Conspiracy

Please God, Make It Stop: Palin Goes Birther

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In an interview with talk show host Rusty Humphries, Sarah Palin threw her lot in with the "just asking questions about Obama's birth certificate" nutters. Transcript via Allahpundit, who asks: "I wonder if she realized when she said this that it's going to follow her around." Well if not, she is hardly qualified to manage a fantasy baseball team, much less the government of the United States.

Would you make the birth certificate an issue if you ran?

I think the public, rightfully, is still making it an issue. I don't have a problem with that. I don't know if I would have to bother to make it an issue 'cause I think there are enough members of the electorate who still want answers.

Do you think it's a fair question to be looking at?

I think it's a fair question, just like I think past associations and past voting record — all of that is fair game. You know, I've got to tell you, too: I think our campaign, the McCain/Palin campaign didn't do a good enough job in that area. We didn't call out Obama and some of his associates on their records and what their beliefs were and perhaps what their future plans were. And I don't think that that was fair to voters to not have done our jobs as candidates and as a campaign to bring to light a lot of the things that now we're seeing made manifest in the administration.

I mean, truly, if your past is fair game and your kids are fair game, certainly Obama's past should be. I mean, we want to treat men and women equally, right?

Hey, you know, that's a great point, in that weird conspiracy-theory freaky thing that people talk about that Trig isn't my real son. And a lot of people say, "Well you need to produce his birth certificate! You need to prove that he's your kid!" Which we have done. But yeah, so maybe we could reverse that and use the same [unintelligible]-type thinking on them.

Audio and video, via Huffington Post:

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  1. *facepalm*

    Don’t tell me she’s going to fall into the ‘he’s secretly a Muslim’ crowd as well.

    1. Nope. Just the “If you want to go for that angle, that’s fair game too” crowd.

      1. Oh ok, so basically it’s “I’m not going to give them my seal of approval, but I’m not going to tell them to stop attacking him based on something I should realize is ludicrous”. Politician speak for wanting to have it both ways.

    2. *shrug*

      She’s not very smart, but she’s also not a birther. It seems more like she’s whining here about her unfair treatment, demanding the same behavior, etc.

      1. But she’s not the one who brought up her unfair treatment, so, no, I don’t think that’s it.

        Although if she does want to whine about it, I don’t think it’d be unjustified.

    3. If his birth father was a Muslim, then he is traditionally a Muslim. Is not a child born of Jewish decent not a Jew. Obama has to declare or renounce he is a Muslim. But if his father is Frank Marshall Davis, then I don’t think he is a Muslim & he would also be a Natural born citizen.

      1. What difference does it make in your mind if he is a Muslim?

      2. Several points:

        1) Just because sharia says someone’s a Muslim at birth doesn’t mean they can’t convert to another religion later. Obama was raised as a Christian by his mother and was an active participant in his church in Chicago. As radical as that church may be, it’s still a Christian one.

        2) You’re confusing religion with race.

        3) Most important, there is specifically a “no religious test” clause in the Constitution. So even if he were a sekret mooslim, this wouldn’t disqualify him from office. So shut the fuck up about it.

        1. Ann Dunham was an atheist.

      3. I thought America was supposed to be about being free from the sins, financial difficulties, beliefs, etc of the father and mother?

        I don’t care if he is muslim anyways. Being Christian is bad enough.

      4. He did “announce” when he answered an alter call, was baptized and professed that Christ is his Savior.

  2. Gold. Comedy gold.

  3. Don’t know much about trig-
    onometry

    Don’t know much about…

    1. ‘Nuff said.

      1. Is trig short for something? “Trigger”?

        1. A son named Trig, a grandson named Tripp– you sure they’re not from Utah?

          Whatever trips her trigger, I suppose…

  4. When is Bristol’s sex tape coming out? You know it’s only a matter of time.

    1. It’ll be out just as soon as that loser ex of hers decides he wants to get himself locked up in semen-stained prison with a bunch of big hairy pederasts with–shall we say–a strong sexual preference for fresh meat.

  5. Okay, I’ll make it stop: Palin hasn’t gone birther.

    Hope that helps!

    1. No, no! Torture him! Turn up the heat. Indulge his nightmare about Palin turning “birther” just because she thinks that Zero’s unreleased long-form BC that he’s spent so much money to keep from us is “fair game” for any and all of his critics to attack for any reason or none. We should strap Moynihan in a chair with his eyes clamped open Clockwork Orange style and make him watch the consequences of all the retarded things he’s said and done unfolding.

      “Climategate” won’t go away, the ACORN tapes showing ACORN people aiding an apparent child prostitution ring won’t go away, and the fact that this empty suit you liberaltarian morons voted into office has yet to release anything but that worthless short form won’t go away either. Let 0bama’s true believers beg in vain for mercy from the God in which they don’t even believe as Moynihan is doing.

      1. Yeah… I was ashamed how many Reason editors said they were going to vote for Obama.

  6. She already has a facebook post up refuting this latest rumor.

    1. What rumor? she said she was a birther right there.

  7. I like Sarah Palin but?

    I will not even try to defend that statement. The Birthers are an embarrassment.

    1. Just curious, but what is it that you like about her if you’re at least smart enough to realize that birthers are an embarrassment? Is there really anything besides “she’s not Obama”?

      1. Great gams, that’s what.

        Not enough?

  8. Everything Palin says should say unintelligible!

    1. Well, if it makes you feel any better, you’re pretty unintelligible right now.

  9. Worse yet Joe Biden is Yugoslavian. He was switched as a foreign exchange student.

  10. I think Reason is off the mark here. Yes, Palin does give more credence that the birthers really deserve, but she’s clearly not throwing her lot in with them.

    1. I think the public, rightfully, is still making it an issue.

      Without the word “rightfully” she would just be diplomatic, not wanting to offend an almost exclusively Republican constituency.

      With that word, she’s making herself fair game for the accusation of being a Birther.

