Monday Open Thread

Merry Christmas!

Comments

[ThePublius]

Merry Christmas, Prof. Volokh, and all of the conspirators and commenters!

[Brett Bellmore]

Store bought puff pastry sheets are not really big enough for making a beef Wellington, extra seams were needed. And for some inexplicable reason, the wax paper pieces between the folds were just barely short of big enough to keep it from touching itself and sticking together.

Managed somehow, though. I'll report on how it came out this evening.

Merry Christmas, all!

[ThePublius]

I hope it works out! I love beef Wellington. I'm surprised you didn't make your own dough, it's really quite simple and gratifying. I use nothing but flour, butter, and ice water. Same dough I make for Scottish steak pies, etc. Tip: get a pasty blender.

[Brett Bellmore]

Think I will, next time. (Since I bought the whole tenderloin, and got two roasts and a steak out of it, there will be a next time.)

I was really sweating, but it came out great.

[Mr. Bumble]

Beef Wellington sounds like a wrestler's name. Hope yours wins the match.

Wishing everyone at the VC a most Merry Christmas!

[Nige]

Beef Wellington vs Chicken Napoleon.

[Dan Schiavetta]

¡Feliz Navidad!

[Dr. Ed 2]

Christmas was way more political during the cold war than people realize.

"Do you see what I see what I see" was actually about the Cuban Missile Crisis: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/do-you-hear-what-i-hear-conjures-images-of-peace-everywhereand-nuclear-annihilation-180979292/

The Grinch who Stole Christmas was about Stalin and the Communist's attempts to steal Christmas. During the Cold War, they used to put a large Christmas tree up on top of a building so it could be seen in East Berlin.

[darkknight9]

And also "Do you hear what I hear" was setting up the future secret micro audio wave weapons facing the US Embassy.

Merry Christmas 😀

[Dr. Ed 2]

Other than the fact that the Owl's Head lighthouse marks the southern edge of ROCKLAND harbor, this story is true: https://getpocket.com/explore/item/the-flying-santas-who-airdrop-christmas-cheer-to-america-s-lighthouse-keepers?utm_source=pocket-newtab-en-us

After WWII, the families were supposed to return to the lighthouses but the USCG, which had taken over the lighthouses during the war, never gave them back and then automate them.

[Sarcastr0]

Dr. Seuss claimed he was the inspiration for the character, as his wife's health problems and his dismay with the commercialization of Christmas made him feel "very Grinchish" as he looked in the mirror one year on December 26.

Dr. Seuss wrote the book quickly and was mostly finished with it within a few weeks.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_the_Grinch_Stole_Christmas

[Dr. Ed 2]

He said...

Look at the stuff he drew during WWII for the Army -- parodies of Japanese.

[Frank Drackman]

wait till you find out what Harry S. Truman did.

[Sarcastr0]

Dunno how as any kind of evidence that the Grinch was Stalin.

[loki13]

Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays!

I hope that everyone has a joyful day, and spends it finding the things that unite us with the people we know around us, instead of arguing over the things that divide us with randos on the internet.

[Nelson]

Wait, arguing with randos on the internet isn't joyful? Then why are we all here?

Sarcasm is my gift to all of you this Christmas.

[Nige]

It's a safe space for all of us.

[Nige]

The way we all come on here and have massive rows over and over means that, in a way, we are always there for each other.

[Mr. Bumble]

Please speak for yourself as you usually do.
Happy Christmas.

[Nige]

Love you too. Merry Xmas.

[Dan Schiavetta]

It's better than arguing with people you have to live with day by day.

[Nige]

Well, they're stubbornly reasonable and nice, impossible to argue with that.

[Nelson]

The VC comments: better than Thanksgiving dinner with drunk uncle Frank!

Seems like a low bar.

[SRG2]

Merry Christmas to all celebrants!

[Ed Grinberg]

https://jewishinsider.com/2023/12/former-adl-ajc-leaders-abe-foxman-and-david-harris-call-for-scrapping-dei/

They finally figured it out!
(Conservatives have been screaming about the evils of this ideology since it first reared its ugly head.)

