Terrorism

Jesse Ventura, Citizen of the World

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Reuters reports on a poll of residents in 17 countries about who was really behind the 9/11 attacks, despite the fact that Al Qaeda leader "Osama bin Laden has boasted of organizing the suicide attacks by his followers using hijacked commercial airliners."

The (no-so-surprising-but-still-disturbing) results? 9/11 troofer and homeless-man impersonator and former Gov. Jesse Ventura (I-Minn.) is in tune with residents of many parts of the world, including Mexico, where he lives part of the year:

On average, 46 percent of those surveyed said al Qaeda was responsible, 15 percent said the U.S. government, 7 percent said Israel and 7 percent said some other perpetrator. One in four people said they did not know who was behind the attacks….

In Europe, al Qaeda was cited by 56 percent of Britons and Italians, 63 percent of French and 64 percent of Germans. The U.S. government was to blame, according to 23 percent of Germans and 15 percent of Italians.

Respondents in the Middle East were especially likely to name a perpetrator other than al Qaeda, the poll found.

Israel was behind the attacks, said 43 percent of people in Egypt, 31 percent in Jordan and 19 percent in the Palestinian Territories. The U.S. government was blamed by 36 percent of Turks and 27 percent of Palestinians.

In Mexico, 30 percent cited the U.S. government and 33 percent named al Qaeda.

The only countries with overwhelming majorities blaming al Qaeda were Kenya with 77 percent and Nigeria with 71 percent.

More here.

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  1. Didn’t Bin Laden admit to doing it at his trial after we caught him?

  2. The U.S. Government planning and executing the 9/11 attacks.

    BWAA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

  3. Wait, it thought Iraq was behind 9/11

  4. Since the only evidence we have that al Qaeda was responsible is the word of the same administration that told us Saddam Hussein had WMDs, do you blame people for being skeptical about the official story?

  5. With movies like “Fabled Enemies” circulating on you tube getting millions of hits this isn’t surprising. I haven’t seen any response from official sources claiming the ABC, CNN and NBC news reports were false about the numerous issues brought up.

  6. I find it interesting that so few Palestinians believe that Israel or the US did it. Wonder what they know?

  7. Jesse knows what he is talking about. He is, after all, Captain Freedom; and working on The Running Man game show taught him how much the government lies to the people.

  8. Since the only evidence we have that al Qaeda was responsible is the word of the same administration that told us Saddam Hussein had WMDs

    Well, we also have AQ’s word on it, for that’s worth. And, of course, several binders worth of information on the highjackers and their affiliations with AQ.

    This just reminds me of why I am right not to care about public opinion in other countries.

  9. Don’t you remember Bush’s confession in that South Park episode?
    “Yes. Quite simple to pull off, really. All I had to do was have explosives planted at the base of the towers, then on 9-11 we pretended like four planes were being hijacked when really we just rerouted them to Pennsylvania then flew two military jets into the World Trade Center filled with more explosives and shot down all the witnesses in Flight 93 with an F-15 after blowing up the pentagon with a cruise missile. It was only the world’s most intricate and flawlessly executed planm ever, ever.”

    Really?

  10. The US government isn’t that competent.

  11. That’s the joke Nigel…..

  12. “This just reminds me of why I am right not to care about public opinion in other countries.”

    No shit. If you had to listen to the bullshit I listen to day in and day out (from Chavez and his goons), you’d simply accept the fact that most people are downright stupid.

  13. Assuming it wants the credit for its hard work, Al Qaeda has a pretty poor PR Department if it can’t convince its own constituency that it carried out the most successful terrorist attack in US history.

  14. Who ever did it carried out a pretty complicated task. That much we know, it wasn’t real easy to do..and it wouldn’t have been easy for the Mosssad/CIA/CIA-Al Ciada Assets to have carried it out…nor would it have been easy for 19 camel jockies who don’t know how to fly airliners to have carried it out….but somebody did it…we do know that.

    The problem is that when we look at the 19 camel jockies it turns out lots of them had the CIA intervene with US government officials to specifically allow them into the country for unexplained reasons and it turns out that some of them were trained at US military facilities.

