Three Police Officers Shot Dead, More Injured in Baton Rouge

Shooting follows fatal police killing of Alton Sterling.

WAFB Live Feed, screencap

Police officials in Baton Rouge, Louisiana have confirmed that at least three police officers were killed, and several more injured, in a shooting this morning. The city's mayor has described the shooting as an "ambush." 

The shooting took place near a convenience store, after officers responded to reports of shots fired around 9 a.m. this morning. It's unclear how many shooters were involved, but police say they believe there is more than one suspect. Reports indicate that one suspect is dead. Local news outlet WAFB reports that area police says the scene is now "contained." 

Tensions have run high in Baton Rouge since the fatal police shooting of Alton Sterling, 37, on July 5, outside a convenience store. The shooting was caught on video.

Black Lives Matter activists have organized multiple protests in the city, and police have arrested both activist leaders and journalists at the rallies. 

Update: Baton Rouge police are now saying they do not believe the shooting is "race related," according to CNN reports.

This story is developing.

Comments

[JFree]

Ooh - this is getting ugly

[Trigger Warning]

Yeah, fuck these psycho assholes. This is only going to set back policing reform and criminal justice reform back decades. Murdering cops is not the fucking answer.

[Trigger Warning]

We get to read about Kathryn Johnston and babies getting flashbanged, about dirty cops setting low-level drug offenders up as informants so the informants can get whacked, about beating after beating after wrong-door no-knock raid. All at the hands of state warriors fighting a monstrously unjust vice war.

We make a little progress. Body cams enter the national conversation and become a thing.

Then this shit erases it all. Now the national conversation is going to be war on cops and respect my authoritah. All because retarded assholes think killing cops is the answer to bad cops.

[Agammamon]

So . . . if institutionalized authority continues to run unchecked and violate people's rights - cops shoot people at the drop of a hat and the judicial system, from their peers all the way to the USSC, bends over backwards to ensure that they suffer as little consequence as possible - and perpetuate *systemic* incentives for bad behavior on the part of police officers (vice 'crime' details, DUI overtime, civil asset forfeiture, etc) and the populace *complains* and is pretty much ignored (because its going to take a wholesale removal of the current management of police forces across the country and at all levels in order to effect significant culture change within *any* large organization) we should just . . . what? Cry louder?

The cops - the one's here, in Dallas, and NYC - may be good people, may be bad people, probably are decent people who've done good and bad things with that badge probably did not earn those bullets personally and their families have my sympathy.

But I can't sit here and drum up a whole lot of outrage that this has happened. The police have been acting like a gang for a long time now, have been routinely filmed acting as a gang, have repeatedly shrugged off any suggestion that they *aren't a gang* and are responsible to the populace. So when someone takes a shot at a gangbanger, well its not exactly unexpected.

[SIV]

It's almost like #BLM was designed to derail police accountability and criminal justice reform.

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[LaraGriffin]

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[Euphemisandry]

Reason runs a story about there being no war on cops, and then this happens. Do we need any more proof that Reason is a terrorist organization?

[commoditous]

They're libertarians, which is much worse. Terrorists you're allowed to shoot.

[FD]

Technically, the "no war on cops" article was penned by Chapman.

I know libertarians.
Libertarians were friends of mine.
Chapman.....

[XM]

It was Tim Lynch.

[FD]

Apologies, and thank you, XM.
I was erroneously thinking of Chapman's straw man arguments in his "Black Demands and White Fears" article.

[bacchys]

This shooting isn't proof there's a war on cops, but if it is the totality of rhe evidence shows the police declared war on the people a long time ago.

[Hank Phillips]

There's something awfully karmic about this. Seneca Officer Mark Tillet and Solicitor Chrissy Adams proved cops and prosecutors exist to murder kids for victimless fun and by mock trial let them escape justice. Anyone can watch large numbers of videos of... well... pigs murdering unarmed people by shooting them in the back. The exact same thing went on in 1927 when all preachers, schoolmarms, judges and politicians swore that beer was a deadly addictive narcotic and that bootleggers deserved to be shot. OF COURSE bootleggers returned fire. George Holy War Bush repeated this 65 years later, calling for the deaths of hemp kingpins.

--Oh you who place your faith in fire, in fire your faith shall be repaid. Until cops openly refuse to murder people over superstitious quackery, they will get no sympathy from me.

[colorblindkid]

There wasn't ever a War on Cops in the past, but I think we're getting to a point where we can acknowledge there might be one now.

[Euphemisandry]

Maybe a Kinetic Action on Cops.

[commoditous]

*slow clap*

[Illocust]

Pretty much this. Two more cop killings and we can declare there actually to be a war on cops. Right now it's still in the real possibility but it might putter out phase.

[You Sound Like a Prog (MJG)]

So it'd be the cops against an army of four? Godspeed to them.

[Illocust]

Sensationalist crimes tend to go in patterns. First we had the serial killers, then we had the school shooters, now it looks like the crime de'jour for the insane might become cop killing. If we get four major killing against cops in such a short amount of time it will be a sign that its probably not going to stop anytime soon.

[Chipper Morning Wood]

There is also a war on bias-free reporting without an agenda to reinforce a particular world view on order to cement viewership for higher ratings.

[sloopyinTEXAS]

Another "100 Years War" then.

[You Sound Like a Prog (MJG)]

So was there a war on schools?

[Domestic Dissident]

Obama has way more than four ghetto brownshirts in his army, stupid.

[Hank Phillips]

None of these are wars. Poverty never surrendered to Lyndon Johnson, not drugs to Dick Nixon, Ford, or Bush. Bushie's asset forfeiture ruined the economy but terrorism hasn't surrendered. But suppose the cops agree there is a war on them... who do they surrender to?
A real war is declared, and one side or the other sues for "peace with honor." Only by voting libertarian can the American people break the chokehold organized murdering mysticism and entrenched looter extortion have on the nation. Voting for looters keeps information from politicians, so they rob and murder all the more. LOSING votes and elections gets their attention, and the learning and "repeal with honor" can then begin.

[bassjoe]

The state declared a war on the populace first. The War on Drugs is a war on "undesirable" Americans that has been waged to ruin Americans' lives, throw them in prison for unjustifiably long periods of times, tear apart their families, prevent them from obtaining gainful employment, and steal their money and property. The War on Drugs has been used to justify extreme state violence and the abridgment of basic rights.

We should have stopped the War on Drugs by now but it's just gotten more excessive. But most of us are not affected by it or don't care that its victims are generally those we do not care about or can be easily demonized.

We reap what we sow. It is sad. It is a disgrace. But we have nobody to blame but ourselves.

[DOOMco]

Well said.

[Heroic Mulatto]

I came here to say just that.

[robc]

Blowback, its not just for the Middle East anymore.

[sarcasmic]

Blowback? It doesn't exist! Blowback implies that the government did something to deserve retaliation! You can't say that! Those are our sons and daughters out there carrying guns for the government! They didn't intend for this to happen! So it can't be blowback! Blowback would mean it is their fault! It's not their fault! Traitor! Love it or leave it!

[Gene]

I don't see how we get past this pervasive sentiment.

[sarcasmic]

Me neither. All we can do is watch as those good intentions pave the road to hell.

[Hank Phillips]

Um... by, like, voting for rights and freedom for a change?

[Gene]

Any day now, I'm sure.

[Trigger Warning]

Ignoring it when we can, smashing it when we can't.

[AlmightyJB]

True. However going after the low level enforcers may give them the most satisfaction but isn't going to help the problem. The fascist politicians love a good war against the plebs. They're more likely to double down on a war then reform.

[bacchys]

I agree. The most one can expect from something like this is more difficulty getting much needed police reforms enacted.

