LGBT

Gary Johnson Getting Nearly as Many LGBT Voters as Trump

Clinton is still the heavy favorite.

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Gary Johnson
Paul Gordon/ZUMA Press/Newscom

A new poll has Hillary Clinton dominating Donald Trump with registered gay, lesbian, bisexual, and transgender voters. This is not terribly surprising news. But both Libertarian Party candidate Gary Johnson and Green Party candidate Jill Stein are drawing some notable numbers from the LGBT community.

NBC partnered with Survey Monkey to track likely voters for two weeks in September. In a head-to-head matchup between Clinton and Trump, Clinton won overwhelmingly, 72 percent to 20 percent. Those numbers are generally comparable to the split in the LGBT vote in previous elections.

But the poll also evaluated a four-way matchup. There, both Clinton's and Trump's numbers dropped. Clinton would beat Trump for the LGBT vote, 63 percent to 15 percent. Johnson would get 13 percent of the LGBT vote and Stein would get 8 percent. So the third-party candidates are pulling 9 percentage points worth of LGBT votes from Clinton and 5 percentage points from Trump. And given that the head-to-head matchup shows an 8 percent either undecided or declining to say, it's safe to say that there's a good number of LGBT voters unhappy with their major party choices.

LGBT votes
NBC/SurveyMonkey

By and large, though, the poll also shows that LGBT voters view Clinton much more positively than the general public. Among those polled, 59 percent view Clinton positively. Her popularity numbers when comparing the LGBT community to the general community are essentially reversed. Trump's favorability rating is even worse among LGBT voters than it is among the general public. Only 17 percent of LGBT voters view Trump favorably.

Trump's unpopularity with the LGBT community should be seen as rather striking, given that he's less openly hostile on gay issues than previous Republican candidates. But policy-wise, he's extremely unpredictable. He has taken both sides on the debate over whether North Carolina can ban transgender people from using the school or government bathrooms and other facilities of their choice. He has, as the election gone on, essentially taken every Republican position, including opposition to the legal recognition of gay marriage.

Clinton, meanwhile has promised the LGBT community anything any activist group has asked for, a host of new federal laws and regulations to protect them, and just about anything at all to get the gay vote.

But clearly a good chunk of LGBT voters are thinking beyond gay issues, which is not unusual. What is unusual is that these third-party candidates are siphoning off such large numbers. According to the poll, 70 percent of the LGBT voters who responded identify as Democrats or lean Democrat. That means Clinton is losing seven percentage points from LGBT voters within her party when Johnson and Stein are offered.

The LGBT voting community is not large. They accounted for seven percent of this total voting sample. But given how close the polls are now, that's enough to swing an election outcome.

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  1. “He has taken both sides on the debate over whether North Carolina can ban transgender people from using the school or government bathrooms and other facilities of their choice.”

    Even the article pointed out that he’s really just a federalist “On the other hand, really, Trump is probably just saying here that it’s not a matter for the federal government to get involved at all.”

  2. Who gives a fuck?

  3. Well, why wouldn’t the LGBLT voters support a 70 year old woman who publicly demonized them and, along with her husband, supported policies that were actively discriminatory until public opinion overwhelmingly told her it was safe to do otherwise?

    It only seems natural, right?

    1. Look, Hillary was always willing to talk about gay marriage, but first she needed to bring those fags to heel.

    2. I think you’re mistaking motivations here.

      You assume that gays will vote or not vote for clinton because of her track record dealing with “their issues”. i.e. assuming that voters are always primarily self-interested in ‘their issues’ to the exclusion of more-general ones.

      its the same mistake people make talking about the ‘hispanic vote’, and acting as though they all somehow monolithically give a shit about ‘immigration’ , when in fact its fairly low on their list of priorities (*i mean, hey, they’re already here)

      I’d guess that gays vote overwhelmingly for clinton because “woman”, because “why not”, because everyone else is lame anyway. And they do so more reliably than many women, even. Basically, its a style thing, and isn’t about ‘policy’ so much. Just let her do it already, she wants to!?!

      1. This is where everyone’s worst friend, Episiarch, would swoop in and say something about “team voting” and how Jerry Bruckheimer films are awful. And he’d only be half right.

      2. From my (admittedly anecdotal) survey of What the fuck has Hillary done?, it seems like a solid chunk of her “accomplishments” are on “LGBT” issues. She has done a lot to pander to the “gay vote”. Her past attitudes and positions are mostly irrelevant now, no doubt because “she evolved” and “she was only saying what was popular at the time” (um, hooray? get ready to be thrown under a bus again later).

        1. “” a solid chunk of her “accomplishments” are on “LGBT” issues.””

