Jazz and Modern Liberalism: The Eerie Parallels
Anytime Esquire writes extensively about politicians, it's going to be pretty icky, and this Tom Junod piece which compares Obama's governing style to "positive discipline" parenting (this makes us a bunch of bratty children) is pretty super-icky. (Esquire can never quite get it through its head that what politicians do, mostly, is order around mass murder, mass theft, and the spinning of resources and power to their buddies. They certainly aren't alone in missing this point, though. But they really, really, really miss it. Politicians to them are always noble guardians of the best in the American spirit or some such sententious bullshit.)
That all said, there's one really funny line in the piece spinning a comparative metaphor about jazz and modern liberalism that's also somewhat wise, and I say this as someone who does love jazz as much as I say, and does hate modern liberalism probably more than I can say:
Everybody's frustrated with Barack Obama. We like him, we're glad he's president, but we're frustrated with him. Sure, he's done a lot more than he's gotten credit for. Sure, he's basically governed as he said he was going to govern in The Audacity of Hope. He's even been audacious, especially if audacity can be measured by expenditure. But when does the "hope" part start? When does the Obama part start? It's as if we voted for Miles — that ease, that seething grace — and got Wynton instead, a careful custodian of a tradition that nobody likes as much as they say they do.
I've bitched about Esquire's tongue-bathing of the vice president before.
Editor's Note: As of February 29, 2024, commenting privileges on reason.com posts are limited to Reason Plus subscribers. Past commenters are grandfathered in for a temporary period. Subscribe here to preserve your ability to comment. Your Reason Plus subscription also gives you an ad-free version of reason.com, along with full access to the digital edition and archives of Reason magazine. We request that comments be civil and on-topic. We do not moderate or assume any responsibility for comments, which are owned by the readers who post them. Comments do not represent the views of reason.com or Reason Foundation. We reserve the right to delete any comment and ban commenters for any reason at any time. Comments may only be edited within 5 minutes of posting. Report abuses.
Please
to post comments
Don't blame me, I voted for Dizzy Gillespie.
Salt Peanuts! Salt Peanuts!
http://www.online-piracy.int.tc/
Nice.
Johnny is a false god, and I am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me.
For truth, seek the Guaraldi Three.
RT
http://www.online-piracy.int.yadayada
How about, "It's as if we voted for John, and got Ringo instead."
I'm warning you with peace and love... I've got TOO MUCH TO DO.
A more apt comparison might be: we voted for John, and got Yoko instead.
It's as if someone voted in 2000 for the Bush who wanted a modest foreign policy, and instead got two wars.
Oh, Oh! I got another one (bluegrass edition):
"It's as if we voted for Bela Fleck and got Earl Scruggs instead."
Earl Scruggs rules.
Are you saying everyone doesn't REALLY love Ringo? I'd disillusioned...
It's as if we voted for Ted Bundy, and got Jeffrey Dahmer, instead.
If somebody told me I only had an hour to live, I'd spend it choking a white man. I'd do it nice and slow.
Me too. The white man would be Joe Biden.
Going only by what Biden says, I think he's been deprived of enough oxygen in this life.
Autoerotic asphyxiation-related, I'm guessing.
Eeeeewwwwwwww!
Thanks a lot! I'm gonna be right at the moment of orgasm and up in my mind will flash a scene of Biden leaning forward hard with a rope around his neck attached to a headboard while he furiously beats off and rides a large buttplug.
Damnit...
I don't doubt it Kyle. but please keep those fantasies to yourself.
Where the hell is sugarfree?
Biden is a gasper. That's why you rarely see him in a tie. They get him all riled up.
Sure, he's done a lot more than he's gotten credit for.
Well, he's kept Gitmo open, he's expanded our war in the Mideast, he's approved kangaroo courts for terrorists, he's spent far more than anyone thought possible, he's thrown open the doors of his administration to lobbyists, he's stocked his staff with hard-core leftists, he's conducted a prolonged exercise in governance-by-press-release.
