The Volokh Conspiracy
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Happy Saturnalia!
The Volokh Conspiracy tradition of marking the occasion of this ancient Roman holiday continues.
Today is Saturnalia, an ancient Roman holiday with a long tradition here at the Volokh Conspiracy. Admittedly, it's tradition only in so far as I have put up a post about it every December 17 for the last several years. But, by internet standards, that's a truly ancient tradition, indeed!
The Encyclopedia Romana has a helpful description of Saturnalia:
During the holiday, restrictions were relaxed and the social order inverted. Gambling was allowed in public. Slaves were permitted to use dice and did not have to work. . . Within the family, a Lord of Misrule was chosen. Slaves were treated as equals, allowed to wear their masters' clothing, and be waited on at meal time in remembrance of an earlier golden age thought to have been ushered in by the god. In the Saturnalia, Lucian relates that "During My week the serious is barred; no business allowed. Drinking, noise and games and dice, appointing of kings and feasting of slaves, singing naked, clapping of frenzied hands, an occasional ducking of corked faces in icy water—such are the functions over which I preside."
As is usually the case, we have no shortage of strong candidates for the position of Lord of Misrule. Plenty of politicians in both major parties qualify, as do many other politically influential people.
Happy Saturnalia to all the friends, Romans, and Volokh Conspiracy readers out there!
NOTE: Most of this post is adopted from previous Saturnalia posts.
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What's the point of ducking corked faces in icy water?
While naked?
What else might have occurred when one did so? (Remember that one must bend over in order to dunk one's face.)
These were fertility orgies which history has cleaned up.
That puts a whole new shine, so to speak, on the Festivus Pole, feats of strength, and airing of grievances.
Blackface? In Rome? Racism's roots?
It was the Solstice Orgy when all sexual prohibitions were lifted.
The legacy today (until recently) was the right of any man to kiss any woman whom he caught under the mistletoe.
Am I being sufficiently clear here?
So everything is backwards in Saturnalia, is it?
Good morning, I look forward to a mutually-respectful exchange on matters of common interest on this comment section. While we may disagree, we share a common bond of love and respect, and productive conversations such as the ones in this comment section increase our knowledge as well as our appreciation of the diversity of ideas in our great nation.
I see what you did there.
And remember, December 25 is Isaac Newton's birthday, so be sure to observe the day with all appropriate gravity.
On the contrary, the ceremonies should be filled with light.
Bobbing for apples in icy water with corked faces?
Sheldon Cooper approves this post.
Can't wait for Adam Sander to do a "Saturnalia song", on second thought I can,
Frank "another friggin Dreidel"
Typical - the Christians take over Saturnalia and get rid of most of the fun.
They can't have eliminated *all* the fun - the Puritans wanted it banned.
I'm not sure what's involved in corking a face, but it doesn't sound pleasant.
Not when the aedile catches up with you and arrests you for violating the policies of diversitas, inclusio, and aequitas,
I hope the Conspirators and their Republican fans will share with us their favorites among the new Trump NFTs.
Is it the cowboy? The astronaut? The elephant rider? The 'rasslin champion? The golfer? The racecar driver? The ripped guy with laser eyes? The caped superhero?
Carry on, clingers, you pathetic dumbasses.
(Cheer up, culture war casualties. Joe Biden tried to compete with Trump's "MAJOR ANNOUNCEMENT," and all he could come up with was
✔️ Inflation’s easing
✔️ I just signed the Respect for Marriage Act
✔️ We brought Brittney Griner home
✔️ Gas prices are lower than a year ago
✔️ 10,000 new high-paying jobs in Arizona )
Nice Try, D'scrotum, or J' ball's,
OK, you did make a "Klinger" reference so maybe it's really Gerald Arthur Sandusky (born January 26, 1944) is an American retired college football coach and convicted serial child molester.
Inflation’s easing
✔️ I just signed the Respect for Marriage Act: which like the "The Gun Control Act of 1968 (GCA or GCA68)" controls no guns,
✔️ We brought Brittney Griner home, Great, that she got rid of her "Stash" (love Druggie slang) before going through US Customs, as US penalties for Drug Smugglers are even more Drack-monian (See what I did there?) than Roosh-un (she's already out, try pulling that smuggling shit at LAX)
✔️ Gas prices are lower than a year ago. Yeah, Lower than their historical maximums, Heck of a Job Brownie-Senescent Joe, and he didn't even have to deplete our Strategic Reserves to achieve it. Hmm, don't peoples tend to drive more in the warmer months, i.e. not now?
