Reason Morning Links: American Airlines Files for Bankruptcy, Herman Cain Accused of 13-Year Affair, Pakistan Admits to Firing First

Mike Riggs | 11.29.2011 8:58 AM

Due partly to debt accumulated in various labor disputes, American Airlines' CEO has stepped down and its parent company has filed for bankruptcy.
Pakistan says it fired first in the Saturday morning skirmish that led to a U.S. airstrike that killed 24 Pakistani soldiers.
A Georgia woman claims she had a 13-year affair with Herman Cain, during which the former restaurant executive flew her around the country and signed books for her.
Occupy protesters in Los Angelese and Philadelphia completely ignored their eviction deadlines, cops did not respond violently.
Germany has been told that if it does not act to save Europe, all hell will break loose.
Egyptian dock workers at the Suez Port are refusing to receive a shipment of teargas from the U.S., ordered by the Interior Ministry.

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Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago

American Airlines' CEO has stepped down and its parent company has filed for bankruptcy.

Couldn't have happened to a more deserving company.
1. Lost_In_Translation 13 years ago
  
  US Airways?
  1. Kunty Kristen 13 years ago
    
    I'd love to hate on US Airways, but they're the only airline that offers direct flights to smaller airports from DC. And for a fairly reasonable price.
    1. annonymous commenter some guy 13 years ago
      
      DCA is a great airport to fly to/from. It's never busy and you can walk anywhere in 5 minutes. I wonder how heavily it is subsidized. Anyone know?
2. Yet another Peak Oil casualty 13 years ago
  
  Although debated and denied frequently, a massive shortfall in oil production is coming faster than many are willing to admit. Drs. Alex Kuhlman assesses the situation and its effect on the airline industry, and reminds us to start thinking about tomorrow.
  
  Peak Oil: The Coming Global Crisis and the Decline of Aviation
  By Drs. Alex Kuhlman
  October 29, 2005
  http://www.airliners.net/aviation-art.....main?id=81
  1. CoyoteBlue 13 years ago
    
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8arvEzHsA8
  2. Arcaster 13 years ago
    
    http://www.dailymarkets.com/ec.....economics/
    1. The problem with economics... 13 years ago
      
      ...is that economists ignore reality.
      
      "Take oil, for example. Everyone says it's a limited resource...Excuse me, it's not limited from an economic point of view." ~Nobel Prize-winning economist Milton Friedman
      
      Because, ya know, the earth isn't spherical. Economics just doesn't do finite. LOL
      
      Really, how fucking stupid can you get? Friedman stupid!
      1. Maxxx 13 years ago
        
        Yeah.
        
        It's not like economics is the study of scarcity or something.
      2. Jk 13 years ago
        
        You really have no clue what Friedman is saying do you? I suggest you read a little more than one sentence quotations.
        
        Friedman is talking bullshit 13 years ago
        
        Get a clue.
        
        Sy 13 years ago
        
        Yeah..might want to talk to someone that actually works in the oil industry before you start spouting bullshit again, WI.
  3. Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
    
    Do you drive a car, Jason?
  4. Pip 13 years ago
    
    I thought Peak made anti-freeze.
  5. Barack Obama 13 years ago
    
    Only if I have anything to say about it.
  6. DesigNate 13 years ago
    
    It has nothing to do with their shitty customer service and charging customers for every little thing.
3. Anacreon 13 years ago
  
  Damn! Wanted something wacky and stimulating to say today but nothing in Morning Links led to that.
4. Chloe 13 years ago
  
  My father was killed when the American Airlines flight that he was on crashed because they never bothered to check if the wings could handle ice. So, fuck you AA and don't let the door hit you on the ass.
  1. Tym 13 years ago
    
    My condolences, sorry.
  2. Jk 13 years ago
    
    So sorry Chloe.
  3. Doubting Thomas 13 years ago
    
    Flight number and date or it didn't happen.
    1. Fatty Bolger 13 years ago
      
      Well, the crash itself definitely did happen:
      
      American Eagle Flight 4184
      
      I remember seeing a show about it, probably one of the ones mentioned in the Wikipedia article.
      1. Doubting Thomas 13 years ago
        
        "The" crash? How do you know which incident "Chloe" is referencing?
        
        operated by Simmons Airlines
        
        Simmons, American...whatever.
        Not that an anonymous commentator is not to be believed in her (his?) assertion that American Airlines "never bothered to check if the wings could handle ice." Nobody ever lies on the internet.
5. Metazoan 13 years ago
  
  Delta is worse.
Ice Nine 13 years ago

I think I just lost a shitload of AA frequent flier miles.
1. Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
  
  Why do you say that? It's not as if the government's not gonna bail them out like they always do.
  1. Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
    
    Sidenote: I demand Riggs link to Pope Urban's ascension to the Buckeye Throne.
    1. Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
      
      Maybe he's one of them butthurt Gators fans. Or worse...he's a Michigoon.
      1. Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        It doesn't bother me. Besides, it's not like OSU will contend for a national title while he's there.
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        It doesn't bother me. Besides, it's not like OSU will contend for a national title while he's there.
        
        Whatever helps you sleep at night.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        Please. How many national titles have the Big Ten won during the BCS era? Compare that to the SEC and, even worse, the SEC plus the non-SEC Florida schools.
        
        Not very likely.
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        Doesn't tOSU have the most BCS appearances? And they did lose 2 championships, but have a pretty fucking good record at 6-3? The Gators are 5-1, but where were they the three other years the Buckeyes were playing in Pasadena or Glendale?
        
        BTW, Bama is 1-2 in BCS games.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        Which conference has won most of the BCS national titles? By far? Which one has won the last five straight? Which has never lost a BCS championship game?
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        The BCS is new Pro. The SEC got their asses kicked a lot before the BCS. They have had a good 8 year run. But before that, Miami, Nebraska and FSU generally owned the SEC.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        Yes, well, we all know how good the old bowl system was at picking national champions. The closer we get to a playoff system, the better the conference will do. And even in the 90s, the SEC won what, three titles?
        
        Of course, I do think the SEC isn't actually as dominant as it once was. It's losing that good-from-top-to-almost-the-bottom factor, which I think is the beginning of a real decline. Saw that with the Big Ten when it started to lose its edge. I think the SEC will retain something just because of where it is and its ability to recruit, but it's not going to stay on top to this extent if things keep going the way they are.
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        You have three-four decent teams and a bunch of total crap on the bottom. I bet the only reason we have not moved to a playoff is because the SEC would hate to actually be tested in a game.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        Now you're being silly.
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        Yeah, we all know the SEC has. But unlike the SEC homers, I'm a fan of my team, not an entire conference.
        
        I always love the SEC homers (not saying you are one Pro Lib) coming out of the woodwork when the Buckeyes are brought up. For some reason, they feel the need to compare their entire conference to us.
        
        Timon19 13 years ago
        
        Seriously, who the fuck roots for a conference filled with teams that you should be hating particularly passionately?
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        Obviously, as a Florida alumnus, I don't have to do that. When I worked at Ohio State in the 90s, I kept telling them that Florida would kick their ass. But they just wouldn't listen.
        
        To be honest, OSU is about the only team in the Big Ten that even comes close to contending anymore. I think that's why the comparisons can sometimes get reduced to that. I may be all happy about SEC dominance, but I'm saddened at the decline of conferences that were once quite good--the Big Ten and the Big Eight-Twelve-Eleventy Billion in particular.
        
        EDG reppin' LBC 13 years ago
        
        Love Ohio State, could fucking care less about the rest of the Big10. Except Michigan. Fuck Michigan.
        
        Brandon 13 years ago
        
        How long after the death penalty do you think Meyer will stick around?
      2. T-Bone 13 years ago
        
        Can someone explain to me why Gator fans are so butthurt over this? Hasn't the OSU job always been his dream job?
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        Frankly, I wasn't a big Meyer fan. I appreciate the national titles, but I think we won those because of our defense more than anything else. We're missing Charlie Strong more than Meyer right now.
        
        One thing Meyer didn't like is that even with two national titles, Spurrier remained atop the UF pantheon.
        
        T-Bone 13 years ago
        
        Also, you won those b/c of Tebow. I've heard people say that Meyer left b/c he knew he couldn't win without Tebow. Who knows? Elway thinks the Broncos can win without Tebow, but he's wrong.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        Not so much the first national title. Tebow was a pretty small part of that. Chris Leak really shined in the title game, too.
        
        Bones 13 years ago
        
        Buddy of mine is a big OSU fan and bet 4 grand on that game and lost it all. He spent all football season betting wisely, building it up in a Costa Rican account and then dorked himself with one game. I personally think it's delicious karma because he cheers for OSU against his alma mater Ohio U. The football gods smite traitors.
        
        Bones 13 years ago
        
        Oh, and Go Noles!
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        Go Noles!
        
        Who do they have this weekend in the I-AA playoffs again? Or are they in the ACC? I never can tell the difference.
        
        Brandon 13 years ago
        
        Leak had the longest run in that game, as well.
        
        Ted S. 13 years ago
        
        Elway thinks the Broncos can win without Tebow, but he's wrong.
        
        The Packers seem to be doing just fine without Tebow. 😉
    2. Montani Semper Liberi 13 years ago
      
      It would be funny if Saban took the PSU job and ran him out of the Big 10 like he did the SEC.
      1. Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        He won't leave Bama yet. I don't think they're getting ready to be put on probation. But give him another year or two.
      2. Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        This is a new angle - I never heard that Urban Meyer was "run out" of the SEC. How does a a guy who gets blown out by Utah run out someone who reformed a team into a two-time BCS winner again?
        
        Montani Semper Liberi 13 years ago
        
        Well, he wasn't having heart problems until Saban started beating that ass, and then miraculously, a year after leaving the SEC, the heart problems are no longer an issue.
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        That is hilarious. The theories of homers are always good for a guffaw or two.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        I meant to say the SEC East sucks.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        It does right now. Of course, Florida won the national title only three years ago, so it's not like it's dead. The west is great at the moment.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        The SEC East shouldn't be dead. But college is all about coaching. And the SEC East has a sorry collection of coaches. I still can't believe Bill Muschamp got the Florida job. Florida, Georgia and Tennessee, all of whom should be good, all have bad or fair coaches right now.
        
        Montani Semper Liberi 13 years ago
        
        Who do you think I am a homer for? I don't give two shits about any SEC or Big 10 school. I'm just calling it like I see it.
        
        Montani Semper Liberi 13 years ago
        
        Oh, and I think OSU should dominate the Big 10 for awhile. There are no other coaches in the conference close to him.
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        Who do you think I am a homer for? I don't give two shits about any SEC or Big 10 school. I'm just calling it like I see it.
        
        A coach fakes heart problems because Nick Saban has a few good years (where, again, he couldn't beat Utah?) That is a field too far, dude.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        He has one more title at Florida than Saban has at Alabama. And he doesn't play in the same division as Alabama. The SEC sucks. I don't think it was that.
        
        I think he always wanted the Ohio State job. And I think he knew last year that the problems at Ohio State were bad and that Jim Tressel was on his way out. So here the job and the place he always wanted to be was about to come open. But he is under contract at Florida and it would take a huge buyout to leave. So what does he do? Feels his health declining, walks away from his contract at Florida for a year and is then free to take the Ohio State job when Tressell resigns.
        
        Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
        
        So Urban Meyer = evil genius. I might warm up to the guy.
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        Meyer does have a lot of "Hail Buckeyes" and "Our Woodys" to say in order to atone for inflicting Tim Tebow on us, though.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        May Tebow forgive you.
        
        Brett L 13 years ago
        
        "So Urban Meyer = evil genius. I might warm up to the guy."
        
        Actually, the word I heard from my UF friends is that he was a recruiting retard. He won with Zook's teams (which proves he's a better coach than Zook, but talent recruiting is a big deal), but his own recruits were not of the same caliber.
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        He actually had a clause in his UF contract that let him out, buyout-free, if he went to tOSU.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        Wow. I didn't know that.
    3. Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
      
      To get ahead of the curve, I registered the domain name http://www.fireurbanmeyer.org yesterday.
      Not up yet, but today's top reason to fire Urban Meyer: Meyer has one fewer Buckeye victory than David Farragut Edwards.
      1. Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        Nice.
        
        I loved how there were haters about this yesterday all over the radio. Like, who did they want - Jesus?
        
        Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
        
        Jesus don't know shit about offense.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        I'm curious about whether he's going to stick with the spread. I never liked it, and it fell to pieces once Tebow was gone.
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        He'll have to stick with it till Miller's gone. Guy's about as accurate a passer as Michael J Fox.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        If he's that bad, why not use someone else?
        
        Red Rocks Rockin 13 years ago
        
        If he's that bad, why not use someone else?
        
        The spread option really doesn't require a great or even very good passer(see, Tebow and Alex Smith, along with Pat White at WV and Denard Robinson at Michigan before Rodriguez got canned). It requires someone who can make veer-type reads.
        
