Election 2012

The GOP Race Heats Up

Surveying the 2012 Republican field

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Did we learn anything from last week's Republican presidential debate? I heard the usual platitudes like "bring people together," but there was also plenty of talk about the private sector. I liked that. So did the guests on my show.

One was Steve Forbes, himself a former candidate for the GOP nomination:

"We got first the principle: The government does not create prosperity; entrepreneurs create prosperity. The candidates emphasized that, and that was a very positive thing."

But he cautioned: "We didn't get a lot of specifics in terms of what kind of flat tax might you like, what departments you might close."

No, we didn't. I guess specific cuts don't win votes.  

Nicole Neily, executive director of the Independent Women's Forum, was impressed with Herman Cain and Ron Paul:

"I thought Herman Cain was great on growth. I thought Ron Paul was great on everything, and I love that he stood up for himself."

I also was impressed at how passionate Paul got in response to Rick Santorum's smug comments about sanctions on Iran. I don't pretend to know much about foreign policy, but Paul's answer made sense to me. He cautioned against what he sees as pressure for war with Iran. Paul says that even if Iran is building a nuclear weapon—he cited a U.S. intelligence estimate saying it is not—that need not mean war. After all, the Soviet Union had tens of thousands of nukes. When Santorum countered that trouble with Iran goes back to 1979, Paul corrected him, noting that in 1953 the CIA helped overthrow a secular democratic government and install a brutal monarch. The anti-American Islamic revolution of 1979 was "blowback," he said. "We just plain don't mind our own business. That's our problem."

Makes sense to me.  

Matt Welch, editor of Reason magazine, noticed a big change from the 2007 Iowa debate.

"We live in a different universe," he said. "Mitt Romney back then was talking about how George W. Bush was insufficiently interventionist in Lebanon. … Newt Gingrich is talking a lot more like Ron Paul these days. So it's a different GOP now."

One debate moment that got my guests' attention was Michele Bachmann's attempt to explain what she meant a few years ago when she said, "(T)he lord says be submissive. Wives, you are to be submissive to your husbands." At the debate, Bachmann elaborated, "What submission means to us … it means respect."

I thought she ducked the question. I hope she'll come on my show. I'll say to her: I thought "submission" meant submission. If it means respect, why not say "respect"?

Syndicated columnist Deroy Murdock called her answer "an incredible evasion … that could have been a real disastrous moment for her. She bounced back from it very well."

Bachmann impressed me more when she appeared on Fox News Sunday a few days later. She's a serious candidate who understands that our big problem is reckless government spending. Chris Wallace's questions gave her every opportunity to be squishy about cuts. She didn't back down. Good for her.

Welch brought up other revelations from the 2007 debate.

"Romney was asked … what do you think we should do about national health care, and he said exactly, 'I think that we should do what I did in Massachusetts and make it federal.' So that's another thing that he's flip-flopping on."

One thing we didn't hear during the debate was a plan to cut entitlements. It would have been refreshing if a candidate had just said, "I'm glad our debt was downgraded. Maybe that's what it will take to wake up Congress and the president to the fact that we are on an unsustainable course."

And I wish someone had said, "I'm sick of politicians talking about creating jobs. Government can't create real jobs. The best thing it can do is get out of your way. We should shut up about creating jobs."

Nobody really laid out the truth and offered the big cuts that are needed. I'll vote for the politician who says that and means it.

John Stossel is host of Stossel on the Fox Business Network. He's the author of Give Me a Break and of Myth, Lies, and Downright Stupidity.

COPYRIGHT 2011 BY JFS PRODUCTIONS, INC.
DISTRIBUTED BY CREATORS.COM

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  1. The Stossel post up at 7AM instead of noon? WHAT IS GOING ON?


    We didn’t get a lot of specifics…

    Apparently these days specifics cost votes instead of earning them.

    1. Server squirrel humor.

      1. I knew it. It’s because they don’t have Morning Links (or whatever they’re going to call it today) ready and in a panic turned to the Stoss to step in early and pull their fat out of the fire.

  2. Cancel my subscription!

    1. This didn’t happen when Postrel was here.

      1. For a magazine named Reason, …

        1. lit by 10am…nice

    2. HERP, DERP! You make funny. HURRRRRRRR!

  3. Is the last few lines Stossel saying he’s voting for Johnson?

  4. Why are people attacking Bachman for something a Jewish person wrote 2000 years ago? She’s allowed to believe it if she wishes. Freedom of religion covers Christianity too, people. It’s not just there to protect Muslims and Scientologists.

    1. Why are people attacked for something a science fiction writer wrote 30 years ago? They’re allowed to believe in Thetans and shit. Freedom of religion should prevent others from mocking their gullibility.

      1. You go right ahead and fret over people believing “in Thetans and shit,” or [Insert Wacky Religious Belief Here], as best pleases you.

        Me… I’m more worried about government officials believing in genuinely fucking INSANE shit, nowadays.

        One materially impacts on my rights and life, as an adult American citizen.

        The other: meh. Not so much.

        1. No fretting. Just parody.

          1. Fair ’nuff.

        2. Dude! 1.84 Multiplier!!!

        3. Are you saying that food stamps are NOT a multiplier.

          Holy fuck, you libtards are morons.

          1. Must not be much of one since they have already been expanding food stamps for the last 3 years.

            1. If we just placed every last living person in America on food stamps, tomorrow: GIGA-STIMULUS! WOOOT — !!!

              1. Food stamps are a multiplier. Check out the birth rate in da hood.

                1. Planed parent hood fixed that

          2. That’s exactly what I’m saying, clownshoes!

          3. Episiarch|8.18.11 @ 11:10AM
            Remember, this is Troll Free Thursday. Pass it on.

      2. And as such, you’d never vote for a Scientologist because you think some of their beliefs are wacky?

        Can you find anyone one Earth with whom you agree 100%?

        1. Same standard I have for other politicians. If they just go to Scientology on Easter, Christmas, and L. Ron Hubbard’s birthday to make their parents or spouse happy, and they draw doodles on the offering envelope during the sermon, then we’re OK.

          If they actually take their religion seriously, I start to worry.

          1. That’s freakin’ hilarious.

      3. “Freedom of religion should prevent others from mocking their gullibility.”

        Um. No. It should just allow them to not be arrested by the state for it.

        1. And it should allow me to not be arrested for making fun of it.

          1. You were arrested for it? WOW!

    2. She is allowed to believe in alchemy and the Tooth Fairy, but if she wants to have an arsenal of nuclear weapons and the ability to screw up my life, I’m going to take those things into consideration.

      1. Which is why I support the idea of setting up limits on the power people can have in the first place, not giving total power to somebody and hoping they will do the things you want.

        1. No, No, No. We need to have limits on what they are allowed to think! Mind-scanning tech is needed right away. This will create massive numbers of jobs as a by-product. And it’s green!

        2. So when those limits on power actually exist, I’ll care a bit less about the retardedness of elected officials.

      2. Bet you all sleep snug’n’content, each and every night, knowing I’m just a sniper rifle’s scope away from the Oval Office, huh? CHOO-CHOOOOOOOOOOOOO — !!!

      3. Alchemy gave us nuclear weapons!

        1. And fun drugs too.

        2. Mostly it gave people heavy metal poisoning.

          1. Ozzie has no place in this discussion.

      4. I have yet to find in the Bible a passage concerning the righteous method of conducting a nuclear strike in God’s Holy name. When I stumble across it, then I will begin to worry about how Christians might use them.

        As long as she’s talking about how she views her relationship with her husband? That’s not my concern any more than it was when Clinton was getting BJs, or when gay couples want to get married. To each their own.

        1. See “Holy Hand Grenade” in “The Book of Monty”.

          1. See “Holy Hand Grenade” in “The Book of Monty”.

            That’d be preferable. You have to be able to reliably count to three in order to operate it….

            1. Of course. Five is straight out.

        2. The problem is that most of the candidates won’t mind their own business and so they don’t want to concentrate on jobs and the deficit but they also want to worry about nasty brown people crossing our borders and who you’re sleeping with and what you smoked in your living room.

          1. Unfortunately, no one goes through the trouble and expense of getting elected just so they can leave you alone.

          2. [::BILL and WIFE seated at dinner table, deliberating glumly over leftovers how best to adequately divide their last remaining BidenBuck between a meager breakfast for the both of them tomorrow morning, and the latest mandatory payment installment on their “free” ObamaCare.::]

            WIFE: “Hey, remember a few years ago, when everyone was all twitching and agitated over the private details of Michelle Bachman’s relationship with her husband…?”

            BILL: “Shut up, and pass me the last of that cat.”

            1. *snorts appreciatively*

            2. More like this please. Get on r/libertarian if you’re not.

        3. I suggest consulting the bit about Sodom and Gomorrah.

          1. Too much of a pain in the ass.

            1. i see what you did there

        4. Only because they were too busy writing down stories of unceasing biological and meteorological weapons on unbelievers.

        5. I have yet to find in the Bible a passage concerning the righteous method of conducting a nuclear strike in God’s Holy name. When I stumble across it, then I will begin to worry about how Christians might use them.

          It’s right next to the one in the Koran about flying planes into buildings.

    3. People who dehumanize other humans cause bad things can happen, as demonstrated throughout history.

      The godtalkers use religious scripture to make themselves feel superior and then dehumanize others as inferior “satanic” beings.

      Same with the modern secular religion of economics, especially those who dehumanize with the other “s” word.

      “You have the courage to tell the masses what no politician told them: you are inferior and all the improvements in your conditions which you simply take for granted you owe to the efforts of men who are better than you.” ~Ludwig von Mises letter to Ayn Rand, January 23, 1958

      “Holier than thou. Better than thou. You’re inferior.” Such is the schtick of the narcissists.

      1. Incidentally, if any of you are currently in the market for nekkid Buffy Sainte-Marie glossies, full color…!

      2. As a lurker I feel compelled to note that it is Thursday.

        1. So… put you down for an even dozen, then?

          1. Nah, gotta duel later this morning. After, though.

          2. STFU, Ward Churchill

          3. ? ?Global……….Global Footprint Network…… ? ?

            Pale Rider is muy malo Malthusian.

      3. Episiarch|8.18.11 @ 11:10AM
        Remember, this is Troll Free Thursday. Pass it on.

      4. I don’t know about that. Christianity was the religion of slaves precisely because it claimed they were just as good as anyone else. And the only thing a person will by judged by (and only “god” should be the one judging) is their actions, which they can be forgiven of too btw if they repent. Remember that whole bit about the good samaritan versus that rich ahole?

