Chicago Residents, Activists Slam President Obama's State of the Union, Suggest He Resign, Stop Blaming Corporations

Say he hasn't done anything for the community

Rebel Pundit, a citizen journalist project founded by a self-described "anti-activist" from Chicago, put together a video of local grassroots activists responding to President Obama, who once called Chicago his home. The reactions are universally negative, and display opinions usually marginalized in the mainstream media's narrative about the arguments of the president's supporters and detractors. There are comments in the video you might agree with, others you might not, but they all seem honest and uncanned.  It's only five minutes and well worth to watch:

h/t BakedPenguin

Comments

[The Last American Hero]

More propaganda from those racist Teathuglicans.

/Progtard

[Ed]

One of the people points out there are no Republicans or Tea Partiers in Chicago.

[Killaz]

John Lewis lies about being called a nigger in a staged walk through of Tea Party protesters, the lie is picked up in black media and assumed to be true due to his status as a 'legend'. Negative opinions of the Tea Party become set in their community and the 'angry white male' becomes an other fulfilled prophecy. Nice work if you can get it and if you can stand your soul being thoroughly corrupted.

[Smilin' Joe Fission]

These must be the stupid blacks

/Tony

[playa manhattan]

He dug himself quite a hole this morning.

[Grand Moff Serious Man]

Shit, what did I miss?

[playa manhattan]

BRB, I'm going to find it. Work today?

[Grand Moff Serious Man]

Yeah, first day. Glad to have some steady work but my schedule and hours leave something to be desired.

5:30 am til 2, Thursday through Monday. Can't complain too much though.

[playa manhattan]

Dude, you're out in time to play the back 9. Nothing to complain about.

[Grand Moff Serious Man]

With paying my parents rent and starting my student loan repayment in the next few months I won't have much money for golf.

Although I guess I'll be less tempted to waste money on weekend nights.

[playa manhattan]

You have to pay your parents rent? Then what's the point of living at home?

[Grand Moff Serious Man]

They gave me 6 months of free rent after moving back and after that I agreed to pay them something.

I don't resent it all, both of them work very demanding jobs so I'm glad to help out.

[playa manhattan]

When you were negotiating, I hope you reminded them to declare it on their income taxes.

[Grand Moff Serious Man]

My mom is all over that. But as much as she complains about taxes (and rightfully so, they rob her blind) I'm surprised she's still a Democrat. I guess it's mainly because she still hates Bush.

But on the other dad's a conservative, born-again Christian that I convinced to vote for Ron Paul in the 2012 primary. So at least that's something.

[playa manhattan]

Starting here, and going on and on and on:
http://reason.com/blog/2014/01.....nt_4277480

[Irish]

Didn't he basically argue that the 10% of black people who vote Republican are race traitors and dupes?

Yeah, I'm sure black people love being told that they're incapable of making their own decisions by a white person from Oklahoma.

[playa manhattan]

IDK, I'm too busy to bother reading his shit or arguing with him.

[Ken Shultz]

That's nothin'!

He still maintains that Rosa Parks didn't have the right to sit in the front of a public bus.

His take on Rosa Parks is indistinguishable from the Klan's.

[Irish]

Wait, what? When did he say that?

[Grand Moff Serious Man]

This is where Tony lost the Slate liberals: he essentially went down the path of saying your rights don't exist without government approval.

And thus if 50% + 1 of voters decided Tony was subhuman and could be enslaved, Tony would have to conclude that he no long has human rights.

I've yet to hear answer the obvious problem with his total rejection of the concept of natural rights.

[Ken Shultz]

Oh, I've been hitting him over the head for that for more than a year, and he still won't budge an inch. I'd have to dig up the original thread...

His basic take is that because our rights only come from the government, so they don't exist unless the government gives them to us.

So, becasue the government didn't Rosa Parks the right to sit in the front of a public bus at the time, she didn't have the right to sit in the front of a public bus.

It gets worse!

He went so far as to defend the idea that because the government of Germany didn't recognize the rights of Jews under the Third Reich, Jews didn't have a right to their own lives.

All of this in opposition to the idea that our rights might exist apart from government. I'm tellin' y'all. Tony is so unhinged, he can be made to say anything. This is how the Hitler Youth and the Cultural Revolution happen. He has no logic and no moral compass attached to his beliefs. And he's so convinced he's right, he'll argue the same position as Nazi war criminals and the Klan.

[DH]

I think the article you're talking about is A. Barton Hinkle's The Enduring Legacy of Martin Luther King's I have a dream speech. Aug 28 2013. Tony was really laying the shit on that day!

http://reason.com/archives/201.....have-a-dre

[Michael Ejercito]

Under Supreme Court precedent, she did not have that right.

[Grand Moff Serious Man]

Tony also comments on Slate and he made that exact same argument a while back ("You can't explain why blacks vote Democrat without showing your racism!") and was promptly destroyed by Slate's minority (ha) community of conservatives and libertarians.

None of the proggies were really interested in helping him. I think that's why he comes here, even on lefty blogs they find him tiresome.

[Episiarch]

He comes here because whoever operates the Tony sockpuppet has found that a lot of people here will argue with him and engage with him, over and over and over, even if he spouts the same shit and no matter how obviously a sockpuppet it is.

[playa manhattan]

The interns at OFA were overworked today.

[Francisco d Anconia]

Dear god!

[Irish]

Oh my God, Brian fucking wrecked Tony in that thread.

Tony: So you're saying the left actually talks about issues.

Brian: In the way that a creationist who hates gay marriage is talking about an issue.

[Irish]

Brian is a champ:

Tony: So 90% of blacks are delusional and voting against their own interests? Gee what could possibly explain that.

Brian: 84% of the world population has a religious faith.

