Gun Control

All 4 Senate Gun Bills Fail Today

Two bills to restrict "terror watchlist" people from getting guns, two to strengthen federal background check system in general, all fail to garner needed 60 votes in Senate. Sen. Rand Paul angers some Second Amendment activists by voting for one of the terror suspect bills.

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The Senate this afternoon rejected four different gun bills supposedly intended to help deal with future Orlando-like mass shootings; two related to the background check systems operation, two related to keeping terror suspects from getting guns. Procedurally, all of the bills needed 60 supporting votes to stay alive for now.

JIM LO SCALZO/EPA/Newscom

Jacob Sullum explained the for-now failed bills related to the terror watch list in detail earlier today. One, from California's reliably anti-gun Sen. Dianne Feinstein (D), would, as Sullum reported, allow the attorney general to deny a gun sale if, in Feinstein's bill's language, the A.G. "determines, based on the totality of the circumstances, that the transferee represents a threat to public safety based on a reasonable suspicion that the transferee is engaged, or has been engaged, in conduct constituting, in preparation for, in aid of, or related to terrorism, or providing material support or resources thereof."

That one only got 47 pro-votes, far short of the 60 required.

A similar bill from Republican Sen. John Cornyn (Texas), as Sullum wrote, would have "allow[ed] the Justice Department to delay the transfer of a gun to someone who is 'a known or suspected terrorist' or who has been 'the appropriate subject of a terrorism investigation within the last five years.' The government then has three days to persuade a judge there is probable cause to believe the suspect is involved in terrorism."

Cornyn's version got 53 "for" votes today, again not enough to proceed.

Sullum also discussed a sort of compromise bill in the works on the terror suspect matter from Sen. Susan Collins (R-Maine), which has not yet been voted on.

Connecticut Democratic Sen. Chris Murphy, one of the leaders of the 15-hour attempt to talk his colleagues into acting on further gun restrictions last week, tells Politico that "I'm going to be turning my attention to the November election. I'm going to take some of my energy and help make sure that people who cast the wrong vote don't come" back to the Senate.

Two bills related to background check system were also blocked from proceeding for now, one a standard attempt to universalize background checks for every gun sale, not just one's by licensed federal gun dealers. That one saw a 44-56 vote against today.

Another background check bill out of the office of Judiciary Committee Chairman Sen. Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa), which would spend more on the national background check system and encourage more thorough reporting on those in the mental health system to prevent them from legally obtaining guns, also failed today, 53-47.

Many in the Second Amendment community considered even Cornyn's supposedly milder attempt to prohibit people under government suspicion from getting guns legally to be an illegitimate restriction against those not actually arrested or charged with crimes. Still, Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.), usually a staunch gun rights man, did support and vote for Cornyn's bill. (I saw handfuls of gun rights activists in social networking say this made them vow to never support Paul again.)

In a press release emailed to me that I was not able to find online as of posting, Paul wrote that:

"By all means we should do everything possible to prevent terrorists from buying weapons, but we should never take away any American's Second Amendment rights without due process. Innocent until proven guilty is the basis of our judicial system.  We should not abridge any of our basic rights without due process in a court of law," Dr. Paul said….

"I recently asked the FBI Director, why was this investigation closed? The Orlando killer at least twice threatened violence against co-workers, he knew another suicide bomber, he travelled to Saudi Arabia, and five weeks before the massacre a gun store owner reported him to the FBI. The FBI dropped the ball here. To prevent more tragedies like this from recurring, we need to insist that the FBI does more thorough investigations," stated Dr. Paul.

Paul also wrote in that release that he "advocated to change the Cornyn Amendment to ensure that anyone investigated by the FBI would stay on the terror watch list for five years."

While Sen. Paul seems to consider the fact that a judge would need to sign off on the prohibition sufficient due process, many Second Amendment supporters consider anything short of prosecution for a crime that puts one in a legally prohibited category an unconstitutional reason to deny the right to purchase a gun.

