Pence AOL Account Hacked, Undocumented Immigrants Pay Billions in Taxes, E.U. Could Change U.S. Visa Rules: A.M. Links

• 

  FRANCIS DEAN/DEAN PICTURES/Newscom

  An AOL email account used by Vice President Mike Pence from the 1990s through early 2016 to conduct both personal and Indiana state business was hacked last year, his office confirmed. After the hack, Pence adopted a new AOL email address.

• Undocumented immigrants in America pay an estimated annual $11.74 billion in state and local taxes claims a new report from the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy.
• The FBI's new online FOIA portal is now live.
• "Tolerating prostitution" could become grounds for getting business licenses revoked in Las Vegas.
• The European Parliament is proposing that U.S. citizens be refused visa-free access to the European Union in response to American visa rules affecting citizens from EU-members Bulgaria, Croatia, Cyprus, Poland, and Romania.
• Interior Secretary Ryan Zinke signed an order Thursday repealing a ban on using lead bullets.

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Comments

[Fist of Etiquette]

An AOL email account used by Vice President Mike Pence-

Stop right there.

[Rich]

Why?

It's the start of a great limerick!

[Gene]

....that he thought was protected by a giant fence....

[Scarecrow Repair & Chippering]

... was corrupted by haters ....

[Fascist loofa-faced shitgibbon]

... actual anarchist skaters...

[Rufus The Monocled]

Hello.

[PBR Streetgang]

Before we go any further, do you love me

[Fist of Etiquette]

Always the most awkward line on the affirmative consent form.

[Citizen X - #6]

"Well, i love parts of you."

[Rich]

"Well, I don't love her. But I LLLLOVE her!"

[Fascist loofa-faced shitgibbon]

"do you love me"

Now that I can dance.

[Bee Tagger]

The FBI's new online FOIA portal is now live.

It took that long to crop a photo of a middle finger?

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

Beef sausage is a travesty.

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

Also, "Beef Sausage" was my nickname in college.

[Longtorso, Johnny]

That's what she said.

[Not a True MJG]

Even when done right??

[Careless]

Beef hot dogs are the best hot dogs

[Longtorso, Johnny]

Does it sync with MyFitnessPal?

This cock ring connects to the world's worst social network
...The sensor-laden ring isn't a condom itself, but sits over the base of your preferred prophylactic. Put it on, "get it on," and learn about metrics like the average velocity of thrusts, frequency of sessions, average skin temperature, and other details you probably don't need to know about. After bedroom activity dies down, you can pair the ring's data with the i.Con app via Bluetooth for further analysis.

British Condoms said the data collected is completely anonymous... if you want it to be. Because modesty is dead, users can use the app to share their stats with their friends or the world in what can only be described as a literal dick-measuring contest....

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

I'd use it just so I could finally be able to measure my girth.

[Citizen X - #6]

+1 tuna can

[Fist of Etiquette]

The FBI's new online FOIA portal is now live.

Hopefully they don't mix it up with their online child pornography portal.

[Rich]

Honeypots, both of 'em.

[Bee Tagger]

Interior Secretary Ryan Zinke signed an order Thursday repealing a ban on using lead bullets.

The ban on using them as ice cubes still in place.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Interior Secretary Ryan Zinke signed an order Thursday repealing a ban on using lead bullets.

Apparently he doesn't care if gunshot victims suffer lead poisoning!

[Bee Tagger]

The European Parliament is proposing that U.S. citizens be refused visa-free access to the European Union in response to American visa rules affecting citizens from EU-members Bulgaria, Croatia, Cyprus, Poland, and Romania.

Valuing retaliation this highly sure seems to weaken any points about what an inhumane thing the American government is engaged in.

[Scarecrow Repair & Chippering]

We'll always have blowback.

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

Newscom
An AOL email account used by Vice President Mike Pence from the 1990s through early 2016 to conduct both personal and Indiana state business was hacked last year, his office confirmed. After the hack, Pence adopted a new AOL email address.

Old people, amirite?

[AlmightyJB]

Funny Verizon, who is on this kick to appeal to millennials bought AOL and now Yahoo. This dispite Yahoo's data breeches (another one just discovered). Doesn't sound like AOL all that secure either.

[Fist of Etiquette]

The European Parliament is proposing that U.S. citizens be refused visa-free access to the European Union...

Excluding all the military personnel stationed there so the EU doesn't have to spend money on its own security.

[Free Society]

Oh no he didn't *snaps fingers*

[Fist of Etiquette]

They woke the sleeping giant.

[Stoic]

Pretty sure they all have visas already. Visa-free is for short-term travel.

[Bubba Jones]

They have special passports. Different color

I think they are embossed with a giant FYTW

[Rich]

"Tolerating prostitution" could become grounds for getting business licenses revoked in Las Vegas.

"If you see something, saw something -- even in Vegas."

[Rich]

*say*

*** gets coffee ***

[Fist of Etiquette]

"As you can see, this blade is real. And now my lovely assistant will lie in this box..."

[Rich]

😎

And don't even get me started on those costumes the "ladies" wear!

[Longtorso, Johnny]

What Is "Birth Rape"?

[Rich]

Nice band name.

[Citizen X - #6]

I saw them open for Gwar a couple years ago. They were okay.

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

You're about three days late.

[Rich]

Tough delivery.

[Libertarian]

"You're about three days late."

Somebody's going to be a mommy!

