Republican Debate Thread: The Suicide Watch in Simi Valley

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Some liveblogging here, although at this point the McCain-Romney-Huckabee-Paul contest is far less dramatic than the Clinton-Obama clash of the titans. A humble prediction: Ron Paul will get less than 25 percent of the questions.

The debate will run live on CNN from 8 until Romney buys the Reagan Library and kicks the other guys out.

I had to restart my PC to recover from a wireless meltdown, hence the brief delay…

8:02: Romney refuses to answer a straightforward question on whether people are better over than they were pre-Bush by bragging about what he did in Massachusetts.

8:04: Good, Cooper slices through Romney's bullshit. "Are you running for governor or are you running for president?"

8:06: Not that McCain sounds much better. He's a little lost on economics. "We have problems with the subprime mortgage housing… problem."

8:09: McCain lets his hatred for Romney flare, craning his neck over and bragging that he was endorsed by both Boston newspapers: "The people who knew you best." And "I bet that the Arizona Republic will endorse me." Extremely petty straight talk.

8:16: I think Romney's losing as long as he's defending his record in Massachusetts—he's trying to introduce himself to California, and he's doing it from a crouch—but he proves McCain is basically smearing him from a place of low information.

8:19: We're still talking about Romney in Massachusetts? This is reaching 1972 Olympics basketball finals levels of unfairness.

8:28: Cooper cuts Paul off for trying to answer a previous question: He'll get another chance! "I promise you. Coming up in, like, two minutes." Start your watches!

8:30: Huckabee's big ideas sound awfully stupid when they're pitched back to him. His super-awesome mega-highway 3000 will save America because people will use their tax rebates to shop more while getting 32 extra minutes to cuddle their kids. Then he dashes it all and admits it was a huge pander. "I said that when I was in Florida. Today, we might look at a Western highway!"

8:32: McCain on mortgages: "It's tough in California, it's tough in Arizona, it's tough [pause to think of more Feb. 5 states] all over." The solution: "There are some greedy people on Wall Street that perhaps need to be punished." Your conservative candidate, ladies and* gentlemen.

8:34: McCain talks as if the crisis is ongoing, but those punish-worthy companies have pretty much already taken their hits or collapsed or started facing investigations.

8:36: Maybe I'm being mind-controlled by Hugh Hewitt but I'm seeing signs of general election doom as McCain rambles about how he understands spending because "I was there with Jack Kemp." The response to Democrats who'll be calling either for 90s restoration or a 21st century New Frontier shouldn't be "remember the mid-1980s? Man, they were swell."

8:40: Huckabee's pander to NumbersUSA is complete: We'll build a fence within 18 months! While letting undocumented workers get their citizenship papers started and hold their heads up into the sunlight! Romney's looking at him like he's speaking in tongues.

8:43: Romney, back on one of his worst issues. "Illegal immigration? That's gotta end."

8:45: McCain says not to worry about his support for comprehensive immigration reform: "The American people have made it clear they want security first." They didn't "trust" the Senate, so it's okay to cave on the straight talk. Also: "I come from a border state where we know about building walls."

8:47: A weird moment as Anderson Cooper waves his hand over an original Reagan diary: "I'm a little worried about even touching it." If you open it, does a ray of light shoot out and imbue you with superpowers?

8:49: Do the candidates think Reagan was right to choose Sanda Day O'Connor? Huckabee whiffs: "I'm not that stupid!" Paul says "no," starts talking about the Constitution, is cut off with a sharp "Senator McCAIN?" McCain, looking exhausted, is sad that O'Connor's husband has Alzheimer's. Romney would have fired up the DeLorean and travelled to 2005 to bring Alito back to the past.

8:57: Future questions from Anderson Cooper: "Is Iraq better off than it was eight years ago? Is CNN's prime time lineup better off than it was eight years ago?"

8:59: Romney boldly defends Bush for battling "Washington" (which the president looks down at from a height of 3000 feet in a titanium-plated hover-fort) and "keeping us safe."

9:00: Has Ron Paul been asked that question about conservatism yet?

9:01: Romney bitches about McCain attacking his apocryphal statement about Iraqi timetables. This won't go well.

9:02: McCain picks up the ball and bashes Romney in the head with it. He wanted to surge, he blocked the timetable votes. "I was out there on the front lines." (Of Sunday show green rooms? Sometimes, they didn't even have peanut M&Ms!)

9:04: This is the most we've ever heard the word "weeds" in a presidential debate. I'm willing to be proven wrong, but I doubt I will be.

9:07: It's legitimate to ask why Romney's swerved around on his war positions, but Jesus, the last six minutes have been basically planted by the McCain campaign. This was a controversy they started. Watching the way this is being stacked you'd think Romney was ahead by 20 points, not about to get thumped by McCain in that many states.

9:09: More gratuitious Romney-bashing from McCain, making fun of Romney's attack ad budget. "It's your money, you can spend it all!"

9:10: McCain keeps lecturing about how Romney should have talked about timetables and withdrawal. "That was the Iraq Study Group. That was what the Democrats wanted to do. You should have said no."

9:11: What had Ron Paul been doing during the eternal Romney-McCain smackdown? Apparently, injecting steroids. "They're arguing technicalities of a policy they already agree with!" He's collected, pissed off, and there's no Rudy Giuliani to tell him to shut up.

9:13: I was at the McCain town hall where he gave the "100 years" quote and he's actually right: He's talking about keeping troops there after the war is over.

9:16: Huckabee begs (rather pathetically) for a question and gets one: What does he see in Putin's eyes. "I'm not good at looking into people's souls!" He's not good at talking about foreign policy without running at light speed to boilerplate crap about a "strong army."

9:18: Romney's answer sounds more like a Foreign Policy essay, with a digression urn them towards modernity!"

9:20: What makes McCain more qualified than Romney to fix the economy? "I led the largest squadron in the United States Navy." Really. I had to check the question to see if I had heard it wrong.

9:22; Romney's basically right on the economic question. If this primary's narrative wasn't "heroic man of iron versus flip-flopping loser" he'd be winning this round.

9:23: Romney sounds… less good on the military question. "One of my great regrets is not serving in the military. I would have loved to." What was stopping him? "It's not like checkers. It's more like three-dimensional chess." He'll play against Spock?

9:25: This is probably Paul's best debate performance: He actually gets Romney nodding when he says "the president isn't supposed to manage the economy."

9:27: That's enough jokes from Huckabee about how he wants more questions. He sounds like a whipped, whining puppy.

9:29: Good, Huckabee finally gets called on his odious line about looking like the guy you work with, "not the guy who laid you off." What's he mean? "I mean you have to care about how your decisions affect the guy at the bottom." No, you don't. You mean "Mitt Romney looks like a polo-playing douchebag." Just admit it.

9:32: "Would Ronald Reagan endorse you?" Mitt Romney says yes. McCain says he wouldn't endorse Mitt Romney. Ron Paul says, well, he endorsed Reagan, but he's not going to speak for Reagan now, although Reagan endorsed the gold standard. (This is a fact.)

*fixed

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  1. Prediction 2: RP will get a higher % of questions than he did votes in FL.

  2. Here we go. I predict that Mr. Reagan’s name will be invoked a few times.

  3. Watch for Mack and Huck to tag team Gov. Magic underpants while Mittens and Paul gang up on Hunerdyears McWar.

  4. This would be more fun if they each had a slingshot and a bowl of jellybeans.

  5. Oh Mitt, I love your scripted answer. Too bad it has nothing to do with the question.

  6. Yea! I get to follow the debate from work!

  7. mccain has no idea what his is taking about. “up and down” low unemployment, we’re better off….

    WTF

  8. Straight talk! drink!

  9. Please, Ron, avoid talking about the gold standard…

  10. This debate feels so empty without Rudy’s obnoxious laugh whenever Ron Paul answers a question.

  11. Paul has to attack!

  12. Prediction: Ron Paul will say something kind of embarrassing.

  13. Please, Ron, avoid talking about the gold standard…

    It would have been a better answer than the one he gave.

  14. This debate feels so empty without Rudy’s obnoxious laugh whenever Ron Paul answers a question.

    And don’t forget the Halloween mask-like facial expressions.

  15. The same Phill Gramm whom you were rebuked by the ethics committee back in the 80’s…

  16. Prediction: Ron Paul will say something kind of embarrassing.

    Hasn’t Bush said something(s) stupid? He still made it.

  17. Do they have to use their library voices?

  18. This might be Paul’s last debate. I hope he makes the best of it.

  19. Romney actually sounds like a normal guy tonight

  20. Where I work we don’t. I work in a very odd library. It is a medical library.

  21. shuckabee, lying about his tax cuts again…

  22. I wish the desk front went all the way down. I don’t need to see their weird legs.

  23. Romney actually sounds like a normal guy tonight

    Yes, “sounds”.

  24. I can’t believe I’m saying this, but I agree with Rush Limbaugh.

  25. Mike Huckabee doesn’t even know how to spell Conservatism.

  26. haha, huckabee- proud to have brought Ark out of the doldrums of bubble jet printed forms

  27. John McCain would do well to put effort into sitting up straight and not look like his back is humping… or maybe he is…

  28. fee, tax, its all the same thing…..the gov taking your money

  29. Health care is fundamentally broken. Lets talk about fixing it before we talk about universal health insurance.

  30. I forgot Arnold was still a Republican.

  31. What’s the over/under on the number of questions Paul get asked?

  32. Someone give Ron Paul a sudoku puzzle. He looks bored.

  33. What’s the over/under on the number of questions Paul get asked?

    7

  34. Too bad Huckabee’s a Baptist preacher; maybe he and Paul could play a little blackjack or something down there.

  35. I forgot Arnold was still a Republican.

    So did he

  36. I don’t know why, but I have zero faith in these guys to make us energy independent. I doubt they’ll even try.

  37. javier, it needs to be either 6.5 or 7.5 to break ties.

