Reason Morning Links: More Questions in the Gunwalker Case, Centrist Dems Likely to Reject Obama's Tax Plan, Newt Gingrich to Unveil Another Contract

• A secretly recorded conversation between an ATF agent and a gun dealer raises new questions in the Fast and Furious case. 
• Democratic Sen. Ben Nelson is "put off" by President Obama's talk of increasing taxes. 
• WSJ: "[In 2008] nearly all millionaires paid a rate that is more than twice the 8.9% average rate paid by those earning between $50,000 and $100,000, and more than three times the 7.2% average rate paid by those earning less than $50,000." 
• Newt Gingrich's new Contract with America "will be 10 times deeper and more comprehensive than [in] 1994."
• The NIH is standing between a young woman and an experimental surgery that could save her life. 
• Meth trafficking up 300 percent in Indonesia. Meth: Not just for hillbillies (anymore)! 

New at Reason.tv: Wayne Allen Root Explains How He Will Become President 

Comments

[Suki]

Good morning Links!

[Lost_In_Translation]

Guten Morgan Suki

[PIRS]

Bueonos Dias!

[Suki]

B??y d?
Stupid filter, that is "good afternoon" in Thai. Here are a few more:
Bu?i chi?u
annyeonghaseyo

[Trespassers W]

Annyong?

[John]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sci.....nland.html

More global warming lies.

[Old Mexican]

"This is concrete evidence of how climate change is altering the face of the planet for ever ? and doing so at an alarming and accelerating rate."

Except for the nagging fact that the "concrete evidence" turned out to be overstated by about, oh not much: just 15 times.

This thing is unraveling by the minute - it's fun to watch.

[o2]

meanwhile the artic ice continues to melt

[Pantless Deviant]

And Antarctic ice continues to grow.

[o2]

that dont count cuz its underneath and stuff

[not fooled]

"that dont count" cause it would prevent me from telling you how to live your lifer and stuff

[teh rael o2]

sherlock - u responded to a spoof

[reality]

which represents your actual opinion perfectly, so it's you by proxy

cry more

[teh rael o2]

Nuh UH!

[teh rael o2]

hardly - because its false. being socially [LIBERALZ] i dont care how u live ur life & i have no desire to tell anyone how.

[teh rael o2]

Nuh UH!

[reality]

isn't it funny how you drop the stupid schtick and get defensive when the truth comes out

interestingly, your posts belie your claims

also, are you too stupid to type properly or do you enjoy the fact that your composition displays the fact the you are incapable of intelligent communication?

[teh rael o2]

u mean the "stoopid stick" about AGW?

[reality]

"schtick"

try again, but with more reading comprehension and less trolling

[why lie lair?]

Your original claim

"Gulf War Syndrome Is Brain Damage Caused By Nerve Gas, Not Psychological Issues, UT Southwestern Study Proves"

is not in any way the same as

"Conclusion: Chronic hippocampal perfusion dysfunction persists or worsens in veterans with certain Gulf War syndromes."

there you go, you're a proven liar, stats and all.

Again.

[teh rael o2]

the research scientists reached a different conclusion. fortunately for the vets the healing can start now that GWS cannot be denied

[Restoras]

Your original claim

"Gulf War Syndrome Is Brain Damage Caused By Nerve Gas, Not Psychological Issues, UT Southwestern Study Proves"

is not in any way the same as

"Conclusion: Chronic hippocampal perfusion dysfunction persists or worsens in veterans with certain Gulf War syndromes."

We're talking about your claims.

there you go, you're a proven liar, stats and all.

Again.

[o2]

i quoted the linked UT study webster. jeesch

[Old Mexican]

Re: Double Asshole,

meanwhile the artic ice continues to melt

Yes it does, as a result of my warm awesomeness.

[Zeb]

Climate change has always been altering the face of the earth forever.

[teh rael o2]

but not mankind...who's only been around like ~5k yrs right?

[Neu Mejican]

More global warming lies.

I'll just note that the lie was exposed by the climate science community vigorously and publicly.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Democratic Sen. Ben Nelson is "put off" by President Obama's talk of increasing taxes.

So I guess Nelson's seat is up next year, too.

[John]

Yes. And the people of Nebraska remember the Nebraska payoff. Gentle Ben is toast and is getting desperate.

[Lord Humungus]

Sen. Schumer Expresses Reservations About President Obama's Tax Plan
http://newyork.cbslocal.com/20.....-tax-plan/

"$250,000 makes you really rich in Mississippi but it doesn't make you rich at all in New York and there ought to be some kind of scale based on the cost of living on how much you pay," Schumer said.

[Lost_In_Translation]

I suggest Mr Schumer relocate to a less wealthy state. He'll feel much better.

[Eduard van Haalen]

This just in: NY Senator's responsibility to his constituents overrides his insane ideology.

[SIV]

"Really rich"(or even just "rich") people in Mississippi are worth far more than 250k a year. Other than real estate and taxes, what costs more in NY?

[New Yorker]

Wat? Are yous fuckin retahded ova dere?

EVERYTHING is more expensive fuckwit.

[Lost_In_Translation]

Yeah, which makes me wonder why anybody lives in such a terrible place.

[NeonCat]

Just keep repeating "Greatest city in the world, greatest city in the world" to yourself over and over again?

[reality]

I always marvel at how many of them declare that having never been anywhere else.

[Gibby]

I've traveled a good bit (DC Native) and I think NY is the greatest city in the world.

[obvious]

So you're clearly not the person he's talking about.

Why is there always an asshole like you who thinks your unrelated useless anecdote is worth posting...

[mad libertarian guy]

The only possible reason I can imagine is that you can get essentially whatever kind of food you want at virtually any hour.

Everything else about NYC sucks if you're going to be there for more than a day or two.

[JD the elder]

Yeah, it really sucks having what's pretty much the largest collection of museums, libraries, performing arts venues, etc. anywhere in the world. Terrible, really.

[JD the elder]

No, actually groceries are cheaper: http://newyork.cbslocal.com/20.....er-in-nyc/

And of course, what people usually forget is that salaries are higher here than in most of the nation, and you don't have to own a car, which frees up a lot of cash.

[Neu Mejican]

^^^this^^^

[reality]

NO, ACTUALLY, they aren't. Your article was debunked.

[reality]

http://swz.salary.com/costofli.....l_119.html

[reality]

http://realestate.yahoo.com/pr.....e-usa.html

[JD the elder]

Except that nothing you cited actually addressed the specific point I was making. So much for the reality-based community.

[Rhywun]

As a New Yorker for 15 years now, I can state that everything is more expensive, but salaries IMHO more than make up for it. Other than housing, things aren't THAT much more expensive (especially outside Manhattan).

[mad libertarian guy]

But housing is stupid.

You pay FAR more for a shoe box sized apartment than I pay for a massive house with 5 acres of land.

[Rhywun]

I don't want a massive house or 5 acres of land.

[mad libertarian guy]

Cash for you to spend on the taxes you pay for all of your public transportation, along with the fees associated with it.

[Lost_In_Translation]

Schumer's referring to his manhattan clients who might not be able to afford the 3 a day habit of $10 cappicinos or lattes.

[Citizen Nothing]

A McRib'll run you, like seven bucks, in Manhattan -- if you can get it. If you gotta go black market, well then, the sky's the limit.

[o2]

so eat outta a corner deli. greek, indian, jamacian, etc...cheap n delisch

[Lost_In_Translation]

Its funny when sock puppets forget what side they're supposed to be on.

[everyone who knows o2]

it'd be even more funny if o2 got cancer

[teh rael o2]

being a combat vet, i defended ALL "sides"

[Trespassers W]

By blocking bullets with your head?

[WTF]

By blocking bullets with your head?

This is why he still needs to wear a helmet at all times.

[Red Rocks Rockin]

being a combat vet, i defended ALL "sides"

The "Great C.O.B.R.A. Rattler Incident" doesn't count as combat.

[Citizen Nothing]

A gyro'll run you, like seven bucks in Tupelo -- if you can get it. If you gotta go black market, well then, the sky's the limit.

[shut the fuck up]

1) not cheaper, so your point is moronic
2) delisch? if you're gonna bastardize the word, what the fuck kind of idiot adds an extra c for no fucking reason?
3) new york food is way overrated, particularly pizza, particularly by new yorkers

[Old Mexican]

Re: STFU,

Double Asshole there is the poster child for what results after 13 years in the Amerikan Pulbic Skool Seestiem

[reality]

I thought it was a head injury

[teh rael o2]

nope - i spend ~$10 for takeout deli w a tallboy in chelsea or brooklyn. aint difficult

[teh rael o2]

which, by the way, is neither cheaper nor tastier than a mcrib

[teh rael o2]

an entire plate of greek dishes w a tallboy for ~$10 certainly beats fake micky dees meat

[reality]

"an entire plate of greek dishes w a tallboy for ~$10"

is something you've never gotten in chelsea or brooklyn

what the fuck is wrong with you that you get off lying about petty shit on the internet?

