The Volokh Conspiracy
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Second Amendment Roundup: Firepower and the Fourth Circuit
The en banc court makes bizarre claims about the 5.56 mm cartridge.
The case of Snope v. Brown has been distributed for the Supreme Court's conference for December 13. Previously styled Bianchi v. Brown, the cert petition challenges Maryland's "assault weapon" prohibition which the Fourth Circuit upheld en banc earlier this year.
The Wall St. Journal's Editorial Board just took notice in "AR-15 Rifles and the Constitution" (Dec. 8), observing that the Fourth Circuit "second-guesses people who say they keep or bear an AR-15-style rifle for self-defense." It concludes: "But the Second Amendment isn't an inkblot on the Constitution. It means something. Can that possibly not include a right to own the gun that claims to be America's bestselling rifle?"
Now for a deeper dive. Essential to the majority's decision was a sadly-mistaken view of the quite ordinary ammunition that the banned rifle typically fires.
Back on March 20, the case was being argued before the Fourth Circuit en banc. Judge Harvie Wilkinson noted that "Heller talks about M16s and the like, weapons of war," and another judge chimed in that "the AR15 is the M16." That was the basis on which the court previously upheld the ban, which was now back in the court because the Supreme Court vacated and remanded the case for reconsideration in light of Bruen.
Judge Wilkinson asked appellants' counsel Pete Patterson: "Have you ever fired an M-16?" Counsel: "I have not your Honor." Judge Wilkinson: "Well I have and we used them when I was in the Army Reserve. That was way back, way way back." (He served in 1968-69.) Judge Wilkinson went on to state:
And when we took shots at the targets, wherever we hit, there was nothing left, the kick was so powerful that when the bullets hit the human beings, it splintered them into all sorts of little pieces, there was very little left of the human being, and that was a very earlier model of the M16, and since then it's been perfected, and perfected, and perfected into an even more lethal weapon than the ones that I used.
Actually, both back then and now, the M16 (like most AR-15s) fires the relatively-underpowered 5.56 mm cartridge. It has very little kick. And while obviously the 5.56 can be lethal, in no way does it even come close to "splintering" a human into "little pieces." It won't even do that to a squirrel.
While the rhetoric was toned down when the en banc decision was issued on August 6, what it said would still make any person familiar with firearms wonder what planet the court is on. But first let's conduct a reality check on the characteristics of different higher-powered and lower-powdered rifle cartridges.
For over a century, millions of American deer hunters have chosen the .30-06 round. That is what our Armed Forces used in the M1903 bolt action rifle and the M-1 Garand semiautomatic rifle. The .308 or 7.62 cartridge, which the military used in the M-14 rifle, perhaps became the most popular deer round for a time. There are numerous other rounds on the market of equal or better take-down power, such as the 6.5 Creedmoor.
In 1950, the .222 Remington cartridge was developed for varmint hunting. It evolved into the .223 Remington round, which in turn became the basis of the 5.56 mm cartridge adopted by the military for use in the M16 and favored by many target competitors. Neither round is preferred by deer hunters, as most loads are too underpowered to harvest big game.
Maryland game regulations require that rifles used for deer hunting must use ammunition developing a muzzle energy of at least 1,200 foot pounds. A typical 5.56 with a normal 55 grain bullet generates 1,223 ft.-lbs. of muzzle energy. By contrast, a. 308 round with a 150-grain bullet fires with 2,648 ft.-lbs. of muzzle energy, over double that of the 5.56.
As is plain to see, the power of the .223/5.56 round isn't much to speak of compared to typical hunting rounds. It is so underpowered that the Armed Forces are replacing its 5.56 M16 and M4 rifles with a new 6.8 x 51 mm round (the XM7) which has muzzle energy of 2,267 ft-lbs with a 135 grain bullet.
Now to the decision in Bianchi, authored by Judge Wilkinson. On cartridge power, it includes a single long paragraph with citations to five district court opinions and a Washington Post article, but no expert sources. It begins: "The firepower of the AR-15 and M16 is a key component of their 'phenomenal lethality.'" They are "[b]uilt to generate 'maximum wound effect' and to pierce helmets and body armor…." You can't have it both ways. Maximizing the wound size requires a bullet with a soft nose or hollow point that expands. Piercing a helmet or armor requires a bullet with a steel core or other hard metal that will not expand.
Instead of comparing other rifle cartridges with the underpowered 5.56/.223, the court compares this rifle cartridge with handgun cartridges. Supposedly "AR-15 bullets discharge at around 'three times the velocity of a typical handgun….'" What is a "typical" handgun? What are your calculations? Are you aware that rifles in the AR-15 configuration come in many calibers, including as small as .22 rimfire?