More likely, it will justify more authoritIan police state policies and less oversight of the police than we have now.

But the police are the ones on the ground and in the front lines, both in terms of enforcing unjust and unconstitutional laws and facing the blowback from that.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Hey, if you don't want a war on drug users, stop voting in - or refusing to vote out - drug warriors. This commenter places the blame squarely on you.

[Hank Phillips]

Tank Bob someone around here has a grip on ethics, karma and causality! The stark fist of retribution is what they voted for and got, so alluva sudden they can dish it out but they can't take it. Boooo hoooo.

[Rufus The Monocled]

Yeah. The blowback moment has arrived.

I'm sorry. When you kill a child carrying a toy and get off, you know you've jumped the shark.

We - as in society - doesn't see the seething anger of people who face injustice at the hands of people who are supposed to protect the people. The only time we do *see* it is through stuff like this.

It's awful. Two wrongs don't make a right.

[Chipper Morning Wood]

I wonder how many conservatives are secretly ecstatic about this shooting so they can go "see, I told you there was a war on cops!!"

[DOOMco]

Huge war boxers.

[Chipper Morning Wood]

I am more a war briefs kinda guy.

[DOOMco]

Dammit. This phone will die a horrible death. I'm currently taking suggestions for fun ways to kill it.

[But Enough About Me]

Anything that involves firearms, Tannerite?, or Tannerite? + firearms.

Although I've always been a fan of liquid nitrogen immersion followed by high-speed application of the business end of a three-pound hammer...

[DOOMco]

Explosions are fun.

[commoditous]

Trade it in for a little bit of store credit. Make it watch you buy its replacement using the little bit of trade-in value it's worth.

[DOOMco]

"You see what you made me do?! You happy now?!"

[But Enough About Me]

"You know I love you, baby! Why you make me trade you in for a newer model?"

[Rufus The Monocled]

David French was already taking pen to paper.

[Intraveneous Woodchipper]

Enough with this Helter Skelter bullshit already! This is fucking insane.

[That's A Bingo!]

More workplace violence.

[(((Renegade)))]

Start a war, get a war.

[Gene]

This.

[Lord at War]

Start a war, get a war.

Fight a war when you're out-numbered, out- gunned and on the wrong side in public opinion, watch Sherman march to the sea burning everything in his path.

[Clint Eastwoodchipper]

Good grief, this has to stop already. Screw all of the political figures and talking heads in the media who've tried to further politicize and polarize an issue like this. That includes Giuliani, Obama, Holder, Lynch, Trump, Christie, Clinton, Tom Cotton, etc.

I'm sick of this partisan shit. Stop whining about a lack of "law and order" (aka -- eventual martial law), and stop jumping the gun on every shooting before the facts are known (that goes double for the Obama administration).

[Chipper Morning Wood]

Good luck with that. We are at the point where news stories will start with:
"Breaking news. More proof that there is a war on police emerged today, making more urgent efforts to give police officers more leeway in use of deadly force to protect their lives and keep us all safe from the darkness of the criminal element. In Baton Rouge, where police officers have already been under fire from hoodie-wearing hoodlums thirty seven times this year, an incident today...."

[Hamster of Doom]

Start practicing your Batman voice. We're going to need it.

[Hank Phillips]

With looters-by-law calling the shots, the oceans will dry up completely before "the facts" are "known..."
Looter politicians hire cops to repress, loot, rob and murder with impunity. There are hours of footage of this. The cops are doing what they are paid to do--and it ain't defense of individual rights. This is a political party problem, not wrong candidate problem. The Dem and GOP sell the wrong ethical principles, wrong function of government, and wrong methods of inference, but they respond to being slapped upside the head with spoiler votes cast FOR the right principles.

[Steve G]

RIP: Police Reform this decade

[You Sound Like a Prog (MJG)]

Hey, more reason for always-on vest cameras. Get video evidence of the cop-killers.

[Unauthorized Journalist]

Martial law for election season?

[Ken Shultz]

Remember when we were all bored sick hearing about Brexit?

I miss those days.

[Chipper Morning Wood]

We are in the age of the Sanitexit.

[kinnath]

Mr. Hatfield, I'd like you to meet Mr. McCoy. Mr. McCoy, meet Mr. Hatfield.

[EdWuncler]

"This drug thing, this ain't police work. No, it ain't. I mean, I can send any fool with a badge and a gun up on them corners and jack a crew and grab vials. But policing? I mean, you call something a war and pretty soon everybody gonna be running around acting like warriors. They gonna be running around on a damn crusade, storming corners, slapping on cuffs, racking up body counts. And when you at war, you need a fucking enemy. And pretty soon, damn near everybody on every corner is your fucking enemy. And soon the neighborhood that you're supposed to be policing, that's just occupied territory. " -Bunny Colvin

[Paloma]

^^^This

[DOOMco]

Good speech

[Isaac Bartram]

Best cop drama series ever.

Actually, to my mind, The Wire is the only good cop drama series ever.

Every other cop drama series has been loaded with cliche-ridden cop beatification bullshit.

Here's a challenge. I'm willing to accept that there have been shows that have not uniformly glorified the kind of violence and disregard for due process done by cops on the typical cop show, I just can't think of any. Who can?

[DOOMco]

Breaking bad wasn't uniformly glorifying. Honest?
Trailer park boys?

[Isaac Bartram]

Is "Breaking Bad" a cop drama or a crime drama?

Haven't actually watched it but from reviews etc it sounds more like social satire.

[DOOMco]

I guess it'd fall under crime drama. The police aspects don't glorify it, but do show some police brutality for what it is.

[Euphemisandry]

Brooklyn 9-9

[Isaac Bartram]

I'll check it out.

[pan fried wylie]

not a drama, but don't let that stop you. unless you hate Andy Samberg, then do let that stop you.

[Rhywun]

In that vein, there's Reno 911.

[A frilly pink thing]

Andy Griffith.

[Isaac Bartram]

🙂

[VG Zaytsev]

Barney Miller.

[Isaac Bartram]

Like "Andy Griffith", not drama.

[adifferentken]

Barney Miller.

[Isaac Bartram]

ditto

[Hank Phillips]

I wouldn't know. I quit watching when Police State and Police Woman replaced Mod Squad--shrieking that all crime--especially victimless crime--hadda have victims, and it was up to the cops to murder a few as examples and DELIVER those victims like Mr Gattis DELIVERS pizzas. The vidiots got what they ordered, and it wasn't rights or freedom.

[Isaac Bartram]

Sorta, kinda my point.

Who can forget "Cagney and Lacey" which delivered the feminist message that wymminz cops could be just as badass violating defendants rights as the male hierarchy.

[mashed potatoes]

I'm really starating to see a scenario where trump is elected. I bet hillary will go full law and order here in the next few weeks.

[Intraveneous Woodchipper]

She's far too beholden to BLM. Not gonna happen!

[mashed potatoes]

Their useless to her know she has the nomination. Loom for a sister soldier moment

[OneOut]

She needs the black vote. She came out after the first multiple cop shooting and blamed it on white people.

[You Sound Like a Prog (MJG)]

While it's of course always about perception, the idea that more chaos in the world helps Trump is funny. It's not as if Clinton is some peace-lovin' hippie. She's eager to crack some skulls in the mideast, and Sanders's campaign made sure everyone remembered her "superpredator" position in the 90s.

[mashed potatoes]

I think that is true and she is stuck. If she isn't blantantly bloodthirsty, Democrats will justify it. Have you ever seen them in Libya?

I just think she will feel the need to move to the right in rhetoric. Which could sink her too

[Hank Phillips]

She will demand that abortion be banned and hempheads hanged? Isn't "to the right" toward mystical conservatism and an Islamic State?

