What's Wrong With Health-Care Reform: A Recap


The House has yet to vote on a final bill, and the Senate has yet to release any complete legislation, but the various health-care reform proposals are starting to shape up. And, not surprisingly, there's quite a bit to worry about. Here's a recap of the major objections currently making the rounds:

It will not save money. In fact, according to CBO director Douglas Elmendorf, it will "significantly expand the federal responsibility for health-care costs," exacerbating rather curing the dire, health-care driven budget problems we already face. As Ron Bailey pointed out earlier today, this is the result when you use official government cost estimates. And as the Massachusetts experiment with universal coverage taught us, the true cost of any universal-coverage oriented health-care overhaul is likely to be far higher than projected.

It will likely shift people away from their current health-insurance plans. Depending on the final details surrounding the proposed public plan, some people will almost certainly end up moved away from their current plans. At a bare minimum, Obama's promise that individuals will be able to keep their current health-insurance is misleading

It will raise taxes. On people who make too much money, perhaps. Or perhaps on people who make money off of rental units. Or maybe, if Senate Finance Chairman and health-care poobah Max Baucus has his way, it will tax the middle class by way of their employer-provided health benefits. No matter what, any bill will cost a lot of money, so someone's going to pay for it. 

It will be tough on small and medium-sized businesses. According the Wall Street Journal, under the current House plan, "all but the smallest businesses" would be slapped with "a penalty equal to 8% of payroll if they fail to provide health insurance to workers." Meanwhile, the drug industry, which Obama promised to "take on" during the campaign, has extracted endless concessions, and supposed liberal villain Wal-Mart would make out rather well by using legislation as a weapon against its competitors

It will pave the way for health-care shortages. There's widespread agreement that the current system of medical provider payments in Medicare and Medicaid is a mess. But depending on how the plan shakes out, reduced doctor payments might essentially result in a system of health-care price controls, potentially causing shortages in care. Even if the system were set up so as not to reduce payments now, one can easily imagine anxious government officials cutting payments in the future in response to unexpected cost overruns like we've witnessed in Massachusetts.


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  1. I’d be interested to know the facts behind this Investor’s Business Daily article.


    It’s Not An Option

    By INVESTOR’S BUSINESS DAILY | Posted Wednesday, July 15, 2009 4:20 PM PT

    Congress: It didn’t take long to run into an “uh-oh” moment when reading the House’s “health care for all Americans” bill. Right there on Page 16 is a provision making individual private medical insurance illegal.

    When we first saw the paragraph Tuesday, just after the 1,018-page document was released, we thought we surely must be misreading it. So we sought help from the House Ways and Means Committee.

    It turns out we were right: The provision would indeed outlaw individual private coverage. Under the Orwellian header of “Protecting The Choice To Keep Current Coverage,” the “Limitation On New Enrollment” section of the bill clearly states:

    “Except as provided in this paragraph, the individual health insurance issuer offering such coverage does not enroll any individual in such coverage if the first effective date of coverage is on or after the first day” of the year the legislation becomes law.

    So we can all keep our coverage, just as promised – with, of course, exceptions: Those who currently have private individual coverage won’t be able to change it. Nor will those who leave a company to work for themselves be free to buy individual plans from private carriers.

    From the beginning, opponents of the public option plan have warned that if the government gets into the business of offering subsidized health insurance coverage, the private insurance market will wither. Drawn by a public option that will be 30% to 40% cheaper than their current premiums because taxpayers will be funding it, employers will gladly scrap their private plans and go with Washington’s coverage.

    The nonpartisan Lewin Group estimated in April that 120 million or more Americans could lose their group coverage at work and end up in such a program. That would leave private carriers with 50 million or fewer customers. This could cause the market to, as Lewin Vice President John Sheils put it, “fizzle out altogether.”

    What wasn’t known until now is that the bill itself will kill the market for private individual coverage by not letting any new policies be written after the public option becomes law.

    The legislation is also likely to finish off health savings accounts, a goal that Democrats have had for years. They want to crush that alternative because nothing gives individuals more control over their medical care, and the government less, than HSAs.

    With HSAs out of the way, a key obstacle to the left’s expansion of the welfare state will be removed.

    The public option won’t be an option for many, but rather a mandate for buying government care. A free people should be outraged at this advance of soft tyranny.