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

Trump transition team canceled plan for ethics training for staff: report

President Trump's transition team called off a plan for an ethics, leadership and management course for his senior White House staff and appointees, including Cabinet members, according to a new report.

According to documents obtained by Politico, the Trump team opted not to have staffers go through the program, which would have covered confirmation hearings, complying with existing laws and orders, dealing with scrutiny from the media and collaborating with lawmakers and agencies.

[Idle Hands]

That's rich. Why would they need it they're practically all CEO's they practically wrote the book on ethics, they're the best kind of people. Trust me you'll love our ethics.

[Rhywun]

Can I get Trump to cancel my HR departments requirement to attend this junk?

[Red Rocks Baiting n Inciting]

Ironically, the briefings on sexual harassment have not been canceled.

[Bubba Jones]

I have to take these courses. They are largely worthless.

[Citizen X - #6]

An AOL email account used by Vice President Mike Pence from the 1990s through early 2016 to conduct both personal and Indiana state business was hacked last year, his office confirmed. After the hack, Pence adopted a new AOL email address.

Jesus Christ, veep. My grandparents don't even use AOL anymore.

[Not a True MJG]

Your grandparents sound like some cool cats, 'zen.

[Citizen X - #6]

Cooler than Pence, apparently.

[Fist of Etiquette]

"Tolerating prostitution" could become grounds for getting business licenses revoked in Las Vegas.

Regulating vice in Las Vegas seems like a fool's errand.

[Libertarian]

"We'll tolerate corruption, we'll tolerate the mob, we'll even tolerate tacky gold-leaf decors. . . but what we will NOT tolerate is paying a woman for sex (unless, of course, payment is in the form of an over-priced dinner and drinks on the strip)."

[Rich]

Undocumented immigrants in America pay an estimated annual $11.74 billion in state and local taxes claims a new report from the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy.

See? They're practically citizens already.

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

And since they don't use any government services, that's 100% pure profit.

[Rich]

*** scratches head ***

Gee, maybe we should *all* be undocumented?

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

This calls for a national Burn Your Papers day!

[Libertarian]

Agreed. If my mental math is correct (that's a huge assumption) that means 30M undocumented immigrants are paying about $400 per head in taxes. Where do I sign up?

[Rhywun]

Sign me up! I mean, don't sign me up!

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

'Do not mess with Nato': Alliance's British chief warns Russian election hacking and fake news could been seen as an act of war

ussia's cyber hacking, meddling in elections and fake news could be deemed acts of aggression by Nato, Britain's most senior officer in the alliance warned yesterday.

General Sir Adrian Bradshaw said Article 5 of the Nato charter ? in which an attack on one member state is an attack on all ? could apply to unconventional forms of warfare.

Yay!

[Citizen X - #6]

Fake News 'An Act Of War;' Entire Media Hardest Hit

[Rich]

I'm sure Putin is quaking in his shirtless boots.

[Libertarian]

Geeze, Rich, I thought you were done with the euphemisms.

[Rhywun]

Please, Britain, come to our defense.

?_?

[Red Rocks Baiting n Inciting]

NATO apparently had their plans all ready to go for when Her Inevitability took office, and like Europe before WW1 doesn't want to let them go to waste.

[Rich]

Shooting death livestreamed on Facebook

WTF *is* it with this stuff?

BAN FACEBOOK!

[Libertarian]

The Singularity is reached in baby steps.

[Sevo]

I'll be happy to spend money somewhere other than Europe. And, BTW, let them pay for their own defense.

[Fist of Etiquette]

After the hack, Pence adopted a new AOL email address.

He's just happy his geocities website remained untouched.

[Citizen X - #6]

Anybody who messes with his dancing baby gif WILL be on the receiving end of some very sharp words.

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

His ICQ account is still going strong.

[Citizen X - #6]

I'd like to get in touch with him and ask about fax machine repair. What's his pager number?

[Jerryskids]

Just use his Friendster account - his user name is MikeyLikes.

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

I am not normally attracted to young, tattooed women, but some of them can really make it work.

[Citizen X - #6]

Fuck you. [sobs]

[Not a True MJG]

C'mon, it shoulda been obvious when he mentioned tattoos.

(it's a pic of Dunham, right?)

[Citizen X - #6]

A bovine vacant gaze resting atop acres of billowing suet. I may never masturbate again.

[Idle Hands]

Why?

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

1 2 3, 1 2 3, drink
1 2 3, 1 2 3, drink
1 2 3, 1 2 3, drink
Throw 'em back till I lose count

I'm gonna swing from the chandelier
From the chandelier
I'm gonna live like tomorrow doesn't exist
Like it doesn't exist
I'm gonna fly like a bird through the night
Feel my tears as they dry
I'm gonna swing from the chandelier
From the chandelier

[Citizen X - #6]

Ok, you're forgiven. That is rad.

[This Machine Chips Fascists]

Expect to hear from my classy class action lawyers. Who's with me?

[Free Society]

You son of a bitch.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Undocumented immigrants in America pay an estimated annual $11.74 billion in state and local taxes claims a new report from the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy.

DEPORT ILLEGALS AND STARVE THE BEAST

[Bubba Jones]

No, use this money to pay for the wall!

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

"Tolerating prostitution" could become grounds for getting business licenses revoked in Las Vegas.

Remember: You can't beat ISIS if you get VD.

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

She may be a bag of trouble.

[Rich]

Keep 'em, um, coming, C J.

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

Juke Joint Sniper was my nickname in college.