"These higher velocity rounds 'hit fast and penetrate deep into the body,' creating severe damage," continues the court. Most bullets from most firearms have that potential. The court adds that an AR-15 bullet "yaws" or "turns sideways" in tissue, rotating and creating a large, "temporary cavity" or "blast wave" that can be "up to 11-12.5 times larger than the bullet itself"; that is known as "cavitation." That's from another district court opinion, not a scientific study. And it is oblivious to the fact that more powerful rifle rounds would have much more devastating effect. But that doesn't justify banning the rifles that fire them.
This is a complex subject, and the court just didn't do any real homework. Dr. Martin Fackler, military trauma surgeon and former director of the Army's Wound Ballistics Laboratory, wrote in the Annals of Emergency Medicine: "The most common misconception about gunshot wound treatment is that the penetration of any 'high-velocity' bullet causes enigmatic 'shock waves' and cavitation that will doom tissues even far from the bullet path."
Regarding rounds fired from the M16, Dr. Fackler wrote in Wound Ballistic Review that "most often the bullet travels about five inches through flesh before beginning significant yaw. But about 15% of the time, it travels much farther than that before yawing – in which case it causes even milder wounds, if it misses bones, guts, lung, and major blood vessels." In Vietnam, it was found that many bullets passed through torsos "traveling mostly point forward, and caused minimal damage."
The Bianchi court next inappropriately compares wounds from rifles to those from handguns. It asserts that a "typical 9mm [bullet] wound to the liver" from a Glock 19 handgun "will produce a pathway of tissue destruction in the order of one inch to two inches," but an AR-15 wound "will literally pulverize the liver, perhaps best described as dropping a watermelon onto concrete." Hyperbole aside, a .30-08 deer rifle round would cause much more injury. Again, should deer rifles be banned?
While we're comparing rifles to handguns, consider the 7.62 x 39 full metal jacket round used in the AK-47 (which Maryland bans) and the SKS (not banned). Dr. Fackler notes that it "does not deform in tissue and travels about 26 cm [10.2 inches] before beginning to yaw. This explains the clinical finding that most wounds caused by this bullet resemble those made by much lower velocity handgun bullets."
Bianchi tells us that the "catastrophic" damage of AR-15 rounds leaves "multiple organs shattered," bones "exploded," and "soft tissue absolutely destroyed," which "often cannot be repaired" by trauma surgeons. That potential exists for wounds from shots fired from firearms of almost any kind.
A cartridge does not care what type of firearm fires it. A .223 round fired from an AR-15 will cause exactly the same wound as one fired from a single-shot rifle that Maryland does not ban. Yet the Bianchi court seeks to justify the ban on certain rifles based on the wounding potential of the cartridge they fire when countless other rifles fire exactly the same cartridge. Presumably all rifles that fire this cartridge, not to mention all that fire more powerful cartridges, may be banned. That would be most rifles other than the .22 rimfire.
Descriptions of wounds in the most gory manner possible to justify a gun ban loses sight of the fact that the Second Amendment protects "arms," which include "any thing that a man wears for his defence, or takes into his hands, or useth in wrath to cast at or strike another." (Heller, quoting Timothy Cunningham's 1771 legal dictionary.) That criminals injure and kill innocents with arms is reason for innocents to have arms, not to ban them.
There is much more to the Bianchi's majority opinion, and Judge Richardson (joined by four other judges) does an able job in refuting the arguments. As a side note, he knows about firearms, writing: "Speaking from experience, many hog hunters deploy the exact weapons that Maryland bans, including the AR-15."
David Kopel's post on this blog from last year – "How powerful are AR rifles?" – provides a detailed review of the issues herein. At a more general level, my book America's Rifle: The Case for the AR-15 discusses the broader, historical context of the issue.
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AR-15 = America’s Rifle.
I'm so old I remember my first AR-15 was a Colt (only one who made them then) the gun store I bought it from didn't want it, had only ordered it for a cop who welshed, and the only ammo I could find was .223 Remington at K-mart (remember K-mart?) and I had to sign in a big bound book for it (the 1986 "Gun Owner's Protection Act" while freezing the number of legally owned machineguns, did do away with the signing for ammo foolishness) A year or 2 later you could order 1000 rounds of military surplus .223 through the mail for a few hundred bucks.
Frank
Why is there judicial hostility against the 2nd Amendment?
The 2nd amendment, like other civil liberties, only more so, is an expression of fundamental distrust of government. It's the "break glass in case of emergency" amendment, and the emergency is the government gone bad.
Judges, of course, are part of the government. They don't like the idea that the institution they're part of isn't trusted even by the nation's highest law, and that the people are actually entitled to be in a position to overthrow it, THEM, if things get bad enough.
That, and judges are the product of law schools, and law schools are hardly representative of larger society to begin with.
Well there are 16 states that do not allow hunting deer with a standard AR-15 with a standard.223 cartridge because its too low power and may wound a deer, rather than reliably kill it.
And at least some of those states allow hunting with a .357 handgun, which while it does have perhaps 1/3 the muzzle velocity of a .233 the bullet weighs 2-4x more than a .223, and the area of the footprint is about 2x a 2.23 round.
