The Volokh Conspiracy
Mostly law professors | Sometimes contrarian | Often libertarian | Always independent
Justice Thomas Reverses President Trump's Executive Overreach in Cargill v. Garland
Justices Sotomayor, Jackson, and Kagan disregard ATF’s “about face.”
I was in the Court when Trump v. Hawaii was handed down. I remember the scorn with which Justice Sotomayor referred to "President Donald Trump" by name. It was visceral. However, in Cargill v. Garland, Justice Sotomayor name-dropped President Trump in a good way. She wrote:
Shortly after the Las Vegas massacre, the Trump administration, with widespread bipartisan support, banned bump stocks as machineguns under the statute.
Now, there is no reason to mention the President's name when referring to a rulemaking. It was a regulation promulgated by ATF, not signed by the President. But the import here is that even a right-wing fascist like Trump thinks this rule is sensible. Moreover, it is strange to think of a regulation having "bipartisan support." Usually, when people on both sides of the aisle agree on a policy, legislators pass a statute, which the President can sign. But there was no statutory amendment here. Indeed, President Trump was quite clear that he didn't want Congress to pass a statute, and directed ATF to change the rule. Presidential administration in action! (Justice Kagan probably was proud.)
However, I saw the dynamics as presidential maladministration. ATF had a long-standing interpretation in which bump stocks were not machine guns. After the Las Vegas mass killing, there were calls to abandon that long-standing interpretation. The President directed his agencies to abandon that long-standing interpretation. And wouldn't you know it, ATF reaches the exact result the President wanted. I called it a presidential reversal. In 2019, I advanced this position in amicus briefs filed on behalf of the Cato Institute back before the Tenth Circuit and the D.C. Circuit.
Justice Thomas gestured towards this maladministration:
- "ATF abruptly reversed course in response to a mass shooting in Las Vegas, Nevada. In October 2017, a gunman fired on a crowd attending an outdoor music festival in Las Vegas, killing 58 people and wounding over 500 more."
- "This tragedy created tremendous political pressure to outlaw bump stocks nationwide."
- "While the first wave of bills was pending, ATF began considering whether to reinterpret §5845(b)'s definition of 'machinegun' to include bump stocks."
- "ATF's about-face drew criticism from some observers, including those who agreed that bump stocks should be banned."
- "The final Rule also repudiated ATF's previous guidance that bump stocks did not qualify as 'machineguns' under §5845(b)."
- "Moreover, it is difficult to understand how ATF can plausibly argue otherwise, given that its consistent position for almost a decade in numerous separate decisions was that §5845(b) does not capture semiautomatic rifles equipped with bump stocks."
- "Curiously, the dissent relegates ATF's about-face to a footnote, instead pointing to its classification of other devices."
And here is Justice Sotomayor's footnote, in part:
The majority emphasizes that ATF previously took the position that certain bump-stock devices were not "machinegun[s]" under the statute. See ante, at 3, 19. ATF, however, has repeatedly classified other devices that modify semiautomatic rifles by allowing a single activation of the shooter to automate repeat fire as machineguns.
All of the Court's six conservatives found this statute unambiguously does not support the bump stock ban. However, the en banc Fifth Circuit could only muster eight votes for that position—one short of a majority. Please recognize that the en banc Fifth Circuit is not as conservative as critics would tell you. The other Fifth Circuit appeals that the Supreme Court heard this year did not go through the en banc court: FDA v. AHM, Rahimi, NetChoice, and CFPB. In any high-profile en banc case, there are three of four moderate Republican appointees who can vote with the Court's Democratic appointees. If those Republican appointees judges end up taking senior status during a second Trump administration, I think the en banc court would look very different.
Editor's Note: We invite comments and request that they be civil and on-topic. We do not moderate or assume any responsibility for comments, which are owned by the readers who post them. Comments do not represent the views of Reason.com or Reason Foundation. We reserve the right to delete any comment for any reason at any time. Comments may only be edited within 5 minutes of posting. Report abuses.
Please
to post comments
Is not the issue whether a 'bump stock' can be used to increase a possible crime by allowing a greater weapon discharge rate versus not having a 'bump stock' ?
