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Drug Propaganda Thursday
A couple of months ago, the Office of National Drug Policy apparently decided that a "with it" kinda' thing to do would be to upload the agency's awful anti-drug videos up to YouTube. Naturally, you aren't permitted to comment on the commercials, keeping with the drug warriors general approach to dissent. Once several hundred people had given the videos poor ratings, they disabled the rating function, too.
What's disappointing is that the agency persuaded YouTube to give it its own little corner of the site, complete with unique formatting and a unique URL. Not cool, YouTubers.
This week's propaganda video is apparently an attempt to encourage young people to buck peer pressure. The tag line is a riot: "When you give up the ability to decide for yourself...You give up what makes you, you."
Marvel for just a sec at the irony in that line.
|11.23.06 @ 4:41PM|#
"When you give up the ability to decide for yourself...You
give up what makes you, you."
Just as long as your decisions conform to the priggish whims of of
a bunch of puritanical assholes who dominate Western culture.
D.A. Ridgely|11.23.06 @ 5:00PM|#
"When you give up the ability to decide for yourself...You give
up what makes you, you."
I guess we won't be seeing the FDA adopt that as its new motto.
|11.23.06 @ 5:07PM|#
Once several hundred people had given the videos poor
ratings, they disabled the rating function, too.
Ignoring feedback in order to save face is quite stupid. But of
course we're used to this type of thing coming from the government
prohibitionists as their policies wreak tragedy throughout our
nation.
"When you give up the ability to decide for yourself...You give
up what makes you, you."
Just amazing! The government idiots just came up with a fine slogan
(based on a truism) for the anti- prohibitionist movement.
Come on You Tube, when you lay down with Big Brother you get up
with brain rot.
|11.23.06 @ 7:37PM|#
What's disappointing is that the agency persuaded YouTube to
give it its own little corner of the site, complete with unique
formatting and a unique URL. Not cool, YouTubers.
So what? As libertarians, don't we believe that the answer to bad
speech is more speech? In the marketplace of ideas, this shit is
pretty cheap. Let 'em babble. They're clearly not winning the
hearts and minds of their target audience, and they never
will.
Having their own little corner just makes it easier to avoid.
|11.23.06 @ 9:19PM|#
Shame on YouTube for playing along. I swear, if it wasn't for all the free porn...
|11.23.06 @ 9:31PM|#
"When you give up the ability to decide for yourself...You
give up what makes you, you."
Ability to decide for yourself? HAR HAR HAR!!! What planet are they
living on?!
|11.23.06 @ 10:42PM|#
Guys, I think you are missing the point,
When you do something that you wouldn't otherwise want to do in
order to convince others that you are cool, you are giving up your
individuality.
When you don't do it because you fear armed men breaking into your
home, shooting your pets, tasering your mom, confiscating your car
and dooming your chances of getting into a good college, you have
retained your individuality.
The former is bad, and your so called friends are evil for so
pressuring you.
The latter is good, and we owe a debt of gratitude to those who
risk their lives daily meddling in our personal business.
I'm so glad that I have to postpone repairing my gutters to afford
the taxes that keep these mental midgets off of the street.
|11.23.06 @ 11:24PM|#
I was curious, so I took a look at the profile of "ONCDPstaff",
the "user" who uploads their videos.
http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=ONDCPstaff
Interestingly, ONCDPstaff has watched 239 videos. I wonder which
ones...
|11.23.06 @ 11:31PM|#
Follow Madog's link to the user profile of ONDCP. They have disabled the comment and rating function for their videos, but you still can (literally) send a message to them from their profile. Give 'em hell!
R. S. Porter|11.24.06 @ 1:33AM|#
I don't really see the why the slogan is particularily
bad.
Actually I agree with it. When you do many drugs you are losing
your inhibitions, and it is our inhibitions that give us our
individuality. Part of one's personality is regulating their own
conduct and thus taking drugs is counteracting reason. On the peer
pressure aspect there is a point too. Regardless of what the peer
pressure is, conforming to anything reflexively is not a
good thing. I think J.S. Mill is right in his advocation of pure
individuality in all aspects of human thought.