[Dr. Ed 2]

More interesting, from the same website, is this: https://jewishinsider.com/2023/12/penny-pritzker-harvard-president-claudine-gay-barack-obama/

This is Obama's 3rd term, and it's starting to unravel.

[John F. Carr]

For those who remember the Cold War, happy Gorbachev resignation day.

[Dr. Ed 2]

I didn't realize he'd resigned on Christmas.

[Nelson]

Peace and joy to all. I hope your year was a good one and that next year is even better.

[Defenderz]

Happy Ceausescu execution day. The world was rid of an evil communist. People like him were the forebears of the modern Democrat Party.

[Joe_dallas]

He was one of the few communist leaders that died the way he should have

[Krayt]

"Make sure you don't shoot him in the face. That way the people will know he is truly dead."

[ObviouslyNotSpam]

You mean the MAGAt Republicans, but I share the sentiment.

[Ed Grinberg]

"On December 19, 2023, the Colorado Supreme Court ruled that [Donald] Trump was disqualified from holding office and that his name must be removed from the Colorado Republican primary ballot." (source)

VDARE headline: Colorado Court Saves Democracy By Banning Frontrunner From Ballot

Tell me again: between the Colorado Supreme Court and VDARE, who's supposed to be a serious, respectable institution, as opposed to a bunch of irresponsible political extremists?

[Mr. Bumble]

On this day in 1941, Bing Crosby performed "White Christmas" in a national radio broadcast. Written for the movie "Holiday Inn" by a Russian emigre Jew, Irving Berlin.

[Dr. Ed 2]

Remember that this is the first verse:
"The sun is shining, the grass is green,
The orange and palm trees sway.
There's never been such a day
in Beverly Hills, L.A.
But it's December the twenty-fourth,—
And I am longing to be up North—"

The other thing people forget is that we once had the American Chestnut tree: https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2023/12/american-chestnut-perfect-tree-restoration/676927/

So all the references to roasting Chestnuts are to an extinct nut.

[Magister]

American chestnut: endangered but not extinct.

[Mr. Bumble]

Has there been any real breakthrough in re-introducing them?
I know that there have been attempts to hybridize them and find resistant trees but haven't seen much about the success of the attempts.
Love chestnuts on the holidays and just had some really good ones (Italian) yesterday.
The loss of American chestnut and elm trees was a real loss.

[Brett Bellmore]

Gave up on the genetic engineering project. They'd messed up the initial trial, but mainly they were concerned it would cause PR problems even if it worked.

[ObviouslyNotSpam]

I've never tried any roasted chestnuts, but judging from the obnoxious odor emanating from the roasters I pass by in Europe during the holiday season, I am not very inclined to try any.

They actually taste good, you say?

[Mr. Bumble]

They do indeed. Sweet and meaty but they need to be fresh as the have a relatively short shelf life.

[Dr. Ed 2]

"Functionally extinct" -- it keeps sprouting & dying.
There are some hopes for resistant trees in the future, retaining the fast-growing characteristics, etc.

[Michael P]

Merry Christmas to all, and may you have a wonderful new year!

[not guilty]

Merry Christmas to all who celebrate the holiday!

Donald Trump has filed his opening brief in the D.C. Circuit Court of Appeals regarding his claims of immunity from criminal prosecution and double jeopardy. https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.cadc.40415/gov.uscourts.cadc.40415.1208582803.0_3.pdf It is weak tea as to both claims, but particularly as to his specious claim of double jeopardy.

To “be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb” means to face the possibility of “multiple criminal punishments for the same
offense.” Hudson v. United States, 522 U.S. 93, 99 (1997) (italics in original). Article I, § 3, ¶ 7 of the Constitution limits judgment in impeachments to removal from Office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor, Trust or Profit under the United States. Trump's brief notably fails to show that criminal penalties attach to impeachment proceedings.

A more glaring omission is that Trump was not impeached for any of the offenses charged in the pending D.C. indictment; ergo, he is not being put to trial for the "same offense." As Judge Chutkan opined:

As long as separate prosecutions charge an individual with violating different laws, the prosecutions are considered separate “offenses” under the Double Jeopardy Clause and the second prosecution passes constitutional muster. Denezpi v. United States, 596 U.S. 591, 597–98 (2022). When the same “act or transaction” violates two distinct provisions of the same statute, there are distinct offenses only if “each provision requires proof of a fact which the other does not.” Blockburger v. United States, 284 U.S. 299, 304 (1932). . . .