[teh rael o2]

been visiting for yrs & yrs. i live like a local...not a tourist who's soon seperated fm his [MONEYZ]

[A real New Yorker]

an entire plate of greek dishes w a tallboy for ~$10

Name the places. Name them, or admit you're lying.

[Gibby]

This place is good and cheap:

http://mamouns.com/menu-2

[teh rael o2]

walk metropolitian blvd in brooklyn & take ur pick

[Picky]

except that it is Metropolitan Avenue not Blvd

[shut the fuck up|]

Cool, so not cheaper just like I said then.

[teh rael o2]

only the food yes. but when i get the tallboy too then moarz

[A real New Yorker]

And still no names.

[why lie lair?]

Your original claim

"Gulf War Syndrome Is Brain Damage Caused By Nerve Gas, Not Psychological Issues, UT Southwestern Study Proves"

is not in any way the same as

"Conclusion: Chronic hippocampal perfusion dysfunction persists or worsens in veterans with certain Gulf War syndromes."

there you go, you're a proven liar, stats and all.

Again.

[teh rael o2]

wrong thread

[why lie lair?]

Your original claim

"Gulf War Syndrome Is Brain Damage Caused By Nerve Gas, Not Psychological Issues, UT Southwestern Study Proves"

is not in any way the same as

"Conclusion: Chronic hippocampal perfusion dysfunction persists or worsens in veterans with certain Gulf War syndromes."

We're talking about your claims.

there you go, you're a proven liar, stats and all.

Again.

[o2]

i quoted the linked article webster

[A real New Yorker]

And still no names

[Lost_In_Translation]

New Yorkers go to Pennsylvania to get their Mcribs.

[Joe M]

Food, gas, everything else.

[Restoras]

Higher gas prices is at least partly a function of taxes.

[Juice]

High prices on everything are a direct result of high property taxes.

[SIV]

Gas? Like people drive 12 mpg pickup trucks 100+ miles a day in NY.
They have high speed and underground choo choo trains to do the driving for them.

[Lost_In_Translation]

but how will they execute the perfect JFK "pickup" without a vehicle of sorts. Come on, George Costanza wants to know.

[Zeb]

The thing about New York that makes it (and most big cities really) so expensive is that it is nearly impossible to do anything that doesn't involve spending money.

[Lost_In_Translation]

they charging admission to the park now?

[EscapedWestOfTheBigMuddy]

The thing that makes big cities expensive is that all those nifty big city services (which is why I like to live within a few hours of one) require people, and those people are competing for living space and other resources.

The market responds in part by building up (but tall buildings are expensive), and where possible by building out (but all that transportation infrastructure is expensive even if its is paid in the form of taxes).

In short, cities are expensive because they are, well, cities.

Oddly (or not?), they seem to have lower per person environmental costs then rural living.

[mad libertarian guy]

Because they're forced to live in shoe box sized apartments.

[Pharmaceutical Industry]

There is actually a lot of fairly cheap real estate in upstate NY, but the problem is that the taxes and restrictions on use are high.

[Restoras]

Get rid of rent control and building restrictions and Manhattan real estate would fall sharply. Of course, Chuckie Shumer's UES and UWS sources of funding (aka - constituents that matter) won't be happy.

[Rhywun]

Not really. Studies have shown rent regulations have a pretty small effect, certainly much smaller than other regulations and zoning laws.

[Rhywun]

OK, you added "building restrictions". I only saw "rent control", my bad.

[Jimmy McMillan]

The Rent is too Damn High!

[Pablo]

Yes everything is more expensive. I lived there briefly about 20 yrs ago and in NYC it was hard to find a burger for less than $6. Taxis cost more. As you mentioned real estate and taxes were and are astronomical.

I'll be quite happy if I never go back again.

[Restoras]

I can't wait to leave. NYC sucks.

[JD the elder]

Oddly enough, while taxis are expensive in a sort of absolute sense, they're not all that expensive compared to other US cities. Comparison here:
http://www.schallerconsult.com/taxi/fares1.htm
showing NYC to be about at the middle of the pack.

[Jerry]

there ought to be some kind of scale based on the cost of living

How about we use that same scale when calculating poverty statistics, mr. Schumer.

[Gibby]

There is no poverty in the US.

None.

[CrackertyAssCracker]

He really might be the most evil son of a bitch in the Senate.

[Lord Humungus]

S&P cuts Italy ratings one notch, outlook negative
http://www.reuters.com/article.....6920110919

Italy's fragile governing coalition and policy differences within parliament will likely limit the government's ability to respond decisively to the challenging domestic and external macroeconomic environment, the agency said.

[SugarFree]

Those sick Canadian bastards... I can't believe they would honor him like this.

[Warty]

Those eyes, that smirk...TRIGGER COIN ALERT

[STEVE SMITH]

WHY NOT HONOR? STEVE SMITH MINISTER OF RAPE IN CANADIAN GOVERNMENT!

[PIRS]

Is Canada now in charge of Abu Ghraib?

[SIV]

it's "trigger WARNING" you running dog lackey of the Patriarchy.

[Joe M]

Too late. I already looked. Now I've have to go buy a can of soda out of a vending machine.

[CoyoteBlue]

Climbing up the tree won't save you cunucky campers.

[Devil's Advocate]

You should be ashamed... subjecting unsuspecting viewers to that GAZE.

[Steven Smith, Therapist]

Looks like a young William Shatner.

[gaijin]

I prefer the version of Sasquatch in the Jack Links commercials...friendly, but with a temper when provoked. The Canadian version looks, well, unintimidating.

[SugarFree]

The Canadian version looks, well, unintimidating.

Thus, the gross lie that it represents.

[WTF]

Notice they depict it at such an angle so as to conceal the raging hard-on.

[Lord Humungus]

I lol'd.

[Abdul]

In related news, sexual assault claims by Canadian vending machines skyrocket.

[SugarFree]

+1

[Maxxx]

Who knew that sasquatch was an ant species.

[Matrix]

Sasquatch sits in a cube caddy corner to me.

[Ted S.]

I think what makes them sick bastards is using a Flash video to show the coin. Ever heard of photos?

[Fist of Etiquette]

Newt Gingrich's new Contract with America "will be 10 times deeper and more comprehensive than [in] 1994."

Because America isn't tired of big stacks of paper shat out by politicians.

[Eduard van Haalen]

I think I can guess what "10 times deeper" refers to. Get the Vaseline.

[STEVE SMITH]

STEVE SMITH GO TEN TIMES DEEPER ON CAMPERS, NO VASELINE!

[Gibby]

So you're an Astroglide fella?

[Lord Humungus]

Employment: The Texas Story Is Real
http://www.newgeography.com/co.....ry-is-real

While every statistic isn't a winner for Texas, most of them are, notably on the jobs front. And if nothing else, it does not appear that Texas purchased job growth at the expense of job quality, at least not at the aggregate level. There are certainly deeper places one might drill into and find areas of concern or underperformance, but that's true of everywhere. And these top line statistics are commonly used to compare cities and states. Unless Texas critics are ready to retire these measures from their own arsenal, it seems clear that Texas is a winner.

[o2]

alotta stim monies helped.

[o2]

for sum reazon they only werked in texas no were else holy shit im a big steaming pile of stoopid

[Old Mexican]

Re: Dobule Asshole,

alotta stim monies helped.

Helped with what?

[teh rael o2]

helped perry, the counties, & local govts hire govt employees

[shut the fuck up|]

source that

[teh rael o2]

Even budget deficits are bigger in Texas
Texas, which crafts a budget every two years, was facing a $6.6 billion shortfall for its 2010-2011 fiscal years. It plugged nearly all of that deficit with $6.4 billion in Recovery Act money, allowing it to leave its $9.1 billion rainy day fund untouched.

Gone are the $4.3 billion in stimulus funds for Medicaid and $3.25 billion for public education. The resulting cuts outlined in the budget means schools would likely close and class sizes would get bigger. And because the budget proposes a 10% cut in Medicaid reimbursement rates for doctors, physicians will likely leave the system, making it harder for the poor to get health care.