You always make these appeals to populism. So, when are you going to give up on your irrational atheism and join the herd? Who are you to say that everyone's wrong, and they have to respect your atheist opinion?

Drop your stupid selfish atheism. You're not so smart that you're right while 84% of people are wrong. Pick a church, start going, start tithing, and quit being an immature whiner.

[Killaz]

That was beautiful. I basically avoid everything Tony says, but that was more than worth it to see him destroyed in a way I haven't already read a dozen times before. Thanks Brian, whomever you are.

[Corning]

Tony|1.30.14 @ 11:49AM|#

Reason censors the racists, I gather.

lulz

They did censor calling lawyers sheep fuckers.

Good times.

[Old Man With Candy]

They still do. That dropped my respect for them several notches.

[Invisible Finger]

I may have to change my handle.

[Ken Shultz]

Tony has no reasons for anything he says. Basic logical thinking is foreign to him.

He's a parrot. He's a roto-call. He's an echo. He's the voice of others. He doesn't understand what he says; he just says it.

I thought it was funny, yesterday, when Tony made this statement:

Tony|1.29.14 @ 11:28AM|#

The point of my being here will be revealed in time.

http://reason.com/blog/2014/01.....nt_4275049

As if all of his stupid trolling has some higher purpose that we're not ready to behold yet. But when he reveals his master plan? Oh we are gonna be so awed, so overwhelmed by the profound genius of it all, that we'll all come begging him--begging--for forgiveness!

How could we have doubted his superior intellect?

[playa manhattan]

There's definitely some mental illness in play here (if you believe in that sort of thing).

[Ken Shultz]

I think he's been severely indoctrinated by somebody.

His parents might be Rouchies or something--maybe he was born into it.

Everything about his screams cult victim.

There's the rationalizations that have no reasonable basis, and there's the supreme respect for authority. Like yesterday when he was saying that the Pentagon knows what's best--because they're in charge of the Pentagon.

I think he's just been conditioned. He's always surprised that we think we can think for ourselves. That just doesn't make sense to him.

[playa manhattan]

Are you by chance a regular at Grunions?

[Ken Shultz]

I know where that is.

[playa manhattan]

I'm going to ask Bob Beverly if you are a weirdo before I invite you to lunch. This could go either way.

[Sevo]

I'd sure like to know what sort of numbers these people represent. Looked like a degree of skepticism I really don't expect of the mainstream.

[Irish]

Wealthy white progs are unskeptical religious adherents. Most black Democrats I've met are not on that level.

I think black people vote Democrat because they really have been convinced by Democrats that anyone who votes Republican or libertarian is a racist, an Uncle Tom, or a race traitor. That's unfortunate, but I don't generally see the snarling insanity coming out of inner city black Democrats that I see from the supposedly 'educated' progs that suck the black off Hilary Clinton's boots.

I think black Democrats tend to be skeptical of government much more than people think.

[Dweebston]

they really have been convinced by Democrats that anyone who votes Republican or libertarian is a racist

See: Tony, not more than nine hours ago, insisting that the only reason one might oppose further immigration is cold-blooded race-hatred.

I don't agree with most arguments against immigration, but it's mendacity incarnate to suggest that opposition is rooted exclusively in racism and not (say) erroneous economic beliefs or legitimate concerns about welfarism and demographics.

I know, I know, the sun rose in the east, set in the west, Tony's a liberal shill.

[Killaz]

I really think the association began when blacks immigrated North and towards larger cities in the South. Before then, Democrats in urban America already had their machine in place dominating urban politics almost everywhere, but as the immigrants who formed the second generation machine core (the first were mostly Brahmin WASP), such as your namesake, began to move to the suburbs and diversify their own political focus, blacks took their place. The current arrangement only appears set in stone, but demographics is destiny, and the old power locus is rubbing everyone the wrong way who isn't a first order beneficiary of it.

[Cyto]

The Democrat Party and their allies in the NAACP and other organizations work very hard to keep racial animus alive. When election time comes around the volume of direct mail and phone calls is very impressive. My ex-wife attracted massive volumes of race-baiting mail every election season.

The stuff from the NAACP and Democrat party associated "minority" groups was "thinly veiled" racism in the way that David Duke and the National Association for the Advancement of White People was "thinly veiled" in their racism.

Since moving out of their target area east of Atlanta and becoming a non-minority household I've seen a 90% reduction in all political materials. If you are not in their target demographic it is hard to imagine just how persistent and voluminous their push to keep the monolith intact is.

[MJGreen]

I can't imagine it being easy for your average black American to have that much confidence in government. As with the Native Americans, it's never really been their friend.

[sarcasmic]

h/t BakedPenguin

I've always wondered if that moniker means 'stoned tuxedo' or 'roasted waterfowl'.

[BakedPenguin]

It can't be both? Hater.

[sarcasmic]

So you get your birds stoned before you roast them. I guess that's humane in an odd sort of way.

[Sevo]

BakedPenguin|1.30.14 @ 8:16PM|#
Nice find, BP. One Ataboy comin' up.

[Ken Shultz]

Stoned in Canada?

[SweatingGin]

Stoned nun?

[Dweebston]

Sister, your habit it showing.

[All-Seeing Monocle]

heh

[All-Seeing Monocle]

The guitar was annoying as shit, but otherwise that was pretty great stuff. I'm down for a cup of cocoa with all of them.

[playa manhattan]

Cocoa? RAAC....

[Suthenboy]

Yep, the music kinda pissed me off....

Who thinks every time blacks talk there are blues playing in the background? Jeebus.

Wasn't there a family guy episode where Peter had his own theme music?