So that slower slug, with at least 2x the weight and 2x the hole it creates can be more lethal than the .223 which by some accounts can liquefy an elephant with a tail shot.
Not one to pick nits (are you kidding, I love picking nits) depending on whether you have a 157 grain bullet or my preference, the 125 grain, your typical .357 has about 1/2 the muzzle velocity of the .223 which typically fires a bullet around 60 grains.
I wouldn't want to get shot with either, but since I can't carry an AR-15 in my coat pocket I make do with my S&W Model 19 snubby.
Sometimes just for a change of pace I'll carry my East German Makarov in 9mmx18, or a Beretta M9 or CZ75 in 9mm, or if I'm really feeling old school my 1911
For the car trunk it's a Remington 870 Police 12 gage Shotgun loaded with 4 00 Buckshot rounds and 2 Slugs, if I need more that that I'm fucked,
Frank
For the car trunk it's a Remington 870 Police 12 gage Shotgun loaded with 4 00 Buckshot rounds and 2 Slugs, if I need more that that I'm fucked,
An underappreciated point. In any plausible civilian self-defense situation, what you would bring to a firefight (or a home invasion by rival meth dealers) is irrelevant. If you can't get the job done with the kinds of weapons nobody wants banned*, you're not going to get the job done. More than one gun writer I know recommends for home defense lever-action carbines of the type made familiar from westerns. They are light, fast-handling, carry plenty of rounds with man-killing punch, accurate at defensive range, and don't frighten the bystanders.
*During hearings on the first assault weapons ban, a woman testified about how she used a gun to defend her home. The gun was a Remington 870 pump 12-gauge shotgun. (Quite a load for a woman who doesn't practice regularly. Maybe a 20-gauge would be better.) Someone pointed out to her -- it might have been Joe Biden -- that the bill wouldn't affect such guns.
Yeh - lever action. Have a .44 mag lever gun with bear loads by the front door in MT. Never expect to need it, but… Luckily the brown bears stay up on the ridge. But have had black bear on the front porch. I hope that I have my wife well enough trained not to put something there that they like too much…
Hayden, forget the porch. Read the recent New Yorker article about Tahoe City, CA. There, the black bears have learned they don't need a warrant; they're gonna come in.
Think of black bears as fiendish killers with super powers. They combine intelligence and curiosity with strength which can only be called, "bear-like." Contrary to traditional expectations, black bears are proving far more dangerous than grizzlies.
Put bars on your windows, and black bears just pull them out with one swipe of a paw. Lock your groceries in your car, and the bear tears his way in through the sheet metal, and sits down for lunch. Leave the car open to prevent damage, and the bear politely uses the door latch, opens the door, gets in, and locks the doors behind him.
For your safety, do not store any food in your house. Do not cook, or take your meals there. Eat only in restaurants with armed guards full time at the door.
According to my Idaho friend, Bloggins, who recently visited California bear country, restaurants there have upped the caliber of arms they use to equip their guards; the best places now feature guards bearing .375 caliber Holland and Holland African double rifles.
Bloggins thinks that may be mostly for show, to reassure understandably nervous diners. He asserts a deadlier .470 would be overkill. "After all," Bloggins said, "black bears aren't rhinos."
Bloggins is not known for reliable judgment, and I remain skeptical. Sadly, experience is teaching rural Californians a bitter lesson about bears: once the emboldened-bear phenomenon gets going, their property values collapse.
Smart Californians who are not independently wealthy have learned they must be among the first to decamp. Wait too long, and you may get stuck with worthless real estate when the market crashes. The only place you might be able to buy affordable safety could be Richmond—not very safe, admittedly, but with the Black Bear Diner maybe the only ursine menace around. For certain, San Bernardino is out. Too many bears.
I was told is US Army basic training that the primary goal of the M-16 was to wound the enemy, rather than to kill, because it takes at least two other people to care for a wounded enemy combatant, taking more enemy solders out of the fight.
And while obviously the 5.56 can be lethal, in no way does it even come close to "splintering" a human into "little pieces." It won't even do that to a squirrel.
Unless more-or-less total decapitation does not count, Halbrook is either lying about the squirrel, or surprisingly short on experience about what he is talking about.
Decades ago in Idaho I had a go-to place for cottontails. I enjoyed eating cottontails as much as any other game I could shoot. They were easy to find. And a day's hunt never lasted long before I had as many as I cared to take home. It was frankly meat hunting, not sport.
For hunting I enjoyed more, going after chukar partridges with a shotgun was more sporting. The chukar and the hunter were both in peril. That was a quarry which could literally kill a man, by exhausting him, chasing them over snake-infested sagebrush-covered mountainsides.
Birds aware you were after them would run invisibly, a thousand vertical feet up through sagebrush to a ridge, and then fly down the other side, keeping low, while rocketing and dodging through the brush. Chukars were expert at that strategy. They used it to keep safe from their natural predators, raptorial birds like prairie falcons, harriers, and even golden eagles.