  38. oh fuck, Huckabee actually had a good answer

  39. I don’t have cable, and can’t get the damned CNN liveplayer to play on any computer in my house through any browser. Any suggestions?

  40. Whoa! Tough titties, RP, if you want to talk.

  41. And Paul speaks…

  42. Wow. This is horrible. Let him speak for the love of god.

  43. And Paul gets shut down.

  44. Fuck Anderson Cooper. What a bitch.

  45. “Are you running for governor or are you running for president?”

    I did not hear the context of this coment (I am reading the liveblog sans TV) but serving as governor is better experience for being POTUS than, say, US Senator. I think there is a reason that most POTUS in modern history have either been a governor or a VP at some point before becoming POTUS.

  46. adamness, we will be energy ind the day the last drop of oil is sucked out of the desert wasteland

  47. @Tom Walls: Don’t know what to tell you. Works in Internet Explorer for me (and only IE).

  48. Good thing they don’t have any time limits for tonight’s debate, except when Paul is talking.

  49. I don’t have cable, and can’t get the damned CNN liveplayer to play on any computer in my house through any browser. Any suggestions?

    Cspan has the audio. Just go to cspan.org and it’s on the front page.

  50. CNN to Ron Paul: Shut up.

  51. anderson just dissed ron.

  52. Everyone is a federalist now.

  53. What’s with this obsession over energy independence? The federal government today could outlaw the purchase of foreign sources of energy and, viola, America would be energy independent! Of course, the market would adjust by dramatically increasing energy prices.

    If the federal government wants to lower energy prices it should eliminate the regulations and subsidies that limit supply. Moreover, perhaps a more sane foreign policy would reduce price volatility.

  54. I understand what Paul was trying to say there in regards to “property rights,” but he didn’t explain it enough — people are going to get the wrong impression.

  55. huckabee invokes falling bridges….a mirror of his campaign?

  56. Romney just bragged about the Big Dig creating jobs. Wow

  57. Last time I checked, the bridge in MN fell because it was ill designed.

  58. And Paul speaks…

  59. enough with the monetary system. The average voter doesn’t care.

  60. I thought Paul’s answer was good Reinmoose.

  61. ignoring RP again…

  62. this is appalling. RP needs to toughen up and just keep talking.

  63. applause for Ron!

  64. KB, the bridge fell due to accumulation of bird shit..

  65. I thought his answer was good, for Ron Paul.

  66. should i keep watching the debate or switch over to Lost in a half hour? I think Lost.

  67. I’m not hearing anything new from Paul, but I guess he’s not trying to convert me. I’m wondering if joe voter finds his talking points interesting.

  68. CIA agent Anderson hates Ron Paul who wants to get rid of the CIA.

    Surprise surprise…

  69. Well, at least the Ghoul isn’t there to be heard giggling every time the Doc speaks.

  70. @javier: Isn’t Lost a clip show?

  71. JL, And so do we, the msm apparatus is NOT going to be fair to RP. It’s time to take the gloves off.

  72. Ron needs to start talking like he’s talking to children.

  73. LoL McCain just invoked Ron Paul’s hatred of Spending.

  74. So McCain gets to go off-topic but Ron gets shut down? That’s bull, man.

  75. woah woah woah McCain… part of the recession is psychological?

  76. ::enough with the monetary system. The average voter doesn’t care.::

    I think he’s just trying to lay the foundation for a future politician to make changes to it. He’s trying to jam that message down the throats of anyone who is in earshot.

  77. I didn’t say I didn’t think it was good. I just said I didn’t think he needed to drive home the monetary system point for every issue. The average American just isn’t informed enough to know that it makes any difference, nor would they care.

  78. Voters would care about the monetary system if they knew it was why some things cost more every year rather than getting cheaper.

  79. JL, you’re exactly right. Ron Paul needs to treat this like he’s trying to cajole a particularly stupid high schooler.

  80. What’s the over/under on the number of questions Paul get asked?

    7

    I’ll take the “under”.

  81. I get more infuriated every time I watch these debates. I have tended to disapprove of many of Ron Paul’s supporters for their flamboyant behavior, but I am starting to feel more and more sympathy for them. THIS ID FRIGHTENING.

  82. The Bush revolution? Yikes.

  83. I disagree. I think part of Ron Paul’s appeal is that he doesn’t talk down to people and doesn’t pander…usually.

    I’m sure there are a good number of people who had no idea what RP was talking about at some point or another, and went and did their own research on it. That’s a good thing.

  84. Romney wants to cut entitlements and double the military.

  85. I’m horribly disappointed by Paul’s responses so far. His voice is high, he talks too fast, and he jumps to Iraq (and the fuckin’ monetary system) when he should be pointing out that he’s the only guy on stage who is actually a fiscal conservative.

  86. Huckabee wants to lower federal spending yet just endorsed a $60 billion fence. Nice.

  87. A secure border fence? There’s no such thing. Ask Berlin.

  88. Whether you agree with a fence or not, does anyone actually think any of these 4 guys will get a 1800 mile border fence built? There’s no way that’s going to happen.

  89. But when Ron doesn’t talk down he is immediately labeled as a loon by the uneducated voter that will vote for Mitt Romney because of his hair.

  90. Thanks, fellas. The CSPAN site is running something on waterboarding at the moment but it says they’ll have it up at 10 PM ET.

  91. What would the effects on the economy be of deporting all the immigrants? Anyone?

  92. I tell ya, Mitt’s plan for dealing with illegal immigrants is foolproof. He is going to tell illegal immigrants who are already here to go home and… problem solved!

  93. i feel sorry for ron.

  94. flip flop flip flop

  95. ::I didn’t say I didn’t think it was good. I just said I didn’t think he needed to drive home the monetary system point for every issue. The average American just isn’t informed enough to know that it makes any difference, nor would they care.::

    They need to be informed, and they should care. They have to care. It dictates almost everything aspect of our country.

    Paul isn’t running to win. He’s running to plant the seed of change in an entire generation.

  96. Ron Paul should stand up and walk out. This is a Soviet-style “debate.”
    Fuck these assholes.

  97. Travis, stop saying mean things about Kathryn Jean Lopez!

  98. ::Whether you agree with a fence or not, does anyone actually think any of these 4 guys will get a 1800 mile border fence built? There’s no way that’s going to happen.::

    Yes, because government projects are good for the economy… according to 3/4 of the conservatives on stage, anyway.

  99. I went to cnn radio and it started playin’.

    cnn.com/audio/radio/winmedia.html

  100. ::I’m horribly disappointed by Paul’s responses so far. His voice is high, he talks too fast, and he jumps to Iraq (and the fuckin’ monetary system) when he should be pointing out that he’s the only guy on stage who is actually a fiscal conservative.::

    I really wish he would rip every other candidate on stage. I don’t understand why he isn’t.

  101. TAmper proof documents monitoring all businesses….the fiscally conservative choice!

  102. What would the effects on the economy be of deporting all the immigrants? Anyone?

    What would the effects on the economy be of deporting all the immigrants? Anyone?

    1) Tell illegals to go home.
    2) ????
    3) Profit!

  103. ::
    I’m sure there are a good number of people who had no idea what RP was talking about at some point or another, and went and did their own research on it. That’s a good thing.::

    *raises hand*

  104. Such as lethal area denial systems.

  105. RP need to do the Ron Paul Point more….where he points to the moderators letting them know he has something to say. i love it.

  106. Oooo, nice crane shot.

  107. i Hate huckabee. “i won’t answer that question cuz in reality I have nothing to do with reagan.”

  108. Sure, we’ll secure the borders. Thanks, Sarge. Heckuva job so far, bub.

    I don’t know that Dr. Paul’s stance on immigration would work better as policy, but it would be amusing if he was to have a Larry, Darryl and Darryl moment (anyone remember the last episode of Newhart?)… Just stand up as the others continue their pandering and yell

    “SHUT UP!!!!!!!!!”

    Oh well… he’s polite. To a fault, possibly.

  109. yes, history will, and she retired a few yrs ago now, so answer the question dickhead

  110. oh bull.shit

  111. I like that Ron Paul encourages people to look things up and think for themselves and whatnot, but this isn’t an after school special. It’s a debate, and he needs to win it.

  112. whoa ron, calm down, dont talk to much!

  113. Holy cow. Did that really just happen?

  114. 8:47: A weird moment as Anderson Cooper waves his hand over an original Reagan diary: “I’m a little worried about even touching it.” If you open it, does a ray of light shoot out and imbue you with superpowers?

    think the climax of radiers of the lost ark.

  115. I would have thrown something at cooper and walked out by now if I was Ron

  116. ron’s gonna second guess the gipper, apparently. lol

  117. Yes, Charles. I think it did

  118. LIAR he executed more ppl than any other ark gov.
    FUCK YU ANDERSON!

  119. It’s kind of hard to win when you can’t get more than a “Yes” or “No” in.

  120. “What would the effects on the economy be of deporting all the immigrants? Anyone?”