      Dunno if she was just winging it, pandering a little and not realizing that this kind of stuff can and will get reported — like Obama’s “bitter and clinging” moment.

      1. Why should she give a damn how it’s reported? She’s selling books and winning points with people who hate your bloody enemedia. Why would any of us listen to you? The leftstream lost all credibility with us long ago, as did this kiddy fiddler Moynihan and his butt buddy Sullivan.

        1. oh shut yer choco-hole

      2. One would hope that one is not so dumb as to think a radio interview cannot or will not be reported. At least Obama had the excuse of saying it at an ostensibly private function.

    2. Oh come on. The headline on this is totally misleading. She isn’t starting some birther crusade, she’s stating that people’s past histories are legitimate issues, and saying that his birth certificate is at least a legitimate issue as her “fake” motherhood. You could also read that as an acknowledgement that they’re both bullshit issues.

      People seriously get hysterical about this woman.

      1. and saying that his birth certificate is at least a legitimate issue as her “fake” motherhood.

        Just because she was stupid enough to feed the trolls doesn’t mean it was a good idea, or should have been bothered with.

        You could also read that as an acknowledgement that they’re both bullshit issues.

        I could agree that they both are, if I were to go so far as to call them “issues”, but that is certainly not what she said.

  11. Please God, Make It Stop

    You do believe in God, sir?

    1. No. He’s a lying Satan-worshiping queen. Like everyone else who hates Palin.

  12. This is the same woman, who, when on local radio show, giggled and snickered when the shock jock kept making cancer jokes about a female senator, cancer survivor.

    The same woman who gave her under aged daughter’s teenage boyfriend the run of her house 24/7, yet continues to promote her brand of responsibility and family values.. yes, she quit on her daughter too, when she failed to supervise and educate her properly.

    So now she wants to rile up her base again.. and willing to use hate to do it. Remember, this is the woman who’s first speech to our nation contained a direct quote from Westbrook Pegler, the rabid racist who begged his followers to kill Robert F. Kennedy.

    Palin may have a selective memory, among her other personal problems, but the American public does not.

    1. My memory tells of how you traitors slandered and libeled her daily, went on your shows to say she should be raped, and joined with that faggot pinprick Sullivan in accusing her husband of incest with Bristol, and bashing her for keeping and nurturing her Downs kid instead of murdering him in cold blood the way you baby massacring pro-abortion fascists wanted her to do. Damn you Palin-bashing non-public-representing elitist prison bitches all to Hell and may Satan chew your livers there for all eternity. The public’s memory is actually very selective, and now it will select against you.

      As for what Sarah Palin says or has said, after all I remember you fascist faggots saying and doing to her, I wouldn’t mind if she went on the radio or TV to say all of you Communazi traitors should be ass-raped with running chainsaws and hanged by ropes made from your own intestines from the nearest street lights. There is no torture anybody could inflict on you Palin-hating fagdyke eunuchs that would be sufficient punishment for what you did to her. May that “cancer survivor” bitch you pretend to care about get cancer again and go to burn with Ted Kennedy; you never gave a damn about any of that shit you’re spouting anyway.

      Fuck you.

      1. ‘raped’
        ‘faggot pinprick’
        ‘prison bitches’
        ‘fascist faggots’
        ‘ass-raped’
        ‘fagdyke eunuchs’

        Issues?

      2. ” raped, faggot pinprick, incest, prison bitches, fascist faggots, ass-raped, fagdyke eunuchs.”

        Issues?

      3. What kind of Chainsaw does Jesus endorse?

      4. If he was just a little more brief I’d think it was “bearded” shriek from the mirror universe.

      5. Can’t wait to see the movie.

      6. Hate to see gay self-haters like this. Come out of the closet and be free!

    2. MsSwin seems to want to make me like Palin.

    3. This is the same woman, who, when on local radio show, giggled and snickered when the shock jock kept making cancer jokes about a female senator, cancer survivor.

      OMG, she snickered at tasteless jokes told by her radio host?? For shame!

      The same woman who gave her under aged daughter’s teenage boyfriend the run of her house 24/7, yet continues to promote her brand of responsibility and family values.

      And she trusted her teenage daughter, who turned out to be immature?? This woman should be locked up!

      So now she wants to rile up her base again.. and willing to use hate to do it.

      Sorry, I missed the “hate” in the article. Please point it out.

      Remember, this is the woman who’s first speech to our nation contained a direct quote from Westbrook Pegler, the rabid racist who begged his followers to kill Robert F. Kennedy.

      And that horrible quote was: “We grow good people in our small towns, with honesty and sincerity and dignity.” Can’t get much more racist than that!

      That’s quite a roll call of evil you’ve got there. I invite you to examine every politician’s record with the same level of prissiness. You’ll have lots of fun with Obama’s.

  13. hahahahahaha

  14. Boy, the night-shift trolls aren’t nearly as entertaining.

  15. Day-yamm. That thar Palin dee-rangermint sindrome looks ta be the most kun-tage-us mintal diz-eeze that thar be. Hits eve-un in-fek-tun tha day-yam libbers at Ree-zun.

  16. She seems to be not wanting to offend an anti-Obama constituency and being slightly spiteful. Basically, she’s saying “If I have to deal with Andrew Sullivan types questioning my son’s maternity, then it’s fair that Obama has to deal with questions about his citizenship status”. But it;s rather clear from the context that Palin is not intending to make it an issue herself.

  17. This is about as deranged as it gets. I’m no Palin supporter, but that doesn’t mean I want to try and dissect every interview in an attempt to pull out a one-off or an aside to throw some mud her way.

    Obama has been asked multiple times about his birth certificate. It would be a simple matter, a VERY simple matter, to shut people up about it. But he doesn’t. Couple that with how seccretive he has been about various details in is personal history, and you can’t blame people for wanting to know–to be reassured. Any time a politician evades a personal issue like that, then the public *should* pursue it. If Bush had a parallel situation, the New York Times would have assigned a dozen reporters to it and gotten the truth out in a week.