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117 responses to “All 4 Senate Gun Bills Fail Today

  1. NEEDZ MOAR PORK!

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  2. I can imagine the forelock tugging in the Chron tmorrow. Just today they had a forlorn piece of whinery wondering ‘if the gun nuts were finally going to be forced out of their corner?’.
    Nope.

    1. Pork is being chopped, diced, pulled, smoked, baked, spiced, and whatever else it is you can do to pork, furiously in the congress right now.

      How long before something even worse and more diabolical is up for a vote? Tomorrow or the next day?

  3. So…Sen. Paul voted to strip Americans suspected of terrorism of their right to a jury trial and their right to be presumed innocent until proven guilty of some past crime beyond a reasonable doubt.

    And the amendment he voted for has moved the Overton window a bit more in the statist direction.

    Not that we should be bitter.

    1. Well, I guess they finally got him, I wonder where the private island is? I hope he gets hell from his constituents over this.

      1. Anyone ever see one of these emails before, asking for donations in the fight for liberty? I mean, I know why I’m getting them. This shit has me thinking…

        Rand Paul “rand.paul@campaignforliberty.com”

        1. The bad news is that if you get them, hitting and asking to be removed from the list is never acknowledged, and there’s no Unsubscribe Link anywhere, either.
          Talk about ‘transparent’ or ‘ability to communicate’…

          Epic Fail.
          Now I just automatically let my email put them in the junk folder. Too bad Rand can’t see That kind of “feedback.”

      2. This is a bit too harsh, but it gives the gist.

        1. Wait until I get another email from the fucker asking for donations.

          1. And to think I supported this fuckers presidential campaign also and defended him constantly online, and to people I know in person. I was going to volunteer if he got the nomination, for whatever I could do. Fuck.this.shit.

            1. Tell me about it…I sent him $1000 during the primary 🙁

    2. To be fair to Rand, the bill he voted for was a compromise that would have simply placed a 72 hour hold on the transfer, during which the FBI would have time to follow up. It’s not great, but it’s not nearly as bad as some of the other bills.

      And it gave Democrats a chance to show their ass by showing that they aren’t interested in compromises, which makes it easier to take on their bullshit in the future.

      1. Yeah, sometimes it works that way: By moving the Overton window in the direction it would seem you don’t want, you manage to put yourself inside the window and your opponents outside it. Since they won’t compromise, you just painted yourself as reasonable & your opponents as unreasonable. Since people form their opinions partially on who holds what ideas while seeming reasonable, vs. who holds what ideas while seeming unreasonable, the Overton window winds up moving paradoxically in the other direction from the way you seemed to pull it. If ideas existed on their own in a vacuum, it wouldn’t work that way, but because ideas exist in the heads of people whom, in some cases, can be identified, it does work that way.

  4. Chris Murphy hardest hit.

  5. Stripping rights based on a whim of a bureaucrat? Ladies and Gentlement, meet the Democrats!

    1. And apparently a heaping helping of Republicans.

      1. Always has been. Look at the roll call vote for the 1994 Brady Bill. Quite a few R’s jumped on that one.

        1. Worst anti-2nd amendment bill ever passed. Fuck you, Clinton, and fuck you Republicans, and fuck you Democrats, go to hell.

          1. Would not have passed without Republican support, at least on paper. I suspect some of those Democrat no votes were acceptable by their leadership because of those R’s

    2. Hey, Rand Paul… how about a bill to establish a “transparent” process to get your name OFF that fucking list if it Really Doesn’t Belong There?

      No Court of Appeals? Morons!

  6. Gun-Ban Rand

    At least Trump is still pro-2A

    1. How did that talk go he’s having with the NRA?

      1. The NRA freaked out because Trump said people should be able to carry in bars. He moved “to the right” of the NRA

            1. Thanks. The NRA has always been weak. Trump probably should have suggested instead, that people who are armed, and drinking, can leave their weapons with ‘designated drivers’, or volunteers at the club who would not be drinking, but would be able to defend. Also, armed bouncers, guards.