    Washington does not have the constitutional or moral authority to outlaw private markets in which parties voluntarily participate. It shouldn’t be killing business opportunities, or limiting choices, or legislating major changes in Americans’ lives.

    It took just 16 pages of reading to find this naked attempt by the political powers to increase their reach. It’s scary to think how many more breaches of liberty we’ll come across in the final 1,002.

  2. mediageek, I was curious about that, too. I heard it in one place but it hasn’t gone viral yet.

    Also, this being a health care thread, I’m expecting a “Yo, fuck Kevin” in 3,2,1…

  3. FOX News tells me that the 2009 Healthcare Scheme is dead.
    MSNBC says there’s nothing to worry about, and soon everyone will have access to free doctors.
    I’m so confused.

    1. msnbc IS a Democratic Station. Extremely biased.

      1. And Fox News IS a conservative station. Extremely biased.

  4. Shut the fuck up, Kevin.

  5. Kevin – no offense, mind you. Who are you, again?

  6. Warty, I really feel like I fit in now that I’v gotten both a “Shut the fuck up” and “Yo, fuck Kevin” in the same week. Life is good.

  7. You’re not one of us until SugarFree writes a horrifying sex story about you.

  8. THIS IS IT!

    The healthcare reform bill released by the House Of Representatives is an excellent bill as I understand it. It’s a bill with a strong, robust, government-run public option, and an intelligent, reasonable initial funding plan to cover almost all of the American people. It is carefully written, and thoughtfully constructed, informed, prudent and wise. This bill will save trillions of dollars, and millions of your lives. It is also now supported by the AMA.

    This is the type of bill that all Americans can feel good about. And this is the type of bill that has the potential to dramatically improve the quality of healthcare for all Americans. Rich, middle class and poor a like. Democrats, Republicans, Independents, and all other party affiliations. This bill has the potential to dramatically improve the quality of life of every American.

    The house healthcare bill should be viewed as the minimum GOLD STANDARD by which all other proposed healthcare legislation should be judged. All supporters of true high quality healthcare reform should now place all your support behind this healthcare reform bill released by the United States House Of Representatives, as the minimum Gold standard for healthcare reform in America.

    You should all now support this bill with all your might, and all of your unrelenting tenacity. This healthcare bill is a VERY, VERY GOOD! bill for all of the American people. Fight tooth, and nail for every bit of this bill if you have too. Be aggressive, creative, and relentless for this bill.

    From this time forward, go BIGGER and DEEPER with the American people every day until passage of healthcare reform with a robust, government-run public option.

    FIGHT!! like your life and the lives of your loved ones depends on it. BECAUSE IT DOES!

    It should also be noted that Ron Wyden’s “Free Choice Proposal” in the senate is a highly intriguing proposal and possibly a brilliant idea. And an Idea that should be strongly looked into as a way of increasing consumer choice, and consumer access to a government-run public option.



    God Bless You

    Jack Smith – Working Class

  9. Warty, we can still dare to dream, can’t we?

  10. go BIGGER and DEEPER with the American people every day

    SugarFree, your skills are needed.

  11. I’ve seen that jacksmith post before, only last time it was bigger, longer and uncut.

  12. HealthCareBot?

    Does the poster of that tripe actually think that he will get anything but a hostile reception here? I mean, I think even the regulars here who are for this sort of thing would write this crap off as unabashed boosterism. It sounds about as genuine as a $3 bill.

  13. Final reason:

    Guess what procedure the federal government could be able to force providers to perform?

  14. At least insurers would be required to include it in insurance plans

  15. Kevin sat back, warm with the glow of having been noticed by that most important of posters, namely Warty. He wondered, guiltily, if Warty had big strong arms with which to hold him. He could just imagine snuggling into Warty’s manly, hairy chest, and feeling so safe and protected there.

    Kevin dropped the shades and pulled down his pants. The thoughts were just too exciting for him to not relieve himself, right now. In his mind, Warty looked like a shaggy Burt Lancaster, preferably like in Seven Days in May, or even The Train.

  16. Holy crap, I can’t wait for school to get back into session so that I can immerse myself in calculus, physics, and engineering and can be somewhat ignorant of the absolute mess that is our government right now.

    mediageek’s post both scares and angers me…

  17. To MediaGeek at post number 1:

    Ummm…I would not trust any article that describes the Lewin Group as “nonpartisan.”