Other areas are being hit too. For instance, the state would have to lay off 565 caseworkers who investigate child abuse. And stimulus funded child care and job training programs would also end.
http://money.cnn.com/2011/01/2...../index.htm

[still waiting]

I said "source that"

and you failed.

You said "hire".

[teh rael o2]

sorry - should have written "saved or created" right?

[why lie lair?]

Your original claim

"Gulf War Syndrome Is Brain Damage Caused By Nerve Gas, Not Psychological Issues, UT Southwestern Study Proves"

is not in any way the same as

"Conclusion: Chronic hippocampal perfusion dysfunction persists or worsens in veterans with certain Gulf War syndromes."

there you go, you're a proven liar, stats and all.

Again.

[teh rael o2]

keeping in mind of course that all the other states got the same money, and don't have the same jobs situation

yes, I am that fucking stupid

[teh rael o2]

pls provide the source which proves ALL states got the same amt of stim monies. thx

[still waiting]

please quote where he said "same amt of stim monies"

you'll notice he didn't, and that your reading comprehension sucks.

[teh rael o2]

"...got the same money..." >wait, u think the spoofer was referring to some other monies fm the feds? what other monies besides stim?

[still waiting]

no, I think your reading comprehension sucks.

[still waiting]

"all the other states got the same money" /= "same amt of stim monies"

if you can't tell the difference why are you pretending to be intelligent enough to discuss this

[o2]

pass the parse please.

[Restoras]

California received substantially more stimulus money than Texas, yet their job situation is much worse.

Your argument fails.

[o2]

so perry did NOT use stim monies to create or save govt [JOBZ] ?

[SugarFree]

HAW-HAW!

[Fist of Etiquette]

Who wants soulless little sperms who can't be in the sun for more than five minutes at a time?

[SugarFree]

Maybe don't leave your sperm outside.

[Steven Smith, Therapist]

You took the words right out of my...mouth.

[gaijin]

Every sperm is sacred,
every sperm is good.
Every sperm helps populate your neighborhood.

[Matrix]

every sperm is sacred.
every sperm is great.
if a sperm is wasted,
God gets quite irate.

[JW]

C'mon, who wouldn't want Carrot Top for a donor?

[Kristen]

They don't have sun in Denmark!

[Fist of Etiquette]

Nor now do they have access to my seed, those pastry-eating racist pricks!

[Restoras]

Free market at work!

[Matrix]

I'm sure some lib will step in and claim some kind of unjust discrimination and force the banks to take deposits from redheads.

[Joe M]

"Cryos's stores have now reached their peak capacity of 70 litres of semen..."

That is all.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Peak jizz. We all knew this day would, uh, come.

[WTF]

I blame the internets.

[troy]

I did my share god damn it.

[CaptainSmartass]

How much is that in terms of bukkake videos? Two, three, ...?

[Citizen Nothing]

"I do not think you chose a redhead, unless the partner - for example, the sterile male - has red hair, or because the lone woman has a preference for redheads. And that's perhaps not so many, especially in the latter case. "

Ouch.

[Kristen]

Tru fax

[Atanarjuat]

Take heart, redheads:

Mr Schou said the only reliable demand for sperm from redheaded donors from Ireland, where he said it sold "like hot cakes".

[Matrix]

So... be sure not to order hot cakes while you're in Ireland. Never know just what they are putting in it.

[Pope Jimbo]

As a redhead who has been married for 20 years, I am not surprised. Demand has been dropping off at my house steadily for years and years.

[Devil's Advocate]

GINGER-ISM.

You are all h8ers.

[T]

You are all h8ers.

If this realization just dawned you're either new or incredibly thick.

[Citizen Nothing]

Only here at Hit & Run we turn it up a notch. We're h9ers.

[Citizen Nothing]

Meant as a response to T below.

[T]

Fuck that, CN. This one goes to 11. h11ers!

[Fluffy]

The true market failure is the failure of the market to provide me with red-haired and green-eyed nineteen year old "personal assistants".

The real problem here is that male gingers are so unattractive that they're being selected out of the gene pool - but this has the unintended consequence of cutting down on the number of FEMALE gingers, who are the pinnacle of evolution.

Damn you free market!!!!!!!!

[SugarFree]

All we need is cheap pre-implantation sex selection. We can just flush all the male ginger embryos down the toilet.

[Trespassers W]

Never understood the appeal of redheads. Probably because there's a high correlation to being big, pale, freckly and flabby.

[proegg antichicken]

nearly all millionaires spaid a rate that is more than twice

You can call a spade a spade but that doesn't mean anyone will listen. Now, let's start talking about those tax reduction reductions that will finlly create jobs, shall we?

[Fist of Etiquette]

Remember, folks, get your millionaires spaid and neutered.

[Rock Muppet]

If millionaires benefit disproportionately from the services our federal government provides (and they do), why shouldn't they pay more in taxes? It's only fair.

[o2]

yeah they use all the entitlements welfare unemployment food stamps medicaid social security they should pay for it all

[teh rael o2]

spoof fail old mex

[Zeb]

They do pay more in taxes.

[sarcasmic]

They're still not paying their fair share because they're still rich.

If they paid their fair share then they wouldn't be rich anymore.

Once they've been bled dry and there are no jobs and no goods in the stores, the government can take control of production and the transformation to socialism will be complete.

[Lord Humungus]

David Brooks: "I'm a sap, a specific kind of sap. I'm an Obama Sap."
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09.....ef=opinion

The White House has decided to wage the campaign as fighting liberals. I guess I understand the choice, but I still believe in the governing style Obama talked about in 2008. I may be the last one. I'm a sap.

[Mike M.]

Anyone who still doesn't realize by now that Obama is a hard leftist on domestic issues isn't just a sap, he's a complete moron.

[Devil's Advocate]

The willful blindness involved with this kind of thinking is really disheartening. A sap? More like a mark. Obama began his presidency exactly as he meant to go on. I don't know why so many of his partisans are so surprised by this.

[John]

Beat me to it. Sorry to double post you.

[Jerry]

The NIH is standing between a young woman and an experimental surgery that could save her life.

Rachel and Steven have already spent more than $200,000 on medical expenses, and they have exhausted the limits of their available health insurance benefits. Twenty-three separate insurance companies have rejected Rachel's applications for treatment. They forge ahead, though, exploring options through grants and charitable organizations in the U.S. and Europe.

Suck it Wolf Blitzer.

[Fist of Etiquette]

And surprisingly, the Food and Drug Administration and the National Institutes of Health are standing in the way of Rachel getting the help she needs.

It is a surprise when bureaucrats do what bureaucrats do.

[Whappan?]

How unexpected!

[P Brooks]

there ought to be some kind of scale based on the cost of living on how much you pay," Schumer said.

The Ministry of Plenty will maintain a list of Party members in good standing, and determine their permissible level of compensation according to their value to society.

[Lost_In_Translation]

a scale because your choices to live in a godawful expensive hellhole should be validated. VALIDATED!!!

[SugarFree]

The legal battle over "corn sugar."

[Au H20]

That word; I do not think it means what you think it means

Key quote:

Globalization is another word for corporate lack of accountability. Post-industrialization is a symptom of lack of accountability. Ruin porn is type of media narrative that allows people to believe that there is nothing fundamentally wrong with corporate lack of accountability.

Post industrmialization is a symptom of the fact that anyone can use a hammer, and some people will for a buck an hour.

[Lost_In_Translation]

Ruin porn, now where might I find such a site?

[Lord Humungus]

is that like zombie porn or post-apocalyptic porn? (does the latter exist?)

[BakedPenguin]

...does the latter exist?

You've never seen The Omega Man & Woman, & Woman, & Woman, & Woman?

[Lord Humungus]

why no I haven't.

[BakedPenguin]

Kind of meh. But it's better than A Boy and His Dog and a Slut.

[Matrix]

Rule 34

[hmm]

I'd start with searching "STEVE SMITH."

[Warty]

You're looking for prolapse fetish movies. They exist.

[SugarFree]

The technical term is "rosebudding."

[Citizen Nothing]

So it's not about sleds?

[SugarFree]

Nope. Cane was thinking about that time he prolapsed during rough trade.

[Warty]

Prolapse is a much sexier word, though.

[Zeb]

I thought it was "pink sock".

[SugarFree]

* What would economies that valued ambiguity, flexibility, fluidness rather than rigidity, control and border enforcement look like?

Nothing says "ambiguity, flexibility, fluidness" like union-dominated industries forced to stay in one place forever.

[R C Dean]

What would economies that valued ambiguity, flexibility, fluidness rather than rigidity, control and border enforcement look like?

Umm, Somalia?

