Those Confusing New Yorkers: A Reminder That the New York Supreme Court Is the Trial Court

From NBC News' article, Herschel Walker's Loss Is Just More Bad News for Trump:

Two Trump companies were found guilty of criminal tax fraud in New York's highest court Tuesday.

The verdict did happen in the Supreme Court in New York, but that's not the highest court in New York; rather, it's a trial court. Above that is the Appellate Division, which is the intermediate court, and then the Court of Appeals, which is indeed New York's highest court. Worth remembering.

Thanks to Bruce Wessel for the pointer.

Comments

[F.D. Wolf]

Alternate headline: "Manhattan DA Alving Bragg finally finds criminal case he's willing to prosecute."

I'm sure all those squeaky-clean Wall Street firms are safe as long as they keep donating to the candidates of the proper political party.

[Formerly Known as Stash]

That's what the feds are for.

[Dr. Ed 2]

"I’m sure all those squeaky-clean Wall Street firms are safe as long as they keep donating to the candidates of the proper political party."

Trump has never really called for rioting on his behalf -- he clearly has had major lapses of judgement in both some of his verbiage and some of his associations, but he's never openly called for violence. Yet...

And all he would have to do is what Kamela Harris already has done, including promising bail money for anyone arrested.

Trump is, if anything, Machiavellian -- even in NYC (particularly in NYC) he could shut that courthouse down if he wanted to. I wouldn't be surprised to find him behind a wildcat rail strike -- those workers are p*ssed at both Biden and their own union leadership.

[Nige]

Trump has promised to pardon all the Jan 6th convictees, hasn't he? For being good loyal soldiers.

[Milhouse]

The pardon promise was not made to encourage them to riot, since it was made long after the riot was over. Harris's promise to cover rioters' bail was made during and before the riots; its only plausible motive was to encourage people to commit crimes.

[myself]

The official Weisselberg / Trump narrative here is that Weisselberg stole from Trump for years in the form of false expense claims.

Then in 2016 when Weisselberg decided to clean up the books he confessed his theft to Trump who responded by.... giving him a raise big enough to make up the gap for the money he was no longer "stealing".

Despite Weisselberg's refusal to flip I doubt that anyone believes that Trump wasn't in on the scheme from the beginning.

[Krayt]

And the official government narrative is this wasn’t going after a political enemy to git ‘im, that wouldn’t have happened but for exceptional partisan motivation.

Having said that, Donald “Lock her up!” Trump pulled it onto himself.

In politics, two wrongs do make, ummm, well, apt demonstration the Founding Fathers’ attempts to forbid the use of government investigation as a tool against one's enemies could use a little work.

[Formerly Known as Stash]

Feature, not a bug. Prosecutors love landing the big fish. Members of Congress, Judges, governors, local pols. Caesar's wife. If you push yourself forward, don't be a crook. Check out the endless lists of convicted pols at Wikipedia. "List of American federal politicians convicted of crimes" and "List of American state and local politicians convicted of crimes." If you are famous, a prosecutor can get famous prosecuting you. And has there ever been a politician who didn't claim that their prosecution was politically motivated? Literally true since the founding. Comes with the territory. The whole purpose of the two-party system is to keep each side honest.

[Reallynotbob]

Could it ever be true that a politician actually broke the law and should be prosecuted?

[myself]

Investigations need cause to start and require resources to continue. There's a lot of companies that might be doing something sketchy, but there's no reason to start randomly poking about to find something.

But becoming a politician, particularly a controversial one, means that media organizations will start doing their own digging for the purposes of a story. Once the media finds evidence of criminal wrongdoing and starts plastering it all over the front page what's a prosecutor supposed to do, pretend they don't see it?

Evidence of Trump's various financial crimes have been in the papers since 2015, of course prosecutors will follow up.

[Mr. Bumble]

...of course the media has shown no such interest in the Biden family crime syndicate.