    The Lewin Group is a wholly owned subsidiary of United Healthcare–the largest for profit health “insurer” in the country.

    The same outfit that shipped their last CEO off into the sunset with a $1.8 BILLION compensation package.

    These people are leeches–bleeding the country dry in order to make profits–siphoning 30 cents off of every dollar they touch.

    FYI–that’s not my number-it’s the figure that John Sheil–the chap cited in the article as saying 120 million Americans would move from the private, for-profits–if there was a government option.

    His reasoning?

    Because the government plan–with no need to generate profits, lower overhead and sufficient market share clout to wring better care and lower fees out of providers–would be able to offer BETTER coverage at about a 30% discount.

  18. Because the government plan–with no need to generate profits, lower overhead


  19. Decent troll Don. Keep it up.

  20. Following up on the point raised by mediageek, I looked at the bill myself (HR 3200). It is pretty bad. Existing coverage will be “grandfathered”; plans that enroll new participants after the bill takes affect will have to do so via a “Health Insurance Exchange”. There are detailed requirements in the bill for what the plans cover and how.

    Guess who runs this “exchange”. And we’re not supposed to call this socialized medicine?

  21. Many of these same objections were raised, in forms appropriate for the day, when Medicare was proposed. It passed anyway, and here we are. What we need is a wooden stake to make this very bad idea die and stay dead. I suspect that the only (or, at least, the best) way forward for believers in liberty is to create the closest thing possible under present circumstances to “free-market health care,” and then defend it vigorously in court when the government inevitably tries to shut it down. (No, I’m not paranoid. See this: http://www.nypost.com/seven/03042009/news/regionalnews/state_slaps_dr__do_good_157907.htm) The goal must be to have the alternative last long enough to become established as a practical counterexample to spurious claims that we have to “go forward” to single-payer because it is “too late to go back” to a true, free-market approach. At some point, we will be able to use this example to inspire legislation that will make the world safer for free-market health care.

    If anyone is working on this now, I’d be glad to give a hand and provide any help I could. After working for over a decade in informatics within health-care-as-we-know-it, I am extremely well motivated to “smash the system.”

  22. Thanks for that baptism by fire, I am apparently now a regular.


    It’s official. America and the World are now in a GLOBAL PANDEMIC. A World EPIDEMIC with potential catastrophic consequences for ALL of the American people. The first PANDEMIC in 41 years. And WE THE PEOPLE OF THE UNITED STATES will have to face this PANDEMIC with the 37th worst quality of healthcare in the developed World.


    We spend over twice as much of our GDP on healthcare as any other country in the World. And Individual American spend about ten times as much out of pocket on healthcare as any other people in the World. All because of GREED! And the PRIVATE FOR PROFIT healthcare system in America.

    And while all this is going on, some members of congress seem mostly concern about how to protect the corporate PROFITS! of our GREED DRIVEN, PRIVATE FOR PROFIT NATIONAL DISGRACE. A PRIVATE FOR PROFIT DISGRACE that is in fact, totally valueless to the public health. And a detriment to national security, public safety, and the public health.

    Progressive democrats the Tri-Caucus and others should stand firm in their demand for a robust government-run public option for all Americans, with all of the minimum requirements progressive democrats demanded. If congress can not pass a robust public option with at least 51 votes and all robust minimum requirements, congress should immediately move to scrap healthcare reform and request that President Obama declare a state of NATIONAL HEALTHCARE EMERGENCY! Seizing and replacing all PRIVATE FOR PROFIT health insurance plans with the immediate implementation of National Healthcare for all Americans under the provisions of HR676 (A Single-payer National Healthcare Plan For All).

    Coverage can begin immediately through our current medicare system. With immediate expansion through recruitment of displaced workers from the canceled private sector insurance industry. Funding can also begin immediately by substitution of payroll deductions for private insurance plans with payroll deductions for the national healthcare plan. This is what the vast majority of the American people want. And this is what all objective experts unanimously agree would be the best, and most cost effective for the American people and our economy.

    In Mexico on average people who received medical care for A-H1N1 (Swine Flu) with in 3 days survived. People who did not receive medical care until 7 days or more died. This has been the same results in the US. But 50 million Americans don’t even have any healthcare coverage. And at least 200 million of you with insurance could not get in to see your private insurance plans doctors in 2 or 3 days, even if your life depended on it. WHICH IT DOES!

