Former Reason editor Virginia Postrel writes up Murray's latest in her Bloomberg column. Anything she writes is worth a read, especially when it relates to how elites interface with the hoi polloi. At the heart of Murray's take is the belief that America's "new upper class" is pulling away from the rest of the culture (a theme that pervades The Bell Curve as well). Postrel argues that the notion that elites are somehow more alienated from the masses than they used to be is wrong.
Snippets:
"Instead of feeling sorry for the exceptionally able student who has no one to talk to," Murray writes, "we need to worry about what happens when exceptionally able students hang out only with one another."
As someone known for writing defenses of chain stores and explaining Plano, Texas, to puzzled pundits, I agree that way too many smart people, particularly on the coasts, are quick to condemn middle-American culture without understanding why people value one or another aspect of it. But they were even worse in 1963.
That's the second problem with Murray's fable: The cultural consensus was not just an illusion. It was an unhealthy one. Instead of promoting understanding, it fed contempt.
One piece of evidence is right on page 2 of the book: "The Beverly Hillbillies," the highest-rated TV show the week Kennedy was killed. As Murray points out, nearly a third of American households watched it on CBS every week -- astounding numbers by today's standards. "The Beverly Hillbillies" was not just popular. It was, by most measures, the biggest hit in sitcom history. By its fourth week on the air, it had knocked Lucille Ball out of her top spot, and it only fell from the top 10 in its ninth and final season. It even saved "The Dick Van Dyke Show," a flop in its original slot, by providing a big lead-in audience in an era when it was hard to change the channel. In a true consensus culture, everyone would have loved it….
With five decades' distance it's clear that books as seemingly different as "The Organization Man," "The Lonely Crowd," "The Feminine Mystique" and "Atlas Shrugged" were really all about the same thing: the alienation and discomfort of gifted, independent-minded individuals in a society in which the "normal" ruled. The "cognitive elite" felt left out of or oppressed by the country's culture and, as a result, scorned it.
Now these people have one another. "People like to be around other people who understand them and to whom they can talk," Murray writes. "Cognitive segregation was bound to start developing as soon as unusually smart people began to have the opportunity to hang out with other unusually smart people." If you care about happiness, that seems like a good thing.
Interestingly, when smart people feel less alienated, they seem to buy different sorts of books. Instead of condemning American society for not honoring the author's personality or tastes, the new bestsellers explore the mysteries of human behavior. Think of Malcolm Gladwell's various books or Daniel Kahneman's "Thinking, Fast and Slow." Perhaps once you accept that people really are different -- that nobody's normal and, at least when it comes to food or entertainment or vacations, there's no one best way to live -- you can, paradoxically enough, start to think about the commonalities known as human nature.
The title of Postrel's piece comes from a quiz that Murray includes in the book (take it here). The goal of the quiz is to ascertain just how thick your "bubble" is - how hived off from mass culture you are. It's worth taking, especially if you fancy yourself either close to the masses or oh-so-alienated from them.
As something of a public service, I include below a full episode of The Beverly Hillbillies. It's the one where Granny mistakes an escaped kangaroo for a giant-sized jackrabbit. I read somewhere that when it aired, it became the highest-rated episode of TV (discounting specials, finales, etc) for many years. Certainly it showcases that The Beverly Hillbillies was a pretty smart and funny show, Newton Minow be damned.
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Charles Murray claims to be a libertarian and spends half of his book bashing social liberalism and deprecating any lifestyle that isn't out of Leave it to Beaver.
While I can't stand fuckers who think we can legislate every morsel of morality (listen up, Team Blue, as well), bashing social liberalism is shitloads of fun.
This study intdicates that only the deep south has a majority of respondents that buy non-scientific creation. While I find it very distressing that these numbers are a high as they are, they really don't support your narrative.
In any case, you pretty made yourself the posterboy for what this article is about... good job.
Libertarians can bash any social philosophy they want, you know, without giving up social cred, as long as they tow the lion on no state involvement in the war of all social philosophies against all.
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"where Granny mistakes an escaped kangaroo for a giant-sized jackrabbit..."
Uh, no, its where elitists and the ignorant (but I repeat myself) mistake giant jack rabbits for a mythological critter called a "kangaroo."
