Open Thread

What’s on your mind?

Comments

[Kazinski]

Elon got a big win yesterday

"The Delaware Supreme Court has restored a massive pay package awarded to Tesla CEO Elon Musk in 2018 that had twice been voided by a lower court judge.

The package awarded Musk the option to purchase 303 million split-adjusted shares, a package worth $139 billion at Friday’s closing share price. Delaware Chancery Court Chancellor Kathaleen McCormick, who oversaw the bench, had found that even though Tesla shareholders twice approved the compensation plan, the size of the package was unfair to shareholders."

Delaware is losing enough revenue to affect their budget, and perhaps have to raise taxes because corporations don't trust their judges anymore, this probably isn't going to help much, but its something.

https://www.cnn.com/2025/12/19/business/musk-pay-package-latest

[Stephen Lathrop]

Probably is unfair to the vast majority of shareholders. A lot of what happens in per-share voting corporations is unfair to the vast majority of shareholders.

But they are stuck, aren't they? At least until shareholding, corporate governance, and American politics get reformed to run on democratic principles. Until that happens, a corporate manager who may own no shares at all can expend corporate assets at pleasure, to meddle with political processes, legal processes, and the economy, on behalf of the interests of oligarchs. The manger typically will not even tell the majority of shareholders what the manager is doing with their money, or what political outcomes the shareholders' money was spent to effect.

Given a system of corporate governance designed to support that outcome, it is probably reasonable for the highest courts to compel the others to go along. It does seem peculiar to me, however, that in a case of this type, the Delaware Chancery Court does not get ultimate jurisdiction, given the subject matter.

Of course I am in over my head to be commenting on this subject, just as Kazinski is. I would have thought Kazinski's implication that the Delaware Chancellery Court was rightly overruled would have been more frightening to corporations than otherwise.

[Kazinski]

"It does seem peculiar to me, however, that in a case of this type, the Delaware Chancery Court does not get ultimate jurisdiction, given the subject matter."

Because the Delaware Constitution gives the Delaware Supreme Court Jurisdiction?

The board voted for the pay package, and the shareholders approved it twice.

And they likely had good reasons, Elon has his Tesla stock already, he can spend all his time on other ventures if he thinks he can make more money on them. He owns 42% of SpaceX which could go public next year for as much as 1.5 trillion, he could decide to work full time on that since it could make him another half a trillion. That seems worth his time.

He could spend more time working on x.AI (originally Twitter) he spent 40 billion on that, now its only worth 200 billion, because he built a very competitive AI.

[Stephen Lathrop]

Kazinski — Question begging and question answering. How are they different?

Hint: The Supreme Court is fully empowered to defer to the Chancery Court. Right? So on what basis? And why is it reassuring to Delaware corporations if the Supreme Court overrides the Chancery Court?

Seems like the only issue that interests you is cheerleading for Musk.

[Mr. Bumble]

Maybe they take seriously the idea of being "Supreme".

[Stephen Lathrop]

Bumble — Why would you suppose being supreme would even make them more likely to overrule the Chancery Court, let alone require them to do so?

Also, since you bumbled in, why does a Delaware Supreme Court which overrules the Delaware Chancery Court improve the corporate outlook to incorporate in Delaware? That is what Kazinski said would happen. I thought the Delaware Chancery Court had something to do with why corporations like Delaware.

[Mr. Bumble]

Simple answer is because the Chancery Court judge got it badly wrong. Her thinking on the matter sounds like that of PBJ in her dissents at the US Supreme Court.

[ThePublius]

"I thought the Delaware Chancery Court had something to do with why corporations like Delaware."

Fewer and fewer corporations like Delaware, as is evidenced the trend called 'Dexit.' Many companies have left to incorporate elsewhere, like Nevada, Texas, Florida, and so on. The unpredictability of the legal environment is one of the key reasons.

[Malika la Maize]

Despite Musk’s proclamation that “Delaware continues to bleed companies,” those departing the state make up a distinct minority.

According to the Delaware secretary of state’s office, only 28 companies have deincorporated from the state this year. Meanwhile, as of the end of September, 249,214 new entities were formed in Delaware this year, an increase of 14% from the same period in 2024, the data show.

https://www.cnbc.com/2025/11/14/despite-coinbase-departure-only-28-companies-left-delaware-this-year.html#:~:text=According%20to%20the%20Delaware%20secretary,in%202024%2C%20the%20data%20show.

[Mr. Bumble]

That's a lot of "entities". Has Hunter been busy creating more Biden family shell companies?

[Malika la Maize]

More like Kushner and the lesser Trumps?

[ThePublius]

That's rather silly, to count companies, or entities. You and I could both establish Delaware corporations, but that's not going to balance out companies like Tesla, SpaceX, Coinbase, Dropbox, Roblox, and Meta leaving. This is a real issue for Delaware.

"Delaware has long been the preferred state of incorporation for corporations due to its business friendly legal framework, its specialized Court of Chancery, and its well-developed and unified body of corporate law. However, recent news suggests that corporations are reconsidering their allegiance to the state.[1] Recent changes in regulatory policies, controversial judicial decisions, and tax implications have prompted a significant number of companies to seek incorporation elsewhere.[2] As a result, many believe that Delaware’s “monopoly” over corporate incorporation seems to be showing early signs of collapse. This blog post explores the factors driving this potential corporate exodus and its implications."
Delaware’s Corporate Crack-Up: The “Great” Business Exodus and Its Legal Fallout - Fordham Journal of Corporate and Financial Law

[Sarcastr0]

"reconsidering"
"many believe"
"seems to be showing"
"potential corporate exodus"

The weasel word density in your excerpt is very high.

[Malika la Maize]

What’s silly is for Musk to say bleeding companies when the reality was 28.

[jb]

The Delaware Francine Tax is a minimum of $175 and a maximum of $250k, so 250k new small entities and 28 fewer big companies means that the new small entities are providing something like 200 times the tax revenue as the big ones that are leaving.

So no, a few big companies leaving isn't a problem for Delaware at all.

[Life of Brian]

so 250k new small entities and 28 fewer big companies means that the new small entities are providing something like 200 times the tax revenue as the big ones that are leaving.

This goes far beyond tax revenue. Business-related litigation is a major state industry, and those disputes disproportionately tilt toward larger companies per the Willie Sutton rule.

[bernard11]

I think you are falling for the fallacy of the magic CEO.

Sure, he did a lot for these companies, but to attribute all their success to his efforts is just silly.

I know shareholders approved the package but shareholder votes are almost as meaningless as board votes. It's mostly the very large shareholders - mutual fund companies and the like, who normally vote with management and don't reflect the views of their shareholders.

Besides, Musk himself owns about 12% of the company. That's a pretty big leg up in the voting.

Yes, it's all legal, but it's still bullshit.

[Armchair]

Let's be honest here. Musk is very very good. A difference maker. He's like the Tom Brady of CEO's. Sure, there's the rest of the team. But in a competitive market, having a Tom Brady versus anyone else is a massive difference maker.

In the US, besides Tesla, you have VW, Ford, GM, and Rivian for major players in the EV market.

Tesla's market cap exceeds all of the competitors. Combined. Does Tesla do that without Musk? Unlikely. No one else could even come close.

[David Nieporent]

Does Tesla do that without Musk? Unlikely. No one else could even come close.

Look, I'm not going to say that it's wrong. I'm going to say, "how could you possibly know that?" What's even the premise of the claim? What decisions do you contend that Musk made wrt Tesla that were the "difference maker"?

[Armchair]

There's an old saying. "Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. Three times is enemy action".

What that generally means is "once" could just be luck. "Twice"...exceptional luck. "Three times"...and there's really something there.

Musk has done it three times. Pay Pal. Tesla. SpaceX. There's really something there.