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

Juke Joint Jezebel

[Memory Hole]

Fucking badass. Where were those posters when I was in college?

[Sevo]

"Where were those posters when I was in college?"

When you get to college, let us know.

[Idle Hands]

I have it on good authority that nobody had premarital sex in the 1940's. Ever.

[Citizen X - #6]

Sorry to be the one to tell you, bro, but your grandma was hella slutty.

[Chupacabra]

She still is.

[Free Society]

Let's just say that you ought to think twice before sitting on grandma's Davenport.

[Jerryskids]

Interior Secretary Ryan Zinke signed an order Thursday repealing a ban on using lead bullets.

And some people think there's nothing left to cut.

I recently read a piece by some nut alarmed by Trump's intent to get rid of the EPA and start allowing toxic waste manufacturers to just start pouring billions of gallons of flammable genetically-modified plutonium right down our gullets. As if about 99% of the good the EPA accomplished wasn't accomplished by about 1980 and everything since then has cost more than it's worth. Repeal everything back to about 5 years after an agency was created and you've probably gotten close to its original mandated function. After 5 years, any agency is working primarily to metastasize itself and no longer knows or cares about its original purpose.

[Memory Hole]

"It worries me to think about hunting and fishing becoming activities for the land-owning elite," he said in a statement.

Do I detect a whiff of socialism?

[Raston Bot]

?

zinc bullets are price competitive with lead already and there's really only one producer. granted they probably strip your rifling 20% faster but look at that squeaky clean shine!

and you can't use lead shot with water fowl already.

[Mike Laursen]

Zinke seems to be a guy who knows that zinc bullets will strip your rifling.

[Bubba Jones]

No one uses steel shot for clays.

I have trouble believing that enough rifle rounds are expended while hunting so as to justify this.

Deer aren't eating spent bullets.

This would have more effect on shooting ranges that are on public land. Those places are already toxic waste dumps. And no one can afford to use copper bullets for target practice. Those are expense hunting and self defense rounded.

[Marty Feldman's Eyes]

I detect a whiff of concern trolling.

[Domestic Dissident]

He's going to be one of the biggest deregulators in Amereican history, and it's driving the nutbags insane. I love it.

[chemjeff]

flammable genetically-modified plutonium

Now THERE'S a great band name.

[Derpetologist]

file under: well, at least they're being honest

The University of Maryland's Residence Hall Association (RHA) voted to introduce a mandatory student fee to cover Metro rides, calling it appropriate for the school's "socialist" climate.

"When you come to college, you pay into a socialist society," O'Brien, who chairs the RHA Transportation Advisory Committee, told The Diamondback, comparing the fee to standard amenities that apartment tenants are billed for.

"If you stay in a similar place as someone else and you use 10 times as much water as that person, you don't pay more money, [and] people aren't upset about that," he elaborated. "You are helping someone else ride the Metro and it's not like you're not getting anything out of it."

Fascinating. So if I rob you of $100, but give you a lollipop, it's all good because it's not like you didn't get anything out of it.

[Rufus The Monocled]

It's a thug life.

[Citizen X - #6]

I appreciate the RHA's honesty, and will be strongly discouraging my kid from applying to U of M when application time comes around.

[Rich]

"If you stay in a similar place as someone else and you use 10 times as much water as that person, you don't pay more money, [and] people aren't upset about that," he elaborated.

"By golly, it would take using, oh, *1000* times as much for anyone to get upset!"

"You are helping someone else ride the Metro and it's not like you're not getting anything out of it."

"Because children are our future!"

[Fascist loofa-faced shitgibbon]

Using this joker's logic, why would the RHA limit themselves to forcing people to by Metro passes?

Mandatory dance lessons because "you're helping someone else learn to dance"?
Mandatory golf membership because.........
Mandatory hair perming because..............

[Kauzig Kristen]

When you come to college, you pay into a socialist society

I guess I didn't go to college for a degree and job prospects after all. Who knew I was agreeing to live in a socialist society?

[Rhywun]

Is there some non-socialist society out there I haven't heard about?

[Citizen X - #6]

Hmm...

[Kauzig Kristen]

If I had kids, this is the only college I would want them to go to (maybe Mason, too)

[Raston Bot]

online education is already attractive. this guy doesn't need to sell it anymore.

[Bubba Jones]

I don't get it. Don't All students have to pay those fees. Even the poor ones?

And in the real world you do have to pay for water and electricity.

[WakaWaka]

"The European Parliament is proposing that U.S. citizens be refused visa-free access to the European Union in response to American visa rules affecting citizens from EU-members Bulgaria, Croatia, Cyprus, Poland, and Romania"

That will show those Americans. We all know how much the American economy is reliant on tourism from Bulgaria, Croatia, Cyprus (how are they part of the EU when Turkey and Greece continue to dispute its legitimate government?), Poland, and Romania and not the other way around.

[Azathoth!!]

The weird thing is that the demand for visas from Bulgaria, Croatia, Cyprus, Poland, and Romania appears to have been started in 2014.

That is to say, it comes from the Obama administration.

Why is the EU reacting now?

[Memory Hole]

"He was literally conducting himself as a United States senator," White House press secretary Sean Spicer said Thursday. He said Mr. Sessions didn't discuss matters related to Mr. Trump's campaign.

These statements fall apart upon closer scrutiny.