The raptors were strategists too. They learned to follow hunters around, circling overhead to see what the hunters might turn up.
Very challenging, unless you had several good dogs to help out. A day's hunt for chukars could exhaust even the best conditioned dogs, because each dog was so active on the hunt it traveled several times as far as the hunter.
Because of the snakes, and the exertion, it was better to hunt chukars in sub-freezing temperatures. Even in peak condition, I found 5 miles out, and 5 miles back in chukar country to be about as much as I could take in a day—very little of that kind of hunt afforded even a moment on level ground. So I used a lightweight 20 gauge shotgun.
My cottontail rifle was far less powerful than an AR-15 shooting the .223. It was a rimfire .22 magnum. I liked it because I had a well-made Winchester lever-action chambered for it, which was accurate enough, and flat-shooting enough, to enable me to shoot standing, and hit my targets mostly in the head, out to about 80 yards, using rudimentary open sights.
When that happened, it was always a humane kill. The rabbit never knew it had been shot—because there was almost never much left of its head. If I missed the head, and happened to hit any part of the body, there would likely be extensive waste of meat.
It sounds like Halbrook may be mostly a gun-range type shooter. Depending on where and what a bullet hits, almost any rifle shooting anything bigger than bird shot can wreak havoc, including partial decapitations, injuries which amount to traumatic amputations of limbs, and internal organs blasted out of the body cavity. I have seen such results on small game, with deer, and once with an elk shot by someone else.
Of course all that is literally far afield from the subject Halbrook is trying to confuse his readers about, with his, "look, a squirrel," approach. Halrook's subject, if he were candid enough to admit it, is shooting people at very close range. And for that, the AR-15 shooting the .223 cartridge is indeed a formidably deadly weapon—more so than perhaps any existing rival.
Halbrook's dodge, and it is a dodge, is to narrow the scope of discussion to numerically quantified ballistic power. That bypasses other firearms design factors which notably multiply the power of a rifle already capable of ballistic overkill against humans out to even ranges typical of military armed combat.
What design factors? Light weight, light recoil, semi-automatic operation, capacity to accept large magazines, low muzzle blast, flat trajectory, and light-weight inexpensive ammunition all contribute.
It is that uniquely engineered combination which makes the AR-15 unreasonably dangerous for civilian use. Just as any other rifle which combined all those human-killing advantages would be. And there are a few others which come close to doing that, but not quite with the panache that has made the AR-15 such a market success among shooters who keep human-shooting ambitions uppermost in mind.
To wind up quickly, it is necessary only to note that a single shot from the AR-15/.223 combination is more ballistically powerful than one shot from the famously formidable .44 magnum pistol, a monster of a weapon which few can master.
But because of its light-weight bullet, and correspondingly light recoil, the AR-15 is literal child's play to learn to shoot. And with its rapid-fire capability enhanced by relatively little recoil disruption of accurate aiming, the AR-15 can in practice deliver multiples of the .44 magnum's ballistic energy to a series of human targets in a given time frame. It absolutely is unreasonably dangerous for private use, in a way which no other weapon generally available can match.
"with its rapid-fire capability enhanced by relatively little recoil disruption of accurate aiming, the AR-15 can in practice deliver multiples of the .44 magnum's ballistic energy to a series of human targets in a given time frame. "
Reasonable description. However, when it is in the hands of a person defending her life, the AR-15 appears to be a very good solution. What matters is the morality of the use to which the instrument is put, which your argument thoroughly ignores.
Accurately placed first round: safer. Accurately placed following rounds: safer. Light weight and low recoil: adaptable to a broader range of users.
The combination of factors that make the AR-15 uniquely, unreasonably dangerous in your opinion is what makes it particularly suited to a defensive purpose for anyone physically fit enough to operate any weapon. The only difference between the two is the intent of the person operating it. Don't interfere with the choices of those acting with lawful intent. You're handing the criminals a heckler's veto.
McGlynn worked through this in Barnett v Raoul.
Presumption of innocence is for criminal trials, not for public policy. A great deal of criminal law is based on presumption of mischief, and rightly applied alike to everyone.
The law understands those who stand innocent today, are at risk to become criminals later. And that for good reason. It has been the case in the history of every criminal, without exception.
As a general proposition, very few people, and those mostly fools, think there is anything wrong with public policy tailored to reduce criminal capacity to harm innocents. Notions to increase innocents' capacity to harm criminals tend dangerously toward fantasy, vigilantism, and unexpected collateral damage.
Also, as a practical matter, it is impossible to show that your hypothetical female is made safer by living in a world where potential assailants may use an AR-15 style rifle to attack her, even at long range, at an open air concert, for instance. Or, hypothetically, among the crowd at a presidential inauguration ceremony.
No thanks Fudd. The presumption written into the 2nd Amendment was "the security...."- for the home AND for the homeland. Modern citizen militias being confined to "safer" lever rifles and double barrel Fox shotguns is ludicrous.