[Dennis, Constitutional Peasant]

Well, tat least it ended that Hillary/Trump abomination-thread.

[mashed potatoes]

Oh yeah? Haven't seen the comments in that thread yet. Worth a look?

[DOOMco]

Oh. God no.

[Dennis, Constitutional Peasant]

Worth a look?

Not unless you want to ruin your favorable impression of radley balko, and watch people's faces melt like the end of Raiders of the Lost Ark.

[John Titor]

"Oh boy, face melting!"

*Sees John and Tony arguing about Presidential candidates.*

"Noooooope. Just nope."

[sloopyinTEXAS]

I had no idea that thread existed until you said something. I opened the first story there.

So I read the story and started on the comments but decided that I'd just go ahead and log off of here for good.

I feel ashamed I named my daughter after Reason now. They care more about social signaling than the rule of law, gun running, warmongering, attacks on te 1A and 2A or even a semblance of pulling back from our socialist lurch to te left. They can all go fuck themselves. Goodbye.

[DOOMco]

Most were former reason people, right?
I find it best to avoid any article that involves a who's better contest or the libertarian case for (anti libertarian thing).

[Swiss Servator]

NOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[sloopyinTEXAS]

You guys have my email address. Let me know when you find a site not run by cowards that would rather social signal instead of have a clown at least uphold our 1A and 2A rights.

I'll be happy to join you there.

[FD]

There are a few sites out there. Ain't this one. But man, my sister's interminable farewell dances when visiting my mother are making your byes look downright eye-blinking.

[FD]

Oh shit, vice-versa.

[Hank Phillips]

I can relate, but to run from battle and turn into panhandlers is... well... what objectivists were ordered to do by Peter the Human Skunk. Besides, only 1 in 3 people can see reality (Asch, 1955) but it takes only single dissenter to skew mob hysteria by about 17%. The commies send looter anarchists in here and the prohibitionists send mindless Jesus freaks to tell us the initiation of force is goood. Besides, it's un-Texan to turn tail and run.

[Dennis, Constitutional Peasant]

Does anyone here ever understand what the fuck ^^this guy^^ is saying? Agile makes more sense.

[Dennis, Constitutional Peasant]

Come for the comments, STAY for the comments, Sloop.

I agree that some writer's squishiness here has gotten super-retarded; but then its just an opportunity to beat them mercilessly about it. Its the only decent workout some people get.

i think whiney commenters can be more tedious than the writers. They act like a handful of Yokeltarians or hillary-aplogists have ruined their lives; and that any discussion of pragmatic politics is an abandonment of the all-important Libertarian Party and its fat-stripping, Nazi-cake-baking ideals.

everyone's self-image is so sensitive that they're aghast that anyone could possibly consider voting for [insert unacceptable candidate here]. I think its foolish.

I personally have always believed in a pluralistic world and prefer one where people can agree about ideas, while differing entirely on things like "who to vote for president"; which isnt nearly as important as people make it out to be.

People who call themselves libertarians and yet demand some sort of uniformity of opinion are the apex of 'Tardery.

[John]

You should never expect uniformity of opinion. You can, however, expect good faith opinion. The problem is that so much of the opinion the staff really isn't in good faith.

[Dennis, Constitutional Peasant]

The problem is that so much of the opinion the staff really isn't in good faith.

I presume you're a believer in the "Kerry Howley"-brand-cynicism? who once said (paraphrasing)

"Reason Libertarians are just smart kids the super-rich pay to say nice things about them""

I don't know how accurate that really is, but like Kerry, it certainly is cute.

The suggestion seems to be that all of them are at least a little full-of-shit.

[Dennis, Constitutional Peasant]

*correction - i found the source

Kerry Howley @KerryHowley

I thought cato was just a place where smart people took free money from rich people. The Kochs think it's influential?

I think i'm just conflating this comment with something WW said about Reason Libertarians being temporary PR people for actual libertarian ideas which few of them actually believe.

Although that too is probably just a conflation of a number of other things he said. My memory is one big stew of general-impressions converted into quotes for convenience

[Hank Phillips]

Speaking of Jesus freak infiltrators here to preach the "pro-life-after-death" line...

[Ted S.]

And your comment isn't about social signalling, no sirree.

[Heroic Mulatto]

*shrugs*

I found Gilmore's post to be quite even-handed.

[Ted S.]

I thought I was responding to Sloopy, not Gilmore (who I presume changed his handle to Dennis?).

[Heroic Mulatto]

Ah.

[Dennis, Constitutional Peasant]

who I presume changed his handle to Dennis?

I have always been Dennis; this "Gilmore" you refer to was nothing more than a passing idiosyncratic phase.

[OneOut]

You are the commentor formerly known ad Gilmore.

I thought Dennis was just a descriptive, not an actual handle.

[DOOMco]

Dennis is an old woman, this is known.

[Contrarian P]

He's 37, that's not old.

[You Sound Like a Prog (MJG)]

If someone comes to a different conclusion than you, it's a good sign that they're virtue signalling.

[Duke]

I'm with you sloop. I live right down the road from Baton Rouge and watching the local coverage now. The local reporters have been talking more about Alton Sterling and police injustice than this. Murdering three police officers in cold blood is not justified and is not blowback. These people who were killed did not deserve this. The social signalers and glib libertarians can fap about blowback all they want but I refuse to give them an audience. The war on drugs is terrible and should end. But it does not justify this.

Adios.

[DOOMco]

So we they escalate or listen to the reasons people are shooting cops.
I fear this will go the same way we deal with terrorists. Ignore the reasons they give, make up ones that cause an easy patriotic response.

[Possible Bot]

The reasons they give are that cops are murdering black people and creating genocide. BLM is not some principled law enforcement reform movement and this who would like to push it as one are not doing any favors to reform goals.

[AblueSilkworm]

It cops acted like frightened bullies before when they had no reason, can you imagine how they'll begin acting now were this to continue? Things are going to get so so horrible.

[CptNerd]

National Police Force in 3... 2...

[DJF]

"You can't professionalize unless you federalize,"

It worked for the TSA, why not the police!

Don't know what exactly worked but the politicians support it

[creech]

Blowback. The various police unions have to get behind the notion that rogue or untrained or psycho cops have to be dismissed from the force and not protected by their fellow cops. Many of the nut punches we see here are accompanied by official cop denials, victim blaming, and sweeping egregious misconduct and excessive use of force under the rug. The self-congratulatory "they are our city's finest" and "the cop went home safe to his family"
cliches have to disappear before many citizens can restore their faith in justice and impartial policing.

[DOOMco]

We need less preventative Nonsense. Less laws to enforce. Get the cops to solve real crime, not be a revenue source for a cities pension problems.

[Lord at War]

Blowback. If I'm just an average cop who has never even considered taking a "racial" approach to my job, I just might reconsider that stance about now...

[Scarecrow & WoodChipper Repair]

Is an ambush any worse than a SWAT raid at the wrong address, or a flash-bang into a crib?

[Dennis, Constitutional Peasant]

I suppose that depends if you think the morality of an act is defined exclusively by its predicted consequence, or its intent

[Scarecrow & WoodChipper Repair]

I think an individual taking individual action on his own is far more moral than a government hiring thugs to do the same, and using more thugs to cover it up, to break up people protesting said thuggery, and in all other ways proving the old saw that the government hates the mafia because they hate competition.

[Dennis, Constitutional Peasant]

I think an individual taking individual action on his own is far more moral than a government hiring thugs to do the same

Well, that's a little insane and irrational, but hey, its a free country website

[Scarecrow & WoodChipper Repair]

Wut?