[anon]

/roadhouse

[Irish]

This video shows why Republicans are fucking idiots at minority outreach and also shows a way libertarians can make inroads among groups that are not historically libertarian.

I live in Chicago and I've worked in poor black neighborhoods. Most of the people I meet there are not true believing progressives who are out of reach for either conservative or libertarian messages. What's happened is that they've largely bought into the Democratic Party's propaganda, and despite their distaste for a lot of Democrat positions they vote that way because it's almost thought that the only way a black person CAN vote is Democrat.

I think if you pointed out, and kept pointing out, that the people running inner city police forces, shutting down inner city businesses, and generally abusing inner city black people are all Democrats you could make legitimate inroads. The corrupt inner city alderman who force people to give them kick backs to open businesses? All Democrats. The police commissioners who run no knock raids? Appointed by Democrats and paid by Democrats. The party that has overseen the decay of the inner cities? The Democratic party.

Democrats take black people for granted. They're not even trying to guard the black vote based on the racist assumption that blacks are 'inherently' Democrats. There's no reason that can't be changed.

[Episiarch]

The problem with this suggestion is that there really isn't multi-party rule in many of these places. Everyone running is a Democrat, and even though there may be significant differences between Democrat candidates at times, it doesn't change the fact that they're still all Democrats.

And it doesn't really matter what party the politicians claim to be part of, because they're all just scumbag politicians who all do scumbag politician stuff anyway.

The only way for anyone to make inroads would be to put up genuinely less statist and corrupt candidates, but the very nature of the political environment of cities keeps such people out.

[Irish]

Why? What about cities makes it natural for only scumbags to run?

The problem is that scumbags are the people who most want power. That doesn't mean they have to be the only ones running.

[Episiarch]

Cities are dense. They have communities. They have tons of rules and zoning. Power-hungry politicians love these things because they give the politicians leverage. They give them the ability to grant favors or punish people. They form bases in communities where they are at least seen as the devil they know.

All this stuff works in favor of the glad-hander, the back-room-dealer, the rent-seeker. It completely works against the guy who says he's going to clean all that up, because all the powers that be and those who benefit from this system don't want it to go away, since it's where they get their power from.

You don't rise to heights in politics in places like Chicago or New York without being a vicious trench battler. Anyone else gives up right away, because the people who really want the power will do whatever it takes to get it.

[Raven Nation]

Even smaller cities seem to attract people who want power. Friends of mine live in a mountain state. In their region there's a wealthy tourist town and then their town about 20 miles away. She was telling me that the current mayor of her town failed to win office in the tourist town so moved to the smaller town and won office.

And, since in office she has been proposing a lot of things for the "average" people that either involve taxing property owners OR backing schemes to toss poor people out of rental properties so they can be "redeveloped."

[playa manhattan]

You seem to have gone to a lot of trouble to avoid naming these places....

[Raven Nation]

Yeah, deferring to my friends' desire for a low profile & her town is pretty small. But then, I doubt any of the political schmucks up there read here so, "tourist town" = Aspen.

[playa manhattan]

*taps nose*
And that must mean mountain state= Colorado!
I'm going to reward myself with a beer.

[Raven Nation]

Maybe this:

aspenbrewingcompany.com/

[Episiarch]

There are always people who want power. Some people are better at getting it than others, and many have family connections and other things that give them an advantage.

The ones who are good at it become powerful politicians. The ones who suck at it become DMV clerks or the dog catcher. Petty bureaucrats have been around forever.

[GILMORE]

or, 'what epi said'.

[Francisco d Anconia]

Simpler explanation.

If you get off on controlling people, you go where the people are. No one cares about implementing zoning regulations in the middle of nowhere Montana, because there is no one there to control and no power to be gained in doing so.

[GILMORE]

""Irish|1.30.14 @ 8:40PM|#

Why? What about cities makes it natural for only scumbags to run?

population & asset concentration, and lots of loose cash enables comparatively few organizations to control all municipal jobs, and creates relationships with moneyed interests (e.g. real estate developers) that enable vast quid-pro-quo that would otherwise be impossible in a more geographically dispersed and more fragmented district.

this is an interesting read:

http://www.theatlantic.com/pol.....ay/276503/

I knew 2 guys who went to work in manhattan for congresspeople. their job titles varied at times, but they were essentially 'fixers'. supporters would find their utility costs suddenly lower. Need an air-conditioner? There's a warehouse full of them in the Bronx. Brother out of work? call this number. legal problems? We know a guy. etc. etc.

I don't think it necessarily "has/had" to be Democrats... but that's the way it developed, and that's who's run most large American cities in the 20th century, and you're not going to get rid of them from the outside. too much money, too many people concerned. They're dug in deeper than the mafia. Hell, they ARE the mafia.

[Sevo]

Irish|1.30.14 @ 8:40PM|#
"Why? What about cities makes it natural for only scumbags to run?"

Under the development rules in SF, any development, commercial or residential, requires a 'remediation' (or several); a park, sculpture or perhaps a 'community hall', where 'community assistants' can help with 'community access'; the selection of the remediation falls largely on the locally-elected supervisor.
It will not come as a surprise that the 'assistants' commonly steer people to programs championed by that supervisor, nor that the 'assistants' are quite active during the campaign.
So, in short, unless you are a scumbag gaming the system, you have as great a chance of getting elected as the Bears do of winning the Super Bowl.

[MSimon]

you have as great a chance of getting elected as the Bears do of winning the Super Bowl.

It happened once. But the quarterback was not real good at taking orders from the coach.

[anon]

Why? What about cities makes it natural for only scumbags to run?

Cities are where collectivists gather in herd-like fashion. The most "honored" among them are often the worst people you'll find.

[Notorious G.K.C.]