The original purpose was said to allow handicaped shooters / plinkers to enjoy the active life of blasting away at 'targets' with an improved means which utilizes a bump stock equal to what other un-handicaped can do.
No, that is not the issue.
As Noscutur said, no that is not the issue. Nor is that the "original purpose" of bump stocks.
You are mixing up bump stocks with pistol braces.
I've seen very little evidence that a bump stock would make any crime more deadly. I'm not convinced the shooter in LV couldn't have done the same carnage with a regular semi-auto rifle. It isn't that hard to fire rapidly when you are from an elevated position with a dense crowd below you and you have tons of fully loaded mags waiting to go.
That might be right, but that's not the legal issue either.
"Usually, when people on both sides of the aisle agree on a policy, legislators pass a statute, which the President can sign. But there was no statutory amendment here. Indeed, President Trump was quite clear that he didn't want Congress to pass a statute, and directed ATF to change the rule."
My impression was that the aim here was to bleed off the temporary political demand for legislation with a regulation which was inevitably going to be struck.down, only after the moral panic had subsided.
Then, to everybody's shock, the lower courts upheld it. Everybody having forgotten the power of "But, guns!" In the judiciary.
And whence did you derive that impression?
From being an NRA member who has been following this fight for half a century.
I thought Trump would sign bipartisan legislation no questions asked.
So, in other words, from nothing at all, since being an NRA member gives you exactly zero insight into the motivations of any particular individual.
So NRA members don't know or talk to other NRA members?
Unless one of those other NRA members that NRA members were talking to was Donald Trump, how would that tell Brett what Donald Trump's intentions were?
I agree with that analysis. What the executive branch does on its own it can reverse on its own - and quickly.
Not that quickly, as Trump found out to his chagrin multiple times. The APA requires more — much more — than just announcing that a regulation is bad and you don't like it and it's therefore abolished.
That was more Trumplaw. The liberal judges had no issue finding Trump's actions "arbitrary and capricious" when they never found any Democrat Party presidential action to be such.
The entire point of Brett Bellmore’s claim is that the administration was not going to reverse the policy on its own (which, you’ll recall, they didn’t).
Other than that, great comment!
Covering for Trump going after gun rights.
Unsourced speculation as your all so common outrage in gun threads falls before how hard you have bought the cult of personality.
I don't even understand that comment, except that it seems quite snarky.
I think Brett's analysis is right on, and it would apply to many executive orders and administrative rule changes that any president might do. Look at Biden with the border stuff, for example.
Far from covering for Trump, Brett is indicating that Trump could act cynically, pacifying everyone at the moment knowing he can reverse to appease the gun lobby.
It’s telepathy not analysis,
Not telepathy. It is mere speculation that everyone is entitled to
Speculation such that Trump can do no wrong is indeed something you are entitled to.
And we can all see what that says,
I made an anodyne comment about your foolish charge of telepathy.
Your response is either
1) Your typical dishonesty accusing me of supporting the Orange Clown. And we can all see what that says about you.
Or
2) A poor and misleading choice of words that seems to say option 1), in which case I accept your apology.
“He’s not reading minds! He’s just completely making it up!” isn’t exactly the rousing defense you seem to think it is.
It was not a defense. I made an anodyne comment prompted by a stupid charge of telepathy–which as we all know does not exist.
a stupid charge of telepathy–which as we all know does not exist.
Wait, do you think I was saying that telepathy exists and Brett has it?
Without stupid charges of telepathy, Sarcastr0 would only post half as often.
Bump stocks hardly implicate gun rights.
I think they can be legally banned by legislation because they are dangerous and unusual and thus are not protected by the 2nd amendment.
But the Supreme Court was certainly correct in striking the regulation, because the ATF should be given no discretion in interpreting legislation as the attempt to outlaw pistol braces shows, they seldom act in good faith in implementing legislation.
An agency that expects hyper technical exactitude from people subject to regulation, should be held to the same standard in promulgating regulations under the law. No tolerance works both ways.
It implicates gun rights only because this gross over-reach involved guns, not something unrelated to a civil liberty. And because the law they were misconstruing is itself a 2nd amendment violation as correctly interpreted.
As it’s the right to ‘every terrible implement of the soldier’, machine guns are particularly protected as having military utility. Bump stocks are a technically inferior way of converting a civilian arm into an arm that actually does meet Miller’s test for military utility.