[myself]

Well there's been plenty of investigations into Hunter Biden's business activities, resulting in investigations and charges. As for his drug issues, there's a lot of folks, famous and otherwise, with drug problems and no criminal convictions. I don't know the full calculus that prosecutors use to bring drug charges, but him not being charges doesn't seem unusual.

As for Joe Biden... there's been extensive media investigations and so far all I've seen is him rebuffing his son's attempts to pull him into a business deal.

[David Nieporent]

…of course the media has shown no such interest in the Biden family crime syndicate.

Or the gangs of leprechauns, to talk about something equally real.

[Bill Poser]

You'd think that people would know this from watching Law & Order even if they have no other knowledge of the legal system.

[PeteRR]

Exactly. The younger generation never saw the show in the first run.

[Mr. Bumble]

If they watched Law & Order they'd think that cases were tried in a grand courtroom in the NY Federal court building.

[Martinned]

And that the DA for the County of New York has jurisdiction to prosecute crimes for all of New York City.

[Mr. Bumble]

Well in most people's minds, Manhattan (Manhattan county) is NYC. They don't realize that it is comprised of 5 counties from reaches from Staten Island (Richmond county) in the south to part of Long Island (Queen's county) in the north and includes King's county (Brooklyn) and Bronx county (Bronx or the Bronx).

[Seamus]

Manhattan may be the Borough of Manhattan, but it's not Manhattan County; rather, it's New York County.

[Bored Lawyer]

Manhattan being the nerve center of much of the financial and business world, it often has sufficient nexus for the Manhattan DA to prosecute.
There once was an episode where the Manhattan DA and the Suffolk County DA were simultaneously prosecuting different people for the same crime. So such conflict occassionally happen.

[Frank Drackman]

with that cool "Shutting Cell Doors" sound effect
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8lDYrvTILc

[Reallynotbob]

Those state court courtrooms at 100 Centre are actually pretty grand as those things go. The exterior shots on the steps are 60 Centre, which is State civil court. Occasionally, they'd use 40 Centre exterior shots, which is the federal court.

I think one thing that puzzles non-lawyers is that L&O always said "Supreme Court, Part 70" or "Part 33" which is a location not a time stamp.

[Bored Lawyer]

Part means a particular judge. Generally to whom the case is assigned.
They usually have the same court room, but not always. And nowadays a lot of court business is conducted by Zoom and online.

[Michael P]

"The average reporter we talk to is 27 years old, and their only reporting experience consists of being around political campaigns. That’s a sea change. They literally know nothing." - Obama staffer Ben Rhodes, circa 2016. Now, of course, those reporters are on average 33 years old, but they still know literally nothing.

[Carl_N_Brown]

Watching Lawn Odor I always snickered at New York criminal cases first presented in the trial court named the Supreme Court in New Yotk only.
That NBC News thinks the NYC Supreme Court is "New York's highest court" confirms what I have observed about my betters.

[Formerly Known as Stash]

I don't watch Law & Order, but I remember it as a curious 1L factoid. And, of course, it is revisited whenever one cites NY law. Kinda embarrassing for NBC to get that wrong. 4 co-authors on the article.

[Dr. Ed 2]

Question: Why is it the Massachusetts Supreme Judicial Court?

Because the Massachusetts Legislature is known as the General Court, aka “The Great and General Court.”

And Massachusetts, Pennsylvania, Virginia, & Kentucky are not states — they are Commonwealths. (How Kentucky got to be one is beyond me -- remember that Maine isn't one.)

[SMP0328]

And Massachusetts, Pennsylvania, Virginia, & Kentucky are not states — they are Commonwealths. (How Kentucky got to be one is beyond me — remember that Maine isn’t one.)

They are States that call themselves Commonwealths. Just as the United States of America is a country even though that word is not in its name.

[santamonica811]

New York is tots weird in this way. Now, don't get me started about the Louisiana state legal system, or we'll be here all day.

[Reallynotbob]

Louisiana is weird. Literally a different system shoehorned into the common law system of precedent.