              There is no practical or constitutional solutions which removes anyone’s right to own firearms and protect themselves, period.

              1. Also, armed bouncers, guards.

                Sure & he left it open for that. He didn’t say anything about drinking and gunning – that’s just the narrative that was put in his mouth.

            2. More proponents of that which is not forbidden, must be mandatory.

  7. …Sen. Rand Paul (R-Texas)…

    WRONG.

    Maybe Senator Paul is thinking about running for the P-word again, and wants to be on record as having been tough on terrorists. Or maybe, just maybe, he’s actually a Republican, regardless of which state he carpetbagged it to.

    1. Wrong what? Did he vote for one of these things, or not? He knows better than that shit.

      1. Well, he represents Kentucky, not Texas.

        1. Yes, I see that now, it’s really hard to care about trivia when you are fucking pissed as hell.

          1. I mean I see the error, I know he represents KY!

            1. Sorry bout that stupidity. Fixed if you refresh. A reflex of sorts after typing the name “Paul” for so many years.

              1. Brian, again, don’t worry about this. It’s an important and informative article. I appreciate it anyway. Like I said, I didn’t even notice it, people are being anal retentive.

          2. Not a good way to fuck.

  8. Uhh… Senator Rand Paul should be (R-KY), not (R-TX)… that was Representative Ron

    1. Oh yes, that. Sorry, I’m so fucking mad I don’t have time to notice small shit like that.

    2. Give him a break, it’s not like he wrote a book on the guy…….

    3. You guys got me. I have a reflex to type “(R-Texas)” after the name Paul, apparently. Dumb mistake fixed if you refresh.

      1. Don’t worry about that. People being anal retentive and missing the important part.

  9. I don’t think ISIS likes guns in the hands of the hot gay fucks they wish to mow down. So, let us for sure remove all those guns through the thresholds of the places these fringe fucks party through. Also, all the other goddamn leapers to songs- let’s make sure they are all sitting goddamn baby geese under the lilting tongues in the halls when these serial killing fucks come to visit. Hey, world, let’s just fucking roll over the goddamn religious horrors unleashed by the scripts of Islam as their twisted doctors come to unveil their forms of surgery on the freest masses while the elected representatives of the entire fucking goddamn rotund globe decides that being fucking mentally-deficient and insidiously relativistic is the way to placate birthed murderers walking and acting to verses weighed down by the voice of a blood-letting prophet of ANY goddamn STRIPE.

    1. ISIS likes guns in the hands of their jihadists. Of course they want a soft target if they can get it.

      1. ISIS in the cities and woods of America with a bunch of my friends, hyp, would be riddled into a middle-eastern poem.

        1. Haven’t seen you around for awhile. All is well I hope?

  10. Guns inoculate killers. Guns in the hands of honest men and women allow the algorithm of law to exist without the insidious acid of lawyers and judges when the tempest of hell is quick.

  11. Look, all of these bills, no matter what they say, only have one intention. And that is to proceed the agenda, if it’s one inch at a time, one nano scale unit at a time, it doesn’t matter, that is how the left works, to ban all guns and totally disarm the American public. Anyone who tells you anything different is a shameless fucking liar.

    1. Security ends societies forever and always.
      Whether by armies or legislation.
      Security is how ALL governments from the dawn of modern civilizations from hundreds of years ago until this day are able
      to
      nip
      at
      the
      rights
      of
      the modern earth citizen.

    2. Dems will get their ban if they have to do it one Planck-length at a time. The idea of the peasants having the means to resist is intolerable to the modern heirs of Marx and Mao.

  12. Paul wrote that:

    “By all means we should do everything possible to prevent terrorists from buying weapons, but we should never take away any American’s Second Amendment rights without due process. Innocent until proven guilty is the basis of our judicial system. We should not abridge any of our basic rights without due process in a court of law,”

    Well, apparently, you don’t know what the fuck due process means, Rand, since you just went ahead and voted against it. That’s ok, it won’t affect you no matter what, will it, Senator?