        Meyer's version of the offense is more reflective of a single-wing philosophy than a true spread like the Run and Shoot--Tebow was essentially a single-wing fullback his whole career. So Miller might actually work out okay as long as he can hit the occasional post route or swing pass.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        Do you have the speed to run it as far as receivers and tailbacks go?
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        Yeah, that won't be an issue. If they have a hard time adjusting, it will be due to the size of D-lines and LB's they face. Those are some big fast guys.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        Interesting to see how it works. OSU usually has decent speed on offense, which is a big part of the equation.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        Also, the spread means smaller linemen, which means no switching back and forth from the spread option to a pro-set scheme. Not effectively, anyway. That's exactly what UF is dealing with right now.
        
        Timon19 13 years ago
        
        Miller is a shitty passer unless he's forced to throw on the run out of total desperation. Then, somehow, he throws tight spirals in perfect places. It's weird.
        
        He also appears to be a smarter player than Pryor was at this time by some distance.
        
        EDG reppin' LBC 13 years ago
        
        I was looking at TP on the sideline of the Raiders game Sunday, and he still looks like a little kid. Miller, otoh, looks like a man. He is way ahead of Pryor both physically and decision-making at this point in his (freshman) career. Pryor seemed to plateau, hopefully Miller will continue to progress. He's good, maybe he will become great.
        
        NeonCat 13 years ago
        
        Always declines penalties, too.
        
        Ted S. 13 years ago
        
        Jesus don't need no forward passes.
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        Read the most butthurt article ever written by a sportswriter. I always thought Schlabach was a hack, but this is below even hackery.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        I think Meyer is a good coach, but he's got some flaws. Recruiting may be one of them, and he certainly doesn't exert a lot of control over his locker room.
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        Recruiting may be one of them
        
        Meyer has a recruiting flaw? Are you for real?
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        Don't confuse Florida--which recruits well no matter who the coach is--and Meyer. He had success with some key players, but let's not forget that his biggest recruiting successes were with specialized players like Tebow, who weren't going to end up anywhere with a pro-set scheme in place.
        
        I'm not saying he's a bad recruiter, but I do think we've had better down here. Spurrier, of course, but even Zook seemed to do a better job.
        
        I know how desperate the OSU faithful are to restore past glories, but with NCAA penalties and a conference well into a decline, I wouldn't get too excited just yet.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        That said, OSU will get a recruiting bump just for hiring him. For one year. If they suck next year, that may disappear.
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        restore past glories
        
        Jesus tapdancing Christ. "Past glories," like the Sugar Bowl they won not even 11 months ago? Or the Rose Bowl the year before that?
        
        You sound like the program has been on the skids because we had one bad year because the NCAA penalized kids for selling their personal property and we had a shitty interim coach.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        Sloopy,
        
        Sorry but Ohio State deserves to be cursed after they fucked over Michigan State last year. Ohio State screwed an 11-1 Michigan State team out of a BCS birth. All three teams were 11-1. One team couldn't go. And Ohio State and the Big 10 knew they had cheated and the NCAA hammer was coming down. But they still accepted the BCS bid. And then they pulled the bullshit farce of "we are going to suspend them for next year's games but let them play in the bowl game". Yeah, everyone knew Tyrell Pryor was a model citizen and wasn't going pro or anything. He promised not to. What a fucking joke. They should give the damn place the Death Penalty for mendacity.
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        And I guess Auburn ought to have not played in the NCG when Cam Newton's daddy sold him to the highest bidder and the NCAA let him get away with it?
        
        Puh-leeze. And Sparty got his taint handed to himself in the Cap 1 Bowl last year, but tOSU fucked them by winning the Sugar Bowl?
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        And Ohio State and the Big 10 knew they had cheated
        
        Bartering private property now constitutes cheating? GTFO!
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        Yes it does Sloopy. That is why the players who were involved and not good enough to go to the NFL, didn't play this year.
        
        And they knowingly played ineligible players in the Sugar Bowl. And they go there by playing said players. That used to be a big deal in college football.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        About all of these violations--the system is a disaster. Most teams are doing bad things behind the scenes, and there's little point in pointing fingers except in the most egregious cases.
        
        It's not just about technical NCAA violations, either. One issue I had with Meyer, for instance, was the number of bad kids he recruited. How many Florida players got in trouble during his time? When Spurrier was coach, that happened much less frequently, and the team had better academic performance to boot.
        
        EDG reppin' LBC 13 years ago
        
        How many Florida players got in trouble during his time?
        
        I heard in passing on ESPN (John Richie?) 30 players arrested during Meyers' tenure at UF?
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        That sounds about right. I didn't like that at all, and that's definitely a coaching issue when you reach those kinds of numbers.
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        They self-reported and the NCAA cleared them. The fact that their coach hid information from the NCAA, the AD and President of the University doesn't change what the school did, which was self-report.
        
        I loved Jim Tressel, but everything that went wrong there was his doing. The school had no fucking idea, and if they had known, they would have reported it.
        
        BTW, tOSU is considered among the most consistent self-reporters in the NCAA for any and all potential infractions. The tattoo thing was a clear case of JT doing the wrong thing and deliberately hiding it from the school.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        Was Tressell not a part of the OSU athletic department? Sorry but our coach was crooked and we didn't know doesn't excuse it.
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        Blame the institution when an employee deliberately breaks the terms of his employment contract (to report infractions) to the detriment of the school?
        
        Did you fall on your head today?
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        Oh BS. Tresell didn't do anything the AD and President didn't approve of. They just threw him under the bus to save them from the NCAA hammer they so richly deserved.
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        Oh BS. Tresell didn't do anything the AD and President didn't approve of. They just threw him under the bus to save them from the NCAA hammer they so richly deserved.
        
        Do you have any proof for that?
        
        No. Naturally, you are just making stuff up.
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        I like you, John but you are out of your fucking mind. They never threw him under the bus. He personally went to the NCAA and told them he deliberately hid the info from Gene Smith and Gordon Gee. Rumor has it that he accepted a behind the scenes ban from the NCAA as well.
        
        Not to mention that he fucking got fired for not reporting the violations, and he never once complained about the firing or contested it's validity.
        
        If the school knew anything, they're a lot better at keeping quiet than anybody I've ever seen.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        Treseel is a loyal Buckeye and took the fall for the school.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        The Big Ten hasn't had a great team in quite some time. That goes for OSU, too.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        Meyer won a whole lot of games with Zook's players. When he ran out of Zook's players and Tebow graduated, he wasn't very good anymore. I think there is some legitimate criticism of Meyer's player evaluation abilities.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        I see your article and raise it with this.
        
        http://www.grantland.com/story.....just-money
        
        Those evil NBA owners expect to be able to control their employees. And they make those poor black men dress in suits on the sidelines. It is just horrible I tell you.
        
        Elder Scrolls Enthusiast AuH20 13 years ago
        
        Yeah, Simmons and Co. are quickly devolving into hack territory.
        
        Mo 13 years ago
        
        What's the matter John? Black men in street clothes scare you? The NBA is the only league that has a fucking dress code for injured players at the game.
        
        And it's nice to see one person push back against the lying owners and their sob stories. If the league was doing as poorly as they claimed, teams wouldn't have been going for multiples of their value mere years ago. Instead the owners were willing to trash a season after one of the best NBA seasons in recent memory. Fuck them.
        
        Mo 13 years ago
        
        What's the matter John? Black men in street clothes scare you? The NBA is the only league that has a fucking dress code for injured players at the game.
        
        And it's nice to see one person push back against the lying owners and their sob stories. If the league was doing as poorly as they claimed, teams wouldn't have been going for multiples of their value mere years ago. Instead the owners were willing to trash a season after one of the best NBA seasons in recent memory. Fuck them.
      2. Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        Now that's efficiency.
        
        I'd fire him because he coached at Florida, which has twice humiliated the Buckeyes at the national level. He is unclean in a way that could only be matched if he's ever set foot in Ann Arbor.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        Don't let them kid you. They are all incestuous up there. Bo Schimbechler was a former Woody Hayes assistant. Ohio State would hire a Michigan man if they thought he would beat Ohio State.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        Don't say that in Columbus.
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        Don't say it in central California either, cause I'll find you and kill you.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        I know some UM-OSU mixed marriages. Not an easy combination.
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        I had a good female friend, that I used to sleep with once in a while, who went to UM. Every year, the loser had to do a striptease in the other team's jersey then we'd get it on.
        
        She never got to see me dance.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        Good think you don't sleep with her now.
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        You're right. She's since chucked out a kid and married a douchebag that went to WVU.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        So much for her sex games--when do they even play?
      3. Matrix 13 years ago
        
        I lost all respect I had for Meyer over this whole ordeal.
        
        First, I have little love for UF since I'm a UGA fan. I have nothing but contempt for Ohio State. Also, this whole thing was ridiculous. He kept claiming he has never spoken to anyone at Ohio State about the job, and all of a sudden he just takes it. BS. I don't care if he takes the job or not, but don't go on TV claiming you have never spoken to anyone about the offer. Makes you look like a f***ing asshole.
        
        I hope they lose every game.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        Can't believe the fucking Dawgs are getting the honor of getting creamed by LSU.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        I don't think LSU is as good as advertised. And I think Miles is going to have one hell of a time getting them up for that game since they know they are playing for the national title. I bet Georgia gives a better game than people think.
        
        EDG reppin' LBC 13 years ago
        
        I don't think LSU is as good as advertised.
        
        I don't know dude. LSU looks fast, mean, and reaaalllly good. Good luck to UGA, but I don't think they stand a chance.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        LSU is pretty tough. So is Alabama. They both do it with good defense and running, which can make them look less dominant than they are.
        
        Jim Morrison was right: The West is the best. At least for now.
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        If I were a UGA fan, I don't think I'd be saying anything about Urban Meyer other than, "I wish we had him instead of that retard Mark Richt."
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        It's funny, because I thought Richt was going to be a great head coach. He did a superb job as an assistant at FSU. Just goes to show the Peter Principle at work.
        
        A Girl 13 years ago
        
        This is like the worst chat room ever.
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        He kept claiming he has never spoken to anyone at Ohio State about the job, and all of a sudden he just takes it. BS. I don't care if he takes the job or not, but don't go on TV claiming you have never spoken to anyone about the offer. Makes you look like a f***ing asshole.
        
        Whatever. The reason that the denials had to come is because somebody at OSU or ESPN leaked the news early, and it really was disrespectful to the current OSU coach to expect him to coach The Big Game already knowing he was gone.
        
        This is just manufactured outrage on your part.
        
        Pro Libertate 13 years ago
        
        Yeah, these guys (and the institutions) are always lying about who contacted whom and everything else about the hiring process.
        
        Meyer going to OSU doesn't bother me at all.
2. Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
  
  You should be good.
3. Name Nomad 13 years ago
  
  Bankruptcy doesn't mean the company doesn't exist anymore. Usually, someone else just buys them, and I doubt the new owner would give the proverbial finger to all frequent fliers.
  1. rather 13 years ago
    
    It means they will restructure, and dump obligations. It may be the death of their union obligations and FF points too.
    1. Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
      
      I feel their pain. I lost a lot of FF points by inexplicably not starting SeaBass this weekend.
      1. Bones 13 years ago
        
        I play in two leagues. Lost by 1 in one and won by 112 in the other. Wish I could share points...or Stevie Johnson could catch when it counts.
      2. Elder Scrolls Enthusiast AuH20 13 years ago
        
        I honestly can not believe I won that week, but clearly Ryan Fitzpatrick and Johnny Knox knows who signs their cheques: Massah Koch, that's who!
4. No 13 years ago
  
  AA says that their FF program will continue as is.
  1. No 13 years ago
    
    Jesus, that original comment got a little sidetracked. Not that off-topic meanderings ever happen with threaded comments.
    1. rather 13 years ago
      
      Yes, I heard AA statement on airline points but there is a divide between what is said, and what is done. The bankruptcy judge/arbitrators get their say too
Arduin Grimoire 13 years ago

UN climate expert: Durban conference 'make or break for humanity'

Obamacare Sequesters Your Flex Account
1. John 13 years ago
  
  Make or break for humanity until the next conference. If it actually was "make or break" they would have to give up and go home after the conference fails. And I don't see that happening.
2. Auric Demonocles 13 years ago
  
  I want to get lasik, but I'll probably have to wait until 2013 so that my eyes are completely done growing. Jerks.
3. Elder Scrolls Enthusiast AuH20 13 years ago
  
  In the immortal words of Krieger: Those corporate bagmunchers owe me 3500 dollars from my GODDAMN FLEX ACCOUNT!
Ice Nine 13 years ago

Anyone got a fork? I need to stick it in Herman.
1. I call random women at 4:15 am 13 years ago
  
  ...every single day.
  
  The Great White Hope for a Black on Black White House Battle has been cancelled.
2. robc 13 years ago
  
  If an affair ends Cain's bid, then Gingrich is doomed, right?
  1. Ice Nine 13 years ago
    
    Don't think so. Cain appears to be approaching Clinton magnitude and quality. Newt seems to be out of that league.
  2. SFC B 13 years ago
    
    Cain made the egotistical mistake of thinking that there is no way all of his consquests would come out of the woodwork.
    