[T]he impeachment proceedings charged Defendant with “Incitement of Insurrection,” which is not charged in the Indictment. See Opp’n to Constitutional Motion at 60–62 (citing H.R. Res. 24, 117th Cong. (Jan. 11, 2021)). Although there are few decisions interpreting the analogous federal statute that prohibits inciting “any . . . insurrection against the authority of the United
States or the laws thereof,” 18 U.S.C. § 2383, it is well-established that “incitement” typically means “advocacy . . . directed to inciting or producing imminent lawless action” that is “likely to incite or produce such action,” Brandenburg v. Ohio, 395 U.S. 444, 447 (1969). None of the statutes under which Defendant is charged require the Government to prove incitement. See 18 U.S.C. § 371; id. §§ 1512(c)(2), (k); id. § 241; accord Indictment ¶¶ 6, 126, 128, 130. The impeachment proceedings and this prosecution therefore did not “twice put” Defendant “in jeopardy of life or limb” for the “same offense.”

Trump's brief nowhere even attempts to engage in any "same offense" analysis.

[gVOR08]

The goal, of course, is not to win, but to delay. Delay, delay, delay. The mills of the American legal system grind slowly, but they grind exceedingly slowly.

[Roger S]

Trump's brief makes a different argument. It says that he could only be criminally prosecuted if he were convicted by the Senate. And it is the same offense, if the same actions gave rise to the charges.

[ObviouslyNotSpam]

In other words, he's in "pound the table" territory...

[Brett Bellmore]

It's pretty obvious that the game plan here is to keep charging him with stuff, over and over, before hostile judges and always in jurisdictions that guarantee hostile jury pools, until either they convict him, or he dies. That's not the sort of legal strategy a normal defense can defeat, because factual and legal innocence are irrelevant to it. However unlikely, he needs some kind of longshot legal argument which would immunize him against ALL this crap if the Supreme court bought it. (Spoiler: They won't.)

Barring that, he needs to delay, get elected President, and use the power of the office as some sort of defense, likely using offense as the best defense.

It's famous that dictators will do absolutely anything to hold onto power, because the retirement plan sucks. The Democrats have demonstrated that they're willing to make retirement from the Presidency suck just as much.

Ironically, if they'd just dropped the lawfare when he left office, he might have retired. They saw to it that retirement wouldn't be an option.

[Sarcastr0]

They just keep charging him with stuff might not be a game plan. In fact, I'm pretty sure you're assuming liberal collusion again.

You think Georgia is a hostile jurisdiction? The Southern District of Florida? You are once again writing an fiction. This time not just unsupported, but actively contradicted by the facts.

It’s famous that dictators will do absolutely anything to hold onto power, because the retirement plan sucks. The Democrats have demonstrated that they’re willing to make retirement from the Presidency suck just as much.
The question, it is begged.

Ironically, if they’d just dropped the lawfare when he left office, he might have retired.
No chance; he's an ego monster. Don't play stupid counterfactual games. ALSO if someone does crimes it's a bad move to just not charge them and home they retire.

[Mr. Bumble]

...or instead of working their asses of to fortify the 2020 election he might be nearing the end of his second term and leaving the political scene.

[not guilty]

No, Roger S., it is not the same offense, if the same actions gave rise to the charges. SCOTUS opined in Grady v. Corbin, 495 U.S. 508, 510 (1990), that over and above the analysis required by Blockburger, double jeopardy bars a subsequent prosecution if, to establish an essential element of an offense charged in that prosecution, the government will prove conduct that constitutes an offense for which the defendant has already been prosecuted.

Three years later, the Supreme Court abandoned the "same conduct" test and overruled Grady in United States v. Dixon, 509 U.S. 688, 711-12 (1993), returning to the same elements test.