Next thing you'll be saying is a "platypus" is some kind of odd critter found in Australia instead of the all you can eat special at the "Garden of Oriental Delights"
32, proudly first generation upper middle class. My kids are going to be insufferable. They'll have the good sense to avoid shitty beer at least, but they're gonna be pussies.
I also got a 32, but "uppder middle class" I'm not. I grew up in a rural Nevada, and am currently living on a farm in Oregon. I'm not exactly living in a bubble...
I think the test is flawed in that it identifies a very narrow range of interests and activities that the lower classes might participate in and then says that if you don't also have that narrow range of interests, your living in a bubble. I mean, how the fuck does preferring football and rally racing over basketball and NASCAR make you more upper class? And in some of the questions (such as the one about eating at certain restaurants), being extremely rural will lose you even more points.
It was hard to apply some questions - for example, I have few close friends, period, but I have had frequent conversations with the not-so-brilliant. Also, all those chain restaurants I tend to avoid because they're too high class and expensive. For the television season in question, I was in Antarctica where television reception was not so good.
Depending on whether I go with the text as written or with the spirit of the thing, my score ranges from 46 to 66.
Perhaps more notable is the fact that I am fully aware of how much I don't understand ordinary Americans. At best, I partially understand the skilled middle class. Likewise, I have enough understanding of rural issues to know that city folks have no idea about rural issues, without having an awful lot of knowledge on many aspects of normative rural living myself. In this sense, Murray is absolutely right: the people running the U.S. today have no conception of what life is like for the people they supposedly represent, and that can lead to some huge mistakes. It's a good thing that educated people can congregate with other educated people, but too much of that leads to a significant disconnect between classes. I should also note that most of the "dumb" people are a lot smarter than they are given credit for. There's a lot they don't know, but there's also a lot they do know, that the "smart" people are clueless about.
I'd argue, however, that the test does not weigh work and military experience heavily enough. If one has done physically exhausting work for months or years, one has experienced life outside of the elite bubble. Ditto the military.
Watching Oprah, American Idol, or Iron Man II after dining at Outback Steakhouse doesn't come close.
66. A ?rst- generation middle-class person with working-class parents and average television and moviegoing habits. Range: 42?100. Typical: 66
Not too far off. My parents fought their way up into the middle class with the G.I. Bill and serious guts. I'm more the guy who had a tornado take down 13 big trees 5 months after I bought my first house and said, "It's just work." I bought a 14" chainsaw and had fuel for the wood stove for years.
And I only just eeked into some of them. But then I just missed a few others, so maybe that evens out.
Can I have some points for being sad that I don't have a pickup and haven't been fishing lately? On the other hand I make no excuses for the beer thing. I don't have much beer money and I will spend it on beer that I like.
There is too much emphasis placed on what these sapsuckers call the cognitive elite. A New Yorker reader is just a New Yorker reader, not harming anything outside of his domain. When doing political analysis, as opposed to sociological, you need to concentrate on classes of the polis who have the ability and the motive to use coercive force. Hence, the managerial elite and its motivations is more typically the proper subject of libertarian investigation. Anti-libertarian statist are vehemently opposed to that investigation as well. You can talk about fonts and Beverly Hillbillies all day long and they wont care, but if you ask who is pulling Obama's strings they will go into a knee jerk rage and claim conspiracy theories -- que shrike.
Moreover, the cognitive elite status that is granted to them is often times not based on solid metrics of intelligence (symbolic logic, spatial reasoning, etc) but rather on mundane knowledge, the kind of thing even a monkey can master and regurgitate.
"You can talk about fonts and Beverly Hillbillies all day long and they wont care, but if you ask who is pulling Obama's strings they will go into a knee jerk rage and claim conspiracy theories -- que shrike."
I LOVE being told by some young lumberjack looking hipster that I should stop getting my new from Alex Jones
I also got a 45, which oversells my folksiness. I'm an immigrant that spent the vast majority of my life in coastal enclaves and went to elite universities.
There's a major regional and cultural bias built in. Why NASCAR* and not college or pro football (the true "universal American sport")? Why does the guy from Brooklyn get credit for living in a small town when it's in on an Army base instead of a college campus? You're just as likely to interact (or not) with locals in both situations.