If I rob you at gunpoint, that's a simple morality no-no, and there's isn't a justice system in the world which would ok that.

But if the government robs you to pay me the same amount, there isn't a justice system in the world that would give you any justice.

Now which one do you think is insane?

[Dennis, Constitutional Peasant]

which one do you think is insane?

the one saying that the individual is "more moral" for committing the same immoral act?

[american socialist]

Just wrong. The 2nd amendment is here for White pedophiles in Waco, not oppressed Black people in inner cities. Why these Black folks bit chin' anyway?

[Swiss Servator]

You really should see a doctor about those concussion symptoms.

[american socialist]

I'm a libertarian and all so i really don't care for cops, but I've never made the argument that unfettered access to firearms in order to shoot said police officers in the coming revolution was a good idea. You?

[Hyperion's Post Brexit Moment]

I'm a libertarian

LOL

[Suthenboy]

Yeah, and I am a flying reindeer.

[DOOMco]

2/10. Obvious troll is obvious.

[Isaac Bartram]

Oh really???

Oh really???

[Isaac Bartram]

Oh really???

[american socialist]

I'm an amateur historian and I can't think of an example-- outside of John Brown's raids and some labor organizing-- where an individual's possession of firearms in order to confront the military or the police has advanced the cause of liberty. Women's suffrage, the Civil Rights movement, marriage equality for homosexuals were all achieved by peaceful protest, getting people to vote, passive resistance, etc. I'm against all laws related to the drug war, but I'm not about to shoot it out with the DEA to make my point. Maintaining an armed populace so that populace can engage in a guerrilla war with the government is just about the most idiotic idea I've ever come across.

[sarcasmic]

I'm an amateur historian and I can't think of an example-- outside of John Brown's raids and some labor organizing-- where an individual's possession of firearms in order to confront the military or the police has advanced the cause of liberty. Women's suffrage, the Civil Rights movement, marriage equality for homosexuals were all achieved by peaceful protest, getting people to vote, passive resistance, etc. I'm against all laws related to the drug war, but I'm not about to shoot it out with the DEA to make my point. Maintaining an armed populace so that populace can engage in a guerrilla war with the government is just about the most idiotic idea I've ever come across.

ftfy

[kbolino]

Maintaining an armed populace so that populace can engage in a guerrilla war with the government is just about the most idiotic idea I've ever come across.

It is far more idiotic to say the populace should be disarmed, in order that the government can avoid such a war altogether and just get what it wants without resistance. Or to pretend that our own government, right or wrong, is eternal, and will never be supplanted or challenged by a worse one.

It is also more idiotic to fail to recognize the deterrent effect of widespread firearm ownership. They're not going to send in the tanks and the planes. The Gestapo and the Stasi had no heavy equipment. They wage war against the populace in the shadows and with fear. Let them be afraid, instead, and not us.

[Not an Economist]

I guess you would have been a Loyalist during the Revolutionary War.

Some amateur historian .... Not

[John Titor]

Remember guys, just this week Amsoc was praising the NKVD/KGB for their brutality. His only problem with the jackboots of the police is that they don't have a hammer and sickle on them.

[Heroic Mulatto]

It was more than praising the Soviet Union for their brutality. He was expressing his desire to engage in genocide against Muslims. And as I predicted, he returns on another thread and adopts a posture of moral self-righteousness.

[Hank Phillips]

And speaking of looter commie anarchist infiltrators sent here to tell us Only Jackbooted Minions of the Looter Staat should have guns and trucks, cars, fertilizer, gasoline or food...
Hang on Sloopy, Sloopy hang on!

[John Titor]

Well, congratulations America, police reform is doomed for at least another five years, maybe ten. There was a lot of hope in 2011-2012 that things were finally going to start turning around. But once police misconduct was subsumed into the culture war partisanship it rotted all away. Tribalism feeds on division, and there's always hucksters willing to cash in on it. Now we've got BLM chanting cop murder songs and law-and-order types defending Kent State. Jesus.

That's the biggest danger of the culture war. It actively stagnates civil society and makes legitimate reforms extremely difficult.

[VG Zaytsev]

The cynical side of me thinks BLM was intended to kill police reform and perpetuate the war on ... paradigm.

[sarcasmic]

You give them too much credit. BLM is just another page in the "It's because I'm black" pity-fest that is so ingrained into American black culture. Nothing more.

[FD]

You privileged bastard, you...

[sarcasmic]

What reform? The problems are a toxic combination of immunity from the law, public sector unions, an obsession with officer safety at the expense of public safety, and zero tolerance for noncompliance. None of that was ever mentioned in any talk of police reform that I ever heard. At least outside libertarian circles.

So you're lamenting the loss of something that was never going to happen. Government is a one-way ratchet. Reform would be a relaxation of power. The odds of that happening are about as good as the odds of my having a three-way with Kate Beckinsale and Emma Watson.

[DEATFBIRSECIA]

^This. The one aspect of police reform, rewriting the union rules which confer immunity, is noticeably absent from every proposal I have thus far seen. It's the elephant in the room that no one, outside this blog, is willing to even discuss, much less propose.

[Winston]

Probably because battling Public Sector unions is very difficult? If people have trouble dealing with Teacher's Unions how will they handle Cop Unions?

[sarcasmic]

The only thing that could stop them would be a federal law, or even a constitutional amendment, forbidding government employees from organizing into unions.

Heck, even FDR saw the danger of public sector unions.

However I doubt that will ever happen.

[kbolino]

That may be the only thing that can stop them altogether country-wide but lots of reforms can be made at the local and state level without requiring the Feds to be involved. Especially since the Feds' primary tool, thanks to the courts' tortured interpretation of our Constitution, is the carrot. The voters wield the stick.

The problem is, and events like this are hardly likely to change this, the voters by and large want the police to be well staffed, well compensated, well equipped, and well treated. They are, after all, the enforcers of the voters' will. A group of people who wants the drug war prosecuted vigorously is not likely to give a skeptical eye to those who prosecute it.

[Suthenboy]

I only have a vague recollection of it but I think even the socialists in America were against public sector unions when it was being debated. Of course, like all government action, the worst course was chosen.

[kbolino]

even the socialists in America were against public sector unions

Yes, but for different reasons. Both of us see them as conspiracies against the people. We just differ on the ends of that conspiracy. The socialists view them as entrenching the bourgeois, capitalist order. We see them as entrenching the government's power. In a way, I think we're both right. The unions fought communism in this country, and with the same fervor they fight any attempt to reduce the size and scope of government.

[Paloma]

I seem to recall it was part of the BLM movements platform

[John Titor]

There was potential for reform. One of the primary problems with actually getting people to talk about it was that they'd handwave the fact that they're 'good citizens' and so obviously nothing would ever happen to them. But that was starting to shift as police misconduct and abuse was being exposed, and the people on the receiving end were not revealed to be the villains for Dirty Harry movies that people expect. Cases like Garner or Rice were actually getting the layman's attention. The issue is that once that attention was gained it was completely squandered on the culture war.

Yes, they've failed to identify the actual power structures and police culture that needs to be dismantled. But there was an actual recognition that something needed to be done, and that was the first step outside of libertarian circles. Now everyone's just going to close themselves off into the respective camps of 'Fuck the po-lice' and 'the officer went home, that's all that matters'. I do think police reform is actually something you could pull progressives (manipulate their social signalling in regards to the poor and/or race) and conservatives (argue for traditional police powers as per common law) together if handled properly.

[kbolino]

Repealing LEOBoR laws should be a no-brainer. I don't even begin to understand how people can support them. There is one BoR and it applies to all of us, equally.