    It would cost money to deport them and cost even more money to pay people to do the jobs they once did. Bad all around. The xenophobes don’t care about that though. They would rather live in a third world country than have to take the time to press 1 for English.

  121. So Ron gets a total of 9 seconds on that question.

    Anderson promised Ron Paul that he’d get to talk about conservatism vs. liberalism, and he has to give Ron his moment. Bastard.

  122. I think it’s time for RP to stand up, give everyone a few choice words (something the FCC might have to worry about tomorrow morning), and leave.

  123. “Hi. We’re McCain and Romney, and we’re here to repeat what Ron Paul just said.”

  124. I hope he’s giving them a firm talking to during the break. threaten to sick his revolutionaries on them.

  125. I predict Anderson will be getting some emails tonight . . .

  126. So Mitt approved of the Justice appointment, but would have appointed someone else.

    Yeah, makes sense.

  127. Anderson promised Ron Paul that he’d get to talk about conservatism vs. liberalism, and he has to give Ron his moment. Bastard.

    But brother Anony, it was coming up in “like, 2 minutes”

  128. Did you see the look on RP’s face when cooper jumped to McCain? First time i’ve seen him obviously annoyed about something like that.

    It was only a brief half-second

  129. 8:32: McCain on mortgages: “It’s tough in California, it’s tough in Arizona, it’s tough [pause to think of more Feb. 5 states] all over.” The solution: “There are some greedy people on Wall Street that perhaps need to be punished.” Your conservative candidate, ladies in gentlemen.

    Well, conservative or not, I’m sure McCain will be the “mainstream libertarian” in the race as soon as Romney drops out.

  130. Wow, CNN will be having “40 straight hours” of coverage (Read- repetitive speculation) for Super Tuesday. Sounds like a party!

  131. 8:47: A weird moment as Anderson Cooper waves his hand over an original Reagan diary: “I’m a little worried about even touching it.” If you open it, does a ray of light shoot out and imbue you with superpowers?

    Think Raiders of the Lost Ark

  132. Chris,

    see my post above…

  133. But brother Anony, it was coming up in “like, 2 minutes”

    Yeah, it’s just that Anderson Cooper travels at the speed of light, so 2 minutes to him is like 2 days for the rest of us.*

    *Time comparison approximate because I suck at physics.

  134. “There are some greedy people on Wall Street that perhaps need to be punished.”

    Uh…. there are, and they do.

    “Go to bed with no rate cut”.

  135. I’d tell RP to throw his chair at that goddam ?roplane if I thought he could hit it.

  136. Did you guys see the Ron Paul ad? I am in his district right now visiting for some business and this ad just came up. Very well done I think.

  137. CNN is a CIA front.

  138. if ronald reagan were as great as people in that room think he is i’d still be annoying with the sainthood he’s been annointed.

  139. any of you watching the real time responder while this is going on?
    AWESOME!

  140. On the online stream, they featured one user comment during the break:

    to paraphrase, “Why the hell aren’t you letting RP speak?”

  141. From Weigel’s liveblogging:

    Your conservative candidate, ladies in gentlemen.

    So now they’re aiming for the strap-on vote?

  142. last question for RP: “do you think 9/11 was an inside job?”

  143. I still don’t understand how some of the more unruly Paul supporters, as they are accused of being, haven’t done anything to Anderson Cooper yet. They took over his one show but that wasn’t anything bad, I was expecting a Hannity like greeting. He keeps being an asshole in the debates to Ron and I wish he would just tell him off or have a “I paid for this microphone” moment.

  144. Watching online… during the break, a viewer asked why Ron Paul wasn’t given more time to answer questions, and the lady at the desk, in response, showed some viewer pulse line that was going down when Huckabee mentioned Limbaugh.

    Quite relevant, I suppose…in Bizarro-World.

    Wow. You can’t make this shit up.

  145. ok, they can’t say anything critical about dubya or oviously reagan. what republican can they be critical? nixon? yeah screw nixon.

  146. one million dead iraqis might disagree

  147. momo,

    they might…but they’re dead….

  148. At least we don’t have to watch Giuliani bugging his eyes and sticking his teeth out:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yzt6ZJYss-0

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=AImDKbkjhuA

  149. this is not a debate… it’s a McCain-Romney lovefest.

  150. Romney won’t pull out! Cue Kathyrn Jean Lopez joke.

  151. Anderson Cooper – Would you hit that?

    (I would, right in his Anderson POOPER!)

  152. I didn’t realize that Hezbollah had a large presence in Iraq.

  153. “nixon? yeah screw nixon.”

    To a lot of conservatives the worst thing he did was betray Taiwan (R.O.C.). I agree that was a horrible act.

  154. Lost, yes, but how many relatives of the dead are now sworn enemies now?

  155. Yeah, the CNN wavy red line is fascinating! But it’s in the positive zone while Romney talks, so I’m very confused.

  156. Under the McCain presidency, April will now be a year.

  157. yes, that magical interesting YEAR of APRIL

  158. haha, even Romney doesn’t know what Romney means.

  159. Romney finally acts like he has a pair — will it be too late for his candidacy?

  160. Oh goodie…now the puppets are going to fight!

  161. Fight . . . fight!

  162. oh McCain you miserable geriatric

  163. I think Ron Paul needs a comic strip-like thought bubble above his head that displays his internal monologue.

  164. McCain sounds like a rambling old cook.

  165. Wow…McCain just mentioned FactCheck.org. Without the dot org. I wonder if he likes them calling out his lies, misleading statements, etc…

  166. Please let the conservative crowd have an epiphany regarding this god-awful war.

  167. “what republican can they be critical?”

    I believe that Chester Arthur was said to be a late riser and quite flamboyant.

  168. Anonymoose… they couldn’t show that on broadcast TV. Not that it wouldn’t be more enlightening for 1 minute than what we’ve seen so far. 🙂

  169. the red line drop low when they is scrappin

  170. This entire debate is ridiculous, insulting, and worst of all, boring.

  171. “the enemy”, read the rightful owners of the land.

  172. i can’t wait until we all give up on this election and just start focusing on snark.

  173. ohh…getting ugly. maybe ron should sit between them to keep the peace.

  174. I’m amazed Paul and Huckabee are still awake.

  175. wow.

    I can’t believe one of these jackasses will hold at least 49 percent of the presidential vote.

  176. boy, huckabee isn’t getting much speaking time either but ron might as well not be there by now.

  177. ohh…getting ugly. maybe ron should sit between them to keep the peace.

    Ron doesn’t believe in intervention.

  178. L_I_T –
    done

  179. Ron should just bring a big dry erase board and write his answers o nit to show everyone.

  180. im just gonna go over to wonkette and see if they’re making this shitfest entertaining

  181. Are Huckabee and Paul still there?

  182. obama and hillary aren’t much better.

  183. new york times endorsement=you’re mom’s a whore-esque insult.

  184. Three Pinocchios, that’s got to be a first for a debate.

  185. Holy !#$%! A question to RP?

  186. And Paul gets a question.

  187. why would they ask paul a question anyone the least bit informed already knows?

  188. “new york times endorsement=you’re mom’s a whore-esque insult.”

    Unless you are a conservative talk show host who got his book on the New York Times bestseller list. Then its OK.

  189. “Whether you agree with a fence or not, does anyone actually think any of these 4 guys will get a 1800 mile border fence built? There’s no way that’s going to happen.”

    Anyone who thinks that there isn’t a barrier on the Mexican border have never lived in South Texas, New Mexico, Arizona or So Cal. There is a 12 mile area north of the border similar to the 1 k zone in the old FRG without nukes and the military flavor. It is patrolled by ICE and has border control checkpoints on the roads.

    I’m not saying that it is excessively hard to go north from the border, but there is a significant presence there. Additionally, distance often serves as a barrier.

  190. Paul is behaving bad… he just called the others silly!! Excellent.

    I love you Ron Paul. I love you man. Loooove!

  191. Dear God…they’re letting him speak. The crowd cheers…anyone know what that red line is doing?

  192. Iraq is definitely RP’s strong point.

  193. That was pretty good.

  194. Kudos to RP for pointing out the sheer fatuity of this “debate” so far.

  195. holy lord. Ron Paul owned. maybe thats why they don’t let him speak.

  196. He had a little Morton Downey Jr Show in him in that one.

  197. Anderson Cooper is a monster.

  198. you tell em huck!!! wait i don’t want to listen to you either….

  199. One of Paul’s best moments of the campaign.

  200. CNN’s real-time do-whacky doesn’t like “guns and butter”.

    Went down when he mention, “How many people will you let die?”

  201. Well stated Ron Paul. These idiots need to stop fighting, they are making themselves look bad.
    But at least that makes Mccain look bad

  202. GO RON!!!

  203. That was freakin’ awesome!

  204. Sure go ahead Senator. Cooper’s a prick.

  205. McCain and Cooper sucked each other off before the debates

  206. No McCain, its both presence and casualties you idiot. What do you think policing the world means? And Ron Paul said Rumsfeld was wrong too so quit saying that.

  207. Zig-zag man, I have been told that there are places in US where, if you live there, you have to cross a border checkpoint, to go anywhere north. Is that true?

  208. CNN’s real-time do-whacky doesn’t like “guns and butter”.

    I’m partial to machetes and margarine myself.

  209. McNasty is bringing it tonight.

  210. finally! RP puts his foot down.