* The highest rated NASCAR races still trail the highest rated NBA, NFL, MLB and college revenue sports in ratings
Fun Fact: The NASCAR Hall of Fame complex includes an office building which houses a company devoted to fashion (high heels, in fact). Talk about a culture clash!
From the Postril article on Plano "She contrasts Plano with Fresno, California, where she spent most of her childhood. In California, her friends would say, "You go to church? That's something my grandmother does."
Hey!!!!, we go Satan church in Fresno, where we put puppies and kittens in blenders and sacrifice virgin heterosexuals - and finding a virgin at the Costco in CA for a reasonalbe price is IMPOSSIBLE - if your from Fresno, your super cool, super secular, and AVANT Guarde.....
OK 🙁 EVEN people in Plano are cooler than people in Fresno
In Fresno, we aspire to 1/10 the number of teeth the rednecks had in Deliverance.
Of course, nobody in Fresno understood why "oink" sex was protrayed as if it were a bad thing...
Ditto. I scored a 32 with most of my points not coming from lower middle class upbringing but the fact that I hung out with the stupid crowd and got high throughout my youth. Questions 5-9 accounted for 20 of my points. 8 is a bit of a skewer though. As a libertarian, I naturally disagree with everyone.
The leading qualifying beers are Budweiser, Coors, Miller, orBusch, light or regular. The disdain of the new upper class for domestic mass-market beer is nearly as intense as its disdain forpeople who smoke cigarettes
Shiner is a hybrid I'd think. It's really not that far off from Bud with brown color to it. NTTIAWTT. But somehow they have convinced rich snob fuckers that its all "authentic" or something.
It's important to note that average people are extremely dumb and this is why it is crucial to maintain a strong manufacturing base regardless of the changing tides of economic progress. Ordinary people are too stupid to do anything other than pull levers in factories. Fortunately people such as myself are better educated and have the know how to create and maintain a healthy society.
TV did create an American meta culture...with the internet that culture has mutated and bifurcated and advanced into something huge weird and beautiful....my guess is Murphy thinks himself smart and elite but he is also completely shut off from the new meta culture....this book is the whine of a man who was born a few decades to late and forgot how to change.
My mother was an immigrant to this country, came here in the early fifties. She was a British Subject but was born in Czechoslovakia, bilinqual, bicultural between Britain and Czech etc.
Her first introduction to the States was Shreveport, Louisiana.
I savaged her continuously about British culture, and the functional plumbing and lucas electric jokes were never far in the background at our house.
But love of food came from her Czech half (her citizenship came from her Father's birthright, her mother was 100% Czech). So the food was a major... major disappointment, and in that regard, I'm on her side.
The overt racism also horrified her-- afterall, European racism was different. For instance, my mother just looked down on Ukranians and Slovaks.
But love of food came from her Czech half (her citizenship came from her Father's birthright, her mother was 100% Czech). So the food was a major... major disappointment, and in that regard, I'm on her side.
Taste is taste is taste. There are people who absolutely love British food. It's a debate with no end.
A lot of the food I grew up with because of my mom was itself an amalgm of many cultures, often pan-eastern European. I grew up eating Piroshky, which is considered a Russian invention.
I did eat a lot of knedliky growing up as well. Definitely a Czech delight.
I was not, however, a big fan of her Goulash (which is of Hungarian origin).
Some of the other food we ate was of Austrian origin. So go figure.
For myself, there were specific British delicacies that I enjoy. Roast Beef and Yorkshire pudding is one of my favs.
You have a point. I once overheard an Englishman and an Australian arguing over which was better, Marmite or Vegemite. They both seemed to miss the salient point that both of these rank among the most disgusting foods ever conceived by man.
Eh, it depends on the pop culture. And I would remove women from the analysis entirely, as their intelligence is merely a mirage. It is raw unadulterated emotion caged in a decent enough vocabulary so as to be deemed intelligent in passing.
Eh, it depends on the pop culture. And I would remove women from the analysis entirely, as their intelligence is merely a mirage. It is raw unadulterated emotion caged in a decent enough vocabulary so as to be deemed intelligent in passing.