[Bwaaah]

Pay Pal. Tesla. SpaceX.

wow

[Kazinski]

X.AI is the baby of the bunch at 200 million valuation.

And don't forget he helped start Open AI with a 1 billion commitment when it was a non-profit.

[Sarcastr0]

Let's be honest here
You have no idea if anything you've said is true. We don't know the counterfactual. We don't know if it was his connections with the government, or if it's inherent management talent, or if he is lucky.

It's wild to here the folks that (correctly) argue EV's are a nonviable market, and therefore (incorrectly) deserve no subsidies and then argue but Tesla is different.

Number bigger does not mean company is different. It's got the same problems. Maybe more-so, given how it's pivoted from marketing it's shrinking car sales into moonshit stuff like Mars robots and robotaxies.

Opinions can differ on him, but the excuses certain people make for him remind me of the same excused the same people make for Trump.

Whether Messianic CEO or President Can Fix It, some people just yearn to be ruled by their betters.

[DDHarriman]

>It's wild to here the folks that (correctly) argue EV's are a nonviable market, and therefore (incorrectly) deserve no subsidies and then argue but Tesla is different.

That's not the argument you pathetic liar. Have you ever once fairly represented the other sides argument?

[TwelveInchPianist]

"You have no idea if anything you've said is true. We don't know the counterfactual."

We can't know, but we can make educated guesses. And when different people have different guesses, they make different investment decisions.

So it's not that "some people just yearn to be ruled by their betters," it's as mundane as people want the companies they invest in to be run by people that they think will do a good job. Or that people want Presidents who they think will do a good job.

[Armchair]

"You have no idea if anything you've said is true. "

I do. I said "Tesla's market cap exceeds all of the competitors. Combined. "

That's true. Look it up. You don't know, because you don't know the facts. You assert without knowing. I don't.

[Bwaaah]

As you (Armchair) noted: "Pay Pal. Tesla. SpaceX."

Add Sarcastr0's doubts. He aspires to personify his own insignificance, and he succeeds.

[Kazinski]

But the whole point is shouldn't the shareholders opinion count most of all?

Its their opinion, repeatedly expressed, the Chancery court countermanded, which the Delaware Supreme Court said they lacked the authority to do.

[bernard11]

It's possible to be very very good without one's efforts being worth $139 Billion.

[JohnSmith97]

Confused about the difference between stock price and actually having the cash?

[bernard11]

I'm not confused about anything except the point you are trying to make.

[Riva]

I would think that a decision signaling that Delaware courts would respect board and shareholder decisions is obviously beneficial for Delaware’s position as a preferred state of incorporation. The really crazy thing is Tesla’s share value. In a sane world it would be trading a little over $30 a share.

[David Nieporent]

It does seem peculiar to me, however, that in a case of this type, the Delaware Chancery Court does not get ultimate jurisdiction, given the subject matter.

TF? What do you think "Supreme" means, exactly?

[Magister]

Highest state court in Delaware, but I learned last year that in New York it does not mean the highest state court.

[Bored Lawyer]

It means highest everywhere but New York. NY is special.

[David Nieporent]

At least until shareholding, corporate governance, and American politics get reformed to run on democratic principles.

This is just gibberish. You and I and Kazinski decide to start a business together. I put in $50,000; Kazinski puts in $25,000; you put in $1,000. And you think we should each get the same vote on corporate affairs?

[DDHarriman]

They think capitalists should be no vote and only the workers they hired should get the say so. You know? The ones who never took any risk.

[Magister]

If you and Kazinski put in $25,000 each and then colluded to screw over the other 49 investors of $1000 each, that would make the stock market a place for connected rich people only in the same way that insider trading would make it a place for insiders only. More democracy in American politics would be welcome; right now billionaires have a lot of power to buy elections.

[TwelveInchPianist]

"And you think we should each get the same vote on corporate affairs?

Hey! How come I don't get a vote?!?

[bernard11]

This is just gibberish. You and I and Kazinski decide to start a business together. I put in $50,000; Kazinski puts in $25,000; you put in $1,000. And you think we should each get the same vote on corporate affairs?

You make a fair point, but this is a stick-figure analysis.

First, notably, the board, which generally collectively holds a large number of shares is largely picked by management tends not to risk their cushy positions by defying the CEO.

This is particularly true of Tesla, where the director compensation has been enormous.

In addition there are the institutional holders, primarily, Vanguard, Blackrock, and State Street, with roughly 15% of the shares. It is well known that these companies routinely vote with management, in order to maintain their relationships and access to the company. Note that the votes of investment companies do not in fact necessarily reflect the views of the actual shareholders.

So the idea that all is well because the shareholders approved the package is a bit dubious.

Tesla may be an extreme case

[David Nieporent]

So the idea that all is well because the shareholders approved the package is a bit dubious.

To be clear, I was not discussing this specific situation, but rather Lathrop's general idea about business structure.

[Commenter_XY]

Elon well on the way to becoming the first trillionaire.

[Sarcastr0]

He's also retweeting and funding white nationalists. Which in Europe means plenty of antisemitism.

That's no reason for people on here not to follow him like ducklings, through!

[Frank Drackman]

C'mon (Man!) don't tease us, tell us he's "Literally" the H-word

[DDHarriman]

White nationalists? Oh no! The government must immediately swoop in with censorship and ban opposition parties to save Sacred Democracy!! This is a bigger crisis than Global Warming, Global Cooling, Climate Change, George Floyd, White Supremacy, Gay Rights, Trans Rights, Carbon Zero, Illegals Free Shit, and ICE!!!

Everyone P-A-N-I-C!!!

[Magister]

Come on, it's not like Musk has given Nazi salutes or anything.

[not guilty]

Here is the Delaware Supreme Court opinion: https://courts.delaware.gov/Opinions/Download.aspx?id=389200

I haven't read it yet, but it is always useful to have original source materials.

[Internet sloth]

I used to think "leadership" was all bull, but with more life experience it appears to take real talent to pick the right goals. Musk appears to be really good at picking the right goals, which is a valuable skill.

[Kazinski]

The US seized another tanker filled.with Venezuelan oil, this one had not been previously sanctioned.

"The US has seized an oil tanker that had recently departed from Venezuela, according to the US Department of Homeland Security.

It is the second time this month that the US has seized an oil-carrying ship off the country's coast.

The move comes after US President Donald Trump said on Tuesday that he was ordering a "blockade" of sanctioned oil tankers entering and leaving Venezuela.

The Centuries is a Panamanian-flagged ship, but in the past five years it has also sailed under the flags of Greece and Liberia, according to records seen by BBC Verify.

It is not on the US Treasury's list of sanctioned vessels."

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c0mpy1ynnzzo

[Dr. Ed 2]

More interesting is the Ukrainians attacking a tanker -- this one empty. how long before they start shooting at full ones?

How sinkable is a supertanker?

A torpedo works because of the density of the water behind it, but if there is almost the same density in oil inside it, it's going to lack the ability to rip the ship open.

[Absaroka]

"A torpedo works because of the density of the water behind it, but if there is almost the same density in oil inside it, it's going to lack the ability to rip the ship open."

I have long wondered why in WWII laden tankers were so impervious to torpedo attack!

[Dr. Ed 2]

Ummmm -- they were much smaller and carrying distillates, mostly gasoline. See: https://petroleumservicecompany.com/blog/oil-barrel-42-gallon-breakdown/

You have much more inertia with a much larger volume of a heavier liquid.

[Kazinski]

Hard to sink a tanker, unless its on fire, but it can certainly be disabled and damaged enough so it can't proceed to its destination.

What more does Ukraine need to meet its objective of disrupting Russia's oil revenue and deterring tankers from carrying it?

[Armchair]

I look forward to Panama using naval force to protect its flagged vessels.