[T]

What would an economic system that valued, for example, non-violence look like?

A protection racket writ large? You'd pay people to be non-violent?

[Fluffy]

The real joke is that our system already values non-violence.

People pay for it with their own non-violence.

I don't kill you or rob you or rape you; you don't kill me or rob me or rape me. Sounds like an even exchange to me. We're square.

But silly me, I'm sure by "an economic system that values non-violence" she means "Since the poor refrain from killing you, you should refrain from killing them, but also pay them lots of money and a player to be named later." 'Cause, like, that's fair and stuff.

[Fluffy]

Globalization is another word for corporate lack of accountability for everyone, including the state.

FIFY

[Au H20]

NO REDHEADS ALLOWED: Sperm banks reject gingers.

So, the guy who has 150 kids? We now know that he isn't a redhead.

[P Brooks]

Ruin porn is type of media narrative that allows people to believe that there is nothing fundamentally wrong with corporate lack of accountability.

Run that one through the translator, plz. Your space-alien pidgin gibberish is unfamiliar to me.

[SugarFree]

"If there is beauty in ruin, then there is worth in creating it."

[Red Rocks Rockin]

Nero? Or FDR?

[o2]

Gulf War Syndrome Is Brain Damage Caused By Nerve Gas, Not Psychological Issues, UT Southwestern Study ProvesBy Brantley Hargrove Thu., Sep. 15 2011

A UT Southwestern study, published in the journal Radiology, used a specialized MRI that specifically measures blood flow in the brain and detected marked abnormalities in the brains of those with Gulf War Syndrome. Not only have those abnormalities persisted for 20 years, but in some cases they've worsened.

The findings mark a significant advancement in our understanding of the syndrome, which was for years written off by the Defense Department and the Department of Veterans Affairs as a form of combat stress rather than an objectively diagnosable injury. Dr. Robert Haley, chief epidemiologist at UT Southwestern, and a cadre of clinicians and researchers, have struggled with the government for some 18 years for research funding and to have the syndrome recognized as a legitimate war injury caused by chronic exposure to minimal amounts of sarin gas.

http://blogs.dallasobserver.co.....in_dam.php
_

>but america has no [REASONZ] to treat these ill vets since they were volunteers right?

[why lie liar?]

And because the studies are garbage, which morons like you and the author of the article insist "prove" your point, ignoring all standards of science in the process.

Maybe we'd care more if you stopped lying.

[teh rael o2]

post ur stats to prove different

[why lie liar?]

the study doesn't "prove" anything, you claimed it did.

there you go, you're a proven liar, stats and all.

[teh rael o2]

the research scientists say UT say that the data does prove the link

Results: Physostigmine significantly decreased hippocampal rCBF in control subjects (P < .0005) and veterans with syndrome 1 (P < .05) but significantly increased hippocampal rCBF in veterans with syndrome 2 (P < .005) and veterans with syndrome 3 (P < .002). The abnormal increase in rCBF was found to have progressed to the left hippocampus of the veterans with syndrome 2 and to both hippocampi of the veterans with syndrome 3.
Conclusion: Chronic hippocampal perfusion dysfunction persists or worsens in veterans with certain Gulf War syndromes. ASL MR imaging examination of hippocampal rCBF in a cholinergic challenge experiment may be useful as a diagnostic test for this condition.

http://radiology.rsna.org/cont.....5.abstract

[teh rael o2]

typo sorry - make that the research scientists AT UT say...

[why lie liar?]

NOWHERE in that post do thay claim it proves anything liar.

there you go, you're a proven liar, stats and all.

Again.

[teh rael o2]

"Conclusion: Chronic hippocampal perfusion dysfunction persists or worsens in veterans with certain Gulf War syndromes."
_

pls provide ur alternate conclusion using the data. thx

[why lie liar?]

Your original claim

"Gulf War Syndrome Is Brain Damage Caused By Nerve Gas, Not Psychological Issues, UT Southwestern Study Proves"

is not in any way the same as

"Conclusion: Chronic hippocampal perfusion dysfunction persists or worsens in veterans with certain Gulf War syndromes."

there you go, you're a proven liar, stats and all.

Again.

[teh rael o2]

incorrect per the research scientists. go argue w the UT research team einstein.

[sloopyinca]

So, you're admitting that Saddam has WMD's and actually used them? Does Team Blue know you've strayed this far off the reservation? Without your thudguard on, no less.

[teh rael o2]

known saran gas isnt an aQ mushroom cloud over NYC...which was team boosch's fearmongering.

[teh rael o2]

i thought my thudguard was supposed to go on my dick

[o2]

what's that?

[CoyoteBlue]

Government Healthcare - they're going to deny you treatment as long as possible to save a few bucks. "Unless you have the right people in charge"

[Matrix]

That's not even the whole story, though. The government would prefer to save a few bucks today even if it would cost them 50 times more in the future.

Like... foregoing an oil change for $30-$100 today, but spending $5000 for new engine a little ways down the road because they did not do so.

[PIRS]

I think the Department of Veteran's Affairs ought to become a subsidiary of the Department of Defense. They ought to get one budget for both. This would give the folks who head the DOD a greater incentive to PREVENT these kind of problems. If they don't they will have to spend more money on treating illnesses that could have been prevented to begin with.

[teh rael o2]

agreed

[CaptainSmartass]

You assume the people running the DOD care even a little bit about the veterans who used to be a part of that department.

[PIRS]

That isn't my argument at all. My argument is that this would place a financial incentive on their caring about the ones currently serving.

[teh rael o2]

or deny it like the GWS...until research proves otherwise. by then many are dead.

[obvious]

you mean research that says one thing, while you lie about it saying something else?

like pretty much every piece of research you post that you're incapable of understanding?

[teh rael o2]

"Conclusion: Chronic hippocampal perfusion dysfunction persists or worsens in veterans with certain Gulf War syndromes."
_

pls provide ur alternate conclusion using the research data. thx

[why lie liar?]

Your original claim

"Gulf War Syndrome Is Brain Damage Caused By Nerve Gas, Not Psychological Issues, UT Southwestern Study Proves"

is not in any way the same as

"Conclusion: Chronic hippocampal perfusion dysfunction persists or worsens in veterans with certain Gulf War syndromes."

there you go, you're a proven liar, stats and all.

Again.

[o2]

take it up w the UT research team einstein. jeesch

[Isaac Bartram]

The VA was under the DoD until the late 80s.

I don't recall hearing of them doing that stellar a job back then.

[Matrix]

But you'd hvae to stipulate that they would be required to render all necessary and proper care. Otherwise, they would slash the funding for Vet care in order to give the chiefs of staff and SES's new fancy coffee makers in their offices.

[Old Mexican]

Re: Double Asshole,

but america has no [REASONZ] to treat these ill vets since they were volunteers right?

That's what happens to you for invading countries.

[PIRS]

O2 should have no problem with this statement because Obama ended the Wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and has not gotten us into any other wars. Right?

[R C Dean]

So, who used the nerve gas?

[John]

Actually, I think the guys who showed up with that syndrome were around Iraqi ammunition dumps that were destroyed and contained nerve gas. But remember Saddam was a peaceful wonderful guy who never had WMDs.

[T]

I got a long and detailed letter once explaining that if I had been within a certain radius of several Iraqi facilities that had been destroyed, the VA thought it might be in my best interest to come see them about Gulf War Syndrome.

Seeing as how to the best of my recollection, I hadn't been in the places the named, I declined. But this does confirm John's idea to a certain extent.

[PIRS]

John, I don't recall anyone actually making that argument (except for employees of the Iraqi regime.) I think Hugo Chavez is as scum of the Earth as they come - this does not mean I think we should go to war against Venezuela.

[John]

I recall an entire movie called Fahrenheit 9-11 being made on that premise. And said movie making millions and winning an Oscar.

[PIRS]

Since you obviously saw the movie perhaps you can quote from it and tell me the part where it states Saddam was a peaceful wonderful guy.

[John]

Watch the first five minutes of it. It shows Baghdad as a peaceful and idealic place with people flying kites.

[PIRS]

"Watch the first five minutes of it. It shows Baghdad as a peaceful and idealic place with people flying kites."

It seems you are equating a people with their government. I have nothing but contempt for Warmonger Obama but I know for a fact that most U.S. Citizens are good people. I would hope no other country decides to go to war with the United States because Obama is an asshole.

[Chatroom Crank]

Except for the ones we sold him.

[Fluffy]

What's the persistence rate of that stuff once it's released into the environment?

[T]

The military claims it breaks down rather quickly, like 72 hours or something close to that.