But, of course, the Court’s majority wants to convert the actual right to one to ‘every non-threatening implement of the Rudd.’
There would be little or no market for devices like bump stocks or forced reset triggers absent the Hughes Amendment.
In the 1980’s, gun abolitionists thought they were on a roll. In today’s far more robust Second Amendment environment, it’s hard to see any objective public safety benefit from outlawing new civilian machine guns if they remain under NFA control.
Given that everything else under NFA control was essentially a drafting error because it was originally intended to encompass ordinary handguns, the only real valid application of the NFA today would be machine guns.
Some sort of grand compromise ought to be possible. Of course, it isn’t because doing so would gut the raison d'être of multiple advocacy organizations on both sides.
I've actually attacked both the NRA and Trump over this. Trump has no principled concern for the 2nd amendment. But he would have normally refrained to avoid pissing off an important constituency, which puts him ahead of your average RINO, who would be willing to take the hit for (non-conservative) ideological reasons.
Only the NRA leadership thought it was a good time to throw some more members under the bus, and told him they'd cover for him. (Which they did.)
Sure they did it expecting the regulation to be struck down BEFORE taking effect, but it was still unprincipled.
“ My impression was that the aim here was to bleed off the temporary political demand for legislation” is not a plan to avoid pissing off gun rights folks.
You have switched narratives in midstream.
I have no use for the NRA.
Hahaha! Time to pack it all in, Wayne—you’ve lost Dr. Ed.
Actually, he was forced to pack it in months ago.
It's only a "cult of personality" when it's not the speaker's guy.
Blackman seems perturbed. He objects that when new evidence delivered news that previous regulatory interpretations were mistaken, and bump stocks really did function as machine guns, dissenting justices took notice.
What was demonstrated in Las Vegas was that bump stocks could deliver from an allegedly private-style firearm, at a range greater than anyone expected, casualty counts unheard of in human history, except in the cases of machine guns used in warfare. To prevent that outcome was, of course, the entire point of the regulation, both before the Las Vegas attack, and afterward.
When incontrovertible evidence showed the previous regulatory interpretation was improper—in the constitutional sense of, "improper," meaning incapable to deliver the result intended—then American constitutionalism not only permitted but demanded that the improper regulation be abandoned, and replaced with one which was capable to deliver the constitutionally legitimate result the law intended. Which is what the ATF did.
The decision as decided is egregiously wrong. Events are destined to prove that presently, in some context more convincing even to gun nuts on the Court—perhaps if they get to witness in person a Las Vegas-style attack on a crowd celebrating a presidential inauguration.
It really does matter whether a means chosen by Congress to achieve a constitutionally legitimate purpose is capable to do it. That is the principle which has not changed, except in the feckless reasoning of a pro-gun majority on the Court.
"It really does matter whether a means chosen by Congress to achieve a constitutionally legitimate purpose is capable to do it."
Absurd. It the statute as written by Congress is at odds textually with a regulation implementing it, then the regulation is invalid. Even if it is true to the purpose of the legislation.
In about 7 months when Trump is innuagerated again, do you want him regulating based on what he deems the purpose of the legislature is, regardless of the text?
Wow, there is literally nothing right in that comment. Bump stocks to not function as machine guns, the casualties and range in Las Vegas were not "unheard of in human history" and American constitutionalism does not permit executive regulations to be arbitrarily "abandoned and replaced" without legislative enablement. If the means chosen by Congress fails to achieve its desired end, the fix must come from Congress.
It's Fathers Day. Allow Lathrop his unhinged rant.
We love democracy! Until we don't.
As always, Lathrop retreats to his mindless mantras because he hasn't learned anything about law (at least post 1790) but thinks he has. This case had nothing whatsoever to do with your mistaken understanding of the Constitution or the necessary and proper clause. The entire question here was what the "means chosen by Congress" were.
Nieporent — There is no question what the means chosen by Congress were. Congress legislated a legitimate end—to protect civilian society from machine guns. The specific means they chose to accomplish that was to use policies enacted per the APA by the ATF. In this case, the ATF, under intense political pressure, blundered, and enacted an improper policy, demonstrably incapable to accomplish the legitimate end enacted by Congress.