You are basing policy on one single instance, where the shooter had a literal armory available to him, with several dozen rifles, in multiple calibers, and utilized a number of both. It took much of a week to haul it all down from Mesquite and up to his room.
Besides, you are placing the burden of proof on the wrong side. It’s up to you to prove that she wouldn’t be safer, since you are the one claiming that she wouldn’t be. All because of that one instance where a single shooter, with dozens of guns, was able to kill so many.
Ignoring your single instance, the reality is that AR-15s are almost exclusively a defensive weapon, while handguns are the firearms used in almost all offensive uses of firearms. The reason is obvious - conceilability. Handguns are easily concealed. AR-15s are not. And, except in places like Israel, walking into a store with something like an AR-15 is going to be highly suspicious.
1: The Second Amendments not about hunting
2: Why do you kill Bunny Rabbits? I hope if there's an afterlife (Spoiler Alert, there's not) you come back as a 14 point Buck on the first day of Bow Season, then as a baby cow about to be turned into Wiener Schnitzel, then a chicken, (aren't you glad there's not an afterlife?)
Frank
US vs Miller (1939) taught “With obvious purpose to assure the continuation and render possible the effectiveness of such forces the declaration and guarantee of the Second Amendment were made. It must be interpreted and applied with that end in view.”
Is effectiveness now a bad thing, rather than an obvious purpose of the declaration and guarantee of the Second Amendment?
Are you really going to say that the right to keep and bear arms only applies when in actual service of the state militia but only protects those arms which are ineffective for collective defense?
Hansberry, I have advocated for availability of fully capable military weapons for militia use. Of course, that advocacy presumes well regulated use of such weapons, under conditions of storage, availability, and use consistent with military discipline. But with those restrictions under the political control of the states, not of the federal chain of military command. In short, I advocate a 2A regime consistent with the founders' understanding.
Good, because I am part of the militia.
Completely unorganized of course, but part of the militia nevertheless.
Kazinski, what makes you think you qualify? How old are you? What is your military experience?
I shudder to think how stupid your question is.
What makes you think that he doesn’t? The militias that mustered and defeated the British expeditionary force from Boston, sent to disarm them, in 1775, were not (any longer) state (or colony) sanctioned, the British governor-general in Boston having taken over the governance of the colony. Let me repeat that - our Revolutionary War began in response to the British government attempting to disarm the colony’s towns’ militias (plural). Any other interpretation of the term “militia” is ahistorical and revisionist.
Are you claiming that the right of the people to keep and bear arms is limited to those persons in active service?
When you advocate for availability of fully capable military weapons for militia use, are you doing so in reference to a second amendment right?
Of course it is in reference to a second amendment right.
I do not claim the right to keep and bear arms is limited to those in active service. I do claim there is zero historical evidence even to suggest the federal constitution, including the 2A, protects anything but the militia purpose.
Other purposes, including a right to armed self-defense, have since the founding been protected variously, mostly by state constitutions.
OK, so we agree that the right to bear arms applies to the people, not just to those in actual service. But, what evidence do you have that the right to bear arms in the federal constitution is so very different than the broad individual right protected in the various early state constitutions?
Moreover, are you really claiming that the right to keep and bear arms only protects the possession of those arms which are ineffective for collective defense, while claiming that only the militia purpose is protected? If the militia purpose is protected, which it clearly is, though not exclusively, then it follows that arms useful in civilized warfare are protected. See Aymette v TN (1840) which was cited in US v Miller.
Is effectiveness for militia use now a bad thing, rather than an obvious purpose of the declaration and guarantee of the Second Amendment?
Hansberry, I advocate fully automatic rifles for all legitimate militia purposes recognized by the Constitution. Those must be stored and used under customary military discipline, but kept outside the federal chain of command. In short, well-regulated, within the original meaning of the Constitution.
So you agree with the Aymette court that the citizens have the unqualified right to keep arms of the type used in civilized warfare, but only the right to bear them for the purpose of the common defense/militia uses. Is that right?
Why won't you answer?
But, what evidence do you have that the right to bear arms in the federal constitution is so very different than the broad individual right protected in the various early state constitutions?
You are confused about history. It is what it is. That is what happened. We know that because documentary evidence supports it.
We also know that gun advocates have ransacked the nation's archives searching for evidence to the contrary, and come up empty.
Scalia offered historically incompetent, tendentious arguments to the contrary. As history, Heller would be laughed out of any respectable graduate history seminar. Scalia's reasoning stacked a full catalog of historical methodological errors on top of each other, and announced conclusions even those did not support.
If there were even one historical citation to support gun advocates' claims about gun purposes in addition to the militia purpose, it would have been the only citation needed in Heller. That citation is not in the decision because it does not exist. It does not exist because so far as exhaustive historical research can show, nothing like it ever happened.
What documentary evidence supports it?
All the relevant evidence, without exception.
