The Volokh Conspiracy
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What's the Correct Way to Pronounce "Qatar"? Well, What's the Correct Way to Pronounce "France"?
Or what's the correct way to call "England" in Arabic?
Because of the World Cup, people who haven't much focused on Qatar have been talking about, and there's been a cottage industry of articles about how to pronounce it—and about how people are pronouncing it "wrong" or "incorrectly."
Here's my modest contribution: There is no one transnationally correct way of pronouncing "Qatar," just as there is no one correct way of pronouncing "France," or for that matter of pronouncing the name of the countries we call "Germany," "Greece," or "Russia." Rather, each language has its own norms, which stem both from the sounds common in that language, and from the history of how a name has been adapted into the language. The "correct" way to call a country in a language is just a matter of what is customary in that language.
Thus, "France" is pronounced one way in French (with an "ah") and another in English (with the more familiar English "a"). In Russian, it's pronounced "Frahntsiya"; and that's even apart from the fact that the "r" sounds are different in the three languages. I imagine many other languages have their own pronunciations.
"Russia" is likewise correctly pronounced in English as "Rusha," though in Russian it's "Rosiya" (I use italics to indicate emphasis) and in French it's spelled "Russie" and pronounced "Roosee" (to use English transliteration), though with the different French R and "oo." (It's also "La Russie" in French, but that's a separate matter.) And many countries' names are completely different in English (or in other languages) than they are in the country's official language; "Greece" in Greek is "Ellas," and of course "Germany" in German is "Deutschland." (Germany has many completely different names in different languages.)
Indeed, "England" in Arabic is, unsurprisingly, not "England," but apparently "'iinkiltira," likely from the French "Angleterre." I assume Qatari Arabic is the same on this point, though I recognize that there are some differences in how Arabic is spoken in different countries.
Are Qataris "wrong" if they call England "'iinkiltira" while speaking Arabic? Not at all. Likewise, English speakers aren't "wrong" when we pronounce "Qatar" in a way that's normal in English (according to dictionary.com, that's either kah-tahr or kuh-tahr).
Now if you want to pronounce Qatar the more Arabic way in English, for whatever reason (e.g., to impress people with your familiarity with the country), you should of course feel free to. But there's nothing wrong in using the English name for a foreign country when speaking English, or the French name when speaking French, or the Arabic name when speaking Arabic.
For more on this as to Ukraine, Kiev, Turkey, and Moscow, see here.
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It is a very, very slow day here at the VC.
Who cares about England? I always thought it was a great country. Today I learned it has ZERO Waffle Houses. My illusions have been shattered.
Not a single SEC championship either.
Not to mention that you can't pan for gold there like in Dahlonega, and there isn't a single Beef O Brady's for like 2000 miles.
Not even VC is immune to 3YearLetterman. (Also, beat me to it.)
I don't think non-English speakers are ever required to do this.
I watch Spanish TV with my wife. Korea is spelled "Corea". Ukraine is spelled "Ucrania". And pronounced accordingly. No attempt to learn the phonemes of another language.
I like all the names that my grandmother's home city has:
1. Бережани (Ukrainian)
2. Бережаны (Russian)
3. Berezhany (English)
4. Bereschany (German)
5. Brzeżany (Polish)
6. ברעזשאַן (Yiddish)
7. בּז'יז'אני/בּז'ז'ני (Fake Invader Hebrew).
Spanish avoids a k. I believe an older Spanish keyboard often did not have a k.
My family birth name is: פֿאליק (Yiddish), which has a plethora of German, Slavic, Hungarian, Lithuanian, and Romanian variants.
Because my depraved and evil hyperwealthy Zionist relatives are ignorant in all things, they spelled the family name Falic when they lived in Mexico* even though anyone with the slightest knowledge of Spanish orthography realizes that a final /k/ is spelled with a q as in Domecq.
Yet the most interesting variant of the family name, which I had at birth, is Volokh.