No, it isn’t. (Doing it that way might have raised different issues, but it’s not what happened.) The means they chose was to 1. Pass a law making it illegal to possess a machinegun and 2. Pass another statute defining machinegun, in a way that does not encompass bump stocks.
3. And then to discover by disastrous demonstration that they were mistaken, and that bump stocks do function as machine guns—by enabling a single shooter firing at a range of ~500 yards, to inflict nearly 600 casualties. How can you support that and live with yourself?
If Congress discovers that it was mistaken about something, Congress is free to pass a law correcting said mistake. But Congress did not pass a law banning 'guns that shoot real fast.' It banned a specific thing.
Nope, Nieporent. Congress passed a Constitutionally legitimate law to ban machine guns. It delegated to the ATF the task to define machine guns. As subsequently proved by experience, the ATF chose an improper means to reach the end sought when Congress passed its legitimate legislation.
That legislation remains legitimate. The ATF’s error changes that legitimacy not at all.
The ATF was justified to correct its mistake, and substitute a proper means. It got bi-partisan policy support in both political branches when it did so. But a politically unaccountable and minoritarian Supreme Court, intent on partisan policy usurpations, intervened.
The Court asserts nonsensically that correction of an administrative error invalidates an entirely legitimate law. It does that because the Court rejects the law itself, and wants occasion to sweep it away for reasons transparently related to partisan politics. How transparently? As transparently as a corrupt justice saying in a forum open to the public that he is intent on his side winning.
You applaud that. Or perhaps you applaud the winning, but deplore the transparency. You are ideologically supportive of the notion that whatever hampers the administrative state is okay, no matter how arbitrary, or how contrary to centuries-old Constitutional landmark precedent.
You enjoy knowing an illegitimate Supreme Court shares your ideology—even though the Court has not yet mustered effrontery sufficient to overturn explicitly the Necessary and Proper clause. A clause for which you have previously expressed distaste, if not contempt. Until that happens, the Court—and apparently you too—will content yourselves with workarounds.
That does not look like American constitutionalism to me, or constitutionalism of any kind. It looks like opportunism, exercised by political ideologues.
A note in passing. The definitive precedent on the Necessary and Proper clause dates to 1819, not 1790.
Once again: no, it didn’t. It instead enacted a statute that defined “machinegun”.
No. It. Didn't.
Congress defined machine guns in the statute. There was no such delegation.
"bump stocks do function as machine guns—by enabling a single shooter firing at a range of ~500 yards, to inflict nearly 600 casualties"
This may come as a surprise, but that has nothing to do with the legal definition of 'machine gun.'
How many bullets come out with each pull of the trigger when a firearm has an attached bump stock, Lathrop? It's a pretty simple question, and yet somehow I think you'll still get it wrong.
Cavanaugh — Even more surprising? An administrative error to choose an improper means—subsequently and properly corrected—does nothing to justify a demand to rewrite the still-legitimate law which occasioned both the error and the correction.
No doubt we will be discussing that with more specific focus presently, after the partisan Supreme Court decrees that administrative errors always justify the Court to invalidate laws the Court seeks to reject for reasons of partisan politics.
It may have been "legitimate," but that doesn't make it constitutional.
The 2nd Amendment was clearly intended to protect military arms. Today, that means machine guns.
Stephen Lathrop 9 hours ago
Flag Comment
Mute User
“Blackman seems perturbed. He objects that when new evidence delivered news that previous regulatory interpretations were mistaken, and bump stocks really did function as machine guns, dissenting justices took notice.”
fwiw - 2A definitely conveys and individual right & machine guns can be constitutionally barred with violating 2A
What new information?
Bump stocks still require a pull of the trigger for each firing.
Just how did the events in Las Vegas change the statutory definition of machine gun?
Hey Sonja T.
How do you decide which sock puppet account to use on any given day? Why did you create more than one account? Finally, how pathetic are you to do so?
Gun control measures that have overwhelming public support are dead letters in Congress, thanks to the gun lobby. The only way to get things done is by regulation or executive order.
Both of which are unconstitutional.
And it's not the gun lobby, which is much smaller and with much less money than many people imagine. It's that congress members' constituents are overwhelmingly pro-gun.
