the hands of those that’ll spend it, generating greater economic activity.

      PEOPLE NEED TO BEWARE OF LOGICAL FALLACIES WHEN MAKING JUDGEMENTS.

      Cum Hoc is the fallacy committed when one jumps to a conclusion about causation based on a correlation between two events, or types of event, which occur simultaneously.

      Sadly, fewer people are being taught to employ logic, or think.
      More, they’re being taught just to do as told.
      They therefore can no longer employ reason.

      1. So what’s your first language?

  20. Fuck you, vote me my money!

  21. since the main benefactor of the $ 15.00 / Hour “Minimum” wage is the Federal Government’s favorite slush fund,,The
    Social Security and Medicare “Lockbox” it is really hard to tell what Party might really be sponsoring the many and various efforts. The really funny thing is all of the automation that has already come to pass in the customer service arena. Oh well we were warned that anything above current Federal minimum was going to cost jobs and it has.
    Walmart’s Profits should really be up,, they seldom have any more than 4 warm bodies actually running scanners.
    And I am constantly being urged to pay for regular purchases and monthly prescription refills in advance to “Save Time”
    where the real point is to save Walmart some pennies on their labor cost.

  22. For those that believe in higher minimums should unpaid internships be made illegal? Many trades used to have a training wage, learn a skill, prove you are reliable and get paid instead of paying to go to a trade school. Upon completion you end up with full time employment and wages. A good deal for many young people that got limited by minimum wage laws.
    It is not a benefit but a theft of freedom and flexibility.

  23. States whose voters approve inordinate minimum wage hikes are, eo ipso, not conservative. That’s the problem. People who call themselves “conservatives”, when asked to define what that means, usually cannot do so in any meaningful way. Muddle-mindedness is the characteristic political philosophy of most voters.

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