    If President Obama has to declare a NATIONAL STATE OF EMERGENCY to rescue the American people from our healthcare crisis, he will need all the sustained support you can give him. STICK WITH HIM! He’s doing a brilliant job.



    Join the fight.

    Contact congress and your representatives NOW! AND SPREAD THE WORD!

    (http://action.firedoglake.com/page/s/publicoption) (http://www.actblue.com/page/healthcareheroes)

    God Bless You

    Jacksmith – WORKING CLASS

  24. nice post..
    Entertainment at one stop

  25. I find it oddly . . . comforting that Britneybot approves of jacksmithbot’s post.

  26. In Mexico on average people who received medical care for A-H1N1 (Swine Flu) with in 3 days survived. People who did not receive medical care until 7 days or more died. This has been the same results in the US. But 50 million Americans don’t even have any healthcare coverage. And at least 200 million of you with insurance could not get in to see your private insurance plans doctors in 2 or 3 days, even if your life depended on it. WHICH IT DOES

    This person clearly has no idea what waiting times are for specialists are in countries with socialized medicine. Any DMV-level bureaucrat can give you a swine flu shot, but you probably don’t want him doing your orthopedic surgery.

  27. I think JackSmith is being paid to post on blog sites. Nobody outside of lobbying groups can be this in favor, and write this long, in adoration of government-sponsored health care.

  28. 1.2/25/1010
    Now somebody is not telling the truth, on both sides. So I did a little number check with my friends on the net and I was right, so enjoy the truth, of force pay through the Bill and the freedom of choice offered By me and my friends in and for FASC Concepts .This Prime Directive on page 100 at our site will not be completed until 3/1/2010, but hey please drop on by and see what the fuss is about……..
    A Prime Directive
     For Health Care