  211. Well, to be fair I missed the first hour of this groundbreaking event. But I’m sure it wasn’t half as bad as what I’ve been observing so far.

  212. “we’re gonna shower you with questions now gov. huckabee”

    “paul-we’re gonna give you the shaft the rest of the evening but you know that already..”

  213. Mr. Paul, you may be excused now.

  214. A better question would be “What do you see when you look in the eyes of Mitt Romney?”

    I dare not answer out of fear.

  215. Did Romney just make a little sense?

  216. Did i just see the mom from The Wonder Years?

  217. Here we go again with the Cold War rhetoric. We don’t have enough enemies, let’s make some more.

  218. I love Romney’s incredibly naive understanding of geopolitics.

  219. Did Romney just list Al Qaeda as a major power in the league of Russia and China? Perspective, please!

  220. “I wanna start with Senator McCain”

    WOW! That’s a total turn of events!

  221. What does he see in Putin’s eyes. “I’m not good at looking into people’s souls!”

    He must have been a shitty pastor then. Not that I didn’t believe that already.

  222. McCain’s awkward pauses mid-sentence are really weird.

  223. I wish, when McCain talks about radical Islam as the transcendent issue for the 21st century, or whatever that means, that someone would ask him what it is about rock-throwing barbarians that scares him so much.

  224. CNN’s real-time do-whacky just does not like McCain.

  225. “was romney a pow? nooooo…!!! gimmeee the nomination, now NOW. grrrrrr…”

  226. A proven leader….at blowing shit up. Then crash landing and being tortured

  227. I’m a footsoldier in the “I want to make sweet sexy in Anderson Cooper’s hot tight man-hole” Revolution.

  228. Was McCain ever diagnosed/evaluated after his 8 years in prison camps?

  229. governors are so much cooler than congresspeople

  230. McCain mentioned Reagan, which means it’s time to drink.

  231. Romney’s doing well tonight, I think

  232. I think the CNN real time do-whacky is connected to Romney’s butt-cheeks, from reports so far.

  233. What’s all this talk about litres? Are these bastards taking us metric?

  234. yes mitt, but that means they have to cooperate

  235. Ron should say he was one of the first SDI proponents and that they named one of the particle-beam satellites after him.

  236. Did Romney just steel Paul’s opportunity to respond?

  237. He was just about to ask Paul a question. Thanks, Mitt.

  238. mccain looks like he has gas

  239. can they please give mitt some face time? please? he has so much to say.

  240. I think Paul and Huckabee just shared a short WTF conversation…

  241. JESUS MITT, SHUT THE HECK UP

  242. “What’s all this talk about litres? Are these bastards taking us metric?”

    One of the few good ideas Carter had. I wish he had suceeded at that.

  243. ok now i’m curious – what the hell was the other regret?

  244. Oh no! He mentioned Lincoln in front of Ron Paul!

  245. 3d chess is tough

  246. mccain is definitely growing a tail right now.

  247. i just saw paul and huckabee smile at each other and say something. must be something about what a douche anderson is being to them.

  248. Mitt paid for that stage!

    Or was just everything else?

  249. Wow, Huck and Paul are throwing their arms up at the bias.

  250. I feel really bad for Mike Huckabee actually. Huckabee is arguably a more competitive candidate than Mitt, yet I’ve hardly heard his voice.

  251. I watched until I was ready to jump out a window. During that time it appeared to be a debate between McCain & Romney. Well, actually, it appeared to be an odd sort of conversation between those two. I don’t think the camera ever left the two of them.

  252. I really don’t like the taste of McCain’s “businessmen are inherently not as good citizens as gook-killers like me” rhetoric.

  253. Once again, McCain speaks, and the real-time do-whacky drops 10 to 20 points.

  254. you were a military doctor. Say you were a military doctor!

  255. also, reach over and knock out John McCain

  256. Librarian,

    If you were a REAL libertarian, you would support letting the market decide whether or not we go metric. Which, as I check to make sure I’ve had enough grams of protein before I fill my 2 liter bottle of water for tomorrow’s 5 K race, I must say it has.

  257. Good response from Paul.

  258. Wow… McCain and Romney smiling in unison. The Doc is telling the gospel, and he’s managed to bring two douches together in the harmony of silently mocking him.

  259. Another good answer.

  260. Ron’s good when he’s pissed.

  261. Ron Paul’s response started out good. The real-time do-whacky likes him a little.

    When he starts talking about the Fed, though, and the war, and foreign policy, it goes down. (Yes, I’m addicted to the do-whacky.)

  262. the red line is all over he place when RP talks

  263. Wow, Paul could have really hit a home run there. Unfortunately, he barely made it to first base with that answer.

  264. ::Wow… McCain and Romney smiling in unison. The Doc is telling the gospel, and he’s managed to bring two douches together in the harmony of silently mocking him.::

    They’re mocking him for preaching the same gospel the Reagan espoused. Does anyone else see the irony there?

  265. The red line actually bumps up a bit for Ron while he talks about deregulation.

    Mostly it’s a whore for Mitt, though (audience demographics, I’ve decided)

    McCain is making a big mistake – he should be acting like a frontrunner, but he can’t resist attacking ROM gratuitously.

  266. How many questions so far?

  267. I don’t like him, but Huckabee’s done a lot better with his 10% of camera time than Ron Paul has with his 10%.

  268. Ron makes his points again and I think the audience is absorbing the possibilities he has presented.

  269. Romney’s butt cheeks don’t know what to make of Ron Paul..hence the confusion of the do-whacky. That, or it foibles when he internally laughs in his blissful ignorance of economics.

    This proves it. The whole red line is connected to Mitt’s backside.

  270. RP needs to stop bringing up Bush.

  271. Chris Potter, I am a real libertarian but I also recognize that (either way) the government sets the standards of weights and measures. Either way it does. If you want to talk about some future Rothbardian utopia sure. But in that case I think metric would win out anyway. It just makes sense.

  272. I don’t like him, but Huckabee’s done a lot better with his 10% of camera time than Ron Paul has with his 10%.

    Huckabee loves the camera, even though it adds 10 pounds.

  273. Weigel, I hope they’re giving you a fat bonus for having to blog though this.

    My buddy Ben Boychuk is blogging through it over at redblueamerica.com. Course he may have slit his wrists by now.

  274. Romney’s used the 3 dimensional chess reference in at least previous two debates already.

  275. RP needs to stop bringing up Bush.

    seriously!

  276. I believe the camera acutally made Huckabee lose approx. 100 lbs.

  277. REAGAN TIME!!! TIME TO GET KRUNKED!!!1!!!

  278. STOP SAYING RONALD REAGAN

  279. Mitt Romney is so fucking arrogant!

    Would Ronald Reagan endorse you?

    Absolutely. Absolutely.

    What an asshole!

  280. RP needs to stop bringing up Bush.

    Yeah, in the context of not policing the world?!?!

  281. Yes, and Ronald Raegan probably also said that dogs can fly and birds can bark. I heard him say it. I was there with him.

  282. Ok i get it, CNN wants mormon gold.

  283. McCain’s turning red, he’s gonna go into asshole mode now.

  284. My favorite question, what would Ronald Reagan do/say/bless/eat?

    I find it ironic that Ronald Reagan actually endorsed amnesty in the 1980’s while these clowns are fighting for who will kick out the most illegal immigrants fastest.

  285. A noun, a verb and…Ronald Reagan?

  286. Reagan DID endorse Paul back then and vice versa.

  287. good think i still at work or i’d need to go to the er after that last round of ‘ronald reagan’ mantra

  288. Man I’m glad I didn’t buy into the RR drinking game.

  289. Huckabee is winning, Paul is running a strong second.

    McNasty and the Rombot are just making everybody hate them.

    Huckabee’s little riff on being a governor was good. It was a real shot to McCain. It plays into the “McCain doesn’t know economic policy” thing – he’s a one-dimensional leader.

  290. GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLLLLLDDDDDD!!!!

  291. NO! NO MORE MONETARY POLICY! But the real-time do-whacky seems to like it.

  292. Oh fuck..he’s mentioning the gold standard. He’s right… but everyone will mock him. I know, change of pace, right?

  293. “gold standard” – NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

  294. FUCK ME STOP TALKING ABOUT THE GOLD STANDARD

  295. Good for Ron for avoiding fellating the dead Reagan once again.

    Enough with this necrophilia!

  296. I love the huckabee “and I’m going to tell you why” line. He uses it so often. It’s nice of him to warn us that an explanation is forthcoming.

  297. that was a good answer from RP though…did the do-hicky line go up a lot?

  298. Huck is using the same answer that Obama used for the MLK endorsement question. Good thinking by him

  299. wow did huckabee really use that “”but i endorse him” paraphrase? i wouldn’t have had the balls

  300. You gold haters here are provincial pussies.

  301. Well, if you cosmos would listen, he wouldn’t have to talk about gold.

  302. It was a good place to put the gold standard, better than trashing Reagan, he spoke the truth on the judge question, go to your safety blanket.

  303. Petraeus to Petraeus’ level three.

  304. And Anderson never gave Ron Paul his question. Bastard. 2 minutes my ass.

  305. I don’t hate the gold standard, it’s just that NO ONE FUCKING CARES ABOUT IT. when you have 30 seconds to speak, it shouldn’t be about specie.

  306. ::NO! NO MORE MONETARY POLICY! But the real-time do-whacky seems to like it.::

    It liked it because Reagan liked it.

    speaking of the gold standard, I’ve spoken to some old folk FDR-lovin’, Reagan-hatin’ democrats who HATE that our nation is off the gold standard.