    The word Rightfully in this case is appropriate. But instead of looking at who’s evading an issue, you call Palin names. She’s not a birther, she’s looking for some transparency and noting the public’s right to have their questions answered.

    Your bias is showing, and it isn’t pretty.

    1. It would be a simple matter, a VERY simple matter, to shut people up about it.

      It was very simple for him to show the copy, and he did. Shutting birthers up, however, would be absolutely impossible. They already have to believe that the entire Hawaiian government is in on a conspiracy to still be clinging to this, so why would anything they do make birthers shut up?

    2. Nonsense! You should know how conspiracy theories work. If he provides the particular copy of the birth certificate that the birthers want, they’ll just claim it was a fake or say some larger conspiracy is at work. They don’t believe what they do because of any particular evidence; rather, their pre-existing opinion of Obama’s character is allowing them to believe what is really baseless supposition.

      1. There are still people who believe Bush didn’t win FL in 2000 and never will, regardless of proof.

    3. Ben, I demand an unredacted copy of your birth certificate to prove that you are not an Muslim terrorist. PROVE THAT YOU ARE NOT A TERRORIST.

      1. Jim Bob, what makes you think I might be? That fertilizer is for my crops, I promise. I got a great deal on it, that’s why I have so much… 😉

    4. Wrong. When Bush was asked repeatedly about whether he had used cocaine, he refused to answer. In the end, the press let up and never made him admit that the reports that he had used cocaine were true. They didn’t ask him to prove he hadn’t used cocaine (proving such a negative is essentially impossible), but just asked him to address it. He never did. And he didn’t even need to produce a piece of paper!

      1. In fairness to the debate, past drug use or lack thereof is not a Constitutional qualifier for the presidency.

        Let’s assume for a moment he isn’t qualified due to the citizenship. I’m not sure that would force him out of office in and of it’s self. The only way to remove a sitting President is by impeachment, or should I say lawfully remove, JFK was removed from office by mean other than impeachment. Besides the burden of proof is on the birthers. They can’t prove crap. Oama’s refusal to present what they want isn’t proof of their claim.

  18. The real quesion here is how, in this depressed economy, where the radio industry is on life support, guys like Rusty Humphries get work…

  19. Boy, the night-shift trolls aren’t nearly as entertaining.

    Word. The nearly 1:1 ratio between regular commenters and mystery trolls sure in this thread is entertaining, though.

    1. Seriously. It seems so difficult to me to support Palin that I can’t tell if they actually think these things.

  20. I eagerly await Andrew Sullivan’s take on this.

  21. Of course that woman isn’t qualified to manage a fanstasy football team. She’s a cheerleader for the Republican Party (not trying to insult cheerleaders! We love you ladies!), not a serious candidate for office…

    I hope…

  22. It doesn’t sound here like Palin has gone birther. It seems more that she’s still a little bitter about the kid gloves that she feels Obama and Co. were treated with by journalists during the campaign relative to the others in the running.

  23. “I mean, we want to treat men and women equally, right?”

    ahahahahah

  24. Sarh
    Legitimacy is probably not a concept you want floating around you these days (especially around, say, the family dinner table).

    Stick to folksy platitutes: “You betcha!”

    1. Absolutely delicious.

  25. This thread has started off wonderfully, and i look forward to checking in on its progress over the course of the day.

  26. I think she should immediately hide from the press for the next few weeks, then resign her post. You gotta go with who you are.

  27. If it was up to me, all politicians would be challenged to prove the constitutionality of every little goddamn thing they do. But that’s just me.

    1. Are you serious? Are you serious?

  28. I think she should beat Andrew Sullivan with a golf club and then smash out the windows of his Prius.

    1. I would pay to see that. Sullivan hunch down in the driver’s seat sniveling in fear. At that point, one his begals would finally take its revenge for having to listen to years of his ravings and come out of the back seat and nail him.

      1. “One his begals”? John, I tend to enjoy and agree with your postings here, but you really need to be more careful about typos….

  29. Would you make the birth certificate an issue if you ran?

    I think the public, rightfully, is still making it an issue.

    I.e., the public is right in making it an issue. That seems to say it all right there.

    Give someone enough rope, etc.

    1. That depends on how much weight we give her impromptu word choice. In that kind of setting, it is believable that she would have said “rightly” in place of “appropriately” or “justifiably,” just because that was the word that popped into her head first.

      Besides, even if she does believe that these people are “rightly” asking questions about where President Obama was born, that is not the same as actually caring about the issue and wanting to see it raised. (I neither care about the issue nor believe that these people are “rightly” asking about it, but there really is a difference between the two.)

  30. Why do people get so hysterical about the birther thing? Somehow any mention of the issue is a clear sign of mental derangement. Why? It looks like some inconvenient topics are simply declared “conspiracy theories” in the society. The facts in the controversy aren’t difficult.
    1. If Obama was born outside of the USA he wouldn’t be a natural born US citizen (or maybe not even a US citizen) according to the US laws that were in effect in 1960s.
    2. Due to Hawaii laws it was theoretically possible to get a birth certificate without a mother and child present in the state.
    3. It’s almost impossible to imagine that a 18-year-old woman would travel across half the world from Hawaii to Kenya to give birth in a poor third-world country when she could do it next to her parents in the most prosperous country in the world. And she would have to make this journey before transatlantic (and transpacific) air travel became the norm.
    Because of 3 I don’t think it’s possible that Obama wasn’t born in Hawaii. But I very rarely notice that people ridiculing the birthers know anything about 1 and 2.

    1. Good summary, thanks!

    2. Yes, #3 is the strongest point. I wonder if Obama won’t release it for two reasons: it drives the fringe right crazy, and there might be something embarrassing on it. Maybe it lists his religion as “Muslim” Maybe it doesn’t name his father. But who knows? Frankly I’d rather see his college records.