          I doubt this is actually the case. I DO know that she made a huge stink @ the State Dept about making this a very visible thing… where she advertised very lgbt-friendly hiring practices at State, and waved around a lot of stern-statements to countries that were ‘not LGBT-friendly’ (see: Africa, Arab world, Russia, etc), and insisted that they better fix that mister!! (finger wave)….

          …but in actual fact, this is all just optical bullshit. Everyone swallowed the “efforts” whole, while ignoring the actual continued policies. We don’t put any pressure on anyone in the middle-east, africa, etc to actually change their abuse of gays…. we just ‘make statements’ about it. Same with hiring = like w/ many investment banks, they have very prominent programs to recruit LGBT staff… and they’ll tout their growth #s, or higher share than their competitors, or whatever, but the reality is that they’re still just a tiny fraction, and they’re mostly all in HR or other low-grade internal positions. oh, they’ll promote one or two to some high-profile job (CEO even), but its still just a PR-scam more than anything.

          it may be true that, of all her meaningless projects while @ state, the LGBT thing is what got the most favorable press… and i think she’s milked that – but whether those things actually reflected any significant material changes in US policy vis a vis other countries, i seriously doubt.

          1. but whether those things actually reflected any significant material changes in US policy vis a vis other countries, i seriously doubt

            Empty symbolism is the best kind of pandering there is!

    3. Yeah gay people must be especially stupid on the whole huh.

      1. Identity politics is a hell of a drug.

        1. So that’s a yes. Thank you for your bigoted condescension. Perhaps now I’ll consider voting for Trump whose entire campaign is literally identity politics. But since it’s for white people, we don’t use that term.

            1. its tony. he’s talking to himself. don’t bother.

            2. You said that most gay people are “drugged” by identity politics as opposed to, say, making rational political decisions. Does that go for everyone who doesn’t vote for Republicans, out of curiosity?

      2. That’s toats what I said, Tony OMG you read my comment but saw into my soul!

      3. No, LGBT people are just exceptionally pandered to this election, by a lying fraud of a candidate.

        The level of stupidity and gullibility of LGBT voters is otherwise no worse than that of other voters.

      4. No, LGBT people are just exceptionally pandered to this election, by a lying fraud of a candidate.

        The level of stupidity and gullibility of LGBT voters is otherwise no worse than that of other voters.

      5. No, LGBT people are just exceptionally pandered to this election, by a lying fraud of a candidate.

        The level of stupidity and gullibility of LGBT voters is otherwise no worse than that of other voters.

      6. No, LGBT people are just exceptionally pandered to this election, by a lying fraud of a candidate.

        The level of stupidity and gullibility of LGBT voters is otherwise no worse than that of other voters.

      7. It is very evident that homosexual males are some of the dumbest people on the planet.

        I mean, when they fought to keep the bathhouses in SanFran open in 1982-83, they at least had ignorance as an excuse.

        It’s now 2016—We know what HIV is. We know how it is transmitted. We know how to suppress it.

        Meanwhile, MSM (men who have sex w/ men) are about 4% of the population and are still 63% of all new HIV infections every year.

        So, that means they are as dumb as IV drug junkies and street prostitutes.

  4. Clinton, meanwhile has promised the LGBT community anything any activist group has asked for, a host of new federal laws and regulations to protect them end free speech, end free association and effectively end freedom of religion and just about anything at all to get the gay vote.

    FIFY

    1. It’s not even really the ‘gay vote.’ They are a few percentage points of the pop. It’s about signalling to progressives that you are socially tolerant of the right sort of people and not tolerant of the bad people.

      1. Yeah, it’s the very-public-gay-sympathizer vote she’s after here.

        1. No, it’s the people that want to force their values on others that she is courting.

          This isn’t a gay-straight thing. Because most gays or straights just want to be left to live as they wish privately. She’s courting people that want to lord over others…gay rights is just the latest hobby horse they’ve climbed up on (although many have transitioned to championing trans rights now that gays can marry).

          1. I love your level of trust in your fellow man. I have little doubt that most people want to rule over other people in one way or another. Yeah, I’m not feeling too optimistic these days.

  5. Voting for Clinton is so gay. NTTAWWT.

  6. I dunno, maybe if we didn’t have all these special interest groups to pander to, we could just consider everyone to be Americans and we could just focus on important issues like the economy, foreign policy, government spending, police misconduct, the WOD? I know, that’s not a very popular idea.

    1. None of those are as important as where a high school girl who claims she is a high school boy is allowed to shit!

    2. What about people who don’t want to be considered Americans?

      1. There’s a form you can buy for a couple thousand from the government to deal with that. But until then, you’re taxable no matter where you live.

        1. +1 best answer.