[Kazinski]

Toronto Sun is reporting surprising news, well certainly surprising to me, Mark Carney isn't a complete idiot:

"Sometimes policy change is necessitated by reality. The welcome new entente cordiale between Ottawa and Alberta, fast tracking new energy developments, marks a pleasant example.

This is all the more remarkable since Prime Minister Mark Carney, was once a leading voice against fossil fuels; as head of the Bank of England, he led the charge for banks to bankroll the much-ballyhooed transition to renewables. Yet a decade later, he appears to have shifted from a “net-zero” crusader to seeking to become “an energy superpower.”

What changed? This corresponds to the global weakening of climate hysteria. As Matt Ridley noted recently in the Spectator, extreme claims of an imminent collapse of humanity, so promoted by the likes of Greta Thunberg and groups like Extinction Rebellion, have lost their credibility on everything from sea-level rise to imminent mass starvation."

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/joel-kotkin-carney-faces-reality-110049842.html

[Stephen Lathrop]

Kazinski — Thunberg is not in charge of measuring the disappearance of the Greenland ice sheet. Where do you think that water is going?

What do you think is in it for you to lie again and again about plainly evident environmental disruptions?

[Mr. Bumble]

I thought Thunberg has moved on to important stuff like blockade running.

[Davedave]

Thunberg and Kazinski are two sides of the same climate-science-denial coin. Kazinski doesn't accept the science showing serious impacts, and Greta doesn't accept the science showing things aren't as bad as she'd like. Both are useful idiots of the far right.

[Mr. Bumble]

Your "climate-science-denial coin" is worth as much as the now extinct penny.

[DDHarriman]

"We really are going extinct from climate change, just not right now!" Is his parse. lol

[Davedave]

And here, folks, we see displayed the difference between a useful idiot and the old-fashioned kind.

[Frank Drackman]

Which one are you?

[Drewski]

Hear, hear.

[Kazinski]

I accept the science that shows major benefits, like greening of the earth, and higher crop yields.

I do accept that there has been modest warming, but I don't accept that they can measure the average temperature of the earth to a hundredth of a degree, perhaps or that there is even an meaningful average temperature of the earth. Probably a more reasonable error bar would be .5 degrees, and even that is effected by UHI which is a completely different phenomenon than GHG.

But mostly my skepticism is due to the fact that our current climate is still in an ice age which is way cooler than the earth's "normal" climate just looking at the last 1% of Earth's existence.

The hysteria bubble has popped.

[ThePublius]

Great, let's have the climate change debate on here again.

Lathrop:
- Anyone who disagrees with me is a liar (even if they are just quoting an article);
- support for my position is self evident.

Very 'scientific' of you.

[Sarcastr0]

In actual climate science news, not political tribalism, there's been an interesting switch away from the assumptions of the 2010s, due to a paper put out in 2020 (https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.2017124117).

Basically, the leading model for most of the 2010s, known as 'Representative Concentration Pathway 8.5' made assumptions about coal use that haven't panned out. It assumed essentially no mitigation. But in reality, the world did a lot more work on renewables than that assumption.

Adoption of less pessimistic models has not been immediate, but most climate scientists have switched over.

Unless you're full on 'everyone who studies climate science is in bad faith because I don't understand how grants work' this is a great example of scientific progress.

A great and short summary of things:
https://www.podbean.com/media/share/dir-bxpaw-297cebfe

[ThePublius]

I'm not sure what you're getting at. Are you saying the world is burning less coal for electricity generation now than in 2010? Because that's not so.

[Sarcastr0]

Check out the podcast - it's like 10 minutes long. It does a better job than I will in writing my interpretation of it.

What's happening is that the world is burning materially less coal than if no mitigation policies were in place.

[ThePublius]

Perhaps I will listen when I have a chance. But I think you're mistaken that "the world is burning materially less coal than if no mitigation policies were in place." Unless I misinterpret you. The use of coal is increasing over time. Maybe you're saying it would be increasing even faster save the mitigation?

[Davedave]

RCP 8.5 was intended to illustrate (roughly) the worst-possible scenario. It showed what would happen if, among other things, fossil fuel usage grew rapidly. Among other things, it includes high population growth, low wealth generation, no efficiency gains, and absolutely zero mitigation via adoption of renewables.

It is absolutely unsurprising that we are well under RCP8.5 As far as I remember, RCP 4.5 is the one that all sensible informed people thought likely to be the better ball-park estimate of realistic future emissions growth - though, again, it should be stressed that the RCPs were not _predictions_, they were scenarios chosen to illustrate what the science showed were likely results of different future emissions levels.

[Joe_dallas]

A - There is no legitimate dispute that the earth is going through a warming phase for the last 150 or so years.
B - there is little (or no dispute ) that co2 is playing a part in some of the warming.
C - there is a legitimate dispute as to how much of the warming is due to greenhouse gases

However, the use of junk science greatly undercuts the validity of good science. The use of 8.5 RCP is just one of the many examples of junk science in the field of climate science. Climate scientists have allowed pseudo sciences masquarating as scientists. 8.5 rcp was always a joke

[SRG2]

What other causes do you think are contributing to warming?

[bernard11]

As Davedave says:

the RCPs were not _predictions_, they were scenarios chosen to illustrate what the science showed were likely results of different future emissions levels.

[Davedave]

SRG>

Joe's talking points are well-phrased to sound like 'climate change is bollocks' without straying into actual denial - he's clearly been fed his stuff by some of the cleverer deniers.

A is obviously true.
B is also obviously true. But CO2 is not the only greenhouse gas, and there are complex feedback loops. What Joe's talking point attempts to gloss over is that all of the other primary causes are _also_ human-related - methane emissions from farming, for example.
C is also true, but only in the most limited sense. There is always scientific debate as our knowledge evolves, but the debate is about the digits after the decimal point, so to speak - we know the primary cause is human emission of greenhouse gases, but we can debate how much of the actual warming is due to primary causes, how much to feedbacks, and, precisely how very insignificant the few other (positive and negative) contributors are.

[Joe_dallas]

SRG2 2 hours ago
" What other causes do you think are contributing to warming?"

In response to SGR, Dave etc

A - Very simply - far too much is unknown to know what other factors are contributing to the warming.
B - The quality of the paleo reconstructions should give any honest scientists some pause to reflect on the science.
C - Dave's response to my comment C , along with his original defense of RCP 8.5 shows that he has become nothing more than the typical mouthpiece for the non scientific advocates.
D - Dave and SRG fail to recognize the significant amounts of junk science intermingled with climate science and thus fail to see what would be characterized as shortcomings in the climate science. The frequency of the junk science intermingled through out climate science should raise some questions, yet advocates such Dave and SRG worship the science.

The problems with agenda driven science came to the forefront with the covid science, yet the lessons which should have been learned have been ignored.

[Davedave]

And now Joe attempts to elaborate, he demonstrates his utter lack of understanding even of what he said, let alone of climate science.

[Joe_dallas]

Dave - fails to notice the extensive junk science intermingled through climate science .

Dave - can you attempt to distinquish the differences or are you even capable of recognizing the junk science.

Dave - Have you bothered to explore the epistemic errors or the aleatory errors in the paleo arena?

Dave - Have your bothered to explore the epistemic errors or the aleatory errors in the attribution studies that claim co2 is the primary driver of the current warming?

Come back with any studies that have properly taken those factors into account (or any study that has even attempted to account for those errors).

[Davedave]

Ah, and now Joe's back to regurgitating stuff he's been told is persuasive, but doesn't understand.

[Joe_dallas]

Dave - in other words - you cant come back with any studies that properly address the aleatory or epistemic errors. Key components of scientific studies used to determine confidence levels and the validity of the studies. Like most zealots, you just demonstrated you cant even recognize the shortcomings as an issue.