As Judge Chutkan recognized, the second impeachment of Donald Trump charged incitement of insurrection. https://www.congress.gov/117/bills/hres24/BILLS-117hres24ih.pdf Incitement is not an element of any of the four criminal offenses alleged in the indictment. Three of the criminal charges allege conspiracy with at least one other person -- not an element of incitement of insurrection. The substantive charge of obstructing/impeding of an official proceeding (or attempting to do so) requires the government to prove an official proceeding -- not an element of incitement of insurrection.

Trump's claim that double jeopardy bars the instant criminal prosecution is frivolous on its face.

[Michael P]

I am thankful that the US does not politicize things like egg fried rice in the way that China does. See also Language Log on the same topic.

I do not have a good sense of where that dish sits in either Han or broader Chinese cuisine; would the US analog be politicizing hot dogs or apple pie or the like?

[Krychek_2]

This is also the season of Isaac Newton's birthday, so be sure to observe it with all appropriate gravity.

[Mr. Bumble]

Falling on your face after too much eggnog?

[Bored Lawyer]

I see the calculus in your comment.

[Frank Drackman]

I can't differentiate your statement, is there something Integral I'm missing? I'm at my limit!

[Sarcastr0]

Christmas eve is tree trimming, deli sandwiches and homemade potato salad.
Then a family gift on Christmas Eve.
Santa comes in the night and fills the stockings/delivers a few additional gifts. (even with no kids, Santa still comes to our condo!)

The morning is stockings at your own pace.
Stockings contain some kind of breakfast treat (kippers, corned beef hash, fancy sausages, etc.) these are cooked for a late breakfast after which presents are opened.

Christmas dinner varies, but usually something in the beefy direction.

Then on Epiphany (we call it 'Ukrainian Christmas' after my Gramps) we each get a book.
This year we're doing a belated stockings Zoom with all the millennial siblings.

It's a pretty jolly season.
We're hosting my Mom, and my (separated) in-laws are each coming down over the next couple of days. Not stress free, but also part of making it a family affair.

[Ridgeway]

Kippers -- a treat for those who eat plain herring and remark, "I wish these were fishier." 😉

Mais chacun a son gout, and a Merry Christmas to all.

[SRG2]

Kippers — a treat for those who eat plain herring and remark, “I wish these were fishier.”

LOL.

Harrod's used to sell wonderful kippers. I very much like them grilled, but a friend preferred them poached in milk.

Where do you stand on schmaltz herring, btw?

[bernard11]

Merry Christmas to those who celebrate, and enjoy your day off to those who don't.

[Mr. Bumble]

,,,and especially to those who celebrate Christmas but whose job requires that they be working today.

[bernard11]

Yes, and sympathies.

[Frank Drackman]

Me and Mrs. Drackman (ICU Nurse) for years worked Easter/Xmas for the Goyim, no more, (Christmas used to be a great day to take call, usually people have to actually be sick to go to the Hospital on Hey-Zeus's birthday, but with all the Moose-lums, Hindus, Wiikins, and the general decrease in religiosity, it's like any other day. Mrs. Drackman left for Tel Aviv yesterday, the Wah isn't over yet, like Churchhill said, it's just getting to the end of the beginning.

Frank "What do you get for the Saviour who died for your sins?"

[SRG2]

Sign on the Meadowbrook Parkway (LI) last night

DON'T BE ON THE NAUGHTY LIST
KEEP TO THE SPEED LIMIT

[Nelson]

I-95 had the classic "Rudolph is the only one who should drive lit. Stay sober.".

Another was "He sees you when you're speeding. He knows when you tailgate.".

[Mr. Bumble]

Did we get a Christmas gift of a working edit function?

[Mr. Bumble]

Nope.

[Nelson]

We can't have nice things.

[Bored Lawyer]

For the first time, I saw today someone making a constructive suggestion for the situation in Gaza:

Hamas, Islamic Jihad Reject Egyptian Proposal For Ceasefire, Won’t Give Up Power: Report

https://www.dailywire.com/news/hamas-islamic-jihad-reject-egyptian-proposal-for-ceasefire-wont-give-up-power-report

The Egyptian proposal would have Hamas give up power, in exchange for personal immunity. Then there would be new elections in Gaza. Perhaps the leaders would have to go into exile. Unfortunately, Hamas rejected it.
This is not a full solution, but a step in the right direction.