[sarcasmic]

I'm not so sure. Thing is, people in government view any admission of wrongdoing as a threat to public trust. If they admit that maybe there is something wrong with police culture, then that means government did something wrong. That would, in their view, undermine the public trust. The idea that reform might actually increase public trust by showing the people that government can change course when something is wrong simply does not compute in the minds of those with the power to change things. Just look at how far they will go to blame everything but the police for the actions of the police. It's the fault of people recording the police, of the media for reporting police brutality, of people with guns, of drugs, of everything except police culture. No reform will happen. Not in the current political environment.

[kbolino]

In a sense, they're right, but they're also myopic. Admitting wrongdoing, or at least admitting that reforms are needed, erodes public trust in the short term, it is true. But covering up wrongdoing and resisting necessary reforms erodes the public trust in the long term. The former is easily recoverable, the latter much less so.

It's a classic example of seen vs. unseen.

[Hank Phillips]

Unless whacked upside the head with a two by four stack of spoiler votes. I vote libertarian, claim credit for being part of the solution, couldn't care less who the looters put on teevee but I do read their platforms. Those killers in blue are enforcing the Dem and GO-Pee platforms, literally and to the hilt. German altruist voters got what they deserved in 1933, and the Berlin wall was there as a reminder 56 years later. Only now is there finally a Partei Der Vernunft (Party of Reason) in Germany. We should set a better example.

[Rhywun]

BLM has a police-reform platform, and it's got a lot of good stuff on it. It's been overshadowed by some of their other... activities, though.

[Mr Lizard]

Good afternoon mammals! It seems I have consumed too much of your native liquid intoxicants last night. I am a bit reluctant to crawl off my branch today

[Ted S.]

We'll enjoy watching you fall off.

[Mr Lizard]

You will be happy to know that I managed not to fall off. I also just partook in the most thorough of hangover cures: I went for a run in this FloridaMan July afternoon

[VG Zaytsev]

Is it a war on cops yet?

[Hyperion's Post Brexit Moment]

There will be a war on citizens soon enough. Well, there already was, but now it will be official. Thanks, BLM, for giving us that police state you always wanted.

[Suthenboy]

If BLM are not Obumbles ghetto brownshirts, as I have heard them described more than once, they have accomplished what they would have sought if they were.

[SIV]

The survivors can at least take comfort in knowing their deceased loved ones gave their lives to elect President Trump.

[Hyperion's Post Brexit Moment]

Maybe Obama declares martial law now and suspends elections. Thanks Obama, for saving us from Hillary, again.

[VG Zaytsev]

I'm sure that Obama will come out and condemn the climate of hate created by BLM that caused this senseless violence, any minute now. In fact, I'll hold my breath until he does.

[Hyperion's Post Brexit Moment]

You mean this racial tension that Obama has instigated? Yep, he's going to make a speech right now apologizing for his 8 years of divisiveness for those right wing extremists in the NRA who are causing this.

[commoditous]

He's giving pointers to his speechwriters for the upcoming eulogy.

[FD]

A short while back, in Concord, NH, in spite of a thoughtful anti-Bear Cat argument by the Free State folks, the City Council approved the acquisition. (BTW, Concord is quintessential New England yawn country, shuts down by 8:30p.m. because it's time for jammies and reading by the fire. The town can fit into most city-sized neighborhoods.)
I must have missed the fact that my coffee house booth was overrun by drug warlords and gangs; and since it's the state capitol, the law-and-order gang wants to be as civilized and modern as the rest of the megalopolis centers. So they got their big-ass Batmobile. Well, that certainly won't be enough. Come budget time, I can already hear it. "See? I told you! We're gonna need more Bear Cats. Just look at what the hell's happening all around us!"
So ante up, taxpayer and f---k this 'Live Free or Die' shit. Otherwise we're taking your house.

[Mr Lizard]

"big-ass Batmobile"

Great funk band song title

[Heroic Mulatto]

Listen, bub, without those Bear Cats, the meth-addicted Golden Horde will stream up from Manchester and Nashua and cannibal rape gangs will rove up and down Main Street.

[SIV]

Ain't nothin' but a Bearcat

[Gene]

The hoser version.

https://youtu.be/IUuGQPCPAEI

[SIV]

Couldn't even crack the Canadian Affirmative-Action Top 40 in his career.

[Gene]

I know, if it ain't top 40 it's shite.

[HTuttle]

Radical Obamists. Period.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul.)]

We are so fucked.

[HTuttle]

THIS guy is Obama's BFF and one of his most frequent visitors to the whitehouse.
Remember When Al Sharpton Said to Kill Police Officers?
(Google it!)

[FD]

Of course.
Some folks think the Reason editors have no balls? You can be sure the MSM won't dare fry his race-baiting ass by recalling his 1990s speeches. Talk about cowards. Can one, just one for cripe's sake, push him on this? No, not patty-cake. I mean, really push him. Repeat it. Over and over and confront him, and don't let it go. Want to grow a pair, Anderson? Push the bastard on this, as hard as you pushed Trump on his sandbox tantrum with Cruz. (By the way, you didn't push the clown nearly hard enough!)
Not a tough guy among them.

[Hyperion's Post Brexit Moment]

This is playing out exactly how the ruling class wants it to play out. There was a legitimate movement to condemn police brutality and rein in out of control police tactics and get some much needed justice reform. So the race baiters and their media accomplices jumped right in and made it all about race, guaranteeing that nothing will ever be done about it. Now , BLM are being played like a fiddle by the same people, guaranteeing that there will be no reform here and instead, just the opposite, a more militarized and unaccountable police force. Look for the push to get guns out of the hands of citizens and to ban police cameras and the recording of police by citizens.

This was so fucking predictable, it's sickening.

[Duke]

I expect the media and the Obama administration to come out and acknowledge they were the racists and they were the ones who fomented our current racial divide.

I also expect some of the stocks I buy to go up but they never do.

[VG Zaytsev]

Watching Prog central, aka MSNBC, they're strectching, stretching stretching to blame these deaths on open carry in LA. Cause them rifles just up and kill people at random if there not locked up 24-7.

[commoditous]

I get that land management is an important issue, but these race agitators have a lot to answer for.

[Winston]

Ah so there is a chance of real social disorder and along racial lines too. Good thing the politicians won't exploit this for their own gain, right? It's not like Obama and Hillary aren't using these to call for more gun control...

[commoditous]

Remember that time when NRO was ahead of the curve on the topic of policing reforms while progressive race agitators were barely getting their boots on?

[AddictionMyth]

It's a war of police against themselves. How much you wanna bet these guys have connections to law enforcement?

[Domestic Dissident]

Weigel, you are one sad motherfucker.

[Winston]

Two things about the US political situation bring to mind Weimar Germany. The increasing use of executive orders to bypass Congress reminds me of how from 1930 Hindenburg was ignoring the Reichstag by Presidential decree. However by 1932 the Nazis and Communists had a majority of seats (and votes). And in 1932 Presidential Election there was a choice between Hindenburg and Hitler in the runoff. In the first round the third place candidate was the Communist and the fourth place was the anti-Semitic (though part-Jewish!) authoritarian Nationalist.

And Altona Bloody Sunday. A confrontation between SA, Commies and cops saw 18 people die. Papen used it as an excuse to toss out the Prussian State government by Presidential decree. This put Germany's largest police force under Federal Government control. Oh and when Hitler became chancellor it was because Papen hoped to render Hitler a powerless figurehead (it also seemed the only alternative to Hitler was a military dictatorship). This Prussian coup backfired since when Hitler came to power Hermann Goering was given control of the police and he made sure they did the Nazis bidding which rendered the Nazi's "allies" unable to prevent the Reichstag Fire Decree or the Enabling Act which gave Hitler dictatorial power.