  13. Many in the Second Amendment community…

    Brian, please don’t use the word ‘community’ like that.

  14. Be secure. However- own some shit that spits lead. Because if you are gay and drunk in a club or NOT gay and drunk in a club. THIS motherfucking country cannot protect you. PERIOD.

    We spend probably hundreds of millions of confiscated dollars from millions of barely making it citizens and we lost 50 bloody horrors of them to what THIS motherfucking goddamn FBI was SUPPOSED to be hired to protect us from.

    I at this point HATE the FBI. for what they allowed to happen to me. i HATE that this happened and I no longer view the FBI as competent in any manner.

    THE FBI can FUCK itself. They are no longer relevant. How are they? They have a hundred MILLION dollar budget and SOMEHOW TONS of people died in the country they are tasked to protect.

    WHAT PISSES me OFF is we get a FUCK TON of articles about how awesome all these motherfuckers are. SWAT was saved people and shit. BUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    NOT ENOUGH CRITICAL ARTICLES about the shitty ability of the FBI to EVEN STOP this shit fucker.

    1. Send your resume into the FBI, Agile Cyborg. Just for chuckles and I really want some insite into the hiring process.

    2. Say word. Maybe I can’t stop someone from killing me or people around me just because I’m packing at the time. But don’t tie my hands behind my back and make it a guarantee.

    1. Angering the authors of pro-Putin hit pieces?

    2. William Browder, says The Jewish Chronicle, considers himself Putin’s Number One enemy. For him, Putin is “no friend of the Jews”

      Well, typically leftist Democrats are no friends of Jews either, in fact they typically rant on and on about evil Jews, but that doesn’t seem to stop Jews from voting for them. Go figure.

  15. Can all the articles in America stop it with the SWAT worship. Because SWAT is always pure asshole. NOTHING these people do is great. HOWEVER, what we expect from the FBI is to NOT BE SWAT BECAUSE SWAT IS NORMALLY FULL OF JIGGLY ASS FUCKERS!! WHO KNOW NOTHING ABOUT THE WORLD!! BUT, what I, as AGILE CYBORG expects is that the motherfucking intelligENT layer of the GREATEST FUCKING NATION ON earth is to KNOW is to actually SAVE AMERICANS from an untimely death.

    WHY does the FBI even exist? 50 people were killed under THEIR watch.

    WHY the FUCK does this agency even have the goddamn RIGHT to act like the swaggering shits they are?

    1. AGILE CYBORG iS [HERC]!

      I love you, Agile 🙂

  16. I just have to eat vinegar jalapenos rolled in Jewish bread with spinach and a long-legged Ginger inserted for yummy nipple juice and a punch in the neck for a bite too tight and then a fuckton of fun in the spa, sweet lover.

  17. Well, libertarian moment. Until tomorrow.

  18. It’s not that we’re mad, just disappointed.

    1. No, I’m fucking mad. Speak for yourself.

      1. I am disappoint.

      2. That should be been in quotes.

  19. If 50 people were actually killed and this isn’t some fucking state propaganda act which can occur easily in the age of dispensed reality…

    I have partied in many many many many clubs over the years… and MOST large clubs have several bouncers who are ARMED cops working off-duty. The PULSE is not small. IT IS very LARGE in terms of common busy club.

    The fact that 50 people were killed is suspicious to me. Even two or three armed cops could have killed this fucker rather quickly in a large club in a big city.

    I am highly suspect of what happened at Pulse, bro. A club that large doesn’t have fat overpaid retards at their entrance pretty much anywhere near a large city.

    Not enough dig-down going down at Pulse.

    1. AC, one of my first thoughts was how does one get an AR-15 past the bouncer.

      1. Never met a bounce that doesn’t search for tiny bottles of alcy on the belt in a club worth its salt. Tiny holes in the walls don’t search but ALL large clubs search for liquor. I am suspicious!