Lol, I jest. My misogyny is not so overwhelming. Although I stand by my central points about the measuring of intelligence should be more based on abstract reasoning and not vocabulary, English diction, and ability to absorb and retain facts.
As for the pop culture stuff, I do find women that would fit within the so called cognitive elite, or at least upper echelon based on their decent handle of language and facts, will often times have some strange fascination with abhorrently stupid reality shows like Real Housewives of this or that Metropolitan Area, Jersey Shore, or Teen Mom.
So Murray wants the cultural elites to start condescending to his average Americans and become moralizing scolds about their lifestyles?
"Don't you know that you'll remain in the lowest quintile unless you stop being a single mother and go to church, you dumb trailer-trash slut." That's what he wants?
The problem with microbrews are the mornings you start drinking and you go all day into the night. Tough to manage with microbrews. That's a job for the High Life because it is the High Life.
The best BH is the one where Granny has Jethro cut down Mrs Drysdale's trees. Jethro assures Jed that it won't come back on the Clampett's because Jethro "gnawed on the stumps so she'll think a gopher done it."
Instead of feeling sorry for the exceptionally able student who has no one to talk to, we need to worry about what happens when exceptionally able students hang out only with one another.
Err...nerd table?
The principal watching a gang of students run through the hall carrying a lens frame with a homemade twelve element telescope on it---because they need to point it out a window and the place is built like a prison---during class hours and deciding not to do anything about it because they're all on his National Merit finalist list?
42. Mostly because I don't watch TV or movies, or drink shitty beer. While I am well educated, and work in a respectable profession (engineering), I sometimes wear a uniform, frequently work on a plant floor, have had significant interaction with skilled labor, including unions.
My hobbies (primarily shooting) generally put me in contact with folks who occupy a wide range of socioeconomic status.
Didn't Postrel support both the Afghanistan and Iraq wars? Don't read articles by phony libertarian warmongers.
Charles Murray claims to be a libertarian and spends half of his book bashing social liberalism and deprecating any lifestyle that isn't out of Leave it to Beaver.
While I can't stand fuckers who think we can legislate every morsel of morality (listen up, Team Blue, as well), bashing social liberalism is shitloads of fun.
Not as much fun as bashing Creationist conservative hicks who make up the bulk of Red State America.
I finally discovered what American Exceptionalism means - "we're rednecks and the rules don't apply to us".
What the fuck did I just say up there, shrike?
Go back to your Obama worship service.
You're scheduled to blow me and Buffett today, shrike. And you know how we frown on tardiness.
"...bulk of Red State America.
Citation needed.
This study intdicates that only the deep south has a majority of respondents that buy non-scientific creation. While I find it very distressing that these numbers are a high as they are, they really don't support your narrative.
In any case, you pretty made yourself the posterboy for what this article is about... good job.
To shrike, not-shrike = filthy capitalist pig Red State inbred secretly-gay wife-beater.
Libertarians can bash any social philosophy they want, you know, without giving up social cred, as long as they tow the lion on no state involvement in the war of all social philosophies against all.
+1
Wholeheartedly agreed. I bash both, and I even more fervently bash both of their contempts for eachother.
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"
God DAMN it, why does this stupid bitch keep referring to me?
If you're not a member of our Team... you're a hillbilly.
ginger, mary ann, or elly mae?
All three, plus Bailey Quarters.
Ginger. No doubt.
Ginger as well.
The answer to Ginger or Mary Ann ?
Jeannie
yep + boing
Throw in Jeannie and Samantha from Bewitched and you would have a superior lesbian orgy.
Hell, I might invite the mother-in-law too, I suspect that she was a freak.
Charles Murray can kiss my ass.
Yes, but will he? I'd lay odds against it.
academia is chock full of Jethro Bodines. simultaneously the most educated and stupidest people in the room.
tl;dr
I take great enjoyment in asking people I have recently met "what's the first thing you know?"
"where Granny mistakes an escaped kangaroo for a giant-sized jackrabbit..."
Uh, no, its where elitists and the ignorant (but I repeat myself) mistake giant jack rabbits for a mythological critter called a "kangaroo."