[sarcasmic]

About the only thing that can be learned from history is that nothing is learned from history.

[Winston]

So is Shinzo Abe blowback from WWII and the Civil War?

[Heroic Mulatto]

No. Blowback from China trying its hand at imperialism in the South China Sea.

[Domestic Dissident]

Welcome to Obama's permanent legacy: a two front war against law, order, civilization, and basic decency, with his ghetto brownshirts now on the rampage on one end and the radical Muslim terrorists on the rampage on the other end, with the poor normals caught in the middle of the vise.

[Hyperion's Post Brexit Moment]

But don't you know, if we could just get rid of white people, the world would return to the peaceful utopia it had always been before the white devils appeared.

[Duke]

At one time your comment could have been dismissed as tinfoil hat conspiracy nuttery.

And yet here we see this scenario playing out before our very eyes.

[Domestic Dissident]

And I'm sorry to say that absolutely none of this stuff that's now happening now surprises me one bit. I've been expecting it for years, and the writing has clearly been on the wall for a while now.

I was one of the few people who truly vetted and investigated the background and history of this son of s bitch back in '08, so I had him pegged for what he is almost from day one.

[Vampire]

Terrible news about these folks that were killed.

The very issue is the state's standing army that is shielded from consequenses through qualified immunity. I also fault the protesters who talk of "reform" and "change", while never mentioning replacing the current system with the private production of security. This way if a security person violates someone's liberty, the people can actually choose to fund a competing security agency, rather than be forced to pay the salary of someone that harmed them or their family member. Such a person would be a liability to a company, and I don't think they would keep them employed at a desk job because of consumer backlash.

[You Sound Like a Prog (MJG)]

Please, someone get Hihn his meds.

[Dennis, Constitutional Peasant]

David Burge ?@iowahawkblog Jul 15

I'm struggling to imagine a person for whom Vox is a go-to world crisis news source.

[Hyperion's Post Brexit Moment]

No need to struggle, there are people who take Salon seriously.

[Dennis, Constitutional Peasant]

for context - i think he said this as a joke when Vox said, "HERE'S WHAT WE STILL DONT KNOW ABOUT TURKEY COUP".... as though there were millions of people hanging out at Vox, considering them the #1 source of intel on International Affairs.

i just thought it was apropos humor re: any breaking news at all.

i'm quite sure Vox will have an 'explainer' about police-shootings shortly, stealing the same argument gun-rights advocates have long used = noting that police shootings are way down overall (as is the overall murder rate, and gun-violence rate... but they'll avoid that last part)... and then quickly scoot back to the claims that police murders of unarmed blacks are actually "entirely unknown" and like campus rape - any measure is but the tip of the iceberg....

it has been noted before how amazingly comfortable they are using certain arguments in one context, while reversing themselves entirely and denying the same logic in others.

(e.g. "Carbon taxes will save the planet....because higher carbon prices reduce pollution - but higher minimum wages have no effect on employment demand, naturally... because reasons)

[Fist of Etiquette]

Update: Baton Rouge police are now saying they do not believe the shooting is "race related," according to CNN reports.

So then a mix of skin colors on one or both sides? Or simply a shootout related to some other everyday, run of the mill crime?

[Mr Lizard]

So a hot mess Sunday in the bayou?

[Domestic Dissident]

Sounds to me like one of those "not terrorism" reports we always get shortly after another Muslim massacres a bunch of people. Let's see what the dead perp and his victims looked like.

[Duke]

I'm watching BR local news. Suspect has been dead for a while. I imagine if he was white CNN would have blasted that out first thing.

[Heroic Mulatto]

I'm going to let it roll and place my chips on "Muslim". Why not? Luck be a lady tonight!

[AlmightyJB]

Hopefully it's a gay Muslim

[Rhywun]

Self-loathing?

[AlmightyJB]

Is there any other kind?

[Dennis, Constitutional Peasant]

I'm going to let it roll and place my chips on "Muslim".

I'm going with "drug related shootout"

[Heroic Mulatto]

Low-risk, low-reward.

[arbitrary wavefunction]

Obama:

I condemn, in the strongest sense of the word, the attack on law enforcement in Baton Rouge. For the second time in two weeks, police officers who put their lives on the line for ours every day were doing their job when they were killed in a cowardly and reprehensible assault. These are attacks on public servants, on the rule of law, and on civilized society, and they have to stop,"

Even Obama assumed what this was.

He probably was getting so much static for not condemning the Dallas stuff enough that he decided to whip out the ol' jump to conclusions mat for this one.

[Knarf the Yenrab]

Muh legacy! Every time he closes his eyes, he sees Pat Buchanan's grinning visage.

[CatoTheChipper]

Somebody out to ask Preet Bhahara whether it a coincidence that Black Lives Matter quotes Assata Shakur on its Get Involved webpage.

[Rhywun]

I thought that was a Star Trek character until I looked it up.

[Heroic Mulatto]

Assata Olugbala Shakur (born JoAnne Deborah Byron; July 16, 1947),[1] whose married name was Chesimard

Clearly, she is a mega-evolution of Charizard.

[The Fusionist]

Rearrange the letters in her name, you get "A Rutabaga Oak Ass Hulls."

[DenverJ]

Bobby jindell on Fox "these are the heroes that run towards danger" me yelling at the TV " like they ran towards danger at Columbine? The way they ran towards danger in Miami?"
Fuck the police. You get rid of all accountability, then act like an occupying army, and a free people are gonna rise up and shoot at you.

[Duke]

Good grief dude.

[DenverJ]

Oh, I'm sorry. Did I upset you? Is the second amendment just for hunting? Fuck those unaccountable, jack booted, thugs.
The founding fathers would tar and feather assholes acting like our modern police do.

[Duke]

Sounds like I upset you buddy. But hey guy, keep spewing the police murders are like totally justified crap if that's what floats your boat.

[Dennis, Constitutional Peasant]

that's nice sentiment and all, but i don't think "people killing cops" is necessarily a sign of "Free people rising up"

'free people rising up' would actually have implemented body-camera rules, use-of-force guidelines, created independent bodies to adjudicate misconduct etc. a long time ago. People killing cops are just killing cops because "reasons" which here remain unknown.

[Duke]

Agreed.

[Dennis, Constitutional Peasant]

"these are the heroes that run towards danger"

June 12
2:02 am

Orlando police receive the first notification that shots have been fired at Pulse nightclub.

2:22 am

Officers report over radio that they have contained the shooter in the back of the club.
...
...
...
...
...
5:02 am

Orlando police make the decision to rescue Pulse patrons

[DOOMco]

Heroes

[Duke]

Ya know, you all could go out and join the police and make a difference from the inside. I know I know-- it would require putting the Pokemon down and actually doing something other than being a keyboard warrior, but still...

[DOOMco]

They won't let people with high IQ's on.
I also doubt any of us would be hired after explaining that we believe in the 4th amendment.
And I doubt any of us would last, we wouldn't pull over speeders.

[Duke]

If ifs and buts were candies and nuts...

[DOOMco]

You're saying I could tell the department that I would never search a car without a warrant, and they would hire me?

[Heroic Mulatto]

No, he's saying LOVE IT OR LEAVE IT!

[DOOMco]

Great video. I play that game, but only the air side.

[Duke]

That's exactly what I meant Heroic! Of course I subscribe to the infantile either/or choices we are constantly confronted with in politics and as you pose here. Either I'm ok with killing cops as expected blowback ( and thus a bonafide libertarian) or I'm a pro police brutality statist. Yep. That's me to a T.

You're a bright one and your reading comprehension skills are improving. I'll be keeping my eye on you -- great job!

[Heroic Mulatto]

It was more about your affected "tough guy" pose, but I see that went whizzing by your sloped brow.

