Our Guest-Blogger Prof. Robert Leider (George Mason) Is New ATF Chief Counsel/Assistant Director

So reports the ATF page. Prof. Leider is a noted scholar of criminal law, the law of self-defense, and gun control (among other topics), and a former clerk for Justice Thomas.

You can read Prof. Leider's guest posts, which stemmed from his article The Modern Common Law of Crime, here; we've also quoted him extensively in other posts, such as Guns, Background Checks, Administrative Law, and the Sixth Circuit Michigan Case; Are Parents Responsible for School Shootings Committed by their Children?; and Military Federalism and State Sovereign Immunity. He's also the coauthor, with our own Will Baude, of The General-Law Right to Bear Arms.

Comments

[John F. Carr]

A commenter here recently noted he got a suppressor permit in six days that used to take six months.

[Martinned2]

A sufficiently large "investment" in Trumpcoins will do that.

[dwb68]

no, see below

[dwb68]

Suppressor wait times dramatically decreased in the last 3 years. Yes, Form 4 individuals are down to about 1-2 weeks or so. Last year, mine took 2 weeks. They are recently tracking about 1-2 weeks.

To be fair: this was a Biden achievement shortly after the Bruen decision.

It may have been a result of the technology investment in the electronic form site they made to get all the braces amnesty registered as SBRs.

The full tinfoil version would be that the Biden admin contemplated putting semi-autos on the NFA (a licensing scheme Bruen would permit per footnote 9), but the only way they could sell it to the court was if NFA wait times went down substantially so they were not overly burdensome.

Make of that theory what you will. Nevertheless, wait times are now... shockingly reasonable.

[Doug Heffernan]

As someone who knows nothing about guns, is it correct that a suppressor is the same thing as a silencer? If so, how are these typically used in the sport/hobby sphere?

In TV/movies I've seen them used mostly by contract killers. They must have other uses, like maybe keeping neighborhood noise down when shooting cans in the backyard, or something like that.

[dwb68]

Yes, silencer and suppressor are synonymous.
Movies are wrong. (some authors get this wrong as well). Suppressed guns are still noisy (but its the difference between a car with and without a muffler--fun fact: silencers are just an application of the car muffler).

My wife's early experience going to the range: The guy next to him, his rifle was LOUD. Ear splitting concussion, even with 2x ear protection (at indoor ranges the sound bounces off the walls). He reaction was that "that guy was too fucking loud and needs one of those things you have") a suppressor. ????

Without a suppressor, a pistol is about 140 decibels, (aka LOUD AS FUCK) and a rifle is often higher (150, 160).

A suppressor shaves 15-30 decibels off the boom depending on the design. It cannot eliminate supersonic crack.

A pistol will end up 110-120 decibels suppressed at the ear (still LOUD, but not hearing damage level), a rifle will end up 120-135. smaller calibers like 22 will be quieter.

110 decibels is still loud! think: jackhammer, power saw, or thunder.

Of course you want one. It's hearing protection. Repeated exposure to 120+ concussive decibels damages hearing, and the louder the worse the damage is. If NFA had never been enacted, OSHA would probably make them mandatory.

Yes, my self defense guns are suppressed. In the middle of the night, I will not have time to don hearing protection, and this will keep me lucid so the concussive blast does not damage my ears and ability to think straight.

[Absaroka]

Yes, suppressor==silencer. No, they aren't as quiet as in the movies[1]. Revolvers don't shoot 37 times without reloading, either :-).

The reasons the military is starting to issue them generally is A)less hearing loss and B)better control. As in, your platoon is in a firefight, and you want 3d squad to hook left. Without suppressors they are half deaf and can't hear you yelling orders, so you have to take your soft pink body through the enemy fire to go shout in 3d squad's ear. With suppressors you can maybe just yell across.