      2. Maybe he shot the bouncer first? Some muscle is not a good match for some .223 rounds. But no worries, if anyone even gets the idea to arm their bouncers, congress will make sure soon to not let this happen, for the children.

        1. Most large clubs which was the Pulse have SEVERAL off-duty cops/security guys working them, dear. And these guys are fucking ready to fuck your ass up. They are usually tired and angry and troll donkey dicks. I buy them cans of redbull to purchase favor with them. Which works by the way as it should because my projection of respect is meant to offset their fucking impatience with my FUCKING drug-addled horsey-stomps with my whores on oaken floors.

        2. Where’d he shoot the bouncer from? The street?

        3. The off duty cop exchanged gunfire with him, realized he was outgunned, and rereated. In other words, he didn’t do his job.

  20. Finally some good news, Rand’s vote notwithstanding. Paul does need to catch some hell over this, though.

    1. It’s not good news. The votes are way too close on all of these bills. That means there will be bribes of all forms, they will be amended with meaningless bullshit and stuffed with pork and at least one of them will pass soon.

      1. I hear what you’re saying but I figured one of the less restrictive ones would make it. If you’re the type let your senator know how you think they should vote if they recycle any of these bills.

        1. Well, I live in MD, so that’s a useless waste of time for me.

          No matter what passes, it is a fucking huge win for the gun grabbers. That’s how they win, an inch at a time. The left have been playing this game for 100 years. And when they say they will eventually win, it’s hard for me to imagine any other outcome, given the spineless pussies who are supposed to be opposing them.

          1. As an Annapolitan I sympathize. Totally unrelated, did you know that Polymer80 is coming out with an 80% Glock lower kit? Just throwin’ that out there.

  21. An average small club in Chicago has at least 5 off-duty armed cops working the scene gently. How does the Pulse? which is quite large have ONLY door keepers? and NO off-duty cops inside? I dislike cops but they are part of the landscape of partying clubs and I have tolerated them for decades with a neutral to slightly appreciative aura. HOW does a club of PULSE size have NO COPS inside that cannot tackle a mass murderer? I am suspicious.

    1. I share your suspicion. I guarantee you the Feds were working this guy and it got out of hand.

      1. I believe you are [REDACTED]

    2. HOW does a club of PULSE size have NO COPS inside that cannot tackle a mass murderer?

      They would have been breaking the law doing so, wouldn’t they? Maybe FL is strict about that sort of thing.

    3. More likely Chicago is the oddity due to its warzone level crime rate. Such heavy security is seen as a waste of money in safer cities.

    4. Chicago is about as violent as Iraq…Orlando is not.

  22. “I recently asked the FBI Director, why was this investigation closed? The Orlando killer at least twice threatened violence against co-workers, he knew another suicide bomber, he travelled to Saudi Arabia, and five weeks before the massacre a gun store owner reported him to the FBI. The FBI dropped the ball here. To prevent more tragedies like this from recurring, we need to insist that the FBI does more thorough investigations”

    And if the investigation was still open, how would that have stopped him? None of those things are criminal acts other than the threats, and those undoubtedly would take a much lower priority to other crimes.

    1. There’s no real solution to anything like this other than allowing people to protect themselves. That’s not a perfect solution and there is no perfect solution, but that’s the best solution. Everything that is done to restrict a person’s right to defend themselves will only result in more crime and make everyone less safe, it will never make anything better.

      The left’s assertion that if we ban something, no one will get it, is absurd and they know this. How’s that drug war going, dipshits?

      1. Exactly. It was the same thing with 9/11. Dealing with the hijackers is someone else’s problem. Sit in your seat and do what they say. Call 911 and wait for the police to handle the shooter. Somehow, thanks to the shining example of the passengers & crew of UA93, the lesson of post-9/11 hijacking or any disturbance is passenger must deal with it themselves. And that’s what needs to happen here or any incident. Parents need to teach their children (because it’s not the government’s goddam responsibility or business) that they are ultimately responsible for their own safety and well being. No one else is.