Hansberry — Nobody gets to announce this or that preference is Constitutionally mandated without being able to point to the mandate. So start pointing.
Gun advocates have compiled long lists of historically bogus claims you can start with. I will be happy to explain to you the historical principles which debunk them, one by one, if you want to play that game.
To simplify your task, start with the presumption that almost everything which happened after the Bill of Rights was ratified is historically irrelevant. Another simplification is the principle that a right protected elsewhere is in no way evidence that the Constitution made the right federal, and thus universal among states. To accept that would presumptively invalidate any state constitutional provisions which differ from the one chosen to be attributed federally. Without explicit contemporaneous evidence that happened, you cannot do that.
After those two simplifications, you will find yourself with precious little to work with. But we can get started if you want to. What's your first historical citation to prove a federal Constitutional purpose to protect use of private arms, other than the militia purpose?
"What's your first historical citation to prove a federal Constitutional purpose to protect use of private arms, other than the militia purpose?"
The text of the second amendment. It contains no qualifiers on the right guaranteed, not even the "for the common defense" language which caused so much debate regarding the MA constitution of 1780.
You lost that one with Heller. Sorry. That’s the law. It’s binding precedent by the United States Supreme Court.
While you are correct about Halbrook misrepresenting what an .223 will do to a squirrel, it's equally disingenuous to compare a rifle to a handgun and you must know that. Halbrook's point stands that the .223 is one of the LEAST powerful rifle rounds. The features you point out make the ar-15 uniquely suitable for civilian self-defense, and using a rifle ergonomically and ballistically similar to the standard US military issue weapon make it uniquely suitable for the "militia" component of the second amendment.
reasonable — Where the topic is not the comparative capacities of like weapons, but instead a focus on destructiveness generally—which is the framing Halbrook chose for the OP—there is nothing disingenuous about my comparison.
Nor are you correct about your assertion, "one of the LEAST powerful rifle rounds." To arrive at that conclusion you must invoke the same mistaken framing used by Halbrook. You both exclude every metric of destructive power except ballistic energy, despite the evident success of weapons engineers to find destructive power multipliers among other aspects of weapons design.
Yet, the ban doesn’t limit itself to .223/5.56 NATO. The ban includes .22 LR, as well as .50 BMG shot from the same platform.
"It is that uniquely engineered combination which makes the AR-15 unreasonably dangerous for civilian use."
The point of guns is that they are dangerous, dangerous to others. The fact that the vast majority of the population is law abiding, and that an easy to use dangerous weapon is available for use against criminals that prefer smaller concealable weapons is a plus.
And despite the 'unreasonable' danger of AR-15 rifle, less than 3% of murders annually are from rifles of any kind, fewer murders than by hammers or clubs.
The Supreme Court has been clear, potential criminal misuse is no excuse to infringe upon the rights of the law abiding.
Your description shows there are few other guns that would be more useful to a citizen militia than an AR-15.
Kazinski, I do not disagree with your last sentence.
It’s esp useful because the core of any militia raised to defend this country, is, by necessity, going to be our veterans, due to their military training. And the firearm that almost every veteran trained over the last more than half century, is the M16/M4, which shares most parts, as well as manual of arms, with the civilian AR-15. So, banning AR-15s significantly affects the ability of present day American militias to muster with the firearm that they are most familiar with and best trained to use.
"For hunting I enjoyed more, going after chukar partridges with a shotgun was more sporting. The chukar and the hunter were both in peril. That was a quarry which could literally kill a man, by exhausting him, chasing them over snake-infested sagebrush-covered mountainsides. "
You're going to run away from a 12" tall bird, and you claim it can put your life in peril?
Do GI Joe dolls scare you too?
"This is a complex subject, and the court just didn't do any real homework."
They already knew how they were going to rule, why do homework?
Just enough homework to get the result they wanted.
Anyone else shocked that the Hoplophobes didn't do their homework?
I carried the M16, then later the M4, for 29 years 6months and 6 days. I've put 10's of thousands of rounds through them. Including 3 tours in Iraq. At no point did a human being, struck with a 5.56mm round explode, liquify, blow up, disintegrate, atomize, or fall to pieces. It is an underpowered round that still managed to do the job (mostly), and, coupled with good tactics and some team work, is still a sufficient round for the military. But, looking ahead, particularly at advances made in body and vehicle armor, a new round should (and is) being adopted in order to defeat those advances. Meanwhile, back in civilian land, where armor is not something most people need to worry about in a self defense scenario, the round is sufficient to either kill an adversary, or at least make them regret their horrible decisions. The Left doesn't like it for that simple reason because, deep down, they really don't believe that Americans should be able to efficiently and capably defend themselves. Have at it.
I recall reading that one of the reasons for actual "assault rifles" using a lower power round, aside from the ability to carry more ammo, (Most of which was expected to be expended on suppressive fire, and thus didn't need to be particularly deadly.) was because from a military perspective it's actually better to wound the adversary than kill them: Either way they're largely out of commission, but a wounded soldier forces the adversary to expend resources on something other than fighting you.