[Davedave]

No, Joe, we've demonstrated that some of us have a clue, you don't even have a timeshare on a brain cell of your own, and that you're regurgitating nonsense you don't understand.

[Joe_dallas]

Davedave 52 minutes ago
"No, Joe, we've demonstrated that some of us have a clue,"

Dave - you have only demonstrated that you are a zealot.

There remains considerable debate as to all the causes of the current warming and as to whether the warming is outside the historical range. In spite of the multitude of junk science intermingled with the good science, you fail to notice, much less recognize the isssues. I at least recognize the science is not settled with far too much unknown.

[Dr. Ed 2]

The glaciers are still retreating -- there *was* a couple of miles of ice over Boston at one point.

[Magister]

The glaciers are still retreating -- there *was* a couple of miles of ice over Boston at one point.

Sure, but that was before America fought back during President Gore's second term.

[Kazinski]

Just about every scary headline we've read over the last 10 years was based of flawed that not only used RCP 8.5, but then exaggerated its effects to by using unrealistic positive feedback parameters.

[Joe_dallas]

As stated - There is a lot of junk science intermingled through Climate science (quite a bit of climate science is good science, there is just a lot of junk science the advocates push) . Yet, the SRG's and Dave's of the world, not only fail to recognize the junk but instead chose to worship the junk science.

[Bwaaah]

He's saying that one of the climate models is being adjusted to adapt to overly pessimistic estimates of CO2 emissions. Generally speaking, that's not news. Models are being continually adjusted, and are of dubious predictive value.

But why does Sarc repeat it? Probably to say something like, "Here's a piece of science that goes your way, implying that climate science is balanced. And that's why you should have confidence in climate science."

Mind you, climate modeling, though a useful exercise for some, is a noisy, often wrong and/or imprecise, always self-reinforcing instrument of prediction subject to substantial political uncertainty, complex inter-dependent variables of which we have varied levels of understanding, and overall, substantial imprecision.

Sarc is making a little more of a little less because We're Destroying Our Environment™ and he's on Team Rah-Rah.

[Malika la Maize]

Climate science is complicated! Thanks for that insight. Some might think that’s a good reason to defer on it to the people and agencies with the most education, experience and expertise on the subject, but YMMV as a totes recently disaffected liberal.

[Davedave]

"the leading model for most of the 2010s, known as 'Representative Concentration Pathway 8.5'"

This was never 'the leading model'. It was one of the illustrative pathways set out in the IPCC report as part of the explanation of what the accepted models showed, and never expected to be what actually occurred. Though climate science deniers - both of the 'it isn't happening, the only solution is to kill the Jews' variety found on these pages, and 'the sky is falling, the only solution is to kill the darkies' variety exemplified by Greta Thunberg - pretended it was an actual prediction.

[Stephen Lathrop]

ThePublius — Do not characterize my commentary if you pay no attention to it. I have insisted again and again that it is a likely mistake to invoke, "science," on behalf of future climate predictions. My message has been consistent: the future is unknown, and climate too complicated, to justify, "scientific," claims on behalf of so-called climate models. Nor are such claims needed. Because baleful changes are already indisputably evident on the basis of commonplace observations, such as glacial retreat, melting icecaps, thawing permafrost, and chemical changes in the oceans and the atmosphere. All those are either self-evident under casual examination, or simple to measure and indisputable.

Oh, and by the way. Nieporent disagrees with me all the time on climate stuff, ecological stuff, and even questions of elementary geology and hydrology. Nieporent is not, however, lying. He is inexperienced with those subjects, cannot tell which are amenable to slightly-informed observation, and which might require technical expertise. Nieporent would do better to restrain himself, but that is not a culpable failing.

[DDHarriman]

Oh Kazinski, I guarantee you the bootlickers around here are still deathly afraid of Climate Change and are still begging for a corporate+government social credit like carbon system for individuals.

[Frank Drackman]

Regular Gas 87 Octane $2.07/Gallon in Atlanta yesterday Premium $2.47 (my Vette gets the good stuff) adjusted for inflation it’s the same as 1964.

Frank

[Mr. Bumble]

...meanwhile, thanks to refinery closures, Californian's are facing $8-$10 /gallon prices.

[Frank Drackman]

"facing"?? OK, I guess you aren't saying that's what they are now, "Gas Buddy" is showing Regular Unleaded as low as $3.47/gal in San Fran Sissy Co (Probably because of all the Sissy's riding Bikes) lets see what it is in a real City, like Fresno......
$3.58 (try calling one of the many Vato Locos there a Sissy and see how many pieces they cut you up into)
Of course that means Gas is 67% more expensive in CA than GA, loved how the Marxist-Stream Media thought they had a "Gotcha" (their 965,856th since 2015) with "45/47" using percentages incorrectly, when it was THEY who don't understand the concepts of >100% (Yes, it is possible to give %110)

Frank

[Mr. Bumble]

FWIW:
https://gasprices.aaa.com/?state=CA

[jb]

So... gas in California is cheaper today than yesterday, a week ago, a month ago, and a year ago? Definitely sounds like it's on its way to $8!

[Life of Brian]

You can at least start to tease out the broader momentum by comparing the YoY delta in CA (a penny down) to the national average (19 cents down).

But more importantly, one of the two refineries is closing this month and the other this coming April. Today's prices aren't going to reflect that upcoming constricted supply.

I doubt $8 is realistic--at least in the short haul--but it's certainly going to get a lot worse unless and until the environmentalistocracy starts to lose its chokehold on the state.

[jb]

I posted a pretty interesting analysis of this earlier in the week when Bumble last brought this up. He found the one sentence saying it would possibly increase prices a lot and ignored the rest of the analysis about ways the impact would likely be softened. One of them was indeed revisiting the California blend requirements, since it's less clear they're needed now with modern cars.

[Life of Brian]

Ah, missed that. If gasoline becomes 50-state fungible, that should help a great deal. Was it more of an academic piece, or did it look like there was a realistic path?

[jb]

Here it is:

https://energyathaas.wordpress.com/2025/08/18/californias-refinery-closure-drama/

It's all pretty academic/speculative, but a lot better than the analyses that just assume the refinery capacity goes away and nothing else changes (or that assume additional supply disruptions on top of the loss of refinery capacity, like the analysis that Bumble probably saw to get to his $8 number.)

Worth noting, though, that the West Coast is relatively isolated from the rest of the country in terms of fuel distribution, so the fact that the fuel blend might become fungible helps less than it otherwise might. Still, the fuel blend itself adds a decent amount of expense so removing those requirements would reduce cost separate from the supply/demand issues.

[NvEric]

There's a state tax of around 85 cents per gallon.

[Dr. Ed 2]

It's not just refinery closures.

The US military now runs everything on jet fuel "in theater" so that they have only one fuel to supply. By contrast, California has all kinds of both winter and summer blends and different switchover dates, all of which have to be segregated from each other creating a logistical nightmare which inherently increases prices. See https://www.energy.ca.gov/sites/default/files/2020-09/2020-09_Petroleum_Watch_ADA.pdf

Not only are these blends more expensive to make, but it is like a restaurant cooking 30 different versions of scrambled eggs, on 30 different grills, with 30 different cooks, etc....

[Commenter_XY]

As we come to the close of Hanukah...The Epstein files: so how have we been enlightened thusfar?

Here is just a partial list:

Prince Andrew really is a scumbag; Charles is right to banish him
Yes, Bill Clinton really is/was a Horn Dog who liked them young
Larry Summers is a slimy POS, so are Ehud Barak, and Jose Aznar
David Copperfield is a sick SOB, and so is Bill Gates

Quite honestly, The Donald is not unscathed. POTUS Trump needs better friends, and he has some explaining to do. The only saving grace for POTUS Trump is he banished Epstein from Mar-A-Lago years ago, and is now releasing the files (his predecessors, notably, did not release the files).