  31. Please God, make it stop! Reason’s near-daily articles obsessing over Sarah Palin.

  32. When is Michelle Bachman going to join Sarah and Orly on the “World Birther Tour?”

    1. Bachmann really isn’t a birther. She’s had multiple openings to indulge this nonsense and hasn’t.

      The smartest thing Bachmann did was choosing Ron Paul as a mentor in the House — insofar as she’s done things the media defines as “kooky,” it’s one-world government and anti-Fed stuff.

  33. I think Moynihan is smart and knows how to drive the comment count up. Palin! Palin! Birthers!

    That should generate some ad revenue.

  34. I’m starting to think the libertarians are more scared of Palin than the loonie left. Humoring a large portions of your constituency is part of the job. I hope this post is just a ratings grab, but if it isn’t, you’re a moron Moynihan.

  35. This is her Howard Dean moment. If anyone remembers, Dean said on some Sunday morning talk show something to the effect of “well the idea that 9-11 was an inside job is a theory some beleive and ought to be looked at.” Really dumb. But it hasn’t seemed to hurt Dean. But, trutherism among the hard left is an exotic but acceptable belief just like birtherism is among the hard right.

    It won’t hurt her with her base (many of whom are birthers) and everyone else hates her anyway. I think that her saying that means she is not going to run for President. I think it means she is going all in with her base and will play kingmaker in the Republican Party.

    1. I can see her playing kingmaker as you call it. To really cash in on that role, she has to be aware that some alliances she makes can be a hinderance to a national candidate by alienating the independants that are so important these days.

      1. I take back my above post. I think she was being ironic. I don’t think she was endorsing birtherism at all. Note she says “in that weird conspiracy-theory freaky thing that people talk about that Trig isn’t my real son”.

        All she is saying is, “If I have to be subject to perverts like Andrew Sullivan going after my OBGYN records, why shouldn’t Obama have to suffer people demanding his birth certificate?” That is not endorsing birtherism. She is telling her critics to fuck off. And her critics are not smart enough to understand that is what she is saying.

        1. I think the public, rightfully, is still making it an issue.

          Emphasis added. Do you know what rightfully means? It means she thinks these questions are justified. If Obama said that the idiotic questions about Trig’s birth were justifiably being asked, you would shit a brick. In fact, I seem to remember him saying the exact opposite of that during the campaign.

          1. “Emphasis added. Do you know what rightfully means? It means she thinks these questions are justified.”

            In the same way the public is “righfully making an issue” of her son’s birth. You have to put that in context to her reference to the Trig theories. The public is “rightfully making an issue” because the other side is allowed to make an issue about her family. Again, this is fuck you to her critics. They don’t have to like it. But it would be nice if they were at least smart enough to understand what she is saying.

          2. You are confusing the question of where Obama was born with the question of why Obama hasn’t released his birth certificate. The question was “would you make an issue out of his birth certificate,” as in, do you think he should have to produce it. I see nothing wrong with saying “rightfully” in that context.

    2. If anyone remembers, Dean said on some Sunday morning talk show something to the effect of “well the idea that 9-11 was an inside job is a theory some beleive and ought to be looked at.” Really dumb.

      No, I don’t. Got a link?

  36. “Hey, you know, that’s a great point, in that weird conspiracy-theory freaky thing that people talk about that Trig isn’t my real son. And a lot of people say, “Well you need to produce his birth certificate! You need to prove that he’s your kid!” Which we have done. But yeah, so maybe we could reverse that and use the same [unintelligible]-type thinking on them.”

    Hold it, how is she being a birther there? She is doing nothing of the sort. She is saying “if my oppenents are going to claim Trig is not my son, well fuck them, lets see Obama produce his birth certificate”.

    She is not endorsing birtherism. She is doing just the opposite. She is equatiing it to Andrew Sullivan’s obsession with her son. That is hardly endorsing it. All she is saying, if that if her son is fair game, Obama birth certificate ought to be as well.

    I don’t think Monynahan is being fair here at all. When I first looked at this post, I didn’t read what she said very carefully. I just assumed it was true. But it really isn’t. If anything, I think what she said went right over Moynahan’s head.

    1. John, she also said this: I think the public, rightfully, is still making it an issue. I don’t have a problem with that. I don’t know if I would have to bother to make it an issue ’cause I think there are enough members of the electorate who still want answers. when asked if she would make it an issue if she ran.

      She is saying that it is a valid issue but because so many voters are still bringing it up, she wouldn’t have to use it as an issue during a campaign.

      1. Saying something is a “valid issue” is not saying you believe it. It is only saying people who think it is true have a right to be heard. There is a difference. See my below example about global warming.

    2. “””She is not endorsing birtherism.”””

      She said “”I think the public, rightfully, is still making it an issue.””

      It’s about what one thinks is right. If someone said the Ft. Hood shooter did the right thing, wouldn’t you agree that they are endorsing terrorism?

      1. You are missing the point. Take another example. I think global warming is a hoax. I think it is a load of scientific crap. But, I would certainly say that “some in the public are rightfully still making an issue of it” because a lot of them think it is true. That doesn’t mean I think it is true. It just means I think the people who do have a right to make an issue out of it. Thinking that someone has a right to be heard and endorsing their issue are two different things.

        Further, put it in context with her comparison to the Trig conspiracy. She is saying basically “the idiots who think that Trig is not my son are still making it an issue so why can’t the people who think Obama’s birth certificate is fake make an issue?”

        She actually being fairly subtle and ironic here. It goes over most of her critics’ heads. Yet, she is the stupid one.

        1. I don’t know if I would have to bother to make it an issue ’cause I think there are enough members of the electorate who still want answers.

          So when she says this she is saying that she would be as shitty is the Trig conspiracy folks if she felt it necessary in a campaign even though she believes it to be untrue and wrong?

          1. More or less. Like I said, this is a fuck you to her critics. Again, she is saying if she can be subject to Trig rumors, why can’t Obama’s birth certificate be an issue.