Next thing you'll be saying is a "platypus" is some kind of odd critter found in Australia instead of the all you can eat special at the "Garden of Oriental Delights"
Jethro was a caricature of academia; the most educated and stupidest guy in the room.
Eb was an argument against minimum wage.
No one took the quiz?
71
Redneck.
32, proudly first generation upper middle class. My kids are going to be insufferable. They'll have the good sense to avoid shitty beer at least, but they're gonna be pussies.
Grew up a po cuntry boy. I seen sum shit.
But I haven't drank a Bud in 20 years and I most definitely have NEVER watched a NASCAR race OR American Idol.
I also got a 32, but "uppder middle class" I'm not. I grew up in a rural Nevada, and am currently living on a farm in Oregon. I'm not exactly living in a bubble...
I think the test is flawed in that it identifies a very narrow range of interests and activities that the lower classes might participate in and then says that if you don't also have that narrow range of interests, your living in a bubble. I mean, how the fuck does preferring football and rally racing over basketball and NASCAR make you more upper class? And in some of the questions (such as the one about eating at certain restaurants), being extremely rural will lose you even more points.
The test is, IMO, extremely flawed.
I did a few weeks ago. I'm Bubble Boy.
I can't, from work. Based on the questions I've seen, though, growing up in a small Texas town pretty much ensures your bubble gets popped early on.
Found it. 48.
Agreed. Small Texas town as well. 61
Not until I'm remunerated.
80 or 84 for me. I got hung up on question nine.
I couldn't get it to work in Chrome.
46
It was hard to apply some questions - for example, I have few close friends, period, but I have had frequent conversations with the not-so-brilliant. Also, all those chain restaurants I tend to avoid because they're too high class and expensive. For the television season in question, I was in Antarctica where television reception was not so good.
Depending on whether I go with the text as written or with the spirit of the thing, my score ranges from 46 to 66.
Perhaps more notable is the fact that I am fully aware of how much I don't understand ordinary Americans. At best, I partially understand the skilled middle class. Likewise, I have enough understanding of rural issues to know that city folks have no idea about rural issues, without having an awful lot of knowledge on many aspects of normative rural living myself. In this sense, Murray is absolutely right: the people running the U.S. today have no conception of what life is like for the people they supposedly represent, and that can lead to some huge mistakes. It's a good thing that educated people can congregate with other educated people, but too much of that leads to a significant disconnect between classes. I should also note that most of the "dumb" people are a lot smarter than they are given credit for. There's a lot they don't know, but there's also a lot they do know, that the "smart" people are clueless about.
56
I'd argue, however, that the test does not weigh work and military experience heavily enough. If one has done physically exhausting work for months or years, one has experienced life outside of the elite bubble. Ditto the military.
Watching Oprah, American Idol, or Iron Man II after dining at Outback Steakhouse doesn't come close.
39
No one took the quiz?
66. A ?rst- generation middle-class person with working-class parents and average television and moviegoing habits. Range: 42?100. Typical: 66
Not too far off. My parents fought their way up into the middle class with the G.I. Bill and serious guts. I'm more the guy who had a tornado take down 13 big trees 5 months after I bought my first house and said, "It's just work." I bought a 14" chainsaw and had fuel for the wood stove for years.
Nawh...it's just work and a chance to buy a new tool. I got a couple of pry bars out of the limb that holed my roof a couple of years of.
33.
And I only just eeked into some of them. But then I just missed a few others, so maybe that evens out.
Can I have some points for being sad that I don't have a pickup and haven't been fishing lately? On the other hand I make no excuses for the beer thing. I don't have much beer money and I will spend it on beer that I like.
Oh yeah, and I think I should get credit on the poverty thing for the first year of grad school...no support and three part time jobs.
I was often almost as physically tired as when I worked landscaping, only I couldn't afford much more than ramen to eat.
Jethro was a caricature of academia; the most educated and stupidest guy in the room.
Eb was an argument against minimum wage.
There is too much emphasis placed on what these sapsuckers call the cognitive elite. A New Yorker reader is just a New Yorker reader, not harming anything outside of his domain. When doing political analysis, as opposed to sociological, you need to concentrate on classes of the polis who have the ability and the motive to use coercive force. Hence, the managerial elite and its motivations is more typically the proper subject of libertarian investigation. Anti-libertarian statist are vehemently opposed to that investigation as well. You can talk about fonts and Beverly Hillbillies all day long and they wont care, but if you ask who is pulling Obama's strings they will go into a knee jerk rage and claim conspiracy theories -- que shrike.