[Carl_N_Brown]

Louisiana legal system is based on French law tradition rather than English common law. I could get snarky and say I learned that watching "Swamp People".

[Mr. Bumble]

Just remember that the MSM is reporting you can trust (to usually be wrong).

[apedad]

So two Trump companies were NOT found guilty of criminal tax fraud in New York's highest court Tuesday?

[OtisAH]

Exactly. It’s all fake news. First they reported it as coming from the NY Supreme Court just to mislead Americans. Then they report the exact opposite of what the jury did, which was to congratulate the Turnip Org for being the best, cleverest, and most handsome organization the jury had ever seen. But the MSM won’t tell you this.

[Mr. Bumble]

"So two Trump companies were NOT found guilty of criminal tax fraud in New York’s highest court Tuesday?"

No, they were NOT. They were found guilty in the lowest state court.
If they choose to appeal there are two higher courts.

[Bored Lawyer]

Do you think it is at all embarassing that a national news outfite like NBC publishes something about a legal case that is ignorant of the basic facts of the NY legal system?

[Mr. Bumble]

Has any MSM outlet shown that they were ever embarrassed by getting basic facts wrong about anything?

[Reallynotbob]

As much as I think the NY Post is a hacky rag, their court beat reporting is often superior to the Daily News and usually faster than the NYT. (It's the season for generosity, don't judge me.) It's the one thing I read it for, other than blind gossip items on Page Six.

[dwb68]

Maryland just renamed their courts https://thedailyrecord.com/2022/11/09/voters-approve-new-names-for-court-of-appeals-special-appeals/
"Maryland voters Tuesday approved a constitutional amendment to change the name of the state’s top judicial tribunal from the Court of Appeals to the Supreme Court of Maryland and the title of its jurists from judge to justice, with the chief judge becoming the chief justice.

The name of Maryland’s intermediate court will also change, from the Court of Special Appeals to the Appellate Court of Maryland. Its judges, however, will still be called judges."

And now there is justice in Maryland! Except, not really.

[Martinned]

Why was that put to voters in the first place? Isn't renaming courts the kind of thing the legislature can do under its own powers? (Even if it does require an amendment to the state constitution because the state constitution mentions the courts by name.)

[Michael P]

The state’s constitution requires all amendments to it to be submitted “to the qualified voters of the State for adoption or rejection”, by simply majority, after it goes through the legislative process. And yes, the constitution identifies "The Court of Appeals" by name as the highest court.

[Reallynotbob]

If you like that, you'll love Texas.

[Rev. Arthur L. Kirkland]

That NBC Newser could have a great future editing Today In Supreme Court History at the Volokh Conspiracy.

Carry on, clingers.

[Rev. Arthur L. Kirkland]

Trump’s company convicted.

Trump’s tax returns being reviewed by investigators,

The insurrection committee preparing criminal referrals.

Democrats win again in Georgia (by 3).

Tired of winning yet, clingers?

[apedad]

Apparently, they're not winning in Germany either.

Germany arrests dozens suspected of plotting far-right extremist coup

MAINZ, Germany — Authorities in Germany arrested 25 people on Wednesday who are suspected of planning to violently overthrow the government in a far-right extremist plot.

More than 3,000 police officers, including special forces, made 130 early morning searches across 11 of Germany's 16 federal states in one of the biggest counterterrorism operations in the country's history.

Suspects from the so-far unnamed group include a nobleman with a historic royal title and various armed forces veterans. It is centered on the so-called Reichsbürger, or Reich Citizens, movement which is motivated by conspiracy theories about the role and legitimacy of the modern German state.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/germany-arrests-plot-far-right-extremist-coup-military-rcna60481

Although this is another NBC news item and according to Mr. Bumble (above), it might not be a valid story.

[Michael P]

25 people sounds like a smallish Antifa cell. It took 3000 police-plus-special-forces to arrest 25 people?

[Reallynotbob]

I forget, is Antifa "far right"?

[Nige]

Imagine that, swooping down on a planned coup attempt before it kicks off.