Wall Street Journal reports:

The Trump administration says Attorney General Jeff Sessions was acting as a then-U.S. senator when he talked to Russia's ambassador at last year's Republican National Convention, but Mr. Sessions paid for convention travel expenses out of his own political funds and he spoke about Donald Trump's campaign at the event. At the time Mr. Sessions met the Russian ambassador at the convention, he had been serving as chairman of Mr. Trump's Foreign Policy Advisory Committee for more than four months.

[WakaWaka]

Pretty sure this is the only time you've ever read the Wall Street Journal over the NYT

[Red Rocks Baiting n Inciting]

It's hilarious that you and the left are desperately flogging this nothingburger instead of focusing on Sessions' more egregious sins like his support for the drug war and civil asset forfeiture.

[american socialist]

This

[Marty Feldman's Eyes]

focusing on Sessions' more egregious sins like his support for the drug war and civil asset forfeiture.

Those things aren't going to get him booted. No one will intentionally drown even the most unpopular passenger on a sinking cruise ship, you have to wait until his blood is in the water and let the sharks take care of him.

[Red Rocks Baiting n Inciting]

Maybe, but it speaks to the depths of vacuity our society has sunk that the Dems are making hay over this rather than stuff that has real, everyday impacts to the citizenry.

Look at the chimpouts over the DeVos nomination--MASSIVE left-wing phone and email campaigns over a cabinet position that does little more than cut checks to poor schools and acts as a glorified cheerleader the administration, a post so unnecessary that 0.01% of the shriekers could probably name any Ed Secretary in the last 35 years without looking it up on Wikipedia first. The visa protests weren't even focused on how it affected Americans, it was because foreigners were inconvenienced.

At least during the Bush years the left still acted like it gave a shit about how Republican policies impacted Americans. Trump has truly broken their brains if this is what they're going to be hammering on the next 4-8 years.

[Marty Feldman's Eyes]

it speaks to the depths of vacuity our society has sunk that the Dems are making hay over this rather than stuff that has real, everyday impacts to the citizenry.

True that, we have scandal driven as opposed to policy driven politics. Seems like it's been that way since... well, no matter how far back I go I keep coming up with an older example. Scandals are how things get done nowadays so it seems odd to take Dems to task for seizing an opportunity and we all know R would have done the same.

Agree about DeVos. I think they picked her for their fight because she looked vulnerable, whereas Sessions looked like a shoe-in. And of course it's not like they didn't want to fight Sessions, but hey, can't have anyone insulted on the floor of the Most Derpiest Body.

[Bubba Jones]

Ok, but isn't the question about the content of the discussion? He hadn't resigned as senator.

[Rhywun]

The European Parliament is proposing that U.S. citizens be refused visa-free access to the European Union

I'm sure the Left will be demonstrating against this policy in front of the EU embassy or whatnot any minute now.

[Free Society]

An AOL email account used by Vice President Mike Pence from the 1990s through early 2016 to conduct both personal and Indiana state business was hacked last year, his office confirmed. After the hack, Pence adopted a new AOL email address.

AOL is still in business? The only perk I can imagine from using their email service is for people who want to get a sense of what internet was like in the 90's.

[Sevo]

"An AOL email account used by Vice President Mike Pence from the 1990s through early 2016 to conduct both personal and Indiana state business was hacked last year, his office confirmed."

I was not disappointed.
The local rag hinted strongly that this was *exactly* like the hag setting up the server in the hall closet.

[Domestic Dissident]

Valerie Jarrett has moved into Casa de Block Yomomma in order to help lead the Shadow Government/"Resistance".

No word on whether or not George Soros has his own bedroom there.

[Jerryskids]

My guess is that, technically, all the bedrooms are Soros'. The Obamas are humble public servants and have been all their lives, it's not like they would be able to afford multi-million dollar homes in DC, California, and Hawaii on humble public servant salaries. Somebody's got to be paying their expenses.

[Careless]

$60 million plus royalties to write a book that no one will read is a nice deal.

[creech]

People will buy the book to virtual signal. Oh yeah, as you said, no one will actually read it.

[DanO.]

Man, those experienced, profit-conscious publishers must be idiots!

[Careless]

I never said no one would buy it

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

Yeah, we saw this yesterday. You really missed out on all the hilarity.

[Domestic Dissident]

I've been spending more time at the new competition lately. Folks are both more intelligent and more interesting over there.

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

OH SNAP SICK BURN, YO! Totally original too!

[Citizen X - #6]

Mikey, you wouldn't know "intelligent" if it bit you on the ass.

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

I don't think those guys are going to put an endorsement from Mikey on their website.

[Domestic Dissident]

You clowns are Exhibit A.

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

Hey, don't blame us for the fact that you and Free Society are too utterly moronic to realize that people aren't objecting to the commentators but to the mind-numbing stupidity of the commentary provided.

[Free Society]

Ha ha. So you think all those commenters left because of meanie commentarians that you don't like. Such insights you have,

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

So you think all those commenters left because of meanie commentarians that you don't like

Nope. I just wish the dumbfucks would quit coming back and those with actual useful comments would come by more often.

[Free Society]

I wish you would piss off too, Sparky. It's mutual. We all want things, hypocrite.

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

I wish you would piss off too, Sparky. It's mutual. We all want things, hypocrite.

Uh oh, looks like I hurt someone's feelings again. 🙁

[DanO.]

I just wish the dumbfucks would quit coming back

They've become what they used to accuse other exiles of doing: leaving the site in a huff and going to other places to complain endlessly about this place. There's a justice in irony.