        Seems a rather nice system to me. Not that I buy any of the magic stuff.

        It’s just human nature to consider oneself “better” than others when there’s an opportunity. As soon as there is a metric for right and wrong behavior, people score each other on the metric. Can’t blame that on religion. Do you not consider yourself better than a serial killer or something?

        1. White Indian must think it’s better than us ’cause we dun respect Mama Earth like it does.

        2. Do you not consider yourself better than a serial killer or something?

          STEVE SMITH… NOT UNDERSTAND QUESTION.

    4. People are attacking her, because she has brought it up, and she got it wrong.

      Its the similar to Kennedy having to answer would he as President follow the instructions of the Pope.

      She should have answered as Kennedy did.

      The right answer is that passage refers to family matters, as President her husband would be only one of many advisers.

      1. I don’t buy this over-repeated argument at all.

        Why do we have to go all the way to a president that was a member of an unusual religious sect to find something to call it “similar” to? What it’s way more similar to is every other candidate and president who had a spouse. Similar as in identical.

        Now what she should have said if she really wanted to pander to the people who are gonna hate her anyway, is that submission stops at personal decisions, and as congresswoman and president she bases political decisions on the will of the people.

    5. She can believe whatever the hell she wants to believe, just like I have the freedom to believe that what she believes is stupid. This is not a freedom of religion issue.

      1. Ephesians 5:17-33

        17Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord is.

        18And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit;

        19Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord;

        20Giving thanks always for all things unto God and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ;

        21Submitting yourselves one to another in the fear of God.

        22Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord.

        23For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.

        24Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.

        25Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

        26That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

        27That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

        28So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.

        29For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:

        30For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.

        31For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.

        32This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

        33Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife see that she reverence her husband.

        In order to post this, I had to click a button that said submit.

        http://www.biblegateway.com/pa…..ersion=KJV

        1. 18And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit;

          My preference for bourbon over red wine is justified by the Lord. Hallelujah!

        2. Seeing as the term “submit” is the end product of generations of translation, I would be mildly curious to see some exegesis of the original.

          1. But not some eisegesis.

          2. R C Dean, I hope you’re not buying that Ehrman garbage about “generations of translation.” The scholarship on manuscript evidence has moved beyond such skeptical theories.

    6. The problem is Bachmann has let it affect her personal life in away directly relevant to the submissive question. By her own words she only became a tax-lawyer because her husband told her to.

      1. most people would never let their spouse affect their personal life.

  5. While neither a Bachman supporter or (as is more common, hereabouts) hysteric, myself… I can’t resist tweaking the following:

    a.) Bachmann impressed me more when she appeared on Fox News Sunday a few days later. She’s a serious candidate who understands that our big problem is reckless government spending. Chris Wallace’s questions gave her every opportunity to be squishy about cuts. She didn’t back down. Good for her.

    b.) I hope she’ll come on my show. I’ll say to her: I thought “submission” meant submission. If it means respect, why not say “respect”?

    Given that “A” is of genuine (and crucial) importance to us all, re: any given candidate’s understanding of same… dude: why do you even give a rat’s ass about “B?” You’re not married to her, after all.

    Fine article overall, though. Particularly liked seeing this “We got first the principle: The government does not create prosperity; entrepreneurs create prosperity.” highlighted.

    1. I dunno, candidates that suggest that half of the nation should submit to their better halfs and then cowardly back away from that by arguing “oh, when I say submission I just mean respect”, that might say more about them than you think.

      1. See @7:41.

        You worry about the evilnastybad Christians/Jews/Muslims/Illuminati/C’Thulhu Cultists, if that’s genuinely a pressing concern of yours. (Hey, it takes all kinds…!)

        As for my self-assigned share of the communal fretting gestalt, on the other hand: I’ll stick with the economic retards currently attempting to further bollix the national purse by means of the fiscal equivalent of voodoo fetish magic.

        Call it prioritization, if you like. Or call it Fred. Whatever,

        1. Sure, government officials make policy on many matters, no problem with people prioritizing one over the other. Of course, extend to those of us who differ on those priorities the same courtesy.

          Of course, one might say apart from specific stances on issues the basis from which a candidate makes decisions on might be important. For me those who have as that basis a literal reading of the Bible is troubling.

          1. those who have as that basis a literal reading of the Bible

            [::shrugs::] You’ve already had a boatload of those, as recently as pious, besweatered James Earl Carter.

            Just… not terrified, ultimately.

          2. It is only troubling when you don’t like the reading. Democrats beat the bible all of the time. There are Democratic politicians who are literally ordained reverends. But you never have a problem with them.

            This is just team warfare nothing more.

            1. “PRESENT!”

              1. “ME FIRST! ME FIRST, DAMMIT — !!!”

            2. “It is only troubling when you don’t like the reading.”

              Well, duh, but only on a very superficial level. The Bible says we ought to be kind, but if someone takes that literally I have no problem with that. If they say that we should stone gays because it literally says to in the Bible I do have a problem with that. If it says some leftist nuttiness (like that every seven years farmers should have to let people freely come eat their crops, something like that is in the OT) and someone thinks our current policy should be based on that I’d call that out to.

              1. Then be honest and say “I don’t agree with them” and leave the bible out of it. By bitching about the bible, you imply you want the bible out of politics. You clearly don’t. You love the bible when it is your side using it.

                1. Everyone here hyperventilating over OMGSHE’SRELIGIOUS!!OMG11!!! sounds remarkably like all the similarly pinched, disapproving types making ominous, throat-clearing noises over Kennedy’s Catholicism, back in the day.

                  1. THIS.

                  2. remarkably like all the similarly pinched, disapproving types making ominous, throat-clearing noises over Kennedy’s Catholicism, back in the day.

                    OUCH for truth.

                  3. Maybe I’m the only one picking up on this, but I think the cause for concern is not whether or not she’s a religious nut, but whether or not because she is a religious nut will she be the president, if ellected, or will her husband.

                    1. Elected… damn my fingers!

              2. The problem with the Bible in politics is that both sides habitually cherry-pick the passages that they like…either to support their policies, or to chastise the beliefs of the other side. Passages are taken completely out of historical context (eg: your farming argument).

                The left is never shy to invoke the name of Jesus when it comes to social welfare programs.

                Can’t have it both ways.

                1. Hah! Just watch us!

              3. “I have no problem with that. If they say that we should stone gays because it literally says to in the Bible”

                Prove it, bitch.

                1. No, we’re supposed to exile the gays and cut them off from all other human contact.

                  1. Happens a lot in Minnesota, does it…?

                    1. Okay. After a long and (ultimately) fruitless Google search, I’ve been unable to scare up even so much as one photo of Michelle Bachmann using her vast, senatorial powers to have gays stripped, shaven and banished out into the cruel Minnesota snows, and ultimate darkness.

                      So: I’m calling bullshit, on this one.

              4. This is especially troubling, MNG, since by your reading of the commerce clause elected officials could direct that gays be stoned, the rest of the Constitution be damned. Of course with a Constitution of limited powers, that ceases to be a concern.

          3. But you’re okay with Obama’s 20 years with Rev. Wright?

            Not God Bless MNG. God DAMN MNG!

      2. Given that picture of her with the corn dog, I’d say that “submit” means “deep throat like a whore”.

        1. NTTAWWT

          1. Abso-fucking-lutely not.

          2. You have to question the judgement of anyone who knows there’s a camera on them, and still eats something so phallic. Unless that is what they’re being paid to do.

      3. candidates that suggest that half of the nation should submit to their better halfs
        When did she say this? Maybe it’s a personal belief that she doesn’t want to impose on other people?

        1. You, there! Yes, you! What are you doing, standing there without your hair lit on fire, dammit? You’ll start flapping your arms and running around in circles and shrieking “SUBMISSION! YEEEARRRRRRRRRRRGH!” at the very tip-top of your lungs, if you know what’s good for you — !

        2. As has been stated previously, I think the issue is really if she were elected President would she submit to her husband in all things, thus effectively making the self-loathing, pray the gay away, minister defacto Pres.

          1. … and, as has been more pointedly stated recently: Everyone here hyperventilating over OMGSHE’SRELIGIOUS!!OMG11!!! sounds remarkably like all the similarly pinched, disapproving types making ominous, throat-clearing noises over Kennedy’s Catholicism, back in the day.

            Try a little harder not to be one of those guys. You’ll thank yourself, later.

          2. if she were elected President would she submit to her husband in all things

            And she did this in Minnesota, while serving as a senator? And you can provide linkies, detailing said action(s)?

            Go ahead, then.

            1. “As has been stated previously, I think the issue is really if [Religious Jewish/Religious Islamic] were elected President, would he submit to the dictates of [Israel/Islam] in all things, thus effectively making [Insert DailyKos Booga-Booga Goblin Du Jour Here] President.”

              Anti-religious bigotry is an abomination, and profoundly anti-libertarian, no matter how apologists for same attempt to tart it up for public outings.

            2. Go ahead, then.

              … annnnnnnnnnnnnnnnd: time’s up. Put down your pencils and turn in your work on the assigned question, class.

              Hmmm? What’s that? Nothing whatsoever, you say?

              F – .

    2. “I thought “submission” meant submission. If it means respect, why not say “respect”?”

      Maybe this is a translation problem from the Greek or Hebrew into English? That is one plausible answer.

  6. Debates are meaningless. Presidential elections are bait and switch scams anyway. You pay in advance with your vote and have to take what you’re given. And then you get punished with jury duty for being a registered voter.

    Also, I have yet to meet a submissive Christian woman, except for the fatties.

    1. Events drive them once they get in there. Clinton campaigned as a centrist only to raise taxes and try to socialize medicine and then later switch back to being a centrist. Bush ran on ending nation building only to end up being the biggest nation builder since Johnson.

      Did they lie? I don’t think so. The events drive what they do more than they do. In short, they are probably going to disapoint you and if they don’t it won’t be because of them.

      1. I often worry more about pols that are going to do exactly what they say they are than ones that change…

        1. They all change. They don’t know the facts before they get in there.

          1. Situational ethics?

        2. [I often worry more about pols that are going to do exactly what they say they are than ones that change…]

          Then when Obama said he wanted to “fundamentaly change the way (insert whatever), you were convinced he was a liar? Why then fellate him now as you do?