✔️ 10,000 new high-paying jobs in Arizona : Doing What, securing the 300,000 coming across the border?? (You make up "10,000" I make up "300,000")
is this really the Jerry Sandusky we've come to love and thank god we didn't play defense under (literally) him??
Gotta stick in your craw that the Nittily Lions (HT B. Hussein) are playing Utah in the Rose Bowl, good thing is thanks to the CFB Playoff, you and me are the only ones who know about it,
Frank "No Comparisons on $$$ given away to You-Krane?? (To a Losing Side, seems to be an Amurican Tradition) in 2020 vs this year
Now you've done it, the chatbot didn't like me soliciting a response to your comment. It violates the "content policy." Here's what the bot said:
"It is not appropriate to use derogatory or insulting language to address others, regardless of any perceived differences in political beliefs. It is important to respect the diversity of views and opinions held by others and to engage in civil discourse. Using insulting or inflammatory language only serves to polarize and divide, rather than facilitate constructive and respectful communication."
sucks to be you
It took some time for the bot to clean up your remarks, but at my prompting it boiled them down to this:
"There are many new Trump NFTs available. Some options include a cowboy, astronaut, elephant rider, 'rasslin champion, golfer, racecar driver, ripped guy with laser eyes, and a caped superhero.
Joe Biden also made some announcements, including:
✔️ Inflation's easing
✔️ Signing of the Respect for Marriage Act
✔️ Bringing Brittney Griner home
✔️ Lower gas prices compared to the previous year
✔️ 10,000 new high-paying jobs in Arizona"
OK, so let me X-plain it to you like you're a Mongoloid (are you?)
oh wait, I already did,
Hey did you hear the one about Senescent Joe, (Dr) Jill Biden, and Hunter Biden getting together to smoke Crack at Bo Biden's Grave???
Good, neither did I, sounds like a great set up though,
Frank "and then Beau Biden's Widow, and Hunter's Illegitimate kid (anyone know if it's a He/She/They??) show up, hilarity ensues"
You seem troubled, Frink Dickman. I too am troubled by President Biden's leadership choices, particularly the ones that involve ramming NATO up Russia's backside, thus violating an aged agreement that JFK had negotiated circa Bay of Pigs and risking a very nuclear WWIII. I would rather focus on those issues rather than invent some story about the consumption of deprotonated ("free base") alkaloids.
I will also mention your use of the word Mongoloid betrays some of your ideological preferences. That term was bandied about alot by Heinrich Himmler and his buddies - the same geniuses who thought Aryans were white rather than proto-Iranian / proto-Indian. If you meant "a native of Mongolia",
I will have you know that they are smarter than your average American. Mongolia, France, Hungary, and the USA share the 29th place in terms of average IQ of a nation's citizens (eg 98 IQ.) However, Mongolians spend about 1/20th as much as we do on education. 1st - 3rd place on avg IQ by nation are Japan, China, and South Korea. China overall has ~5X the cumulative IQ of the USA. (154 billion points vs 32 billion). [source: worlddata.info] So if you are trying to find some way to insult a person's intelligence or their capacity to reason- why not call them a conservative or Republican? No?
Professional scientists (noted for their capacity to reason) who are or lean Republican/conservative accounted for only 6/11% of that sub-population, according to a Pew poll done around 2011. My guess is that those numbers have dropped even lower since then. Its a pity, really, as leftist bias is ubiquitous within most scientific communities - and monocultures are extremely dangerous. (As ~99% Shinto Japan and 97.5% Christian Germany demonstrated in the early 1940s.)
Mongoloid, it's an old-timey word for those afflicted with "Down's Syndrome" aka Trisomy 21. I like the old-timey and British medical terms, and writing a diagnosis of "Perityphlitis" instead of the boring "Appendicitis" causes the Insurance companies all sorts of headaches. "Laudanum even had a revival with it's use in "Tombstone"
Frank "Take 2 Paracetamols and don't call me in the morning"
I mean, neither of those things happened.