Sure, better yet a dictator.
Ain't you about to get one of them in November?
Only for Jan. 21, 2025.
If those gun control measures really have overwhelming public support, they'd be passed regardless of the "gun lobby". The fact that they very consistently do not get passed should be a clue that maybe they don't have the "overwhelming public support" you think.
This is not a matter for debate. All you have to do is look at the opinion polls.
So now you want "government" via opinion polls?
S_0 always tells us that polls are worthless.
They are certainly no substitute for Congressional courage.
Not something I say, Don.
Are you mixing me up with Bob from Ohio of all people?
That could be.
And the Democrats were shocked, shocked the latino hoi polloi, clinger Catholics all, voted in favor of California Prop 8, causing it to pass. “Overwhelming support”, well, we love democracy. Until we don’t.
BTW I have no problem overturning laws if it increases personal freedom. I do have a problem if it increases government power in unforseen ways that would have been laughed at as unconstitutional for a century or two.
But I am not one who holds vox populi vox dei as a value. That concept is one of the golf clubs in the dictator’s bag of tools of tyranny. Politicians regularly speak of democracy, in that sense, which is philosophy to empower them. They rarely speak of freedom, which means freedom...from them.
The former allows for much easier cosmic gnosis melding with the karma flows of the universe as their House-like investmen-savant spouses suddenly discover their superpower, like a tween in comics seeing their mommy threatened.
Krayt thinks is people vote for something you need to like it or else you hate democracy.
Legitimate is not the same as right.
Noting something is anti majoritarian is not by itself a good argument against it, but it can be part of a larger narrative of ruling from the minority.
"All you have to do is look at the opinion polls."
lol, lmao
Rossami — that comment stands on a par with the nonsense the Court announced in Citizens United—that corporate donations, and resulting appearance of special access to politicians, will not cause Americans to distrust their political system.
The “gun lobby” conspicuously supported the regulation at issue in this case.
The NRA, anyway; The least principled segment of the 'gun lobby', barring false flag operations.
But they did so tactically to avert legislation, not on account of actually favoring the policy.
Suppose someone didn’t want to rely on your experience of being an NRA member before believing that. What’s the strongest piece of evidence you’d point them to?
What if someone developed a glove that had a motor built in, and moved your trigger finger at the maximum rate at which your semi-automatic rifle could fire, i.e., pull the trigger and allow it to reset. The rifle is not a machine gun. The glove is not a machine gun. Is the combination a machine gun?
Yes, by long standing precedent.
But not if your glove just had a spring pressing on your finger.
Can you please elaborate?
I think (hope) that was sarc.
No, it wasn't! 🙂
Unfortunately so.
I didn't write the law.
That's literally the precedent.
https://gatcrank.com/
Do the same with a motor? Machine gun.
Interesting. I always wondered why a Gatling gun is legal but a machine gun is not. I mean, with a Gatling gun, there's no trigger to pull!
The crank is the 'trigger', and you have to manually keep moving it to keep firing. Add a motor and the on switch for the motor becomes the trigger.
"Interesting. I always wondered why a Gatling gun is legal but a machine gun is not."
Because Congress is not half as good at drafting laws as they think they are.
Could they have crafted a definition of machine gun that would cover civil war era Gatling guns and bump stocks? Yes, but that's not what they actually wrote.
If Congress intends Y but writes X, tough shit, X controls.
They were not half as aggressively hostile to gun ownership as today's Democrats, either. So they often weren't trying to be comprehensive.
And it's awfully hard to fire a Gatling gun from the running board of a Model A Ford.
This exactly. If the constitution and laws written and passed under it are to ultimately be enforced through the use of force, then they should not go beyond the text and referenced material. Documentation should be easily accessible and dictionaries being used should be included as references. A person under a political entity's jurisdiction should not have to read tea leaves so to speak.
If there were to be exceptions to items in the constitution then why not just include clauses stating exceptions. Otherwise, you have the text.
Incorporation is one thing that is a little weird to me regarding the constitution. It would have been written in the frame of the federal government but then do those incorporated elements have an equivalent meaning when applied to the states? Bear in mind I am not trained in law but these sorts of questions are interesting to me.