Does that about cover it?
Sure, he's basically governed as he said he was going to govern in The Audacity of Hope.
Except for the part about stocking his staff with hard-core leftists, I defy anyone to find any of his "accomplishments" in any of his books or campaign speeches.
Don't forget nationalizing entire sectors of the economy! Oh! And the health care takeover attempt too!
"It's as if we voted for Pharoah Sanders and got Kenny G instead."
Why, it's almost as if we voted for Col. Sanders, and got Ronald McDonald instead.
I would've said Sonny Sharrock instead of Pharoah Sanders, but same idea.
... to be consistent, though, that would be something like "It's as if we voted for Sonny Sharrock and got William Ackerman instead" or something...
(full disclosure: I think Will is actually semi-awesome.)
Or John Coltrane and got Kenny G
Or Kenny G and got that kid from band camp
Nah, the kid from band camp is still a better player.
Jazz and Modern Liberalism: The Eerie Parallels
I sure hope so, since the only tools who like jazz are fifty-something fudgepackers. It will be gone by 2040.
That's the worst tolling I've seen this millennium. You're not putting any effort into it at all.
I resent 1/2 of that characterization, and resemble the other 1/2. NOYFB which 1/2 ;^)
"Play Freebird, motherfuckers"
**chugs 20th can of PBR**
Who knows what the fuck these idiots voted for. What they got was an 8th rate CC DeVille impersonator with no thumbs and a prosthetic arm. In short, almost completely unsuited for the job he holds.
And fuck this asshole Junod for insulting Davis and Marsalis by just thinking of comparing them to Obama. Much less actually doing so.
That's not really very fair. A prosthetic limb would have a thumb. Or, at least, it's churlish in the extreme to point out that an missing arm is also thumbless. That's implied.
He opted for a device that securely holds the pick over a thumb on his right arm prosthtic.
It's as if we voted for Miles ? that ease, that seething grace ? and got Wynton instead, a careful custodian of a tradition that nobody likes as much as they say they do.
OK that was hilarious. And, as above, makes a good format.
It's as if we voted for Gale Sayers and got O.J. Simpson instead.
It's like we voted for the Flying Spaghetti Monster and got Cthulhu instead.
Why settle for the lesser evil?
Not really. Obama, is real. Unfortunately.
"That's the worst tolling I've seen this millennium"
Ask not for whom the troll tolls. He tolls for thee.
It's like we voted for John Donne and got Alexander Pope instead.
You gotta pay the troll toll to get into the boy's hole.
It's like we voted for the Night Man and got Steve Smith instead.
Any 'Its Always Sunny in Philadelphia' retort is genius, pure genius. +100
That's politics, bitch!
its like we voted for Cato and got Reason instead.
i keeeed, i keeed (copyright NBC)
Brian not get his coffe this morning? Kinda of out of character bitter.
Just sayin
Like voting for Coleman Hawkins and getting Bill Clinton.
Its like we voted for Conan but got Leno instead.
It's like we voted for Conan and got Red Sonja instead
That's a problem?
Thanks, Johnny. Now I've got to get a mental image of Jay Leno wearing ragged furs and swinging an oversized axe out of my head.
Now imagine him saying, "By this axe, I rule!"
It's like voting for Steve Smith and getting consensual sex.
It's like voting for the sweet release of death and getting MNG.
It's like voting for Kids in the Hall but getting Saturday Night Live.
It's like voting for joe and getting LoneWhacko.
Thats just wrong
It's like voting for cake, and getting haggis.
It's like voting for The Big Lebowski and getting The Ladykillers.
It's like voting for Ron Paul and getting Bob Barr.
+1
hahahahahahaha
+2
It's like voting for cake and getting thrown into an incinerator.
+1 for the Portal reference.
Now, now, now. GLaDOS said she was only pretending to murder you. That's not nearly as bad as the government.