I have my doubts. It's not like they conducted large scale trials with the shit and did environmental monitoring for 20 years to see.

[Gray Ghost]

I've wondered whether similar effects to Gulf War Syndrome have ever shown up in personnel who worked with chemical weapons. Until we outlawed the things, and built that incinerator at Johnson Atoll to get rid of them, we used to have a great deal of the same types of weapons implicated in that report. And we had them since the 50's, at least. They often leaked, too. You'd think that if it was just chronic exposure to end products from organophosphate oxidation, that we'd have seen similar effects in those custodial personnel by now.

My guess was the cause of GW Syndrome was something additional to organophosphate exposure; perhaps it potentiated with DU exposure, or with inoculations that personnel received before arriving in KSA.

[Maxxx]

Why do so many "libertarians" feel compelled to ridicule vets with the syndrome and thereby defend DoD, when this is exactly the kind of damage caused by reckless governments that libertarians reflexively attack in other contexts.

Somehow I doubt you all would be attacking the author of a study that found permanent nerve damage as a result of being tasered or pepper sprayed by over aggressive cops for example. Or is the damage was caused by any other government program.

[kill yourself]

Because the "syndrome" is bullshit.

[Zeb]

Um, only one commenter was ridiculing the study, and he sounds like an idiot.

[Restoras]

So it wasn't all those depleted uranium rounds that were fired? When did this mother of all bogus causes go away? Clearly this story is bullshit becauz everyone knowz that Saddam didn't have WMD - all the Democrats said so and they voted against the war.

[teh rael o2]

pure conflationz. refute the data in the clinical trials i posted above

[why lie liar?]

you mean the one where you continue to lie about what it claims?

yeah, you're a liar

[teh rael o2]

"Conclusion: Chronic hippocampal perfusion dysfunction persists or worsens in veterans with certain Gulf War syndromes."
_

pls provide ur alternate conclusion using the research data. thx

[why lie lair?]

Your original claim

"Gulf War Syndrome Is Brain Damage Caused By Nerve Gas, Not Psychological Issues, UT Southwestern Study Proves"

is not in any way the same as

"Conclusion: Chronic hippocampal perfusion dysfunction persists or worsens in veterans with certain Gulf War syndromes."

there you go, you're a proven liar, stats and all.

Again.

[teh rael o2]

incorrect per the research scientists. go argue w the UT research team einstein.

[Zeb]

Did anyone ever claim that Saddam didn't have chemical weapons? I thought everyone knew that and it was just nukes that were in question.

[EscapedWestOfTheBigMuddy]

There were a metric buttload of different claims made by diverse groups with as many agendas.

My vague understand of how it shook out is

1. He had the kinds of chemical weapons we knew he had, but had limited delivery capability
2. He was still researching chemical weapons, but not getting very far
3. He had had a nuclear programs of sorts, but it was mothballed and didn't appear to have ever been particularly advanced

but I could be wrong in any of those points, especially the latter ones.

[Joe M]

Morning thought experiment:

Define "externality" and give an example.

[Lord Humungus]

This is "one of those words".

- like proactive and paradigm are used by 'certain types' to sound more intelligent.

[proegg antichicken]

When a "music collective" purchases a house down the street from me externalities include loud noises at 3am and PBR cans strewn about the sidewalk.

[regular people]

it's funny though how no one thinks there are people with money who don't want to live with tyrannical lawn measuring assholes

yes, you make people want to murder you, and no, living near you is not desirable

[proegg antichicken]

you are so silly. You think I have a lawn? But if I did I would tell you to get off it, for sure.

[Trespassers W]

What are you even talking about?

[Old Mexican]

Re: Joe M,
If I paint my house in a way it looks nice and pretty, it raises the value of the house and raises the value of the rest of the butt-ugly houses around. According to neo-classical pieces of shit, that's a positive externality that goes unremunerated. For us Austrians, it's just a pretty house until somebody actually PAYS for it.

[Zeb]

And for those of us who pay property taxes and don't intend to sell any time soon, it is a negative externality since it increases the value of the property relative to others in the same jurisdiction and thus increases my taxes.

[Abdul]

NYPD "daggers" (a lap dance with a little STEVE SMITH) at West Indian parade.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YH5JlBezFyA

Nothing else happens.

[gaijin]

Why officer, is that a nightstick on your belt?

[Lord Humungus]

or are you happy to see me?

[Au H20]

Feministing really hates white men, especially when they win emmy's

Written by the "woman" Jos Truit.

[Devil's Advocate]

Man, Charlie Sheen looks like Nosferatu in that pic.

[The audience]

Why the fuck would anyone want to win an emmy? Or be jealous about those who have like the idiot bitch Jos appears to be?

It's for television you stupid penis cover, what kind of idiot would seek to be associated with the Creepy Uncle of entertainment?

[Restoras]

There is some good stuff on TV - it just never wins those dumb awards.

[Kristen]

Alton Brown

[Red Rocks Rockin]

Jos Truitt is the walking proof of Steve Sailer's thesis that feminism is largely promoted by ugly women as a means of trying to make society consider them attractive.

[sloopyinca]

Actually, she is walking proof of Steve Smith's ability to fertilize human eggs.

[Joe M]

1950s - colored people
2010s - people of color

Now that's progress.

[Rhywun]

Can't they just be happy a midget got one?

[Tim]

Have we won in Libya yet?

[shell exxon halliburton]

another joyous corporatist victory! rejoice brother

[Question?]

No, nor do we know where Gaddafi is. And Yemen is rapidly turning into another Somalia - although yesterday was international talk like a pirate day. Aaarrrr!

[teh rael o2]

cpt jack sparrow would say "why is the rum always empty"?...then arrghh

[why lie lair?]

Your original claim

"Gulf War Syndrome Is Brain Damage Caused By Nerve Gas, Not Psychological Issues, UT Southwestern Study Proves"

is not in any way the same as

"Conclusion: Chronic hippocampal perfusion dysfunction persists or worsens in veterans with certain Gulf War syndromes."

there you go, you're a proven liar, stats and all.

Again.

[teh rael o2]

wrong thread sherlock

[Atanarjuat]

I keep hearing references to the "illegal" war (not authorized by Congress) in Libya. Can Obama be impeached for this offense, if it is indeed illegal?

[teh rael o2]

impeachment's one thing, conviction's another

[why lie lair?]

Your original claim

"Gulf War Syndrome Is Brain Damage Caused By Nerve Gas, Not Psychological Issues, UT Southwestern Study Proves"

is not in any way the same as

"Conclusion: Chronic hippocampal perfusion dysfunction persists or worsens in veterans with certain Gulf War syndromes."

there you go, you're a proven liar, stats and all.

Again.

[teh rael o2]

wrong thread sherlock

[Warty]

From an otherwise uninteresting story about Hugh Jackman and pro wrestling:

The Australia native hosted WWE Raw at Quickens Loan Arena in front of a packed crowd, but he also promoted his new movie, "Real Steel." The action movie features Jackman as a washed-up boxer struggling to make cash in the world of robot boxing, while trying to reconnect with is young son.

They really made that movie?

[Au H20]

Embarrassing admission: I'm kinda excited for Real Steel.

[AblueSilkworm]

I thought of a whole different sort of Steel. "Hugh Jackman is now doing Interracial??"

[Abdul]

I thought "Real Steel" was the working title for Jeff Stryker's bio-pic.

[Old Mexican]

It's like Robot Jox, except with smaller robots... and smaller audiences.

[Au H20]

You forget how much that movie spent to acquire the Rock-Em Sock-Em Robots license.

[Restoras]

When I first saw the trailer, that's what I thought Rock'em Sock'em Robots would be the name of the movie and thought - how stupid. Then I saw the real name - and I had the same thought.

[Gray Ghost]

Agreed. I thought, "They made a movie about rock'em sock'em robots?! What's next? Hungry Hungry Hippos?"

I don't know what's funnier: that shit like this gets green lit, thinking about what ideas the studios shoot down for being too crazy, or the idea that someone is expecting an adult to pay $12+ to watch it. (And the 1/2 hour of ads before the previews, but that's another rant.)

[SugarFree]

They didn't have the balls to release it under its actual title:

Rock'em Sock'em Robots: The Motion Picture.

[Au H20]

Great minds think alike.

[Abdul]

Finally, a role suited for Keanau Reeves' unique acting talents--the inantimate plastic punching target!

[The Other Kevin]

Have you seen the previews? I think a better title would be Rock em Sock em Robots. Like Transformers, it is clearly playing on nostalgia for our childhood toys.

[Citizen Nothing]

I need to acquire the rights to Creepy Crawlers, pronto.