    In all things there must be a guideline in order to prevent diversity within that issue. As it would seem, after 50 years or more this Health Care issue is still without a moral value and it is not in the best interest of man kind. This word Man Kind, should be the building block for Health Care.
    Health Care Insurance Companies;
    The merger of HCIC = Health Care Insurance Co., to show that when these companies put 95% of the intake of funds into a United Health Care Forum The balance left over could be all most tax free, but in our view should be tax free, for their income because of this 95% is considered a donation to the Rebuilding the National Security Of The United States Of America.
    This statement of rebuild the National Security Of The United States, it is because of the tax forum in place that has failed because the tax dollar was calculated as a constant figure. The economy reports is in support of this statement?.
    The early released reports that this Health Care Bill would not increase the National Debt, as 6 months have past the new reports are stated at a $1.2 trillion dollars, plus a extra 6.2 billion dollars for economic recovery. And at the same a new tax forum against the Health Care System. The balancing is not shown because of over lapping reports and concepts for Bill to Law.
    {report from page 89.New Taxes in the Senate Health-Care Bill }
    Tax on high-end health insurance plans: $149.1 billion
    Capping flexible spending accounts at $2,500: $14.6 billion
    Fees for drug makers: $22.2 billion
    Fees for medical device makers: $19.3 billion
    Fees for health insurance companies: $60.4 billion
    Higher floor for deducting medical expenses: $15.2 billion
    Higher payroll tax for top earners: $53.8 billion
    Tax on cosmetic surgery: $5.8 billion
      page 87.The President’s Proposal for Health Reform
    It puts our budget and economy on a more stable path by reducing the deficit by $100 billion over the next ten years ? and about $1 trillion over the second decade ? by cutting government overspending and reining in waste, fraud and abuse.
     page 92.17 Tax Increases in Senate Health Care Bill
    1.40% excise tax on health coverage in excess of $8,500/$23,000 ($149.1 billion)
    2.Employer W-2 reporting of value of health (negligible revenue effect)
    3.Conform definition of medical expenses ($5.0 billion)
    4.Increase penalty for non qualified health savings account distributions to 20% ($1.3 billion)
    5.Limit health flexible spending arrangements in cafeteria plans to $2,500 ($14.6 billion)
    6.Require information reporting on payments to corporations ($17.1 billion)
    7.Additional requirements for section 501(c)(3) hospitals (negligible revenue effects)
    8.Impose annual fee on manufacturers & importers of branded drugs ($22.2 billion)
    9.Impose annual fee on manufacturers & importers of medical devices ($19.3 billion)
    10.Impose annual fee on health insurance providers ($60.4 billion)
    11.Study and report of effect on veterans health care (no revenue effect)
    12.Eliminate deduction for expenses allocable to Medicare Part D subsidy ($5.4 billion)
    13.Raise 7.5% AGI floor on medical expenses deduction to 10% ($15.2 billion)
    14.$500,000 deduction limitation on taxable year remuneration to health insurance officials ($0.6 billion)
    15.Additional 0.5% hospital insurance tax on wages > $200,000 ($250,000 joint) ($53.8 billion)
    16.Modification of section 833 treatment of certain health  organizations ($0.4 billion)
    17.Impose 5% excise tax on cosmetic surgery ($5.8 billion)
           See CCH’s Special Report.
     As stated By President Obama, this reform will not increase the National Debt, but it looks a lot like borrowing from Petter to pay Paul.
       Now lets look at this??
     Lets Use The 10 Largest Health Insurers
    (by revenue)
    AARP was not on the list for top ten,
    1.UnitedHealth Group
    3.CIGNA Corp.
    5.Anthem, Inc.
    7.Health Net
    8.PacifiCare Health Systems
    9.Oxford Health Plans
    Just with the top ten Health Care Insurance Companies we can show a income of around 100 million people x $100.00 per month at a low ball figure = $ 10,000 000 000 { $10 Billion Dollars.} To show a basic scale below In the US the progression is:
    Hundred – 100
    Thousand – 1,000
    Million – 1,000,000
    Billion – 1,000,000,000 as a low ball figure $10 billion per week at 100,000000 people
    Trillion – 1,000,000,000,000
    Quadrillion ? 1,000,000,000,000,000
    I a sure you that this $10 billion dollars is chump change even at $10 billion x 12 months. This does not even cover .5% of the revenue. This Health Care system is all most a $100 Trillion dollar package per year.
    As a part of Law when a Company is built , as HCIC and people invest money into that system and the amendments of Laws allow the continue lack of representation then the failure falls on Law Makes for the United States. One further failure is according to Law, that when Laws are written and the lack of a people to read this Law, is further supported by the conman need of the Peoples Right To Understand that Law. “In other words it must be in English.”
    As stated before the Age of Health Care Insurance Companies have ended, they had their chance and now nature have selected them to be no more. In order not to further burden a troubled economy I did change my mind 3 months ago and offer a way out in the best interest of the People and employees Of Insurance Companies.{ A Merger}
    The Prime Directive Of HCIC has become as a Factor of profit and the calculus of the birth of a child by sophisticated testing for their A.I. So as these Officials Of HCIC fixed a system by their Artificial Intelligence, within a Health Care Matrix and now all they can do is see us as variables in a equation as dollar numbers, I do not believe they try to see any more, because without that Mathematical A.I. They can not insure just anybody. Our Health Care Insurance Companies,watch as A.I. shows the way for D.N.A testing and other inventive forms of how to calculate the dollar as a human input. {This is all so documented}
    Henry Massingale
    FASC Concepts in and for Pay It Forward
    http://www.fascmovement.mysite.com on google and see all of our friend…