The irony is most of the social liberals/anti religious types who like to show how hipster they are looking fondly upon the 'original' roman holidays or the good old days of rome before Christianity supposedly destroyed it would probably be the first to get tossed into a slave pit on to the crucifix. While on the other hand a lot of conservatives would probably kind of like the old pagan emphasis on the virtues of masculine glory and honor over the more equity/empathy based ideals that replaced it.
Hmm, it would be too bad if those were the only two choices.
Where do I sign up?? Most of the Juden from my Sin O' Gogue voted for a virulent Anti-Semite, all because the Repubiclan didn't "talk good English" Shit, Senescent Joe Biden hasn't "talked good English" umm ever??
Frank
a lot of conservatives would probably kind of like the old pagan emphasis on the virtues of masculine glory and honor over the more equity/empathy based ideals that replaced it.
I didn't know Christianity emphasized "the virtues of masculine glory and honor over the more equity/empathy based ideals."
Seriously,
any of you You-Krane-o-Philes able to tallyhow much Senescent Joe's given to Hunter's You-Kranian "Overlords" (HT "Reverend" Sandusky)
and I know you can't put a price on our Servicemen (maybe you can, I can't) who just happen to be in the impact zone as "Advisors" No, I mean all the ammo that we're now short of, Other Rockets, Jets, Trucks, that we're also short of,
All so some Seinfeld-reject can look tough in his Uniform,
When Saadam did that everyone laughed,
Roosh-uns play the long game, lets hear about all the Volunteers when peoples are freezing to death in Berlin and Warsaw,
Frank
This time I won't even try running that by the chatbot, it would probably put me in chatbot jail.
Too bad, it's amusing to show a computer program being more polite and substantive than an Internet commenter.
Your loss, No Gain, No Brain (I'm thinking mostly "No Brain" in your case)
Hanukkah starts the evening of Sunday, December 18 and ends the evening of Monday, December 26. The Hasmoneans were probably priests of Canaanite paganism. They took the opportunity of the conflict between Antiochus Epiphanes and the Ptolemies to overthrow the Persian-sponsored elite in Jerusalem. The Hasmoneans probably respected El-Kon-Artz (Kronos/Saturnus-equivalent, a raven god) and his son Baal (Zeus-equivalent, a bull god). Hanukkah is probably a midwinter "festival of lights" that connects to Saturnalia or to Yule and that has been awkwardly tacked into Judaism.
I wrote a summary for my Palestinian fiancée: Hanukkah Should Become the Palestine Return Holiday!.
Just waiting for your mention to link this great....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qUCNAnp2QAI
You can find the URL of The Broflovskis Sing "The Dreidel Song" - SOUTH PARK in the Quora post I hyperlinked above. This video is much more fun than Adam Sandler's video. Olivia is my dreidel (spinner). I will definitely over-shtup her for Hanukkah. She tells me that she makes me Palestinian by نكاح. I am making her Jewish by שטופּ, and she doesn't have to tovel herself.
A reader of Volokh Conspiracy has to find his own dreidel/spinner.
The Genius of "South Park" get people (Ok Me too) to laugh at Anti-Semitic jokes ("Kyle's Mom's a Bitch" gave me a Hernia) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQ49UoiLe5A
Ah, your usual creative drivel.
Chag Semeach Hanukah, SRG. (a little early)
Thank you, and a happy Chanukah to you. I eschew the phrase "chag sameach" as Chanukah is not one of the shalosh regalim. 🙂
It's always pathetically amusing when a white racial supremacist genocide-supporting Zionist anti-Jew tries to scam us into believing he knows something about Judaism. For such a depraved Zionist anti-Jew, the sum total of his Jewishness consists of:
Hag Sameah is generic and a translation of Gut Yontif. Hag Sameah is suitable for any holiday even if it's a minor Rabbinic holiday.
The bare minimum opening greeting, which is usable for a pilgrimage holiday, is מועדים לשמחה (A Festival in Joy!). There are also more ornate greetings, which are specific to the beginning or the end of a holiday.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0wbApVCWnc
The chatbot comments on Saturnalia:
"Today, Saturnalia is often remembered as a time of celebration and indulgence, and it is still celebrated by some people as a way to mark the winter solstice and the holiday season. It is important to remember and respect the cultural and historical significance of such holidays and to celebrate them in a responsible and respectful manner."