IT LIKE VOTING FOR MORE HIKERS AND GETTING ONLY ONE HIKER!
It's as if we voted for Miles ? that ease, that seething grace ? and got Wynton instead, a careful custodian of a tradition that nobody likes as much as they say they do.
For my money, the player that I never tire of listening to --
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wes_Montgomery
I spent nearly a hundred bucks on Hot Club of France CDs before I could admit to myself that I hated everything about Django's cutesy mannerisms with a fucking passion.
Wow. That's err... Are you sure you're not infested with a brain eating parasite?
It's like voting for a brain-eating parasite and getting a jazz snob.
Vote Hypnotoad.
All...vote...for...Hypnotoad.
It's like voting for a brain-eating parasite and getting a jazz snob.
Exactly. Django is one of those players that you are suppose to like because everyone else does. However, in my honest opinion, after more than fair appraisal, his dingy noodling belongs on an instrument less full bodied than the guitar.
Well at least django is good for doing the balboa to.
Be fair, with only two fingers, there are some things you're never going to be able to play.
True. I wonder if those gypsy scales sounded so messy before the accident. Likely not, as there were certain standards that would have been expected of him before being carried away into the flighty world of European Jazz.
No, I just come from a long line of Spanish guitar players with very good ears and musical talent.
Anyone who listens to Wes Montgomery's live album "Full House" and doesn't like can not be considered a "music" fan in this humble record snobs opinion.
It's like voting for Charlie Parker and getting Kenny G. instead.
Wow, that was painful to even type.
Wes Montgomery was a big influence on Hendrix.
If anyone wondered what a psychedelic Wes sounded like, look no further that The Third Stone From the Sun.
Anyone who utilized octaves in their guitar solo's post 1962 is in debt to Wes Montgomery.
And again, if neither of you have heard the album "Full House", run don't walk to Amazon or whatever AND BUY IT RIGHT NOW.
http://www.amazon.com/Full-Hou.....B000000Y6B
After the ex stole the LP collection, reconstituting Wes was the first thing on my list. I got the Full House.
Oh, one of my favorites from Wes:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-rjvoZOaos
Maybe you should inform the Spanish guitarists in your family "with very good musical ears" that the cutesy Gypsy stuff had largely disappeared by the late 30s. By the 1940s Django had far more in common with Charlie Parker than he had with Gypsy players.
As I mentioned above. It wasn't the Gypsy in him that made his music too cute. Gypsies have standards, Euro-Jazz doesn't.
It's like voting for Hit'n'Run and getting Jezebel.
Yo, fuck that. Over the line X.
It's like voting for a jacuzzi, and getting a woodchipper.
No, no, no.
I love jazz.
I just hate Wynton.
Also, the best living jazz trumpeter is Tomasz Sta?ko.
I've always liked Winton's playing (classical and jazz) but I sure got tired of his pompuous bloviating in Ken Burns' Jazz.
Yeah, but I blame Ken for that more than Wynton.
Yeah, I guess a lot of it comes with Burns' circlejerk narrative style.
It's like voting for Ken Burns and getting Michael Moore.
Indeed.
I'm far more interested in hearing a musician's signature then whether they're playing "real" jazz or "real" blues or "real" whatever.
Not sure I can argue with the shout-out to Sta?ko. Anyone on here who's a serious jazz fan should check him out.
It's like voting for Black Sabbath and getting Nickelback.
Wow. That's a talent shift downward of at least three orders of magnitude.
It's like voting for Tim Cavanaugh, and getting Ron Hart.
It's like voting for Ron Hart, and getting Tim C.
Or P.J. O'Rourke.
It's like voting for Peter Bagge, and getting Chip Bok.
It's like voting for Hope and Change and getting exactly what you deserve.
+1
It's like voting for cake, and being SugarFree so you can't eat it.
NOOOOOOOOOOOO!
It's like voting for Milan Kundera and getting Peter Suderman.