NOTE
* I suppose they spelled it Falick or Fallick before they entered Mexico. I hated the phallic jokes, and I hate my Zionist relatives even more. I legally changed my name to Affleck. My Palestinian friends heard عفلق and renamed me عطا عفلق because I explained that Jonathan is equivalent to عطا الله in Arabic. When I have to deal with Zionist state officials, I am stuck with יונתן פֿאליק.
My ancestors named Schwartz changed the spelling to Black.
Black is just a translation into English. When translated into a Slavic language Schwartz usually becomes some variant of Charny.
When a Zionist colonial settler tries to conceal that he is an invader, interloper, thief, and impostor in stolen Palestine, he often changes Schwartz to Shahor.
Fallick/Vlach/Bloch/Voloch is a harder case.
Some claim it comes from פלג.
I disbelieve.
Fallick etc. is probably a variant of volxъ.
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Vlach
Black is just a translation into English.
I bet he knew that.
As far as I know, Fallick is not related to Vlach, etc. It comes from the German Falke, which means falcon, and was traditionally the Yiddish name for anyone whose Hebrew name was Yehoshua. I don't know what connection was seen between the Biblical Joshua and falcons, but that was the traditional pairing.
Is that your current version of your ethnic background? (Check back in a few months to find out what it will be then!)
A depraved and evil Zionist like apparently David Nieporent makes up all sorts of nonsense about me. I have always written exactly the same description since I first put together a bio in prep school.
My father is Ukrainian Jewish -- his family is technically originally from Austrian Poland -- and is a Galitzianer. My mother is a N. African Jewish Berber.
End of story, but because a depraved and evil Zionist anti-Jew invariably resorts to an attack ad hominem when he has no rational response to any reasonable analysis of the absolute and utter evil of:
1. Zionism,
2. the Zionist movement,
3. the Zionist colonial settler conglomeration,
4. the Zionist state, and
5. every Zionist on the planet,
I periodically have to deal with a lot of Zionist-fabrications about my background.
Because legal nitwit David Nieporent is tossing rocks at me, let's refocus.
Eugene Kontorovich is a member of the Volokh Conspiracy. He is also a depraved and evil genocidal Zionist.
Genocide is US federal capital crime. The US federal criminal code defines genocide to be a form of terrorism. Kontorovich seems to have gone to live in a settlement of vicious bloodthirsty racial supremacist Zionist anti-Jews in stolen Palestinian territory, which the criminal genocidal Zionist state seized in 1967. Konotorovich has provided himself in the form of material support to genocide and hence to terrorists.
Shouldn't Kontorovich be hauled back to the USA so that he can be:
1. tried for genocide and for material support to terrorists,
2. almost certainly convicted, and
3. sentenced to a quick jab in the arm or to a long prison term?
Not only is genocide a US federal capital crime, but it is a international capital crime. In response the 1946 Nuremberg Tribunal, the international community banned genocide in Dec 1946. This ban on genocide constitutes jus cogens.
How many in this forum know what jus cogens is?
Should any Zionist anti-Jew be allowed to practice law in the USA?
I'm having a hard time deciding what I care about less, Qatar (or any Muslim country) or soccer.
Well, given that three of the ten most populous countries in the world are overwhelmingly Muslim (Indonesia, Pakistan, Bangladesh), one is about half Muslim (Nigeria), and one has a Muslim minority of 200 million (India), I think there's reason to care about Muslim countries -- though Qatar, perhaps not so much.
Muslim countries have a lot of the world's oil.
OUR oil -- we found it for them.
Please invite me to your home for dinner. I look forward to making that argument when I find your wallet.
For all the good that did them prior to the 20th century.
Back in 1992, an Anthro professor predicted we would have more problems with Muslims than Commies.
And I think this is relevant now: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XjFsZj1aHow
The bigot speaks again.
I didn't see any comments from the Rev. Costco.
If the West was smart, we'd have nothing to do with them, irrespective of their populations.
But we're dumb.
Ann Coulter put it best: We should invade their countries, kill their leaders, and convert them to Christianity.
It worked with Japan...
You're an idiot, and Coulter is scum.