            1. No, I think she just came out with a knee jerk response, then tried to backtrack to cover her ass.

              1. The problem is when you agree that conspiracists have a right to speak, you are signing yourselves up to their cause, in the political perception sense. Ron Paul was dogged and sank because he supported the truthers right to have a conspiracy and speak freely of it, even though he didn’t agree with what they believed.

                1. Conspiracists have a right to speak, but you should call a spade a spade. If Palin was asked what she thought of Flat Earthers’ or Moon Landing Deniers, she would be an idiot for saying they rightfully are asking these questions. Say they’re ignorant conspiracy mongers and move on. Nice and simple.

        2. “”You are missing the point.””

          Am I? The point being, if you believe X is the right thing, then you support X.

          “”She is saying basically “the idiots who think that Trig is not my son are still making it an issue so why can’t the people who think Obama’s birth certificate is fake make an issue?”

          At no point does she call them an idiot. Using quotes doesn’t make it so. You are using a fair amount of imagination in your support.

          She’s not saying FU to her critics at all, she’s saying turnabout is fair play. If they can call for Trig’s birth cert, then it’s ok for them to call for Obama’s, and she doesn’t have a problem with it. She said the pubic is right to have an issue with Obama.

          1. And Obama has the right to whine and moan about all the unfair treatment he’s getting from such hard-hitting media figures as Katie Couric, presumably.

            1. And she probably figures he could quit his job over it, and shouldn’t be labeled a quitter.

          2. She says in a “crazy conspiracy”. That would be calling them idiots.

            1. Maybe in your mind. Crazy and idiot are two different words and she only used one of them.

              But note, it was ” that weird conspiracy-theory freaky thing” when referring to Trig’s birth cert, yet when talking about Obama’s birth cert, “I think the public, rightfully, is still making it an issue. I don’t have a problem with that”

              So by your “crazy conspiracy” = idiots standard, the only idiots are the ones asking for Trig’s birth cert. She never called the Obama birthers a crazy conspiracy.

              1. Jesus fucking tap dancing Christ Vic read the damn quote and the question asked.

                First, the question

                “I mean, truly, if your past is fair game and your kids are fair game, certainly Obama’s past should be. I mean, we want to treat men and women equally, right?”

                So, the guy is asking her if they can look at your kids, why not Obama’s birth certificate.

                She Answers

                “Hey, you know, that’s a great point, in that weird conspiracy-theory freaky thing that people talk about that Trig isn’t my real son.”

                First, she is saying, yes there are all these wierdos who claim Trig is not my son.

                She continues.

                “And a lot of people say, “Well you need to produce his birth certificate!”

                Just like people are saying Trig is not her son, people are also saying Obama should produce his birth certificate.

                She then goes on

                “You need to prove that he’s your kid!”

                So, these idiots say she has to prove its her kid.

                “Which we have done. But yeah, so maybe we could reverse that and use the same [unintelligible]-type thinking on them.”

                That is the key sentence right there. She is saying “yeah, they have done this crazy shit to me, so maybe we should apply that thinking to them”.

                She is not saying that thinking is right. She is only saying, if they can do crazy shit to me, we should do the same to them and see how they like it for a change.

                I know you don’t like Palin. Fine. Fair enough. But, don’t let your dislike of her take away your ability to read. You are normally much more reasonable than that.

                1. My ability to read?? yeah, right, I’ll put it back in proper perspective for you.

                  Q “Would you make the birth certificate an issue if you ran?

                  A I think the public, rightfully, is still making it an issue. I don’t have a problem with that. I don’t know if I would have to bother to make it an issue ’cause I think there are enough members of the electorate who still want answers

                  She thinks it the right thing because people want answers. Regardless of the reason, she thinks it’s right.

                  Q “I mean, truly, if your past is fair game and your kids are fair game, certainly Obama’s past should be. I mean, we want to treat men and women equally, right?”

                  A “Hey, you know, that’s a great point, in that weird conspiracy-theory freaky thing that people talk about that Trig isn’t my real son. And a lot of people say, “Well you need to produce his birth certificate! You need to prove that he’s your kid!” Which we have done. But yeah, so maybe we could reverse that and use the same [unintelligible]-type thinking on them.””

                  Show me where she equates the birthers and wierd conspiracy? She doesn’t, she only equates it to Trig. Then she claims turnabout is fair game.

                  Fine, it is fair game as I mentioned before. But if that’s true and she is using the same type of (whatever) thinking on them, and their type of thinking is a “weird conspiracy-theory freaky thing” then the birthers are quilty of engaging in a “weird conspiracy-theory freaky thing” too. If that true then she it’s rightly to engage in weird conspiracy-theory freaky things.

                  Perhaps you Palin love is screwing with your thought process, if you were actually going to get some nookie, or she lead you to beleive so, I could understand.

                  “”I know you don’t like Palin. Fine. Fair enough. “”

                  I’ve never said I don’t like Palin, I do like Palin, but I think she screwed herself. Once again you are making shit up and claiming it to be facts.

                  1. We are going to talk past each other forever. You are never going to admit it. She is saying that she doesn’t have a problem with people using crazy shit on Obama since they did the same thing to her.

                    That may not be admirable. But it is not endorsing birtherism. Further, even by your reading, which is complete fantasy, all she is saying is birtherism is a respectable point of view. At no point does she say she believes it. Saying something is a “serious point of view” is not saying that you believe it. There are lots of “serious points of view” I think are crap.

                    1. “””She is saying that she doesn’t have a problem with people using crazy shit on Obama since they did the same thing to her.”””

                      What the hell do you think I mean when I say she believes turnabout is fair play?

                      “””Saying something is a “serious point of view” is not saying that you believe it.”””

                      Who said “serious point of view”? And why are you using quotes?

                      You are making shit up.

              2. “Crazy” and “idiot” do not have the same meaning, but if the point is whether they signal that she does not agree with whatever is being called crazy or idiotic, it probably doesn’t make much of a difference which word she uses.