  29. Hi everybody, I stopped by to blog again with you all and to show you how the cause and effect of a work of uniting the views of 173 million inter faced sites has forced Government to sign this Bill to Law and now it is where It needs to be, in Court. Officials seek to balance, I seek to un-balance because I want the same as 89% of the People want, a honest Reform.
    I am sorry but this Bill to Law needs to go back to formula. It is not built on equal standing between Social Grace of People and The People.
    First off, somehow there is just to many people that do not understand the function of the Governing Bodies within Government. First, there are around 60 Personal that hold seats that write these Laws, both Democrat and Republican. Then this Bill for Law goes up for a vote and there is around 500 or so Republican and Democrats that vote. The sling talk of this of being the Obama Bill is not Political Correct within the use of words.
    Now lets get to the issues of this Bill of Law being Unconstitutional.
    I agree this new Health Care Law borders on a Constitutional Infringement and within the rush of putting it into action, a balance of dollar issues is lost. The placement of threats against the People is in fact Unconstitutional, as will as force pay.
    Unfortunately the Law Suites against the Bill needs to be restructure within the Concepts Of Constitutional Infringements through the voice of the People it is this Voice that guides the destiny of the Country and the decisions within that Court. .For Example, the weight of 100 million people, and their words in Court bring weight of value to not destroy this Bill of Law but to take it back to formula.
    I must agree with people that this Bill to Law is built within the concept of Social Grace and I do not blame people one bit for the out cry of the burden place against Companies and people that make a great deal of money.
    The use of FASC Concepts 10% per cent on a yearly income that may have been used by Officials is in error because this forum of mine looks into the economic conditions within each home before a placement of payment can go forward, and we believe in the freedom of choice. {As of yet there has been no reply by Officials of Government if they used our Concepts.}
    To show people that I do not belong to any Governing Parties or Insurance Companies, please enjoy the Roll back Concepts of FASC under economy buster at our site.
    This issue we find unfair, According to information, that Tax Payers pay for over 75% of all Medical Cost for Government Officials. As it would seem this Social Grace, is not of a equal standing, as stated in Bill 101 of the New Health Care Laws. Government Officials are Civil Servants According to Law and should not be above the Law of this 10% Force Pay on a Yearly Income. Health care for U.S. Politicians receive the Countrys ,New health care plan to cover all government people (When the President, Senators, … leaves office do they lose their federal employee health care or go on cobra like concept… Make them pay for their own Health care just as we do if they refuse to pay tax, what then ? { you can find this story also at the page for economy buster and the link } …
    My big complaint is that the 10% based, Health Care Forum Bill 101 is lacking inter structure and will not help the economic effected people, and will burden people who all ready have insurance.
    This 1900 pages of Law is untested and only in theory. The fact still remains that because this Health Care System is a $100 Trillion Dollar per year system ,we feel that the Court should place this new Tax Theory { Bill to Law} under Court Supervision for 3 years, because of the failure of Officials to fix the existing Tax System. Without further in site of a balance, only a way to balance the existing in a concept that still eludes practical guidelines. As in I see no back up ideas like {plan B} and it, this Tax Plan is still based on a dollars being a constant flow of cash.
    According to information that there is a plan to lay off City and County workers, that it is considered cheaper to put them on unemployment and Social Services then payroll. What would be more practical is to have every other weekend off or for those who wish, each weekend off. This includes Postal Workers. Also as in Deer field Beach Florida a out side contractor has offered a Bid Per Purposed Contract and lay offs will be against employees under so much time in and on that County job.
    We do understand that Governing Officials are desperate for this Health Care Money, so as a concept of a way to balance trust again between Officials and the People, any Government official that has a Job Concept, they must put up a Bond as a Contractor would to build a project. Once the Job Conclusion has reached a successful point in it creation, Officials receive a refund.
    As stated before, this Health Care Dollar belongs to the People, and I do have this Little Health Care Bug in my Hands. The balance of the views of 250 million people and all this diversity created by Officials is slowly coming to a silence, because I speak for the People and I offer respect to the views in a building block to a Health Care Reform, because of my concept to reform Government within this Health Care Issue, and I would ask the United States Supreme Court to place this Health Care Dollar under Court Supervision until it is deemed worthy of a People right to be a part of or not.
    In 3 years our budget / deficit, can be a positive balance of $1.2 Trillion Dollars. But first we must put forward a Job, work force to strategically rebuild the United States in a anti / war crime forum. To place Factories where they serve that area of city or town.
    I watched for 7 years this failure reach where it is today, ” I saw this”, but there was no intervention by Officials. Officials had their hats handed to them by Scam Artist, and The Arabic Drug Empire, cave dwellers. This issue has not one thing of how I believe, I can only share with you what I have watched for over 30 years take place and there must be a unity by the people to bring a reform to this new Law and to our Government.
    No I am sorry President Obama, Officials need to earn trust again, and to become as one with the People. This is a way to say, look into the economic conditions at persons home before you over burden their lives, with this Bill to Law. This is why you was voted into Office…..
    FASC Concepts in and for Pay it Forward covers the web see why we have become the largest web site in the United States, and we give our thank to the thousands of people who post by us, as one voice.
    on google , yahoo, and aol http://www.fascmovement.mysite.com

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