As for the blurb that inclusion doesn't imply wrongdoing: horseshit. The people who were there were not there by accident. At the very least, they are guilty of exceptionally poor judgment (which is not a crime). These people need a public reckoning.

[Mr. Bumble]

...and so far Epstein is dead (he didn't kill himself) and Maxwell is the only person prosecuted and in prison.

[Frank Drackman]

Funny that Barry Hussein, Barney Frank, Cory Booker, and Linsday Buckingham-Nicks-Graham aren't mentioned, I wonder if there's some common denominator there?

[DDHarriman]

lol

[Davedave]

"As for the blurb that inclusion doesn't imply wrongdoing: horseshit. The people who were there were not there by accident. At the very least, they are guilty of exceptionally poor judgment (which is not a crime)."

There are the ones like the Andrew formerly known as Prince, who were close friends of Epstein, including after his conviction, who must have known what was going on, and then there are the many, many people who were vaguely associated with Epstein at one time or another. Having met him in passing is not problematic or a sign of poor judgment. Epstein's business - not the paedophile stuff, his money-making activities - was all about making contacts and schmoozing people, and he was photographed with just about every prominent person under the sun.

[Joe_dallas]

fwiw - I would suspect that everyone in his circle knew he was a pedophile along with many of his business associates. Likely an open secret. So yes, Trump likely knew he as a pedophile, and of course , clinton both knew and participated.

[Malika la Maize]

“and of course , clinton both knew and participated.”

Proof?

[Joe_dallas]

proof - did you fail to see the released pics?

proof - did you fail to see the reports of clinton on the flight logs?

[Malika la Maize]

Link to the flight logs and pictures that provide proof for your claim.

[Joe_dallas]

Why should I do homework for you when what I stated is all over the web?

[Malika la Maize]

So you’ve produced nothing to back up your claim. Glad we straightened that out.

[Joe_dallas]

dont be lazy and live in your bubble

google
"clinton photos with epstein"

google
Clinton photos in epstein swimming pool

[Malika la Maize]

So you’ve produced nothing to back up your claim. Glad we straightened that out.

[CountmontyC]

Here you go.

https://www.politico.com/news/2025/12/19/trump-world-takes-shots-at-favorite-boogeyman-bill-clinton-in-epstein-file-dump-00701780

[Malika la Maize]

That link has a picture of Clinton sitting with a woman and in a hot tub with a woman. That’s of course not proof the he was having pedophiliac sex with either. I mean, here’s a picture of Trump with his daughter, is it proof that he slept with her?

https://www.yahoo.com/news/articles/fact-check-photo-trump-daughter-130000718.html

[CountmontyC]

Malika
"WHATABOUT TRUMP!!!!!"

[bernard11]

What strikes me about those four pictures is, "Is that the worst they have on Clinton?"

And if those are as damning as some of you claim, would you be prepared to criticize Trump equally on the basis of similar pictures of him?

And do think Trump never put his arm around women, or went into a hot tub, or associated with Epstein?

[Malika la Maize]

That’s not whataboutism ya goof, it’s an example of what you’d have to accept in making the ridiculous conclusion jd (and I guess you) make on the evidence proffered. If a picture of Clinton with a young woman sitting on his lap is proof of pedophilia then what is a picture of Trump with his teen daughter on his lap proof of?

[Joe_dallas]

Malika wants to blame others for his ignorance. Everyone else is up to speed.

[Malika la Maize]

The only ignorance is yours regarding logic. I’ll repeat: If a picture of Clinton with a young woman sitting on his lap is proof of pedophilia then what is a picture of Trump with his teen daughter on his lap proof of?

[Davedave]

I would imagine it's true that all of his friends knew, but I would also imagine that lots of people who knew him didn't know, because they never met him in that context.

"and of course , clinton both knew and participated."

Cuckoo!

I don't know how mad you have to be to think Clinton - I assume you mean Bill - _cared_ about what he was getting jiggy with enough to screw children. The man would stick his dick into wet cement.

[Joe_dallas]

Repeating my response to Malika - some stuff should have been obvious - but not to Malika, not to Dave

proof - did you fail to see the released pics?

proof - did you fail to see the reports of clinton on the flight logs?

[David Nieporent]

What do you think "flight logs" show, incompetent/dishonest bookkeeper_joe? Nothing other than that he flew on Epstein's plane. Which nobody "failed to see" because that's been known for like 10 years. What also nobody except you "failed to see" is that he didn't fly to Epstein's island.

[SRG2]

Lots of redactions, minimal new releasing, plenty of deflection - as predicted.

[jb]

Also it seems like they're taking down some of that Trump-related content and inserting some pictures of Democrats that are obviously unrelated to Epstein.

But what do we expect from this administration?

[Drewski]

MeidasTouch is reporting they redacted Trump's name from a document that is publicly available unredacted. Undoubtedly because he says he's a victim, and they have to redact victims' names.

[Estragon]

It’s two versions of the same thing, filed at different times. Both in the dump, both old, and seen publicly before.

[David Nieporent]

The only saving grace for POTUS Trump is he … is now releasing the files (his predecessors, notably, did not release the files).

This is like praising Jefferson Davis for freeing the slaves.

[Alpheus W Drinkwater]

Praising Hitler for killing Hitler

[Commenter_XY]

You do have a way with words, David. LOL.

[Mr. Bumble]

Happy first day of Winter.

[Frank Drackman]

Or Summer for the other 1/2, the Earth is round (so they say).

[Malika la Maize]

“Twenty-eight thousand people die a year from a snake bite, a certain snake,” President Trump falsely claimed. “It’s a viper, right? It’s said to be the most poisonous snake in the world.”

Trump rambled on: “The chances of living from that snake are substantially less than 1 percent and that’s only if you have the [anti]venom. Even if you have the [anti]venom you don’t live.”

To set the record straight: Snakebites in Peru do occur, but the incidences and resulting death toll is nowhere close to tens of thousands.

Using health-service notifications compiled across the Americas, one peer-reviewed analysis estimated that about 2,150 snakebites per year in Peru were treated in health facilities during 2000–2015, resulting in about 10 deaths per year on average (i.e., fatalities typically in the low double digits).

https://www.peruviantimes.com/15/fact-checking-president-trumps-peru-viper-tale/32669/

[Mr. Bumble]

Another page from Qualika's up coming book, "Trump our Idiot (Retarded?) President".

[Malika la Maize]

Trump’s writing this one all himself.

[Mr. Bumble]

You're probably right.

[Frank Drackman]

Hey!! I'm supposed to be the one who's living Rent-Free in that big Nappy Hai'd of yours.
and he probably meant India, those Brown 3rd World Countries all sort of blend together, and this is from the BBC circa 2020

"An estimated 1.2 million people have died from snake bites in India in the past 20 years, a new study has found.
Nearly half of the victims were between 30 and 69 years old, and a quarter of them were children, the study says.
Russell's vipers, kraits and cobras were responsible for most deaths. The remaining deaths were caused by at least 12 other species of snakes.
So many of the attacks proved fatal because they happened in areas without swift access to medical care. Half of the deaths occurred in the monsoon season between June and September, when snakes are known to come out. And most victims were bitten in the legs.
The study, published in the open access journal eLife, was conducted by leading Indian and international experts. It's based on data collected from India's ambitious Million Death Study.
Russell's viper, a generally aggressive snake, is widespread across India and South Asia. It feeds on rodents and so is often found near human settlements, both in urban and rural areas."

Frank "Snakes, I hate em'!!!"

[Malika la Maize]

“He just confused India with Peru” is Frankie’s idea of a *defense* of Trump, lol. Idiots of a feather….