    Newcular Titties hasn't, to my knowledge, denied that he is a lecherous scumbag in his personal life. He is a hypocrite because he endorses a far more faithful and conservative ideology, but he doesn't pretend that it is a philosophy his penis follows.
    1. John 13 years ago
      
      The problem with Cain is that he is so new. The titties has been around so long that all of his flaws are known and to some measure forgotten. You only get that privilege by hanging around public life for a long time.
    2. Proprietist 13 years ago
      
      "Newt Gingrich: His heart is conservative, but his genitals are liberal."
      1. mad libertarian guy 13 years ago
        
        Put together, Newt is all stupid.
      2. rac3rx 13 years ago
        
        BLEAGH. I have no desire to even think that Gingrich has genitals, thank you very much.
    3. RoboCain 13 years ago
      
      It would only be an egotistical mistake if these accusations were true.
      1. SFC B 13 years ago
        
        I'm all for "innocent until proven guilty", and I previously defended Cain to my friends and family, but really, after the number of accusers exceeds what can be counted on one hand I start looking for fire in that smoke.
        
        I'm sure it rankles Mr. Cain that N. Titties doesn't have this problem, but N. Titties has already had his public flogging.
Fist of Etiquette 13 years ago

The employees have been subjected to questioning for their refusal to allow an initial seven ton shipment of the US-made tear gas canisters enter the port.

Maybe a little tear gas will make those activists change their tune.
1. Jozef 13 years ago
  
  What Egypt needs is pepper spray instead, to feed its starving population.
  1. Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
    
    You must watch a lot of FoxNews.
    1. We Distort, You Deride 13 years ago
    2. Question? 13 years ago
      
      The Financial Times says Egypt will have run through its foreign currency reserves (they import half their food) in about 3 -4 months. We are talking about a country with the same population size as Germany.
      1. Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        IIRC, the Germans had a solution to their population at one time. I have a bad feeling Egypt's will be similar.
        
        Solutions are never Final 13 years ago
        
        Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
        
        So what'd you think -- The Copts = Egypt's Jews?
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        More like Egypt's Gypsies. The role of the Jew will be played by...the Jew again. Remember, the Holocaust (TM) wasn't limited to the area within Germany's borders.
    3. Pro Libertate 13 years ago
      
      I saw something about Martha Stewart using pepper spray on a turkey (to cook it--it was already quite deceased). I think it was on The Tonight Show?
  2. rather 13 years ago
    
    lol Josef but how will they get their vegetables? Even Dominos can't deliver pizza in 30 minutes to Africa.
    1. Herman can if there's a hottie 13 years ago
      1. Gimlet 13 years ago
        
        You communicate poorly. So sad.
Arduin Grimoire 13 years ago

It is "Global Warming Week" and the press will be full of it

Obama administration, GAO appear to have ignored group's ACORN affiliation to award $700K
Lord Humungus 13 years ago

Not sure if anyone else posted this, but a fascinating article on the blackmarket, aka System D.

The Shadow Superpower
Forget China: the $10 trillion global black market is the world's fastest growing economy -- and its future.
http://www.foreignpolicy.com/a.....?page=full

In many countries -- particularly in the developing world -- System D is growing faster than any other part of the economy, and it is an increasing force in world trade. But even in developed countries, after the financial crisis of 2008-09, System D was revealed to be an important financial coping mechanism. A 2009 study by Deutsche Bank, the huge German commercial lender, suggested that people in the European countries with the largest portions of their economies that were unlicensed and unregulated -- in other words, citizens of the countries with the most robust System D -- fared better in the economic meltdown of 2008 than folks living in centrally planned and tightly regulated nations.
1. John 13 years ago
  
  You mean if you regulate and tax everything to death people just go underground? Who would have thought such a thing?
2. gaijin 13 years ago
  
  ...inventive, self-starting, entrepreneurial merchants who are doing business on their own...
  
  But, but...I was told I had to be educated by the academy and then subsidized to win the future.
3. Raston Bot 13 years ago
  
  I'm still waiting for the System D vs Public Employees battle royale in Greece, Italy, et al.
John 13 years ago

Occupy prostesters in Los Angelese and Philadelphia completely ignored their eviction deadlines, cops did not respond violently.

So what should the cops do then? Just let them stay and not enforce the law?
1. Suki 13 years ago
  
  Occupy British embassy compound in Terran is underway now.
  1. Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
    
    in Terran
    
    Send in Starship Troopers?
    1. Suki 13 years ago
      
      ROFL! Ooops! Every post must contain a mistake, it's the law.
2. El Commentarioso 13 years ago
  
  Not enforce the law? That would be unethical.
3. Ice Nine 13 years ago
  
  I think they need this guy.
4. T 13 years ago
  
  Can either Riggs or yoo tell me where is Los Angelese?
  
  I can find Los Angeles on a map, but not this place.
  1. Ice Nine 13 years ago
    
    Uh, what I said - I think he probably knows.
  2. Suki 13 years ago
    
    He is using the David Letterman pronunciation.
  3. annonymous commenter some guy 13 years ago
    
    Los Angelese isn't a city. It's a language. Try to keep up.
5. Red Rocks Rockin 13 years ago
  
  So what should the cops do then? Just let them stay and not enforce the law?
  
  It's too late for that. Villaraigosa did what everyone's been doing with Generation Trophy the last 20 years--enabling them by trying to be their best friend instead of an authority figure, and telling them that everything they do is adorable, no matter the dysfunction.
  
  No child is going to take a pussy parent seriously when it comes time to drop the hammer--the parent will never completely follow through, and the child knows they're bluffing regardless because they realize the parent wants to be liked rather than respected.
  1. T 13 years ago
    
    The problem with elected officials is not only do they want to be liked, they need to be liked to get elected. You may respect an asshole, but you probably won't vote for one unless he has some likeable characteristics.
    1. Red Rocks Rockin 13 years ago
      
      Antonio took it to a different level, though--he's made no secret of the fact that he completely supports what they're doing. You can't do that and then turn around and expect them to respect you when you say, "Well, you've had your fun, but maybe it's time you share that park with the other residents of L.A.; if you don't we may have to remove you." Why would they take him seriously when their whole worldview is based on "FUCK YOU DAD!"?
Suki 13 years ago

Good morning reason!
Big ass explosion in Iran. Plus British embassy under siege by Occupy kids and Detroit union workers who make armor for US military take a few tokes during their shift. All tastefully decorated with fine images not found in the original stories.
1. Suki 13 years ago
  
  Reason might cover this if Israel is implicated, maybe.
Jozef 13 years ago

"Pakistan Admits to Firing First"

In other news, Pakistan has employed George Lucas to work on a yet unspecified project.
rather 13 years ago

we all need friends
John 13 years ago

http://classicalvalues.com/201.....nd-useful/

Democrats abandon the useful once and for all.
1. Ice Nine 13 years ago
  
  Boy, there's an exemplar of vision, no?
2. Slap the Enlightened! 13 years ago
  
  Hmm... sounds like they're gonna compete for Reason's demographic....
  1. DesigNate 13 years ago
    
    Fuck you slappy.
Lord Humungus 13 years ago

Barney Frank's exit sets off scramble on Hill
http://www.bostonherald.com/ne.....id=1384466

Cranky liberal standard-bearer U.S. Rep. Barney Frank's bombshell retirement announcement sent shock waves rippling through the Bay State and set the stage for an epic national clash as Democrats and Republicans prepare to do battle over a seat that until yesterday seemed staunchly and securely blue, observers said.

"It will be a fun race to watch ? at least fun from a distance," said U.S. Rep. Michael Capuano (D-Somerville), who said Democrats are launching a major push to recapture the majority in the U.S. House of Representatives. "It's not the only race in the country that both sides will be playing heavily in. ... They're all important. We're down 26 (seats), and we need to pick them up."

anyone want to lay odds on the Dems winning back the house?
1. John 13 years ago
  
  Longshot doesn't do it justice.
2. Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
  
  Capuano was also heard to say, "Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit snifing glue."
3. NoVAHockey 13 years ago
  
  I have to believe his internals were shit. With Obama and Warren at the top of the ticket, what else could it be?
  1. John 13 years ago
    
    Mass lost a rep during redistricting. So his district was redrawn to include a few areas that were not just mindlessly Democrat. The truth is no one liked Barney Frank other than the media and the morons in his specially created district. Once he was faced with the possibility of running in a distract that was not made for him, he knew he was doomed. I am just mad the rat bastard didn't stay for the humiliating election defeat he so deserves.
    1. NoVAHockey 13 years ago
      
      forgot about the redistricting -- thanks
    2. Sparky 13 years ago
      
      Considering this last election he just barely scraped out victory there is a decent chance that the new district may vote red next election. I'm not going to hold my breath though, this is MA after all.
      1. Sparky 13 years ago
        
        IOW, I think he's stepping down to ensure that a fresh D candidate gets the seat.
        
        romulus augustus 13 years ago
        
        I think he's stepping down in order to make a more lucrative living doing, oh say, advising Freddie and Fannie.
        
        mad libertarian guy 13 years ago
        
        ^^THIS^^
        
        If he doesn't pull down ~$10M over the next 4-5 years from some cushy consulting gig, I'll be shocked.
    3. Ted S. 13 years ago
      
      According to Real Clear Politics, Massachusetts hasn't finalized its congressional districts yet.
4. Anomalous 13 years ago
  
  Because of imminent redistricting, it was likely that Frank would have been sent packing.
  1. Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
    
    ...Frank...sent packing.
    
    **Chortle**
    1. Keebler Elves 13 years ago
      
      Make all the juvenile "fudge-packing" jokes you want, but it's a time-honored and honorable profession.
5. Auric Demonocles 13 years ago
  
  I unofficially live in Somerville. I'm debating officially switching from VT, but it'd cost me a lot (mostly with car registration/insurance). It would make it easier to vote for a losing cause.
Jerry 13 years ago

Ron Paul in 2nd place Iowa polling ahead of Romney: http://www.realclearpolitics.c.....P_1129.pdf
1. Chloe 13 years ago
  
  This is great, even if he comes in second in Iowa were get a segment on The Daily Show with Jon yelling about how they only acknowledge the first and third place winner. God, I hope Paul wins.
2. Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
  
  Something funky is going on with that poll. No way in the world Gingrich and Romney get 0% of the vote for 18-29 y/o's. I know they're not too popular, but 0%? And Bachmann gets 46% of the same demo?
  
  Sorry, I can't put any stock in that data. It's just a bit too goofy.
P Brooks 13 years ago

I doubt the new owner would give the proverbial finger to all frequent fliers.

In Chapter 11, you get to offload or restructure your liabilities (like "free" plane rides). I suspect a lot of those miles will go poof.
1. CaptainSmartass 13 years ago
  
  Frequent fliers are the bread and butter of any airline. Piss them off, and they'll go somewhere else (and take their last-minute fares with them).
2. Gray Ghost 13 years ago
  
  The following Washington Post article quotes a frequent flyer blog operator saying that miles should be fine.
  
  ""Miles are safe," said Gary Leff, co-founder of frequent flier site MilePoint. He said the bankruptcies of past airlines "are instructive." He even suggested there might be some promotions to keep loyal travelers."
  
  The article also mentioned that even when the airline ceased to exist, a la Pan Am, miles were often honored by other carriers.
  
  Now, the article doesn't mention that the ff programs' reward structures remained intact. Not totally useful to keep your miles if you can't redeem them, or if Airline B requires twice the mileage for the same reward.
Arduin Grimoire 13 years ago

BTW, did MNG ever explain the context that made "I have been talking w/ folks in the states about finding an investigative journalist to investigate and expose McIntyre, and his thus far unexplored connections with fossil fuel interests" acceptable, or how I need a PhD in a hard science to interpret that?
1. John 13 years ago
  
  The MNG Neu Mejican line yesterday was that anyone who points out these inconvenient facts is just repeating what other people have told them and is "out of their depth". They really don't have a context or a response beyond "how dare you question science" and "you are just repeating talking points".
  1. Neu Mejican 13 years ago
    
    No, John, what "my line" yesterday was, was they you, John, aren't qualified to judge the SCIENTIFIC implications of all of this. You, John, are not qualified to judge the impact of this on the peer review process. You, John, are just repeating what you have read about what these things mean for the science moving forward. You, John, are just repeating what you have heard about their implication for the peer review process.
    
    how dare you question science
    
    Not "how dare you question science," but "you are questioning the science based on non-science-related behavior."
    
    Call him an asshole all you want. The emails are evidence of that. But that does not lead to support for your declarations yesterday that the science was irreparably damaged by this behavior.
    
    Remember, McIntrye got his papers published. He continues to have a voice in the debate. The real discussion happens in the journals.
    1. John 13 years ago
      
      Yes it was. And I love how you have retreated from defending Mann. You certainly were not doing that when the first emails broke two years ago.
      