Well, I've been reading a bit of Kevin Phillips, and from his history of *white* voting blocs it takes some major trauma - like Depression level or absolute in-your-face insanity like the sixties or seventies - to change your ancestral political allegiances. Otherwise you inherit your politics, and it can go back generations. you grumble about your local party like your crazy relative Ned, but they're both *family.* It takes something traumatic, something on the order of a blatant betrayal, to get turned against your family. And long-term corription and mediocrity don't seem to be dramatic or in-your'-face enough to qualify as betrayal.

[LarryA]

Frog. Boiling water.

[Michael Ejercito]

A comparison of the 1912 and 1920 elections illustrates that example vividly.

[Dweebston]

An Irishman in Chicago?

[kibby]

Al Capone dislikes this comment.

[Grand Moff Serious Man]

Irish's great-grandfather?

[Grand Moff Serious Man]

Possible 'Boardwalk Empire' spoiler, although not really if you know your history.

[kibby]

I can't believe anybody watching didn't know what was coming even if they aren't history buffs.

Any time Frankie Yale shows his smug face in Chicago, it's curtains for someone.

[Episiarch]

I thought this was his great-grandfather.

[Grand Moff Serious Man]

It's funny when otherwise revered historical figures like Thomas Nast show the casual racism common at the time.

But that's obviously Irish's great-great-grandfather. The one that came over here in his potato boat to take all the American jobs.

[Irish]

No. My great-great grandfather was too busy bathing in Protestant blood and shouting vague epithets at British sentrymen to take a boat any place.

[Episiarch]

Don't be silly, the Irish don't work. Bunch of welfare queens!

[Grand Moff Serious Man]

No, you're thinking of the Scots. They've fallen considerably since Mel Gibson gave them their freedom.

[Episiarch]

Yes, they have.

[Heroic Mulatto]

I don't know why Nast is revered at all. He was a political cartoonist. The ur-political cartoonist. Every shitty political cartoon is his fault.

We should dig up his corpse and gibbet the remains.

[Grand Moff Serious Man]

Because he used the power of the media to attack Boss Tweed and the Tammany Machine. It's not his fault we've gone from him to images of a weeping Statute of Liberty and Lincoln and MLK fist-bumping in heaven after Obama was elected.

Racism aside, he also turned against the Republicans in the 1880s to support classical liberal Grover Cleveland.

[kibby]

Stopppp, Dean is my favorite ever!

[Grand Moff Serious Man]

I absolutely loved his accent, so very Midwestern and Chicago-y.

[kibby]

Arron rocked that role so hard. The accents on that show are impeccable as a rule. Like holy crap, Anatole Yusef, are you kidding me? Stephen Graham, too.

[Thane ? the booty]

Next you're going to tell me there are Poles in the Windy City!

[Ted S.]

Who is Wanda Skutnik?

[Thane ? the booty]

Huh?

[Ted S.]

It's a reference to the movie Call Northside 777, which is largely set among the Polish community of Chicago.

[SIV]

The Man With the Golden Arm is set there too.

[GILMORE]

I think the most encouraging line is when the guy, while talking about how bad things are in Chicago, points out, "...and there's no republicans, no tea party around here... this is the most democratic city [on earth]..."

but gay tony is going to tell us that they all still *love* their liberal patrons. Thinking so makes him feel good.

[Irish]

The other guy I liked was the one who said "He just placed blame, on corporations, on rich people...this isn't about blame. It's everybody's fault. It's not 1% or 99%."

[GILMORE]

The thing overall that was the most impressive was an apparently shared belief that *business investment creates jobs*, and not feelgood Federal 'soak the rich' programs.

now if only you could get recent college grads to understand this...

[All-Seeing Monocle]

Concur.

[Ed]

The video's a reverse nut punch. Wish I had come up with that before posting

[Episiarch]

This probably makes sense, because first of all, "soak the rich" programs generally don't end up as much money making it down to the people on the street who might like the idea (so much is diverted to cronies and bureaucrat salaries and waste). Secondly, the hatred of the rich that we see trumpeted day in and day out is mostly coming from upper middle class college graduates engaging in class warfare with the poor merely pawns in their eternal struggle of the upper middle class versus the upper class.

[Bill Dalasio]

As much as you like to trash me, that was VERY well said, Epsiarch.

[Episiarch]

Hey, when did I trash you, Bill? Maybe I was drunk. Or stoned.

[Bill Dalasio]

There've been a few threads. But, to be fair, I may well have deserved it. I really can be an asshole at times.

[Ted S.]

Aren't we always drunk and stoned here?

[Wasteland Wanderer]

Aren't we always drunk and stoned here?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xECUrlnXCqk

[Irish]

Secondly, the hatred of the rich that we see trumpeted day in and day out is mostly coming from upper middle class college graduates engaging in class warfare

I actually think most of the class warfare rhetoric is coming from people who were raised middle class but destroyed their future due to poor work ethic, gross stupidity, and the decision to go $75,000 in debt for a useless degree.

That's where an awful lot of the Gawker people are coming from. They were raised middle class, were promised they'd be richer than their parents, and then fucked up by going into journalism despite being terrible at the job.

As a result of the decision to go into journalism despite being functionally illiterate, a lot of the Gawker writers are now miserable and angry that they didn't become upper class as was their birthright. That's the only way to explain a moron like Adam Weinstein.

[Episiarch]

There is unquestionably a deep strain of envy among those who are most prone to devolve into class warfare. While I think you're on to something with the fact that some of them made some dumbass life choices, I have also seen a lot of people who come from families where everyone hates the rich and the kids learn it from the cradle. Often times these families aren't poor, but aren't as wealthy as some in their area, but it becomes a family habit to be super envious and hateful of people who have more than you.