Moreover, the cognitive elite status that is granted to them is often times not based on solid metrics of intelligence (symbolic logic, spatial reasoning, etc) but rather on mundane knowledge, the kind of thing even a monkey can master and regurgitate.
What's that again...comrade?
+1 - there's a reason they're called educated idiots. (The bubble is the reason that most of them don't even know that this is a common expression.)
"You can talk about fonts and Beverly Hillbillies all day long and they wont care, but if you ask who is pulling Obama's strings they will go into a knee jerk rage and claim conspiracy theories -- que shrike."
I LOVE being told by some young lumberjack looking hipster that I should stop getting my new from Alex Jones
This is like the worst chat room ever.
Scored a forty three. I'd be a full blown redneck if I went to movies or watched tv.
We're kindred souls - right down to the exact number. Hmm, did we really need this quiz to tell us that?
I also got a 45, which oversells my folksiness. I'm an immigrant that spent the vast majority of my life in coastal enclaves and went to elite universities.
There's a major regional and cultural bias built in. Why NASCAR* and not college or pro football (the true "universal American sport")? Why does the guy from Brooklyn get credit for living in a small town when it's in on an Army base instead of a college campus? You're just as likely to interact (or not) with locals in both situations.
* The highest rated NASCAR races still trail the highest rated NBA, NFL, MLB and college revenue sports in ratings
Because fuck niggers.-Charles Murray
I agree. I love college football; I hate NASCAR. I'll challenge Charles Murray to redneck-off anytime.
Fun Fact: The NASCAR Hall of Fame complex includes an office building which houses a company devoted to fashion (high heels, in fact). Talk about a culture clash!
From the Postril article on Plano "She contrasts Plano with Fresno, California, where she spent most of her childhood. In California, her friends would say, "You go to church? That's something my grandmother does."
Hey!!!!, we go Satan church in Fresno, where we put puppies and kittens in blenders and sacrifice virgin heterosexuals - and finding a virgin at the Costco in CA for a reasonalbe price is IMPOSSIBLE - if your from Fresno, your super cool, super secular, and AVANT Guarde.....
OK 🙁 EVEN people in Plano are cooler than people in Fresno
I grew up in Dinuba, and consider Fresno to be a cultural mecca.
I live in the sburbs of Los Angeles, where people who only fly or take the five between here and SF consider Fresno to be Deliverance on steroids.
In Fresno, we aspire to 1/10 the number of teeth the rednecks had in Deliverance.
Of course, nobody in Fresno understood why "oink" sex was protrayed as if it were a bad thing...
Yeah, but in Fresno, the toothlessness is less related to having not discovered toothpaste and more related to meth.
In between California's version of the Scylla and Charybdis (Fresno and Bakersfield).
[goes back to polishing monocle with 600tc Egyptian brushed cotton cloth]
In between California's version of the Scylla and Charybdis (Fresno and Bakersfield).
[goes back to polishing monocle with 600tc Egyptian brushed cotton cloth]
I scored a 46, which puts me in sort of a no-man's land in Murray's description of the various categories at the end of the test.
I suspect the extremes on either end of the test are maybe rarer than Murray thinks.
Man, I'd love to have that old double neck DanElectro. Those things are like gold now.
Otto: You know those guitars, that are like, double guitars, you know?
APPROVED
I scored a 39, but most of my points came from the first section.
In fact, living through that first section is what made me score so "low" in the rest.
Ditto. I scored a 32 with most of my points not coming from lower middle class upbringing but the fact that I hung out with the stupid crowd and got high throughout my youth. Questions 5-9 accounted for 20 of my points. 8 is a bit of a skewer though. As a libertarian, I naturally disagree with everyone.
Another 39 here. Questions 5-9 were where the points came in
Is Yuenglings domestic, mass market beer?
No. skipping to the answer section:
The leading qualifying beers are Budweiser, Coors, Miller, orBusch, light or regular. The disdain of the new upper class for domestic mass-market beer is nearly as intense as its disdain forpeople who smoke cigarettes
Middle America was turned on to microbrews 20 years ago. I think Murray's a bit off on this one.