That said, people should still be allowed to do how they please and
no one should regulate their victimless actions.
Overall, though it's more government wasting our money on
moralistic propaganda, I don't think the statement itself is so
inherently wrong as you people make it out to be. There is much to
object to in the ad--and the fact it even exists--but that line is
the least of your worries.
brucem|11.24.06 @ 2:39AM|#
It's like Christi-fascists telling people "Jesus wants you to think for yourself!" ... they are comfortable in their hypocrisy, irony, and blatant falsehoods because they know all dissent will be stiffled. Bloggers can point out their stupidity in small, dark corners of the web, but not on billboards, tv commercials, radio ads, and other prominent forms of advertisement which they waste our tax dollars on to get THEIR idiocy out there.
|11.24.06 @ 2:48AM|#
Shame on YouTube for playing along. I swear, if it wasn't
for all the free porn...
You can get porn too?? Really? I just use it to score swell New
Wave and old school punk stuff:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sXpWXpCz_e0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qz-nGB6TPj4
|11.24.06 @ 2:57AM|#
The ones in the orevious post were The Human League and Blondie.
Here's the Ramones:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jRxrgZ1T_YM
And I also have this groovy, interesting one: The Future of
Austrian Economics by Murray Rothbard:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWdUIuID8ag
Dig em if you can. But really, you can get porn too?
|11.24.06 @ 3:07AM|#
R. S. Porter:
I don't really see the why the slogan is particularily bad.
Actually I agree with it. When you do many drugs you are losing
your inhibitions, and it is our inhibitions that give us our
individuality.
That's kind of a stretch, is it not? On the other hand, it's
certainly true that the drug laws take away our ability to decide
for ourselves.
|11.24.06 @ 7:55AM|#
The story goes that we beat the Nazis and the commies, but sometimes I wonder if they really lost at all. Lord knows the American people lose every day.
Non Sequitur April 5, 1999|11.24.06 @ 8:47AM|#
Rebel against non-conformity.
Conform to independent thought.
werd|11.24.06 @ 8:50AM|#
I thought the commercial was pretty good. If drugs were legal, and a group of private individuals got together to produce this commercial, would you consider it good? If not, is it possible for an anti drug commercial to be good?
Life of Brian (1979)|11.24.06 @ 8:51AM|#
Brian: Please, please, please listen! I've got
one or two things to say.
The Crowd: Tell us! Tell us both of them!
Brian: Look, you've got it all wrong! You don't
NEED to follow ME, You don't NEED to follow ANYBODY! You've got to
think for your selves! You're ALL individuals!
The Crowd: Yes! We're all individuals!
Brian: You're all different!
The Crowd: Yes, we ARE all different!
Man in crowd: I'm not...
The Crowd: Sch!
|11.24.06 @ 8:55AM|#
I've found that you can comment on videos uploaded by the
hilariously-named ONDCPsucks.
Here: www.youtube.com/watch?v=khbSK9dzLuQ
|11.24.06 @ 10:56AM|#
wow. the hypocrisy here is amazing, but typical.
libertarians are supposed to believe (heck, all americans who
believe in the 1st amendment do) that there should be a marketplace
for ideas.
apparently, the one exception is the US Govt. when was the last
time somebody here referred to NORML as "propaganda". fwiw, i am
against the drug war, but NORML "propagandizes" at least as much as
the govt. does, just from the opposite side of the fence.
it comes down to this . people here don't like youtube giving a
voice to all sides of the debate. nope, youtube is "giving in" if
evul govt propagandists (tm) are given access to a relatively
freewheeling speech site that has a diversity of viewpoints.
people who are comfortable iwth the 1st amendment, and with their
ideas welcome an open and free debate. others, believe that if the
opposing viewpoint is given play, that the dumb sheeple (tm) will
be influenced and it is up to US to make sure that they don't have
the access
grow up. the best counter to bad speech is to counter it with good
speech. people are free to post pro-legalization videos to youtube.
that is the rational, libertarian approach, not whinging that the
evul govt. propagandists are taking advantage of speech and
persuasion
Larry A|11.24.06 @ 11:28AM|#
R S Porter: I don't really see the why the slogan is
particularily bad.