[TwelveInchPianist]

"The Egyptian proposal would have Hamas give up power, in exchange for personal immunity."

What's the incentive for Israel to accept such a deal?

Why wouldn't they expect whoever is in charge next to pull off another 10/7, and then say, OK, we'll take the personal immunity?

[Bored Lawyer]

That's why I said this is only a first step. The new govt. in Gaza has to be committed to changing its entire approach to life in the Middle East. Which has little chance of happening. But none of that can happen without Hamas gone.
Occupation by Egypt would probably be the best solution (or least worst solution), but I don't think they are interested.

[Dr. Ed 2]

Now, PAY Egypt to do it, and they well might be interested.

[Bored Lawyer]

On that note:

Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates have reportedly told the President of Palestine, Mahmoud Abbas that he must Resign as President and Dissolve the current Government in order to Appoint a Saudi and UAE-Approved Government, or else they will Halt all further Financial Aid to the Palestinian Territories.

https://twitter.com/sentdefender/status/1739052007166488820

Take that report with a large bag of salt -- it's only a Twitter. But, if true, it would be one step closer to changing the Palestinian leadership.

[Mr. Bumble]

Palestinians have rejected every attempt to reach a solution to end the fighting (since 1948) and compromise on a plan to bring peace to the region. Short of a unilateral cease fire on Israel's part (which I do not foresee) I don't see a change until Israel has destroyed Hamas in Gaza but then a whole new can of worms will be opened.

[Bwaaah]

Not to be a party pooper, but...

MERRY CHRISTMAS ALL!!!

(and that means my well wishes for all good things for all people, however each may wish)

🙂

[Mr. Bumble]

Thanks! It's actually pretty civil today and with plenty of good wishes for Christmas.

[Nelson]

Don't worry. It's only a temporary ceasefire.

[Longtobefree]

Yep.
As soon as the soccer game is over, back to the shooting.

[Michael P]

The commenters have refused to cede any of their positions, hold elections to determine who should run this place, and potentially go into exile. Go figure!

[Sarcastr0]

Orin Kerr @OrinKerr
7m

"I just wish my news feed could have more coverage of Harvard.

Don't get me wrong, New York Times profiles of every member of the Harvard Corporation is a start. But shouldn't each profile be book length? I suppose there is always tomorrow."

[Jerry B.]

But I’d have to pay the Times baksheesh.

No.

Paying for my local paper (Washington Post) just to get local news, comics, and crosswords is bad enough.

[Dr. Ed 2]

Remember Boston Mayor Wu's "No Whites Allowed" party?
She got away with it.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/other/massachusetts-attorney-general-rejects-complaints-over-boston-mayor-s-electeds-of-color-party/ar-AA1lZ00w

[Nige]

Well, people got away with 'no blacks' parties for most of US history.

[Rev. Arthur L. Kirkland]

Was it necessary to rub the white, male noses of this blog's right-wing law professors in the "no blacks" thing?

[Jerry B.]

Two wrongs don’t make a right. They just make twice as many wrongs.

[Dr. Ed 2]

It's not even that -- 59 years ago, we said THOU SHALT NOT DISCRIMINATE. Like dumping raw sewerage into the river, it's now prohibited. Prohibited.

It wasn't before so this is a bigger wrong.

[Frank Drackman]

they were there, just bussing tables.

[Sarcastr0]

If you standard is 'didn't get criminally charged' you are working hard to get outraged over trifles.

An criminal investigation was never going to happen, everyone knew it.

Political embarrassment is something politicians try hard to avoid, though, so don't pretend this was consequence free just because you didn't get a scalp you never were going to get.

[Rev. Arthur L. Kirkland]

THE VOLOKH CONSPIRACY

This strikingly white, odds-defyingly
male, movement conservative
blog with a vanishingly scant academic
veneer has operated for no more than

EIGHT (8)

days without publishing at least
one racial slur; it has gifted its
target audience by publishing
vile racial slurs on at least

FORTY-SIX (46)

occasions (so far) during 2023
(that’s at least 46 different,
distinct discussions that include
vile racial slurs, not just 46 racial slurs;
many or most of those discussions
have featured multiple racial slurs
from Prof. Eugene Volokh and/or his
carefully cultivated collection of
bigoted, conservative followers.