  7. Mother-daughter lemonade stand nets $160

    A mother-daughter duo from Sammamish raised more than $160 in cash and donations for Hopelink last week with a lemonade stand.

    The two sent out e-mails to friends in advance, and advertised with posters along 216th Avenue Southeast, then set up shop in front of Margaret Mead Elementary School, where Mia will be in second grade this fall.

    Nothing else happened.

    http://www.pnwlocalnews.com/ea…..45994.html

    1. Wow! That IS big news!

    2. You’ve been spending too much time posting AII, time to get back to work.

      That government cock ain’t gonna suck itself.

      1. Trip Derpington, Esq.

        1. “Hi, I’m Trip Derpington, Esq. and I’m a personal injury lawyer. Have you been injured in a freak accident? Do you have bills to pay? Do sad puppy faces make you sad? Call me at 1-800-HUR-DERP for a free consultation”

    3. And no dogs were shot nor people beaten to death since no cops were involved.

      1. Episiarch|8.18.11 @ 11:10AM
        Remember, this is Troll Free Thursday. Pass it on.

    4. I salute our brave brothers in blue for not shutting down an innocent lemonade stand. Or killing the girl’s dog. Or Mom.

      They are true heroes.

  8. I wish Bachman would have told the guy it was none of his business how she interacts with her husband.

    As much as I dislike Perry, he is dead right about the Fed. Printing money to pump up the economy before the election knowing that the mother of all Keynsian contractions is going to happen soon or later is treason. But hey, that is what Greenspan did in 2001 after the tech bubble burst and 9-11. So it is nonpartisan stupidity.

    1. john, i agree with you about perry and the fed, but basically he’s just parroting what ron paul has been saying for at least a decade!

      1. You are right, although Perry wouldn’t abolish the Fed like Paul would. But, that is a tribute to Paul. He started out as a total outlier and now the leading contender for the Republican nomination is saying the same thing. That is a good thing if you agree with Paul. You can accomplish things even if you don’t win an election.

        1. You are right, although Perry wouldn’t abolish the Fed like Paul would.

          Paul’s also talked about auditing the Fed. You don’t audit something that you’re going to unequivocally abolish.

          The objection regards the unaccountable and clandestine tinkering with the economy.

      2. Yeah no shit.

    2. Bachman makes pronouncements on family and law in America all the time, so this kind of thing is fair game. The suggestion that women should submit to their ‘better halves’ because the Bible told her so says a lot about her worldview which is bound to touch on many policy matters.

      1. Obama makes pronouncements about family and marriage all of the time. I guess you would be okay with them asking him if he would object if one of the brats wanted to marry another women since he objects to gay marriage. Shouldn’t we also know everything that Michelle stuffs in her pie hole because she tells other people what to eat? Good to know.

        1. I think asking Obama that question would be totally fair game, and of course people do notice and comment on everything his wife eats. So what’s the problem?

          We make a lot of policy regarding women and inequality given our loooong history of policy promoting inequality and sexism, so it’s plenty relevant to ask a cnadidate about their idea that women should submit to their better halves. And when they cowardly walk away from that in Bachman’s pandering fashion that also says a lot about the candidate.

          1. The whole thing is a sideshow. What does it matter how Bachman relates to her husband? That is her business.

            1. Evidently, it all ties into missle launch codes, or… I dunno… something sufficiently Clive Cussler-y and paperback potboiler-ish, I s’pose. 😉

            2. When she’s trying to be the leader of the country, but here beliefs prevent her from being the leader of her household, than yes, I think it matters.

              1. Somebody’s been hitting the old Ludlam paranoia thrillahs extra-hard of late, I see.

              2. Yeah, like Obama is the leader of his household. The boy is as pussywhipped as the day is long.

            3. Dammit, woman, push the button!

              1. And keep pushing it until they spell our name correctly!

          2. While I agree that all facets of a person should be considered when trying to judge their reasoning process and capabilities, adding extra os to a word does not change it’s meaning or emphasis. It just looks silly.

          3. it’s plenty relevant to ask a cnadidate about their idea that women should submit to their better halves…

            Especially if that candidate is talking about cutting federal spending. Then it becomes even more important!

            Especially!

            1. THREADWIN.

      2. Yes! Yes! That’s exactly what I’ve been saying about those blamed Jews, all this time!

          1. Smiles while lurking.

          2. Deydoogarforeskins!

    3. Printing googleplexes of money is a national mandate. We must stimulate and masturbate our way to prosperity!

    4. “Printing money to pump up the economy before the election knowing that the mother of all Keynsian contractions is going to happen soon or later is treason.”

      Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort.

      One of these things is not like the other.

      1. Perhaps not in fact but in kind?

        1. It’s a matter of having no sense of relative perspective. Pols making policy decisions which may be harmful to the nation based on short term political goals is of course bad, and worthy of being called out, but treason? If this becomes treason then how do we differentiate what Benedict Arnold did, is that Super-Treason?

          1. what Benedict Arnold did, is that Super-Treason?

            I don’t know. Better ask the Super Committee.

          2. I don’t disagree that the hyperbole is over-the-top but that is part-and-parcel in DC these days, and neither side is innocent.

          3. trea?son? ?/?triz?n/ Show Spelled[tree-zuhn] Show IPA
            noun
            1. the offense of acting to overthrow one’s government or to harm or kill its sovereign.
            2. a violation of allegiance to one’s sovereign or to one’s state.
            3. the betrayal of a trust or confidence; breach of faith; treachery.

            Oops!

      2. I forget sometimes that you are not that bright. I guess you really don’t know that words can have different meanings in different contexts and meanings beyond the technical meaning of the terms. I really need to work on not talking over your head so much.

        1. John has a special meaning for many words, sometimes changing mid-thread. What’s your meaning of treason at this day/hour/minute John?

          1. Ignore the fact that I invent my own definitions for words to support my political agenda.

          2. Look up, bitch.

      3. It comforts Iran to see us inflating our money supply exponentially.

      4. So if during WW2 Germany had counterfeited US dollars to inflate and destroy the US economy would this be considered “waging war against the US”.

        1. Terrible analogy, even in the end point of your analogy you are off base
          (treason and a foriegn power waging war are different things), but more importantly there is intent and such.

          1. His intent has been to keep the international banking system afloat even if it means sacrificing the entire US economy. Sounds like waging war for foreign powers to me.

            1. How about, in that case, we add charges of conspiratorial insurrection against the Republic? That would be great, if it were possible.

      5. Destroying the wealth of the nation by devaluing it’s currency sounds like an act of war to me.

        1. Or at the least giving aid and comfort to our enemies.

      6. Hey Mingee:

        Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort.

        I would say that the Fed gives aid and comfort to Congress continuously. Can anyone here think of a more deadly enemy?

    5. It breaks down, good sir, into an issue of whether or not, if elected, will she submit to the will of the people or follow her personal beliefs and subject us all to the will of her husband.

      Get it?

  9. Kids catch entrepreneurial spirit with lemonade stand

    A group of kids hoping to raise enough money for a trip to a water park are running a lemonade stand on Saginaw Street near Hemphill Road.

    “It’s really fun. I like to handle the money,” said Dru Sweers, 11.

    His step-father David Hodge of Davison Township set up a table and a tent yesterday and Dru, his 5-year-old step-brother Drake Hodge and 11-year-old friend Austin Moore have been selling lemonade and chips to auto revelers.

    They’ve made about $50 over two days, he said.

    Nothing else happened.

    http://www.mlive.com/news/flin…..l_spi.html

    1. This is intolerable, I am reporting this to government, they did not get a proper lemonade business license. Nor did they do an environmental impact study to assess what the high acidic lemon content will do to the topsoil.

      1. Did anyone contact the FEC to get the record of their campaign donations? How can we give them a license if we don’t know this first?

    2. My obsession with little kids and their lemonade stands shows what kind of pedophile kink I’m into.

      1. MMMMMMmmmmmmmmm. Lemonade.

        1. I better not show you where the lemonade is made.
          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7akXvYw9oyY

          1. You definitely don’t want to go ’round the corner, where fudge is made.

            1. Episiarch|8.18.11 @ 11:10AM
              Remember, this is Troll Free Thursday. Pass it on.

        2. I know it wasn’t rape-rape. It was something else but I don’t believe it was rape-rape. He went to jail and and when they let him out he was like “You know what this guy’s going to give me a hundred years in jail I’m not staying, so that’s why he left.”

          1. It was drugging and “seducing” a minor, which is totally ok if you are a member of the club.

            1. It was “seducing” a minor in the ass.

              1. MEET STEVE SMITH LATER, FOR DRINKS…?

  10. Kids Running a Ridge Acres Lemonade Stand

    At the corner of 45th Avenue on Tuesday afternoon, seven Western Springs boys were running a lemonade stand, offering cups of either pink or yellow lemonade for 25?.

    The youngsters were Peter Mikulski, Charlie Austin, Joshua, Andrew and Jackson Fowler and George and Peter Marinis.

    A few weeks back, in the thick of the heat wave, the kids raised $40 with a drive-through stand. Business was a bit slower Tuesday, but their spirits remained high.

    Area libertarians complained bitterly about the lack of police involvement and got drunk in their mommys’ basements.

    Nothing else happened.

    http://westernsprings.patch.co…..to-7392169

    1. Just wait until Ol’ Mister Puberty comes a-knock-knock-knockin’ at the door, and you finally discover an entirely new and BETTER use for your hands!

    2. Slow down, you’re gonna get mouth sores!

      1. Well… I like him.

        1. Episiarch|8.18.11 @ 11:10AM
          Remember, this is Troll Free Thursday. Pass it on.

    3. ?Police Continue Battle Against Kiddie Lemonade Stand Menace – The …
      consumerist.com/…/police-continue-fight-against-kiddie-lemonade-s… – CachedAug 3, 2011 ? Every year, the Des Moines Register’s Annual Great Bicycle Ride Across Iowa ( RAGBRAI) pedals through towns across Iowa.
      Ga. police shut down girls’ lemonade stand – CBS News
      http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/0…..9838.shtml – CachedAdd to iGoogle
      Jul 15, 2011 ? Three little girls lacked the required $180-a-year business license and permits.
      Children Fined for Lemonade Stand @ Police Issues and Complaints
      http://www.issues.cc/complaints/polic…..nade-stand – CachedIt is a sad day for American’s when children get fined for a lemonade stand. That is exactly what happened in Montgomery County, Maryland to six children…

    4. I got high in my mom’s basement, dumbass.

  11. H&R’s “Do-Not-Respond-To-Trolls Thursday” Gets Off To Bumpy Start

    Anarchists refuse to go along. Libertarians, accustomed to disappointment, not surprised.