    3. But those interest groups are supposed to balance each other out and create a happy medium. Why isn’t it working??

    4. Because your special interest group is my association of concerned fellow citizens.

      1. It would be nice if some of those citizens weren’t so concerned with screwing over their fellows…

    5. Here’s how American politics actually works. Republicans promise white rednecks and the occasional white Brooks Brothers-clad reader of How To Succeed books that they’ll shit on all the minorities who are causing their personal problems, and that’s been their sole playbook for about 50 years. Thus, all the minorities go to Democrats who, in turn, promise to look out for their interests. That’s politics, not pandering. Pandering is when Donald Trump reads the letters LGBTQ very slowly off an index card to make sure he gets it right, or tweets a picture of him eating a Taco Bowl saying he loves the Hispanics. (He’s a terribly panderer.)

      Minorities do care about real issues. Among those real issues are their own individual sets of injustices. It’s Republicans who never ever talk about anything real. It’s why some of you idiots bought into the transgender bathroom panic.

      1. It’s Republicans who never ever talk about anything real.

        Right. Republicans never do anything real. Which is why they have both houses of Congress and a lion’s share of governorships. Because they’re just so out of touch.

        1. Name one good thing they’ve done for the country in 40 years.

          1. Aw, whine some more.

            The Republicans win elections all the time. Obviously they do something the voters want.

          2. Minorities go Democrats – how’s that worked out in the last 8 years?

            How’s that worked out in cities of Philly, Chicago, Detroit, Cleveland, Baltimore…?

            How’s MSNBC’s all white team doing with you for the news? Or Obama’s lip service to women but is a boy’s only club?

  7. Gary Johnson Getting Nearly as Many LGBT Voters as Trump

    *squints, reads twice… then a third time*

    Is GayJay really that unpopular with our gay friends?

    Actually, this whole graph surprises me.

    By and large, though, the poll also shows that LGBT voters view Clinton much more positively than the general public.

    Kay.

    1. The gay vote is almost as taken for granted as the black vote. “Issues” don’t really factor; it’s more a cultural thing.

      1. I honestly would have thought it’d be more evenly distributed, with Trump having the lowest showing. Even Jill Stein can’t even get gay love. I blame her practical haircut.

        1. That’s because a vote for Jill Stein takes effort to actually understand her issues. Same as a vote for Johnson. Gays are no more “into” politics than the average American and they’ve been on the Dem plantation for a very long time.

          1. Maybe if Republicans hadn’t waged an entire presidential campaign in 2004 on denying gays equal rights and then whined and moaned about the menace gays with equal rights pose to society it ever since, we could get a more economics-based distribution of the gay vote to study.

            1. Somehow, the Republicans are evil forever but the Democrats are easily forgiven. This is of course definitely not a reflection of underlying party sympathies among gay voters.

              1. It is hard to believe that it doesn’t occur to you that this may be because, between the two major parties, the Democrats are the ones who treat gay people with respect and pass laws validating their rights, while Republicans are the party of the Christians whose current sole motivation in life is denying gay people rights. It’s not that difficult.

      2. I don’t think the gay vote is taken for granted, at least not right now. Right now gay issues are seen as a way to go after religious conservatives and paint anyone who isn’t fully progressives as an evil bigot. As long as that is useful, gays will continue to get whatever they want. The moment it is no longer useful and someone like the Muslims become more useful or the Hispanics or blacks stand up and decide they are tired of carrying water for the gays, the gays suddenly will be taken for granted and told to go back in the closet for the good of the cause.

        I think you can look at the Jews for what the future of gays in the Prog movement will look like. For decades Jews were reliable members of the Progressive coalition and calling the right anti-Semitic was an article of faith among Progressives. Today of course the Jews are no longer useful and anti-Semitism is more and more common on the left and Jews are less and less welcome and are expected to refrain from being openly Jewish if they plan to be around.

        Give it a few years and the same sort of change will happen with the gays. Leftist movements love internal conformity. And any group that is outside of the majority like gays or Jews are inevitably in danger. Just like every leftist government eventually goes after they Jews, they also go after the gays.

        1. Yeah Republicans only lost the Jewish vote by 40 points last time. And Republicans don’t even include them in their list of minorities to bash. Asking gays to vote Republican, however, is like asking Jews to consider Hitler’s sensible economic policy.

          1. Aaaaand, Tony Godwins the thread.

  8. By and large, though, the poll also shows that LGBT voters view Clinton much more positively than the general public. Among those polled, 59 percent view Clinton positively. Her popularity numbers when comparing the LGBT community to the general community are essentially reversed. Trump’s favorability rating is even worse among LGBT voters than it is among the general public. Only 17 percent of LGBT voters view Trump favorably.

    Doesn’t that tell you that the gay community is just another special interest give me my forced public accommodation pony single issue voting block? What does Hillary Clinton offer gays other than as Scott points out below forced public accommodation and the end of religious freedom?

    Considering that fact, is Johnson drawing such a block really a good thing? Do Libertarians want the gay vote considering what it takes to get it?