Based on this decision (i.e. Garland v Cargill (2024)), and a correct interpretation of the law, the answer would be no. The combination still wouldn’t be firing more than one shot by “a single function of the trigger.” By your description the trigger would be resetting between each round fired and subsequent fired rounds would require additional functions of the trigger.
While we're on the topic of machine guns, I have a question. Years ago I was competing in what's called the Service Rifle Match using an AR-15, the civilian equivalent of the M16. I had installed a competition trigger, a marked improvement over the stock Colt trigger. Well, the one I installed was defective, and during the prone rapid fire stage of the match (at 300 yards), my rifle went full auto. (I managed to keep them all in the black!) At that moment was I breaking the law by having a machine gun?
p.s. I returned the trigger for a replacement.
In theory it did become a machine gun, but the BATF in its infinite mercy doesn't prosecute such cases unless they have it in for you.
Wouldn't there be liability for the trigger manufacturer?
The closest case I can be bothered to find right now is Staples v. United States 511 U.S. 600 (1994). The court ruled 7-2 that Staples could not be convicted of criminal possession of a machinegun without proof that he knew it was a machinegun as opposed to some other dangerous weapon. Until you discover it fires more than one shot per trigger pull you should be good. What to do after that to stay legal I can't say.
Around here it is customary when possession of a weapon suddenly becomes illegal, say due to a restraining order being issued, to give the owner a chance to surrender the weapon to police.
Is there anything more stupid than pretending the entire Executive Branch changes stripes when a new President comes in?
Deep State, unaccountable lifers didn't magically become conservative when Trump came into office.
Back to the spoils system?
Anything has to be better than being governed by what's essentially a 4th branch of permanent, partisan, and stupid bureaucrats who are unaccountable to no one.
accountable to no one 🙂
If you think everybody is against you, maybe you're paranoid. Or, every time someone you thought was a supporter, who then disagreed, you then tweeted what a worthless traitor and disaster that person was, until everyone is actually against you, then maybe they are all against you and you are not paranoid.
If you are not with us, you are against us. I usually apply that unfortunate concept from religion, part of what makes religion evil, to modern woke behavior from the left (it is literally a tenet of the How To Be An Anti-Racist book) but as we see here, it's use is bipartisan!
'If you are not with us, you are against us.'
Krayt still struggling with the concept of people disagreeing with each other.
However, I saw the dynamics as presidential maladministration. ATF had a long-standing interpretation in which bump stocks were not machine guns. After the Las Vegas mass killing, there were calls to abandon that long-standing interpretation. The President directed his agencies to abandon that long-standing interpretation. And wouldn't you know it, ATF reaches the exact result the President wanted. I called it a presidential reversal.
Events lead to a change in policy. The horror!!!
But the ATF did not have that authority.
Well, that is the argument.
OTOH, changes resulting from events showing a need to change existing policy within the acceptable limits are appropriate.
Maybe, but that wasn't Josh's point.
He seems outraged by the very idea a policy could be changed in response to events.
The problem is that this isn’t supposed to be a policy: it’s supposed to be an interpretation of statutory language. Changing what you say a statute means because you want a different result is very much not how it’s supposed to work.
The argument -- you might not agree with it -- is that the statute allowed the regulation. They did not just "want" a different result.
Flexibility in statutes that allow administrative policies to respond to current realities is part of how things are supposed to work.
Now, if you assume they "changed" the law, that would a problem whatever the reason, including if it helped their financial backers. But, that is assuming the conclusion.
And it was a crap argument. Congress defined a machine gun as a gun that fired multiple rounds from one pull of the trigger.
The "argument" for bump stocks being covered is that one could use one to make a semi-automatic rifle fire nearly as fast as a machine gun.
But that's not the test. Congress did not define machine gun by its rate of fire. It defined it by how many rounds would fire from ONE pull of the trigger. That's it.
That's not the argument—no one is suggesting that the statute gives the ATF the authority to decide what the definition of a machinegun is. The only way that the decision to enforce a ban on bump stocks is permissible, is if they fit under the definition established by Congress. And that's an exercise in interpretation, not policymaking.
Nobody except gun nuts wanted a different result. The others always wanted the same result—protection of the public from machine guns.