[Citizen X - #6]

Hey, i enjoyed the contributions of many of the departed, and their perspectives are missed. Every time Mikey comments, though, a baby gets an extra chromosome.

[John Titor]

You know guys, you could just come over and ask the crowd what their opinions are, rather than use your John-approved mind reading powers. It's almost like there's a variety of reasons why people left.

[Free Society]

Considering that the mass exodus was spurred by a series of articles and the commentarians themselves were framing as though it were "the last straw", I don't need to read minds. I just read the statements they issued immediately preceding their departure as well as email exchanges I've followed up with. I don't recall any saying that they were leaving because of fellow commentarians, not to say that couldn't possibly be a reason why some small number of them left.

[John Titor]

I'm more just referring to the general tit-for-tat that's been going on here about why large sections of the commentariat left instead of this specific argument. Most of the discussions here about it have been way more about people projecting their own opinions than the reality of the situation.

[Free Society]

Within the range of beliefs on this topic, I find the one with the least credibility to be "they left because of all the right-wingers in the comments". Maybe my estimation is off, but of the people who left and announced their departure, they seemed to be evenly split along cosmo and yokel lines. So it seems to be a kind of "bipartisan" opposition to the tact Reason has taken lately. Even the ardent open borders crowd find Dalmia insufferable, for example.

[John Titor]

There's numerous factors for most, with a general decline in the content being the primary one, followed by a decline in the commentariat afterwards (and outside of some specific people, this has less to do with the actual 'yokel/cosmo' leanings and more to do with the general quality of the comments once the majority of the people left). No one wants to read a thread that is just John and chemjeff arguing (though you at least seem to have less AddictionMyth/dajjal now). Some also prioritize the response to the sloopy's mom issue as their breaking point.

[Free Society]

Yeah the Sloopy's mom thing was a factor. And I will not for a second tell you that the comment section is just as good after the departure. A lot of very decent people left and I include on that score a great many people with whom I often disagreed. At the same time that they left, some new commenters came in who just suck. Hail Retaxes emerged from the ether and made a point of talking shit about regulars who left because he thought they were attention whores for saying goodbye to their friends of many years. The mosaic ain't as pretty as it used to be.

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

I don't think anyone here, including the Reason staff (if they care), is confused about why the people who left did so. I actually applaud those who left for finding a libertarian solution to the problem they identified. A good many are high class, high quality commentators.

Unfortunately, the bulk of those who keep coming back have nothing useful to offer. Providing such witticisms as "Fire Shikha!", "Robby's a fag!", and "Our website is where all the cool kids are hanging out!" Shit, even banjos stopped by to do nothing more than troll. And trolling is exactly what that is, let's not kid ourselves here. I personally would love for some of the others to stop in from time to time and offer their insights. But you've gotta believe that everyone who is going to leave has done so.

The honest people here aren't getting down on you and/or driving you off because you left. It's because trolling is trolling no matter who is doing it.

[Free Society]

Providing such witticisms as "Fire Shikha!", "Robby's a fag!"

Those people are just so terrible. Not like the white knights who defend their every indefensible utterance.

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

Those people are just so terrible. Not like the white knights who defend their every indefensible utterance

I applaud you for owning your stupidity and not feeling ashamed of it.

[Free Society]

You lean on insults like a crutch. I voice my opposition to Robby and Dalmia, Sparky disagrees, ergo I'm stupid. Thanks for contributing.

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

You lean on insults like a crutch

I don't think calling you stupid is an insult. It's actually a statement of objective truth. Have you heard of res ipsa loquitor? It's a bit like that. Most of your comments are comments that only a stupid person would ever make. You seem to honestly believe that someone telling you to stop calling Robby a fag is not only white knighting but also agreeing 100% with his statements. You also seem to believe that anyone who doesn't agree with you is a leftist, closeted or otherwise. And you continue to do so even after bitching about people calling you a stupid rightist when they don't agree with you.

You don't know irony.
You don't know shame.
You don't know disagreement.

[Free Society]

I don't think calling you stupid is an insult. It's actually a statement of objective truth. Have you heard of res ipsa loquitor? It's a bit like that. Most of your comments are comments that only a stupid person would ever make.

This is what I'm talking about. You like to lay it on real thick because you don't know any other way to win an argument. Relying on insults to win an argument for you is the crutch of an intellectual cripple.

When did I call Robby a fag? You keep attributing that to me. I want to see a quote.

Someone criticizes Dalmia for calling immigration restriction slavery, you call them a troll. Someone criticizes Robby for making bullshit equivalences or whatever, you call them stupid and tell them to stop calling Robby a fag. You are a white knight for every writer who gets criticized for arguing like a leftist.

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

When did I call Robby a fag?

Maybe effeminate little man-child means something else in your world.

Someone criticizes Dalmia for calling immigration restriction slavery, you call them a troll

Never done that. She is an idiot so I tend to avoid commenting on her posts, like a grown up.

Someone criticizes Robby for making bullshit equivalences or whatever, you call them stupid and tell them to stop calling Robby a fag

I'm not sure I see anyone criticize what Robby actually writes anymore. I see plenty of name calling and other insults and a general avoidance of addressing his points.

You are a white knight for every writer who gets criticized for arguing like a leftist.

I suppose this wouldn't be necessary if people would argue the articles rather than insult the writers.

[Free Society]

Maybe effeminate little man-child means something else in your world.

Yes it does. It means effeminate+stunted adult. Do I seriously need to post some dictionary entries for you or do you think you can manage to look it up on your own?