It's not bad. In fact the ad is a pretty good representation of the
anti-drug peer pressure argument. But it's also supremely
ironically arrogant for the War on Drugs zero tolerance folks to
promote individuality when their solution is prison for
non-conforming behavior.
people here don't like youtube giving a voice to all sides of
the debate. nope, youtube is "giving in" if evul govt propagandists
(tm) are given access to a relatively freewheeling speech site that
has a diversity of viewpoints.
I don't see anyone saying the ONDCP should be kept from publishing
on the site. There were posts saying that YouTube shouldn't give
special preferences like special formatting and an
exclusive area to the ONDCP messages. Which strikes me as a
pro First Amendment message.
whit|11.24.06 @ 11:34AM|#
People give NORML the money it uses to publicise its
cause.
The government takes the money to publicise its cause.
Get the difference.
Am I a hypocrite for condemning rape because I have sex with my
wife?
Now, if a private organization funded by voluntary donations were
to produce this, I would laugh at them, which is particpating in
the market place of ideas. I certainly wouldn't demand that they be
shut down.. But so long as they take their money by threats of
violence to advocate views I don't agree with, they will get my
calls to shut them down.
The wellfare queens in the various departments of the U.S.
government that are dedicated to the Supression of Vice and
Promotion of Virtue need to get real jobs and off the dole.
|11.24.06 @ 11:35AM|#
Larry, that's a good point. rereading the posts here, i realize you are correct.
|11.24.06 @ 11:35AM|#
it comes down to this . people here don't like youtube
giving a voice to all sides of the debate. nope, youtube is "giving
in" if evul govt propagandists (tm) are given access to a
relatively freewheeling speech site that has a diversity of
viewpoints.
No, YouTube is being criticized not for hosting the video, but for
removing the functions that allow users to comment on or rate the
video, something they do for no other videos on their site.
I am also skeptical that many Americans really believe in a free
marketplace for ideas.
|11.24.06 @ 11:48AM|#
whit, It is not the opinion that bothers me and others. It's that we had to pay for this (someone else's) opinion. Of course, nobodody like their taxes paying for positions that they disagree with. But this is the important question. Do you like your tax dollars spent to make advertisements for positions that you agree with? If the answer is "Fuck NO!, than you've got it right.
|11.24.06 @ 11:56AM|#
[i]"When you give up the ability to decide for yourself...You
give up what makes you, you."[/i]
I wonder if they realize that if we all follow this statement of
individuality to its logical end, the government will cease to
exist.
But I suspect the unspoke caveat to this is that you are perfectly
free to be an individual and make your own decisions, but if your
decisions conflict with the government's, they reserve the right to
kick in your door at 2am and shoot you.
|11.24.06 @ 12:51PM|#
"No, YouTube is being criticized not for hosting the video, but
for removing the functions that allow users to comment on or rate
the video, something they do for no other videos on their
site."
false false false.
i have seen other videos on youtube that have the comment section
removed.
here's a hint. research first, form opinion second
|11.24.06 @ 3:09PM|#
whit,
What about the disappearance of the ratings option? Obviously it
was rated unpopularly, the fascists didn't like it so they had
Youtube remove that option. As if that detracted from the main
point though: It's not free speech because the money to pay for the
ad was taken at gunpoint.
Here's a hint. Capital letter first, lowercase second.
Ventifact|11.24.06 @ 3:49PM|#
Is the ONDP really this stupid? Have they ever seen youtube before? Don't they realize that they only effect of this "strategy" of theirs is that a million spoof videos will show up on the site, further turning popular opinion against drug control?