[Frank Drackman]

Let me know when he says we have 57 States like Barry H.O.

[Malika la Maize]

Or when he Capitalizes things Weirdly?

[Frank Drackman]

You know what's "Weird"??
I always want to spell it "Wierd" because that's how it would be in German, "ie" has that "eee" sound, while "ei" has that "eye" sound, so "Weird" always seems like it should be pronounced "Wired"
German equivalent is "Merkwurdig" which is why the guy tells General Turgidson that Dr. Strangeloves original name was "Merkwurdigliebe"
"Seltsam" is similar but more "Strange" than wierd.
I mean "weird", but "Dr. Seltsamliebe" doesn't sound as funny as Merkwurdigliebe.

Frank

[NvEric]

Kavorka ?

[bernard11]

This seems to be the uniform defense to any criticism of Trump for his 1000's of lies and stupidities.

And note that Obama acknowledged his error later that same day at a press conference. How many errors has Trump acknowledged?

[Dr. Ed 2]

Both are places with rural areas lacking access to basic medicine.

[Malika la Maize]

So are dozens if not hundreds of countries (not to mention “places”). What a silly level of abstraction.

[jb]

Like red states after all the Medicaid cuts?

[Dr. Ed 2]

There ARE things which can be done, such as keeping track of who has the antivenom or antidote and having plans of how to get it to the victim.

This isn't just hypothetical -- 20 years ago, there was arsenic poisoning via a church coffee pot in Northern Maine (New Sweden). A Boston hospital had the antidote and as the weather wasn't flyable, it was transported over 400 miles by a relay of police cars.

[Magister]

Relay of police cars from Boston? Hmm.
https://wgme.com/news/local/special-report-new-sweden-arsenic-poisonings
It appears the critically ill patients were transported to Bangor, and that the antidote came from Portland.

[BrotherMovesOn]

Does that mean Dr. Ed is wrong?
My world crumbles.

[Armchair]

Where does Trump say "Peru"?

[Malika la Maize]

Around the 2:15 mark. Says it several times

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=U-XvQTVY7Cw

[Armchair]

He never says 28,000 people die in Peru. He says it's a dangerous place. And a certain snake kills 28,000 people a year.

Let's say a particular car intersection is dangerous. And you say "Oh, it's super dangerous at this street intersection. Car accidents kills lots of people. Did you know that more than 30,000 people die from car accidents per year? Anyway, this intersection is dangerous"

That doesn't mean more than 30,000 die "at this street intersection". It's meant to emphasize the risk of death from these events is real.

If you point out Trump saying 28,000 die "in Peru"...that's inaccurate. But he doesn't say that. You interpret it in a false way.

[Malika la Maize]

The closed captioning:

“In Peru, uh, and it’s known for being such a tough place in tens of physical creatures crawling around. 28,000 people a year die from a snake bite, a certain snake.”

You just beclowned yourself.

[Magister]

In, uh, Peru. And it's known for being a rather rough place in terms of physical creatures crawling around. 28,000 people die a year from a snake bite, a certain snake. It's a viper, right? It's said to be the most poisonous snake in the world. And he made a comment and somebody else told him that's very dangerous in that area to go hiking.

That's attributing it to one snake (species, even if Trump might have been thinking it was the same snake biting 28,000 people). Later Trump lists the most poisonous snakes in the world: "The black mamba. The brown mamba. The viper from Peru." (Is there a brown mamba that is a different snake than the black mamba?) So, is the claim that the Peruvian viper visits India enough to kill thousands of people there while killing only ten per year in Peru (in fairness, it's unlikely that India would have the right antivenom for a South American snake)?

Apparently I am too slow, as Malika la Maize already quoted this. Transcript at https://rollcall.com/factbase/trump/transcript/donald-trump-speech-white-house-christmas-reception-december-14-2025/

[Malika la Maize]

Also, it appears there is no viper species which lives in Peru and Africa and/or Asia, where the vast majority of snakebite deaths come from. So there is no “viper from Peru” that is killing anything near 28,000 people.

https://www.google.com/search?q=which+venomous+viper+species+can+be+found+in+Peru+and+Africa+and+Asia&client=safari&hs=tH1o&sca_esv=0a7ab072f95bd45f&hl=en-us&ei=Tk1IadSvC_qnptQP34ShsA0&oq=which+venomous+viper+species+can+be+found+in+Peru+and+Africa+and+Asia&gs_lp=EhNtb2JpbGUtZ3dzLXdpei1zZXJwIkV3aGljaCB2ZW5vbW91cyB2aXBlciBzcGVjaWVzIGNhbiBiZSBmb3VuZCBpbiBQZXJ1IGFuZCBBZnJpY2EgYW5kIEFzaWFIjtYBUMsRWIrQAXAEeAGQAQGYAa4GoAHqVqoBDjIuNTYuMS4yLjIuMS4xuAEDyAEA-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&sclient=mobile-gws-wiz-serp#sbfbu=1&pi=which%20venomous%20viper%20species%20can%20be%20found%20in%20Peru%20and%20Africa%20and%20Asia

There isn't a single viper species found in all three regions (Peru, Africa, and Asia); however, the Saw-Scaled Viper (genus Echis) is prominent in Africa and Asia, while Pit Vipers (like Bothrops and Bothriechis) dominate the Americas (including Peru). Vipers are generally categorized by continent: Neotropical pit vipers in Peru (e.g., Bushmaster, Fer-de-lance relatives), diverse vipers in Africa (Gaboon, Puff Adder, Saw-Scaled), and Old World vipers in Asia (Saw-Scaled, Russell's, etc

[Davedave]

I did some googling earlier, and it seems like Bothrops is responsible, according to some estimates, for 27-28k deaths a year in S America. Which is presumably the stat that the demented one was misrepresenting in his stream-of-unconsciousness rambling.

https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/snakebite-envenoming

I have to admit to being extremely surprised by the incidence rate of snake bites, envenomings, and deaths. I'd have guessed perhaps 10k-15k deaths per year globally, but the upper estimate is ~9 times that.

[Malika la Maize]

“ I did some googling earlier, and it seems like Bothrops is responsible, according to some estimates, for 27-28k deaths a year in S America.”

Where in your cited source does it say that? If it does claim that it’s in wild variance from what I’ve seen, such as:

Venomous snakebites across the Americas result in an estimated 652 to 3466 deaths per year [1], with the majority of these snakebites by pit-vipers [2,3,4,5]. Bothrops is a genus of pit-viper—commonly known as lanceheads—that is distributed across South and Central America, as well as Mexico. Epidemiological data suggest that across South America, 70–96.6% of envenomings are inflicted by the Bothrops species

https://www.mdpi.com/2072-6651/13/2/78#:~:text=Venomous%20snakebites%20across%20the%20Americas,most%20medically%20significant%20snakebite%20envenomations.

[Davedave]

I didn't mean to imply it was in that source.

I'm very confused after further googling - some sources talk about ~30k snakebit deaths in South America, others talk about, e.g., a few hundred in the whole of Brazil, which has about half the continent's population.

[Malika la Maize]

Where have you seen these 30,000 estimates? I’ve seen none. They’re more like this:

In the Americas, more than 57,000 people are bitten by snakes each year, with a fatality rate of 0.6% and serious sequelae in over 3% of the victims.
https://www.paho.org/en/news/19-9-2024-americas-region-records-more-57000-snake-bites-each-year-causing-severe-consequences#:~:text=In%20the%20Americas%2C%20more%20than,%2C%20chronic%20ulcers%2C%20or%20amputations.

[Davedave]

I have no idea now, I can't find the same page again - checked my browser history. I must have been misreading something or misremembering what I read.