It's like voting for American Idol and... no, it's just like voting for American Idol.
It's like voting for Ziggy Stardust and getting Gary Glitter.
+1
It's like voting for Batman Begins and getting Batman Forever.
Its like voting for Nickle Creek but getting Nickleback.
It's like voting for Michelle Pfeiffer, and getting Michelle Trachtenberg.
I dunno. Under the right circumstances, that's win-win.
Yep.
Does this mean liberals are going to get busted for reefer and smack?
It does mean we need to find The Beatles of libertarianism.
It's like voting for The Sting and getting The Sting II.
Worst. Sequel. EVAR.
It's as if we voted for James T. Kirk and got Jean-Luc Picard instead.
Picard > Kirk any day
of all that jg would do, i wouldn't guess "smoke crack"...
+?
(Filter sucks nuts)
Picard is the man!
It's like voting for "Mirror, Mirror" and getting "The Alternative Factor". God that episode blew.
John = Hayak
Paul = Friedman
George = Rothbard
Ringo = Ron Paul
In re: Neon Cat's post
With a guest appearance by Ayn Rand as Yoko Ono.
"A single plum, floating in perfume, served in a man's hat."
Pete Best = Bob Barr
I thought he was Murray the K
It's like voting for David Lean and obtaining Coleman Francis.
Voted for: Greg Beato
Got: Steve Chapman
It's like voting for Old Mexican and getting Neu Mejican.
Hey, you're being very, very, very mean to Neu.
Why can't we just get Mexican? Why does it have to be one or the other?
LoneWhacko in a bright pink Minuteman uniform stopped him at the border.
I've bitched about Esquire's tongue-bathing of the vice president before.
I believe "rimming" comes closer to capturing the nauseating spirit of these Esquire pieces.
With a guest appearance by Ayn Rand as Yoko Ono.
Sewn up in a bag, accompanied by an anvil, I hope.
It's like voting for Steve Smith, and getting Michael Jackson.
It's like voting for Radley Balko and getting rapted with a nightstick.
*raped
Peg much?
It's not like it's rape-rape.
It's like voting for fuzzy bunnies and unicorns, and getting a Radley Balko piece.
both of you are right.
It's like voting for Obama and getting Obama.
+1
+100
It's as if we voted for Michael Corleone, and got Fredo instead.
It's like voting for Karen Howley and getting the Reason girl.
Its like voting for a smart quip and getting MNG yelping about 'sand in yur pussy' for the ten thousandth time.
It's like voting for Earl Scruggs, and getting Tiny Tim.
It's like voting for intelligent comments and reading about butt sex,sand in pussy,rimming,Autoerotic asphyxiation instead.
Don't forget the vigorous masturbation part too.
It's like voting for vigorous masturbation and getting a post by Not a 12year old.
It's like voting for a slow orgasm and getting a post by a 12 second man.
It's like voting for a witty retort and getting, well, you know...
Hey let's all calm down. Why don't you two go vigorously masturbate each other to a slow orgasm?
Everybody wins!
Sounds good to me!
Unless it's actually MNG or Neu. I have SOME standards.
It's like voting for a witty retort and getting and getting two boys who don't know masturbating is playing solo.
That seals it. It's MNG.
OT:
bad news for LA Rx weed lovers:
http://latimesblogs.latimes.co.....aries.html
It's like voting for a statue of Obama and then not wanting a statue of Obama:
http://www.google.com/hostedne.....UFGhAJkDpg
Gob: I kind of feel like that kid who found the severed hand.
Steve Holt "Hey, Dad, look what I found!"
Gob: Anything for his father's approval. Heartbreaking.
It's like meeting the man of your dreams...and meeting his beautiful wife.
No, that's just ironic.
It's like voting for Kyle to get his scrotum slapped off for quoting that and it not happening.
It's like voting for Rod Serling and getting Alanis Morrisette.
It's like voting for Alanis Morrisette and getting Courtney Love.