    1. Do Libertarians want the gay vote considering what it takes to get it?

      *mind wanders*

    2. Among the short list of gay people I talk politics with, there is a pretty even split between the special treatment/forced accommodation types and the libertarian types. Not a representative sample, I know. I’m always shocked how many gay people lived through or read about the old days of active government discrimination against homosexuals and still vote to give the government more control over people’s lives. I guess it’s different now that they’re the ones wearing the boot.

      1. I am shocked that any gay would vote for a candidate who doesn’t support gun control and makes up for it by supporting mass immigration by Muslims. I think a lot of people in this country gay and straight really have bought into the idea that nothing really bad can ever happen and that no one outside of other Americans are really that bad. They just can’t comprehend that Muslims coming to this country in large numbers could in any way change the country for the worse.

    3. What does Hillary Clinton offer gays other than as Scott points out below forced public accommodation and the end of religious freedom?

      Increased risk of execution by radical Islamonazi terrorist is something, I guess.

      Personally I wouldn’t consider that something positive, but what the hell do I know.

    4. What does Hillary Clinton offer gays other than as Scott points out below forced public accommodation and the end of religious freedom?

      It should be made very clear to that block; civil war in Libya, civil war in Syria, all the refugees and terrorist protectionism those wars entail, continued exile/hounding of whistleblowers, domestic spying, political patronage, cronyism, political criminal elitism, free admission to a collapsing higher education system, more welfare leveraged on the backs of future generations, further corrosion of nearly every amendment on the BOR as well as the constitution itself, ongoing tokenization and race-baiting for votes, etc., etc.

      When, as a culture or as a signal, you vote for the lesser of two evils, it should still be clear that culturally and nominally, you are still voting in favor of all the evil that the lesser entails.

    1. Yes because the freedom of people to have popular views makes the lack of freedom to have unpopular views so much better. Somehow I am not surprised you find that fabulous.

      1. So Walmart should have been forced to make a cake?

  9. Hillary Clinton dominating Donald Trump

    Enough about the candidates sex lives…

    1. Seriously? Whatever else you can say about THE DONALD?, I’ll give him this – he’d never sleep with a woman as (physically/mentally) unattractive as Hillary.

      Bill’s far less discriminating. For looks as well as consent.

  10. Lady gays are voting for Hillary because of Huma. Boy gays are voting for Hillary because that’s what’s trendy. GET OVER IT.

    1. It might have something to do with Trump not even trying to get votes from gay citizens. At the Austin Pride parade, there were large contingents of marchers for Hillary and for the Democratic Socialists, and no one for Trump.

      Whereas at the Pecan Street festival this weekend, there were Johnson signs up all over the place. Someone in the local LP was trying to make it happen.

  11. The issue is that the Democrats have made a platform of dividing people up into groups and pandering to them for votes. There’s really no way they can stop doing this as it’s all they have left besides tax and spend, and labeling people outside their pandering groups as some form of ‘ist’ or ‘phobes’ (now basket of deplorables and irredeemables).

    The GOP, libertarians, and whatever else candidates have 2 options. Join in the pandering and try to outdo the Democrats, or completely ignore the non-sense and say everyone are equals and there’s no need for these divisions or the pandering. I highly suggest the latter.

    1. It would be nice for us to all be Americans again, even if we don’t all agree on issues, solution, and priorities.
      I have polarization fatigue.

  12. “Gary Johnson Getting Nearly as Many LGBT Voters as Trump”

    So it’s like just me and Milo Yiannopoulos, right?? One for each??

  13. Who gives a shit? Gay men = 2% of the population. LGBTQ issues = 150% of Reason’s coverage lately. Newsflash: shut the fuck up, please.

    1. What is your definition of “recently”?

    2. Libertarian party has been pro LGBT since its inception in the 70’s. Such consistency gets them 13% now

      1. I guess I’m Pro-LGBT in the sense that I think people should do whatever they want. Go be gay- that is entirely up to you. I’m just very tired of hearing about gay politics (especially since there is no group of people in American politics more opposed to basic civil liberties than the politically gay [not to be confused with the just gay].)

        The Supreme Court ruled on this so maybe we can get back to important things now, OK?

        1. “Go be gay- that is entirely up to you.”

          No it isn’t. Want to hear the list of things I’m tired of hearing about?

          1. Sure- write me a novel if you feel like it. Don’t expect me to give a fuck though.

  14. Do you mean “lately?” I didn’t use the word ‘recently,’ but I suppose ‘lately’ is close to the same thing.

    1. Squrells ate my response.

    2. Ah yeah, anyway my point was that it used to be worse.

  15. Well, I am gay and am voting for Johnson.

    Millions of people will vote for him because he is the only sane, experienced, honest person on the ballot
    in all 50 states.

    Go Gary!!

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