  307. They cut Huck and Paul off at every chance they had. This was a sad dabate of Romney and Mccain fighting like little boys.

  308. Librarian,

    The Bureau just sets the standard for what the various measurements mean — that is, how much a pound weighs, how long a foot is, etc. Indeed, they also keep a standard meter and kilogram at the Bureau.

    But it is not the govt’s place to force private individuals and organizations to use a certain system of units…especially now that conversion between a bewildering assortment of units is extremely easy with ubiquitous computers.

  309. i didn’t think he was using the obama/mlk thing so much as the reagan “you can’t endorse me but i endorse you” thing.

  310. when you have 30 seconds to speak, it shouldn’t be about specie

    Or the freaking President’s Council on Markets.

    He should stop doing that.

  311. I hope the Republicans have a brokered convention. That would be fun!
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brokered_convention

  312. Ron Paul should hit monetary policy even harder than he does. Given the way the Fed has been in the news over the past month, it’s something voters can finally relate to.

  313. huck did use the same ‘i think it would be arrogant to say whom mlk/reagan would endorse’ which IIRC is exactly how Obama started his. And the substance of the rest of obama’s answer would have been well sumarized with “but I endorse him”

  314. “when you have 30 seconds to speak, it shouldn’t be about specie.”

    Yes, much better to be a fucking moron like the other fucking empty-headed moron candidates. Don’t dare be different and actually talk about substance.

    He aint fucking going to win, so he may as well get his points across with the strength of a 12 gauge shotgun.

    Get it?

  315. Yeah, Obama’s answer was much more impressive. “I think he would tell everybody to hold us accountable.” Very nice. I like that he considers that the appropriate role for the public vs. the government.

  316. It’s not out of hatred for gold…it’s just that morons across the country get frightened by new (err… OLD) ideas, and if the Doc is going to convert the average, simple folk of this land, he won’t have any luck doing so with, while financially sound, SCARY ideas like the gold standard.

    Sure, it makes great sense, but people in this country voted for Bush twice. They need the Sesame Street version of economics. “R…P…RON PAUL!”

    That might work. Ernie for VP?

  317. I can’t believe McCain actually tried to say we’re better off than we were in the year 2000.

  318. Paul is running a strong second.

    Not a chance. RPs biggest problem in these debates is that he can’t give a focused confident answer. He sounds like a whiny kid.

  319. Mr. Artist as a young man,
    Yes, I get it. I have a vested interest in wanting him to win, and I wish he would do the things that could make it possible rather than stabbing his chances in the kidneys every debate.

  320. Randolph, Paul just touched on the gold thing for a second. If RR said it, it is game. I thought that his response was reasonable. He should have quoted RR’s quote that RP plays in his ads.

  321. “Ron Paul should hit monetary policy even harder than he does. Given the way the Fed has been in the news over the past month, it’s something voters can finally relate to.”

    Finally an intelligent poster at Reason.

  322. Paul ahd his supporters have some iffy issues, but I personally don’t see anything kookie about the gold standard. We had one as recently as 1971. Even Alan Greenspan and Jack Kemp were in favor of it (at least, until recently.)

  323. Really what was he going to say about Reagan, that he talked a good game? He liked Reagan early on but he doesn’t have the man crush like the other jackasses. It was a good anecdote since he had really nothing else to say.

  324. Debate’s over – Anderson Cooper can eat a dick! Goodnight, everybody!

  325. Dedalus,
    Also, there are plenty of other substantive issues he could talk about that could get a better reaction from a conservative republican audience.

  326. “and if the Doc is going to convert the average, simple folk of this land, he won’t have any luck doing so with, while financially sound, SCARY ideas like the gold standard.”

    OK, so to convert people to your positions you…shouldn’t talk about your positions?

    Do I get you?

  327. I spend far more time in libertopia than the typical viewer of a Republican debate, and I barely understand what Paul’s comments on central banking have to do with my life.

    If he insists on talking about them, he needs to explain to people what he’s on about. He needs to take something they understand, like foreclosures or the housing bubble, and talk about his currency ideas by talking about that.

  328. These debates and the Republican Party are a perfect reflection of the conservative intellectual movement: They are ALL losers.

    Just read what they’re writing over at the NRs The Corner. Politics is a waste of time if the intellectual culture has become corrupted, which it has.

    Listening to these losers makes me want to move to a cabin on the south island of New Zealand.

  329. I agree that Ron Paul should avoid monetary policy. If he wants to talk economics, stick with the price of the war/cost of taxes, spending, regulation etc. It’s not a question of it being important, but where he’s trying to talk about. Monetary policy doesn’t work in this format.

  330. “stabbing his chances in the kidneys ”

    Now there’s a good idea! He should have performed fucking surgery on Anderson’s kidney and sold it on the black market. At least something good would have come of this Soviet charade.

  331. Dedalus,
    I concur. Any elective, non-consensual surgery on Anderson Cooper is all good to me.

  332. Yeah, Obama’s answer was much more impressive. “I think he would tell everybody to hold us accountable.” Very nice. I like that he considers that the appropriate role for the public vs. the government.

    Well, you’re kind of comparing apples and oranges there. A statement like that fits perfectly with a man who was outside the corridors of power looking in. It wouldn’t fit with a guy who was President for 8 years.

  333. “I spend far more time in libertopia than the typical viewer of a Republican debate, and I barely understand what Paul’s comments on central banking have to do with my life.”

    But…you are retarded.

  334. Dedalus, I’m merely saying that he simplify his ideas when explaining them. I wish we lived in a world where everybody would just hear “money WITH SOMETHING TO BACK IT” and understand that this is a good thing. Sadly, many intelligent folks I know still become frightened or openly mock (like Romney and crew) the gold standard.

    I want Paul to win… but he’s a smart fellow and not as slick as the other dinks. In today’s society, slickness and simplicity outrank actual good ideas… or so I’ve seen. I wish I were wrong.

    Hopefully on the 5th, I’ll be proven such.

  335. I can’t wait for Anderson’s post-debate ANALysis, if you know what I mean!

  336. I left for a few minutes to come back and find that Paul is now a woman!

  337. “I concur. Any elective, non-consensual surgery on Anderson Cooper is all good to me.”

    Also, alternatively, surgical removal of Cooper’s tiny testes and insertion in his fucking nostrils. Talk about reality television. He could even have appealed for assistance from the studio audience.

  338. Schwarzenegger to endorse McCain, according to the Atlantic.

    No big surprise there.

  339. I think McCain’s inherent dickishness hurt him in this debate. Number one should act like number two doesn’t exist; compare McDonald’s commercials with Burger King’s. Starting fights with Romney makes me think McCain forgot he’s ahead or, more likely, he can’t help himself because he’s a bad person.

    Additionally, Bill Bennett looks like mid level Soviet bureaucrat: drunk, red, fat.

  340. ::I spend far more time in libertopia than the typical viewer of a Republican debate, and I barely understand what Paul’s comments on central banking have to do with my life.::

    Are you kidding?

    ::If he insists on talking about them, he needs to explain to people what he’s on about. He needs to take something they understand, like foreclosures or the housing bubble, and talk about his currency ideas by talking about that.::

    I do actually agree with this.

  341. Paul ahd his supporters have some iffy issues, but I personally don’t see anything kookie about the gold standard. We had one as recently as 1971. Even Alan Greenspan and Jack Kemp were in favor of it (at least, until recently.)

    But Ron doesn’t even want a gold standard. He wants to introduce competitive currency (lets see someone explain that to the average voter).

  342. Ron Paul won hands down.

  343. You have to give it to Huckabee, the guy has a silver tongue. He’s clearly the best speaker and quickest thinker there (quick don’t mean deep). I thought McCain was McTerrible.

    Paul’s riffs on the gold standard made him sound like a crazy old kook in most of the public’s eye I imagine.

  344. I spend far more time in libertopia than the typical viewer of a Republican debate, and I barely understand what Paul’s comments on central banking have to do with my life.

    I’ll try to understand your obsession with sprawl if you try to understand our obsession with the Fed.

  345. and if the Doc is going to convert the average, simple folk of this land, he won’t have any luck doing so with, while financially sound, SCARY ideas like the gold standard.

    I hate to say it, but if I’d stumbled onto this debate without knowing anything about the candidates and their positions, the Doc wouldn’t have convinced me of much.

    Sadly, of all the candidates, he’s got the least clue as to how to make his positions sound engaging and interesting.

    Still love ya, Doc – but you sound like a broken record….

  346. The Paultards should put on McCain and Romney tshirts and heckle Ron Paul from the stands if they want him to win debates. Pissed off RP gives way better answers than polite RP.

  347. Well, Paul has Ah-lo on his side and McLame has Ah-nold now.

  348. “Additionally, Bill Bennett looks like mid level Soviet bureaucrat: drunk, red, fat.” Holy shit that is funny and dead on…

  349. Anyone ever see that space ghost episode “art show”? I saw it the other day and it was kind of surreal – this woman talks for like 3 minutes about how after Nixon took the country off the gold standard, money became abstract, so “then the 80s were possible.” Weird.

  350. Pig Mannix: I wish Huckabee had Ron Paul’s policy ideas.

  351. Wharf Rat: Fair enough and I know what you are saying. But Ron Paul has the “disease” that he does not know how to be phony or to put on bullshit airs. He is what he is.