      Specifically, the emails show the team was very aware that the warming of the troposphere above the tropics was not occurring as predicted in the models. This has been called the distinct human fingerprint. Ben Santer, et al, have attempted to cover up this disparity by expanding the error bounds of measurements, but their study is vague, at best. On November 14, 2011 Ben Santer participated in a public briefing of Representatives Ed Markey and Harry Waxman. Santer specifically discussed human fingerprints in global warming but failed to discuss the disparity between models and measurements over the tropics. Apparently, at least some members of the team cannot be relied upon to accurately present the state of the science to members of Congress.
      
      http://www.powerlineblog.com/a.....ate-ii.php
      
      Or listen to these interesting bits posted by McIntyre
      
      From Ross:
      0435.txt, between Briffa and Cook. It's Sept 2003, just weeks before MM2003 appeared.
      
      Without trying to prejudice this work, but also because of what I almost think I know to be the case, the results of this study will show that we can probably say a fair bit about 100 year variability was like with any certainty (i.e. we know with certainty that we know fuck-all). Of course, none of what I have proposed has addressed the issue of seasonality of response. So what I am suggesting is strictly an empirical comparison of published 1000 year NH reconstructions because many of the same tree-ring proxies get used in both seasonal and annual recons anyway. So all I care about is how the recons differ and
      where they differ most in frequency and time without any direct consideration of their TRUE association with observed temperatures.
      
      And I like this bit
      I am afraid the Mike and Phil are too personally invested in things now (i.e. the 2003 GRL paper that is probably the worst paper Phil has ever been involved in
      ? Bradley hates it as well), but I am willing to offer to include them if they can contribute without just defending their past work ? this is the key to having anyone involved.
      
      And this from Briffa to Cook
      You know I desperately want to produce a new temperature reconstruction from the various tree-ring data (and explore the Mann western US PC correction ? though Malcolm has ignored my request for the data) .
      
      Notice that: Briffa couldn't get MBH98 data either, yet Mann would soon claim is was all publicly available
      
      http://climateaudit.org/2011/1.....certainty/
      
      Time and time again, they admit in the e-mails that the science is bad and they don't know what is going on. And time and time again they plot ways to lie and distort what they know to be the truth.
      
      Yeah, the science isn't what it is claim to be and is deeply damaged by these emails. What else have they lied about? And what other checking and good work has either not been done or suppressed?
      1. Neu Mejican 13 years ago
        
        Is this a way for you, John, to defend yourself against an allegation that you are just repeating what you've read about the implications? Really?
        
        And I love how you have retreated from defending Mann. You certainly were not doing that when the first emails broke two years ago.
        
        I don't recall "defending Mann" although I do recall thinking the initial furor over the emails was overhyped and that they would end up showing no scientific misconduct. Which, it seems, is about where it came out.
        
        they admit in the e-mails that the science is bad
        
        That is not what these emails say.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        How can you say that is not what the emails say when I put several emails where they are doing just that?
        
        You know I desperately want to produce a new temperature reconstruction from the various tree-ring data (and explore the Mann western US PC correction ? though Malcolm has ignored my request for the data) .
        
        Notice that: Briffa couldn't get MBH98 data either, yet Mann would soon claim is was all publicly available
        
        And
        
        the emails show the team was very aware that the warming of the troposphere above the tropics was not occurring as predicted in the models. This has been called the distinct human fingerprint. Ben Santer, et al, have attempted to cover up this disparity by expanding the error bounds of measurements, but their study is vague, at best.
        
        That is scientific misconduct. Lying to Congress is scientific misconduct.
        
        And just what is your position here? If there is no scientific misconduct, why do you admit Mann and company are assholes? When confronted with Mann and company's misconduct, you admit they are "assholes" but then say but there was no misconduct. Really?
        
        Neu Mejican 13 years ago
        
        [sigh]...and it continues.
        Off to work.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        In other words NM, you have no answers. And you just sigh and act smug and pretend the obvious does not exist.
        
        mad libertarian guy 13 years ago
        
        It's because you're a 'DENIER', John. It's the new tactic of the left. If you disagree with a premise held by liberalism, or argue that there may be flaws which have led to that wisdom, it's not because you could be right, but because you're a buffoon who simply refuses to see reason.
        
        Neu Mejican 13 years ago
        
        It's the new oldest tactic of the left partisan. If you disagree with a premise held by liberalism someone, or argue that there may be flaws which have led to that wisdom, it's not because you could be right, but because you're a buffoon who simply refuses to see reason.
        
        That is not, by the way, what I am arguing. I am arguing that John hasn't put together an argument. He is just repeating portions of accusations made by others that he doesn't know the context for or implications of.
        
        DesigNate 13 years ago
        
        I may be wrong, but it appears that John has posted the actual text from some of these emails. How exactly is that repeating accusations? You don't have to accuse anyone of anything when they fucking admit it out of hand.
        
        Neu Mejican 13 years ago
        
        DesigNate,
        
        John has copied and pasted a discussion from a blog that includes excerpts. The accusations come from the original text.
        
        See "Notice that: Briffa couldn't get MBH98 data either, yet Mann would soon claim is was all publicly available" & "the emails show the team was very aware that the warming of the troposphere above the tropics was not occurring as predicted in the models. This has been called the distinct human fingerprint. Ben Santer, et al, have attempted to cover up this disparity by expanding the error bounds of measurements, but their study is vague, at best."
        
        Gimlet 13 years ago
        
        "And you just sigh and act smug"
        
        Well, when Al Gore is your god...
        
        Neu Mejican 13 years ago
        
        Or I was headed off to work.
        
        Ben Santer, et al, have attempted to cover up this disparity by expanding the error bounds of measurements, but their study is vague, at best.
        
        So, John, explain how "expanding the error bounds of measurement" hides the data. How was it done specifically in Santer's study (which study by the way...title, date would be helpful).
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        They hide the data by not producing the underlying data the were using to create the measurement.
        
        Whatever NM> Rarely do I claim scoreboard. But I will now. No one believes this shit anymore. And it is not going to drive policy any time soon.
        
        So believe what you want. It is a free country. Just stop pretending it is relevant anymore.
        
        Neu Mejican 13 years ago
        
        John,
        
        They hide the data by not producing the underlying data the were using to create the measurement.
        
        This response is off topic. You brought a specific accusation into the discussion. It has to do with Santer "hiding data" by "expanding the error bounds of measurement." That has nothing to do with "not producing the underlying data the(y) were using to create the measurement."
        
        If you are going to repeat others accusations, at least read them and understand what they are accusing someone of. There isn't a bit THEY doing these things. Climate science is done by many different groups of scientists, some of whom don't like each other mucn.
        
        Neu Mejican 13 years ago
        
        Rarely do I claim scoreboard.
        
        This discussion started with you "claiming scoreboard." Reasserting your claim doesn't validate it.
        
        Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
        
        Does MNG know about this thing John and Neu got goin' on?
        
        Anonymous Coward 13 years ago
        
        Eating isn't cheating.
    2. John 13 years ago
      
      but "you are questioning the science based on non-science-related behavior."
      
      I would say lying about data and actively trying to suppress dissent is very much "science related behavior".
      1. Restoras 13 years ago
        
        They aren't real scientists. Real scientists challenge other scientists to replicate and or disprove their findings, no?
        
        Neu Mejican 13 years ago
        
        Restoras,
        
        Indeed. That would be a true scotsman test of real scientists...at least the Platonic ideal of a scientist. Lots of scientists fall short of that ideal...lots of them. More to the point, the way to show that their science is "bad" is not to point to their emails, but to conduct a study and show that their results are shit.
        
        McIntrye gave it a good shot when he took issue with the analysis in Mann's 1998 paper. But that is hardly a death blow in the context of a scientific debate based on hundreds or thousands of research papers. Particularly when the attack is on a paper that's main conclusion is that there is a lot of "uncertainty" in the reconstructed temperature record. McIntrye, essentially identified an additional source of uncertainty that Mann missed in his discussion of the uncertainty.
        
        Subsequent studies have reduced that uncertainty a bit.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        If there is no certainty in the temperature record, there is no way to know if the current warming, such as it is is out of the ordinary. Game set match.
        
        That is why they refused to turn over the data. They knew the uncertainty was their doom.
        
        That is why
        
        Neu Mejican 13 years ago
        
        If there is no certainty in the temperature record, there is no way to know if the current warming, such as it is is out of the ordinary. Game set match.
        
        uncertainty = no certainty?
        Okay. A devastating argument, scientifically.
        
        John, you have them. Put together your paper that argues this and you can change the field with a single stroke. I would suggest starting with Nature, but there are other options if you can't get it through their corrupted peer review process.
      2. Neu Mejican 13 years ago
        
        I would say lying about data and actively trying to suppress dissent is very much "science related behavior".
        
        If they lied about the data in a published research report, sure. Do you have evidence of that?
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        Read what I just posted. They knew the data went against their models and they tried to hide data and then lied about it to Congress.
        
        Neu Mejican 13 years ago
        
        What you just posted is a quote from someone accusing them of hiding data...not evidence that they tried to hide data in a scientific paper.
        
        Do you not see the difference?
        
        Do you not see that you are just repeating what someone else tells you is true because it fits your preconceptions?
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        "What you just posted is a quote from someone accusing them of hiding data...not evidence that they tried to hide data in a scientific paper."
        
        That is funny. They published the papers and then hide the data underlying that work so no one could check their work.
        
        I am not repeating. I am reading the damned emails. They say what they say.
        
        Neu Mejican 13 years ago
        
        They published the papers and then hide the data underlying that work so no one could check their work.
        
        That is inaccurate.
        
        mad libertarian guy 13 years ago
        
        Yes.
        
        And it's ONE OF THEIR OWN who is accusing the AGW zealots of the "science" community as being disingenuous with the data.
        
        But today The Mail on Sunday can reveal that a leading member of Prof Muller's team has accused him of trying to mislead the public by hiding the fact that BEST's research shows global warming has stopped.
        Prof Judith Curry, who chairs the Department of Earth and Atmospheric Sciences at America's prestigious Georgia Institute of Technology, said that Prof Muller's claim that he has proven global warming sceptics wrong was also a 'huge mistake', with no scientific basis.
        Prof Curry is a distinguished climate researcher with more than 30 years experience and the second named co-author of the BEST project's four research papers.
        
        Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sci.....z1f6xm8vFj
        
        [. . .]
        
        Prof Muller also wrote an article for the Wall Street Journal. It was here, under the headline 'The case against global warming scepticism', that he proclaimed 'there were good reasons for doubt until now'.
        
        Media storm: Prof Muller's claims received uncritical coverage in the media this week
        This, too, went around the world, with The Economist, among many others, stating there was now 'little room for doubt'.
        
        Such claims left Prof Curry horrified.
        
        'Of course this isn't the end of scepticism,' she said. 'To say that is the biggest mistake he [Prof Muller] has made. When I saw he was saying that I just thought, "Oh my God".'
        
        In fact, she added, in the wake of the unexpected global warming standstill, many climate scientists who had previously rejected sceptics' arguments were now taking them much more seriously.
        
        They were finally addressing questions such as the influence of clouds, natural temperature cycles and solar radiation ? as they should have done, she said, a long time ago.
        
        Neu Mejican 13 years ago
        
        You see, of course, that this is evidence that goes against John's argument. Right?
        
        Muller got very quick criticism for hyperbolic statements to the press about his study. It will be interesting to see how they fare in peer review.
        
        Another interesting, non-scientific, aspect of this story is the reaction on skeptic blogs to Muller's press-releases on the subject. But, as with the discussion of the emails, those, for the most part, are irrelevant to whether or not the study has merit.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        So let me get this straight, Miller lies and a lone assistant comes forward and calls him on it. Miller has yet to repudiate his lying or face sanction for it. And the paper as yet has not been withdrawn.
        
        And this is proof the system works?
        
        Neu Mejican 13 years ago
        
        John,
        
        Muller made hyperbolic statements to the press about a paper that is currently in peer review. The system is still in the process of evaluating the scientific merit of the study.
        
        There is, also, a difference between what he says to the press and what the study says. His study can be perfectly good science...and he can still oversell it to the press. One is a scientific question, the other gets into professional ethics. Muller, btw, is not part of the crowd you are complaining about. He is a physicist that set out to disprove the CRU crowd using an independent study.
    3. My Myself and I 13 years ago
      
      How is it that people who favor big govt programs to stop "climate change" are qualified to judge the science accurate regardless of their own qualifications?
rather 13 years ago

The new defense: I'm a redneck, officer
1. Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
  
  Why didn't he just tell the deputy that he is on private property?
Lord Humungus 13 years ago

Obama Abandons the Working Class
http://online.wsj.com/article/.....42360.html

Indeed, though Mr. Obama would go on to win Pennsylvania that November, he would still lose its white working class to Republican John McCain.

There's a message here for Republicans for 2012. Ironically, it may have been outlined best by two Democratic strategists in a publication for the left-leaning Center for American Progress. In "The Path to 270: Demographics versus Economics in the 2012 Presidential Election," Ruy Teixeira and John Halpin made headlines for making official what everyone has known unofficially for some time: The Democratic Party is abandoning the white working class.

this is probably news to most of my 'working-class' friends, who are still largely stalwart Dems.
Lord Humungus 13 years ago

States face bleak economic forecast, report says
http://www.washingtonpost.com/.....story.html

States are caught in a fiscal vise as weak economic growth, dwindling federal help and increasing appeals from hard-pressed local governments squeeze their budgets.