Disdain for beer entirely is a better marker for being an upper-class twit (if you're a guy).
I grew up among teetotalers, so I didn't get anything on the alcohol question either.
Beer snobs can be as annoying as wine snobs. [Speaking of that whatever did happen to the wine_common_sewer?]
PBR has become a brand preference for some as a backlash against beer snobbery.
yuenglings is for when the governor or Pope visits. Pabst is normal drinking beer, and you serve Iron City when your mother in-law comes...to visit.
Heineken??! Fuck that shit! Pabst BLue RIBBON!!!!
So, having grown up on Pearl, Lone Star, Tecate and Shiner, I can answer no as well, right?
Shiner is a hybrid I'd think. It's really not that far off from Bud with brown color to it. NTTIAWTT. But somehow they have convinced rich snob fuckers that its all "authentic" or something.
I will eat your heart if you do not disavow your slander of Shiner.
Eat. Your. Heart.
As a Texan, I tried to like Shiner, especially their flagship Bock.
But, no.
ummm ... ok. It's slightly better than clear mass produced beer.* And it goes better with BBQ for sure.
Thats the best I can do.
*excepting the "I just just cut the grass" rule, of course.
damn. resetting snark handle.
The imminent cancellation of Community shows the cognitive elite are not the most powerful force in this country.
Save Greendale 2012!
Six seasons and a movie!
How come Granny bears an uncanny resemblance to Harry Reid?
It's important to note that average people are extremely dumb and this is why it is crucial to maintain a strong manufacturing base regardless of the changing tides of economic progress. Ordinary people are too stupid to do anything other than pull levers in factories. Fortunately people such as myself are better educated and have the know how to create and maintain a healthy society.
Step #1 Green manufacturing jobs.
extremely dumb is the new normal
Murray says America had a distinctive civic culture but the entirety of US history says otherwise.
If you're premise is wrong, actual research will show that. I conclude that Murray did no research whatsoever.
TV did create an American meta culture...with the internet that culture has mutated and bifurcated and advanced into something huge weird and beautiful....my guess is Murphy thinks himself smart and elite but he is also completely shut off from the new meta culture....this book is the whine of a man who was born a few decades to late and forgot how to change.
Good lord, did you expect him to set foot out of Cambridge?
Not being an American, I'm 100% hillbilly free.
serious?
My mother was an immigrant to this country, came here in the early fifties. She was a British Subject but was born in Czechoslovakia, bilinqual, bicultural between Britain and Czech etc.
Her first introduction to the States was Shreveport, Louisiana.
Imagine her horror.
Her first introduction to the States was Shreveport, Louisiana.
Imagine her horror.
Wait...so she was British...
Yeah i would think the only difference she would notice is the warmer climate....and perhaps slightly delighted by the functional plumbing.
You have a far too sympathetic view of English culture.
You've somehow characterized my views as hers.
I savaged her continuously about British culture, and the functional plumbing and lucas electric jokes were never far in the background at our house.
But love of food came from her Czech half (her citizenship came from her Father's birthright, her mother was 100% Czech). So the food was a major... major disappointment, and in that regard, I'm on her side.
The overt racism also horrified her-- afterall, European racism was different. For instance, my mother just looked down on Ukranians and Slovaks.
Wait... Shreveport LA had worse food than Britain? I call bullshit.
But love of food came from her Czech half (her citizenship came from her Father's birthright, her mother was 100% Czech). So the food was a major... major disappointment, and in that regard, I'm on her side.
In case you're still not tracking, if the choice came down between British food and Southern food in (in the 50s), I'd choose southern food.
But the choice between Czech food and Southern food? No contest.
Although in my mother's later years she would express a nostalgia for British food, but I think it was more of a comfort issue.
When I visited Prague in 2006, the only palatable food I found was in a Mexican restaurant. Are you saying that it used to be better?
(Now Romanian, Ukrainian, or Turkish food, on the other hand - that's good eating!)
Taste is taste is taste. There are people who absolutely love British food. It's a debate with no end.