    Nothing else happens.

    https://reason.com/archives/201…..nt_2470896

    1. Come see us on Moron-Free Mondays!

    2. It would be helpful if any and all trolls put TROLL in either their name or at the beginning of their comments. Thank you.

      1. Episiarch|8.18.11 @ 11:10AM
        Remember, this is Troll Free Thursday. Pass it on.

  12. “I thought Herman Cain was great on growth.”

    Ceaseless growth is cancer behavior that kills the host. Two excerpts from two great essays on the cancer-think concept of growth follow:

    ? “It may be possible to successfully mitigate every symptom of our civilization’s greatest problem as it arises through newer and shinier technology–we can, by definition, never know the truth of this proposition. I submit, however, that anyone who “believes” that it can or cannot happen is acting on faith, not reason. I personally view the potential for success of this “Roddenberry” proposition as very unlikely…”

    What is Rhizome?
    Chapter 1: Problem of Growth. A capstone formulation of why our societal structure is unsustainable, how rhizome presents a solution, and how to implement it.
    by Jeff Vail
    http://www.jeffvail.net/2007/0…..izome.html

    ? “Civilization itself is a Prisoner’s Dilemna driving ever greater intensification, complexity and growth. Garrett Hardin compared the “Tragedy of the Commons” quite explicitly to the nuclear arms race; Daniel Quinn, similarly, compared his “Food Race” directly to the arms race. Both illustrate the arms race itself as a single, minor aspect of a much larger phenomenon that in fact defines all of our recorded history: civilization’s need to continue growing, no matter the cost.”

    Thesis 13: Civilization Must Always Grow
    by Jason Godesky
    http://rewild.info/anthropik/thirty/index.html

    1. This is a spoof, right? Do you not get that “growth” includes all of the many technological, medical, etc., advancements that have increased life expectancy, leisure time and options, and overall welfare? WTF?

      1. Now you know how we feel.

      2. I used to think it was a spook. But this guy really is nuts.

        1. I used to think it was a spook.

          RACIST!!!

        2. I’m telling you, John, it’s Ward Churchill.

          1. “Ward, don’t you think you were too hard on the Little Beaver, last night…?”

      3. Agricultural civilization nearly halved the lifespan of humans.

        Non-State sociopolitical typology affords much more leisure time. Foragers and part-time horticulturalists don’t work near as hard as humans dominated by the agricultural City-State.

        So the City-State has taught you wrong, but well.

        1. Dude, you have to cook those pokeberries.

          1. Humans have been using fire to cook for 1.8 million years.

            Just think, nearly 2 million years of humans organizing in Non-State sociopolitical typologies,* and you denigrate their Non-State sensibilities.

            That’s libertarian-think for ya.

            NON-STATE AND STATE SOCIETIES
            * faculty.smu.edu/rkemper/cf_3333/Non_State_and_State_Societies.pdf

            1. Dude, I mean you have to cook them. Stop eating them raw, seriously.

        2. Listen, children, to a story
          That was written long ago,
          ‘Bout a kingdom on a mountain
          And the valley-folk below.

          On the mountain was a treasure
          Buried deep beneath the stone,
          And the valley-people swore
          They’d have it for their very own.

          Go ahead and hate your neighbor,
          Go ahead and cheat a friend.
          Do it in the name of Heaven,
          You can justify it in the end.
          There won’t be any trumpets blowing
          Come the judgement day,
          On the bloody morning after….
          One tin soldier rides away.

          So the people of the valley
          Sent a message up the hill,
          Asking for the buried treasure,
          Tons of gold for which they’d kill.

          Came an answer from the kingdom,
          “With our brothers we will share
          All the secrets of our mountain,
          All the riches buried there.”

          Go ahead and hate your neighbor,
          Go ahead and cheat a friend.
          Do it in the name of Heaven,
          You can justify it in the end.
          There won’t be any trumpets blowing
          Come the judgement day,
          On the bloody morning after….
          One tin soldier rides away.

          Now the valley cried with anger,
          “Mount your horses! Draw your sword!”
          And they killed the mountain-people,
          So they won their just reward.

          Now they stood beside the treasure,
          On the mountain, dark and red.
          Turned the stone and looked beneath it…
          “Peace on Earth” was all it said.

          Go ahead and hate your neighbor,
          Go ahead and cheat a friend.
          Do it in the name of Heaven,
          You can justify it in the end.
          There won’t be any trumpets blowing
          Come the judgement day,
          On the bloody morning after….
          One tin soldier rides away.

          Go ahead and hate your neighbor,
          Go ahead and cheat a friend.
          Do it in the name of Heaven,
          You can justify it in the end.
          There won’t be any trumpets blowing
          Come the judgement day,
          On the bloody morning after….
          One tin soldier rides away.

          1. It’s funny how libertards have to hijack my name to confuse people.

            That’s what they do – confuse.

            Especially since they can’t debate too well, even simple concepts like the game theory of the Prisoner’s Dilemma.

            Anybody using big words like that must be crazy, yeah, that’s it, now I don’t have to think.

            1. Call him drunken Ira Hayes
              He won’t answer anymore
              Not the whiskey drinkin’ indian
              Nor the marine who went to war

            2. “Anybody using big words like that must be crazy, yeah, that’s it, now I don’t have to think.”

              You first.

        3. So how big an area do you need to achieve an independent hunter gatherer society ? If it was created would you even give up your internet porn surfing, I somehow doubt it.

          1. Agricultural civilization (City-Statism) has aggressively invaded and occupied – and ruined – nearly every square meter of the earths surface in a geologically short time period.

            Attorney Jeff Vail has written an essay addressing your question of how to defend against civilization (city-state) aggression.

            What is Rhizome?
            Chapter 5. Rhizome Network Defense. A review of a Cambridge team’s analysis of potential tacticts to defend rhizome structures against hierarchy.
            by Jeff Vail | January 28, 2008
            http://www.jeffvail.net/2007/0…..izome.html

            1. Still have not answered the question, how big an area do you need ?

              Libertarians do not dictate how people should live their lives, if you want to be a hunter gatherer go right ahead. Just do not expect others to want to live like you do. There are still newly discovered tribes in the Amazon, why not join them, anything stopping you ?

              1. City Statists and so called “Libertarians,” via abstract ownership of Mother Earth’s surface (property “rights,”) dictate how people should live.

                Abstract ownership of the earth is contradictory to the Non-Aggression Principle.

                1. It is you dictating, like you already said, you will ban people growing crops and from voluntarily gathering in large settlements.

                  I do not want to ban people from doing things, one still needs limits on what others can do to me though, if that is what you define as dictating then go right ahead, but you want to dictate practically everything else.

                  1. Sorry, I’m not banning anybody from doing anything. What I am doing is calling the agricultural City-State’s aggression exactly what it is: aggression. And you deny it. Because you support the aggression of the City-State, and you hate the Non-State societies humans lived in before the City-State’s aggression.

                    1. So all the time when I say I do not care how you live equates to me hating Non-State societies.

                      You have already clearly stated to my question that you would not tolerate people growing crops in another article.

                      Like I said there are lots of tribes living the life you want in the Amazon, I will even pay for the air ticket, I would need proof that you actually did go there though.

                    2. You’re like the rapist telling a woman a small, marginally livable area she might be safe from molestation, so you can keep raping the whole North American continent.

                      Agricultural civilization is aggressive, invasive, and occupational, and telling me to “love it or leave it” is just more Butch Neo-Conism. Libertarianism has not much to do with liberty at all.

                    3. You sure must be a hit with the ladies, comparing those who believe in liberty to rapists.

                      But at least you have answered the question, you want an entire continent to create your better society, and you wonder why people call you a lunatic.

                    4. Libertarians aren’t really about liberty, they’re about property. And abstract ownership of the Earth is not liberty and is contradictory to the Non-Aggression principle.

                      Even Rothbard admits to stealing the term Libertarianism as a marketing tool. The Marxist did the same promising liberty, but delivering aggression.

                    5. “And abstract ownership of the Earth is not liberty and is contradictory to the Non-Aggression principle.”

                      How, exactly?

        4. “Foragers and part-time horticulturalists don’t work near as hard as humans dominated by the agricultural City-State.”

          I call bullshit. Life expectancy has increased exactly in line with development, you can today look at that expectancy compared to first and third world nations and see that correlation quite clearly. Consider vaccines for pete’s sake, or pasteurization, antibiotics. Without those things a freaking scratch could mean that’s it for you.

          This is crazy talk. What’s sad is that your view is actually some kind of conservatism on steroids, longing for some long lost glorified past harmony.

          1. Empirical data. Not deductive bullshit from City-State fawning economists.

            “Life expectancy has increased exactly in line with development…”

            Wrong.

            Upper Paleolithic (hunter-gatherer) to Neolithic (start of farming) cut human life expectancy by 40%.

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_expectancy

            Keep repeating the false mantras the City-Statist whisper in your ear. That way you don’t have to think and it makes you feel good.

            1. Dude, development did not stop with the Neolithic age, if you compare life expectancy in current America to Upper Paloelithic times what do you get?

              1. Dude, I just disproved your statement. Now you’re dodging and weaving. Have you ever read how many famines England and France had? How many people today are starving or close to it, a third or so?

                Just because you live so close to the center of the empire, don’t let that fool you. Life is nasty, brutish, and short in the modern civilized world, except for the lucky few.

                As Thomas Paine said in his Agrarian Justice pamphlet:

                “The life of an Indian is a continual holiday, compared with the poor of Europe; and, on the other hand it appears to be abject when compared to the rich. Civilization, therefore, or that which is so-called, has operated two ways: to make one part of society more affluent, and the other more wretched, than would have been the lot of either in a natural state.”

                Of course, to City-Statist loving “libertarians,” that ol’ koot was KRAZY!

                1. “Of course, to City-Statist loving “libertarians,” that ol’ koot was KRAZY!”

                  But enough about your mental problems…

                2. How exactly did you disprove MNG? cause that wiki article clearly shows that we live over twice as long as we did in the Paleolithic era.