    I personally find that to be refreshing, even if it is awkward at times. But I will concede your point that 99.99 of Americans are so fucking stupid that it’s a wonder they still know how to breathe.

  352. Romney did more for the country during his Mormon mission in France than McCain did pussy-vacationing in Vietnam. What’s harder, sitting around or going door to door telling French people top believe in God?

    I rest my case.

  353. RP follow-up interview due to popular demand!

  354. OK, now that this horror show is over, could someone remind me why CNN dumped affably acerbic anchor Aaron Brown for smarmy asshat Anderson Cooper?

  355. “You have to give it to Huckabee, the guy has a silver tongue.”

    That explains Anderson’s visible erection throughout.

  356. Crimethink, you are correct but when government spends so much money and they build things and have things contracted to be built in the pseudo-British measurements we (sort of) adopted it gives artifical weight to those measures. It is not a free market we are living in. I have no desire to foist metric on everyone at the point of a gun. I just want the government (and all government contractors) to be forced to use metric. That is all.

  357. McCain was repulsive and I’m not just saying that because he’s a lying, warmongering, creep….or am I?

  358. It’s totally dishonest to have Bennett doing analysis, he’s probably on Romney’s payroll like most conservative commentators.

  359. The problem among other things is that Ron’s got to speak to idiots, the majority of wonks are set in their ways and the media is a business. That is why these other guys talk like idiots. Tell them to look at their federal taxes next paycheck and their W2s and tell them that he wants to give that to them. People are selfish for the most part, but there are enough that will maintain society. We have the greatest communication and education network ever, the internet, and yet they have absolutely no faith in themselves. We can bribe them more than anyone else, by giving their own money back, and we don’t communicate it effectively.

  360. Paul is on cnn.com right now. The reporter thinks he’s for the fair tax.

  361. “could someone remind me why CNN dumped affably acerbic anchor Aaron Brown for smarmy asshat Anderson Cooper?”

    The Agency called up and requested placement for a trained agent.

  362. True, crimethink, apples and oranges. It wasn’t a knock on Reagan. LoL at the sprawl thing.

  363. Boy, this woman is beyond dumb.

  364. What is going on? I paid for this position fair and square and the people are’nt giving it to me! I’ve done everything and said everything the people I pay to know about these things have told me to do and say! Dad! Dad! Make them give it to me, Dad!!

  365. If he insists on talking about them, he needs to explain to people what he’s on about. He needs to take something they understand, like foreclosures or the housing bubble, and talk about his currency ideas by talking about that.

    True. There’s no reason why monetary issues (even the gold standard) can’t be expressed in down-to-Earth, pocketbook terms given the housing bubble (an issue Paul should be, ahem, gold on) and gas prices (something he actually tackled well in the precious debate).

  366. The questions were terrible, and the little banners at the bottom of the screen were like somthing from Saturday Night Live “Huckabee: What do you see in Vladimir Putin’s Eyes?”

  367. “What’s harder, sitting around or going door to door telling French people top believe in God?”

    Romney lost the true hardcore conservatives with that. They will NOT want a president who has stepped foot in France.

  368. Paul explaining that the President is not the Commander-in-Chief of the economy was good, particularly for a Republican audience that knows this at some level.

    He made his case against the Iraq War w/o sounding like a Kucinich peace creep.

  369. Ron and Huck should agree to fuck these homeboys up next time.

    They need their shit pushed in big-time.

  370. Paul gave intelligent, sensible answers on Iraq and foriegn policy, but intelligent, sensible answers on Iraq and foriegn policy ain’t the GOP’s thing lately…

    If you were McCain, who would you pick for VP? Fred Thompson (Southern and considered conservative by many)?

  371. FUNNY STUFF.
    CNN asks for our comments. They must not want them, their response board is suddenly undergoing maintenance.

  372. MNG: Seriously. CNN’s motif tonight appears to be “self-parody.”

  373. “Huckabee: What do you see in Vladimir Putin’s Eyes?”

    I actually think John McCain’s remark about Putin’s eyes was pretty spot-on.

  374. Librarian,

    In 1808, it was important that everyone use the same measurement units. In 2008, I don’t care whether the contractor I’m working with is using the furlong/ferkin/fortnight system…it takes about a nanosecond of computing time to convert. I just don’t see the compelling govt interest.

  375. Hes picking Lindsey Grahm for VP.

  376. I wonder how it makes one feel to change your position on everything important, pander at every chance, outspend your opponent 10 to 1, and still have a majority of people reject you?

    Maybe Steve Forbes and Mitt could form a little support group…

  377. If I were McCain, I’d pick Phil Grahmn. He’d be a consensus conservative pick.

  378. Cesar-I doubt it. Ever since immigration reform Graham has taken hits in his own state. He’s not the man to shore up the GOP for McCain.

  379. Hey I kind of liked Steve Forbes. He was the best among those running in 2000.

  380. Hes picking Lindsey Grahm for VP.

    That would be a waste, there aren’t THAT many gay Republicans.

  381. Cesar-I doubt it. Ever since immigration reform Graham has taken hits in his own state. He’s not the man to shore up the GOP for McCain.

    McCain seems to value loyalty above all other considerations. Graham has been with him since 2000, and has backed him at every turn. Hes also young enough to balance McCain’s age.

  382. “If I were McCain, I’d pick Phil Grahmn. He’d be a consensus conservative pick.”

    Hey, there’s another guy who raised and spent a ton of money and people just weren’t that into him…
    I think the Dem VP choice will be much more interesting. If the choice is Hillary she would be a fool to not pick Richardson, but if it is Obama that choice would seem way too ethnic I think…

  383. Huckabee is going to be harder to knock out of this race than people think. He’s a lot craftier than people give him credit for. That bit about legislators having the luxury to specialized in the areas that interest them – when’s the last time you saw anyone turn McCain’s record in Congress on military issues into a negative.

    Bill Clinton says he’s the only one in the Republican contest who can tell a joke or give a speech. It’s true – he is vastly more likable and charasmatic than any of his opponents tonight.

  384. Hillary picks Wes Clark. Southern weight guy who helps her in foreign policy and has the added bonus of being a Clinton flunkie.

  385. I did like when Forbes did Saturday Night Live that time when he was running. Did he have to buy a controlling interest in GE to get that?

    Rudy’s SNL appearance was funny too (the Reno-Rudy boxing match)

  386. If you were McCain, who would you pick for VP?

    I think they’d want VPs from swing states. (FL, CA). But I can’t think of any R’s offhand who’d fit. (I know Jeb! isn’t gonna be offered the chance.)

  387. CA ain’t no swing state.

  388. I think the real lesson of this debate is that the Republicans are headed for an epic thrashing next fall.

  389. “Bill Clinton says he’s the only one in the Republican contest who can tell a joke or give a speech. It’s true – he is vastly more likable and charasmatic than any of his opponents tonight.”

    It’s true. He’s a great speaker, quick on his feet, and comes off with that compassionate conservative stuff that W could only dream of.

    Thank God the GOP will not nominate him!

  390. Bill Richardson is a fuck-up. He’s a bit clownish. And I say that as somebody who was going to vote for him.

    Hillary Clinton won’t put up with that. It will remind her of her fuck-up little brother Hughie, and she won’t want anything to do with him.

  391. I think they’d want VPs from swing states. (FL, CA). But I can’t think of any R’s offhand who’d fit. (I know Jeb! isn’t gonna be offered the chance.

    Charlie Crist, the current governor of Florida. Very popular.

  392. Charlie Crist, the current governor of Florida. Very popular.

    That would be the smart pick. But Graham is the more likely.

  393. If you were McCain, who would you pick for VP?

    If I were McCain, I would pick Paul. If I were Paul choosing a VP, I would pick me.

  394. Does anyone know of a gambling site that has over /unders on McCain dropping names? I want to get a piece of that action for the next debate.

  395. If Hillary gets the nomination she picks Harold Ford Jr in an attempt to heal her rift with AA voters and to offer ideological balance.

  396. I can see McCain picking Giuliani…

    I don’t think it matters though, because this is going to go to a brokered convention. Romney is going to do well enough in Arizona and California and any state with a sizable Mormon population. McCain will probably win a few of the Forever War states, and Huckabee will continue to get every single Bible thumper to vote for him to bring this country back into step with God.

    Hooray for identity politics!

  397. “I think the real lesson of this debate is that the Republicans are headed for an epic thrashing next fall.”

    That could well be. McCain’s strategy is nucking futs.

    “What about the economy?”
    “I was and always have been for victory in Iraq and will stick with our action there as long as it takes. Our economic well being depends on victory in Iraq.”

    “What makes you a good leader of the economy?”
    “I showed leadership by supporting the Iraq War all the time.”

    Yo bro, that war is not popular…
    Etc.,

  398. If Hillary gets the nomination she picks Harold Ford Jr in an attempt to heal her rift with AA voters and to offer ideological balance.

    Thats very likely, as well.

  399. Who would Romney pick?

    OK, say David Patraeus told him to go bleep himself, sir. Then who?

    Think McCain would do it? Nah, too old.

    Some respected foreign policy or military figure from the Bush administration? Can anybody think of any? Ooh – Bob Gates!

  400. “If Hillary gets the nomination she picks Harold Ford Jr”

    Oooh, that’s a good fucking pick. Well done!