Gun nuts like… the Obama-era ATF, which expressly concluded that bump stocks aren’t machineguns?
Nobody except senile editors of a failed newspaper wanted a different result.
See how that shit works?
Is the site uncommonly slow for others, especially when posting comments?
Yes. Thought it was just me and it was down for a while yesterday.
I'd assumed it was on account of slow WiFi and international roaming. (Back in the US as of yesterday, should reach home in a few hours.)
Will you be playing "Back in the USSR"?
Yup.
a right-wing fascist like Trump
Look at that... A stopped clock and all that.
Cops aren;t lawmakers.
I'd like cops to have more power to keep us safe from the crook and the mugger and the carjacker and the gang member.
But that extra power can only come from lawmakers; cops can't take that extra power for themselves.
The liberal Supreme Court analyst at Vox argued that there are different reasonable interpretations of the statute. Thus, the ultimate deciding factor is the ideological judgments of the justices.
https://www.vox.com/scotus/355399/supreme-court-bump-stocks-machine-guns-garland-cargill
This is going to be true -- even if both camps think the result is "obvious" in opposite directions -- for many Supreme Court disputes. It will turn on what criteria are used to decide.
Some disputes will be clearer than others. Thus, some rulings will be unanimous or nearly so. The division might not be a stereotypical 6-3. But, at the SCOTUS level, value judgment calls have to be made.
My bottom line here is that the agency should have broad deference. Agencies have always had broad discretion. Experts have discussed this in detail. It is also a sane public policy. Broad discretion doesn't mean total discretion.
Alito himself granted this was not a Second Amendment issue. Congress could ban bump stocks. Some disagree or raise other constitutional claims. Only if there are constitutional problems is this as much like the travel ban or some other Trump policies.
Agency discretion can respond to events.
I doubt the majority is correct. But, that is how I would balance things.
"Please recognize that the en banc Fifth Circuit is not as conservative as critics would tell you."
Sure, Jan.
From the article:
This claim is a little difficult to take seriously (and not just because it comes from Ian Millhiser). At best, I think you can kind of squint and work really hard to get there, you can kind of figure out a way to parse the statute that doesn’t totally foreclose covering bump stocks. And even there, it’s a reach. I absolutely refuse to believe that anyone not trying to reach a particular outcome would have any hesitation about how to read it, much less think that it’s a 50/50 call.
The lower courts split on the issue. Not just three liberals on the Supreme Court. But, you “absolutely refuse to believe” there can be a disagreement on good faith without arguing from an assumed conclusion and working background.
I think that is very understandable. Disagreement on what seems totally clear — even though reasonable people disagree — is common. Then, obviously, the people who get it “wrong” are biased. They are making things up. They are illegitimate and so on.
Millhiser is defending the majority as a reasonable take. Many liberals disagree. They scornfully said the majority was dead wrong.
“Equally permissible” depends on the rules of interpretation. That might be a bit strong, but I think he's correct on the bottom line.
I'm not sure that "good faith" is an especially illuminating way to look at it. I have no doubt at all that the jurists who supported the ATF interpretation genuinely and sincerely believed that they were doing the right thing when they contorted the meaning of the statute to reach the result they thought was right, because they think that judges should be reaching the right policy result, and would be doing the wrong thing to let the strict language of the statute handcuff them. I don't think that's the right judicial philosophy, but I don't think there's anything "bad faith" about applying it openly and honestly.
Sounds like you're reading in a lot that isn't there! I don't think the minority are biased. Or making things up. Or illegitimate. Just wrong.
I think he's dead wrong. In particular, I don't think there's any basis to believe that the majority justices prefer this policy result, much less that they let that preference influence the outcome. (Especially when one of them went out of his way to say he doesn't like it and wants Congress to fix it!)
Alito didn't actually say that Congress could prohibit bump stocks consistent with the 2nd Amendment. He wasn't ruling on the 2nd Amendment at all.
The more accurate way to describe this ruling is that the USSC restored an Obama era ATF program that Trump ended. I don't understand all the democrat angst, I would think this was a win for them.
One thing is very clear. If civilians don't "need" machine guns, then police don't either.
That the Democrats always want to exempt law enforcement demonstrates their bad faith.