[SugarFree]

Day-Glo Cthulhu: The Lovecraftian Horrors of Peter Max

[Citizen Nothing]

I'd watch it.

[Citizen Nothing]

Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl Plastigoop."

[T]

I'll be there on opening day.

[Red Rocks Rockin]

Chucky vs. Teddy Ruxpin

[John]

Basically it is a marketing tool to bring back the old Rockem Sockem Robot toy.

[Au H20]

Goddamnit John. You killed the joke. It's dead- BECAUSE OF YOU!

[John]

Sorry

[Joe M]

Hey, you know what that movie reminds me of? Rock'em Sock'em Robots.

[Matrix]

I think it is a movie about rock em' sock 'em robots.

[Old Mexican]

The NIH is standing between a young woman and an experimental surgery that could save her life.

"Government is here to take care of you...

... because you belong to the government."

[sarcasmic]

Funny how government serves the public by shafting individuals.

It is as if "the public" means "everyone but you" when you are the individual dealing with the "public servant".

[Old Mexican]

Re: sarcasmic,

It is as if "the public" means "everyone but you"

Not as if - it means exactly that.

[Ice Nine]

The case is pending before the NIH's Death Panel. Be patient, dear; these things take time.

[SugarFree]

Has Nicolas Cage been a vampire since The Civil War?

[Lost_In_Translation]

I'll buy it. Those eyes are soulless.

[Warty]

I thought this was common knowledge.

[Abdul]

Was he for Billy Yank or Johnny Reb?

[SugarFree]

The photographer listed on the CDV album that the image was found in was known to photograph Confederate prisoners of war.

This is proves nothing for a whole host of reasons, of course.

[Fist of Etiquette]

One million dollar photo? It proves even back then Cage was overpriced.

[Gibby]

No way it's a vampire. I believe the technology for cameras of that era incorporated a mirror. A vampire would not cast a reflection on said mirror. Ergo, no picture.

[Matrix]

a highlander?

[SugarFree]

Not a CDV. They were produced with wet plate glass negative, a direct lens exposure medium.

[John]

Wouldn't a vampire be a better actor? And since he had lived so long have developed a better taste in scripts?

[EscapedWestOfTheBigMuddy]

I offer Sean Connery as a counter-argument.

That man hasn't been able to reliably pick scripts at any age.

[Warty]

I'M A VAMPIRE! I'M A VAMPIRE! I'M A VAMPIRE!

[Ice Nine]

Phantasmagoric riddles are absolutely my favorite kind.

[P Brooks]

"If there is beauty in ruin, then there is worth in creating it."

Wait- The Joker was the real hero?

[Lost_In_Translation]

Didn't you read between the lines man. Batman was trying to repress the Joker's creativity and that shit's gotta be free man.

Don't forget...eggs...omlette...yeah

[SugarFree]

Yes, if you assume The Joker is the auto industry, Gotham is Detroit (not far off) and Batman is a horde of unionized ticks angry because the dog they were bleeding dry finally decided to scratch them off.

[T]

You have spent entirely too long in and around academia. Between the po-mo fluency and the ability to drop insane interpretation like this at the drop of a hat, I fear you've been irretrievably corrupted.

[SugarFree]

It is far, far too late for me. Save yourselves.

[Art-P.O.G.]

:::Chuckling:::

[P Brooks]

"We're all Keynesians saps, now."

[Au H20]

Bar lets you piss in the Rolling Stones, somehow hates women.

Feminism: The worry that someone, somewhere is enjoying themselves.

[reality]

clearly a woman's mouth, perpetually open

[troy]

[spit-take]

[PIRS]

"Feminism: The worry that someone, somewhere is enjoying themselves."

Feminism is a sect of another religion: puritanism.

[Fluffy]

"When you write your name in the snow, you are secretly fantasizing about peeing on the purity of a strong, independent female."

[Gibby]

I know I am.

[Old Mexican]

WSJ: "[In 2008] nearly all millionaires paid a rate that is more than twice the 8.9% average rate paid by those earning between $50,000 and $100,000, and more than three times the 7.2% average rate paid by those earning less than $50,000."

Just 0.2% of tax returns represented 21% of revenue for the fedgov. Those are likely those millionaires and billionaires that fawn over King Obama The Handsome.

[John]

David Brooks in his own way may be the dumbest columnist at the NYT. Friedman is just an authoritarian. Kruginuts is just crazy. Dowd a shallow aging sorority girl. What is Brooks' excuse?

I'm a sap, a specific kind of sap. I'm an Obama Sap. When the president said the unemployed couldn't wait 14 more months for help and we had to do something right away, I believed him. When administration officials called around saying that the possibility of a double-dip recession was horrifyingly real and that it would be irresponsible not to come up with a package that could pass right away, I believed them.

I liked Obama's payroll tax cut ideas and urged Republicans to play along. But of course I'm a sap. When the president unveiled the second half of his stimulus it became clear that this package has nothing to do with helping people right away or averting a double dip. This is a campaign marker, not a jobs bill.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09.....68pWG9qFSA

Just pathetic.

[tarran]

The Thai Art of Breast Slapping:

The ministry launched a six-month study on volunteers aged 20 to 60, and found vigorous massage left their breasts cancer-free and measurably bigger.

I'm in the wrong line of work.

"Hey baby, I can help you stay cancer free"

[John]

Every time I think "wow that is the best job in the world" there is another one better.

[Old Mexican]

Once a study is released that regular blowjobs can help prevent prostate cancer, I will be a happy man.

[Au H20]

Orgasming 5 times a week, when you are in your younger, helps prevent prostate cancer according to a Brit study.

[Ice Nine]

In your younger what? Wait, please, don't answer that.

[R C Dean]

Ice Nine, I don't want to know what you do for fun.

Because the question I asked myself was "In your younger who?

[Ice Nine]

I know, but not everyone names their sheep.

[Joe Pile]

I do. It makes them hotter.

[mad libertarian guy]

I can't even recall what it is that Pile did that so offended the sensibilities of normal people, but I do know that he's DEFINITELY a sheepfucker.

[WTF]

That won't help - it has to be a study showing that giving regular blowjobs prevents breast cancer.

[Warty]

Andrew Blake made a career out of this.

[Au H20]

Obese people's brains show less impulse control.

Damnit, I had something for this...

[gaijin]

I suspect a similar study would conclude the same thing for those who masturbate in public. Or drink to excess. Or vote for Obama.

[Fat Alice]

Must ... control ... fist ... of ... Twinkies ...

[P Brooks]

I actually tried to read that "Ruin Porn" thing.

What a tedious load of "Woe is Me".

Your city is falling apart, because you killed it.

[John]

If you don't like it, rebuild it. But jeez doing that would require cutting taxes, telling the government employees and unions to go shove it and allowing a few foreigners in who have nowhere else to go. Set up Detroit as a low tax, low service haven and give out a few hundred thousand green cards on the condition that the recipients live in Detroit for say ten years, and Detroit would become a boom town.

[Warty]

Didn't you read it? Unions saved Detroit, and then those GODDAMN CORPORATE FAT CATS ruined everything. But Detroit's not a ruin, it's a survivor.

[John]

Just sad.

[Fluffy]

To provide a positive link for the Morning Links, I would like this morning to take a moment to make my own personal tribute to the Substitution Effect.

Gentlemen, I give you: Aldi fake Fritos:

http://www.taquitos.net/snacks.php?snack_code=1844

Whip Inflation Now, bitches.

[John]

I was watching Anthony Bourdaine the other day. And he was in the Ukraine. Ukraine apparently has pretty lax trademark and copyright laws. So, right next to a McDonalds was a McFoxy. McFoxy is this wonderful place that serves a variety of dishes all blatantly ripped off from various big fast food chains. And, at least according to Bourdaine done better in some cases.

I think it pointed to the lunacy of our trademark laws. If someone can make a Big Mac better than McDonald's, why shouldn't they be able to do it?

[Au H20]

A Kobe Beef Big Mac would be heavenly.

[Fluffy]

I can sell a product identical in every respect to the Big Mac.

I just can't call it a Big Mac.

I don't really see how that inhibits food innovation.

[John]

No you can't. They own a patent on the sauce. If you used their sauce they would sue the shit out of you.

[sarcasmic]

They own the patent to 1000 island dressing?

[T]

You can't patent a sauce. It'd have to be a trade secret to the exact recipe, like Coke.

[John]

But i don't think you could open a McFoxy in the US.

[Fluffy]

I don't think McFoxy is encroaching on trade secrets.

They're encroaching on the marketing expense associated with McDonald's trademarks.