                Also, it is true that she used the word “crazy” in reference to the Trig conspiracy people, not the Obama conspiracy people, but what does it say that when asked about the birthers, what it reminded her of was the “crazy” Trig conspiracy people?

                Finally, I think that by following the “rightfully” sentence by adding, “I don’t have a problem with that,” she is making it clear that it is their issue, not hers, even though she doesn’t think it is out of bounds for them to talk about that.

          3. It’s going to look as though I’m splitting hairs when I distinguish two words with the same root, but I don’t think that saying that birthers are “rightly” talking about this issue is the same as saying that talking about this issue “is the right thing” to do. “Rightly,” in its meaning in this context, could range from saying that the questions are legitimate to saying that the questions actually should be asked. “The right thing” could range from meaning that the questions should be asked to meaning that asking the questions is some kind of moral imperative. There is a little bit of an overlap in the possible meaning, but I do not see it as conclusive.

            Since she followed it by adding, “I don’t have a problem with that,” though, it seems more likely to me that she meant that the questions are appropriate, not that she thinks that they should be asked.

  37. ‘Fight the Smears’ Website Admits Obama was Kenyan Citizen: Where’s the MSM?

    Following the controversy over the authenticity of Barack Obama’s birth certificate can be a bit confusing with all its detailed analysis. Your humble correspondent will leave that up to the experts. However, in response to the charge that Barack Obama is not an American citizen, Obama’s Fight the Smears website, quoting FactCheck.Org, has made a bombshell admission…Barack Obama was once a citizen of Kenya. You read that right, Obama had Kenyan citizenship until 1982. Here is the startling admission published in Fight the Smears (emphasis mine):

    “When Barack Obama Jr. was born on Aug. 4,1961, in Honolulu, Kenya was a British colony, still part of the United Kingdom’s dwindling empire. As a Kenyan native, Barack Obama Sr. was a British subject whose citizenship status was governed by The British Nationality Act of 1948. That same act governed the status of Obama Sr.’s children.

    Since Sen. Obama has neither renounced his U.S. citizenship nor sworn an oath of allegiance to Kenya, his Kenyan citizenship automatically expired on Aug. 4, 1982.”

    http://newsbusters.org/blogs/p…..wheres-msm

  38. Congratulations. You have officially jumped the Palin.

    Next article?
    Palin Wears G-String: Is She a Slut?

    At least wait for her to say something as dumb as Krugman before grabbing the pitch forks and dictionaries to beat her with.

  39. Anchorage Daily News Claims Own Anti-Palin Story Wasn’t Paper’s Fault.
    Trig Truth department at the Anchorage Daily News

    http://newsbusters.org/blogs/w…..-papers-fa

  40. I think Obama was born in Hawaii, but I find it exceedingly odd that the actual birth certificate has never been produced. I’m mostly curious as to why not.

    1. Me too. The whole thing is bizzare. All of the wierd parsing by the Hawaii officials. It is bad for the country. Hawaii should have long ago produced the original 1960 whatever birth certificate.

      I often wonder why one of these birther outfits hasn’t FOIAd Obama’s dad’s alien file. That is subject to FOIA since the guy is dead. The Alien file would tell you each and every time his dad entered and left the country. Just look at the Alien file and see if he was in the country when Obama was born. If he was, that would settle the issue. If he wasn’t, that would be very curious to say the least. I have thought about doing it, but really don’t want the Secret Service showing up at my door.

    2. One reasons why Kerry didn’t want to disclose his military documents was probably because they showed that he had worse grades in Yale than Bush. Given how much the left invested in the idea of stupid Bush it must have hurt that both Democratic presidential candidates had worse academic records than his. I bet there’s something embarrassing about Obama’s documents too.

      1. Maybe his Kenyan father isn’t really his father. Maybe his hippie free love mother made it with some random black guy whose name appears on the real birth certificate. That would kind of kill the whole “Dreams of My Father” thing.

        1. I have a sneaking suspicion his BC may say he is white lol. Not a problem, but…kind of embarrassing. Also, by not releasing it, he gets to paint anyone who wants to see it as a crazy conspiracist.

        2. You couldn’t just leave it alone, could you?

          Your posts are a lot of wondering, supposing, maybes, and conjuring of motives. Might work in a courtroom, but not here. The internet has higher standards of truth.

    3. in 2001, Hawaii destroyed all of the paper records in prior years and digitized them. The “original” is gone. He has released the official copy of his birth certificate. It’s not the original one because the original no longer exists. But this is true of every Hawaiian. Is it his fault that Hawaii changed their document management protocols 7 years before he ran for the presidency?

      1. Paper copies? Hell, they destroyed his “paper” copy back in 1962 when the microfilmed all the records on an annual basis.

      2. That’s not true. Hawaii has stated they didn’t destroy any paper documents and that the originals are still on file.

    4. He posted his actual birth certificate on-line. Why can’t you accept that?

      1. I like your screen name! It reminds me of what my boyfriend made me eat last night!

  41. What I find very interesting about this situation is what it implies about the qualification process for Presidential candidates. There are very few requirements to be eligible as a candidate – natural born U.S. citizen, lived within the country for the past so many years (7, or 14, can’t remember exactly), and you have to be over the age of 35. I would have thought that there were already protocols in place to verify that potential candidates meet these requirements, but it would seem this birth certificate situation suggests otherwise.

    1. Chester A. Arthur had to go through the same thing when he was elected president. People thought he was a Canadian.

      1. Neither Obama nor Arthur were NBC’s because their fathers were not US citizens at the time of their births.

        1. We don’t live in Germany. Citizenship in the US isn’t defined by your bloodline.

          All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.

          1. Never said he wasn’t a CITIZEN, moron. I said he wasn’t a NATURAL BORN citizen.

            1. You need to brush up on your nationality law. Jus soli: If you are born on U.S. territory under U.S. jurisdiction you are a natural born citizen. This is regardless of your parents’ nationality. If a pregnant illegal alien crosses the border and pops her baby out while being arrested, guess what? that child is eligible to be president someday. I don’t like Obama either, but lets deal in facts.