Was that the Roman custom, observing Saturnallia in a responsible and respectful manner?
The chatbot writes a debate between Antiochus Epiphanes and Judas Maccabeus. Curiously, it's more respectful than debates in certain Internet forums:
Antiochus Epiphanes: Greetings, Judas Maccabeus. I am Antiochus Epiphanes, ruler of the Seleucid Empire. I have come here today to debate with you about the recent events that have transpired between our two nations.
Judas Maccabeus: Greetings, Antiochus. I am Judas Maccabeus, leader of the Jewish resistance against your rule. I am here to defend the rights of my people and to stand up against your oppressive actions.
Antiochus: Oppressive actions? I fail to see how my actions could be considered oppressive. I have simply sought to bring the benefits of Greek culture and civilization to the people of Judea.
Judas: But at what cost, Antiochus? Your attempts to forcibly Hellenize our people have resulted in the suppression of our religion and the desecration of our holy temple. You have outlawed our customs and traditions and imposed your own upon us. This is not cultural exchange, but cultural domination.
Antiochus: I see your point, Judas, but I disagree. I believe that the adoption of Greek customs and traditions will bring prosperity and progress to the people of Judea. It is a small price to pay for the benefits that will come with it.
Judas: But it is not a small price to us, Antiochus. Our religion and customs are integral to our identity as a people. They are not something that can simply be discarded or replaced. And the prosperity you speak of has not been shared by all. Your actions have disproportionately benefited the wealthy and privileged, while the poor and marginalized have been left behind.
Antiochus: I understand your concerns, Judas, but I believe that the long-term benefits of Hellenization will outweigh the short-term sacrifices. I am willing to listen to the concerns of your people and work towards a solution that will benefit us all.
Judas: I appreciate your willingness to listen, Antiochus, but until you respect the rights and autonomy of our people, there can be no true resolution. We will continue to fight for our freedom and the preservation of our culture and traditions.
The chatbot also knows a lot more about Jewish history than Martillo does!
A quick search turned up someone named Joachim Martillo who seems to believe anti-Jewish conspiracy theories...if that's not "Martillo" then I don't know who it is.
He posts here as “Jonathan Affleck”.
I am Jonathan Affleck. Joachim Martillo is my pen name. The Zionist nitwits that have been trying to doxx me and to fabricate nonsense about me never managed in 28 years even to find out my actual name.
A rabid supporter of Zionist genocide against Palestinians considers any factual statement of truth or of historical fact to be antisemitic.
I address the real antisemites in When the Charge of Antisemitism is Justified.
Sounds like you're just peeved your brother Ben did so much better than you. Go live in fucking Palestine if you love them so much.
I never used my real name when I worked in the movies. Few do.
I do love my Palestinian fiancée deeply as does my mother. She hated my first two Askenazi wives. In contrast, Olivia is a genuine Judean Woman of Valor (אֵשֶׁת חַיִל), who is someone a vile depraved Zionist colonial settler anti-Jew can never be. Unlike any modern Jew, Olivia descends from Greco-Roman Judeans.
A Zionist colonial settler anti-Jew in stolen Palestine is a murderously genocidal invader, interloper, thief, and impostor, who deserves hatred, scorn, and loathing from the entire human race.
I should retell Mom's story.
My Mom’s Story — She is a Jewish Berber and Hates Zionists as the Whole World Should!
[I don't quite attain Mom's level of vituperation against VuzVuz Zionists.]
After the depraved and evil white racial supremacist Zionist colonial settlers perpetrated genocide on the native Palestinian population from Dec 1947 through 1949, the disgusting Zionist leadership realized that it could not hold stolen Palestine without an influx of cannon fodder, bullet catchers, and mine finders. The villainous Zionist leadership contrived to destroy the communities of Jewish Arabs and Jewish Berbers to force the members of these communities to emigrate to stolen Palestine even though in the minds of the perverted Zionist leadership, Jewish Arabs and Jewish Berbers were considered genetically and racially inferior. The vile Zionist leadership hoped that Jewish Arabs and Jewish Berbers would die in the service of Zionism and would thereby remove themselves from the gene pool.