So, ironically given gun controller rhetoric, being LESS deadly was one of the points of assault rifles compared to the earlier generation of battle rifles.
The military preaches, at least for now, that lethality is king. Most marksmanship training revolves around center mass targeting and volume of fire. Any advantage in wounding an enemy is simply a byproduct and assumes you're dealing with an adversary that cares about their wounded and/or has the capability of caring for their wounded. Remember, almost any piece of equipment that any soldier, in any army, in any period of history, has carried and utilized, is the cheapest made and tested to the most minimal standard requirement in order to save money. That's how you end up with 5.56mm. That fact, however, won't stop people from saying "OMG! This MILITARY ROUND, designed to obliterate humans, has NO place in personal defense of civilians!!!" And it's why they're wrong almost every time.
We train to center-mass because even hitting the biggest part of a moving target is hard (and unlike on the range, real targets in combat do move). Intentionally shooting to wound is, for all but the most exceptional shooters, a Hollywood fiction, not a reasonable expectation.
Intentional wounding is an acknowledged military tactic in other contexts. A variety of mines and traps through history were designed to maximize unit disruption by wounding rather than killing. But for direct combat? I remember Brett's story when I served but I always considered it a post-hoc rationalization by the M-16 manufacturers and congressional advocates, not an intentional design feature.
According to Colonel (Ret.) Craig Tucker, USMC (Retired), in his sworn expert report and declaration in Rupp v. Bonta, No. 8:17-cv-00746-JLS-JDE, (C.D. Ca.): "A single round is capable of severing the upper body from the lower body, or decapitation."
It's right there in paragraph 13: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ssSvFxcpQEgo9b0DJZhU2vptOYgTTsaQ/view
Declared under penalty of perjury!
He also said pistol grips and telescoping stocks make these weapons more lethal. That's in paragraph 14.
Surely you're not suggesting that a Marine Colonel (Ret.) would tell a fib in an official proceeding? Even after he swore up and down that every word was the God's honest truth? Say it isn't so!
He must have been confusing them with Jewish Space Lasers.
NOOC — You seem to be relying on a noxious gun industry screed written by Mark Oliva. It includes this:
I’m not doubting the colonel’s combat acumen. I certainly can’t say that’s what I saw in combat. I never witnessed a single 5.56mm round fired at the enemy decapitate or sever a human body in half. If this were true of the 5.56mm cartridge, it would beg the question why the military is spending millions to move to the 6.8mm Next Generation Squad Weapon, using a heavier caliber that carries more kinetic energy downrange. It would also beg the question of why the military also uses 7.62x51mm, .300 Winchester Magnum, .338 Lapua Magnum and .50 BMG caliber ammunition. If the 5.56mm cartridge were that devastating, there would clearly be no additional need for heavier bullets with more gunpowder behind them.
With that self-contradictory line of argument, Oliva must suppose a typically less-informed pro-gun audience will overlook details, and instead buy his nonsense based on its refutatory sound. But didn't you notice? He actually explained why the AR-15 could be devastating, but the military might still want more powerful small arms ballistics for different scenarios.
In short, Oliva told you, accurately, that the extra ballistic energy is useful to extend the range of a projectile going so fast that its ability to hit hard diminishes rapidly as it flies, due to air resistance. If for instance you want to deliver at long range the same destructive energy a .223 bullet from an AR-15 can deliver at short range, you need to start that long-range bullet out at a much higher energy level—most of which will be stripped away by air friction while the bullet is in flight to a more-distant target. At its target, that more-ballistically powerful round might deliver no more energy than the AR-15 .223 fired in a school room. It would not need to; in both cases the people shot are hit with similar deadly effect. Dead is dead. And within the ranges of ballistic energy typical of both scenarios, bullet placement is more important for lethality than bullet power
Thus, extending range—and capability to damage targets bigger and more rugged than humans—is the principal reason cartridges with more power than the .223 have been designed.
But note: there remains no question that the AR-15 delivers at ranges out to beyond 300 yards enough energy to kill a human efficiently. The Las Vegas attack settled that question, at a range of more than 500 yards.
Would a more energetic bullet kill more efficiently at 500 yards? Seems likely. Would the more energetic bullet kill more efficiently at 800 yards? No doubt about it.
But would the more energetic bullet kill more efficiently at ranges shorter than 100 yards? Almost certainly not. At that shorter range, the more powerful bullet would be at a disadvantage compared to the .223. Especially in a mass killing scenario. The heavier recoil of the more powerful weapon would disrupt its ability to aim accurately. A human target hit by it would be no deader than if hit by a comparably aimed round of .223 from an AR-15. And the AR-15 can be well-controlled in fully automatic fire (or with fully automatic simulated by a bump stock) by an ordinary shooter. Or in semi-automatic fire.