              1. See my reply below. You are wrong. No definitive definition of NBC exists.

              2. Why even use the phrase “natural born”. Why not use “native born”? Because natural born is a higher requirement that’s why.

              3. Why even use the phrase “natural born”. Why not use “native born”? Because natural born is a higher requirement that’s why.

          2. You are correct, though I think the ambiguity in this situation (regarding Obama, at least, I don’t know much about Arthur) is whether he was born in the United States. If he was born outside the country to non-citizens, or a couple in which one was a non-citizen, the result could be different. I don’t know of the applicable law in such circumstances. Do we know for certain he was born in Hawaii? Maybe we do, but honestly I don’t care at this point; he’s elected and that’s that. As I’ve said elsewhere, while it doesn’t matter so much it is still fun to speculate.

            In the future I would think we ought to have some sort of verification of the eligibility requirements for presidential candidates. What’s the point in having the requirements if we don’t have to prove they’ve been met? I don’t think that’s asking too much of someone who wants to be the leader of the free world.

            1. It does matter. What if OBL impregnated some chick, she came here had the baby and then years later the kid becomes President? Now that’s a wild hypothetical but some such situation could arise. We want the President to be solely, wholly and only an American.

  42. As a non-American I have a question…

    If an American-citizen woman, pregnant, goes on vacation outside the US and gives birth, is the child really not an American citizen as the birthers seem to claim ?

    Pretty weird law. The baby has to stay on vacation until the mother can get it a green-card or what ?

    Or are they claiming Obama’s mother wasn’t an American citizen either ?

    1. I’m not sure of the exact rules, but no if you are born abroad and your parents are US citizens, you are a citizen.

      John McCain was born in Panama because his father was posted there with the navy.

      When he was nominated there was a question of whether he was natural born. Ted Olson and Lawrence Tribe came up with some opinion that yes he was.

      I will leave it up to you as whether that would have bloomed into a bigger issue amongst the hard left if McCain had won.

    2. The complications arise because Obama’s dad wasn’t a US citizen and his mother was only 18 therefore could not meet the residency requirement.

      http://travel.state.gov/law/info/info_609.html

      Birth Abroad to One Citizen and One Alien Parent in Wedlock: A child born abroad to one U.S. citizen parent and one alien parent acquires U.S. citizenship at birth under Section 301(g) INA provided the citizen parent was physically present in the U.S. for the time period required by the law applicable at the time of the child’s birth. (For birth on or after November 14, 1986, a period of five years physical presence, two after the age of fourteen is required. For birth between December 24, 1952 and November 13, 1986, a period of ten years, five after the age of fourteen are required for physical presence in the U.S. to transmit U.S. citizenship to the child.

    3. It hangs on the definition of “natural born” in the US Constitution. Foreign-born children of US citizens are automatically citizens, but there is an ambiguity if they fit the Constitutional notion of “natural born,” which has traditionally been considered to mean born on US soil.

      It might be interesting for a foreign observer to note that there was a widespread and positive discussion in conservative circles for rescinding this portion of the Constitution or at least the dominant interpretation, before Austrian-born Arnold Schwarzenegger imploded politically.

    4. Yes they are US citizens, but not natural born ones. To be a natural born citizen of ANY country means that BOTH of your parents are citizens of the country you are born in.

      1. Natural born means you were an American citizen at the time of birth. That’s it. The US adopted the English common law version. In common law, “every child born in England of alien parents was a natural-born subject, unless the child of an ambassador or other diplomatic agent of a foreign state.”

        1. The US did not adopt the English common law. This is a fallacy.

          1. I don’t actually know that that the United States did adopt that rule (or, aside from what Mo wrote, that that actually is the English common law rule), but I am interested in your reason for writing that we did not. I do know that we did adopt a good deal of the English common law, on a state-by-state basis.

          2. Yes they did. See: United States v. Wong Kim Ark

  43. Apparently ALOT of people in this thread are “Just asking questions” and supporting Palin’s “Just asking question!”

    Grow some God damn balls people and state your belief.

    1. Maybe some of us don’t know what to believe.

      Seriously, I think he was born in Hawaii, but given the fact that this debate rages on, I have to wonder WTF?

      How hard is it to prove that you are a natural born citizen?

      How deranged do you have to be to keep believing that he is a crypto-Kenyan?

      Frankly, every time I try to look at the facts for myself, I can’t make it through them because of all the tards from the left and the right screaming and shouting.

      I haven’t seen any smoking gun from any of the birthers, but Obama’s secrecy on this issue does generate a bit of smoke in my eyes.

      I also notice you didn’t state your own belief. Why not? And what evidence did you base your final decision on?

    2. A friend of mine had a theory, which he may have heard somewhere else, that one of the reasons Obama hasn’t produced his birth certificate is because he may have claimed citizenship of another country when applying for college, maybe to get a boost on admission or loans. Who knows if that is true, but also who cares if it is? It’s just fun to speculate.

  44. “But yeah, so maybe we could reverse that and use the same [unintelligible]-type thinking”

    can’t we just put those brackets around everything she says?

    1. ugh, and everything Janet comments

  45. My opinion is that I think it’s a stupid provision that needs an amendment.

    Of all the irrational fears in the world, the Manchurian Candidate stuff is surely near the top. Jesus, if you can get through both our current citizenship process and then get through the scrutiny of a presidential election, that should be enough.

    As far as I can tell, Obama was born in Hawaii to an American mother. As far as I can tell, I don’t care even if he wasn’t. As far as I can tell, we elected him even if we shouldn’t have.

    1. If people wouldn’t accept an amendment allowing someone who became an American citizen as few as 10 years ago to be elected President, we could merge the citizenship requirement with the age requirement and require the candidate to have been a U.S. citizen for 35 years. I think we could get most Americans to support that. As long as we actually amend the Constitution to allow it, I would have no problem with a theoretical candidate who was not an American citizen until 36 years ago becoming President now.