          2. Uh no, this is Gaia worship on steroids. Conservatives might yearn for a past glory, but they do not generally view the world as some happy kumbayah camp. This guy is more likely to endorse Al Gore than Buckley or other such conservative heroes.

            1. Actually, I don’t like Al Gore’s clean green fascism. But I do like William F. Buckley, who supported Geoism (Georgeism) “an economic philosophy and ideology that holds that people own what they create, but that things found in nature, most importantly land, belongs equally to all.”

              Now that’s the right way to think.

              1. Nice try bozo, I am no conservative, but even I know that Buckley was no supporter of land belonging equally to all. You do not believe in people owning what they create, because you do not even believe people should grow their own crops.

                1. Buckley supported Geoism.

                  Notable people influenced by Georgism: William F. Buckley, Jr. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgism

                  which cites: http://www.wealthandwant.com/docs/Buckley_HG.html William F. Buckley, Jr. Transcript of an interview with Brian Lamb, CSpan Book Notes, April 2?3, 2000

                  William F. Buckley: Closet Georgist?
                  Mutualist Blog: Free Market Anti-Capitalism
                  mutualist.blogspot.com/2005/11/william-f-buckley-closet-georgist.html

                  I love how libertarians call people Bozos, but they can’t do a simple google search.

                  Bozo. LOL

                  1. I do not have to a google search to know that Buckley did not support the idea of land belonging to everyone. I know this based on the very simple fact that he owned mulitple properties, and he would most certainly not have share it with clowns like you.

                    1. Buckley was a Geoist. Lots of thinking land-owners are (because that’s the system we all live in – when you’re in a prison, you eat prison food,) who desire a more just system than the abstract ownership of the earth that you support that requires so much aggression.

          3. MNG, you do realize you’re arguing with a nut with no grasp of fact or reality?

            1. While I cite academic texts, you froth. What are you doing in a place called “reason?” A poor example, “wtf.”

              1. What are you doing in a place called “reason?”

                DRINK!

              2. Oh, and just for the hell of it:
                Agricultural civilization nearly halved the lifespan of humans.

                Why would I take anyone seriously who thinks that humans used to live on average nearly 160 years?

                1. The agricultural revolution cut human lifespan by 40%.

                  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_expectancy

                  1. You obviously can’t read. According to your link, average life expectancy throughout history was around 30 years, up until the 20th century, and in modern America, the most technologically civilized nation on earth, the life expectancy is around 80 years, completely refuting your insane assertions.

                    1. Where are the fucking Morning Links? I’m getting bored messing with White Idiot.

                    2. I can read.

                      Upper Paleolithic 33 years. At age 15, life expectancy an additional 39 years (total age 54)

                      Neolithic (agriculture) 20 years.

                      Deal with it.

                    3. Why do you ignore everything after Neolithic? Deal with it, moron.

                    4. In general, the available data indicates that longer lifespans became more common recently in human evolution.[7][20] This increased longevity is attributed by some writers to cultural adaptations rather than genetic evolution

                    5. I’m not ignoring anything after the Neolithic period. All I did was disprove your previous statement.

                      Looking at my link I provided:

                      Medieval Britain 30 years
                      Early Modern Britain 25-40 years
                      Early 20th Century 50-65 years

                      Oh wow, after 10,000 years, lifespan FINALLY gets back to the 54 years Paleolithic people could expect. That’s a real run of success there. LOL

                    6. Not only are you stupid, you are dishonest:
                      Paleolithic 33 Years
                      Medieval Britain 30 years + 43 at age 21 (64 total)
                      Early 20th Century 50-65
                      Modern America approx. 80

                      And stop conflating life expectancy with life span.

                    7. I recognize that modern American, the center of the Civilization Empire, or “First World” as the dominators call it, does profit greatly from being at the top of the pyramidal hierarchy that is the agricultural City-State. But then a couple billion “third world Untermensch” (as the Dominator Hierarchy refers to their land) go hungry while resources are extracted from their landbase to the center of the empire.

                      Thus, in today’s modern civilized world, the average lifespan, 69, is exactly the same as the !Kung bushmen in the hostile and marginally livable Kalahari.

                      That’s not much of an achievement for civilization, given that the !Kung bushmen can gather their food in a couple hours of work per day, and the efforts of the civilized man are much more strenuous for the same results.

                    8. You’ve cherry picked 2 different catagories of data points, compared them, and then made a wild leap in assumption without proving a causality.

                      Paleolithic life expcetancy minus childhood mortality of 54 cannot be compared to Neolithic life expectancy of 20 that includes childhood mortality.

                      While I will conceed that there are chronic disease issues related to agriculture, saying that having a food surplus, allowing the vast majority of humanity to survive beyond childhood because some people might die from type II diabetes is bad is fucking reprehensible.

                      Should your argument sway the population of Earth I’m sure you ideological decendents will be thanking you when a more luminous sun evaporates all the water on Earth in a billion years.

                      To be fair though, you are just a troll.

                    9. I didn’t cherry pick. I just used two data points to disprove his false claim that agriculture has always led to a “progress” in life expectancy.

                      Agriculture is a disaster to human health. How much success do you consider it, even if those congregated in the Center of Empire live to 80 years – shooting themselves with insulin four times a day just to stay alive.

                      If you consider jabbing needles into your body for survival as “progress,” have at it.

                    10. Diseases of Civilization: that’s “Progress!”

                      Diabetes As a Disease of Civilization: The Impact of Culture Change on Indigenous Peoples (New Babylon, Studies in the Social Sciences) by Jennie R. Joe and Robert S. Young
                      4 used from $336.72
                      * shoot, too expensive to buy *

                    11. Can’t produce the statistic for Neolithic life expectancy minus deaths before the age of 15. Got it. Thanks for playing.

                    12. They’ve all been quoted above and referenced.

                      And I’ve discredited the silly notion of “progress.”

                      Funny how libertarians are Progressives in support of the agricultural City-STATE.

                    13. Wikipedia is a reference? Seriously?

                    14. Not anywhere outside of Ms. Wilberforce’s 5th grade civics class, no.

        5. Not sure what is scarier:

          1) WI has internet access,
          2) WI has a driver’s license,
          or 3) WI can vote.

          Certainly 1 is the most annoying.

          1. Can’t address a single issue, libertarians generally stupider than the Obomber they hate.

            1. You want to live life as a savage then go right ahead, who is stopping you ?

              1. He’d have to give up all the Gaia-killing things he loves so much:

                1) unlimited computing power
                2) internet access
                3) enough people on the planet for him to actually find like-minded lunatics
                4) air conditioning
                5) indoor plumbing
                6) MickieDee’s
                7) Tractor pulls!
                8) Not having to get his hands all yucky from cleaning the antelope he freshly killed (in his imagination)

              2. If you haven’t noticed, anybody living in a band or tribal Non-State sociopolitical typology was either killed or put on a reservation too small to live their Non-State lifestyle.

                The City-State aggressively invades and occupies, and stops anybody from living a Non-State sociopolitical typology.

                So it’s civilization (the City-STATE) that is stopping me from living in a band or tribal Non-State society. Usually with game wardens, sheriffs, farmers, etc., etc.

                1. So how big a land do need, I guess google searches do not return such answers do they ?

                  1. I guess not; I have no answer to your question, because the land base has been destroyed.

                    Iraq was forested with Cedars before the agricultural revolution. Then the agricultural City-State came along and destroyed it, making it desert. How many people could live in Iraq in a band or tribal Non-State society?

                    How many here? I don’t know. We’ve lost species, we’ve lost half the topsoil in a short time.

                    You’re like a rapist bargaining, but not acknowledging the damage he’s already done by his aggression.

                    1. I’m just curious, have you ever killed, cleaned, and prepared to eat any wild game?

                    2. Do Hamdingers count?

                    3. More people live in Iraq now, than ever before. So what exactly are you getting at ?

                      Here is one for you, the proof that there was a mass extinction of mega fauna in the American continents is irrefutable. Further this occurred as soon as humans entered the continent, this was not caused by libertarians or city states, this was cause by your sacred hunter gatherers.

                    4. Nobody in Iraq is living in a Non-State sociopolitical typology (band or tribe.)

                      Yep, I know about the extinction of mega fauna.

                      “The standard rejoinder when discussing the ecological devastation wrought by civilization and the relatively benign existence of hunter-gatherers is to point out that hunter-gatherers caused extinctions of their own?the extinction of the megafauna at the beginning of the Holocene interglacial…This is ill-founded anachronism of the highest order.”

                      Overkill, Overchill and Human Nature
                      by Jason Godesky
                      http://rewild.info/anthropik/2…..an-nature/

                    5. Were humans really hunting saber-toothed tigers, and in such numbers as to drive a robust and healthy species into extinction?

                      No, they were hunting the prey of the saber tooth cats (smilodon, not actually tigers, which the so-called ‘expert’ who wrote that article seems unaware of) which the cats relied on to survive.

                      Fucking food chain. How does it work?

                    6. To you, like that of a rapist or cannibal. The only liberty libertarians seek is to not be raped or cannibalized while they rape and cannibalize others.

                    7. Non-sequitur much? Fucking loon.

                    8. STEVE SMITH LOVE WHITE INDIAN. WANTS WHITE INDIAN TO JOIN HIM IN PRISTINE WOODS ONLY STEVE KNOW. GOOD TIMES.

                    9. I “hunted” an entire box of McNuggets, once.

                    10. And then I raped them, like the white devil rapes Gaia.

                    11. Rape is an appropriate analogy, often used by libertarians.

                      And often scorned by libertarians when it is show that they support aggression themselves.

                    12. STEVE SMITH OFTEN USE RAPE! RAPE WHITE INDIAN IN WOODS! AARROOO!!

                    13. It seems libertarians, while they hate the IMF and other aggressors, merely want to eliminate their better competitors.

                      “International Monetary Fund, an elite supra-national organization which rapes and pillages small, defenseless countries and their citizens…” http://www.lewrockwell.com/hol…..d47.1.html

                    14. You are actually wrong about the Iraqis. I met many Bedouins who live in the Western Iraqi desert. The state simply doesn’t exist out there, especially in the post-Saddam days. These people are seriously off the radar. One guy with 5 or 6 wives, some kids and a few goats. They move from well (dug by the State) to well and live in tents. It is really scary how remote that part of the desert is. If you don’t have access to water, you will die VERY quickly. Ironically, were it not for the state digging those wells, nomadic life (which is tribally based) there would not be possible.