    Then the us GOVERNEMNT DIDN’T WANT TO INVESTIGATE THE 9/11. Famileis complained so after a year the administrationa grred to investigate and appointed Henry Kissinger….a guy with similar insider credentials to John McCloy(the guy who headed the warren commision)….the familes confronted him on the millions he makes in working for the House of Saud and Kissinger immediately resigned(signalling more intentions to coverup)…look into it yourself…there is lots more to it than what FoxNews and the NY times are telling you everynight.

  15. Gabe, go take your Lithium.

  16. Who does Sarah Palin think did the 9/11 attacks?

  17. Me: Most people are fucking stupid!

    Pretty girl in bar: Oh, J sub D, you’re such a meanie cynic. [Looks desperately around the bar] Hey Bob! Long time, no see! Well, talk to ya later, J sub.

    Life sometimes sucks being right.

  18. rana,

    How are the goons taking Saudi refusing to abide by the new OPEC production limits? Any Chavez comments about the House of Saud in bed with Satan/Bush yet?

  19. i agree the us governemnt is generally incompetent but the manhattan project was kept secret for a long time and the governemtn was pretty competent about the whole darned thing…The German Governemtn wasn’t super competent after teh Weimar fiasco, but they were competent enough to pull off the Reaichstag fire a cnovince millions to give Hitler all the power.

    Using a “let it happen on purpose technique”combined with “need to know” policies and compartmentalization the combined assets of Mosssad And CIA can probably do things little better than 19 supposed religous fanatics who “hate america for our freedom”.

  20. If nick thinks this is all ridiculous then he should write an article about how factually wrong “Fabled Enemies” is….the movie has been seen by more people in a week than Reason’s most popular videos will have been watched in a year.

    well done criticism of the movie will get lots of hits…and you might even get it produced by the history channel or NBC or CNN.

  21. I need to convince that pretty girl to read a thread where the truthers show up.
    Maybe then she’ll recognize my wisdom and I’ll finally get to “know” her.

  22. “Gabe, go take your Lithium.”

    I prefer Sodium Fluoride combined with double doses of flu shots…it gives me this calm obediant feeling kinda like the jewish prisoners had when they stood patiently waiting to be shot.

  23. A chart of my positive feelings toward Jesse Ventura is almost a perfect bell curve.

  24. j sub d,

    chicks do like guys with a more positive attitude…happiness is contageous and they want to be made happy not depressed.

    go watch swingers and then try to look for slightly smarter chicks at a econ graduate school or something. your chances of meeting girls potentially interested in reason blogs are much higher when you go there than randomly at a bar.

  25. nick,
    If you want to pretend that movies like “Fabled Enemies” are best left un-rebutted or critiqued then I guess your next best alternative would be to insinuate that only anti-semites would watch the movie…I’m guessing strategy #2 from Reason.

  26. I love it. The CIA and Bush pulled off 9-11 but were either too scrupulous or too incometent to put a few thousand pounds of anthrax and nerve gas somewhere in Iraq to be “discovered” by US forces.

  27. Don’t forget Bush also blew up the levies in New Orleans.

  28. Gabe, if you know what’s good for you, I suggest you do the right thing.

  29. I imagine that I will regret this shortly.

    Who ever did it carried out a pretty complicated task.

    Not really. They exploited an operational mindset that hijackings are for purposes of extortion. All law enforcement procedures were wrapped around that mindset.

    That much we know, it wasn’t real easy to do..

    Wrong again, modern jets are actually not that hard to fly. If you can fly microsoft’s flight simulator, you could probably put a 767 into the middle of a tower.

  30. i agree the us government is generally incompetent but the manhattan project was kept secret for a long time and the governement was pretty competent about the whole darned thing

    If by “a long time” you mean until Aug 1945. And that’s not counting what the Soviets found out before then.

    And pretty much everyone who worked on the Mahattan Project could and did say they worked on it about 5 minutes after the war ended, even if they could not and/or did not give details on what they did.