If this is payback for my Biden comment, consider us even.
It's like voting for music that doesn't suck, and getting a 90's folk-y female singer-songwriter.
You know what?
I got one hand in my pocket and the other is flippin' y'all the bird.
Any other fantasies about hairy, lantern-jawed Canadian hippie-rockers you want to share?
Her man-jaw brings shame to hot Canadian girls everywhere.
On this, we agree.
On the subject of hot Canadian women, Erica Durance FTW. And many others.
I love watching Evangeline Lilly on Jimmy Kimble. She has a hell of a lot more personality than Kate whom she plays on Lost.
Hopefully the adoration of Lilly will finally put to rest the pernicious myth that men don't like freckles.
(Yes, some don't, but they aren't the dealbreaker most girls think they are.)
The actress that costarred in Transporter 3 was frecklicious.
I know, I've ragged on Irish red headed lasses on here before, but I kid. My first real love was one.
+1.
As I've written here before, the single most terrifying, yet exhilarating experience once can have.
I dated a redhead from Alsace-Lorraine. Not a freckle anywhere on her. Trust me, I checked.
They don't like freckles? They would obviously avoid Marisa Miller, then.
Its like voting for Highlander, and getting one of its sequels.
Its like voting for Marcel but getting Ilan.
It's like voting for The Jacket and getting Ezra Klein.
EEEWWWWWW!
Ezra Klein, defining the term 'gainfully employed' downward.
Ezra Klein - The Cardigan? The Windbreaker? What is an appropriately crappy piece of outerwear to be the nemesis of the jacket?
Maybe I'm just going too far.
Shit-stained man-thong.
I didn't mean crappy in the literal sense.
A man-thong is Ezra Klein's outerwear.
And it is always quite fastidiously stained with shit.
As is his toungue, which is lined with the anal seepage of our Dear Leader.
Obowelma?
The Jacket is probably the movie inside the Netflix envelope that Klein could not figure out how to open, right C Bandit?
The straightjacket?
It's a time travel flick staring the gorgeous Kiera Knightly and Batman.
Its like voting for a black man and getting "The Man" instead.
...what politicians do, mostly, is order around mass murder, mass theft, and the spinning of resources and power to their buddies...
QFT
Its like voting for Peyton Manning and getting Tim Tebow.
Worse than that, its like voting for Peyton Manning and getting Jake Delhomme, and extending his contract by three years when he is already way past his prime.
Worse than that, its like voting for Peyton Manning and getting Jake Delhomme, and extending his contract by three years when he is already way past his prime.
I'm gonna assume your a Panthers fan...
If you only knew the heartbreak . . .
I'm a Chiefs fan.
I know heartbreak.
Yes, indeed you do,
but to lose the Superbowl like that. Having the Pats pinned, and then a blown kick off . . .
excuse me, I got to go cry like a wee girl.
Condolances, I remember that game eerie well considering how much home-made brew and flaming haberno chili I consumed. But dude, at least you've made a SB. 40 years. The kicker that shall not be named in 1995. Peyton Fucking Manning in the game without a punt in 2004. Oh the pain.
Truth is Delhomme might still have a good year or two in him. You don't get to a 12 and 4 year like '08 without being good. However, is it worth the risk of him repeating next year like this last one? We Panthers fans are like the girl coping with the bad boy jock boyfriend who promises to be good and not screw around and hit her anymore. This time it will be different. Promise.
home-made brew and flaming haberno chili I consumed
My sister in law made a decent chili for that game. Cooked ground sausage, a chunky salsa, roasted peppers, cilantro, and Jack Cheese. She is from Germany and is not a natural in the kitchen, but that was a seriously good chili concoction she came up with on that occasion.
The good news is that Moore looked like he could be a decent stopgap if Delhomme does lay an egg again next year. Add to that the depth of this coming draft class at the QB position and I think that the Panthers will be alright. At least you have the ingredients everywhere else on the team.