This assessment does not address the
incessant stream of gay-bashing, white
nationalist, misogynist, antisemitic, racist,
Islamophobic, transphobic, xenophobic,
and Palestinian-hating slurs and other
bigoted content published daily
at this faux libertarian blog, which
is presented from the disaffected,
receding, deplorable right-wing fringe
of modern legal academia by members
of the Federalist Society for Law
and Public Policy Studies.

Amid this blog’s ugly and obsolete right-wing thinking, here is something worthwhile.

This is a good one, too.

Happy holidays, everyone!

[theobromophile]

How do you know the sex of the commentariat? My husband thought I was a guy for like two years....

[Jerry B.]

The Rev defaults to “White male” in his assumptions because they’re lowest on the intersectionality ladder.

[Rev. Arthur L. Kirkland]

.

The Rev defaults to “White male” in his assumptions

The issue is not my default setting; it's Prof. Volokh's choices, which have led -- for decades of predictable content -- to 99 percent of Volokh Conspiracy posts being the work of white males.

[Rev. Arthur L. Kirkland]

"[S]trikingly white, odds-defyingly
male" described the right-wing law professors here.

It also describes the audience (as does "carefully cultivated collection of bigoted, conservative followers"), although your question addresses a point I did not advance.

Any comment concerning the everyday level of bigotry at this blog, theobromophile? If not, that would be understandable, clinger.

[F.D. Wolf]

Merry Christmas, Conspirators.

[dwb68]

merry Christmas, happy belated Hanukkah.

[theobromophile]

Merry Christmas, Conspirators and readers!

[Frank Drackman]

Any "Conspirators" who haven't been watching Season 5 of "Fargo" it's not too late, it's just getting good. Watching Don Draper as a "Constitutional Sheriff" is great but Jennifer Jason Leigh is chewing the North Dakota Scenery (like the original movie, it's mostly set in Minn-a-So-dah)

Frank

[ObviouslyNotSpam]

Why should I only be merry on a random date appropriated from pagans in an effort by an irrational cult to reduce competition and consolidate power?

Fuck that. I'm going to be merry anytime I goddamn please.

[Mr. Bumble]

Well good for you and don't forget your gay apparel.

[Stephen Lathrop]

ONS, of course you are, but you miss the point. The object is not an increase in merriment. The object is to increase encouragement of merriment—an activity esteemed as an antidote to darkness.

[Purple Martin]

I think someone is confusing cause and effect...

[Purple Martin]

Oh, and Happy Holidays!

[Martinned]

It's only an opinion article for now, but obviously this is what the Netanyahu government has been aiming at for some time: An "evacuation" of the inhabitants of Gaza to Sinai.

https://www.jpost.com/opinion/article-779510

[Bored Lawyer]

Always great to condemn someone by what you imagine. Or an opinion piece by some unrelated person.

If you actually want to know what the Netanyahu government's goals are, maybe it would be a better idea to read an opinion piece by Netanyahu himself:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/benjamin-netanyahu-our-three-prerequisites-for-peace-gaza-israel-bff895bd

Certainly does not call for moving anyone. Although some of the goals are unrealistic, IMO.

[Dr. Ed 2]

It's not even that -- 59 years ago, we said THOU SHALT NOT DISCRIMINATE. Like dumping raw sewerage into the river, it's now prohibited. Prohibited.

It wasn't before so this is a bigger wrong.

[Martinned]

Out of curiosity, who is the "we" who said that?

[Mr. Bumble]

Happy Boxing Day.

[NOVA Lawyer]

"It wasn’t before so this is a bigger wrong."

Because the only difference between the party in 2023 and one in 1950 was one was legal and the other wasn't?

Or is it because the only (or the overwhelming primary) criterion that matters for you when measuring immorality is whether there is a law against it?

Do you even believe the things you write?

Or do you understand at the time you write them that you are merely saying what is convenient to support your ideological priors with no regard for logic, reason, facts, or moral principles?