Never done that. She is an idiot so I tend to avoid commenting on her posts, like a grown up.

So what is it then when you don't avoid commenting on commentarian posts you don't like? The height of adulthood? I disagree with your assertion that commenting on articles you disagree with is childish but I implore you to take that tact with me in the future. Every conversation I've ever had with you is a complete waste of time and effort, so please be a grown up, as you say, and just don't comment on my posts or anyone you disagree with anymore. Hypocrite.

[John Titor]

I don't think anyone here, including the Reason staff (if they care), is confused about why the people who left did so.

They don't, that isn't the issue.

But you've gotta believe that everyone who is going to leave has done so.

I don't see the quality of the magazine improving in the near future, rather the opposite, so I don't believe so. Traffic seems to be indicating this isn't true either.

Shit, even banjos stopped by to do nothing more than troll.

Yes, in a thread for an article where the author compared immigration law to slavery. Somehow I think it might have something to do with the quality and laughable nature of such work.

[John Titor]

The honest people here aren't getting down on you and/or driving you off because you left. It's because trolling is trolling no matter who is doing it.

The only 'honest people' here who actually articulates this reason is you sparky. The rest are throwing tribalist fits about the 'Secession of the Yokels' or how we're all secret Trump supporters. Some of which are probably Mary.

[Free Society]

Yeah I didn't see any trolling from Banjos. I guess if "trolling=people saying things I don't agree with", then sure. But that's a pretty low bar.

[John Titor]

She posted the Alexa figures link and made a comment about Reason's click decline. Yeah, she was trolling a bit for an emotional reaction.

However, it is not entirely unwarranted when the author is legitimately making insanely stupid remarks that are unworthy of any respect. I'm sorry, some people are not going to take your website super-seriously when you have a hyperbolic freakout about how immigration law is totes slavery, you guys! It's a shitty, childish smear job by a bad writer. Hell, if I didn't know Dalmia's work I would say she was trolling, but she lacks the self-awareness for it.

[John Titor]

And for the record, if Dalmia was some principled AnCap who truly believed and articulated a sound idea of how state control of anything is slavery, there wouldn't be a problem here, and there'd be an actual discussion on its merits. But she's not, she's a terrible writer with an extremely shallow view living in her own little moral fantasy world so she can hyperventilate about how anyone who disagrees with her is just the worst.

[Free Society]

And for the record, if Dalmia was some principled AnCap who truly believed and articulated a sound idea of how state control of anything is slavery, there wouldn't be a problem here, and there'd be an actual discussion on its merits. But she's not, she's a terrible writer with an extremely shallow view living in her own little moral fantasy world so she can hyperventilate about how anyone who disagrees with her is just the worst.

Very well stated.

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

she's a terrible writer with an extremely shallow view living in her own little moral fantasy world so she can hyperventilate about how anyone who disagrees with her is just the worst

I actually agree with you. I just avoid it now instead of just dropping insults though.

[Free Society]

I actually agree with you. I just avoid it now instead of just dropping insults though.

You lying holier-than-thou hypocrite. That's all you do. Damn near every time you disagree with some non-author it's a ticket to insult city. I guess it's totes different if the person isn't on Reason's staff. What a fucking joke.

[Free Society]

I agree it was entirely warranted, I don't think it's trolling though. Trolling as I understand it is a very specific thing and I don't think making fun of the publication on some specific issues with a source no less, necessarily fits the bill. If it was trolling, by anyone's standard it's a far cry from the AddictionMyth or Hail Retaxes types of trolling.

[DanO.]

even banjos stopped by to do nothing more than troll

She's a nasty one.

[Red Rocks Baiting n Inciting]

I'm curious to see how long their blog actually lasts. Running one of those things is a lot more work than people realize, and I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of them eventually run out of steam and drop out.

With that said, having another outlet for libertarian kvetching isn't a bad thing.

[DanO.]

In a year they'll be another Grylliade -- 15 people repeating themselves 45,000 times.

[Not a True MJG]

You're doing them a huge favor with these advertisements.

[Derpetologist]

I will keep posting on HnR from time to time. They've been slipping lately, but pretty much the only news site of any size with a perspective that is similar to mine. I've donated a few hundred dollars to Reason over the years and have been a regular reader since 2008.

The comments were the best thing about HnR. It's baffling that KMW, Dalmia, and Soave seemed determined to drive them away. I enjoyed the comments more than anything they wrote.

My constructive criticism is:

1. 1 Trump article per day is enough. ">. Do you now see why we talk about Trump Derangement Syndrome? What is left to say about him that has not been said already? I get that he is definitely not a libertarian and deserves regular coverage since he is president. 1 article per day is enough.

2. If you are going to publish article after article advocating for open borders, it needs to be balanced with articles calling for the welfare state to be dismantled. Reason does a better job of balancing calls for reduced military spending with advocacy for non-intervention.

[Derpetologist]

3. Soave has got to stop with the "to be sure" and other what-about-isms. If leftists are doing something stupid, just report what it is. There is need to constantly tack on that campus conservatives are just as bad. It's not true. It is also idiotic to write about how left-wing idiocy hurts their reputation and cause. Why the hell would I be worried about that? We're libertarians. Why they hell would I want leftists to be more effective?

4. Dalmia needs to learn that there is a whole spectrum of opinion on immigration from "open borders" to "wide door, tall fence" and there are libertarians everywhere between those two extremes.

That's all I got for now.