I carry a picture of DeAngelo Williams in my wallet, and tell people he is my adopted son.
Its like voting for Star Wars and getting Avatar.
nice
Its like voting for Kari Byron and getting that ditzy blond w/ the armpit tattoo instead.
It's like voting for Chris Rock and getting Carrot Top.
Its like voting for lobster girl and getting Jeanine Garafalo.
Foul.
I know. I crossed all sorts of line of web etiquitte and taste on that one. It was just the worse possible downgrade I could think of.
Rosie O'Donnell.
Or voted for the Beatles and got N-Sync
Its like voting for AGW and getting ClimateGate + 10 years of cooling.
If teh Obama did to US politics
as Miles did too Teh Jazz wid
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Magus
you'd be lookin at one happy Monkee
just too reiterate
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Magus
teh awesome
Word.
see also: On The Corner.
Like voting for Opeth and getting Poison instead
Eeeeeessshhh!
I'm listening to "Harvest" as I type this.
Like voting for Black Sabbath and getting Bon Jovi instead
It's like voting for a liberal who will at least get rid of Bush's horrible spending, policies, and interventionism, and getting Obama.
This is a pretty disappointing analogy. If you're going to compare modern liberalism to jazz you could really develop the whole thing. Both with roots in the 1920s/30s in real populist movements, but becoming increasingly elitist and self-absorbed, splitting into increasingly narrow mutually loathing fractions, always ready to tear down any leader who shows a gift for actually being popular, valuing loyalty to abstract principle over results, etc.
As usual, I'm horrendously late to this thread, but I just wanted to note that I feel a little ripped off by this article.
I wrote about jazz & libertarianism last year and was published in a small Colorado magazine for it.
http://seanwmalone.blogspot.co.....arian.html
And no, I don't do anything so painfully stupid as ignorantly compare Barack Obama to Miles Davis or Wynton Marsalis...
This may not be the praise you'd like, coming from the resident Village Idiot, but I really liked that piece.
Though I have to say that while I agree with the philosophy of the band you presented, sometimes I just want to throw on some solo Joe Pass.
Good article still.
Solo artists are cool too, but I really do think that the magic in jazz is really in the small combo, largely because of the awesome spontaneous order that happens.
Like you, I enjoy listening to small combos more than either solo artists or big bands. However, having played in both big bands and jazz combos, I never observed much spontaneity or interplay between artists. Now, this may be partly due to the fact that we were a bunch of white college kids (though I also listened to and watched a lot of pros and was fairly familiar with their practices too). In a combo you just take your turn soloing until you're done and then somebody else solos. Sure, sometimes you get some interplay with the rhythm section, trade fours, whatever. But on the whole, it was largely about waiting your turn to do your thing. The spontaneity was still generally created by the individual (within a solo) rather than the group.
Then you've, unfortunately, been playing with some mediocre players man... I used to play with a group who would shift on a dime in and out of afro cuban & brazilian jazz from standards to funk & hip-hop... A good band will listen to the soloist and complement their performance by altering dynamics or accentuating melodic lines with responses... When I was a grad student in New York, I did half my masters recital with a sextet and on one tune, right as I was to solo, the entire band decided to drop out completely... I didn't plan that or ask them to, I think my bass player arranged that.
I've been in groups where it *is* about waiting your turn, but honestly, they're horrible.
For a good group, there's typically a lot of eye contact and it's never about waiting til you can do your thing.
It's as if we voted for Dick York and got Dick Sargent instead.
Reruns again?
At least this makes a good think-while-you-drink type game.
It's like voting for Tower Of Power and getting Chicago instead.
You should specify Peter Cetera-led Chicago.
I'm voting for Tower of Power right now...
Its like farting, but crapping your pants.
It's like "It's like." But worse!
It's like voting for Spam, but getting Treet instead
It's like voting for New Jersey and....
Never mind.
It's like voting for Tony Williams and getting Dave Weckl.