[jdgalt1]

Try imagining something real. The "coup", like the Gretchen Whitmer "kidnapping" and all of the violence on Jan 6, was conducted by FBI agents provocateurs in order to railroad and smear people on the Right simply for dissent.

But when real terrorists appear, they're always on the Left so the system lets them slide, or people like Maxine Waters prearrange to bail them out.

[Nige]

No, it wasn't, though it is weird that it was flagged in advance and Fed informants warned about it, but it was still allowed to happen. Almost as if right wing voilence isn't taken as seriously as the stats suggest it should.

[Reallynotbob]

Yeah, like that time Obama's goons took away everyone's guns and forced manufacturers to stop making ammunition, amirite?

[OtisAH]

Groups like that are the sorts of folks Bannon was meeting on his world tour the past year or so.

[SMP0328]

Another failed Beer Hall Putsch.

[Frank Drackman]

So Jerry, now you're Charlie Sheen?? and whats the deal with your Commutation "Package"??? not "Winning!" that one??? and Warlock actually won by 1.7%, not 3, and would have lost except for John Lewis's S-hole District(was there over Thanksgiving, S-holier than ever) but hey, you've made a career of exaggerating "Packages"

Frank "and we recognize the Anti-Semite from Georgia, Senator Warlock"

[Dan Schiavetta]

Out of state lawyers are always confused (if not horrified) when they come in on cases where I’m local counsel, not only by the quirky legal system, but by the regular flouting of deadlines, the uncertainty in trial scheduling, the lax attitude toward everything including allowing unannounced witnesses in the middle of trial, the chaotic conferences, and above all the fact that the state with the nation's most extensive and high-performing legal culture could produce so many bad judges.

[Mr. Bumble]

...all in the interest of justice, I suppose.

[bernard11]

Some things are not clear to me about this case.

1. I read that the fine is $1.6M, which won't hurt too bad, but what about back taxes, interest, and so on.

2. Assuming, as seems reasonable, that they were doing the same on federal taxes, why isn't this now a slam dunk for the IRS?

[Ridgeway]

I believe that Weisselberg is the one that owes back taxes, and that the T.O. was convicted of helping him avoid those taxes.

[jdgalt1]

Which other states also have one or more courts called the “Supreme Court” that are not the state’s highest court? Off the top of my head I know that Washington and Texas also have them.

[Eugene Volokh]

In Texas and Oklahoma, the Supreme Court is a highest court, even if not the highest court -- it's the highest court for civil cases, while each state's Court of Criminal Appeals is the highest court for criminal cases.

I believe the Washington Supreme Court is the state's highest court. (Of course, many states, including my own California, have Superior Courts that are trial courts, and therefore inferior courts. Cf. art. III of the U.S. Constitution, which labels federal article III courts other than the Supreme Court, "inferior Courts.")

[Voize]

Washington Supreme Court is the highest court in that state, are you thinking of the D.C. Court of Appeals (the "other" Washington)?

Texas and Oklahoma both have two highest courts, a Supreme Court for civil matters and a Court of Criminal Appeals for the other stuff.

As noted in an earlier comment, Maryland is in the process of changing the name of its highest court from Court of Appeals to Supreme Court. The change, having been approved by voters, is expected to be effective when the Governor issues a proclamation on December 14.

[M L]

Meanwhile....

Maxine Waters, top recipient of SBF political donations, is leading the investigation into FTX, and meanwhile telling him how awesome he is on Twitter.

https://twitter.com/Itsjoeco/status/1598703691418279936

[M L]

The IRS is warning Americans that this tax season they must report payments on Venmo, PayPal & Zelle of over $600.

Meanwhile…

The Pentagon just failed its FIFTH audit in a row, as they were unable to account for 61% of their $3.5 trillion in assets. $800 billion annual budget.

https://twitter.com/Stephen_Geiger/status/1597995546165547009

[Mr. Bumble]

Only the little people pay taxes or are required to comply with the rules.