[Rhywun]

It's on record from some poster I never heard of until this morning that you and your ilk are just trolling us.

[Free Society]

It's on record from some poster I never heard of until this morning that you and your ilk are just trolling us

What's with all the newbies trying to educate the rest of us about H&R history? I keep hearing two retarded versions of events, everyone who left were left-libertarian goodthinkers who were driven away by all the reactionary neocon commenters. The other incorrect narrative I've seen bandied about is that the fleeing posters were reactionary neocons chased off by the sound and reasonable arguments put forth by Dalmia and Soave.

[Rhywun]

I'm sure it's just more socks, not newbies.

[american socialist]

Yea like konima was bo cara but changed name for some reason

[Free Society]

Why the hell would I be worried about that? We're libertarians. Why they hell would I want leftists to be more effective?

Because Robby's mind operates off of leftist assumptions as his starting point. He finds their vision valid, he respects their ostensibly good intentions and he thinks they're natural allies of libertarians. All of that and he's an effeminate man-child.

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

Way to help your cause there, chief.

[Free Society]

That's such an incisive critique coming from you, boss.

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

Your cutting commentary along the lines of "FIRE SHIKAKAH!" and "RBOBO'S SO FAG!" are exactly what is needed in this new era.

[Free Society]

Citation needed on those quotes. In any case, I'm sorry that it hurts your little feelings to see your heroes disparaged. It's only right that if I disagree with someone, I shouldn't say anything. Wouldn't want to offend the closeted leftists.

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

Free Society|3.3.17 @ 10:03AM|#

Why the hell would I be worried about that? We're libertarians. Why they hell would I want leftists to be more effective?
Because Robby's mind operates off of leftist assumptions as his starting point. He finds their vision valid, he respects their ostensibly good intentions and he thinks they're natural allies of libertarians. All of that and he's an effeminate man-child.

Wouldn't want to offend the closeted leftists.

Didn't we have to give you a lesson in irony not that long ago?

[Free Society]

So insulted him? Boo hoo. It doesn't mean I didn't put forward an argument. You insulted me upthread, hypocrite. You use insults early and often in fact. In any case your all caps quoted text is not in any way a representation of what I wrote, but that's what I expect from you.

[WakaWaka]

Charles Murray was banned from speaking at a college campus and labeled a 'white supremacist' (which is bizarre because his book the Bell Curve, does not identify whites as all that supreme).

Prediction: A LOT of 'to be sures' from Soave if he even writes about it.

[Domestic Dissident]

I don't disagree with you a bit, but it should be pretty clear at this point that a) they don't really care what their "customers" here think, and b) they aren't going to change under the current leadership.

This is what they want. They're pushing a very specific agenda, and their attitude is that anyone who doesn't like it can go fuck themselves. Message received.

[$park? don't care bout yo mom]

Message received.

By some more than by others.

[Rhywun]

Yeah, it is pretty clear to me that they're pushing an agenda. There is far, far less give and take than there used to be - and I've been around for ~15 years.

[Citizen X - #6]

Hey, i only come here to chew gum and remind Mikey that he's retarded.

And i'm all out of gum.

[DanO.]

anyone who doesn't like it can go fuck themselves

Or quietly leave, which would be a true libertarian action. But you're a troll, not a libertarian. So you're here just to whine. And read the minds of the Reason Foundation, which hasn't uttered a single word about this little tempest in a teapot. The fact that mere commenters think they are the lifeblood of a news-blog is hilarious. They're the tail that thinks they are wagging the dog.

[Jerryskids]

I'm curious as to why Trump's made such a big deal out of the several million illegal voters who unfairly cost him the extremely popular vote and AFAIK never mentioned the Jerk Johnson/Whacky Weld votes unfairly denied him. Is it because Trump is under the impression that most of those dumb losers who voted unfairly for the dumb loser Libertarian Party would have voted for Crooked Hillary if not for the LP and therefore he would have unfairly lost the yugely popular vote by an even biglier margin had the LP not been on the ballot?

And is Reason using the same logic, thinking they've got more to gain by appealing to the anti-Trumper left rather than to the NeverTrumper conservatives? If Trump turns out to be the trainwreck Reason's betting he's going to be, who gets vindicated more and who benefits - the Bernie Bros or the Ted Cruz supporters? Reason seems to be betting Bernie's the right side of history to get on.

[chemjeff]

If leftists are doing something stupid, just report what it is.

But if conservatives are doing something stupid, then it must must be followed up with BUT OBAMA or BUT HILLARY.

[Marty Feldman's Eyes]

Soave has got to stop with the "to be sure" and other what-about-isms.

The way I've always looked at it is that Reason the mag and the blog are the outreach arm of the foundation. Outreach means putting things in terms that will appeal to people who aren't already open to your ideas.

I'm a classical musician. When we do "outreach", we don't go into a library or school and play Boulez. We play something they can latch on to, like a piece of classical music that was in a popular movie. Maybe the piece isn't the best, but it gives them a hook to grab onto so they don't think they are listening to abstract noise because they don't understand it.

Soave speaks the lingo because that's what non-libertarians understand.

[Careless]

Some of them have been coming around to the Trump Acceptance stage the past week or two, actually. Trying to plot out a best way forward since he is the president. Which has been a nice change.

[Mike Laursen]

I've said this before, but the point is often missed. Reason's main line is publishing a print magazine that is fact-checked and has an editor. It is where Reason posts articles.

Hit & Run is just a blog where the staff quickly post blog posts. Thus the name of the blog.