This seems like a more reasonable breakdown:
https://www.snakebitefoundation.org/blog/examining-the-unbalanced-impact-of-snakebites-worldwide

[Malika la Maize]

Things got ugly late in the Eagles’ 29–18 win over the Commanders on Saturday at Northwest Stadium.

With 4:33 to play, Philadelphia backup running back Tank Bigsby found the end zone for a 22-yard touchdown to put the Eagles up 27–10. The game was already out of reach for the Commanders, who turned to third-string quarterback Josh Johnson after Marcus Mariota left the game with an injury in the third quarter.

But Eagles coach Nick Sirianni opted to go for a two-point conversion, and the Eagles succeeded on a Saquon Barkley run through the left side of the offensive line. Pushing and shoving between the two teams ensued after the play, and it quickly turned for the worst.

The fight led to three players getting ejected: Commanders defensive lineman Javon Kinlaw, Washington safety Quan Martin and Eagles offensive lineman Tyler Steen.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/eagles-commanders-brawl-breaks-out-after-unexpected-two-point-conversion/ar-AA1SKk0g

[Frank Drackman]

Going for 2 with a 17 point lead? doesn't make sense, what was the spread? Is Point Differential one of the 57 Tiebreakers the No-Fun-League uses to decide Wild Card spots? (they should use something more relevant, such as "# of Starters arrested for Domestic Violence during the Season"
In Foo-bawl that is actually entertaining, loved James Madison and Tulane proving just how shitty Non-Power 4 Foo-bawl is.

Frank

[JoeFromtheBronx]

Given the mismatch including the need to use the #3 QB on the Commanders side, that game was more competitive than it might have been.

[DDHarriman]

The EU is in violation of the NATO Treaty, it requires member states to have free speech and free and fair elections.France & Germany are illegally preventing political candidates running for office for ideological reasons namely opposition to immigration

Why Should Americans Die For European Tyranny?
https://x.com/i/status/2002292675475816678

Powerful. Just so powerful.

[Malika la Maize]

“Powerful. Just so powerful.”

About a tweet? Lmao.

[jb]

How can the EU be in violation of the NATO treaty? The EU is not a member of NATO.

[Dr. Ed 2]

The two nations are violating it.

[jb]

Well, with as good of a grip on the facts as the first sentence, I'm sure the rest of the analysis must be spot on.

It's powerfully stupid, at least.

[Malika la Maize]

Estimates of the size of the video game industry range from $200 to $300 billion — larger than film, television and music combined, by some calculations — and Saudi Arabia, in its relentless, top-down drive to diversify from oil, is taking a big slice.

A large-scale, state-backed international video game industry conference announced this month, called Kingdom of Gaming, to be held in Riyadh next year, appears to give name to the ambition. Video games have long been a pet focus of Crown Prince Mohamed bin Salman, said to be an avowed gamer, but the kingdom went all- in this year: In September, the Saudi sovereign wealth fund, with partners including an investment firm founded by President Donald Trump’s son-in-law Jared Kushner, announced the acquisition of video game publisher Electronic Arts for $55 billion.

It would be a buyout on a historic scale. And that’s just the latest video game-related acquisition by the Saudis.

In 2022, Savvy Games Group, a video game holding company backed by the Saudi Public Investment Fund, which the crown prince chairs, spent $1.5 billion to acquire two major companies in esports — an industry centered on competitive video game tournaments, which draw large viewership and offer massive prize pools. Late last year, a spokesperson for the group told the New York Times that Savvy had gobbled up 40 percent of the esports industry.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2025/12/19/saudi-arabia-video-games-esports-mbs/

[Frank Drackman]

It's Saudi Arabia, after the Friday Morning Beheading's there's not much else to do except kick back at the Casbah and play some Madden (Is that how you say it? "play some Madden??" except for Chess, I'm not a Gamer)

Frank

[Davedave]

I can't imagine how you can play chess while insisting on using two sets of white pieces.

[Frank Drackman]

I can't imagine how your mom let you live, being such an embarrassment to the White Race.

[DDHarriman]

Maybe they'll finally purge the industry of all its sick LGBTQP fetishes

[Sarcastr0]

When I was super young, there was a lot of fear about Japanese investors taking over American companies. I mostly remember MAD Magazine doing satires of it.

It turned out they were just chasing value, and the threat was not particularly real.

I'm similarly sanguine about SA investments. I've got my issues with our entanglements in their politics and military sales and oil, but if they want to give fat sacks of cash money to our entertainment industry, I'm assuming it's an investment not some Muslim plot.

[Mr. Bumble]

"When I was super young, ..."
Yesterday?
Also, you forgot to use the words "tons" and "load bearing".

[Frank Drackman]

"When I was 21, it was a very good year
It was a very good year for city girls
Who lived up the stairs
With all that perfumed hair
And it came undone
When I was 21......."
Nothing like a little Frankie on a cold Winter morning....

Frank

[bernard11]

Nothing like a little Frankie on a cold Winter morning....

Or most other times.

[Frank Drackman]

"Gung Ho (released in Australia and New Zealand as "Working Class Man") is a 1986 American comedy film directed by Ron Howard and starring Michael Keaton. The story portrays the takeover of an American car plant by a Japanese corporation (although the title phrase is an Americanized Chinese term). A short-lived television series based on the film, followed in December 1986."

[Dr. Ed 2]

It shows just how bad Detroit's quality control was circa 1980.
The best part of the movie was where they hope the new car will start.

[Malika la Maize]

Remember Gung Ho with Michael Keaton? EDIT: (Holy crap, Frankie thought of this one too, now I have to take a shower).

Also, here’s a fun fact about Keaton I just learned, for years in the 90’s his “partner” was Courtney Cox!

[Frank Drackman]

Thanks for the attribution, sorry if the VCR's making too much noise.
Courtney Cox?
from Birmingham AL (actually "Mountain Brook" nobody from Mountain Brook ever says they're from Birmingham, hey it's a separate City, sort of like Pacific Palisades, but without the Fires and Earthquakes)
Her Ass in that "Dancing in the Dark" Video? Should be stuffed and put on exhibit in the Smithsonian (after she's done with it of course) as an example of the perfect Female Derriere.
She did a remake recently, still pretty tight for 61.
Marine Pilot I knew in the 90's went to the same High Screw-el, said he dated her.
Well, more exactly he said he (redacted) her, but Marine Pilots are known for their "Fish Stories"
Actually, guy had a great "Rap" he probably did.

Frank

[Dr. Ed 2]

The first Die Hard movie was all about it.

[Estragon]

Wrong, but whatever

[Ridgeway]

Maybe he was thinking of Rising Sun? The Michael Crichton book on which it is based is one of the more spectacularly wrong takes I have ever read.

[Dr. Ed 2]

Nakatomi Corporation....

It was the Nakatomi plaza, and the Nakatomi Corporation's Christmas Party, and his wife worked for the Nakatomi Corporation, which represented the Japanese buying up things in the '80s, the way that the Chinese are doing now.

And then what happened???
And yes, I think China is going to have a lost generation as well...

[Magister]

Early in the movie, the setting certainly reflected Japanese economic strength of the time, and American anxiety about it, but it wasn't what Die Hard was "all about"; it had to be set somewhere that would be likely to have excessive wealth in its vault. The 1970s book it was adapted from used an oil company which was corrupt in a way that the Nakatomi Corporation did not appear to be. The movie is all about Bruce Willis's character battling a gang of non-Japanese terrorists.

[gVOR08]

No, but Michael Crichton's "Rising Sun" novel with a similar Japanese company name and the Sean Connery movie were.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rising_Sun_(Crichton_novel)?wprov=sfti1#

[Drewski]

Chricton wrote the Rising Sun, a pretty good book about it that got made into a pretty good movie with Sean Connery. Mind you, Chricton was totally on team fearmonger, but still quite readable/watchable at the time.