Things have improved since the worst of the recession, but states still face a dire fiscal situation, according to a report to be released Tuesday by the National Governors Association (NGA) and the National Association of State Budget Officers (NASBO).
1. Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
  
  Maybe they could go to their police, fire and other govt employee unions and ask them to help. That's where all the shortfalls are coming from.
Fist of Etiquette 13 years ago

Deadlines for Wall Street protesters to leave their encampments came and went in two cities with no arrests in Philadelphia and a festive, party-like atmosphere as protesters in Los Angeles defied the order clear out early Monday.

Lenin and Trotsky had a party when Nicholas II failed to follow through on his threat to evict them before October, and we all know what happened next.
1. T 13 years ago
  
  They got evicted after the party caused all the neighbors in a 3 block radius to complain?
  
  Or is this one of those situations where I shouldn't generalize from my own experience?
2. Lost_In_Translation 13 years ago
  
  Deadlines for Wall Street protesters to leave their encampments came and went in two cities with no arrests in Philadelphia and a festive, party-like atmosphere as protesters in Los Angeles defied the order clear out early Monday.
  
  Was there Latin dancing, because no one can resist a good ass shaking.
  1. Fist of Etiquette 13 years ago
    
    NO LAMBADA!
    1. Worried Stapler 13 years ago
      
      it is forbidden.
Lord Humungus 13 years ago

The supercommittee's 13th member: Occupy Wall Street
http://www.washingtonpost.com/.....story.html

Sen. John Kerry recently declared that Grover Norquist, author of the GOP anti-tax pledge, was "the 13th member of our [super] committee" whose supposedly magical hold on Republicans killed any chance of a bipartisan debt-reduction compromise. Kerry is right that there was a mysterious 13th member at the table who caused the supercommittee to fail. But it wasn't Norquist. It was Occupy Wall Street.

Norquist's pledge demands that Republicans oppose any and all tax increases. Occupy Wall Street demands that Democrats impose massive tax increases on the wealthiest 1 percent of the country. So which of these competing demands held sway in the supercommittee's deliberations?
1. Ice Nine 13 years ago
  
  declared that Grover Norquist, author of the GOP anti-tax pledge, was "the 13th member of our [super] committee" whose supposedly magical hold on Republicans
  
  Well, at least it is a relief to learn that those evil Koch puppeteers are being supplanted.
2. DesigNate 13 years ago
  
  Kerry can suck a diseased cock since the Republicans put two plans up with tax increases in them. Just cause they weren't as high as the Dem half of the "supercommittee" wanted doesn't mean they didn't offer up anything.
Lord Humungus 13 years ago

Stalin's daughter Lana Peters dies at 85

Upon her arrival in New York City in 1967, the 41-year-old said: "I have come here to seek the self-expression that has been denied me for so long in Russia." She said she had come to doubt the communism she was taught growing up and believed there weren't capitalists or communists, just good and bad human beings. She had also found religion and believed "it was impossible to exist without God in one's heart."

In the book, she recalled her father, who died in 1953 after ruling the nation for 29 years, as a distant and paranoid man.
1. John 13 years ago
  
  Must been hard being the daughter of one of history's greatest monsters.
  1. Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
    
    Don't bring Warty's kid into this.
  2. Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
    
    Imagine how Amy Carter feels.
2. PS 13 years ago
  
  SF'd the link.
  1. Lord Humungus 13 years ago
    
    http://www.google.com/hostedne.....34fae49dd5
    1. PS 13 years ago
      
      Somehow appropriate she dies in Madison...
      1. Lord Humungus 13 years ago
        
        http://www.nationalreview.com/.....iel-foster
        
        "Ms. Peters became a United States citizen in 1978 and later told The Trenton Times that she had registered as a Republican and donated $500 to the conservative magazine National Review, saying it was her favorite publication."
        
        weird.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        She didn't have any illusions about communism and socialism. Man I bet she disappointed more than a few lefty fan boys who sought her out to hear tales of the dear leader.
        
        Lost_In_Translation 13 years ago
        
        Her face didn't make it onto any T-shirts I'm aware of.
        
        Elspeth Flashman 13 years ago
        
        +1.
        
        Restoras 13 years ago
        
        I did a masters degree at a NYC school and had a few immigrant and first-generation Russian classmates. They virulently despised the Democratic Party. I guess they had seen/heard first hand enough about socialism.
        
        Neu Mejican 13 years ago
        
        She didn't have any illusions about communism and socialism. Man I bet she disappointed more than a few lefty fan boys who sought her out to hear tales of the dear leader.
        
        I have not met a lefty fan boy of Stalin. Have you?
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        I have. There were several in the history department at my university. In the late 80s they were still claiming that Stalin only killed a few thousand people. No kidding.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        I have. There were several in the history department at my university. In the late 80s they were still claiming that Stalin only killed a few thousand people. No kidding.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        And there were plenty of lefty fan boys of Stalin in the late 1960s. Remember the Gulag Archipelago wasn't published in the west until the early 70s. And not many people knew of the secret 1956 Khrushchev speech.
        
        Neu Mejican 13 years ago
        
        How old were you in the late 60's John?
        If there were plenty I didn't notice as a 4 year old, so I would have to take your word for that. Something I an reticent to do given your track record.
        
        Red Rocks Rockin 13 years ago
        
        I have not met a lefty fan boy of Stalin. Have you?
        
        I actually did in grad school--one of my fellow TAs was a card-carrying Communist who had an excuse for everything Stalin did. I got to hear quite a bit about "bourgeois democracy" from him as well.
        
        Oddly enough, he wasn't even the most eccentric person in the TA cadre--one of the women I entered the program with ended up transferring to Wisconsin after the first year, supposedly because Arizona State was left-wing enough for her tastes.
        
        The Commie was honestly an exception, though--most academics I've met tend to be embarrassed by Stalin because he embodies 20th century communism the way lefties enjoy caricaturing their bete noir du jour.
        
        Red Rocks Rockin 13 years ago
        
        Correction, ASU wasn't left wing enough for her tastes.
        
        PS 13 years ago
        
        Ah, no wonder she dropped off the MM radar.
John 13 years ago

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sci.....ntist.html

A group of scientists is pushing to publish research about how they created a man-made flu virus that could potentially wipe out civilisation.

The deadly virus is a genetically tweaked version of the H5N1 bird flu strain, but is far more infectious and could pass easily between millions of people at a time.

The research has caused a storm of controversy and divided scientists, with some saying it should never have been carried out.

Doesn't this mean we are all doomed? If these guys can do it someone else can. And as technology advances, there will be more and more people able to do such a thing. Given that, isn't it just a matter of time before some religious nut or genocidal environmentalist releases such a thing on the world?
1. Jerry 13 years ago
  
  What would prevent said religious nut or genocidal environmentalist from using anthrax, which is readily available and much cheaper?
  1. John 13 years ago
    
    But not as effective. Anthrax would kill tens of thousands maybe a few hundred thousands and be confined to one area. It is not contagious. This stuff would kill billions.
    1. Jerry 13 years ago
      
      I doubt they could engineer something that is and contagious and lethal.
      1. John 13 years ago
        
        According the the article someone has.
        
        Lost_In_Translation 13 years ago
        
        Artices are always correct. I bet the research was peer reviewed too.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        Any paper that publishes pictures of Charlieze Theron falling out of her dress is a good source.
        
        http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvs.....navel.html
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        Patton Oswalt is a CHUD.
        
        Fist of Etiquette 13 years ago
        
        It's always the African-Americans with the wardrobe malfunctions.
        
        Apple 13 years ago
        
        Heh
        
        Restoras 13 years ago
        
        Huh...
        David Bowie + Kurt Loder = Tilda Swinton?
        
        Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
        
        Patton has a new gig:
        
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v.....sults_main
    2. Lost_In_Translation 13 years ago
      
      a flu that infects billions would probably mutate to a more benign state before it would destroy humanity. Even the black plague didn't wipe out Europe.
      1. gaijin 13 years ago
        
        yes, but who can say that it wouldn't mutate to create zombies?
  2. Ice Nine 13 years ago
    
    What would prevent said religious nut or genocidal environmentalist from using anthrax,
    
    I believe they are talking about a slate wiper - not bush league stuff like anthrax and plague.
  3. Gimlet 13 years ago
    
    "And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth."
2. Lost_In_Translation 13 years ago
  
  Its just hype. They're just trying to prevent their research grants from being wiped out.
  
  Probably couldn't kill and elderly man on dialysis
  1. John 13 years ago
    
    Lets hope so.
3. Joe M 13 years ago
  
  Dude, it the fucking Daily Mail. It's a joke of a news source, and is really only useful for celebrity gossip, as sarcasmic has demonstrated on a daily basis.
  1. Proprietist 13 years ago
    
    It's half tabloid, but the news half is generally a lot more comprehensive than most mainstream publications over here.
4. PS 13 years ago
  
  I'm pretty skeptical that such a thing could be done, especially at today's level of technology. Also, highly virulent germs tend to mutate into much less virulent versions through natural selection. Then there's the difficulty of combining virulance with contagion.
  
  If you look at the evolution of computer viruses one sees something similar. Where's the evil computer virus that's going to take down 3/4 of the planet's computers?
  
  Meh, next fake apocalypse...
5. Red Rocks Rockin 13 years ago
  
  I won't be too worried unless some guy named Randall Flagg starts appearing in the papers.
  1. Worried Stapler 13 years ago
    
    nice one.
Lord Humungus 13 years ago

completely OT:
Peter Murphy's latest album isn't half-bad, if you like that kind of gothic thing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5lnq9Add25M

and I've been playing with this Chinese-made tube amplifier:
http://6streetbridge.blogspot......ifier.html
1. John 13 years ago
  
  I have been listening to the bootleg of the Last Waltz. I didn't know this but the movie and the sound track are, sans the vocals and drums, completely over dubbed and essentially studio sound tracks. The bootleg sounds totally different and better I think. Less full but more raw and real. Also, Scorsese cut out a bunch of great shit. How it is that he thought Neil Diamond was worth keeping but Muddy Waters doing Caledonia was not is one of the great WTFs of all time.
  1. Lord Humungus 13 years ago
    
    hmm... gotta check that out. The Last Waltz has some really great tracks, though Neil Young looks a little jealous of Dylan - or perhaps that was just my imagination. I always though the music seemed a mite too clean for a live performance.
    1. John 13 years ago
      
      It is on the web at a place called Wolfgang's vault as a stream. It is also available for free download in several places. Just do a google search and you will find it. You can tell it is the bootleg because it has songs like WC Walcott's Medicine Show and Tura Lura Lura, Caedonia, among others.
      
      It is a great record. They have always been one of my favorite bands.
      1. Apple 13 years ago
        
        Levon Helm always said the stuff they cut out was the best. He's pretty bitter about Scorsese and Robertson cutting out all but one Richard Manuel performance and isn't a fan of the movie from what I remember.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        He hates the movie. And until I read his book, I didn't understand why. If you watch the movie, it makes it look like Robertson is singing. He wasn't. They unplugged his microphone during performances because his singing would mess up their harmonies. But if you watch the movie you don't know that. Go on youtube and watch "It Makes No Difference" sometime. There is this shot from the side of the stage showing Robertson, Helm, and Danko singing the chorus. If you didn't know better you would think it was the three of them singing the harmony. Indeed, for years, having only seen the movie and not knowing much about the actual band, thought that. But Robertson had nothing to do with the harmony. You are watching Robertson sing, but hearing Manuel, Helm and Danko. It is a total fraud.
        
        Time and time again, the movie makes it look like Robertson is leading the band, when he wasn't the onstage leader at all. It is no wonder the rest of the Band hated the movie.
  2. Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
    
    Song Sung Blue FTW, bitch!
    1. Lord Humungus 13 years ago
      
      ...weeping like a willow...
      
      Thanks to my mom and the wonderful 1970s, Neil Diamond is part of my genetic code.... *CURSES*
      1. rac3rx 13 years ago
        
        Oh, me too...me too.
    2. John 13 years ago
      
      The funny thing is that he has absolutely no connection to The Band. He only got included because Robbie Robertson had produced his last record and wanted to promote it. The rest of the band and other performers were like "why is he here". Allegedly he walked off stage after doing "Dry Your Eyes" and looked at Bob Dylan and said "top that". And Dylan responded "how, by falling asleep on stage?"
      
      The Diamond just gets no respect.
      1. Red Rocks Rockin 13 years ago
        
        The Diamond just gets no respect.
        
        According to La Wik, he's the first-ever winner of the Worst Actor Razzie for The Jazz Singer (a really awful movie, to be certain).
      2. Apple 13 years ago
        
        Thank god he hadn't just produced an Andy Kim record.
  3. Mike Laursen 13 years ago
    
    LLND -- Ladies love Neil Diamond.
2. Neu Mejican 13 years ago
  
  Would be good to hear Peter back in form. He hasn't done anything good in a long while.
  1. SugarFree 13 years ago
    
    Murphy is a victim of the Westerberg/Morrisey curse... it was the band mates they hated that made them great. Frission... how does it fucking work?
    1. rac3rx 13 years ago
      
      That's pretty odd, since the Smiths broke up in '87 and Morrissey's produced 9 solo albums since. Where is Johnny Marr exactly?
      1. Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        Where is Johnny Marr exactly?
        