[Not a True MJG]

^ This guy gets it.

[This Machine Chips Fascists]

"I call our world Flatland, not because we call it so, but to make its nature clearer to you, my happy readers, who are privileged to live in Space."

[DanO.]

You forget the fact that people are literally DYING because of what Shikha tweets. OMG she's worse than Mao!

[american socialist]

What if i use 10x water and the metro?

[Careless]

Undocumented immigrants in America pay an estimated annual $11.74 billion in state and local taxes

A whole $1,000 a head! Meanwhile, they're raking in along the lines of $45,000 a year in government benefits while their children are minors.

[#NotMyReason (Krabappel)]

According to reports, federal authorities have arrested the man believed to be responsible for making death threats to Jewish community centers across the United States.

The man arrested is 31-year-old Juan Thompson, of St. Louis.

According to the complaint filed by the FBI, Thompson made eights threats as part of a cyber harassment campaign against his ex-girlfriend. Thompson then contacted the Center of American-Islamic Relations with an anonymous tip blaming his ex-girlfriend for the threat. He is also charged with stalking and making false complaints claiming his ex was in possession of child porn.

What a surprise, nothing to do with the fucking alt right. Where's that piece of shit, Tony?

[Citizen X - #6]

When have facts ever mattered to Tony?

[american socialist]

They dont. He is a pure partisan which is funny he complains about others being partisan

[#NotMyReason (Krabappel)]

Never but he was here the other day pushing the Trump=anti-semitism garbage the other day citing the JCC bomb threats.

[Domestic Dissident]

You beat me to it. Soave, Brown, and all of Reason's lefties are going to be so bitterly disappointed. Expect this news to be completely ignored now in these parts.

[#NotMyReason (Krabappel)]

It never smelled right from the beginning. I have never heard of any kind of massive anti-semitism from the right. Most of the religious right supports Jewish people and Israel.

[Not a True MJG]

(((Indeed)))

[This Machine Chips Fascists]

A lot of the religious right supports Jewish people and Israel because a big portion of them think that all Jews must return to Israel. Not because they love Jew and Israel, because it's one of the conditions for YHWH to send a zombie to perfect His 6000 year old failed creation. When the last Jew is stuffed back into The Promised Land, Armageddon can commence.

[This Machine Chips Fascists]

make that "When the last *free range* Jew is stuffed back into The Promised Land

[Free Society]

The free range ones produce more eggs.

[Bubba Jones]

A lot? What fraction?

[Free Society]

It's time for Trump to denounce and apologize for all the bigotry and hate crimes that his supporters have, yet again, been falsely accused of committing.

[Careless]

I could see him doing some trolling like that.

[Aloysious]

This mornings musical selections: Post Modern Jukebox as well as KMFDM?

Beautiful.

[MiloMinderbinder]

Undocumented immigrants in America pay an estimated annual $11.74 billion in state and local taxes claims

Great! With 11 to 12 million illegals that comes out to about $1000 per capita.

Last year my local school district spent $12,500 per student. (Not counting debt service or contributions to the teachers' pension fund). So any illegals families with a kid start $11,500 in the hole, before we even get to health care.

[Rhywun]

So I go to the link and it's pushing an agenda even harder that here. I give up.

[Careless]

Yes, this is a rather comical own-goal to anyone who's slightly numerate, which apparently does not include ENB

[Not a True MJG]

ENB's editorializing of that information is quite ridiculous.

[Domestic Dissident]

Looks like they've arrested the guy who has allegedly been making the bomb threats against Jewish centers. A far-right Trump/Bannon neo-Nazi protege, right?

Nope, he's actually a black far left radical named Juan Thompson who calls capitalists "bloodsuckers" on Twitter.

[Raston Bot]

leftist with a mental problem.

😐 my shocked/not shocked face

[Domestic Dissident]

Oh, and get this shit, this Thompson assclown is a disgraced JournoList who used to work for The Intercept (Glenn Greenwald's outfit) but got fired for fabricating fake news.

Basically, he's another Elizabeth Nolan Brown, although I don't think Thompson pretends to be a libertarian.

[#NotMyReason (Krabappel)]

Holy crap, I hadn't seen that reported yet. Unbelievable. Overall I like Glenn Greenwald but he has made some bad hires at the intercept. At least they got rid of this clown.

[Domestic Dissident]

No shit. I'll bet they're pretty glad that they did!

Too bad Welch and Gillespie aren't as intelligent or as good at judging character as Greenwald is.

[Raston Bot]

i'd be surprised if Greenwald decided new hires.

[#NotMyReason (Krabappel)]

Probably not alone, but they can't be that big of an organization?

I feel dumber everytime I read anything written by Jon Schwarz. That guy is a completely Vox-level hack.

[Domestic Dissident]

"America will sink giggling into the sea."
-Actual quote from disgraced JournoList Juan Thompson

I predict that before that happens, Juan Thompson will slink grimacing into a small prison cell!

[Citizen X - #6]

That's just dumb, shitty writing. The Thompson quote, too.

[Isaac Bartram]

The European Parliament is proposing that U.S. citizens be refused visa-free access to the European Union in response to American visa rules affecting citizens from EU-members Bulgaria, Croatia, Cyprus, Poland, and Romania.

I could be wrong, but my impression from the article is that this has nothing to do with Trump's EO.

AFAICT this was established policy that predates the Trump admin.

I suspect that since these are new members (since 2004 and later) that its more than likely an administrative oversight.