From Wikipedia
Religion in Japan is manifested primarily in Shinto and in Buddhism, the two main faiths, which Japanese people often practice simultaneously. According to estimates, as many as 80% of the populace follow Shinto rituals to some degree, worshiping ancestors and spirits at domestic altars and public shrines. An almost equally high number is reported[6] as Buddhist. Syncretic combinations of both, known generally as shinbutsu-shūgō, are common; they represented Japan's dominant religion before the rise of State Shinto in the 19th century
,
On top of that, we didn't invade Japan, and didn't kill their leader, who continued to rule until his death in 1989 🙂
(we did occupy it after they surrendered, and did hang some underlings)
I think Ann Coulter was being discreet. I'm sure she'd be on board with nuking and occupying the Muslim countries, retaining any hereditary monarchs as figureheads, and killing their military leaders.
My wife is a Muslim Palestinian, against whose family vicious bloodthirsty white racial supremacist European Zionist colonial settler anti-Jews committed genocide in 1948. My mom loves her and agrees with me that my current wife is a genuine Judean אֵשֶׁת חַיִל. Mom hated my first two ווז-ווז (vuz-vuz, Ashkenazi) wives.
And yet here you are. What a scintillating life!
You remind me of Herman Cain and Uzbekibekibekistan.
Ummm, there is no correct way to pronounce Qatar. Any way will definitely offend someone and launch another Middle East crisis.
While it extends all the way to Fort Kent, US Route #1 first crosses into Canada in Calais, Maine.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calais,_Maine
It's pronounced "callous" or "cAllous."
And in Indiana you have vair-sales (Versailles) and my-lawn (Milan).
Heck, Colorado and Oregon can't even agree on Willamette (WillAMette versus WillaMETTE).
I always start with the capital of France.
Mexico is a funny name in Japanese. MAY HEE KOH is the Mexican pronunciation, MEK SEE KOH is the US English pronunciation. Japanese can pronounce the Mexican version almost perfectly, but for some reason, started with the US English version which is hard to pronounce in Japanese, and ended up with MAY KEE SHEE KOH.
I wasn't until I had a consulting engagement for industrial conglomerate Matsushita in Osaka (Panasonic in the US) , that I learned it's not pronounced MatsuSHEEta, but MaTSHUsta (and...gesundheit).
I want to hear a pretentious American pronounce Qatar in the proper classical Arabic, with the uvular 'q' sound and the emphatic 't'. At full speed in conversation.
Some of the regional varieties of Arabic have lost some of the unpronounceable sounds. For example, classical 'q' is sometimes modern 'g'.
This is how the former dictator of Libya ended up with a name that started with either Q or G - depending on whether you were transliterating the standard Arabic pronunciation, or you were transliterating the way he (and other Libyans) actually said it.
The standard romanisation is Qaḏḏāfī from the standard Arabic. Gaddafi is probably the best romanisation of the Western Libyan dialect that he actually spoke.
This Qatar pronunciation nonsense is just another ploy for elitist pseudo-journalists to denigrate the majority of the population and make themselves feel superior. F' them. And f' Qatar, while I'm at it.
I'm reminded of all the people who'd have thought it insufferably pretentious to pronounce "Paris, France" like "pa-RHEE, FROHNCE", but who thought it essential to flap the R in "Nicaragua" in order to display solidarity with oppressed peoples.
Fair point, Yevgeny
That seems rather different because I believe he (or his parents, with his concurrence) chose to use the anglicized version of the name. How do Qatari government officials pronounce the country's name when speaking English?
You know his brother is named Sasha, right? As in, the Russian nickname for Alexander?
To be precise, our parents anglicized Yevgeniy into Eugene, and Aleksandr into Alexander. But Sasha decided to keep his Russian nickname, which can be easily pronounced by English speakers. I didn't do the same with my nickname (Zhenia), because it sounded unpleasant to my ear when English speakers pronounced it; the first consonant, "zh," occurs in English (it sounds like the last consonant in "garage"), but isn't commonly used as an initial consonant, and the second consonant, a soft "n," is unknown in English.
I honestly thought you went with Eugene because of the whole Xena, warrior princess thing 🙂 I kinda figured your parents didn't give you boys anglicized names at birth.