Why call your fast-food restaurant McFoxy? Because then anyone who sees it instantly knows exactly what food you sell. You're appropriating the billions of dollars McDonald's spends on brand and product awareness in order to not have to spend money on your own brand.

You may as well download stolen music or movies, man.

[John]

What people can't understand that McFoxy is not McDonald's? If I start selling a hamburger that looks and tastes just like a Big Mac, people will instantly know exactly what kind of food I am selling. How is that not worse than using a similar name? Yet, you say that is perfectly legal and McFoxy is not. If one is stealing they both should be stealing. Indeed selling the copycat burger is really worse since people go to McDonald's for the food not the brand.

[Lost_In_Translation]

Indeed selling the copycat burger is really worse since people go to McDonald's for the food not the brand.

No, they go to McDonalds with the expectation of a particular food, one that is familiar and known. The golden arch assures them of that (that's what the branding is for).

[Lost_In_Translation]

You may as well download stolen music or movies, man.

i think that's a different set of rules being broken for a different purpose.

Anyway, there's valid arguments about the issues of US patent/copyright/trademark laws, though I don't think McFoxy's and their supporter John are making them.

[Libertymike]

I'm disappointed.

Not with you or any other poster; but with Reason.

Reason has now deleted two of my posts regarding certain litigation.

[Lost_In_Translation]

server squirrels im sure. they're out gathering nuts for the winter

[Citizen Nothing]

No. Server sheep.

[R C Dean]

Reason has now deleted two of my posts regarding certain litigation.

You should sue.

[Lord Humungus]

join the crowd!

[tarran]

Libertymike,

Did you fail to accidentally mention the color of Barack Obama's skin in those posts?

If you did, it's likely they deleted them thinking it wasn't you but some impostor.

[Matt Welch]

Hey Libertymike, do you plan to pony up for our now-much-more-expensive libel insurance?

Spare us the lectures about commitment to free speech. You do not know the extraordinary lengths and expense that we went through over the past year to fight this litigation and preserve our freedom and rights to publish freely. We asked commenters not to discuss this case further on OUR website. We did so in order to reduce the risks to us of future litigation, which would impose further massive costs to us and further distract us from our work.

Several of you have ignored that request and have chosen to impose risks on us without our consent. We cannot continue to monitor and delete comments here. If you continue to ignore our request, we will have no choice but to close down these forums. Please Stop Now.

[Libertymike]

Matt, I was a subscriber to the magazine for nearly 15 years.

I have made contributions to the Reason Foundation.

I have also bought magazine subscriptions for others as birthday / X-mas gifts.

The above purchases / gifts were made, at least in part, upon the premise that Reason had a backbone.

[Applederry]

It's easy to criticize when others are bearing all the risk. Why don't you make your own blog, with your real name and identification, and then make fun of Reason and this guy. See how much backbone you have when you receive the court papers.

[Libertymike]

So, the answer is, just be a good little boy and recoil?

Do you like being a slaver? Do you like giving reason a pass when it betrays its values?

[Matt Welch]

Libertymike -- I appreciate your support over the years. And if you think our unwillingness to post your Wolk-related comments in the wake of a hard-won settlement makes us a "slaver," then there's really no point in continuing this conversation.

[Libertymike]

Okay, truce; although I just don't see the basis for any defamatory claim against Reason, I will call off the hounds.

[Lost_In_Translation]

Oooh, that litigation.

THAT guy is a douche, but yeah, having Reason continue to pay lawyers to fight his inanity is wrong LibertyMike, unless you want to bankroll the effort.

[Libertymike]

See post above.

[Fluffy]

Mix together ketchup and mayonnaise.

Voila. Big Mac secret sauce.

[why lie liar?]

NO, liar, they do not.

[T]

Call it the Big Fluffy.

[sarcasmic]

"If someone can make a Big Mac better than McDonald's, why shouldn't they be able to do it?"

Anyone else notice McDonald's quality went to shit in the mid 90's?

They used to toast and dress the buns, grill the meat, and assemble to order.

To save labor costs they now toast the buns and put them in a proofing oven, grill the meat and put it in a steamer, assemble the sandwiches and microwave them to order.

All someone would have to do is go back to cooking the stuff to order and they could put McDonald's out of business.

[WTF]

This is true - I remeber McDonald's seemed to taste so much better when I was younger; I sometimes think maybe it is just nostalgia, because when I have that rare craving for a childhood taste, it just doesn't measure up to the memory. But then on that even rarer occasion when you go in when they are really busy and are cranking out everything fresh, they sometimes sort of come close.

[Matrix]

I know their fries sure tasted better when I was younger. Heck, I'd just have my Dad get me an order of fries instead of anything else.

[Azathoth]

Beef lard. Animal fats. Coconut oil. All tasty--and all banished when they were 'forced' to switch to transfats.

[Fluffy]

Also, doesn't it seem silly to assert that the US faces a problem with the inability of people to enter the hamburger market?

I ate in the first Five Guys restaurant. They opened that up with the spare change they had in their frickin' couch cushions. Now there are going to be THOUSANDS of those places soon.

If you make really, really good burgers and can scale it, you will make bank, whether McDonald's has trademarks or not.

[Citizen Nothing]

Five Guys = awesome fast-food burgers/fries.

[Lost_In_Translation]

Fatburger was the hamburger place in Atlanta. Here in Texas, Whataburger is the standard go to.

[Gray Ghost]

Five Guys doesn't do drive-thru, AFAIK. So they're not fully competing with Whataburger. But otherwise, Five Guys blows Whataburger out of the water, IMO. De gustibus, of course.

If you're going to go into a restaurant for a burger, you could do worse in Houston than to skip both chains and feast on The Burger Guys's selection. No idea why they don't have their own web page, but the duck fat fries are worth the visit all by themselves.

[Lost_In_Translation]

duck fat fries

dude, i was totally going to dismiss this post until I read that. I have to try me some.

[SugarFree]

I don't care for their fries. They are limp and often sodden with grease. They need to employ twice-frying or at least turn their fryers up.

[Red Rocks Rockin]

I don't care for their fries. They are limp and often sodden with grease.

In N Out's got the same problem. Love their burgers, don't like the fries at all. I wish just one fast-food place would go back to frying their stuff in beef fat--if the soda companies can market nostalgia with cane-sugar versions of their soda, why not the old fries?

If I want a greasy cheeseburger with halfway decent fries, Griff's is the way to go.

[Fluffy]

Huh WHAAAAAA?

Even if they are a little limp, you're supposed to soak them in malt vinegar anyway.

Those bottles of vinegar are there FOR A REASON, you heathen.

[Lost_In_Translation]

malt vinegar?!?!

what are you!?

[mad libertarian guy]

Some kind of fucking cretin, apparently.

[Matrix]

I looooooooove Five Guys. they did not have them in Oklahoma, but when I moved to Virginia, I heard about them. Ooooooh so nasty and delicious. So greasy... mmm. It makes me lethargic for the rest of the day after eating a burger. So yummy yummy in my tummy! I'm glad they have them here in Alabama, too.

[Rhywun]

Yeah... crazy expensive though. And their fries are decent but not the best - it's amazing how many of these mid-level burger joints can't get fries right. The best I ever had are at NY Burger Co. but they're only in midtown...

[SugarFree]

In related food news: Mini-Churros Cereal

[Mini-Charo]

Cuchi-Cuchi!

[Warty]

The working product name, Diabeetos, didn't focus-group well. Too close to Cheetos.

[Pablo]

Does it come with an insulin pump? LOL

[Fluffy]

Are those fake Apple Jacks?

I enjoy eating fake knock-offs of established Generation X brands and products now.

It's because I'm too damn old, really.

I can AFFORD to spend $2.49 on a bag of Fritos. It just seems SO WRONG to do so that I can't enjoy them if I buy them. I sit there thinking, "Those fuckers charged me $2.49 for this shit," the whole time I'm eating them and I can't enjoy them.

But since there are fake Aldi Fritos in the world, I can go buy a bag for 99 cents. That's "the right" price for Fritos, so I can enjoy them.

I'll be shaking my cane at the prices on soda machines any day now.

[SugarFree]

I've read that they taste like Apple Jacks, but they are made by Post, so I think they are going after the Latino market.

I really want to try them, but I really don't won't to go blind and lose feeling in my feet anytime soon.

[troy]

I just moved to Arkansas. They sell Razorback ductape at Wal-Mart to tie your cousin up before you STEVE SMITH her. (Unless of course you are Warty, then it is STEVE SMITH "Him")

http://shop.arkansasrazorbacks....._Duct_Tape

God Bless America.