        Maintaining his dignity.
        
        T 13 years ago
        
        By collaborating with Liam Gallagher? That's dignified?
        
        Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        I refuse to believe that without a link.
      2. Apple 13 years ago
        
        He's still a great sideman. I liked him in Modest Mouse. Not a fan of his solo stuff.
      3. SugarFree 13 years ago
        
        Morrisey is not much without Marr behind him. It's nine albums of what could have been.
    2. T 13 years ago
      
      Morrissey has done okay since leaving the Smiths. He never quite reaches the heights he did with Johnny Marr, but his solo work is solid if you're into depressed Brits wailing about how much life sucks.
      
      Which my wife obviously is, since we have all of Morrissey's solo albums.
    3. Apple 13 years ago
      
      I thought Your Arsenal was awesome.
    4. Don Dokken/George Lynch 13 years ago
      
      Murphy is a victim of the Westerberg/Morrisey curse... it was the band mates they hated that made them great.
      
      Tell us about it.
PantsFan 13 years ago

Health Care in Canada: Not free enough

"This is parking-centred health care, which is not compatible with patient-centred health."
1. Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
  
  Jesus, you deserve at least one comment for that link, PantsFan.
  
  I hope you get it.
PS 13 years ago

"Germany has been told that if it does not act to save Europe, all hell will break loose."

Told by a Polish statist fuck.

Sikorski is a member of the Civic Platform party:

The Civic Platform combines liberal conservative stances on the economy with conservative stances on social and ethical issues, including opposition to abortion, same-sex marriage, soft drug decriminalisation, euthanasia, fetal stem cell research, and partially to wide availability of in vitro fertilisation. On the other hand, there is growing centrist "faction" favoring progressive modernisation of country, social justice, social tolerance (especially civil pacts of solidarity), a social market economy, Flexicurity and environmental sustainability. The party also wants to criminalise gambling.

Wow, a member of a party that combines the worst statist impulses of the left and right, that's whose opinion I value.
1. Restoras 13 years ago
  
  Funny, if all hell breaks loose I doubt it will find its way into Germany.
P Brooks 13 years ago

states still face a dire fiscal situation

Just as long as the federal government provides a massive infusion of federal cash to preserve vital services like twitter monitors, civilization might manage to survive.
1. John 13 years ago
  
  Rest assured the useful services will be the first to go. Better to shake down the tax payers that way.
Joe M 13 years ago

Ron Paul's Phony Populism

A Ron Paul America would make the Reagan Revolution look like the New Deal.

He says that like it's a bad thing.
1. robc 13 years ago
  
  Exactly...that is why the Reagan Revolution was an abandonment of the Goldwater movement.
2. Jerry 13 years ago
  
  The guy has an Ayn Rand book to promote, that's for sure.
  1. Joe M 13 years ago
    
    Haha, yeah, I noticed that too.
3. Anonymous Coward 13 years ago
  
  NEWSLETTERS! BIRCHERS!
  
  GeorgeSalt
  Tuesday, November 29, 2011 at 7:0059 am
  
  Honest is not a word I would use to describe a huckster who published a racist newsletter for several years, and then:
  
  -- in 1996, defended those newsletters, claiming that they expressed his "philosophical differences" with Democrats and had been "taken out of context."
  
  -- in 2001, blamed them on an unnamed ghostwriter (most likely his longtime associate, Lew Rockwell)
  
  -- in 2008, denied any knowledge of those newsletters
  
  But please, vigorously deny all of this, and well as Ron Paul's longstanding ties to the John Birch Society. That will demonstrate how utterly tendentious your phony-baloney, warmed-over Bircher movement really is.
Ice Nine 13 years ago

Chris Matthews: "And Mrs. Obama, she's an amazing asset. And what has she done? Obesity? How about connecting with the American people about being Americans?"

Yeah, that's it, Chris; that proud American would of course be the go-to gal for that.
1. John 13 years ago
  
  What you don't think "listen you stupid racist mean spirited yahoos, make me proud for once and vote for my husband", wouldn't be appealing?
  
  Amazing asset? To whom? I don't know anyone not already in the tank for Obama who can stand that woman.
2. PS 13 years ago
  
  Talking about Michelle Obama, obesity and assets in three consecutive sentences is really too much.
  1. John 13 years ago
    
    Sir Mixalot's favorite first lady.
    1. Ice Nine 13 years ago
      
      A simple color photo of him would have sufficed to make that obvious.
3. Chloe 13 years ago
  
  But, but...She has such excellent fashion taste.
  1. Restoras 13 years ago
    
    And fabulously toned arms!
  2. rac3rx 13 years ago
    
    ...if that "snatched it off the rack at Goodwill and wore it dirty" look is your thing...
    1. Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
      
      And she's always so happy!
Fartriloquist 13 years ago

Testing my access.
P Brooks 13 years ago

Speaking of vital yet dangerously underappreciated government services, I was watching the women's GS from Aspen the other day, and a commercial came on (Funded by/ piggybacked on Nature Valley Granola Bars) about how we absolutely positively need to SAVE OUR NATIONAL PARKS!!!!!11 Apparently the parks are being turned over to the 1% for their exclusive private amusement (like, you know... SOMALIAAAAAAA), and nobody told me.

Libertarians: looming large, as usual.
1. Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
  
  Was this is regards to Yellowstone/GoDaddy National Park or to the Meineke Car Care Monument of Washington?
  1. Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
    
    What a genius idea.
    
    New contest: invent a clever corporate sponsorship of a major national landmark.
    
    "The KY Jelly Grand Canyon: Protecting Dry Gashes Since 2011"
    1. Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
      
      Nice.
  2. Jack the Reaper 13 years ago
    
    Cialis Washington Monument? It may be old, but it is still standing strong!
Lord Humungus 13 years ago

"Should I Tell My Roommate How I Feel About Her?"
http://dearwendy.com/columns/s.....about-her/

I've been living with my roommate for the past year and a half and so far I couldn't find a better roommate. We just moved out of a group home and in to a 2-bedroom apartment a few months ago. For the past 6 to 8 months I've became very attracted to her and now that we're living together I have grown to develop feelings to the point where I think about her all the time. We have a great relationship and chemistry. We IM constantly about random things and if we're not IMing, we're texting. We have so many things in common and enjoy each other's company. If we're home watching TV we have a great time; if we go out we have a great time.
1. Pizza Delivery Guy 13 years ago
  
  Dear Penthouse,
  
  I never thought this would happen to me, but I delivered extra sausage to a couple of roommates the other day...
  1. Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
    
    Is that you again, Herman?
    1. Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
      
      *ding dong*
      
      Godfather's Pizza!
2. Devil's Advocate 13 years ago
  
  Answer: Shitting where you live is always a bad idea. In addition, she's treating you as if you are her BFF girlfriend. If you want a relationship with this woman, move out and do whatever it is you want to do. I recommend not making yourself available at all times.
  
  Next!
3. DesigNate 13 years ago
  
  I was actually in a similar situation my senior year of high school. She's just using you as her non-sexual boyfriend. You are doing all of the boring crap that her boyfriends don't want to do while they get all of the fun freaky sex. You need to move out and then tell her how you feel.
Mike M. 13 years ago

More global warming strikes portions of the south with a rare November snowstorm; accumulations reaching as much as 4-6 inches in some local areas.

Perspective: How Rare is Southern Snow in November?

Thanks to weather.com Senior Meteorologist Jon Erdman (Find him on Twitter), here are some November snow statistics:

Memphis, Tenn.

Only 3 days with an inch or more of snow in November since 1875.
Last November inch or more snowfall was 1.2 inches on November 14, 1976.
Snowiest November day: 4.9 inches on November 22, 1929

Tupelo, Miss.

Only 3 days with measurable snow (0.1 inches or more) in November since 1930.
Last November measurable snow: November 7, 1991.
Snowiest November day: 1.5 inches on November 24, 1938.
1. Lost_In_Translation 13 years ago
  
  End of days, fo sho
  1. Polar Vortex Collapse from AGW 13 years ago
    
    It's a puzzle: How could warmth in the Arctic produce frigid conditions elsewhere?
    
    Warm Arctic, Cold Continents
    Changes in the Arctic Are Hitting Closer to Home
    http://www.noaa.gov/features/02_monit.....rctic.html
    
    Warm Arctic - Cold Continents
    The Polar Vortex
    http://www.arctic.noaa.gov/future/war.....inent.html
    1. Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
      
      It woulda been worse! IT WOULDA BEEN WORSE!
      Oh, wait. That's stimulus. Never mind.
      1. MNG 13 years ago
        
        It's rich to see a libertarian mock that kind of thinking. How often have I seen people hear say that X negative economic event following libertarian policy Y happened "DESPITE" Y, but every good event following Y happened BECAUSE of it...
        
        Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
        
        Godlike, I tells ya.
        
        Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
        
        And you should always take "hear say" evidence with a grain of salt.
    2. Mike M. 13 years ago
      
      The only vortex going on is your guys' endlessly swirling vortex of bullcrap.
      
      Here's the bullshit you guys were throwing out ten years ago: "Snowfalls are now just a thing of the past."
      1. # 13 years ago
        
        yeah exactly.
        
        One can certainly imagine a case where higher global temps cause more snow in certain areas. But all the claims now of this are post facto rationalizations of observations over the past few years.
        
        Prior to 3 or 4 years ago when we started getting a bunch of snowy winters everything we heard was how snow would be coming to an end. North America was supposed to become dryer and warmer.
        
        Now that their predictions have not panned out, or at least not yet, they then come back and say what we really meant was more snow.
        
        There litterally is no climate behavior that can happen that cant be attributed to climate change.
        
        Once these guys start making predications that start coming out true I'll start having mroe confidence in them.
    3. Lord Humungus 13 years ago
      
      forever swirling and twirling
    4. Bones 13 years ago
      
      OK, so how does a shift in where temperature is high or low make the planet warmer? Isn't it just shifting, not actually warming? And let's say that's all that's happening. I look forward to owning water front property without moving!
2. Ice Nine 13 years ago
  
  Al Gore must be at home.
  1. Polar Vortex Collapse from AGW 13 years ago
    
    Libertards are fucking stupid on science. Check out the NOAA articles above on why an overheating arctic makes it colder here.
    1. Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
      
      Polar Vortex would be a great name for a band.
      1. Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        Monocle Makers popped into my head last night.
        
        Ice Nine 13 years ago
        
        Monocle Makers Popped Into My Head would be a great name for a band.
        
        Proprietist 13 years ago
        
        60s psych track.
        
        Hank 13 years ago
        
        Monocle Makers Local 862
    2. Polar Vortex Collapse from AGW 13 years ago
      
      And we can all just forget we were saying 10 years ago snow would be a thing of the past, so we obviously either didn't know about polar vortex or we are just making shit up on the fly to try to salvage our bullshit agenda [DERP]
    3. Polar Vortex Collapse from AGW 13 years ago
      
      Libertards are fucking stupid on science.
      
      Just because we say something completely different in the course of a decade doesn't mean we're ever wrong herpity derpity doo!
    4. Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
      
      Just can't resist posting "polar vortex" shit, eh, Jason?
3. Timon19 13 years ago
  
  And here in NE Ohio (Akron, anyway), we have yet to have any measurable snow. Hell, we've barely seen a snowflake...yet.
  
  Tomorrow is a different day, however.
4. mad libertarian guy 13 years ago
  
  "But it's a sign of WEATHER EXTREMES!!!" they'll say.
  
  But what this information says to me is that this exact kind of weather extreme was happening BEFORE global warming.
Abdul 13 years ago

UK bans "high fashion concept" ad of girl sitting on train tracks because it "suggests" teen suicide.
http://www.eonline.com/news/ha....._in/277045
1. Joe M 13 years ago
  
  UK continues its plunge into the abyss unabated.
2. T 13 years ago
  
  I was watching VH1 Pop Up Video the other day. They were playing some innocuous vapid teen song with snarky commentary, but completely blanking out one line. The wife checked the web and the line they balnk out is how the girl will make you feel like suicide.
  
  It ain't just the brits. Apparently the wimpification of the world is progressing so far that we can't even hear words about distasteful concepts.
  