That is emphatically not so for the more powerful cartridges Oliva mentions. Without massive gun supports, combined with very heavy guns, those weapons cannot be rapidly repeat fired. It takes time to recover from recoil, and re-aim each shot.
At ranges shorter than a few hundred yards, the AR-15 is, by design, the more efficient killer. And that is especially so in the cases of amateur shooters, without military style training.
“ At ranges shorter than a few hundred yards, the AR-15 is, by design, the more efficient killer. And that is especially so in the cases of amateur shooters, without military style training.”
There is, as far as I know, no evidence to support that. It was the combination with a platform (M16/AR-15) that allowed controllable fully automatic, or even semiautomatic fire with rapid follow-up, that made that platform more effective, at the distances seen in Vietnam. The M16 replaced the M14, that was more deadly, on a per shot basis, but could not be easily controlled in fully automatic fire. And, the select fire M14 replaced the semiautomatic M1 Garand that required sight reacquisition for follow up shots (and didn’t provide for select fire). But one of the perennial complaints during the Vietnam war was that the 5.56 NATO cartridge was not as effective in killing enemies as was the 7.62 NATO utilized in the M14. 5.56 kills, on average, required more hits than 7.62 hits. It was just easier to get multiple 5.56 hits. And, of course, it turns out that 7.62 NATO was significantly more effective at the distances often encountered in Afghanistan.
The key to the effectiveness of modern assault rifles (and their civilian counterparts) was dropping the barrel to be in line with the shoulder. This effectively eliminated the vertical component of the force of recoil, greatly reducing, if not eliminating, muzzle climb. And having the barrel above the shoulder was necessitated by the position of the shooting hand on the gun. This was obviated by the use of a pistol grip. Which is to say that you are going to get muzzle rise without a pistol or pistol-like grip. This really didn’t matter much until, say, WW II, when muzzle climb slowed down accurate semiautomatic firing with the M1 Garand (most other armies were still using bolt action main battle rifles) but made accurate fully automatic fire almost impossible with a shoulder fired rifle, such as the M14. (I am suggesting here, that if the US military had adopted the 7.62 AR-10, instead of the M14, they may never have gone to the AR-15 platform).
I know little about guns. Do AR-15 cartridges all have the same load?
Of course not.
The number of loads and bullet weights (and types) for all types of ammunition is staggering.
But it's worth noting that none of them can do the things alleged by Judge Wilkinson.
The AR-15 is more powerful than the M2 Browning. Far too dangerous for the hoi polloi.
Source: activist judges and Dunning-Kruger rejects like SL.
Vinni — On the basis of actual experience, the AR-15 has proved demonstrably more dangerous to the public than the M2 Browning. That is not even open to question. One incident, the Las Vegas attack, settles the question.
You might hypothesize that an M2 Browning could have made that worse. There is no experience to prove it; perhaps because some aspect of the M2 Browning—including the legal regime used to manage it—makes it less adaptable to such attacks.
Well, maybe that was because M2 HMGs are nearly impossible to procure by civilians, thanks to the NFA and esp Clinton’s GCA. The death toll in Las Vegas would likely have been far higher with a M2 HMG, or even a M60/M240 MG, both from the ballistics side, as well as the ability to aim fully automatic fire.
Besides, the shooter was also utilizing heavier caliber cartridges, along with the .223/5.56. He had a lot of guns, in multiple calibers, and utilized a number of them.
AR-15-type firearms are available in in a number of calibers, ranging from .22LR to .50AE, with lots of stuff in between (and maybe bigger or smaller ones exist that I'm not familiar with). I personally have AR-15 type rifles in .22LR, 5.56x45 NATO, 6.8 SPC, .300 Blackout, and .458 SOCOM (and that doesn't include the AR-10 types in 7.65x51 NATO and 6.5 Creedmoor). And in any particular caliber, there is a wide variety of bullet types and weights. You could find dozens if not hundreds of different loads (different combinations of bullet designs, calibers, weights, velocities, etc.) that can be fired from some variation of the AR platform.
Yes, but...you are an enthusiast. The vast majority of AR-15s are 5.56x45, and the most common loads are the XM193, 55 grain FMJ, and XM855, 62 grain green tip, plus the commercial variants of these with essentially the same loads.
But that wasn’t what the ban covered. It covers AR-15s chambered from .22 all the way up to .50.
Author has an error in this sentence: "Hyperbole aside, a .30-08 deer rifle round would cause much more injury." He can talk about hte 30-06 or about the .308, both suitable rounds for deer rifles. But he can't conflate them. It's a nit, I know, but he is criiticizing the court for not doing proper research, so he should pay attention to such details himself.
This is an example of “stealth judicial notice”. Ask whether a lawyer’s request for judicial notice that as a matter of common knowledge Proposition X is true; and then insert the judge’s assertion as that proposition. Should the request be granted or denied? If it should be denied, then the judge has no business inserting their anecdotal observations into the record as fact. This is especially true in the case of old judges remarking on events of more than 50 years earlier.