[Brancron]

Why is it that only Ilya Somin, the most fanatically, rabidly, tendentiously anti-Trump person alive, is the only one here who has commented on the Trump ballot disqualification issue?

[Rev. Arthur L. Kirkland]

The others are partisan, cowardly hypocrites, most of whom have their tongues affixed to Trump's ass and/or scrotum (jostling with Ted Cruz and John Eastman for choice spots), hoping to be tossed a federal plum or two if Trump is elected.

[Bored Lawyer]

And if you want a good Christmas laugh, see this from Eretz Nehederet, who once again hits it out of the park:

The Gospel According to Berkeley
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcLCe5iBvVc

[John F. Carr]

That was amusing. I wonder how many people in America know that Islam did not exist until centuries after the time of Jesus. I never learned that in school.

[Dr. Ed 2]

Yes, let's imagine that Mary & Joseph were ripping up the water mains and using the pipe to make rockets to shoot at the Romans. What do you think the Romans would have done in response?

[TwelveInchPianist]

And they don't really celebrate it. They sent Santa to the gulag and replaced him with a secular version who comes on New Year.

[Dr. Ed 2]

Depends -- technically, Jan 6th is the last day of our Christmas.

The Russian Orthodox Church is Jan 6th but most of the Soviet Block (e.g East Germany) is the same as us.

[Magister]

The French are probably disappointed that name did not stick. The right wing insult "soy boy" also springs to mind.

[jb]

Ukraine just switched to December 25th, so Merry Christmas to everyone in Ukraine!

[Longtobefree]

Decimate?

[Nelson]

"I'm so glad we responded to modern problems with the moral vision of the Romans", he thought as he watched a death match between two Christian slaves in the newly-built Elite Slave Markets Colloseum.

[Dr. Ed 2]

Likely the entire city...

[Mr. Bumble]

Thanks. Like I said, their loss was a real shame.

[Nige]

These things aren't easy. Near impossible to duplicate the effects of healthy functioning eco-systems.

[Krayt]

The purpose of going into power is to be a kleptocrat. They are not freedom fighters, they are I'm gonna be the next dictator fighters.

[Bored Lawyer]

They have already stolen billions in aid. They can go live in hotel rooms in Qatar. Or the French can take them, they seem to like doing that.

[SRG2]

Plus they might have to stop killing Jews...

[Sarcastr0]

People go into elective office for reasons other than to steal, actually.

[Stella Link the dog]

Back in the old days when I had to work for a living, before becoming a member of the permanent leisure class, I worked with a bunch of French people; almost all good and decent. A couple things that got them exercised were French fries and French's mustard. Also, St Louis and Illinois.

[Nelson]

That was the real deal-breaker fir Hamas. When all you care about is killing, you can't imagine a world without it.

[Mr. Bumble]

Name one who left office poorer than when he entered.

[Nige]

But I applaud the efforts.

[Sarcastr0]

Even assuming there is no one ever, that is not the same running for office with the sole purpose of stealing.

That's Krayt's dumbass Iron Rule of Government or whatever, and it's flat wrong.

[Frank Drackman]

"45" that's one of the things I like about him.

[Drewski]

Why didn't you bring that complaint up with QA, who raised the idea that Roman-era morals were relevant to the conflict? The answer of course is she agrees with you, and you're not arguing on principle but merely being childishly contrarian.

It's a classic trolling move: Person A brings up a topic, opponent B responds, ally C scolds B for even addressing the topic. You should feel bad and apologize.

[Mr. Bumble]

...and he did donate his salary which was pretty unique.

[Martinned]

Why didn’t you bring that complaint up with QA, who raised the idea that Roman-era morals were relevant to the conflict?

Did she?

[Nelson]

"Why didn’t you bring that complaint up with QA, who raised the idea that Roman-era morals were relevant to the conflict?"

I didn't see that comment. I don't have her blocked, but I don't pay a lot of attention to her posts. But the same reply would work for her as well. Finding an era that approves of your priors and using it as if it's relevant today is a complete non sequitur. Especially with a disingenuous and false premise like Dr. Ed's.