A lot of the food I grew up with because of my mom was itself an amalgm of many cultures, often pan-eastern European. I grew up eating Piroshky, which is considered a Russian invention.
I did eat a lot of knedliky growing up as well. Definitely a Czech delight.
I was not, however, a big fan of her Goulash (which is of Hungarian origin).
Some of the other food we ate was of Austrian origin. So go figure.
For myself, there were specific British delicacies that I enjoy. Roast Beef and Yorkshire pudding is one of my favs.
Oh shit, I forgot about Pala?inky... how could I forget Pala?inky?
We should get Matt Welch to weigh in on his opinion of Czech food. He actually lived there. I just grew up with a Czech* mother.
You have a point. I once overheard an Englishman and an Australian arguing over which was better, Marmite or Vegemite. They both seemed to miss the salient point that both of these rank among the most disgusting foods ever conceived by man.
For the record, my Mother loved Marmite and tried (with little effect) to make me eat it as a kid.
Also spreading goose fat on bread in lieu of butter was another Eastern European tradition. When you live in places that are cold...
This is true. But Bovril is lovely.
The smartest people i know who are my age or younger are huge and enthusiastic consumers of pop culture.
The fact is the smart elite of a young age eat up shit like Nyan cat.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QH2-TGUlwu4
Eh, it depends on the pop culture. And I would remove women from the analysis entirely, as their intelligence is merely a mirage. It is raw unadulterated emotion caged in a decent enough vocabulary so as to be deemed intelligent in passing.
Yeah, what he said.
Obvious troll is obvious.
Lol, I jest. My misogyny is not so overwhelming. Although I stand by my central points about the measuring of intelligence should be more based on abstract reasoning and not vocabulary, English diction, and ability to absorb and retain facts.
As for the pop culture stuff, I do find women that would fit within the so called cognitive elite, or at least upper echelon based on their decent handle of language and facts, will often times have some strange fascination with abhorrently stupid reality shows like Real Housewives of this or that Metropolitan Area, Jersey Shore, or Teen Mom.
You're right, Sudden. Me girl, me stupid.
How are you guys taking the quiz?
all i see from the link is pages from the book containing the quiz....
Do i have to write my answers down with a pen on paper then score myself?
Fuck that noise.
By not taking the test, you receive a score of zero and are instantly jettisoned into the ranks of the cognitive elite. Irony knows no bounds.
I saw the same thing Joshua C. saw, and I bailed. Too far.
It could pretty easily be automated. Surprised they didn't do that.
Old school...God forbid.
I just see a jumble of text or a blank wall depending on the browser. Must be work-banned.
"interface with the hoi polloi."
And they use the ATM-machine by entering their PIN-number, which might be the same as their car's VIN-number.
EDITOR!
My hot water heater broke down at 4am in the morning.
Is that the consensus of opinion?
As a long-time and current Plano resident, I found the linked article an interesting and accurate portrayal of my charming little city.
47
So Murray wants the cultural elites to start condescending to his average Americans and become moralizing scolds about their lifestyles?
"Don't you know that you'll remain in the lowest quintile unless you stop being a single mother and go to church, you dumb trailer-trash slut." That's what he wants?
The problem with microbrews are the mornings you start drinking and you go all day into the night. Tough to manage with microbrews. That's a job for the High Life because it is the High Life.
The answer is 42.
The best BH is the one where Granny has Jethro cut down Mrs Drysdale's trees. Jethro assures Jed that it won't come back on the Clampett's because Jethro "gnawed on the stumps so she'll think a gopher done it."
Err...nerd table?
The principal watching a gang of students run through the hall carrying a lens frame with a homemade twelve element telescope on it---because they need to point it out a window and the place is built like a prison---during class hours and deciding not to do anything about it because they're all on his National Merit finalist list?
Stuff like that?
Old hat, man.
Surprisingly, Jed Clampett looks pretty hot in gold lam? jeans.
42. Mostly because I don't watch TV or movies, or drink shitty beer. While I am well educated, and work in a respectable profession (engineering), I sometimes wear a uniform, frequently work on a plant floor, have had significant interaction with skilled labor, including unions.
My hobbies (primarily shooting) generally put me in contact with folks who occupy a wide range of socioeconomic status.