  401. But joe Richardson would add so much to a HRC campaign (Latino voters, foriegn policy experience, Western states, testicles)

  402. Charlie Crist has happily been a bachelor for many years. Read in that what you will

  403. How does Harold Ford, Jr. ideologically balance Hillary Clinton?

    Does the DLC have factions?

  404. SIV-I see the logic, but I would never pick someone who has never won a statewide election in their own state.

  405. I saw it the other day and it was kind of surreal – this woman talks for like 3 minutes about how after Nixon took the country off the gold standard, money became abstract, so “then the 80s were possible.” Weird.

    That was Laurie Anderson. She’s weird.

  406. Harold Ford Jr. is a Clinton flunkie, a Southerner and a black guy that would help heal the rift with black voters.

    But I don’t see a woman and a black guy. I still think Wes Clark is more likely–the Democrats have to win at least ONE former Confederate State this time around. One former Arkansas first lady and one Arkansasian (spelling?) should do that in Arkansas. That, if anything, is the lesson they should learn from the last two elections.

  407. Anyone know anything about a Petraeus surprise at the Republican convention? Either brokered or for McCain medical reasons.Seems to be hints and rumors simmering.

  408. I can see that much, Cesar, but “ideological balance?”

    the Democrats have to win at least ONE former Confederate State this time around. Not of they can win something in the interior west, or Ohio.

  409. Cesar-If they could somehow have got Gore to run WV, TN, Arkansas, would all be in play

  410. Lindsay Graham is in the spin room now.

    Is he a Larry Craig Republican?

  411. You look at the Democrats’ pickups in 2006, very few were in the South. Many more in the midwest, mountain west, and southwest.

  412. “Is he a Larry Craig Republican?”

    Them boners be poppin’

  413. Somebody a few days ago said that the Democrats should say Screw you, South, we don’t need you, and pick a westerner or whoever. I think that makes sense because I don’t see the Republicans putting up much of a fight this time around.

  414. the Democrats have to win at least ONE former Confederate State this time around. Not of they can win something in the interior west, or Ohio.

    Make the Republicans play in Arkansas or Virginia to take them off of Ohio. It also serves as insurance. If Gore had taken just a little time off to campaign in Arkansas or Tennessse in 2000 he could have told Florida to screw itself.

  415. Wow, I’m showing mad html skillz on that one.

  416. I see Graham is parroting the Reform Institute party line.

  417. Charlie Crist is not gay!

  418. The Clintons don’t care about ideological balance. If they did, why did Bill choose Al Gore (the 1992 Gore was a southern centrist) in ’92?

  419. Harold Ford Jr. is a Clinton flunkie, a Southerner and a black guy that would help heal the rift with black voters.

    He is very conservative by Dem standards, pro-life, Christian and hawkish. He might be too charismatic for Hillary’s taste.

    I wouldn’t call Ford a “Clinton flunkie” despite his DLC position.

  420. Mommy, make the scary man stop with the block quotes.

    I agree with your “make them compete everywhere,” Howard Dean thing, but that’s not winning.

    In electoral math, their pickups are west, but they will run strong and build the party in the South, too. It’s a big Democratic year.

  421. SIV:

    I do not understand the GOP Petraeus love. Is there any substance there or is it mostly the fact that he’s military?

  422. Look, I paid for this election fair and square. My Dad is big people, you understand? Give me this election RIGHT NOW!

  423. SIV – you’re right. PA, WA & OR had close results in 2004.

    Andrew – Crist wouldn’t be a bad choice for R veep, but he’s only had a couple years in at governor. They might want someone more seasoned.

    That was Laurie Anderson. She’s weird.

    Understated as ever.

  424. “I do not understand the GOP Petraeus love. Is there any substance there or is it mostly the fact that he’s military?”

    Have you ever read “The Pink Swastika”?

  425. If its Obama they should play in Virginia, if its Clinton in Arkansas. Remember, McCain is going to hurt you in the southwest.

  426. “Charlie Crist is not gay!”

    Not that there is anything wrong with that.

  427. It used to be a point of pride for the officer corps when people couldn’t peg their politics. Marshall used to brag about not voting. Both parties wanted to nominate Ike.

    Not today.

  428. Joe, again, Wes Clark?

  429. “It used to be a point of pride for the officer corps when people couldn’t peg their politics.”

    Like McClellan?

  430. MNG – Gore would never win WV (which was formed as a Union state to keep the C&O in the Union). In 2000 he managed to cause Bush to become the first non-incumbent Republican to win the state since Herbert Hoover. Coal means too much to the state for them ever to elect a hard-core environmentalist.

  431. How does Harold Ford, Jr. ideologically balance Hillary Clinton?

    Hillary is perceived as a socialist, not a DLCer like Bill. Harold Ford Jr ran credibly in TN as a conservative Democrat.

  432. Coal means too much to the state for them ever to elect a hard-core environmentalist.

    Not to mention a gun-grabber.

  433. Slight typo: not=totally

    I really have to start using Preview.

  434. Yeah, McCain in the Southwest. Score another point for VP Richardson if McCain gets the nomination.

    Wouldn’t Huckabee be a good choice for McCain’s VP?

  435. Dedalus:

    No but after googling it… lol. I may have to read it now.

  436. Joe, woman+minority=losing ticket. Sorry, thats reality.

  437. Cesar, Wes Clark might be a good pick to make the South a contest.

    MNG, the Civil War period was an aberration in our history. Both before that, and after.

  438. “Wouldn’t Huckabee be a good choice for McCain’s VP?”

    Naah, movement conservatives hate both of them too much (Huckabee offended the business Gods and therefore no amount of the God-Talk will save him). That guy is gonna be wrote right outta the conservative movement.

  439. I meant more about how no one could pinpoint the political views of Generals, not the merits of his choice as VP.

    Huckabee is a TERRIBLE choice for VP for McCain. What, you want him to alienate the party establishment even more?

  440. Cesar,

    It’s not like Bill Richardson is a rabble-rousing Congressman from Spanish Harlem.

  441. “No but after googling it… lol. I may have to read it now.”

    Hey, I got no beef with gay dudes who just fucking do what they do and two fingers to the rest of the world.

    But there is a repressed homosexuality that seeps out in extreme right-wing politics and drives the kind of cruelty that we saw with the repressed-gay dominated Nazis.

    Just come out, boys, have your fun and leave the rest of us the fuck alone.

  442. Cesar-I don’t think Richardson will count as a minority. The Dems will lose the south, either way. But with Richardson they pick up NM, maybe CO, etc., and with HRC they pick up FL, CA, NY right away, and that’s about half what you need in itself. ANy tight place she just says, it’s me or the war for four more years and plays endless clips of McCain beating the war drum like a crazy Indian…

  443. MNG, if McCain gets the nomination, it will mean movement conservatives have made their peace with him.

    And John McCain doesn’t give a crap about movement conservatives.

    Cesar,

    I meant more about how no one could pinpoint the political views of Generals, not the merits of his choice as VP. And I meant “used to.” Back before our time. And Clark wasn’t a political figure before he retired.

  444. Obama wins anywhere HRC would, and maybe some more places (like Iowa?). Unless there is some major revelations about a candidate who is receiving, currently, a pass from the usual press inspection (which could very likely happen)…

  445. I meant more about how no one could pinpoint the political views of Generals, not the merits of his choice as VP.

    That Generals would be perceived as nearly always Republican says a lot about the current State of the Democrat Party, and why a win in 2008 is by no means certain.

  446. Here’s my challenge: where would Obama win votes that HRC would not? which states would go Dem or be more competitive WITH Obama than with Hillary? Any states where the Dems pick up an advantage with HRC they would not have with Obama?

  447. Did anyone catch how Romney claimed Huckabee’s crazy idea of expanding the I-95 corridor and all the eminent domain acquisitions involved is a wonderful idea, it just wouldn’t replace putting $300 or $600 in everyone’s pocket.

  448. …and plays endless clips of McCain beating the war drum like a crazy Indian…

    …and maybe a commercial of girl counting to one hundred by picking flower petals…

  449. MNG-

    Arkansas, and thats about it.

  450. But there is a repressed homosexuality that seeps out in extreme right-wing politics and drives the kind of cruelty that we saw with the repressed-gay dominated Nazis.

    Dedalus,

    Don’t you read the bestsellers?
    Nazis are liberals.

  451. Somebody just wrote into CNN whining about “How could RP protect us if there are no taxes? And what would happen to countries like Israel if we didn’t protect them?”

  452. That Generals would be perceived as nearly always Republican…

    Not anymore, they aren’t. Now they’re all running as Democrats. Even Reagan’s old military guys are switching parties.

  453. MNG: Obama will bring out younger people and independents on the Dem side. If Hillary runs shes more likely to get people to vote AGAINST her or not vote at all.

    I think though that given the 40% 60+years old that comprise the electorate, the addition of young people might be negligible. And something tells me granny might have trouble getting very enthusiastic about a young black man (unfortunately).

  454. Just to help, here were the close ones in 2004:

    Wisconsin, Kerry, 0.38%
    Iowa, Bush, 0.67%
    New Mexico, Bush, 0.79%
    New Hampshire, Kerry, 1.37%
    Ohio, Bush, 2.11%
    Pennsylvania, Kerry, 2.50%
    Nevada, Bush, 2.59%
    Michigan, Kerry, 3.42%
    Minnesota, Kerry, 3.48%
    Oregon, Kerry, 4.16%
    Colorado, Bush, 4.67%

  455. Here’s my challenge: where would Obama win votes that HRC would not? which states would go Dem or be more competitive WITH Obama than with Hillary

    Louisiana

    Any states where the Dems pick up an advantage with HRC they would not have with Obama?