Mom was 16 when a white racial supremacist Zionist "snake oil salesman" (שליח) tricked her family into leaving their homes for the Zionist state. As soon as the family arrived, the vile white racist Zionist anti-Jews doused every member of the family in insecticide because to the sick and perverted Zionist anti-Jews, a Jewish Berber was dirty and primitive. My mom's father was a respected scholar and refused to allow his family to live in homes stolen from Palestinians. Zionist anti-Jews beat him almost to death. I suppose he was lucky. If he had been Palestinian, the Zionist anti-Jews would have murdered him. My grandfather had no desire to become an ersatz native collaborator in the service of white racial supremacist genocidal European Zionist colonial settler anti-Jews. He took the whole family out of the Zionist state as quickly as possible.
The DOJ must arrest the US Zionist movement en masse so that each member of the movement can be:
Rabbinic Jews believe a ridiculous false narrative of the war that the Hasmoneans waged. The Hasmoneans wanted to replace the Jerusalem elite that the Persians had installed. The struggle against the Seleucids was tangential. The Seleucids defeated the Hasmoneans, but after defeating and killing Judah Maccabee, the Seleucid ruler Demetrius I Soter decided he did not care who controlled Jerusalem as long as Jerusalem was subordinate to the Seleucids.
The actual history is complex and has few points of contact with Hanukkah nonsense. Alexander Balas made Jonathan Apphus strategos and meridarch of the Seleucid Empire. In 143 BCE, Diodotus Tryphon executed Jonathan Apphus. Simon Thassi made a deal with Demetrius II (Nicator) and became the first autonomous ethnarch of the Hasmonean dynasty. Simon reigned from 142 until 135 BCE when the Seleucid governor of Jericho assassinated him and two of his sons.
John Hyrkanus succeeded his father and ruled as ethnarch from 134 BCE until his death in 104 BCE. Antiochus VII Sidetes reasserted control over Judea from 133-128 BCE when Antiochus died. The Seleucid Empire divided into factions and John Hyrkanus was able to extend his ethnarchy.
When John Hyrkanus died, his son Judah Aristobulus I succeeded him, murdered his mother, and proclaimed himself the first Hasmonean king. (Strabo asserts that his son Alexander Jannaeus was the first to claim the kingship.)
Because the Hasmoneans were thorough-going Hellenizers, it's hard to take seriously any assertion that claims the Hasmonean revolt resulted from opposition to Hellenization.
I'm not paying rent for all the space my People are occupying (get it? "Occupying" I crack myself up) in your Haid'. And hey, we want our Polio shots back out of your arms (Yeah, I'm Dr Shylock) Blue Jeans, TV Remotes, Google, shit, it'd be easier to say the stuff Jews didn't invent/perfect.
Are you offering human offerings ... or masks?
I am pleased that the World Cup was won by people of color
It would have to be won by people of color – who *doesn’t* have a color? (other than the Invisible Man, who would probably be disqualified from the World Cup due to unfair advantages).
All of Team Argentina are Hispanics a group widely recognized in the US as People of Color.
You may object that if those players came to America they would instantly be White. That is also true.
White is a color.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White
Without exception, the Conspirators seem to me like total geeks who would not enjoy Saturnalia at all. Never once do I recall a post here on the theme of “boogie till you puke,” or even “if you can’t be with the one you love, love the one you’re with.” I really don’t understand why Prof. Somin is babbling about Saturnalia.
If he wants to get into the Saturnalian spirit of upending conventional expectations, he should write a post urging stronger immigration controls.
Here's a great Saturnalia/Yule/Hanukka recipe for genuine Israeli falafel.
1. Obtain a trash compactor,
2. Add 10 lbs of canned garbanzo beans,
3. Add 1 vicious bloodthirsty racial supremacist Zionist colonial settler anti-Jew.
4. Press the on switch.
5. Bring the Israel falafel to the nearest zoo, which has an exhibit of omnivores like wolves, coyotes, wild dogs, bears, boars, pigs, chimpanzees.
6. Feed the genuine Israeli falafel to a large omnivore.
Could I get a method patent for this recipe?