                    15. “Ironically, were it not for the state digging those wells, nomadic life (which is tribally based) there would not be possible.”

                      It is possible for non-governmental entities to dig wells. I have heard of and read of wells that were not dug by some government or other.

        6. Dude, when your Malthusian fap fantasy comes to fruition (apologies to the readersfor alliteration), and 6+ billion people have to die, do you suppose it will be you or I that goes first. I really, really, really hope it’s you.

          1. 6+ billion people dying is going to be a consequence of agricultural City-State’s farming-out soils, mining fertility, and exhaustion of Mother Earth.

            You have to own up to it – it’s a consequence of your techno-fap-fap fantasy.

            Now go jerk off to Jeffrey Tucker’s Jetson’s book.

            1. I’m too busy taking a shit on the Global Footprint Network web site. Apologies to Sandy.

      4. Not a spoof: He had become a “heemanee” for which there ain’t no English word. And he was a good one, too.

        1. Not a spoof: He had become a “heemanee” for which there ain’t no English word. And he was a good one, too.

          “Fucking crazy faggot” works for me.

      5. Each morning, a missionary advertises neon sign
        He tells the native population that civilization is fine
        And three educated savages holler from a bamboo tree
        That civilization is a thing for me to see

        So bongo, bongo, bongo, I don’t wanna leave the Congo, oh no no no no no
        Bingo, bangle, bungle, I’m so happy in the jungle, I refuse to go
        Don’t want no bright lights, false teeth, doorbells, landlords, I make it clear
        That no matter how they coax him, I’ll stay right here

        I looked through a magazine the missionary’s wife concealed (Magazine? What happens?)
        I see how people who are civilized bung you with automobile (You know you can get hurt that way Daniel?)
        At the movies they have got to pay many coconuts to see (What do they see, Darling?)
        Uncivilized pictures that the newsreel takes of me

        So bongo, bongo, bongo, he don’t wanna leave the Congo, oh no no no no no
        Bingo, bangle, bungle, he’s so happy in the jungle, he refuse to go
        Don’t want no penthouse, bathtub, streetcars, taxis, noise in my ear
        So, no matter how they coax him, I’ll stay right here

        They hurry like savages to get aboard an iron train
        And though it’s smokey and it’s crowded, they’re too civilized to complain
        When they’ve got two weeks vacation, they hurry to vacation ground (What do they do, Darling?)
        They swim and they fish, but that’s what I do all year round

        So bongo, bongo, bongo, I don’t wanna leave the Congo, oh no no no no no
        Bingo, bangle, bungle, I’m so happy in the jungle, I refuse to go
        Don’t want no jailhouse, shotgun, fish-hooks, golf clubs, I got my spears
        So, no matter how they coax him, I’ll stay right here

        They have things like the atom bomb, so I think I’ll stay where I ahm
        Civilization, I’ll stay right here!

      6. Episiarch|8.18.11 @ 11:10AM
        Remember, this is Troll Free Thursday. Pass it on.

    2. Wait… they gave the Unabomber internet access in supermax?

      1. Yours is a culture of Death, driven by an urge to dominate and control – and destroy – Mother Nature. That puts the crimes of Ted K. to shame.

        “The earth is not dying. It is being killed, and the people killing it have names and addresses.” ~Utah Phillips

        1. “That puts the crimes of Ted K. to shame.”

          Ah, see, you blew it there. This is a spoofer.

        2. You’re all poopyheads! And you all smell like POOP!

          1. But…but…if we all go back to hunting/gathering we will smell like poopyheads!, Amiright???

            1. Wrong.

              The Eastern Woodlands Indians are recorded as feeling pity for the filthy civilized settlers.

              1. Such has always been the view of The Others. See Rome; barbarian.

              2. After the Indians started dying of smallpox and the settlers started slaughtering them with their better weapons, the Indians didn’t feel too much pity for anyone but themselves.

                1. Libertarian goes Butch NeoCon. Hooyah!

                  1. Tough world dude. But it is tougher if you are a hunter gatherer and your enemies are not.

                    And also, having Indians in my family, I find your depiction of Native Americans as not having a full fledged civilization to be disgustingly racist. The Indians had a very advanced civilization and were anything but hunter gatherers.

                    1. “Tough world dude,” said the Butch Neo-Con, as his libertarian masquerade charade fell off.

                      The Eastern Woodlands Indians had an advanced *society,* not civilization.

                      Albeit some of the new world dwellers had advanced civilizations, like the Mayans and Incas and Mississippi Culture – but those civilizations failed as all civilizations do.

                      That’s because aggression and control and domination of civilization (the City-STATE) are like fiat money — short term party-time only.

                    2. Understanding the harsh reality of the world means you are a neocon.

                      And my God you are fucking stupid. The Eastern Indians had advanced agriculture, large settlements and routinely burned the forest down to grow their crops. They were a civilization by any definition.

                    3. No, they were not a civilization. They were a Non-State sociopolitical typology using hunting, gathering, and horticulture (often conflated with agriculture, but with significant differences.)

                    4. And yes, Indians used fire in swidden horticulture. Doing that in small areas, they actually increased the fertility of the soil, and the Amazon rainforest is being recognized now as a human artifact – a gigantic garden.

                      Now you, like a rapist, point to a husband doing a little slap and tickle with his wife, and then you say you’re doing exactly the same thing as you brutally rape her.

                      Gardening Mother Earth (horticulture or permaculture) is to agriculture what making love is to rape.

                    5. You are an ignorant racist White Indian. And I dare you to go out to Oklahoma and go into a good Indian bar and tell them how they were hunter gatherers and didn’t have a civilization.

                    6. No, I’ve just read the anthropological, ethnographic, and archeological literature.

                      Pick up Mann’s 1491. It’s a good start, and some civilizations did start in the New World. But the “Indians” that the “White Indians” fled to (from civilization) lived in a tribal sociopolitical typology, not a State sociopolitical typology.

                    7. I dare you to go out to Oklahoma and go into a good Indian bar

                      [::shudders::] Please. Filthy, filthy people.

                    8. Plus… they taste kinda funny.

                      Don’t ask.

                    9. OK, assuming that you are not just an elaborate parody, what policies or actions do you propose to make the world into what you see as better?

                    10. I’d like to live in a Non-State sociopolitical typology* instead of the agricultural City-STATE.

                      * NON-STATE AND STATE SOCIETIES http://faculty.smu.edu/rkemper…..ieties.pdf

                      I pick on agriculture, because anthropology and archeology, put so succinctly, know this:

                      “Agriculture creates government.” ~Richard Manning, Against the Grain, p. 73

                    11. @Zeb

                      I’m not evading your question, but I don’t really know what to do. Should a rape victim necessarily have to come up with policies and proposals and actions to stop rape?

                      But I will recommend attorney Jeff Vail’s policies and proposals as a way of ascending from the Hell of Civilization in an orderly manner, and trying to avoid an inevitable collapse of civilization, which will hurt many people.

                      What is Rhizome?
                      by Jeff Vail
                      January 28, 2008
                      http://www.jeffvail.net/2007/0…..izome.html

                      But, frankly, I think civilized people are a Culture, a CULT of death, and they’ll keep farming out the soil and resources of Earth until they commit collective suicide.

                      I’m not going to force anybody to reform, but it’s still sad to see an alcoholic abuse himself to death.

                    12. Please don’t read anything into my using the word “rape” more frequently than I do either periods or commas, incidentally.

                      Rape.

                      Rape.

                    13. That’s what the agricultural City-State does. Rape. Rapes Mother Earth and all her children, for the benefit of a few.

                      Like I said, rape is an appropriate metaphor, as it is here:

                      “International Monetary Fund, an elite supra-national organization which RAPES and pillages small, defenseless countries and their citizens…” http://www.lewrockwell.com/hol…..d47.1.html

                    14. Rape. Raperaperape. Raperaperaperaperaperaperaperape. Rape rape, rape. Rape.

                      Rape.

                    15. “I’m not evading your question, but I don’t really know what to do.”

                      It may not be possible to perfectly replicate a world that no longer exists, however, if you join with us in ending or at least reducing the power of government you would have more freedom to experiment and replicate at least some of the important aspects of non-agricultural societies of the past. I am reminded of an Australian Aboriginal lady who was approached by a white social worker who said “I’m here to help you. What can I do?” The Aboriginal lady replied, “If you are here to help me, please go, but if you see that my freedom and yours are linked, then please stay and we can serve each other.”

                      We may not agree on much but I do believe that your freedom and mine are linked. If you work with us, rather than against us we can both benefit.

                    16. When libertarians support abstract ownership of the earth, they are (perhaps unwittingly) supporting big government.

                      Land Title is the foremost big-government enTITLEment program.

                    17. Episiarch|8.18.11 @ 11:10AM
                      Remember, this is Troll Free Thursday. Pass it on.

                    18. “Remember, this is Troll Free Thursday. Pass it on.”

                      If someone has an actual argument to maker, rather than pointless insults I see no harm in replying.

                    19. WI, property ownership need not be enforced by government. Government, in fact, is a THREAT to property rights, rather than a protector of them.

                    20. That’s the libertarian rhetoric, but abstract ownership of the earth’s surface (agricultural and resource property rights) is always accomplished by initiation of force. Always.

                      Of course, don’t be surprised if the “rights” the elite have granted you to get you into the pyramidal hierarchical organization are one day abrogated so that more wealth can flow to the elite.

                      As Stanley Diamond says in his book “In search of the Primitive: A Critique of Civilization,” civilization is externally invasive and internally repressive.

                      Only in libertarian fantasy sci-fi novels is civilization magically different.

                      Empirical evidence from archeology and anthropology observe a reality-based assessment of how human society works, outside of our former Non-State sociopolitical typology:

                      “Agriculture creates government.” ~Richard Manning, Against the Grain, p. 73

                    21. “but abstract ownership of the earth’s surface (agricultural and resource property rights) is always accomplished by initiation of force. Always.”

                      If the Cherokee, Muscogee (Creek),Seminole, and Choctaw nations had successfully resisted being forcibly removed from their homelands would this have been “the initiation of force” on their part? No, it would not have been. The people doing the initiating would have been those trying to forcibly remove them.

      2. “Wait… they gave the Unabomber internet access in supermax?”