  31. John,
    If Mossad was more involved than Bush then it makes sense they want to make sure Bush looks like the bad guy…there are a lot of ways it could have happened…you stick with your faith…the government loves you and wouldn’t lie about any of it.

    you believe:
    The 19 raving religous fanatics succesfully attacked the pentagon yet no one else could penetrate the impenetrable US borders for the last 7 years(accept for when part of the government mailed anthrax to some people).

    and the government has done it’s best to investigate all of this without lying to us at all.

  32. Hey Gabe, if the government is so good at coverups, how come they let Ace Ventura go even though he was the second gunman on the grassy knoll? He confessed to Lt. Einhorn!

  33. Elemenope,
    heh. thanks. funny picture. Reminds me of the pic of Chavez with what looked like Mickey Mouse ears…

    robc,
    Wow. You really are on top of things.
    I have no idea how Chavez has reacted (it’s really hard to keep up with him- the man talks like 12 hours a day! and I have to work)… but I’m sure we can count on: “Es un complot del imperialismo”

    Although, he may be busy playing with the shiny, supersonic Russian Tu-160 jets:

    “Yes, yes ? pitiyanquis ? para que les duela”, ha afirmado.
    “Y adem?s yo voy a pilotar uno de ellos”, ha a?adido Ch?vez.

  34. modern jets are actually not that hard to fly.

    Its the take-offs and landings that are hard – straight-n-level, especially with fly-by-wire and auto-pilots, isn’t that tough.

    There’s a reason that the planes hit landmarks that are easily spotted from the air; the highjackers didn’t even have to be terribly good at navigation.

  35. “modern jets are actually not that hard to fly. If you can fly microsoft’s flight simulator, you could probably put a 767 into the middle of a tower.”

    I have never piloted a plane so you may be right. However I have heard and read a lot of testimony from air force pilots with 20+ years experience that says the exact opposite….here is one guy:

    http://www.captainsherlock.com/101.html

    ” They exploited an operational mindset that hijackings are for purposes of extortion. All law enforcement procedures were wrapped around that mindset.”

    this is contrary to what we see the military doing test runs of in the years before 9/11

    check out: 3:15 of this clip. it addresses the lies the government told about this. Peter Jennings “NORAD practiced drills where terrorist hi-jacked planes and rammend them into the Pentagon and WTC”

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_u9wbEJIsuw

  36. People are fucking stupid.

    Exhibit A – Gabe
    Exhibit B – George W. Bush
    Exhibit C – Redstate.com
    Exhibit D – DailyKos.com

    I have more but I’ll take mercy on the jury.

  37. Its the take-offs and landings that are hard . . .

    I worked with a former Navy training pilot. He said flying was easy; it’s the transition from air to ground that causes all the problems.

  38. “Don’t forget Bush also blew up the levies in New Orleans.”

    You ever notice how “levee” is spelled like “Levy,” which is a Jewish name? Wake up people – after the blew up the Twin Towers, the Jews flooded New Orleans – and they forced me to wear this stupid bow tie.

  39. You got me Epsiarch 🙂 …Jim Carey must be a renegade agent…that is why his wife is complaining about the vaccines the government used to make his kids handicapped. I’d be careful if I were him.

  40. cmon J sub D lighten up…I prefer to be ridiculed as opposed to just being called names…Espiarch is funnier than you. I bet he gets laid more than you ….you can learn from him.

  41. (http://pilotsfor911truth.org/core.html)

    ok none of the 20 year veterans refrenced
    know as much about flying or 9/11 as fat bastards friend…I’ll grant you that, it is easy to hi jack planes and hit targets while evading NORAD. So are you guys saying you think the government is super competent at correcting it’s security holes and that is why the easy task of commiting terror attacks has been impossible to repeat since 9/11?

  42. “modern jets are actually not that hard to fly.”

    “Y adem?s yo voy a pilotar uno de ellos”, ha a?adido Ch?vez. (“I’m going to fly one of them”)

    If Chavez can fly a jet…(fill in the blank).