On civvy street:
1)You see the trophy buck ... no time to put on muffs. Less (not none!) hearing damage from the shot.
2)I'm at our cabin, where it's safe to shoot. Without a suppressor centerfire can be heard for several miles, so maybe 8 neighbors hear it. With suppressor, maybe 2 miles, so only one neighbor hears it. It seems polite to me, like not running straight pipes on a Harley.
3)Even at a range, with everyone wearing plugs and muffs, the blast from some guns will slap you in the face, especially if there is a roof over head reflecting the sound. 7mm Remington Mag, a popular elk caliber, would be one example. Suppressed is way nicer. I mean, take the muffler off your car and see if your Sunday drive is still as pleasant. Not just a rusted out muffler, but no muffler at all, if you have ever heard one.

[1]to be clear, centerfire anything is still jet engine loud, as in the suppressor reduces 140dB to 120. The John Wick scene where he's walking through the crowded mall in a firefight and nobody notices ... nope. You can get pretty quiet with the right (subsonic) rimfire ammo and a fixed breech (e.g. bolt action) rifle. Not Hollywood quiet, but pretty quiet.

[Dr. Ed 2]

You can get a LOT quieter with a crossbow and those are damn near as lethal if you have the right tip on your arrow.

I never really understood why the NFA included suppressors in the first place. The problem was bazookas and Thompson guns -- not a somewhat quieter rifle.

[Absaroka]

Sigh. The NFA was passed in 1934, and bazookas created in 1942ish. Moreover, bazookas ('destructive devices') weren't included until 1968.

The usual justification for including suppressors I hear is that the idea was to prevent them being used by poachers. Other people say the reason never came up. I haven't seen anything definitive.

[dwb68]

My crossbow is quite noisy tbh. Probably the same as my suppressed mp5 with subsonic ammo (Id venture about 110 Db).

[Cyclops]

In a recent case (US v. Peterson) the 5th Circuit Court of Appeals ruled that suppressors are not "arms" covered by the 2nd amendment. However, unsuppressed firearms can cause permanent hearing loss and lifelong tinnitus. Given that we are not born with embedded ear protection and the ordinary usage of firearms for self-defense can cause permant damage to one's hearing, I rather think that suppressors are integral to the use of firearms for defense of home and self. When someone invades your home you don't have time to don ear protection, and whatsmore, putting on ear protection will cause you to lose or deaden an important sense in a dark environment - you often hear threats before you see them.

[SRG2]

I hope that Prof Leider wlll write an article about when it's legitimate to use a weapon to protect oneself against illegal seizure and deportation.

[Stupid Government Tricks]

Have to wait several years for the courts to decide what's illegal.

Wotta shame courts work so slowly, eh what?

[Dr. Ed 2]

If you are not legally here, you neither have the right to possess a gun nor to use it, for anything.

Now how about the legality of Shoot on Sight orders for Illegal Terrorist/Aliens.

[SRG2]

Who said anything about not legally here? You can be here legally as a non-citizen - but I guess the temptation be stupid was just too great.

[AmosArch]

Low key calling for violence against government authorities. How insurrectiony of you

[SRG2]

Nope, you fuckwit.

[Absaroka]

Here is the story of how the ATF did it.

"The ATF didn’t receive an influx of cash to process suppressor applications more quickly. They didn’t hire an army of new approvers, and Congress didn’t pass any new laws to force their hand. They introduced a revamped electronic filing system, but that was all the way back in 2022, and wait times were actually longer in the months that followed.
...
The former chief of the National Firearms Act (NFA) Division stepped down and was replaced with a guy named Ben Hiller. According to Maddox, Hiller started the job by working through 100 Form 4 applications and looking for ways to speed up the process.

“He determined that 80% of the work they were doing didn’t need to be done,” Maddox said.""

I hope Mr. Hiller got a promotion, and wasn't laid off as a probationary employee as a result.

[Dr. Ed 2]

I'd say 100% of it doesn't need to be done.

The FCC used to require a license for CB radios -- Reagan ended that. End suppressor licensing...

[Dan Schiavetta]

Not a cause for congratulation.

[Charles Nichols - CRTC]

Professor Leider was the only vocal proponent of Open Carry on the Volokh Conspiracy.

Now, there are none.

[Stupid Government Tricks]

You're not vocal? Coulda fooled me.

[Charles Nichols - CRTC]

Stupid Government Tricks, aka Cupcake - I'm not a blogger, guest, or otherwise on the Volokh Conspiracy. Do try to pay better attention.