HavenCo, RIP

Jesse Walker | November 25, 2008

A tip for anyone eager to set up a Cryptonomicon-style data haven: If you want to attract actual customers, you should base yourself in a country whose sovereignty is respected by other countries. And which doesn't rely on one of those other countries for its Internet connection.

[Via Julian Sanchez.]

Comments

Guy Montag|11.25.08 @ 12:47PM|#

First Post!

Hi /. :)

Paul|11.25.08 @ 12:54PM|#

And which doesn't rely on one of those other countries for its Internet connection

Duh.

When you get your electricity from an extension cord running from your neighbors house, it's hard to declare yourself 'off the grid' and sovreign. Frankly, I'm surprised it took this long. I kept asking myself "when are they going to get their internet cut?"

|11.25.08 @ 1:06PM|#

Extra-territorial "nations" are great, except for two things. Both played a factor in this failure.

The first is dependence on other nations for infrastructure. Instead of depending on UK for your internet, you should have had connections to multiple nations, or had your own satellite. Also trade in general: It's easy to say you'll just trade for the goods you need, but will people in other nations be allowed to trade with you?

Frankly, Sealand would have had a better time of it if they were a converted oil tanker with actual registry. Similar precedents exist with gambling ships. So why not data haven ships?

The second problem is mistrust of contract enforcement. Who do you sue if HavenCo screws you over? What recourse do you have if your own nation refuses to honor your contract with HavenCo?

There are other problems too: The lack of actual citizenry or other permanent residents. No navy or other means of asserting sovereignty. Etc.

robc|11.25.08 @ 1:07PM|#

Isnt the whole point of an internet connection to "connect". It isnt possible to have one without it running to some other country. Sure, with redundancy, you can route around Country X, but what if you are trying to reach it from within country X?

robc|11.25.08 @ 1:09PM|#

Space based data haven with satellite connections seems the only real solution.

|11.25.08 @ 1:14PM|#

Space based data haven with satellite connections seems the only real solution.

That's how Skynet gets started, dude. It'll decide our fate in a microsecond.

Tacos mmm...|11.25.08 @ 1:28PM|#

Space based data haven with satellite connections seems the only real solution.

No, the real solution is a a distributed data haven, where your data is encrypted and spread over the computers of other participants in the haven.

|11.25.08 @ 2:00PM|#

How can Sealand possibly be expected to launch a satellite? One time at a BBQ party, I duct taped some model rocket engines to an upside down tiki-torch, and that worked - so maybe, I guess...

zero|11.25.08 @ 2:07PM|#

That's how Skynet gets started, dude. It'll decide our fate in a microsecond.

Only when it becomes self-aware. Until that we're fine...

Warmongering Lunatic|11.25.08 @ 2:23PM|#

Launching a data haven satellite requires the cooperation of somebody with the ability to launch satellites . . . remembering that under the Outer Space Treaty, the country with national jurisdiction over the launch bears international legal responsibility for all activities of the satellite.

Man with a Tiki Torch permanen|11.25.08 @ 3:32PM|#

One time at a BBQ party, I duct taped some model rocket engines to an upside down tiki-torch, and that worked - so maybe, I guess...

Can I have your address? I need to talk to you about a legal matter.

Paul|11.25.08 @ 3:33PM|#

Instead of depending on UK for your internet, you should have had connections to multiple nations, or had your own satellite.

Multiple nations which recognize your sovreignty and with which you have treaties.

cunnivore|11.25.08 @ 5:32PM|#

OK, the ad on the right for gold coins with Obama on them is really blowing my mind. Gold bugs mixing with Obamaniacs is like eating a hamburger with maple syrup on it.