  43. How many US citizens think Iraq was behind 9/11? Stupidity is universal. Or the US government should not have played with fire in blaming Iraq for 9/11 or at least implying it..

  44. short, fat bastard. Don’t forget the short.

  45. Yes, most people are stupid, even more stupid and misinformed than most Americans, believe it or not.

  46. So are you guys saying you think the government is super competent at correcting it’s security holes and that is why the easy task of commiting terror attacks has been impossible to repeat since 9/11?

    Why, no. Who here has said that?

    Try to keep the non sequiturs down to a dull roar, Gabe. Maybe that will help.

    And why did anyone need to “evade NORAD” on 9/11? They were domestic airliners in a sky full of the same. I mean, is it even possible for a jumbo jet to “evade NORAD”?

  47. gabe, I’ll see your list of expert pilots and raise you a collection of PhD’s that claim creation science is true.

  48. The problem with 9/11 LIHOP claims is the same problem with claims that FDR knew the Japanese were going to attack Pearl Harbor. Why would FDR start a war with Japan, which he didn’t want, and risk not being able to concentrate on war with Germany, which he did want? Why would Bush or whoever take such a risky plan that wasn’t even clearly connected with his supposed actual target (Iraq)? I would be more likely to believe a conspiracy theory about war with Iraq if it were started with something that actually provided the US with some benefit (like Polk sending troops to defend disputed territory in Texas) or something that didn’t hurt the US at all (like the Gulf of Tonkin incident).

  49. The US government isn’t that competent.

    sure it is

  50. I wonder if the problem in this survey is semantics. By that, some people might believe that AQ terrorists DID fly the planes into the towers & pentagon, but the US government sponsored them (helped them, whatever). I would be curious to know the exact language of the questions asked. As for my two cents on 9/11 conspiracies, I concur with Richard in that South Park summed it all up best. Guess I now know not to put a brown hot dog in the urinal.

  51. I see your point fat bastard. So I conceded that it is easy to hijack planes and fly them into buildings even if you have the crudest flight skills…I still don’t understand how you guys think the government is soo good at fixing it’s security holes.

    R C Dean …Did you look at the news report that NORAD did mock drills on what to do if terrorist hijacked planes and tried to fly them into the Pentagon and WTC?

    the planes weer going off their flight path for over an hou headed straight to the pentagon…after being reported as hijacked…NORAD is supposed to catch that.

    “They were domestic airliners in a sky full of the same. I mean, is it even possible for a jumbo jet to “evade NORAD”?” that is what I thought was strange…and then when you look at the unprecedented change in control of NORAD(cheney took over shortly before 9/11) it looks fishy to me.

    Charles, I don’t know why FDR did it, but it was pretty evil to not let the NAVY respond to the attacks he knew were coming. I suggest you read some of the books about the subject.

    I guess you also think the government told the truth about the USS liberty in spite of the overwhelming evidence to the contrary?

  52. The prudent thing to do when a nation is having a civil war, fracturing is to sit back, take no sides, offer our good services as negotiators and open diplomatic relations with the winners.

    You’ll note the operative word above is prudent, not moral, not realpolitick. As my drunken neighbors would say: Butt the hell out. This is none of your damned business.
    We got Hussein (he wasn’t worth the bother, but we got him). Let the Iraqi’s decide the future of their government. If the government in Baghdad can’t hold it together with a four year enforcer at its back, it seems unlikely it ever will.

    BTW, the partion Iraq thing was not insane. It may well have been the best solution; we will never know.

  53. Everytime one of these Troofer jerk offs opens their pieholes five more people cease to take seriously areas where a government cover-up was WAY more likely–like the antrax attacks, or Iraqi WMDs.

    That’s why I fucking hate Troofers.

  54. BDB,

    That’s why I’ve always thought that truthers are in fact government agents.

    I would’nt be too surprised to learn that Gabe was a member of Mossad.

  55. Meh–

    I can say that if I did want to discredit any and all government coverups, I’d covertly fund the most ridiculous group ever (like troofers). So you might be on to something.