  I'm thinking anybody who would be driven to suicide from a pop song needs to go to help cleanse the gene pool, but I'm hard like that.
  1. Joe M 13 years ago
    
    I caught the end of a Donald Glover stand-up routine on Comedy Central about a week ago. They censored the word "penis". I'm sure a detailed description of eviscerating someone wouldn't be censored, however.
    1. Kunty Kristen 13 years ago
      
      Comedy Central is one of the worst cable offenders in the realm of censorship and bleeping. The only worse one I can think of is A&E.
      1. Hank 13 years ago
        
        CC has, on multiple occasions, run Bigger, Longer, and Uncut... well, uncut.
  2. rac3rx 13 years ago
    
    VH1 also blanked out the words "gun" and "bullet" from the Foster the People song "Pumped Up Kicks". They're morons.
P Brooks 13 years ago

ad of girl sitting on train tracks

Was she tied up?
1. PS 13 years ago
  
  Dudley Do-Right banned in UK!
John 13 years ago

http://www.realclearpolitics.c.....reets.html

Cornell West "the ultimate fight for entitlements will be in the streets". It is amazing these people actually think they can just loot the country. Maybe they can, although I doubt it. But how does it not occur to them that they are going to have to do something after they loot the country and all of that money is gone?
1. Ice Nine 13 years ago
  
  Um, these aren't exactly the paragons of planning ahead, John.
2. Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
  
  See, that's not gonna cut it amongst the well-armed U.S. middle-class.
  "You folk just keep on movin'." (Chunka-chunk.)
  1. mad libertarian guy 13 years ago
    
    (Chunka-chunk)
    
    Fuck that shotgun BS. If I have to use a shotgun, it means that they've infiltrated the perimeter, and that's bad.
    
    I'm thinking more along the lines of CRACK!! from the 6.5 Grendel, hitting its target at 750 yards.
3. Restoras 13 years ago
  
  This will be the catalyst for the end of the First American Republic, and the beginning of the Second.
  1. J. Caesar 13 years ago
    
    That's what I said.
4. Polar Vortex Collapse from AGW 13 years ago
  
  It is amazing these people actually think they can just loot the country. Maybe they can, although I doubt it.
  
  If they're successful in their looting, it's because the people they come after will already be relatively docile by nature and will give it up without a fight right before the guillotines--in other words, it will be the soft middle and upper classes that get robbed. They're too scared of people who will actually defend themselves to make much of a push towards the Gun-totin' Rednecks they hate so much.
  1. T 13 years ago
    
    You'd be surprised at the extent of gun ownership in the middle and upper classes. Let's face it, shooting is a spendy kind of sport once you get out of rimfire territory. Centerfire ain't cheap to go shoot anymore.
    1. mad libertarian guy 13 years ago
      
      It is if you reload.
      
      I live in the midst of redneck country, and I can emphatically say with all certainty that rednecks, despite how destitute their situation might otherwise be, ALWAYS have a gun budget.
5. Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
  
  So... Cornell West is calling for violent uprising against the state?
  
  There's a word for that...
6. TrickyVic 13 years ago
  
  ""Cornell West "the ultimate fight for entitlements will be in the streets". ""
  
  The stupidity amazes me. Since when did independence become something not to desire?
P Brooks 13 years ago

"I think the problem is that the poor children, keep in mind it's 42% of poor children who live at or near poverty, it's 25% in poverty. Our audience needs to keep that in mind." Cornel West said on MSNBC this afternoon.

If Cornell West is an "intellectual" and a "scholar" why can't he speak in coherent sentences?
1. John 13 years ago
  
  Because he is black and learned at an early age how to tell guilty white people what they want to hear. But even that only goes so far. West is so stupid that he managed to get run out of Harvard despite being black and more than sufficiently militant and socialist. That is a pretty mean feat when you think about it.
  1. Mike M. 13 years ago
    
    At least he trusted in Neo to save the humans.
  2. Neu Mejican 13 years ago
    
    Um, what?
    1. John 13 years ago
      
      Larry Sumners, while President of Harvard, asked West to please make a few less rap records and do a little more scholarly work or find another place to teach.
      1. MNG 13 years ago
        
        I think NM is asking about the Neo thing. West was in the Matrix films NM.
        
        Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
        
        Seeing MNG explain pop-culture references to Neu on a libertarian comment board strikes me as deliciously surreal, somehow.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        CN reads the Entertainment sections of the newspaper before he delivers it.
        
        Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
        
        See -- it's like we got Oscar fuckin' Wilde in our midst.
        Speaking of Wilde, did you know he once had a long dinner with Jefferson Davis at Davis' home after the Civil War? Oh to be a fly on that wall...
        
        Restoras 13 years ago
        
        Don't forget, MNG makes more money than you. Probably.
        
        Neu Mejican 13 years ago
        
        Nope...I was questioning John's "despite being black" thing.
  3. MNG 13 years ago
    
    Harvard has quite a few non-militantly socialist profs...
    1. John 13 years ago
      
      Sure they do. But being black, a militant, and a socialist, doesn't hurt your job prospects. West really had to fuck up to get Sumners to step in.
      1. MNG 13 years ago
        
        Iirc West and several others jumped ship at the same time in protest and went to Princeton (Princeton has a rep for one of the more friendly to conservatives Ivies).
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        West also left after Sumners called him out for not teaching or writing. West is a joke. The guy really can't speak in coherent sentences. He is like some SNL version of a black academic. I actually met him once. He spoke at my undergrad. And I was the guy who picked him up at the airport. He was a very nice guy. But I never understood a single thing he said beyond small talk.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        I think he's a huckster. But in this case it's only fair to point out that he didn't leave Harvard alone, several profs were angry at Summers, and the fact that they went to the more conservative friendly Princeton is interesting.
        
        Lost_in_translation 13 years ago
        
        For some reason I kept picturing kanye west and was wondering when he taught at Harvard.
P Brooks 13 years ago

"You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows."
1. wylie 13 years ago
  
  Congress really should step in and correct that. Measuring wind strength and direction is something only trained and licensed meteorologists should be doing.
  
  In the interest of public safety I propose that congress ban any sort of looking-at/measuring the atmosphere or anything falling out of it.
P Brooks 13 years ago

Was this is regards to Yellowstone/GoDaddy National Park or to the Meineke Car Care Monument of Washington?

I'm waiting for the Pryor Mountain Wild Mustang Preserve, brought to you by ALPO.
1. Poet Laureate sloopyinca 13 years ago
  
  More like, "Brought to you by Soylent Roan."
MNG 13 years ago

Did anyone catch Cain on CNN yesterday? It was bizarre. At one point the Wolfman asked him point blank "Did you have sex with this woman" and he said "Well, I'll wait to see what I'm being specifically accused of before I answer that." WTF?

Then while he was denying the affair in such a strange way his lawyer released a statement saying this is a personal matter that no American pol should have to be asked about...

Strange, goofy stuff.
1. Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
  
  I thought strange nondenials and twisting the meaning of words was OK for Executives since Bill Clinton asked for a definition of the word "is".
  1. MNG 13 years ago
    
    I like your fallacy tu quoque, even if you did have to go back a few years for it.
    1. Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
      
      Not an argument, just an observation. I am curious, though, what your beef is. Lucky for you your Commentariat days don't go back to 1998. I bet I could find some hilarious, joe-like nondenials from you as well.
      1. MNG 13 years ago
        
        I'm not sure why you think I have a "beef" with it. I happened to catch it and thought it was bizarre to say the least. You seem a little sensitive about Cain, did he have an affair with you too?
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        Like I said, in a world where the President can talk about the temporality of his affair in order to deny that there "is" a relationship is one where weird denials about sex happen all the time.
        
        This is just you being a Useful Idiot for your Party, per the usual.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        This is funny and amazing. I criticize Cain for something in the news today and you see it as partisanship because I didn't link it to something that happened 15 years ago?
        
        WTF dude? This is your partisanship showing. A non-partisan can comment on recent news without feeling the obligation to reference something 15 years ago...
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        Not the point. Why do you find Cain's nondenials so "bizarre"? Show your work.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        You don't think it's bizarre to answer the question "did you have sex with this woman" with "I'll have to wait until I hear what she specifically says happened before I can answer that?"
        
        Dude, you are hopelessly lost in partisanship if you need "work" to demonstrate that answer as bizarre.
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        I think that Cain's answer became non-bizarre the second that Clinton did it. Like I said, if the President can perjure himself in this fashion, why not a presidential candidate?
        
        You think it's "bizarre" because Cain is a Republican. I think there is nothing bizarre about it, because this is politics in America.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        Er, I think both Clinton's and Cain's responses were bizarre. You're so hopelessly mired in partisanship you don't want to call a spade a spade when it's being held by a GOPer.
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        Not bizarre for either. There are watershed moments in politics, and Clinton's open and public affair and the fact he subsequently survived and thrived as President means that affairs are treated differently nowadays. I mean, unless you have an "R" next to your name - then it's game-on, I guess.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        What can I say, your partisan devotion in this debate has led you to actually find Clinton's existential equivocation over the word "is" to be perfectly normal, non-bizarre behavior.
        
        Sheesh.
        
        WTF 13 years ago
        
        You're so hopelessly mired in partisanship you don't want to call a spade a spade when it's being held by a GOPer.
        
        So you're calling Herman Cain a spade? Nice, MNG, real nice.
        
        rac3rx 13 years ago
        
        You beat me, WTF. I was all prepared to chime in with the "THAT'S RACIST" meme. Well played...
        
        Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
        
        Point is, MNG:
        
        Clinton got away with it.
        
        Cain likely won't.
        
        Double standard.
        
        Bonus points: Cain isn't IN elected office; Clinton was, when he had sex in the White House (and when he was governor of Arkansas, for that matter).
        
        "Take the black non-liberal political hopeful down" - that's been the mission since Cain cracked double-digits in the polls. Otherwise, these women would likely never have come forward.
2. Ice Nine 13 years ago
  
  "Did you have sex with this woman" and he said "Well, I'll wait to see what I'm being specifically accused of before I answer that." WTF?
  
  Might they be investigating the cigar vs penis issue?
MNG 13 years ago

I was at the gym yesterday and saw that MSNBC has given Al Sharpton a regular show. Wow, that's like giving a show to...well, even I can't think of a similarly situated huckster pol on the right equivalent to Sharpton...
1. John 13 years ago
  
  Al is entertaining as hell. He has no business anywhere near power. But I don't see why he won't be a great talk show host.
  1. T 13 years ago
    
    If you're trying to claim to be a serious journlaism outfit, you avoid a serial liar of Sharpton's ilk like he has communicable diseases.
  2. Lost_in_translation 13 years ago
    
    Black lefty huckabee
    1. MNG 13 years ago
      
      Huckabee is a much more serious political figure than Sharpton imo.
  3. wylie 13 years ago
    
    Anyone think this was Al's plan all along?
2. Pat Robertson 13 years ago
  
  You know, MNG, neither can I.
  1. MNG 13 years ago
    
    That's different, Pat created his own network and put himself on.
    1. John 13 years ago
      
      MSNBC is in the entertainment business. Tell me Al Sharpton won't be entertaining.
      1. MNG 13 years ago
        
        Well shit, Kim Kardashian might be entertaining too, but no reason MSNBC should give her a show...
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        I bet she would be more intelligent and interesting the Special Ed Shultz or Crazy Larry O'Donnell. And I guarantee you she would get better ratings.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        Well, you've proven in the past you don't bother yourself with any distinction between someone disagreeing with you and them being un-intelligent, so for you, yes that would be true.
3. Ice Nine 13 years ago
  
  Understandable.
Herman Cain 13 years ago

I only put it in a little.
1. MNG 13 years ago
  
  It's bizarre. If someone asked me if I had sex with a woman I think I could answer without having to wait on what she specifically was saying...
  1. Slick Willy 13 years ago
    
    Except blowjobs don't count.
MNG 13 years ago

I'm not a fan of how the payroll tax thing is structured, but I do think the current debate shows that the GOP doesn't have some general love of tax relief but prefers tax relief for the wealthy over tax relief for workers...
1. Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
  
  I'm not a fan of how the payroll tax thing is structured, but I do think the current debate shows that the GOP doesn't have some general love of tax relief but prefers tax relief for the wealthy over tax relief for workers...
  
  What are you talking about?
  1. MNG 13 years ago
    
    The current debate in the Senate offers a choice: tax relief for the working class or the wealthy. The GOP has said hell no to the first to protect the latter.
    1. Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
      
      I thought the issue was tax relief for the working class plus tax hikes for the "wealthy." But maybe I heard it wrong.
    2. Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
      
      The current debate in the Senate offers a choice: tax relief for the working class or the wealthy. The GOP has said hell no to the first to protect the latter.
      
      Ah, I see. Of course, you could also say that Democrats are holding the payroll tax break hostage until everyone agrees to further gouge the "wealthy."
      
      Tell me, why can't we have both a payroll tax break PLUS spending cuts commensurate with the break? Why do MUST we "shift" the "burden" onto someone else other than a spendthrift government?
      1. MNG 13 years ago
        
        the answer that could be given is to make the cuts deficet neutral.
        
        I'd prefer to pay for it by drawing down foriegn troops. But again, what it does show is that when put to the test of preferring tax relief for the working class to tax relief for the wealthy, we know how the GOP rolls.
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        what it does show is that when put to the test of preferring tax relief for the working class to tax relief for the wealthy, we know how the GOP rolls.
        
        That's your chosen interpretation. I know better. The GOP acts as it does because it knows that as soon as it concedes on this issue, spendthrifty pols (in both parties, mind) are going to continue this pattern.
        
        "Either raise taxes here or face the wrath of the working class! What, do you HATE the working class?"
        
        Do the world a favor and pull your partisan head out of your partisan ass, MNG. You are being decidedly unhelpful. There is no excuse for anyone to leap on the expiration of one tax break and hold it hostage to further their political agenda.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        If you were talking about a tax raise with a promised spending cut then you might have something, conservatives have been burnt before on that. But we are talking about a revenue neutral thing.
        