[T]

I just moved to Arkansas.

And thus begins the inevitable descent into madness.

[Brett L]

Keep your bumper on and represent the school you never went to.

[Citizen Nothing]

It's not just for household fixes anymore, so let your imagination and your team-spirit run wild...

Heh heh

[Matrix]

just because you moved to Arkansas doesn't mean you have to "go native" and pork your cousin.

[Fluffy]

But even more importantly, these pictures refuse to name *why* this decay is happening. Even as the lens is focused up close on "documentation" and "history," it details exactly how the grandeur happened (the glorious era of Industrial Prosperity)?all while studiously ignoring the source of the decay (a weird sudden catastrophe!).

Whoa whoa whoa!

That's not even close to what Detroit ruin porn is about.

The photos are fascinating precisely because we know exactly what caused the ruins. The photos are fascinating because they are documenting what one could call the justice of history, or perhaps instead the long run Keynes did not fear.

The ruins of ancient Rome spoke to the poets about the ephemerality of worldly experience and the vanity of the powerful. The ruins of modern Detroit speak to me about the inevitable operation of the moral law (if you just wait long enough).

A photo of a decayed abandoned Detroit factory is like a photo of a western outlaw being hung. A photo of a burned and flooded Detroit public school system book depository is like a painting of late-medieval barons feasting at a table while plague rats scurry about their feet.

[Warty]

I know someone besides me has to like Anthrax. Their new album is quite satisfying.

[T]

They're still recording? I thought Scott Ian was too busy being on VH1 specials about heavy metal.

[Libertymike]

What gives with Reason deleting posts?

Free minds?

HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!

[Lord Humungus]

Where is our Freedom of Speech?

[EscapedWestOfTheBigMuddy]

Your freedom of speech in the absolute sense is, of course, on your own server.

Which doesn't stop me from having an unstated opinion about The Case That Shall Not Be Named (tm).

[T]

Your mind is free, but litigation costs money.

Money I'm sure they'd rather not have to pay again.

[Matt Welch]

We will delete comments we deem needlessly exposes us to further litigation risks, and if this activity requires to spend much of any more time that could be better spent on doing journalism and commentary, then we will simply shut comments down. We are asking for understanding in not gratuitously exposing us to a greater chance of throwing tons of money and time down the fucking drain.

[R C Dean]

if this activity requires to spend much of any more time that could be better spent on doing journalism and commentary, then we will simply shut comments down.

As is your right, and even your obligation as stewards of Reason's resources.

We are asking for understanding in not gratuitously exposing us to a greater chance of throwing tons of money and time down the fucking drain.

Freedom [to comment] without restraint and responsibility is ephemeral, my friends. Let's respect the proprietor's wishes here.

[Fluffy]

IP ban LibertyMike.

Problem solved.

[Citizen Nothing]

It's Abe Lincoln's fault.

[Citizen Nothing]

Someone, perhaps someone with much deeper pockets than the Reason Foundation, needs to fight something like this to the end.
As is stands now, anyone can come and post anonymously and fuck with Reason?
Doesn't that, ultimately, imply the end of anonymous posts everywhere? Because why wouldn't someone post crap on a site they hate, just to mess with that organization?
Maybe LibertyMike is actually a fifth columnist for Wonkette? (Actually, that would explain a lot.)

[Libertymike]

CN, that is defamatory!

However, you have the unfettered right to post such comments. Unlike others, I will not sue you or Reason.

As to RC's comments-to the extent that reason retreats from its committment to free minds and free markets, it is not being a good steward of its resources.

[Lost_In_Translation]

I think they're retreating from litigation costs. Feel free to start your own dozen anti-"that guy" sites and come back when you've beaten him down to a sniveling pulp. I bet reason will do a flattering piece on you then.

[Lost_In_Translation]

Someone, perhaps someone with much deeper pockets than the Reason Foundation, needs to fight something like this to the end.

Are the Koch Bros. busy? After all, aren't they our overlords?

And I think a new standard should be developed that the litigator in question needs to start being fined by the court pre-emptively every time he brings a suit against anyone. A little societal vendetta against him and his ilk would make for a nice example.

[Libertymike]

Are you moving the goalposts?

None of my comments could, as an absolute matter of fact and law, support an action for defamation against reason.

[Libertymike]

Why the unprovoked hostility, Fluffy?

[PermaLurker]

Cut it out LibertyMike. They asked nice. Now you're just being an asshole.

[gaijin]

I know someone besides me has to like Anthrax...

I'm in.

[Lost_In_Translation]

The castle...oh yes...so much peril

[Sparky]

Nice, sounds like they're getting back to Persistence of Time sound. We Come For You All was kind of, meh.

[P Brooks]

Actually, all Detroit Ruin Porn should include photos of UAW picket lines.

[troy]

West Hollywood bans STEVE SMITH.

http://www.newser.com/story/12.....n-fur.html

[Citizen Nothing]

The city formally recognizes "companions," not pets

That's just sick, man.

[Warty]

Handsome companions?

[WTF]

The City Council is considering banning the sale of any clothing or attire made of animal hair, wool, or fur.

What the hell do they have against wool? And why is leather okay?

[Lost_In_Translation]

Basically they're banning hippies and their hair shirts. I can stand behind this decision.

[T]

Wool is verboten but meat is fine? What's crueler? Shaving an animal once a year, or slaughtering it?

[Ramsey]

Hell, the sheep likes to be shorn. That shit is hot.

[Zeb]

OK, the fur thing is stupid, but I can see that. But wool? Those sheep need to be shorn. These must be the same people that think keeping pets is cruel.

[The Great American Jackaloap]

'cause it's just cruel to make'em all naked and pink.

// it would appear that Pixar defends their copyright on youtube pretty vigorously. If the link stops working go by the DVD or something.

[robc]

Why would a "Buffett tax" have $1M as its low end?

Here is my idea for a Buffett tax: a one time 90% WEALTH tax on those with more than $40B in net worth.

That hits Buffett and Gates. And they both have whined about not paying enough in taxes, so no problem.

Hey, Buffett will still be worth $4.5B afterwords.

That tax would raise about $89B. Chump change, but a few billion here and there and eventually you get real money.

[MJ]

So you either want Microsoft to take a significant hit on its stock price, or you want the Feds to own shares in Mocrosoft?

Gate's and Buffet's wealth are assets, not money. Forcing the wealthy to liquidate those assets at one time will have a bad impact on the economy.

[Zeb]

This is a point that a lot of the "tax the rich" crowd seems to miss entirely. RIch people are not just sitting on a pile of cash. If Buffet or gates wanted to liquidate a large part of their assets, those assets would be worth a whole lot less as soon as people figured out what was going on.

[Number 2]

"Centrist Dems Likely to Reject Obama's Tax Plan"

What "plan," Mike? Didn't you hear Geitner's statement? The Obama Administration is offering no specific proposal, but instead is fighting for this "concept" to be part of the deficit reduction plan. In other words, it is bullshit.

And further...if you are going to send someone to lecture congressional Republicans on having the "fortunate few" pay their "fair share" of income taxes...why on Earth would you select as your messenger a very fortunate multi-millionaire financier who for several years paid NO share of his income taxes because he "forgot" about them?

[Citizen Nothing]

Scammers like red light cameras almost as much as does Tulpa.

[SugarFree]

Rules are rules, you filthy anarchist.

[teh rael o2]

remove front plate.

[PIRS]

In some states that is illegal. Here in Florida we are not even offered the option of a Front plate.

[Tulpa]

This is what your argument against RLCs has devolved to?

I suppose you think the existence of Nigerian princes is an affront to liberty to, since scammers pretend to be afilliated with them too.

Considering I've never heard of an RLC tasering someone to death, beating them against a curb, or shooting dogs, I would think libertarians would prefer RLCs to traffic cops.

[Sparky]

Best headline ever

[Joe M]

They're scientists, not shamans.

[EscapedWestOfTheBigMuddy]

Who knew Italy had reverted to the fifteenth century?

This bodes ill for the future of Renaissance civilization.

[Clich? Bandit]

I guess it isnt thursday.

[Tulpa]

sloopy fails to post the fantasy football results once again. I wonder why.

[WTF]

Jeez - obviously a response to a deleted post.

[Matt Welch]

Not remotely, no. We got everything we wanted, except for the understanding from some of our anonymous commenters who would rather expose us to further litigation and the significant costs that come with maintaining our own rights to free speech.

[WTF]

Matt - my apologies, I was responding to a post by another commenter and didn't realize it might cause you further difficulty.