It's kind of like a religion, and parents raise their kids in it. Some escape, but many fall right into it.

[playa manhattan]

I have a few of those in my neighborhood. Mostly prop 13 holdouts. They start bitching about all of the "new money" moving in, and then I point out that I pay 10x the property taxes that they do...

[Episiarch]

Dude, you should appeal your property taxes. The prop 13 cap causes the assessor's office to ream recent home buyers in order to "make up" for the capped prop 13 properties. However, since they tend to over-ream, you would probably be able to find at least a few comps (comparable properties) within the sale window that are assessed well under yours, and present them as evidence that you are overassessed. Even a partial reduction can save you a ton of money.

[playa manhattan]

I did. The appeal is what got me to 10x. I added on a new room in 2010 for the new baby, and I got absolutely fucked for it.

[Episiarch]

Ah, I see. I still suggest appealing again. You could also get a tax attorney or real estate agent who does appeals and see if they are more successful than you have been (they usually only charge if they win and then only a portion of the first year's savings). I've also seen assessors almost randomly approve some appeals and not others, and you could get lucky.

[playa manhattan]

The shitty house across the street from me just went for $1.2 million. An absolute shithole with a 1980's kitchen. I have zero chance of success...

[Episiarch]

Whoops, yeah, shit like that is not going to be a good comp. And I just checked the Los Angeles County assessor's web site and they charge for property searches. Oops. Yeah, you're kind of fucked.

[playa manhattan]

One of the many reasons I have been going to Utah, Texas, and Florida to look at real estate.

Just the cost of doing business here....

[Michael Ejercito]

Good point.

who again gives money to spro athletes and movie stars?

[GILMORE]

Oh, lord, what I would pay to have Ezra Klein, Sadbeard, Marcotte, and... I don't know...Valarie Jarrett? sit in a room with these people and try and defend the current administration as "something new and different and better" as opposed to, "more of the same with a suntan"

[All-Seeing Monocle]

You mean explain how they just don't understand that everything would be perfect if not for the republican resistance?

Still, I'd pay 2 bucks to see it.

[Francisco d Anconia]

I often wonder how long it would take to hit rock bottom if the opposition just gave into the progs. Let em have their way and let it all go to shit. Who would they blame?

[Irish]

Kulaks and wreckers. It took 70 years of poverty and deprivation for the Soviet Union to wind down, and I'm not willing to give the progs a 70 year ascendancy.

[playa manhattan]

I have too many guns to find out.

[All-Seeing Monocle]

I assume The Rich and Corporations for starters. I shudder to think at how far down we'd have to go before it was impossible to blame either of those.

[GILMORE]

"I often wonder how long it would take FOR GERMANY TO LOSE THE WAR if the opposition just LET HITLER LIVE. Let HITLER have HIS way and let it all go to shit.""

And that's the story of World War II, kids!

[Francisco d Anconia]

Not implying we should do so. Just wondering if they would finally admit the failure of statism, or if they would continue to delude themselves?

To rephrase the question, what will it take for them to admit their way leads to destitution and anguish?

[Ted S.]

It doesn't lead to destitution and anguish for them.

[amelia]

I think they would continue to delude themselves. They'd explain it all away as the outcome of the environmental rapaciousness of our species. They'd start demanding zero population growth policies and laws mandating that you live within a 30 mile radius of your job. Shit like that.

[LarryA]

See North Korea.

[Boisfeuras]

To rephrase the question, what will it take for them to admit their way leads to destitution and anguish?

They already have about 225 years worth of historical examples of their ideology taken to its logical conclusion at the cost of unimaginable human suffering and destruction. So I am guessing they are well beyond logical dissuasion until they become the ones who feel the destitution and anguish themselves.

[Francisco d Anconia]

That's the point. Will they even come to terms with it when THEY are destitute and anguishing. Will that be enough to change them? Or would they rather die (perhaps literally) than admit their philosophy is evil?

I'm really not sure.

[Boisfeuras]

Once the nomenklatura has a grip on the levers of power, the opinions of the useful idiots are really irrelevant. But I'm sure some of the more reflective ones would come to grips with reality, like the many former communists turned anti-communist like Sidney Hook, Max Eastman, or Arthur Koestler. Others would be like the hapless schmucks sitting in the gulag whining "If only Stalin knew!"

[Suthenboy]

FDA ; see Venezuela.

[Grand Moff Serious Man]

Toss Joan Walsh into the mix. Is there anything more ridiculous than a lily-white lady from Long Island who lives in an affluent San Francisco community becoming such an arbiter for progressives on what is racist?

[Bill Dalasio]

Doesn't matter how much you paid. They wouldn't do it. When's the last time you think one of those assholes talked to anyone with calloused hands other than to bitch at them about how they were treating their luggage? I'll be honest, I don't presume to speak for the poor. I work in finance and live on the Upper East Side. But, I grew up working class and I was brought up to recognize that I'm lucky and have a valuable skill, rather than think I'm oh-so-enlightened that these guys are just extensions of my supremacy.

[Michael Ejercito]

Amanda Marcotte can not defend herself from a wet paper bag.

[Lady Bertrum]

I hope blacks in Chicago are eyeing Detroit and realizing the same old, same old is going nowhere. There is no future in bankruptcy and default. Chicago is a few paces behind Detroit, but not far.

We have failed urban areas in Jersey - Trenton and Camden - complete wastelands of hopeless failure.

[Grand Moff Serious Man]

I'm less sure about Chicago, but cities like New York pretty much can't fail like Detroit no matter how retarded the progressives who run it are.

At worst they'll make crime and urban blight in the already worse off areas worse and piss off a lot of the business owners.

But too much capital is invested there in banks and the stock market for the gravy train to completely derail.