        But nice try.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        "pull your partisan head out of your partisan ass"
        
        Yeah, the guy who can't bring himself to admit Cain saying he can't answer whether he had sex with the woman is bizarre because, you know, BILL CLINTON! is accusing me of partisanship...
        
        Physician heal thyself.
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        Again, so wrong.
        
        The "tax break" is, by its nature, temporary. The Democrats want a permanent tax increase on the "wealthy". So when the "tax break" expires again here in a couple of years, I can just guess what your TEAM BLUE is gonna pull...
        
        "Oh, the payroll tax break is expiring! Better pass some more eat-the-rich tax increases or we're going to demagogue against you!"
        
        And look who's here doing it: The Duke of Demagoguery, A#1, MNG.
        
        Mike M. 13 years ago
        
        The MNGs of the world never, ever get tired of the class warfare warfare game, do they?
        
        The worst part is that we have to put with eleven more months of this tedious garbage.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        But wait, why isn't this class warfare by the GOP, just choosing the wealthy class?
        
        According to the GOP letting a temporary tax cut lapse is raising taxes. We heard that all through the Bush tax cuts debate last year. So the option is to raise taxes on the working class or the wealthy and the GOP is threatening to filibuster to protect the latter.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        Sorry, it's your side that calls the lapse of a temporary tax break raising taxes. So, either taxes are going to be raised on the wealthy or the working class, and the GOP has not only made its stance for the former but is willing to filibuster to that end.
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        So, either taxes are going to be raised on the wealthy or the working class, and the GOP has not only made its stance for the former but is willing to filibuster to that end.
        
        The GOP was willing to extend the tax break.
        
        The Democrats were not unless they got a permanent tax increase/surcharge on the rich.
        
        It really is a neat trick when Side A was all set to do a thing, Side B saysv"not until we get what we want!", and then accuse Side A of holding the tax break hostage.
        
        You are such a fucking joke.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        "The GOP was willing to extend the tax break."
        
        Citation needed.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08.....6dems.html
        
        Notice the date.
        
        I guess CN doesn't get much past the Entertainment section before he delivers the paper...
        
        Mike M. 13 years ago
        
        MNG, the problem is that your socialist utopia simply can't be paid for with only the rich paying all the taxes. There's simply not enough of them, and if you punish them even more there will end up being even fewer.
        
        The proof of that is called "Europe". You have been paying to what has been going on lately in Europe, haven't you? Most of Europe has far greater and broader-based taxation than we do in the United States, and in case you haven't noticed, even they can no longer afford it.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        lol, I'm afraid my vision of America falls far short of a "socialist utopia" Mike.
        
        "Most of Europe has far greater and broader-based taxation than we do in the United States"
        
        Er, and they are in worse shape than we are, so I guess the taxes should be more focused, eh?
        
        Mike M. 13 years ago
        
        Er, and they are in worse shape than we are, so I guess the taxes should be more focused, eh?
        
        Errrrrrrr, no idiot, it's the spending that needs to be more focused, because it's the spending that's the real problem.
        
        Restoras 13 years ago
        
        Broad-based - so that presumablke means more people pay something?
        
        Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
        
        Yeah, my take was that the payroll tax roll-back was temporary and the "wealth" tax would be permanent.
        But I figured I must be mistaken, given that MNG would never be so ingenuous to imply otherwise if it were so.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        So if the payroll tax credit were permament you and the GOP would be for this deal?
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        Cuz the GOP said they were going to oppose it even before this current tying of it to a tax increase. The original line was "it failed to stimulate" before.
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        Cuz the GOP said they were going to oppose it even before this current tying of it to a tax increase. The original line was "it failed to stimulate" before.
        
        God you are so full of shit.
        
        There was never, *ever* a time when this tax break extension was NOT tied to a permanent wealth tax increase.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        Again, citation needed.
        
        Are you a clergy of a religion that doesn't believe in google or something?
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        You want me to prove a negative? Did you fail logic in that fancy doctorate program you pimp endlessly?
        
        Citizen Nothing 13 years ago
        
        Fuck the GOP. As for me, I'd certainly consider it.
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        So if the payroll tax credit were permament you and the GOP would be for this deal?
        
        Don't care about the GOP. I'll take a permanent tax decrease on payroll taxes. You aren't going to hold it hostage with tax increases somewhere else, though. If you cut taxes, you cut spending. It's that fucking simple.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        Well, like I said, I'd prefer to pay for any tax cut with defense spending cuts, but if I had the choice the GOP is faced with, raising taxes on the rich or raising it on the wealthy I'd choose the former. We know how the GOP would choose...
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        Well, like I said, I'd prefer to pay for any tax cut with defense spending cuts, but if I had the choice the GOP is faced with, raising taxes on the rich or raising it on the wealthy I'd choose the former. We know how the GOP would choose...
        
        Gee golly, you would support tax cuts if they would only cut the right programs. But, alas, since they don't, I guess it's OK to hijack a temporary tax cut to implement a permanent tax increase.
        
        Your TEAM created these circumstances. Side A said "Let's go ahead and agree to the payroll tax cut." Then TEAM BLUE said "Not so fast - we need a permanent tax increase on the rich!" The GOP cries foul and then useful idiots such as yourself leap in to say "A-ha! See! The GOP hates the working class!"
        
        If your TEAM held a gun to a baby's head and said "Tax increases on the wealthy or the kid gets it", and the GOP objected, you would say that the GOP is pro-child-murder and worships the wealthy.
        
        DesigNate 13 years ago
        
        You, nor Tony, nor anyone else that shills for Team Blue on here have been able to tell me why it would be so fucking devastating to return to 2000 spending levels. Not just defense, but everything.
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        Yeah, my take was that the payroll tax roll-back was temporary and the "wealth" tax would be permanent.
        But I figured I must be mistaken, given that MNG would never be so ingenuous to imply otherwise if it were so
        
        He really is a wonder to behold, isn't he?
2. John 13 years ago
  
  A large percentage of the country doesn't pay taxes. And a very small high earning percentage of the country pays a huge share of the total tax burden. So any tax relief is going to benefit the people who actually pay taxes.
  1. MNG 13 years ago
    
    But since the payroll tax credit is a payroll tax credit it by definition will benefit people who actually pay taxes.
    
    What you meant to say was "relief should go to those who pay more taxes." But I realize you're careless like that.
    1. John 13 years ago
      
      No you are just being nonsensical. It is not that relief should go to those who pay taxes. It is that relief can only go to those who pay taxes. I can't relieve you from a burden you don't bear.
      1. MNG 13 years ago
        
        And by definition John the payroll tax credit would go to...people who pay taxes.
        
        Holy shit!
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        MNG,
        
        How much do the bottom percentage of (non)taxpayers receive of their payroll taxes back from their income tax refunds?
        
        It is a greater number than zero
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        No wonder you don't find Cain's response bizarre. Are you trying to say that the bottom percentage (whatever the fuck that is supposed to be) of people who pay the payroll tax get back what they pay in income tax breaks?
        
        shorter MNG 13 years ago
        
        I'm going to pretend I don't know about the EITC handout.
        
        rac3rx 13 years ago
        
        Nobody wants to respond to you MNG because you are such a staggering retard, but YES...there are people who are at the very bottom of the bracket, who pay their taxes, then get that back, plus additional money they never paid in to the system. They receive, not a refund for overpayment, but a free check for money they never paid in the first place. There are also people who file taxes, and even though they never paid any income/payroll taxes into the system to begin with, they receive IRS checks because they can file all types of credits (the EITC is just one).
        
        And this is why the income/payroll taxe should be eliminated in favor of a consumption tax. It is a fairer, more universal tax.
        
        # 13 years ago
        
        its nice to know that lefties are now admitting that payroll taxes are in fact taxes and not a "pension"
  2. Um 13 years ago
    
    Anyone who uses electricity or a phone or who buys food or clothing or gasoline or any other consumer good pays taxes. The only poor people who aren't paying taxes are dead poor people.
    1. MNG 13 years ago
      
      The late J sub D used to always make a point to say this whenever people talked about poor people never paying taxes. But of course he was a principled libertarian, not one of these LGFer-lites we have running around here since Obama took office.
      1. Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        Fine. Poor people, and even most middle class people, barely fund the federal government. That is why federal pols' demagoguery against the rich is well...rich.
        
        When we talk about "who pays taxes", we are talking about people who pay taxes above and beyond consumption and FICA, because everybody pays those.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        If you hate government in general, apart from any specialized rich-worship, then you'd be just as likely to support cutting the consumption and FICA taxes as you would ones on "job creators."
        
        Beloved Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
        
        If you hate government in general, apart from any specialized rich-worship, then you'd be just as likely to support cutting the consumption and FICA taxes as you would ones on "job creators."
        
        And so I do. So what is your point again?
        
        The "point" that "poor people pay taxes too" is technically correct. It is also a deliberate effort not to understand your opponent. Again, everybody pays consumption and FICA taxes. Blathering about it is irrelevant to the point, which is that when it comes to funding the federal government, the wealthy do way more of the heavy lifting, far and away, than any other class of individuals.
        
        That is the point. If you choose to continue to deliberately misunderstand that, that is your problem.
        
        John 13 years ago
        
        If you choose to continue to deliberately misunderstand that, that is your problem.
        
        Reverend, that is kind of MNG's move; deliberately misunderstanding an argument and then changing the subject.
    2. Restoras 13 years ago
      
      That's not what's at issue, what is at issue with respect to "paying taxes" is paying taxes from income. Some 40% of "filers" pay no "income tax".
      1. Um 13 years ago
        
        The word "income" is usually left out of the conversation when it comes to paying "taxes." Thus the entrenched myth that "poor" people don't pay any.
    3. DesigNate 13 years ago
      
      I'm not sure about everyone else, but I've always understood that whenever people start blathering about taxes (whether red, blue, or whatever color libertarians are this week) it is in direct reference to income tax. Because it's fucking obvious to people (or at least it should be unless you are being disingenuous) that everyone pays sales/consumptive/property taxes.
3. Restoras 13 years ago
  
  Personally, I think its more about having a tax code that can be manipulated with the stroke of a pen - to thoer own benefit as well as whatever constituent is paying their re-election bills. Both parties love it.
4. Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
  
  Team Obama could solve this by merely cutting taxes on middle and lower income people.
  
  But they won't, because it won't score any points if they don't jack up tax rates on people who make more than the magic $200K.
P Brooks 13 years ago

this is a personal matter that no American pol should have to be asked about...

Strange, goofy stuff.

Goofy, indeed.
P Brooks 13 years ago

Mauna Loa, brought to you by Viagra.

"Keep YOUR volcano active!"
Elspeth Flashman 13 years ago

Tomorrow is my first court appearance. Woo hoo! Wish me luck.
1. Brett L 13 years ago
  
  Do exactly what your lawyer says and turn down the crazy eyes when the prosecution witnesses are being cross-examined.
P Brooks 13 years ago

either taxes are going to be raised on the wealthy or the working class

Because a world without twitter monitors is just not a world worth living in.
1. Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
  
  There's no need to raise anyone's taxes.
  
  I know, you know that, Brooks... that's for the benefit of the liberals on here.
P Brooks 13 years ago

Tomorrow is my first court appearance. Woo hoo! Wish me luck.

Plead "non compos mentis" and everything will be fine.
Banjos 13 years ago

Don't fuck with AZ wimmins.
1. Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
  
  I fuckin' LOVE "Dead Right There" stories. Too bad the press doesn't print more of 'em.
jtuf 13 years ago

I oppose USA governmental aid across the board. I'm just find it hilarious for Liberals to finally object to USA aid to Egypt. OK, the Egyptians faced threats if they protested in the past, but where were the American Liberal objections for the past 3 decades? Now that Egyptians are free to complain about USA foreign aid to Egypt, will they start protesting Jimmy Carter for arranging the Camp David Accord that sent billions of USA tax dollars to the Egyptian military?
P Brooks 13 years ago

And this is why the income/payroll taxe should be eliminated in favor of a consumption tax. It is a fairer, more universal tax.

Haven't you heard? Teh Evul Richie Riches still have money left over at the end of the month, so consumption taxes aren't fair!
Mr. Mark 13 years ago

Cain lost it on ignorance of the issues, not the affairs accusations.
Mr. Mark 13 years ago

Primary sponsor of the Taliban: Pakistan

Country where people riot over cartoons in a publication they can't even read: Pakistan

Nationality of A.Q. Khan: Pakistani

Country where Khalid Sheikh Mohammed was found: Pakistan

Country where Ramzi Yousef was found: Pakistan

Country where Daniel Pearl was murdered: Pakistan

Country where Osama bin Laden was found: Pakistan

Country that only exists due to an unwillingness of its citizens to live in a secular nation: Pakistan

Number of people who died during founding of Pakistan: 500,000+

But OH NO - don't anybody offend Pakistan.
jntuk online bits 13 years ago

thank you admin..
nice post
Custom Nike Dunk 13 years ago

thanks

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