[hobie]

Bondi: "There is no place now, especially after what happened to Charlie, in our society...We will absolutely target you, go after you, if you are targeting anyone with hate speech."

[not guilty]

What source are you quoting, hobie?

Never mind. I have found one such source. https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/attorney-general-pam-bondi-doj-hate-speech-rcna231633 She apparently said it during September in an interview with "The Katie Miller Podcast".

I mistakenly thought it was something more recent. Even so, it reflects remarkable ignorance of constitutional law on the part of the chief law enforcement officer in the U.S. https://staging.triblive.com/opinion/barbara-mcquade-what-pam-bondi-gets-wrong-about-hate-speech/

[Dr. Ed 2]

No, she's merely announced that she will play by YOUR SIDE'S rules.

[not guilty]

Dr. Ed 2, I don't think that characterizing someone as malevolent rather than ignorant speaks well of that person. Ignorance can be corrected.

As to your whataboutism, what part of "We will absolutely target you, go after you, if you are targeting anyone with hate speech" do you claim applies to my side? (Since I am a proudly Democratic partisan, I surmise you are referring to Democrats in general as being my side.)

What Attorney General in any Democratic administration do you claim has gone after anyone for merely engaging in hate speech? It is noteworthy that "hate speech" which does not constitute a true threat or advocacy which is "directed to inciting or producing imminent lawless action and is likely to incite or produce such action," Brandenburg v. Ohio, 395 U.S. 444 (1969), cannot be a federal crime, although it might be a sentencing enhancement.

For example, Dylann Roof was not prosecuted for having engaged in hate speech, but instead for killing nine people and injuring a tenth. Payton Gendron was/is not being prosecuted for his white supremacy manifesto, but for killing ten people.

[Magister]

Respecting norms, complying with court orders, and not lying to courts? That would be a good thing, but clearly not what she meant.

[John F. Carr]

"Algeria bill seeks to criminalise French colonial rule"

It's not clear what this means. Colonial rule ended over 60 years ago. Will we see 100 year old retired secretaries dragged into court as in Germany?

Earlier this year the African Union agreed in principle to demand reparations from colonial powers.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2025/12/21/algeria-bill-seeks-to-criminalise-french-colonial-rule-what-to-know

[Malika la Maize]

How far back do you think reparations should apply?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2025/12/20/venezuela-oil-nationalization-expropriation/

[hobie]

I think Trump is demanding government reparations for how unfairly he was treated. MAGA is all for reparations now, it seems.

[Sam Bankman-Fried]

Trump paid reparations to white West Virginian coal miners…it just allows them to buy groceries in their depressed towns so it ultimately benefits the business owners in the towns they live. So reparations would ultimately benefit Republicans in the southeast. Btw, the Warrior Bonuses will end up benefiting tattoo parlors and strip clubs…and the strippers will use their windfall getting tattoos! And the Trump Accounts will end up in spending at gun stores and tattoo parlors…so we will most likely have a murder spike in 20 years like we had when PPP fraud fueled the 2020 crime wave.

[Bob from Ohio]

Whataboutism.

[Malika la Maize]

I see you concede Trump’s claims are like the African Union’s claim.

[Dr. Ed 2]

I think we should demand reparations from the African Union -- they are the ones who provided the slaves...

[David Nieporent]

The African Union was founded in the 21st century, so that seems pretty unlikely.

[John F. Carr]

The treaty ending the war of independence (Evian Accords / Accords d'Évian) included an amnesty. From the English translation deposited with the UN:

No one shall be subject to police or judicial measures, to summary punishment or to any discrimination, on account of :
- Opinions expressed at the time of events which occurred in Algeria before the date of the vote on self-determination;
- Acts committed at the time of those events before the date of proclamation of the cease-fire.

[John F. Carr]

An article from an Algerian source has a little more information. Mostly the law would say "France was mean to us." It would also introduce a European-style crime, glorification of that which should not be glorified. "dispositions pénales criminalisant la glorification de la colonisation ou sa promotion" / "criminal penalties for glorification or promotion of colonisation"

https://www.aps.dz/fr/algerie/actualite-nationale/mjehaf25-la-question-de-la-criminalisation-de-la-colonisation-est-la-cause-de-tout-un-peuple

[ThePublius]

Has anyone here tried Masterclass? I'm tempted - and they now have a 50% off deal. 200+ classes, typically 20 lessons of 10 minutes each. Many famous instructors. I'm interested in Indian cooking, portrait painting, and other things.

I'm interested to hear if anyone's tried it and what they think.

[Estragon]

This is probably going to come off more rudely than it is intended (honestly!)… but maybe you should think about trying something that doesn’t involve sitting in front of a computer more than you already do.

[ThePublius]

Well, it is rude! It's about being in front of a canvas, in front of a range, and so forth!

[Estragon]

You can accomplish all of those things without a computer, obviously, but you do you.

https://fishingheritagecenter.org/programs/classes/

https://www.theitaliandiva.com/

https://paintingatsplash.com/

Just a thought.

[Bob from Ohio]

People never mean what is before a "But ...".

Maybe you should heed your own advice.

[Estragon]

It’s good advice for everyone, dipshit.

[Bob from Ohio]

Oh, more rudeness.

[TwelveInchPianist]

Uh, that came off as kind of rude.

[David Nieporent]

I think it came across much more rudely than was called for.

[DDHarriman]

I did the storytelling one with RL Stein with my kids. It was really really good. Worth the subscription price alone. He was really charming and wonderful to listen to.

[santamonica811]

I don't know about Masterclass. But I am curious about (for example) what this sort of class could add to the literally tens of thousands of India food recipes on line...including thousands of instructional videos on YouTube? I've been using YouTube mostly for my own experiments with Indian dishes.

Does Masterclass give the benefit of instructors giving you feedback on your painting, cooking, etc.? That sort of "extra" benefit could be well worth the cost of the class. (I've been looking, for myself, for in-person "baking macarons" classes. I've looked at a dozen recipes, I've watched a dozen YouTube videos, but I just *can't* get it right. Sometimes none comes out correctly [they still taste delicious, even without the proper feet], sometimes 25% of batch comes out perfectly. But I think I need a professional chef/instructor to be watching me, and hopefully saying, "Oh, HERE is were you're going wrong.")

Sorry for venting. Whew...that was cathartic!

[hobie]

Just look at the avalanche of skillfully produced cooking and painting videos from amateurs to pros. Absolutely no need to pay for classes.

[ThePublius]

Good point, hobie. One of my favorites is 'SoupedUpRecipes.' I haven't found a portrait painting or drawing instructional thing that I like yet.

[Bored Lawyer]

You can learn a lot from Youtube. Once I needed to replace parts in a toilet. Five-minute video taught me all I needed to know. Bought parts at Home Depot, save $ 150 in plumber bill.

[ThePublius]

I'm off to the Christmas candlelight service at the Seaman's Bethel in New Bedford. It's only a mile from my house.

https://nbportsociety.org/christmas-candlelight-service/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seamen%27s_Bethel

[Davedave]

I misread that as 'Seamen's Brothel' the first time. Very ecumenical.

[Bored Lawyer]

Tonight is the last night of Hanukkah. I went to a Hannukah party where they served the traditional latkes (fried potato pancakes). What was new was a "latke bar." Apart from the traditional applesauce and sour cream, there were other toppings to choose from. I tried a latke with cream cheese and lox. Absolutely delicious. Strongly recommend it.

[Commenter_XY]

I will have to try this!

[bernard11]

Sounds great, B.L.

Was there brisket?

[SRG2]

The Russian Vodka Room in Manhattan has latkes with lox as an appetiser. Very good!

I always prefer my latkes with something savoury rather than sweet - gravy from a pot-roasted brisket, for example.