        As long as he doesn’t have mailing priviliges…

        1. Libertarians refer to killing and murdering the earth as “development.”

          1. I am thinking the earth was here for a few billion years before man and will do quite nicely long after we are gone considering that it survived dinosaur killing asteroids and ice ages and such before us.

            Murdering the earth? Really?

            1. Really. Sixth Great Extinction.

              Human activity is driving Earth’s ‘sixth great extinction event’

              Population growth, pollution and invasive species are having a disastrous effect on species in the southern hemisphere, a major review by conservationists warns

              http://www.guardian.co.uk/envi…..-australia

              1. If that is true, you are clearly part of the problem. The obvious solution is for people like you to kill yourselves before you do anymore damage. How do you wake up every morning knowing you are killing the earth? Me I don’t care. But you do. Suicide is really the only way you can avoid being a part of this.

                1. Is Libertarianism defined by “GO KILL YOURSELF?” Really, it’s quite a frequent mantra.

                  Weird how they sound so much like the Butch Neo-Con bullies.

                  I think Libertarians secretly want to be Butch Neo-Con bullies, and their professed hatred of the government is only a pretext for eliminating the psychopathic competition.

                2. Humans aren’t the problem. The aggressive and dominating agricultural City-STATE is the problem.

                  I like how Lew Rockwell puts it….if he had only correctly identified the problem. I’ll fix that by correctly identifying the STATE as a whole system, thusly:

                  “The leviathan [civilization,] that monster devouring the earth in this century, is in the throes of death.” ? Llewellyn H. Rockwell

              2. Yes, you see, there has NEVER been another INVASIVE species anywhere before!

                1. “Waldooooooooo! Waldo P. Emerson Jones! You get right in this house this very minute and get ready for dinner, young man! And that means washing ALL of that silly ‘war paint’ off your face, this time!”

                  1. “Awwwwwwww, MOOOOOOOOOmmmmmmmmmmmmmm! I’m raging against the white man’s machIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINE — !!!”

                    1. Only a heartless Neo-Con would stoop to mocking my sainted, beloved mother, who passed away — suddenly; shockingly — while in the simple act of squatting. On a totem pole.

                    2. Stop hurting my feelings.

                    3. A big, wet, throbbing, totem pole.

                      *fap*fap*fap*fap*fap*fap*fap*fap*

                    4. Why do libertarians have to dishonestly obfuscate like this?

                      Oh right, they’re like Marxists when Marxist are confronted with the logical inconsistencies of their dogma.

                      Marxism and Libertarianism are peas in a pod. Both recognize something is wrong with the City-State, but they aren’t smart enough to identify it. Thus they fantasize about divorcing the State from the agricultural City-State, which is about a realistic as divorcing the wings from an airplane and expecting it to fly.

                    5. Call him drunken Ira Hayes
                      He won’t answer anymore
                      not the whiskey drinkin’ indian
                      Nor the marine who went to war

                    6. ::LOOK OUT WINDOW, SEE SOME BASTARD LITTERING::

                      ::SHED SINGLE, POIGNANT TEAR::

                      ::TURN UP VOLUME ON BEST OF CHER CD::

                    7. Episiarch|8.18.11 @ 11:10AM
                      Remember, this is Troll Free Thursday. Pass it on.

                    8. “Remember, this is Troll Free Thursday. Pass it on.”

                      I see no harm in responding to someone who is making an actual argument.

  13. Bachmann elaborated, “What submission means to us … it means respect.”

    So, does she get the Muslim vote, or did she offend?

    (I say the latter.)

    1. That is the interesting thing. She should get the non blowing thing up Muslim vote and the orthodox Jewish vote. At some point in this country, people are going to start aligning by their interests rather than the laundry they root for.

  14. No morning links. I guess the intern was out late last night and woke up with a case of the stupids. They need to leave Mangu Ward in charge of them. She actually gets them up on time.

  15. White Indian is the Slurm of Hit & Run.

    1. Futurama reference?

      1. Yes. Sweet, sticky and terrible for you–yet so irresistible, you’d suck a giant worm’s asshole to get more.

        1. If that were true, you would think Tony would be responding to him. Tony seems to be the one person who can resist him. Maybe Tony knows something about sucking assholes the rest of us don’t.

          1. Sockpuppets know better than to fight. They unravel and it’s just two sticky hands groping each other.

            1. Episiarch|8.18.11 @ 11:10AM
              Remember, this is Troll Free Thursday. Pass it on.

      2. No, the other slurm.

    2. Isn’t it Thursday?

      1. North Baltimore family stands up for lemonade

        It’s not like life handed the Brody family lemons. They just like making lemonade.

        For much of the summer, the family ? Mark, who sells life insurance;Robyn, a homemaker; and their children, Leo, 8, Blanche, 6, Rachel, 5, and Max, 4 ? have sold homemade lemonade for $1 a cup in their driveway in Homeland.

        And it’s not just any driveway, but one that empties into the southbound lane of Charles Street at Northern Parkway, one of north Baltimore’s busiest intersections.

        Mom makes the lemonade and bubble letters for the signs. The kids color them in, pour the lemonade and carry it to a captive audience of cars sitting at the red light, inches from the driveway.

        Nothing else happens.

        http://www.baltimoresun.com/ex…..1063.story

        1. They are in Baltimore. That wasn’t a lemonade stand, it was a crack stand. That is just how they roll in Crackmore.

    3. Well, it *does* appear to be highly addictive.

      1. I had also considered The Stuff.

        1. “Gentlemen, are you eatin’ it…or is it eatin’ YOU?”

          Awesome.

          Did you consider The Food of the Gods? “One taste is all it takes!”

          1. Herakleophorbia IV is addictive, but talking to sockpuppets just makes you small inside.

            And certain studies coming out of Europe suggest that it may shrink your generative organs by at least 25%. But stopping does let them grow back, in some cases larger than ever.

        2. Watching that and Q back-to-back makes for a most enjoyable movie night.

          1. I think that one of the worse aspects of getting older is having fewer and fewer people who are willing to watch awesomely terrible movies with you. A double feature of Grizzly and The Manitou is still a good time to me, dammit.

            1. Last night on NBA TV The Fish that Saved Pittsburgh was one. Now that is an awesomely terrible movie

    4. Do I even want to know what “slurm” is? Probably not.

      1. Click the worm asshole link. Click it, coward!

        1. I clicked. I regret that I don’t watch enough TV – at least not enough of shows like this. Been trying to keep up with Family Guy and American Dad but usually end up watching my favorite baseball team.

  16. “And I wish someone had said, “I’m sick of politicians talking about creating jobs. Government can’t create real jobs. The best thing it can do is get out of your way. We should shut up about creating jobs.”

    Nobody really laid out the truth and offered the big cuts that are needed. I’ll vote for the politician who says that and means it.”

    Hey Stossel… that sounds exactly like Gov Gary Johnson.

  17. Don’t really give a damn about Bachman’s religious beliefs. I do care about her views on the size and role of government in matters of economics, civil liberties, and foreign policy. She’s gotten it right more times than not on economics, on civil liberties she’s no better than the rest of her party(black mark), on foreign policy she’s either an opportunist or she’s honestly coming around. In any case I’m still voting for Paul.

  18. Don’t really give a damn about Bachman’s religious beliefs. I do care about her views on the size and role of government in matters of economics, civil liberties, and foreign policy.

    The sane approach. Admirable.

    1. Bachman’s religious beliefs include political domination. So they matter.

      1. Hey! I just noticed: “teepee” and “peepee” have almost exactly THE SAME LETTERS — !!!

      2. It would matter less if she forced us to go back to eating gold and using seashells as currency.

        1. “It would matter less if she forced us to go back to eating gold and using seashells as currency.”

          I have never found a good recipe for gold. Could you share one for us?

          1. I’ve seen the Iron Chefs use it.

  19. We learned that some two-term Governors are worth inviting (Huntsman, Romney), while others (Johnson) aren’t.

  20. I guess Reason has canceled morning links the bastards.

    1. I’m giving them til 9CDT then I’m posting links in this thread.

  21. Ugh, no Morning Links means this Stossel post is the surrogate and therefore going to be super comment heavy as we rape it, repeatedly and frustratingly filling it with our links. (Some of us have links that don’t even work, which will only add to the frustration.)

    That’s going to make page reloading tonight’s Team Stossel Liveblog extra bogged down for all the many followers.

    1. White Indian has already violated it repeatedly. So it should be used to it.

      1. Really gotta worry about White Indian’s fixation with rape and death.

        That can’t be healthy.

  22. It doesn’t appear that there will be morning links, so I’ll post it here.
    http://www.realclearpolitics.c…..drome.html

    Fuck, liberals are so racist. I don’t even like Cain, but after this, Garafolo ranks pretty high on my list of horrible, disgusting people.

    1. Cain is about a hundred times more successful in life than that bitch. Who the fuck is she to call him names?

    2. I wonder what she was like before falling into the clutches of Hollywood. Was she always that batshit crazy? Did her views evolve over time? Was she somewhat sane before falling in thrall to the California Insane Asylum?

      1. When is the last time she had a movie roll of any significance? Saying crazy leftist shit is really the only way she can get any traction with the public at all. I am sure she is annoyingly crazy. But there is no question a lot of this is performance art.

    3. You’re just saying that ’cause I’m black!

    4. Wow, she even got in “Kochtopuss!!”

    5. Come! See the violence inherent in the paternalisticly intrinsic system! Where the fuck was Matt Damon for this? They could have hit the perfecta.

    6. Wow! She REALLY hasn’t aged well.

    7. It’s pretty sad, really. The idea that someone from a minority supporting the Republicans/conservatives really fucks up the progressive narrative that Republicans/conservatives are all bigots and racists, so folks like Janeane need to cast aspersions on the characters of those who mess with their cherished narratives.

      It’s a perverse version of No True Scotsman.

      “No true black man [or woman or whatever] would be a Republican/conservative, so they’re either a traitor to their social group, or they’re being manipulated to support something they would never have otherwise.”

  23. And yesterday’s Morning Links weren’t even “Morning”… just Reason News. What nefarious plan is this?

    1. Riggs reversed that under pressure.

      1. I saw that – I had to doulbe check that ‘mea culpa’ didn’t mean ‘last time’ in latin.

      2. just saw that…

        1. I claim responsibility. Follow me, fellow rebels, as we build on this victory and march on Reason to demand even more threaded commenting! Who’s with me!?!