Lazlo|11.24.06 @ 4:20PM|#
The person uploading a video to YouTube can enable or disable comments, ratings, video responses, and external-site embedding on each and every video they put on the site.
|11.24.06 @ 8:23PM|#
Flagged as inappropriate. It is surely inappropriate that YOUR money which could educate your children or whatever has been confiscated to fund government propaganda. I called it 'hate speech' as 'government theft' wasn't listed. I live elsewhere so did it on behalf of you Americans. Hope you don't mind.
|11.24.06 @ 9:24PM|#
bugmenot used-that's BRILLIANT!!! Maybe it should be marked as
another ToU violation?
"submit material that is obscene, defamatory, libelous,
harassing"
I'd say the ads could be considered some or all of the above. Now,
if they are also "falsehoods or misrepresentations that could
damage YouTube or any third party," there's another violation.
|11.25.06 @ 5:23AM|#
Thanks Adam. You know we Aussies are right behind you in the war (on the war on drugs).
|11.25.06 @ 9:12AM|#
i am glad that the people here finally realized that ANY poster
of a video can remove the comments section, and it has been done by
other than the govt in this case.
that was a false claim on no evidence. not surprising. it was just
assumed.
people need to get real. every govt. in the history of the world i
am aware of has promoted it's official POV, which many here would
refer to as "propaganda". basically, propaganda means a POV or
advocating for a policy that one does not agree with.
every person who pays taxes pays for uses of their money they don't
agree with.
this is a "free speech" issue in the grand "marketplace of ideas
thang". it is correct that youtube, a private company has no
OBLIGATION to accept these videos from the govt. but they CAN and i
am glad they do, even though i disagree with the policies, because
i like an open debate. and an open debate doesn't happen when only
one side is heard.
as i said, the best counter for these videos is for people in
opposition to post their own videos explaining why the policies are
wrong, AND what policies would be better.
the whingers here (adam and bugmenot) are all excited to FLAG these
videos, etc.
yawn.
a much more mature response would be to come up with alternative
videos that show why your ideas are better.
|11.25.06 @ 11:40AM|#
a much more mature response would be to come up with
alternative videos that show why your ideas are better.
Great, I'll get started as soon as I get my government funding.
|11.25.06 @ 12:03PM|#
perfect example of whinging as noted. michael moore (lol) didn't
need govt. funding, nor do most of the people who post to
youtube.
file under... waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah
|11.25.06 @ 2:55PM|#
whit, This thread, and my comments, are about the GOVERNMENT funded, GOVERNMENT produced video. I don't think that you, me, or the guy behind the tree should pay fot it. What is so friggin' hard to understand? It's not even information. It's a political advertisement for the drug warriors. It's an attempt by the government to influence public opinion so they durg warriors can continue their assault on our liberties while lining their own pockets at taxpayer expense. The water temperature just went up one degree. Did you notice it, frog?
thoreau|11.25.06 @ 4:36PM|#
I'm glad that government propaganda is so incredibly ironic. It
makes me wonder if there are some pro-legalization people working
for ONDCP.
We'll know something is fishy when they produce an anti-drug poster
that says "Real Heroes Are Drug-Free!" with a picture of Spider Man
scaling a clock tower to rescue his Mary Jane, while the clock
tower reads 4:20.
|11.25.06 @ 6:07PM|#
"whit, This thread, and my comments, are about the GOVERNMENT
funded, GOVERNMENT produced video. I don't think that you, me, or
the guy behind the tree should pay fot it."
no kidding. i agree that there is tons of stuff the govt. funds
that i don't want to pay for. welcome to a representative
govt.
regardless, if the videos suck so much, then exercise your
creativity and counter them with a better video.
being taxed means the govt. is gonna do lots of stuff with our
money we disagree with. welcome to the real world
damaged justice|11.25.06 @ 7:47PM|#
welcome to a representative govt.
Democracy is
the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.
Such is
your love, such!
|11.25.06 @ 9:24PM|#
I'm wondering if youtube would say no if NORML or the Drug Policy Alliance wanted to post their own videos. And why haven't they yet? Or have they?
eric|11.26.06 @ 1:55AM|#
I watched the first 1-2min of this video so forgive me if it
becomes off topic.