[Duke]

I'll bet money have more education than you do HM. Probably money too.

[Heroic Mulatto]

Maybe you do, maybe you don't. What does that have to do with you playing "tough guy" on the Internet?

[Duke]

I wrote that maybe people who are angry at police should join them and fix them from the inside. How do you get I'm acting like a tough guy from that?

[Heroic Mulatto]

I wrote that maybe people who are angry at police should join them and fix them from the inside. How do you get I'm acting like a tough guy from that?

From this:

"I know I know-- it would require putting the Pokemon down and actually doing something other than being a keyboard warrior"

Now are you going to make me go through the trouble of parsing out all the implicatures?

[DesigNate]

Do you bone Morgan Fairchild too Duke?

[Duke]

Doomco -- never know till you try. Cops are required to uphold the law. I'd think if anyone around here who bitches about police brutality should be willing to do us all a public service and try to fix the problem from the inside.

The whole put up or shut up thing.

[Heroic Mulatto]

If you've never been a chef, you have no right to complain about your food in a restaurant.

If you've never been a doctor, you have no right to seek a second opinion.

If you've never been elected to office, you have no right to advocate for lower taxes.

Seems legit.

[DOOMco]

Watch any episode of cops. Tell me that when I go to the interview and say, "yeah I'm not doing that", that the department would hire me anyway and give me a badge.

[Duke]

HM -- I see that introspective and nuanced arguments are beyond your grasp. As evidenced by your inapt example supra.

[Heroic Mulatto]

No, your premise is just invalid.

You don't have to whine about it.

[DOOMco]

But hes smarter than you, hm. And has more money.

[Heroic Mulatto]

What's more important is that his daddy can beat up all of our daddies. Combined!

[Warty]

Duke, how much can you bench press?

[Warty]

Duke, do you have to register your fists as lethal weapons when you move to a new place?

[JW]

Look, Duke lacks in critical thinking skills, so don't be such a big meanie to him. He can't help coming off as kinda fucking dumb.

[Pi Guy]

Supra? SUPRA?!?!

Look, boys - it's Bo, Cara, almost Esq!

Welcome back, you disingenuous weasel.
*waves*

[Rufus The Monocled]

If you've never played - insert sport here - you can't comment on it!

[DesigNate]

The whole point is that we shouldn't have to.

[Rufus The Monocled]

Why does one have to join the police to 'fix things from the inside'? Shoot, they'd probably be made public enemy #1 and never get anywhere unless committed to the job.

The cops represent - in theory - the people who - in theory - give them the legitimacy to use force to protect them. Instead, cops turn around, in documented cases that we now of, and use this force against innocents and then demand pension security from the very people they sometimes abuse.

The people then have a right to put pressure, through respected representatives, on them to reform and not have to face a big, blue wall of indignant resistance.

No need to join their ranks and a union.

[honeygirl]

Ok, lets say i join a pd and they assign me to vice. I hate vice laws. I dont believe in ruining peoples lives over what they do with their own bodies be it drugs or prostitution. Im a harm reductionist. I go to work and make 0 arrests. How long do you think ill stay on the job?

[kbolino]

I don't believe policing is a function limited exclusively to armed agents of the state wearing badges. Those are cops. Every citizen has the right and duty to police his community, no badge necessary.

Also, I am not joining a union. No way, no how.

[DOOMco]

This.

[DenverJ]

Why would I want to oppress fellow citizens and be an active force for evil? You do understand that the State actively works against the freedom and rights of the citizenry, and that, without men with guns, the State would not be able to do all the evil that it does?
Look, any individual cop may actually be a decent person. But the job is to be an enforcer for the State. So, again, fuck the police.

[CZmacure]

Ya know, you all could go out and join the police and make a difference from the inside. I know I know-- it would require putting the Pokemon down and actually doing something other than being a keyboard warrior, but still...

I wonder if this form of rhetoric, where Person B suggests that Person A, about whom they know nothing, must be part of what they are criticizing in order to be allowed to comment on, EVER works.

Maybe if the targets are really, really unsophisticated?

Duke : It sounds kinda like you have a boner for the police. How do you feel about Loss Prevention workers in private industry? Are they also above reproach because their voluntarily taken job involves bearing risk of violence on behalf of others? Or is it the whole doing it on behalf of the state thing that makes police so very special?

[JayU]

Hell of a way to celebrate your birthday.

[Sidd Finch v2.01]

I bet these cop killers read Balko in the Washington Post and thought he really got the better of the argument against whatshername in City Journal and thatblackenconomist at Harvard. They probably decided futher that centralized lawmaking and policing is such an affront to their anarcho-communitarian principles that homicide is morally justified to defend their individual and community sovereignty.

[Knarf the Yenrab]

If only someone had taken away their subscriptions to Foreign Affairs and the Economist years ago.

[Set Us Up The Chipper]

...but no war on cops.

[Knarf the Yenrab]

I only hope it was a white male libertarian. Preferably Baptist, but beggars, choosers, etc.

[Knarf the Yenrab]

According to a WSJ source, the deceased suspect was affiliated with an anti-government group.

Won't someone rid us of these troublesome libertarians and sovereign citizens?

[Domestic Dissident]

Yeah, it's called "Black Lives Matter", or as I like to sometimes call them, Obama's Ghetto Brownshirts.

[Warty]

Do you mean Block Insane Yomamma?

[Swiss Servator]

+1 MikeP

[bendover]

Videos on Long's account show that he was a former Nation of Islam member. He also railed against "crackers" and made references to Alton Sterling, the black man killed by police in Baton Rouge on July 5.

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2016/07.....z4Ei6cguLN

[FD]

If true then Heroic is rolling sevens.

[Jerry on the rocks]

So definitely not race related then?

[FD]

Oh, yuh. Long sounds like a veritable Walt Williams.

[FD]

Oh, yuh. Long sounds like a veritable Walt Williams.

[RBS]

Does anyone know if there was gun play before the police arrived?

[DOOMco]

Paging hihn!

[Rufus The Monocled]

Man oh man are police gonna spin this - and it won't be in favor of meaningful reform.

This is where true leaders are born.

Good luck.

[Rufus The Monocled]

Citizens do hit back. We know they tolerate things up to a point. The question is when do they stop?

"We are on the verge of a civil war." That quote did not come from a fanatic or a lunatic. No, it came from head of France's homeland security, the DGSI (Direction g?n?rale de la s?curit? int?rieure), Patrick Calvar. He has, in fact, spoken of the risk of a civil war many times. On July 12th, he warned a commission of members of parliament, in charge of a survey about the terrorist attacks of 2015, about it."

http://www.gatestoneinstitute......-civil-war

[db]

Hey, guys? I just dropped in to ask if anyone knows whether there was any gunplay before the cops showed up. I haven't been able to find any info on that, and it seems this whole situation could be figured out if only we had that one critical bit of data.

Anyone know about this? Thanks in advance.

[PapayaSF]

Info on Gavin Eugene Long, a.k.a. Cosmo Ausar Setepenra.

His books, from his website. He was also a life coach. There are testimonials on his site....

[Knarf the Yenrab]

Bringing together the untold science of Melanin, ancient esoteric secrets of the Pineal Gland, and how to develop your higher-self, The Ascension Volume Two in The Cosmo Way series will help you achieve higher consciousness, inner strength, as well as your mental and spiritual goals.

As a young man I had a spiritual revelation and traveled to Africa?my ancestral homeland. My spiritual journey took me across the continent where I was taught by native spiritual practitioners and elder holistic healers. In Africa I was spiritually directed to gather the laws of the universe. They are the principles that govern every aspect of life. The universe exists in perfect harmony by virtue of these laws. They control and dictate what science calls energy, and what religions call God. If you understand the laws that govern Y.O.U. (Your Own Universe), you can manipulate, shape, and mold them to your liking. I have compiled these 124 Universal Laws and their use in The Laws of The Cosmos.