  46. The birth certificate is a red herring. The simple fact that his (alleged) father wasn’t a US citizen means Obama is not a natural born citizen. To be an NBC of ANY country BOTH of your parents must be citizens of the country you are born in. Natural born means you are a citizen by blod and by soil. Obama is native born citizen not natural born.

    1. Where are you getting this crap? Are you a lawyer who works with nationality law? Do you work in immigration? I’m guessing not, because you have no clue what you are talking about. I have had to study this stuff endlessly and I can assure you, according to U.S. legal code having two citizen parents is NOT neccessary to be “natural born”

      1. You must really be a suck lawyer because there has NEVER been ANY Supreme Court case that SPECIFICALLY defines what an NBC is. If you can quote ONE SC case that says “the definition of natural born citizen is x” I will fly to wherever you live and kiss your ass. And don’t try Kim or Minor Or Slaughterhouse or Hasspert because it ain’t in there.

  47. When assessing whether someone is indulging this kooks, I always rephrase the question, see how it would sound if it was a different conspiracy theory. For example:

    INTERVIEWER: Would you make the 9/11 cover-up an issue if you ran?

    POLITICIAN: I think the public, rightfully, is still making it an issue. I don’t have a problem with that. I don’t know if I would have to bother to make it an issue ’cause I think there are enough members of the electorate who still want answers.

    The better answer is always “no, that’s crazy.” Isn’t it? Populism doesn’t necessarily mean indulging the worst tendencies of the electorate.

    1. Dave,

      That is pretty much word for word what Howard Dean said in about 2006 or so. I don’t recall any Reason posts objecting to that much less Moynahan having the vapors over it.

      1. Would you have defended him if reason did?

    2. And for the record, 9-11 truthers are a hell of a lot more destructive that birthers. Which is a more destructive conspiracy theory on the body politic? That some politician, who grew up in America and is an American citizen even if not “natural born” hid the fact that he was born overseas to get elected President or that the US government conspired to kill 2800 citizens?

      1. Actually, Howard Dean just talked about the rumor that the Saudi’s tipped off the White House before it happened. That has nothing to do with the government conspiring to kill 3,000 people. Heck, that could have happened, they determined that the source was not credible, but wanted to suppress that because it would look like a fuck up even though it’s totally innocent. The White House gets lots of intel and doesn’t act on all of it.

        * I am not saying the “Saudis tipped the WH off” theory is true, but it’s possible without inferring any sort of malice from the WH.

    3. And Weigel, Read my 1:20ish response to Tricky Vic upthread. If you read the entire thing, it is clear she is not endorsing birtherism. You guys don’t like Palin. We got it. Maybe you are right. But you don’t help your cause by being illiterate douchbags when reading her interviews.

      1. “”But you don’t help your cause by being illiterate douchbags when reading her interviews.””

        I would say the illiterate douchbags would be the ones putting words in her mouth she didn’t say, and encasing them in quotes. Like you did with the term idiot, which she never used.

        1. Vic, I broke out the whole question and answer sentence by sentence and explained what it means. I don’t know what else to do for you. It doesn’t say what you say it does. You can believe it does all you want. If that is what makes you feel better, have fun. But that doesn’t change what it actually says.

        2. And I only rephrase things and put them in quotation marks because you people apparently can’t read the plain english that is there. So, I hope maybe if it is put in simpler terms you might get it. But, I am pissing in the wind, because you will never admit what is in front of your face no matter how close I put it to you.

          1. EWWWW! Get it out of my face!
            Oh. My. God. It has I heart Sarah tattooed on it.

            1. Glad there’s a wind though.

              1. Hopefully it is blowing the piss on you.

                1. Touche, government hack.

          2. “”Vic, I broke out the whole question and answer sentence by sentence and explained what it means.””

            “””And I only rephrase things and put them in quotation marks because you people apparently can’t read the plain english that is there.”””

            I’ll give you a moment to reconcile the two statements. But consider this, if it’s you vs. everyone else (you people), the problem is probably with you.

            1. It is not just me. Lots of people on this thread agree with me. It is only the people whose entire intellectual identity in life comes from feeling smugh about Sarah Palin, who can’t seem to read multiple clause sentences.

              1. “”It is only the people whose entire intellectual identity in life comes from feeling smugh about Sarah Palin,””

                Yeah, that describes nobody on H&R.

    4. That does sound worse, but the September 11 “truthers” are necessarily accusing a lot of people of mass murder and unusually severe treason. The birthers are accusing President Obama only of being born in another country. When someone makes a trivial claim about another person, it is okay to take a “Sure, go ahead and look into it” position in response. When the claim is about something as serious as even a single murder, though, the answer should be “No, this accusation is false, I believe (unless and until you show me firm, reliable, convincing evidence)!”

      1. I the birthers (either the NBCers or the Certificators) accusations are correct then hundreds of people from every part of the country are guilty of any number of felonies including, but not limited to, perjury and obstruction of justice.

  48. McCain was born in the Panama Canal Zone before the law was passed making such births count towards naturalized citizenship.

    Trig is Palin’s grandson

    Obama’s father was Malcolm X – and that fact is spelled out on the original birth certificate.

    Excuse me, I need to have my tin-foil hat adjusted.

    1. McCain was a citizen because his father was a citizen. Actually his birth in Panama means he wasn’t an NBC either.

  49. Sarah Palin’s bus tour is really taking off.

    See:

    http://notionscapital.wordpres…..ane-folks/

  50. You all are idiots. She isn’t a Birther.

    She’s just saying that everything about his past is FAIR GAME.

    Morons. Palin’s been reading Cato. You should be thrilled she’s learning free-market solutions to our problems. Get off her back.

  51. Agreed with the title, but I fear it will continue as long as she is taken seriously.

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