This is a video from BBC that seems to promote legalization quite
well.
Enjoy.
(click my name for the hotlink)
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2908621023073531157&q=legalize+drugs
mgmort|11.26.06 @ 3:43AM|#
[Steve Martin] Now let's repeat the non-conformists' oath: I
promise to be different!
[audience] I promise to be different!
[SM] I promise to be unique!
[audience] I promise to be unique!
[SM] I promise not to repeat things other people say!
[audience] (laughs) I promise not to repeat things other people
say!
[SM] I promise not to depreciate non-taxable items brought forth
from the previous tax year!
[audience] (attempts to repeat and laughs)
--Steve Martin, "A Wild and Crazy Guy" 1978 (the year BEFORE Life
of Brian)
jvon|11.26.06 @ 8:00AM|#
The truly ironic thing is watching 100 "individuals" all posting
messages agreeing with each other.
My position on this? Whatever opinion I have on the effectiveness
of anti-drug commercials is outweighed by my repulsion of a hundred
people bitching about how a company runs a free service.
Don't like it? Don't use it then.
|11.26.06 @ 8:13AM|#
Actually, the best "anti-drug" commercials the Feds could do
would be if they could travel back in time about 30 years to the
druggies I knew back then. Talk about losers and burnouts. Just
show 30 seconds of someone trying to talk to one of them would be
hilarious! More than anything, that would make folks want to NOT do
drugs!
OTOH, the "War on Drugs" is a case of the cure being worse than the
disease. I pray the cops don't kick in my door by mistake some
night, because I will definitely take one of those SOBs down with
me before they kill me.
Mister Snitch!|11.26.06 @ 9:14AM|#
Yes! I want to be a non-conformist, like everyone else!
And, what's all this about porn?
|11.26.06 @ 11:03AM|#
no kidding. i agree that there is tons of stuff the govt.
funds that i don't want to pay for. welcome to a representative
govt.
Perhaps you were sleeping in the portion of U.S. Government 101
when the topic of enumerated powers was brought up. Perhaps you
ignored it. You certainly did'nt get it.
|11.26.06 @ 11:54AM|#
Make that ...topics of enumerated powers and limited government. It better explains where I'm coming from.
|11.26.06 @ 3:22PM|#
Would Youtube allow postings of extensive descriptions of
how to make meth?
Recipes are readily available for meth, acid and God only knows
what else, on the internet. Google to your hearts content. Whether
YouTube would allow it, I haven't a clue.
high.five|11.26.06 @ 3:44PM|#
"When you give up the ability to decide for yourself...You
give up what makes you, you."
Ranks right up there with:
"Don't ever (!), ever(!), let a woman ... ... make you what you
are."
Warren|11.26.06 @ 4:06PM|#
My position on this? Whatever opinion I have on the
effectiveness of anti-drug commercials is outweighed by my
repulsion of a hundred people bitching about how a company runs a
free service.
Don't like it? Don't use it then.
Ah huh, OK how about this? Suppose the Gubmnt was producing
commercials about how the Jews owned all the banks, or the lazy
niggers were having more kids to collect more welfare, or the
Mexicans took R yobs?
Believing in free speech means YouTube (and everybody else for that
matter) has the right to say repulsive things. That doesn't mean
they're any less dickheads for saying them. Or in this case, for
bending over for the man (who doesn't enjoy the same rights to free
speech when he's spending my money)
M. Simon|11.26.06 @ 5:28PM|#
The idea of "addiction" is
superstition.
We are acting like a South Pacific tribe enforcing tribal taboos.
Buying protection against the drug demon with the lives of
innocents. All gussied up to look like science. "Addiction" is
science. Cargo cult science.
|11.27.06 @ 4:24PM|#
"Am I a hypocrite for condemning rape because I have sex with my
wife?"
Andrea Dworkin says: yes.
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