  23. Go to ANY large club at ANY hour in ANY very large city and THAT club WILL have protection for its clientele. I, agile cyborg, a cocaine-enjoying vodka imbibing and whisky loving FUCK has been kicked out of MANY clubs in AMERICA for dancing on rich roof tops to Styx at 11 p.m.. BUT a multiple gun-toting FUCK gets in at a LARGE club in Orlando? – my favorite buddy in the world lives right outside Orlando and we’ve done tons of drugs in the swamp nearby that place.

    I am suspicious.

    1. You are suspicious, you are also marvelous and entertaining. Glad I caught some more of your posts before I vanish from this orbit.

      Hope all is well with you, AC. Tchuss,mein freund.

      1. monster juice creams from the galaxies…

      2. There are a few odd things about it:

        – Where are all the eyewitness reports? Many people survived, correct?

        – I heard that at least one survivor claimed that the shooter had help: that at least one person was holding the doors closed.

        – How did the shooter’s father get to be a naturalized citizen and hobnob with various politicians, while being what sounds like a supporter of the Taliban?

        1. Is this the person to whom you are referring?

          If there is another/more I would be interested in learning of them.

          1. Yeah, that’s her. Not sure if there are others.

    2. “This ain’t no Mudd Club no CBGBs this ain’t no fooling around.” I couldn’t get into either club back in 80’s after happy hour. I got into Max’s KC, yahoo!

      1. I miss the NYC (“alternative”) club scene of the late 90s and believe it or not the Buffalo scene of the early 90s even more.

    3. Me too. Plus…the shooter was in there for three hours! People inside the club had called 911 within minutes. Why did it take police three hours to go in?

  24. “…Democrat after Democrat standing for hours, incensed–not at ISIS; incensed–not at radical Islamic terrorism; incensed…that Americans have a right to keep and bear arms.”

    ~Ted Cruz

    1. Teddy and and Cruzers – worst movie EVAR

      1. Somebody hasn’t seen Grown Ups 2

        1. You are correct, sir. I applaud your amazing insight…. #bows

  25. Oh, PS:

    All 4 Senate Gun Bills Fail Today

    GOOD

  26. Well, typically leftist Democrats are no friends of Jews either….

    You know who else wasn’t a friend of….

    Nevermind the usual and obvious question, Hyperion, Rand Paul’s vote, explanation for same, and potential future actions based upon the aforementioned, all seem to have contributed to your negative frame of mind.

    Not knowing your sense of humor, I will nonetheless take this risk and hope that a very brief and twisted video worthy of H&R’s lowest will slightly alleviate your disgruntlement: A Happiness and Cyanide Short for you

    1. Well, that did make me laugh. Thanks.

      1. I am glad that I took a chance.

        Also – I think that you are being overly hard on yourself.*
        Even you will, upon occasion, be misled. And from what I’ve seen of your postings here at H&R (and despite my admitted lack of what you would most likely find humorous), you’re no slouch in the mental department.

        *I, however, reserve the seemingly hypocritical right to be as judgemental of myself as I want, whenever and however I so choose.

        1. No, I’m being extra hard on Rand. I’m fine with me, I’ve got my principles all in a row, and they are immovable (}:

          1. And thanks for the compliment, bro, I appreciate it.

          2. Hyperion also has an excellent recipe for hot wing sauce.

    2. Godwin’s Law.

  27. Your false flag operation failed, Obama/FBI/ATF/CIA/Clintons/Schumers/Mark Ruffalo.

    1. *adjusts tinfoil hat – throws another can of Sterno? on the fire*

  28. Common sense from the senate, amazing.

    1. Was it morr of a partyline vote that will only reinforce the lesser of two evils narrative?

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  30. Does anyone else think that a War on Guns will be about as effective as the War on Drugs and play out in a similar way?

  31. I’m pretty sure “thereof” in the quoted language ought to read “therefor”. Can a sentence in a bill which does not make grammatical sense be valid law?

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