[Lady Bertrum]

New York isn't really progressive. It's more like gentry class rich people and their adorable serfs.

[Episiarch]

People often don't understand the makeup of the population of NYC. There are lifelong residents, and there are a lot of families out in the boroughs, but there is a large population of moderately young people with jobs who just want to make some money and live in the big city for a while. Like so many people, they may make noise about politics and the like, but they're so fucking far removed from the actual politics of the city they might as well be on Mars. The 26-year-old trader working on the exchange floor and renting an apartment in Chelsea is not going to have the tiniest view or vision into the politics going on around him. Only if he were to actually try and start a business, or buy some property, or in some way actually fall afoul of the politics will he see this.

This is why I've said it was actually kind of pleasant and easy to live in NYC, because if you're off the political radar, you can ignore all that shit for the most part. And many people do.

[Heroic Mulatto]

This is why I've said it was actually kind of pleasant and easy to live in NYC

Unpossible! Kendall told me, based on his vast experience of the subject, that NYC was akin to a post-apocalyptic wasteland where children huddle in fear while hiding from the roving cannibal rape gangs, and the living envy the dead.

[Thane ? the booty]

Whose Kendall? The E! Network Gypsy-spawn?

[Thane ? the booty]

"who's"

[Heroic Mulatto]

I refer to our dear fellow comment-board regular Ken Shultz.

[Episiarch]

Fry: So you're saying these aren't the decaying ruins of New York in the year 4000?

Professor Hubert Farnsworth: You wish. You're in Los Angeles.

Fry: But there was this gang of ten-year-olds with guns.

Leela: Exactly. You're in L.A.

Fry: But everyone is driving around in cars shooting at each other.

Bender: That's L.A. for you.

Fry: But the air is green and there's no sign of civilization whatsoever.

Bender: He just won't stop with the social commentary.

Fry: And the people are all phonies. No one reads. Everything has cilantro on it...

[Ted S.]

They also have the rest of the state to leech off of. They're terrible neighbors.

I live not far from the Ashokan Reservoir, and NYC has been terrible about dumping water into the Esopus downstream from the reservoir.

[All-Seeing Monocle]

I dunno. In Detroit you've been able to *see* it happening in the form of people and business fleeing the city for decades. Now, you might not be able to put two and two together and figure out WHY that is (even if you're an NYT columnist), but you could at least see a very concrete sign that something BAD was happening.

Are they seeing that in Chicago? Wikipedia census figures say Chicago lost 10% of it's population in the last 30 year. Detroit lost *50%*.

[Lady Bertrum]

I'm thinking about unfunded liabilities in the form of public pensions. I think (not positive) Chicago's bonds were downgraded raising borrowing costs. When a huge part of your budget is going toward debt service and unions won't negotiate (see teachers' strike) the death spiral is only a recession away.

[All-Seeing Monocle]

Agree on the trajectory, but I'm not sure that stories about unfunded pension liabilities are enough to make the guy on the street say "hold up, that's not going to work, better start doing something dramatic".

I could be wrong, I just wonder whether the average Chicagoan is seeing enough to believe that yes, this is going to happen to you too.

I certainly don't see any signs of Chicago union employees getting the hint that it is, in fact, possible to kill the golden goose. Hell, I'm not sure even the Detroit union employees have figured it out yet.

[LarryA]

I'm not sure even the Detroit union employees have figured it out yet.

Some of them have, but they aren't there any more.

[Invisible Finger]

I dated a Chicago union employee for a while and she certainly saw it. But she already knew she sold her soul to the devil and was essentially just praying that she could reach the age where she was 100% vested and then skip town. She knew she could make more in the private sector, but those public pension promises are like heroin.

I told her her taking a smaller loss now was better than taking a giant loss later. (Then I realized I had to make the same decision with her.)

[Anonymous Coward]

Barack Obama: Raised by white people. Educated by white people. Funded by white people. Elected by white people.

But he's supposed to do good for black people because looks like them?

To quote the great lyricist, Nas, "Ne-gro please."

[Raven Nation]

Didn't Sharpton bitch about that in '08? Something about Obama not having the right (i.e. Civil Rights' Movement) legacy.

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes. And then like any other whore, they paid him to leave.

[Ken Shultz]

"But he's supposed to do good for black people because looks like them?"

I'm not sure that black people almost uniformly support Obama as much as they almost uniformly oppose the Republicans.

The only nationally known Republican I've seen make an effort to connect with black voters was Rand Paul, when he went to Howard.

The idea of a unified minority voter base is probably a figment of white liberal imagination that gets projected out into the world through white liberal journalists.

My experience, however limited, is that blacks and Latinos are probably less supportive of gay rights than your average white American. I still don't think that white liberals in CA have come to terms with the fact that Proposition 8 was passed with black and Latino votes--so they blame it on Mormon money.

Also, I was livin' in the 'hood during the Rodney King riots, and the idea that Asians and blacks see eye to eye on any given issue just because they're both minorities is...something only a white liberal who's never been anywhere near South Central or Koreatown could think.

I'm not convinced that Latinos feel especially guilty about slavery or Jim Crow either.

I see white liberals dumping all these different groups: blacks, Asians, LGBT, Latinos, et. al. into the same bin and imagine they all think the same things, that seems pretty racist to me.

[Julia.]

The only nationally known Republican I've seen make an effort to connect with black voters was Rand Paul, when he went to Howard.

We all know how successful he was.

Also, I was livin' in the 'hood during the Rodney King riots, and the idea that Asians and blacks see eye to eye on any given issue just because they're both minorities is...something only a white liberal who's never been anywhere near South Central or Koreatown could think.