    PA?

  456. “Don’t you read the bestsellers?
    Nazis are liberals.”

    Oh yes, I keep forgetting my Ann Coulter porn.

  457. MNG,

    It’s tough, because they would both expand from the Kerry states into the southwest (AZ, CO, NM, NV), the rest of the midwest (IN, OH) and flirt with the south (VA, AR, FL, WV). He would squeak out a few more of these than she would, but it’s tough to say which ones. Maybe they’d do the same in the west, and he’d do better in the South.

  458. I see anyone with Richardson taking NM, NV and CO. Obama could take Iowa where HRC can’t imo. HRC may be stronger in Florida than Obama would…

  459. Not anymore, they aren’t. Now they’re all running as Democrats.

    joe: Who ? Where?

  460. joe: I’ve got a feeling that Ohio is going to go to the Democrats this election…

    After watching Taft just run amok, and the fact that there are still news articles about corruption that went on under his watch… as well as the fact the last election for governor here was a slaughter (partially because of Ken Blackwell being the Republican nominee, at least in my opinion)… Ohio is looking good to break to the Dems…

    Nephilium

  461. Funny you should ask.

    Admiral Sestak, who commanded the battle group off Afghanistan during that war.

    Jim Webb, Reagan’s old Navy Secretary.

    I’m forgetting an Army general who ran in 2006.

    Try googling ‘fighting democrats’ if it’s really that important to you.

  462. Nephilum,

    Rare coins? Rare Coins?!?

    Are you kidding me? That’s not normal. I understand why people are pissed.

  463. If McCain wins the nomination, he doesn’t have to worry about “the movement conservatives.” They’ve got a lot of institutional power, but they are a puny part of the general-election electorate. What Huckabee would lose him in movement conservatives, he’d pay back 10X among evangelicals.

  464. Roland Martin is dumb, even for a black person.

  465. joe:

    I wish I was kidding… that’s on top of the random tax increases (Hey, you know, the Ohio economy sucks. We’ve got no new companies coming in. I know! Let’s raise taxes on ’em, that’ll draw ’em in!), criminal convictions, and just downright dickery…

    And to make things worse… he was the first governor I voted for…

    He’s the main reason that Ohio is in play for both sides now (as well as the last election).

    Nephilium

  466. I just switched over to TNT and saw jack nicholson in “A few good men” getting arrested. Why does McCain remind me of that guy?


  467. Admiral Sestak, who commanded the battle group off Afghanistan during that war.

    Not a General, where is he running?

    Must have been rough hitting those Afghan beaches.

    What was Webb’s rank in uniform?
    He is an opportunistic Democrat, not an ideological one (ie “the good kind”)

    There was the lady helicopter pilot with no legs, she lost I think.

  468. Good luck swiftboating Webb, SIV. Its a little hard to do since he isn’t a pompus blowhard like Kerry.

  469. correct that:

    Joe, woman+minority=losing ticket. Sorry, thats reality.

    woman + anyone with less experience than my county manager = losing ticket.

  470. talking about Democrats in the milatary?

    Well, there was my dad who was in the 82nd Airborne in the 60’s. He never went to Vietnam, though. He was sent to fight commie brush fires in Central America, instead.

  471. Good luck swiftboating Webb, SIV.

    I wasn’t, just pointing out Webb isn’t your typical ideological Democrat. As a paleo, I should find his brand of identity politics refreshing (that alone ruled out a Republican run).

    They did try and get him with the gay incest pedophile bit in his novel though. Unlike the swiftboaters, that was more a smear than legit criticism.

  472. Can these “debates” get any worse?

  473. I think John Warner with Jim Webb is probably the best bi-partisan Senate delegation in the entire country.

    They did try and get him with the gay incest pedophile bit in his novel though. Unlike the swiftboaters, that was more a smear than legit criticism.

    The fact that George Allen ran with that “Scandal” should tell you a lot about the state of the GOP in the Commonwealth.

  474. That was Laurie Anderson. She’s weird.

    There were about a dozen different comments that I could have done this for, but this was the winner.

    QFT!

    (and thanks, JR, for ruining that movie for me.)

  475. # t. j. | January 30, 2008, 9:24pm | #
    # i just saw paul and huckabee smile
    # at each other and say something. must be
    # something about what a douche anderson is
    # being to them.

    No kidding. I am watching in the Pacific Time Zone, and by my watch it is 20 minutes since Cooper PROMISED Paul he would get to answer the “conservative credentials” question in “two minutes” (or “a couple of questions from now”). If he doesn’t give RP a follow-up interview immediately afterward, I will recommend that CNN fire Mr. Anderson for moderating in bad faith. We expect politicians to break their promises. But when so-called JOURNALISTS do, on an international stage, it compromises the integrity of the network and the profession of journalism. Shame on Mr. Cooper. He didn’t have to be fair in assigning air time to Ron Paul. But if he made a promise, he needed to keep it.

  476. I fucking hate Huckabee. Hate his religious fanaticism. Conservativism is not a word!
    Democrat is a noun, not an adjective! I’ve had enough presidential speaches with broken English in the past seven years!
    Thank god he has no chance.

  477. Romney is a fucking nazi

  478. I watched he debate and I’m kinda depressed cuz Ron Paul is not in the lead for the nomination of my party. I’m bummed both cuz he’s so liberty principled, and also cuz the other three have such prominent flaws.

    Hi Mrs. Reagan! We love you and we miss President Reagan.

    (It’s more likely than you might think that Nancy reads H&R. Reagan spoke with me briefly about an interview that he did with Reason and Nancy told me that he loves Reason.)

    After watching most of the debates, here are my brief impressions sans very much elaboration right now cuz all the sudden I’ve got the bitchen crashskles.

    Romney -Lightweight. Wants to be CEO of America. Thinks of the citizens as his employees. (Ron Paul scored big when he said that the president does not “manage” the economy-the people do.)

    Huckabee-Very, very lightweight.

    McCain-Self deluded and a little nuts. He has the tendency to be both impulsive and irrational. Do we want his finger on the nuclear weapon trigger?

    Dr Paul-Ideas and principle really matter to him. But he often spaces that the average debate viewer isn’t as informed as he his.

  479. Hmm. I just saw my first Ron Paul ad on TV on the local news. Pretty solid and straightforward with the theme ‘the economy is bad, getting worse, and I’m the only one who knows what to do about it.’

  480. The “* fixed” part at the very end best describes and sums up the whole debate.

  481. 9:25: This is probably Paul’s best debate performance: He actually gets Romney nodding when he says “the president isn’t supposed to manage the economy.”

    Damn, everytime i try to dismiss Ron Paul, he says something so sweet and delicious that i can’t help but root for him.

  482. Actually, I think it was more like 5%. And that is probably being generous! You poor people do not live in the democracy that you think you do.

  483. People who vote for McCain or Romney only do so because they think these guys are the only candidates who stand a chance, and people don’t want to “waste their votes”. NEWSFLASH: if you don’t think your votes count, vote RON PAUL since it “doesn’t matter anyway”. If you think the winner is predetermined, vote RON PAUL since it “doesn’t matter anyway”. It’s such a cop out not to vote your conscience just because you don’t think it stands a chance.

  484. Nancy told me that he loves Reason.)

    Uh, he’s, like, dead. Maybe you should tell Nancy.

  485. “I only saw him [Reagan] once up close, which happened to be when he got a question he didn’t like. Was it true that his staff in the 1980 debates had stolen President Carter’s briefing book? (They had.) The famously genial grin turned into a rictus of senile fury: I was looking at a cruel and stupid lizard. His reply was that maybe his staff had, and maybe they hadn’t, but what about the leak of the Pentagon Papers? Thus, a secret theft of presidential documents was equated with the public disclosure of needful information. This was a man never short of a cheap jibe or the sort of falsehood that would, however laughable, buy him some time.” Christopher Hitchens “The Stupidity of Ronald reagan”

  486. “What Ronnie really liked was horoscopes. We never made a major dscision without consulting our astrologer. It’s very scientific. Really. It is”–Nancy Reagan

  487. Nancy and her astrology and Hillary and her channeling of Eleanor Roosevelt.

  488. Yeah, they’re both dizzy dames.

  489. MK:

    Uh, he’s, like, dead. Maybe you should tell Nancy.

    It was 1976 when Nancy told me that Reagan loves Reason. I’ve posted this account before…

    It was in 1976 when he was trying to wrest the GOP nomination from Ford that Reagan came to Colorado to give a speech in Ft. Collins. I drove up from Denver to hear him and after the speech, when he and Nancy got to me in the receiving line they found a wide eyed kid who was jazzed that he cited “The Road to Serfdom” by Hayek in his talk. He told me he also really liked Hayek’s “The Constitution of Liberty”! This, of course, put me “in orbit” and I then mentioned that I enjoyed the points he made in an interview with Reason. (It was in that interview where he made his “libertarianism is the kernel of conservatism” quote.) I remember he then said, I swear, “Well, I’ll have to look at that again”. (Remember when the “Well” was the stock in trade of a Reagan imitation?) As I shook their hands in an enthusiastic fare well, Nancy assured me that “Ronnie loves that little magazine”.

  490. Sounds like a school girl crush. He was pretty good looking in a vacant sort of way. Nancy looks a bit waxy.

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