  24. I REMIND YOU THIS IS THURSDAY, FOLKS.

    1. ??????????????????????????????????

    2. Well, we wouldn’t have to fuck around with the trolls if we had our Goddamn MORNING LINKS!

      1. Episiarch|8.18.11 @ 11:10AM
        Remember, this is Troll Free Thursday. Pass it on.

  25. And apparently mentioning the one politician who “says that and means it” doesn’t get folks to read columns. Come on John, where’s the Gary Johnson love?

  26. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

  27. When she’s trying to be the leader of the country, but here beliefs prevent her from being the leader of her household, than yes, I think it matters.

    I am the unquestioned god-king of all things legal at work. I have actually said “So let it be written, so let it be done” and yea, verily, it was so written, and it was done as I commanded.

    Not so much at home.

    1. THen, the conventional wisdom would hold that you probably are not the type of guy who relishes the services of a domineering BDSM Mistress.

      You’ve got that covered already.

    2. The whole thing is sexist. If a man said “my wife runs the house with an iron fist” no one would think anything of it.

      1. Well, I would, for one. I would immediately need to check your asshole for diameter and magnetism.

  28. Re: What Indian?

    Must we?

  29. Am I the only one who finds it amusing that What Indian?’s supposedly post-modern screed against civilization is lifted chapter and verse from Enlightenment-era romanticizing of the Noble Savage?

    1. Yup and it is racist as hell.

    2. @RC Dean.

      “White Indians” is the name of a chapter in the following book:

      The Invasion Within
      The Contest of Cultures in Colonial North America
      James Axtell
      Oxford University Press
      http://www.oup.com/us/catalog/…..0195041545

      Piss and moan to Oxford, if you think you really have a gripe.

      1. How on earth does the us of the term “White Indian” in some book somehow bear on my observation about regurgitated romanticizing of the Noble Savage?

        1. Because you are a RACIST, RC Dean, by using the racist term “Noble Savage,” explained as follows:

          The term “Noble Savage,” as we have it today, was a straw man concocted by white supremacists in order to take over the British Ethnological Society, in order to end its opposition to slavery, colonialism, and other imperial atrocities, and instead use it as a vehicle to advance their own racist views.

          ~Jason Godesky
          The Savages are Truly Noble
          http://rewild.info/anthropik/2…..index.html

  30. Seriously, how many fucking times do I have to repeat myself about Pale Rider? This makes 4 times now. He is either:

    a. A Malthusian who wants to decrease the world population by about 6.5 billion so the survivors can live a glorious existence picking nuts and berries

    b. A magnificent sock-puppet

    c. Jared Loughner’s long-lost brother

    d. all the above

    Quit giving him the attention he so desperately craves.

    1. Quite the choices there. LOL

    2. e. Best new troll since Organic Girl ?

    3. “Quit giving him the attention he so desperately craves.”

      Regardless of his motivation, he provides a wonderful opportunity to discuss topics that rarely get discussed. We libertarians should be the first to WELCOME those that challenge long held beliefs. I strongly disagree with many of the things he says but we should not shy away from controversial topics or off beat beliefs, we should welcome them.

      1. he provides a wonderful opportunity to discuss topics…

        Nope – it’s primarily cut & paste. After a while, you see the repetition.

        It’s not a discussion, it’s a timewaster.

        1. “Nope – it’s primarily cut & paste.”

          If so he is copying and pasting things rarely seen. It is still a wonderful opportunity to discuss these things.

        2. And I have another motivation for responding in a meaningful way. Other non-libertarians sometimes wander in here, curious about what we discuss. If they see people blowing people like WI or others who at least appear to have something important to discuss and they may think there are serious weaknesses in our philosophy. I want to put forth the strongest possible face for others to see. It is OK to have fun and joke around but to discourage others from responding can appear to show weakness.

          1. “If they see people blowing people like WI or others who at least appear to have something important to discuss and they may think there are serious weaknesses in our philosophy.”

            Uhh insert the word “off” between the word “blowing” and the second “people”. LOL

            1. There are no accidents.

              Also: call me…?

          2. PIRS: I had a running “dialogue” with the fuckstick the first time I encountered him (about two weeks ago). Like a fool, I tried to debate him on the “merits” of his posts.

            The result was 24 straight hours of the hyper-crazy, punctuated by insults about libertarians and charges of raping mother gaia. Over 100 posts by him. He repeated the performance a few days ago.

            Fuck him with his Mother Gaia’s strap-on.

            1. Mother Gaia’s strap-on.

              Let me guess… Florida?

              1. Yes, James…?

  31. Delicious desire.

    In a learned
    memory you
    can find the
    atmosphere that
    often appears
    near a luminous
    faith.

    Francesco Sinibaldi

  32. The term “Noble Savage,” as we have it today, was a straw man concocted by white supremacists in order to take over the British Ethnological Society, in order to end its opposition to slavery, colonialism, and other imperial atrocities, and instead use it as a vehicle to advance their own racist views.

    ~Jason Godesky
    The Savages are Truly Noble
    http://rewild.info/anthropik/2…..index.html

    1. Race you to the mulberry tree!

      1. I solemnly swear never, ever to think of him as being in any way “noble,” if that helps any.

  33. Pure unabashed ridicule isn’t technically feeding them, is it?

  34. Just to add more ironic spice, the Noble Savage trope that What Indian? has swallowed hook, line, and sinker, was actually used by Rousseau (one of its main proponents) as a foil to argue for . . . wait for it . . . the social contract!

    1. ron johnson & gary paul 2012!!!

  35. Poll Results:

    1. Mitt Romney
    2. ???
    3. Profit!

    1. Vote for Mitt Romney! Because Mormon’s want to blow the shit out of Muslims too! Not to mention he wears magic underpants. What a no-brainer there.

  36. I hope she’ll come on my show. I’ll say to her: I thought “submission” meant submission. If it means respect, why not say “respect”?

    Because what we all need right now is more pettiness and juvenile behavior, right?

    Spare me.

    1. MSM: “Candidate ‘X’ might be gay, or bisexual.”

      REASON (correctly): “Right of privacy! No one’s business but their own!

      MSM: “Candidate ‘Y’ might mainline Cap’n Crunch, or regard cough syrup as one of the four basic food groups.”

      REASON (correctly): “Right of privacy! No one’s business but their own!

      MSM: “Candidate ‘Z’ might willingly share Christian beliefs with her husband.”

      REASON: “AAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGHHHHHHHHHH — !!!”

  37. “I’ll defend the indefensible.”

    Jersey Shore?

    1. The Green Lantern movie?

        1. The replacement Darrin, on Bewitched?

            1. Nude photos of Bea Arthur?

  38. Those people who strap people down and cut them? Turns out they’re surgeons!

  39. Boaz and Gillespie! And not even advertised as such.

  40. “Hurricane Critique”

    My mother-in-law.

  41. Nick is talking about a heat wave wearing that leather jacket.

  42. “We have two kidneys…”

    Speak for yourself! Unilateral renal agenesis is a real thing, Stossel, you insensitive bastard.

  43. Queer as a three-dollar RoPaul bill.

  44. I would love to wear Susan B. Anthony on my wrist. Hey!

  45. Boaz draws the line at legalized rape. The slaver.

  46. “Marriage is a public good.”

    Tell that to Sandy Bullock and Jesse James.

  47. I smell a quick edit there as Brian talked traditional marriage.

  48. Harsanyi is just a tool of Big Marriage. Dig deeper and you’ll see he’s already invested heavily in private marriage companies.

  49. “True and good and beautiful” = marriage.

    Tell that to Arnie and Maria.

  50. Stossel corresponds with a guy and his horse-wife?

  51. “Another bad idea.” Man on the street has Stoss’s number.

  52. The threat of gossip makes people act better? Then blackmail should be illegal, because it let’s rich people off the hook!

  53. “Alexander Hamilton was successfully blackmailed.”

    Apparently not.

  54. I’m going to blackmail Robert for wearing that shirt and tie combo.

    1. I hate that guy and his wife’s huge tits.

      1. They actually look quite similar.

        1. yea, but one’s slightly bigger than the other, so she walks slanted a little to the left… oh you mean Dog and his wife. my bad.

  55. Yes, but can bounty hunters accurately shoot dogs?

  56. Ha, the police are just as shady as bounty hunters, so it’s okay.

  57. The cops are taking it on the chin on tonight’s Stossel.

  58. Ha, bounty hunters are polite to the people once they catch them because they rely on repeat business. Nice.

  59. Russian roulette = climbing Mnt. Everest

  60. Wow, the guests’ kids are also taking it on the chin tonight.

  61. What if Ron Paul money was involved? Still dirty?

  62. Prostitution = child trafficking?

  63. Ooo, good question about corporate espionage by the young fel- GET A HAIRCUT YOU LOOK LIKE A GIRL!

  64. If a guy in a dark movie theater says to me “snack on this” things take a completely different turn than it did in this commercial.

  65. “The pimp, the slanderer, the miser, the slum lord.”

    Still all you, John.

  66. Government protect our rights? From whom? The government? THAT’S THE ROOSTER GUARDING THE HEN HOUSE!

    1. That doesn’t sound right. Is that the saying?

      1. FOX guarding the henhouse…

  67. If a guy in a dark movie theater says to me “snack on this” things take a completely different turn than it did in this commercial
    Nike Mercurial Vapor Superfly FG Football Soccer-Blue/Black
    Nike Mercurial Vapor Superfly FG Football Soccer-Red/Silver

  68. Ron paul is actually a pART of the Bush family and I can prove it!!!
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dVmwoR24rc

  69. You say, “Nobody really laid out the truth and offered the big cuts that are needed. I’ll vote for the politician who says that and means it.”

    You could not possibly have made such a statement had you EVER, EVER watched or listened to Ron Paul.

    “Bring home the troops.” “Shut our overseas bases and end the empire.” “Eliminate the Dep’ts of Education, Energy, Homeland Security” “Slowly reduce entitlements.” “Allow young people to opt out of Social Security if they want to.” “Wipe out 1.6 trillion dollars of our debt owned by the Federal Reserve.” “Just follow the Constitution.” And so much more.

    Where have you been for the past many years, Mr. Stossel? Certainly not watching or listening to this century’s and last centurys’ greatest advocate of liberty and the constitution.

  70. I am encouraged that some candidates are finally talking about reigning in the printing press. Printing has been lowering the standard of living for a long time, especially for retirees.

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