It appears to be a bit of a power trip for third world countries, which have very little actual power, to insist that Westerners pronounce their names in some particular way. As Prof. Volokh notes, the English, French, and Germans don't worry about this, but the Burmese, Qataris, etc. do.
Interestingly, I have never met an immigrant from a third world country who was anything but good-spirited about the difficulties Americans might have with his or her name, but of course the immigrants are the winners of their natal societies, while the population left behind screaming "Death to America" are the powerless losers.
" but of course the immigrants are the winners of their natal societies, while the population left behind screaming “Death to America” are the powerless losers "
Much like the smart, ambitious young people in places like Alabama, west Texas, Idaho, Kentucky, or West Virginia who earn a scholarship and go to Boston, Berkeley, Philadelphia, New York, Amherst, or Ann Arbor, leaving desolate hometowns behind, never to return. It has several names -- bright flight, brain drain -- and America should continue to ensure that lifeline is available for young people who want and deserve better than the shambling circumstances of birth.
For marketing purposes it should be Catan.
All of these places are called "abroad" which is pronounced "abroad."
On a map it is permissible simply to mark the area "Here Be Dragons"
I still say Peking and Bombay. Chile is chilly. Iran is I-ran.
In the case of Qatar, the supposedly more correct CUTT-er does not seem any more like what the people from that country say.
Don't forget Burma.
Professor, you were smart to choose Qatar rather than Quebec. Canadians cannot agree on pronunciation .... eh.
When I hear someone pronounce it "Keh-bek" I know I'm dealing with a huge tool.
I’ve always pronounced it “ka-TAR”.
One of my daughters has a father-in-law who has worked for QatarEnergy for more than 20 years. He pronounces it more like “KOT-ter”. But he’s not Qatari either.
Beats me.
Looking forward to my upcoming Leghorn vacation.
A trip down memory lane leads me to Wolf Blitzer during the first gulf war trying to pronounce "Qatar" the way the natives say it. To say he never quite mastered the "qa" part would be an understatement. Mostly he made the word sound like "Gutter."
Words in any language are just noises. Any noise that results in the desired outcome (presumably communication) is as good as any other noise that produces the same result. Best not to be too prissy about it.
All the big European countries are aware that people in other big European countries have their own name for each others’ countries. Why do we infantalize non-European countries by thinking they can’t accept the same treatment? Wouldn’t it be more actually respectful to treat other countries as peers and not as inferiors who need to be patronized.
For his next post, Eugene will discuss the proper spelling of the guy who used to run Libya.
It's not Nuevo York, and when the latin market quits referring to it aw such, I might care about how Qatar is pronounced.
When I was there, I was told a sort of G/K sound rather like 'guitar'. Nobody corrected me
Flight-ER-Doc: Why do you say that "It's not Nuevo York"? It's "Nuevo York" in Spanish, just as Ciudad de Mexico is "Mexico City" in English, and the French-speaking Nouvelle-Caledonie is "New Caledonia" in English.
The names of countries vary from language to language, and the pronunciation differs regionally even within a language.
Just like, you know, all the other words.
I have to say, the coverage by Telemundo is far better than Fox. Much better commentary and analysis.
The Germany/Spain game yesterday was really wild. Spain likes to live dangerously. 🙂
A soccer game that is "really wild" is a non sequitur.
LOL, you're right. The France/Denmark game was really good, too.
Remember Brazil v. Germany in 2014?
Yes because the English speaking commentators don't say goooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooal.
Harkens back to the Gulf War (I or II, I forget which) when all our military types were running around calling it "Cutter." Funny how pronunciations run through our collective psyche - like "Keev" did at the outbreak of the current war.
You kind of undercut your own point --that what you call a country with a different language is more about language then respect or anything like that-- when you admit, in regards to Ukraine, that you've dropped the "the"
I.e., you have adopted the way they refer to themselves --even though your language does it differently-- explicitly as a sign of respect.
And that's what it really is about: respect. If someone doesn't care how you pronounce their name or what name you use, then it's no disrespect to use one that's easy for you. If someone does care, then it is respectful to do a good faith attempt to meet their care, and disrespectful to disregard it.