Koreans used to vote for the Republicans around that time, but they have largely moved into more affluent neighborhoods, and with that they have adopted the liberal attitudes of their SWPL and Jewish neighbors.

I'm not convinced that Latinos feel especially guilty about slavery or Jim Crow either.

They aren't supposed to. They are supposed to be mad at Whitey.

I see white liberals dumping all these different groups: blacks, Asians, LGBT, Latinos, et. al. into the same bin and imagine they all think the same things, that seems pretty racist to me.

Calling them "racist" for thinking that is unjustified. Not that they aren't racist or anything. But all those groups have in common sense of outsider status in America. And it is important to note that none of those groups are the people who organize and lead the liberal political machine. That distinction belongs to the Stuff White People Like and the Jews.

[Ken Shultz]

This post is so full of garbage, it's hard to know where to start.

So, I won't bother.

[Jordan]

These people are clearly suffering from false consciousness. Shriek told us this morning that everyone who has a pulse and wants a job already has one.

[RishJoMo]

That dude seems to know which way is up.

http://www.AnonStuffz.tk

[Irish]

WOW! Pittsburgh news affiliate drops in on a small business and video tapes a live reaction of their employees to the announcement of how Obamacare will impact their insurance.

They did not take it well.

[All-Seeing Monocle]

Wow. I did NOT realize that Pittsburgh was such a Tea Party stronghold.

[Ted S.]

The yinzers are bitter clingers. (Well, they're not that far from the bitter cling portion of the country.)

[Heroic Mulatto]

Wasn't the O (The Story of) in PA when he made that comment?

[Raven Nation]

He was actually at a fundraiser in SF, but specifically mentioned PA:

"You go into these small towns in Pennsylvania and, like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing's replaced them. And they fell through the Clinton administration, and the Bush administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are gonna regenerate and they have not.

And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy toward people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."

[Raven Nation]

And I forgot how much the left was sucking up to O even then. Here's the HuffPo column that broke the news:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/.....96188.html

[Heroic Mulatto]

Ah, I see. That's why my Lockean brain-association hobby-horse thingy flashed "PA" in my mind.

[Corning]

they fell through the Clinton administration

HA!

I am thinking Barry will not be too helpful in 2016 for Hilary...

And Hilary will not be very kind to O's legacy during her campaign.

[Francisco d Anconia]

Wonder how they vote?

[All-Seeing Monocle]

Before, or now?

You could actually see them turning racist as they read their new policies.

[Francisco d Anconia]

If they voted for this buffoon they are deserving of all that comes to them. Foreseeable consequences are foreseeable.

If they didn't, I sympathise.

[PapayaSF]

This can't be true. The prog line is that all Obamacare horror stories are fakes.

[Heroic Mulatto]

The Puppy Channel was a short-lived American cable television channel whose programming consisted entirely of video footage of puppies.

41% of people in focus group surveys said they would prefer watching the channel to CNBC and 37% preferred it to TBS.

[Raven Nation]

BTW: +1 on the Commonwealth Men reference on the UKIP thread.

[Heroic Mulatto]

Thanks. Now, for an excuse to drink...

You'd think a website called Reason that was affiliated with a foundation called Cato, which took its name from a series of pamphlets that...

[Raven Nation]

My excuse to drink is that there is alcohol in my apartment.

On the flip side of this, it's how I explain Australian history to my students.

"Professor, did Australia ever have a revolution?"

"No. Why would we? We never ran out of beer."

[Archduke von Pantsfan]

Beards are racist

[Episiarch]

Well, Canadian ones certainly are.

[Sevo]

OT, but worth it.
Do you work for a living? Well, you're in an occupation with a lot of fatties, according to the CDC:
"Jobs with the most obese workers"
http://www.sfgate.com/jobs/sli.....-78617.php

[Archduke von Pantsfan]

Health Professionals.
lol

[PapayaSF]

I think fat nurses account for that. There are lots and lots of them.

[anon]

So wait, they basically just listed as many "professions" as they could think of and declared ~20% of all of them "obese?"

Fucking hell, moar effort plz.

[Sevo]

Pretty sure if you include the qualifiers ('and associated occupations'), they've covered them ALL.
Work for a living? You work with FATTIES!

[Corning]

Cleaners and janitors are over 20% obese.

I must be cleaning my house wrong cuz i can't clean my house without working up a sweat.

[Sidd Finch]

So I'm reading this Wonkblog interview with economic historian Gregory Clark about his upcoming book and I get to this:

The conventional estimates of status correlation across generations are 0.2-0.6 [so your parentage explains 4-36 percent of your social status, income, etc. -- Dylan].

and I'm thinking, "This is the first time I've seen one of these Juicebox 'wonk' assholes show they've completed a solid couple years of higher education."

The second comment:

sh5105
1/29/2014 11:13 AM CST
You confuse correlation and R-squared. Correlation of 0.2 - 0.6 implies that anywhere from 4% to 36% of your income/social status are explained by surname. Not 20-60% as you claim.

Of course the post wasn't formally updated.

[Heroic Mulatto]

The surname data suggests that you will not be able to do much to increase social mobility through social policies of any type.

Something the Coleman Reports (I and II) found back in the 60s. The Coleman Reports were commissioned by the Johnson administration to support Johnson's War on Poverty polices. When the Coleman Reports showed that, when it came to education, Johnson's polices weren't going to do shit, LBJ used the full power of his office to attempt to ruin Coleman and destroy his career.

I should mention that in 1981, Coleman III came out, which was the academic version of Coleman getting revenge by pissing on LBJ's grave.

[Notorious G.K.C.]

Coleman III, The Revenge?

[Sidd Finch]

and the ASA

[Heroic Mulatto]

I seem to remember that in '81 he received a standing ovation at the ASA conference, basically a "we fucked up your life, sorry 'bout that" applause. But I may be confusing that with another incident. Too lazy to look it up right now.