  56. then when you look at the unprecedented change in control of NORAD(cheney took over shortly before 9/11) it looks fishy to me.

    Cheney took over NORAD? How? Did he get breveted as an air force general?

    After “taking control”, did he issue any orders? Make any changes, like, I dunno, “don’t worry about planes going off their flight paths and heading for D.C.”? If he had, do you seriously believe it could have been kept secret?

    And, if Cheney had hamstrung NORAD, wouldn’t that mean that no one had to “evade NORAD” anymore? Which is it?

  57. Charles, I don’t know why FDR did it, but it was pretty evil to not let the NAVY respond to the attacks he knew were coming. I suggest you read some of the books about the subject.

    You don’t believe JFK was killed by Oswald, do you?

    Moon landing? Didn’t have the technology?


  58. Why would FDR start a war with Japan, which he didn’t want, and risk not being able to concentrate on war with Germany, which he did want?

    I’m not so sure that FDR didn’t want to fight Japan as well, but the FDR conspiracy is at least plausible – he knew of the attack, and let it happen (For the record, I don’t believe in either the FDR or 9/11 conspiracies). If the conspiracy theory was, the US gov knew of the 9/11 plot and let it happen, then okay, that could be, but deliberately rigging buildings with explosives? Sorry, if you believe in any of that, you have no capacity to reason, and you seriously need help.

  59. I find it peculiar how so many commenters here – and probably authors of this blog – are so sure in their absolute epistemological grasp that they can denounce anyone who expresses doubt in the Al Qaeda theory as “seriously needing help”.

    While I’m not saying that Al Qaeda didn’t do it, I would hypothesize that the people in need of “help” are those who have such firm beliefs in their absolute grasp of reality.

    There isn’t any one person in the world who really knows how everything else is. As far as political schemes go, the people who are probably closest to knowing most of it, are at the top of intelligence agencies, and keep their mouths shut.

    Now, the average commenter on Reason.com… while it may be reasonable for him to think it’s likely that Al Qaeda did it, does he really have access to facts such that he can positively know that this is how things went?

    Most likely not. And since most Reason.com commenters claim to know such things as facts, this can be used as a baseline measurement for how much to discount your most passionate views on most other issues.

  60. Yes Denis, and after we’re done discussing that we can debate whether or you are truly awake or this discussion is actually a figment of your imagination.

  61. I wonder how this affects al Qaeda recruiting.

    Recruiter: Hey, why don’t you leave you family and career for a sucide mission?

    Recruit: What for? Have you guys actually accomplished anything?

    Recruiter: What do you mean? We brought down the WTC!

    Recruit: Come on, you really believe that? Here, watch this youtube video. It explains what really happened.

  62. I find it peculiar how so many commenters here – and probably authors of this blog – are so sure in their absolute epistemological grasp that they can denounce anyone who expresses doubt in the Al Qaeda theory as “seriously needing help”.

    While I’m not saying that Al Qaeda didn’t do it, I would hypothesize that the people in need of “help” are those who have such firm beliefs in their absolute grasp of reality.

    There isn’t any one person in the world who really knows how everything else is. As far as political schemes go, the people who are probably closest to knowing most of it, are at the top of intelligence agencies, and keep their mouths shut.

    Now, the average commenter on Reason.com… while it may be reasonable for him to think it’s likely that Al Qaeda did it, does he really have access to facts such that he can positively know that this is how things went?

    Most likely not. And since most Reason.com commenters claim to know such things as facts, this can be used as a baseline measurement for how much to discount your most passionate views on most other issues.

    BEST COMMENT OF THE YEAR!!! N.b., Secret Grille-Aiders.

  63. You don’t get it Dave w.

    The people at the top of intelligence agencies are of almost angelic character. They tell the american people everything we need to know. They would only use their power to help the american people and anyone who questions their motives or the theories the choose to share with us is insane.

  64. At least denis bider is kind enough to admit up front that he doesn’t have a firm grip on reality. The rest of you troofers should take notice.

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