I'm beginning to think that this individual may have been . . . colorful.

(puts on sunglasses)

[PapayaSF]

His actions do not reflect well on the science of Melanin....

[PapayaSF]

Huh. Looks like he was also connected with the Nation of Islam, the "Washitaw Nation," and the Sovereign citizen movement.

[CZmacure]

the Nation of Islam, the "Washitaw Nation," and the Sovereign citizen movement.

Crazies gonna crazy.

I know, let's take his grandiose delusions seriously, and discuss them in great seriousness.

[PapayaSF]

Oh, I'm not taking them seriously, just noting. What will be interesting is how such connections will be treated by the media. I predict the Sovereign citizen connection will be seized on by the left, and the Nation of Islam connection by the right, and the New Age connection by Christian conservatives. More secular conservatives can blame BLM, BLM can blame racism, SJWs can blame the NRA, and libertarians can blame out-of-control police.

Everyone will have a grand old time.

Except Hillary. She will have to mouth words about "structural racism" and the need for white people to change, because what else would cause a black member of the Nation of Islam to kill a black cop? Yeah, that and gun control and more Muslim immigration is really going to swing the election in her direction....

[PapayaSF]

It seems like just yesterday that putting printer's crop marks on a map of politicians "targeted" for electoral defeat was a reckless call to violence, and an action responsible for the shooting of Gabrielle Giffords (among others). On the other hand, today I'm told that calling police murdering racists is not a call to violence in any way, shape, or form.

Politics can be very confusing.

[SIV]

^Shit Crackers Say^

[PapayaSF]

(Not sure if sarcastic or misunderstanding my point....)

[Agammamon]

If, for some reason, you feel the need to get frisky with the po-po, don't shoot the 50 on patrol. Go down to 1PP - that's where the orders that beat cop is following come from.

90% of the cops walking a beatdriving that patrol car are just blue collar schlubs working for a paycheck - and, believe it or not, may actually put their lives on the line for you one day. Maybe. If left alone to do their jobs and not pulled back by higher to 'secure the perimeter' because 'they're not properly equipped'.

[Tamfang]

police say they believe there is more than one suspect.

Either they suspect more than one person or they don't: why this uncertainty?

I'll repeat it as often as I have to:
A suspect is the known person who is suspected of a crime.
To use the same word for the unknown person who definitely did the crime is needlessly prejudicial to the presumption of innocence, to which I expect Reason to give some weight.

[lukashik]

We can even create playlists of them so it will be very easy to find our videos which we like. We can also download those videos and can watch them offline. Showbox for pc

[That's A Bingo!]

You forgot lizard people.

[sarcasmic]

Behind it all, AGAIN, our Muslim President, financed by George Soros, the Illumnati, the New World Order and the Bilderberg Group. All while Obama's the military invasion of Texas is getting closer to launch.

Tell me, what brand of foil do you use for your hats? I want to buy some stock in the company.

[DOOMco]

Lost your hinge pins, huh?

[commoditous]

Yes, officers being targeted just beggars belief, doesn't it? When has that ever happened last week?

[Diane Reynolds (Paul.)]

At this point, if I had to pick one conspiracy theory that might have a grain of truth, I might go with the BLM plot. 'Cause it ain't open carry.

[Cdr Lytton]

bully!

(giggles into juice box)

[Intraveneous Woodchipper]

Oh Michael, you really can be tiresome sometimes. Ever thought about doing something else with your spare time? You really seem like you could use a hobby.

Also, I don't have any attatchment to a particular narrative so if you have any information regarding the events, do share and perhaps I'll be convinced. But the "we disagree/I can't take a joke" = "you're a terrorist" angle is just kinda lame, no? You can do better.

[sarcasmic]

The name is Michael Hihn, but it doesn't recognize doubling down on sarcasm.

And you wonder why you have no friends.

[Mr Lizard]

Um No...read above you fools. I'm not feelin too conspiracy'y today

[You Sound Like a Prog (MJG)]

I was hoping you'd respond with that. Glad we're on the same wavelength.

[Careless]

Repeating yourself no matter what you're responding to doesn't make you look any less batshit, Hihn.

[commoditous]

You compared MSNBC twirling, twirling, twirling away from freedom in yet another despicable (and entirely predictable) gun control gambit, with Fox (allegedly) blaming the attack on "a BLM plot."

Aside from the fact that nobody says BLM is directly and deliberately responsible for the violence it inspires, you hysteric dunce, one of these things is a more realistic response than the other. It's not unreasonable to suspect that a similar incident a week after an assassination might have a similar provenance.

You're the ass, Mike.

[Not an Economist]

Of course it could of been an ambush (fire shots to draw police into a situation where they could be killed). But why complain about jumping the gun by jumping the gun yourself?

[Ted S.]

Only sometimes?

[OneOut]

I keep trying to come up with so method of getting a bunch of cops to gather together in one place but all I can come up with is free doughnuts.

I wonder if popping off a few rounds in public might work ?

[DOOMco]

Is anyone actually confused about why they were called? What is wrong with you?

[commoditous]

And he may be right, but for some reason feels the need to throw a tantrum about it. Let's not only get our facts straight but let's go one further and claim the null hypothesis from the get-go just in case our first inclinations were wrong. Sorry, Mikey, if I'm not as super excited about this situation as you are. You aspy nerd.

[commoditous]

Some people get their buttons pressed in weird ways. I wouldn't invite Hihn to the gun range, that's for sure.

[arbitrary wavefunction]

I wouldn't invite Hihn anywhere at all.

[DOOMco]

Huh?

[Trigger Warning]

Hihn means "hysteria" on whatever planet you're from, right?

[ant1sthenes]

Isn't she the person who fled to Cuba after murdering a couple of cops?

[Swiss Servator]

BULLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Eloh-Nroc]

MH, exactly how many times do you plan on repeating this little factoid? FOAD Already!

Your Hihn-Sight is so 20/20.

[Swiss Servator]

Your Alzheimer's?

[Swiss Servator]

Hihn is senile or a thread corpsefucker - possibly both.

[PapayaSF]

Alton Sterling was a gang-banger, sex offender, and deadbeat dad with a lengthy rap sheet, including a previous incident of fighting with police while in possession of a gun (illegally). Well, the violent moron did it again, but didn't survive that time.

[DenverJ]

Yeah, not a good guy. But when did the police become judge, jury, and executioner? The video I saw does not justify the police actions.

[PapayaSF]

To me it looked like another edge case. He was fighting, he did have a gun, and maybe the cop wasn't lying when he said Sterling was going for it. And one can argue whether the last few shots were necessary or not. What it doesn't look like is "racist police hunting down and killing another innocent unarmed black man for no reason," which seems to be the BLM/SJW position.

[WTF]

Check your mirror, you corpse-fucking demented old twat.

[WTF]

Why don't you fucking reply within a reasonable time of the post you're replying to? Oh yeah, you corpse fuck so you can pretend you "won" because you got the last word. HURR DURRR!

[ant1sthenes]

Quoting a person who murdered police might be intended to convey a message deeper than the literal words of the quote?

[Hooha]

Do these posts embarrass you now, or are you more feral bird than human, dropping your shit wherever before flying away?

[Hooha]

These fossilized nuggets of intellectual feces are the only good thing about the lack of an edit button on these boards.

[Eloh-Nroc]

MH, exactly how many times do you plan on repeating this little factoid? FOAD Already!

Your Hihn-Sight is so 20/20.