[Suthenboy]

"If this is what you call helping, please stop."

I laughed

[Suthenboy]

"If this is what you call helping, please stop."

I laughed

[Sevo]

Me too! Me too!

[Julia.]

Chicago Residents, Activists Slam President Obama's State of the Union, Suggest He Resign, Stop Blaming Corporations

This is a title you would have seen on the Onion back when it was actually funny. What do you call the Black man at a conservative conference? The keynote speaker? Haha funny. We've heard it all before, along with "MLK was a Republican" and "party of the klan." A better view:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jx8hS8AM1ro

[Irish]

American...is that you?

You always post videos of this creepy weirdo as if he's supposed to impress us. I'm just confused as to why you chose a woman's name this time.

[Heroic Mulatto]

God, that man's voice is obnoxious! Ive heard eunuchs with deeper and more sonorous voices.

[Sevo]

Hey, Julia! Stuff it up your ass!

[Grand Moff Serious Man]

Chief Lizzie Faux-hawk of Massachusetts tribe blames Republicans for increasing income inequality under Obama, vows to take many corporate scalps.

[Sevo]

Yeah, we got a Poli-Sci writer who now writes "analysis" for the Chron, since they fired the other writers.
He says CA is, uh, well, the rich should be blamed:
"Tom Perkins' trickle-down defense of the 1% has huge flaws"
Nothing to do with CA gov't regs! No! Not at ALL!
http://www.sfgate.com/politics.....186878.php

[Grand Moff Serious Man]

Senate Judiciary Committee approves truly bipartisan legislation to overhaul mandatory minimums, HuffPo 'community pundit' sets sights on new dragon for government to slay:

The so-called War onDrugs has been over for years. Just ask the folks who ran it.*

The real danger is prescription meds. More people die in America every year from prescription drug abuse than die from heroin and cocaine combined. That stunning finding comes in a new report Tuesday from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

The CDC found a fourfold increase in deaths from prescription narcotics over the past decade. Not surprisingly, it coincides with a fourfold increase in the number of prescriptions written for the powerful painkillers.

In 2008, the most recent year for which there are statistics, there were 20,044 overdose deaths from prescription drugs. Of those, 14,800 were from narcotic painkillers.

Your body, your choice unless Top Men decide they know what's best for you.

Follow up from another HuffPo lib:

The people who make money off prescription drugs are doctors and the pharmaceutical companies, which is why nothing has been done about that. The profits go to wealthy interests, so their outrage about the dangers of drugs evaporates when the money goes into their, and their constituents', pockets.

There will always be a War on Something.

[Sevo]

"The profits go to wealthy interests, so their outrage about the dangers of drugs evaporates when the money goes into their, and their constituents', pockets."

So the writer has been hanging out in Hopland, CA?

[LarryA]

The fact that many people desperatly need "narcotic painkillers" is irrelevant to the necessity to restrict their availability.

[Ted S.]

Of those, 14,800 were from narcotic painkillers.

How many of them were actually acetominophen poisoning?

[Archduke von Pantsfan]

Do the Fat Dog.

[Archduke von Pantsfan]

At least Justified used real Canadians to play the Canadians.

[Corning]

They even look like Canadians!!

[Notorious G.K.C.]

I wish I'd had access to Thug Notes in school, I would never have had to read any Great Literature, just watch a helpful summary.

http://www.thug-notes.com

[Notorious G.K.C.]

Wow, that couldn't have looked more spammy if it had the Armour logo on it. But I'm just trying to spread culture.

[Heroic Mulatto]

Faust

[Archduke von Pantsfan]

The normal things famous people can't do

[Grand Moff Serious Man]

Burrell claimed Charles would not even squeeze toothpaste onto his own toothbrush. There was someone to pick up his clothes for him, Burrell wrote, and an unlucky servant even had to hold a specimen bottle while the Prince produced a urine sample.

The King shits and the Hand wipes.

[Wasteland Wanderer]

I'd say that the toothpaste thing may be more due to him being a Brit than being a prince...

[Paul.]

Pump gas?

[Sevo]

Naah. Compression's too high; I have to use Av gas.

[Paul.]

I was a bit surprised on the Obama segment. I was thinking it was going to be "check his account balance", "understand the terms of a simple loan" or something like that.

[Paul.]

So, black folks have figured out that white folks voted for Obama because he was a 'safe' black man.

[MasterDarque]

Ask the police no such thing as a safe nigga

[Paul.]

Man, I LIKE the dude in the Argyle sweater and tie.

[american socialist]

Yes, right, a video with some black people spouting Republican talking points from a source related to The Tea Party. Why do conservatives get all uppity whenever a black person doesn't like Obama. There's lots of Black people that don't like Obama... Yes, and so what?

I've been to lots of rallies with anti-eviction activists. I've stopped going. There's a mix of self-righteousness and crazy that I find un appealing. Youtube JR Fleming and see if this is the type of person you want to make common cause with. Personally I couldn't get through 30 seconds of it.

[Paul.]

Personally I couldn't get through 30 seconds of it.

Most modern socialists aren't comfortable rubbing elbows with the working class. We understand.

[Boisfeuras]

Socialism has never been a working class movement.

[Wasteland Wanderer]

National socialists aren't particularly fond of people that have darker complexions, either.

[DH]

"There's lots of Black people that don't like Obama..."

Ha ha ha ha. You're funny.

[RishJoMo]

lol, even the black folk dont like Obama anymore.

http://www.AnonStuffz.tk

[AlmightyJB]

This is the opposite of a Friday nut punch. Thank You. I think I'll stop while I'm ahead.